Guest guest Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 Has anyone heard of a test that measures if a woman's eggs are still viable? One of my patients who has gotten pregant before, but hasn't had a baby, just had this test and it came back that her eggs are no longer viable. Has anyone encountered this before and has anyone treated a woman in this situation suffessfully before? I know this isn't much info, but the patient is totally upset and believes it's a waste to try anymore. Thanks Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 I believe what she is referring to is a ultasound test done prior to ovulation which looks at follicular developement particularly egg size. Eggs that do not reach a certain size are considered not viable. This is normally done as part of ART in which eggs are being considered for harvesting -- thanks, Warren L. Cargal www.acuatlanta.net www.fertilitynow.net 404-233-5080 -------------- Original message from " snydez99 " <snydez99: -------------- Has anyone heard of a test that measures if a woman's eggs are still viable? One of my patients who has gotten pregant before, but hasn't had a baby, just had this test and it came back that her eggs are no longer viable. Has anyone encountered this before and has anyone treated a woman in this situation suffessfully before? I know this isn't much info, but the patient is totally upset and believes it's a waste to try anymore. Thanks Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 Steve -- There are several tests that measure 'ovarian reserve " - which patients sometimes translate as eggs that are no longer viable. These tests are classified as follows: Serum: Cycle day 2/3 FSH (Follicle Stimulating Hormone) + E2 (Estradiol). Ihibin B is also a serum marker of " ovarian reserve " but it is not as commonly used. Generally it is believed that a woman can still conceive either naturally, or with ART (IVF/IUI, etc.) if her FSH is under 15 mL/mIU on cycle day 2 or 3, and her E2 is between 25-65. An day 2/3 FSH under 10 is most preferable. Transvaginal Ultrasound: Basal Antral Follicle Count and Mean Ovarian Volume - in other words, how many follicles containing oocytes are visible on ultrasound waiting to be recruited for ovulation, and how large is the ovary at its' longest diameter. Dynamic or Functional Tests: Clomid Challenge Test: The patient will have their FSH checked on cycle day 3, then take 5 days of Clomiphene Citrate (Clomid) to stimulate follicular recruitment. Because there are more follicles recruited than during a normal menstrual cycle, there is more E2 (estradiol) being made by these multiple follicles, so the day 8 FSH value should be less than the day 3 value if the ovaries are healthy. FSH strictly relates to how many eggs/oocytes are left in the ovaries, i.e. the number or quantity, while age is the single greatest determinant of egg quality. However, because FSH levels increase typically with age, as there are fewer and fewer eggs left for the pituitary to stimulate, and as the ovaries themselves become less responsive to the body's own FSH, then this number will be used to say that the " eggs are no longer viable " and the woman is either perimenopausal, or perhaps has premature ovarian failure (POF). Traditional can successfully treat these patients, and at least 50 % of my practice - in which I specialize only in the treatment of male and female reproductive disorders - is made up of patients who have been referred to me by their western infertility doctors (REI's) for the treatment of diminished ovarian reserve. I would be happy to either walk you through this by phone or maybe off-list if you can get some more information about what exact tests this patient had. Ray Rubio, D.A.O.M. rtoo (805)497-1335 , " snydez99 " <snydez99 wrote: > > Has anyone heard of a test that measures if a woman's eggs are still > viable? One of my patients who has gotten pregant before, but hasn't > had a baby, just had this test and it came back that her eggs are no > longer viable. Has anyone encountered this before and has anyone > treated a woman in this situation suffessfully before? I know this > isn't much info, but the patient is totally upset and believes it's a > waste to try anymore. Thanks Steve > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 The main test to determine egg quality that I am aware of is for the FSH level taken on Day 3 of the woman's cycle. Usually they want the level to be below 10, and anything above this can indicate either poor egg quality or reserve. This test is under lots of debate though, as it can be influenced by the number of FSH receptors and/ or things blocking their normal functioning- meaning the ovaries and eggs may be fine but the route to stimulate them is poor. There has been some research done lately that indicates higher levels of FSH (up to 15 or 20) may still show viable pregnancy possiblities, but that it may just take longer. Ray Rubio posted some articles about this that you can read: http:// www.chinesemedicinetools.com/research/fsh/fsh-levels-under-15-still-viable-for-a\ rt-ivf Hope this helps, Trevor , " snydez99 " <snydez99 wrote: > > Has anyone heard of a test that measures if a woman's eggs are still > viable? One of my patients who has gotten pregant before, but hasn't > had a baby, just had this test and it came back that her eggs are no > longer viable. Has anyone encountered this before and has anyone > treated a woman in this situation suffessfully before? I know this > isn't much info, but the patient is totally upset and believes it's a > waste to try anymore. Thanks Steve > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 21, 2008 Report Share Posted March 21, 2008 Hi, another test for ovarian reserve is AMH or Anti Mullerian Hormone. This done in the UK, but assume also available in the States? See attached link for further information. http://www.tdlpathology.com/index.php?option=com_content & task=view & id=201 & Itemid\ =73 This is meant to give a better indicator of ovarian reserve and a more definitive answer than FSH which can fluctuate and can be affected by stress and drugs. It is more expensive to test and therefore is not automatically done by most clinics. Also, if a patent's FSH is being monitored, estradiol will also be. If this is high - 100-200+, the FSH may be within " normal " range, but it is thought that the high estradiol is masking a higher FSH level. I have seen patient with very low AMH, and patients with very high FSH levels go on to have children. Sometimes there just that one good egg. However, if a patients tries a stimulated cycle and has a poor response, this gives a better indication of ovarian function, Kidney qi and Jing. I also see many women who have done 4 or more cycles of ivf which do not result in pregnancy and are advised it is egg quality. it would be advisable to do a DNA fragmentation test done on the sperm. In many cases it is actually a sperm issue and donor sperm is the only answer in this instance (see link). http://www.tdlpathology.com/index.php?option=com_content & task=view & id=287 & Itemid\ =292 good luck. Suzanne Trevor Erikson <trevor_erikson@ Thursday, 13 March, 2008 2:56:34 AM Re: Test for Eggs that aren't viable The main test to determine egg quality that I am aware of is for the FSH level taken on Day 3 of the woman's cycle. Usually they want the level to be below 10, and anything above this can indicate either poor egg quality or reserve. This test is under lots of debate though, as it can be influenced by the number of FSH receptors and/ or things blocking their normal functioning- meaning the ovaries and eggs may be fine but the route to stimulate them is poor. There has been some research done lately that indicates higher levels of FSH (up to 15 or 20) may still show viable pregnancy possiblities, but that it may just take longer. Ray Rubio posted some articles about this that you can read: http:// www.chinesemedicine tools.com/ research/ fsh/fsh-levels- under-15- still-viable- for-art-ivf Hope this helps, Trevor , " snydez99 " <snydez99@.. .> wrote: > > Has anyone heard of a test that measures if a woman's eggs are still > viable? One of my patients who has gotten pregant before, but hasn't > had a baby, just had this test and it came back that her eggs are no > longer viable. Has anyone encountered this before and has anyone > treated a woman in this situation suffessfully before? I know this > isn't much info, but the patient is totally upset and believes it's a > waste to try anymore. Thanks Steve > ________ Sent from Mail. More Ways to Keep in Touch. http://uk.docs./nowyoucan.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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