shao yao gan cao wan and magnesium

January 3, 2009

Hi Andrea Beth,

Check with Health Concerns--I'll betcha that they use magnesium citrate. Also,

does your patient tend toward having loose bowels? With patients who do, and

who suffer from cramps and muscle spasms, I recommend Magnesium Glycinate which

is much better absorbed and doesn't usually cause diarrhea. Again, of course,

it goes without saying, make sure that the differential diagnosis is

appropriate--don't treat a symptom, treat the patient.

All the best,

--- On Sat, 1/3/09, < wrote:

<

Re: shan yao gan cao wan and magnesium

Saturday, January 3, 2009, 10:42 AM

I had a patient take a formula by Health Concerns, which combines this formula

with magnesium (I'm not sure which kind of magnesium), and it gave her severe,

explosive diarrhea and fecal incontinence, even in small doses.

Andrea Beth

Traditional Oriental Medicine

Happy Hours in the CALM Center

1770 E. Villa Drive, Suite 5

Cottonwood, AZ 86326

(928) 274-1373

--- On Fri, 1/2/09, > wrote:

>

shan yao gan cao wan and magnesium

Traditional Chinese Herbal Medicine, " TCM " <traditional_

chinese_medicine >

Friday, January 2, 2009, 3:08 AM

Dear Colleagues,

Have any of you considered the synergistic effects of Shan Yao Gan Cao Wan,

taken together with Magnesium Glycinate? Both address muscle spasms,

irritability, and liver qi stagnation. It would seem to me that they would

complement each other well. Your thoughts?

www.traditionaljewi shmedicine. net

January 4, 2009

Hi! Andrea Beth,

I just graduated from Dr. Andrew Weil's Integrative Medicine fellowship. It's 2

years distance learning and 3 weeks on site training in Tucson, AZ. Dr. Weil

taught us about the easiest absorb calcium is calcium citrate. Please see the

website: http://www.drweil.com/drw/u/ART02814/calcium

Here is the website regarding Magnesium:

http://www.drweil.com/drw/u/ART02805/magnesium.html

I gave pt the Health Concerns' SPZM without problem. It's possible that your

patient may have too high dosage of Magnesium from herb and food interaction.

Sincerely,

Ta-Ya Lee, MSN, CRNP, MAc, LAc, MBA

Johns Hopkins Community Physicians

Wyman Park Internal Medicine

Phone 410-338-3421 Fax 410-338-3413

Canton Crossing Integrative Medicine

410-522-9940

WARNING: E-mail sent over the Internet is not secure. Information sent by

e-mail may not remain confidential.

January 4, 2009

Hi Yehuda,

The patient in question did not ordinarily have loose stools, but constipation.

She was rather elderly and frail. Her case was one of the worst episodes of

shingles I had ever seen - typically, shingles is often misdiagnosed here and I

have seen some horrendous cases of it in our elderly population. Hers covered

her buttocks and inner thighs, and caused her muscles to visibly contract in

spasms. Acupuncture and herbs helped, but ultimately she couldn't tolerate the

herbs and the acupuncture relief was fleeting. She passed a couple of years

ago.

Anyone have experience with treating patients who have had shingles eruptions

enter deeply into the muscles? I've seen a bit of it here, and it is a

nightmare story. All of them have been far advanced in their years and

diagnosed with everything but shingles until it was too far gone for any therapy

to offer them much relief.

Andrea Beth

Traditional Oriental Medicine

Happy Hours in the CALM Center

1770 E. Villa Drive, Suite 5

Cottonwood, AZ 86326

(928) 274-1373

--- On Sat, 1/3/09, wrote:

Re: shao yao gan cao wan and magnesium

Saturday, January 3, 2009, 9:17 PM

Hi Andrea Beth,

Check with Health Concerns--I'll betcha that they use magnesium citrate.

Also, does your patient tend toward having loose bowels? With patients who do,

and who suffer from cramps and muscle spasms, I recommend Magnesium Glycinate

which is much better absorbed and doesn't usually cause diarrhea. Again,

of course, it goes without saying, make sure that the differential diagnosis

is appropriate--don't treat a symptom, treat the patient.

All the best,

--- On Sat, 1/3/09, < wrote:

<

Re: shan yao gan cao wan and magnesium

Saturday, January 3, 2009, 10:42 AM

I had a patient take a formula by Health Concerns, which combines this formula

with magnesium (I'm not sure which kind of magnesium), and it gave her

severe, explosive diarrhea and fecal incontinence, even in small doses.

Andrea Beth

Traditional Oriental Medicine

Happy Hours in the CALM Center

1770 E. Villa Drive, Suite 5

Cottonwood, AZ 86326

(928) 274-1373

--- On Fri, 1/2/09, > wrote:

>

shan yao gan cao wan and magnesium

Traditional Chinese Herbal Medicine, " TCM "

<traditional_ chinese_medicine >

Friday, January 2, 2009, 3:08 AM

Dear Colleagues,

Have any of you considered the synergistic effects of Shan Yao Gan Cao Wan,

taken together with Magnesium Glycinate? Both address muscle spasms,

irritability, and liver qi stagnation. It would seem to me that they would

complement each other well. Your thoughts?

www.traditionaljewi shmedicine. net

January 5, 2009

Dear Ta-Ya,

I have seen material like this before. My impression is that it is

controversial and that the research is far from clear as Dr. Weil says. From

what I have read, more often than not the problem is not so much that the body

lacks calcium, but rather an absorption problem. Often this accounts for bone

spurs, calcium deposits and arterial plaques. What I have read is that

Magnesium serves as the vehicle to deliver this misappropriated calcium to bones

where it belongs and is needed, and actually acts as a calcium channel blocker

to break up calcifications and treat atherosclorosis.

From my experience, the only time, if one's diet is lacking adequate sources of

calcium, to consider taking supplemental calcium Citrate would be if the

patient feels bone pain or if there is evidence of osteoporosis.

Respectfully,

--- On Sun, 1/4/09, Ta-Ya Lee <tlee19 wrote:

Ta-Ya Lee <tlee19

Re: shao yao gan cao wan and magnesium

Sunday, January 4, 2009, 3:39 PM

Hi! Andrea Beth,

I just graduated from Dr. Andrew Weil's Integrative Medicine fellowship. It's 2

years distance learning and 3 weeks on site training in Tucson, AZ. Dr. Weil

taught us about the easiest absorb calcium is calcium citrate. Please see the

website: http://www.drweil. com/drw/u/ ART02814/ calcium

Here is the website regarding Magnesium: http://www.drweil. com/drw/u/ ART02805/

magnesium. html

I gave pt the Health Concerns' SPZM without problem. It's possible that your

patient may have too high dosage of Magnesium from herb and food interaction.

Sincerely,

Ta-Ya Lee, MSN, CRNP, MAc, LAc, MBA

Johns Hopkins Community Physicians

Wyman Park Internal Medicine

Phone 410-338-3421 Fax 410-338-3413

Canton Crossing Integrative Medicine

410-522-9940

WARNING: E-mail sent over the Internet is not secure. Information sent by e-mail

may not remain confidential.

January 10, 2009

Hi! Yehuda,

I did a bit more research on this topic.

Here is the direct quot from my teacher, Dr. Tieraona Low Dog: " The

recommendations for calcium are " elemental calcium " . The amount of calcium

listed on milk labels indicates how much elemental calcium is in 8 ounces. Soy

milk is fortified with and naturally contains some calcium but remember soy

contains phytic acid and this blocks part of the absorption. I think we may need

more calcium in northern countries because we have low vitamin D, which impedes

absorption of dietary calcium, as well as having a diet that encourages the

excretion of calcium. Populations living in Africa near the equator do great on

600-700 mg of calcium per day but they have roughly 30-40% body exposed to the

strongest vitamin D in the world.

Most studies suggest that 1200 mg calcium and 800 IU vitamin D3 are optimal for

bone health. "

Here is the information from ConsumerLab.com:

" Therapeutic Dosages

A typical supplemental dosage of magnesium ranges from the nutritional needs

described above to as high as 600 mg daily. For premenstrual syndrome (PMS) and

dysmenorrhea (painful menstruation), an alternative approach is to start taking

500 to 1,000 mg daily, beginning on day 15 of the menstrual cycle and continuing

until menstruation begins. Magnesium citrate may be slightly more absorbable

than other forms of magnesium (Walker AF, Marakis G, Christie S, et al. Mg

citrate found more bioavailable than other Mg preparations in a randomized,

double-blind study. Magnes Res. 2003;16:183-91)

Safety Issues

The US government has set the following upper limits for use of magnesium

supplements:

Children 1-3 years: 65 mg 4-8 years: 110 mg

Adults: 350 mg Pregnant or Nursing Women: 350 mg

In general, magnesium appears to be quite safe when taken at or below

recommended dosages. The most

common complaint is loose stools. However, people with severe kidney or heart

disease should not take

magnesium (or any other supplement) except on the advice of a physician. Maximum

safe dosages have not been established for young children. There has been one

case of death caused by excessive use of magnesium supplements in a

developmentally and physically disabled child. Pregnant or nursing women should

not exceed the nutritional dosages presented under Requirements/Sources.

If taken at the same time, magnesium can interfere with the absorption of

antibiotics in the tetracycline family, and possibly, the drug nitrofurantoin.

Also, when combined with oral diabetes drugs in the sulfonylurea family,

magnesium may cause blood sugar levels to fall more than expected. "

I hope these information can help to clarify this topic.

Sincerely,

Ta-Ya

Ta-Ya Lee, MSN, CRNP, MAc, LAc, MBA

Johns Hopkins Community Physicians

Wyman Park Internal Medicine

Phone 410-338-3421 Fax 410-338-3413

Canton Crossing Integrative Medicine

410-522-9940

January 10, 2009

Dear Ta-Ya,

What you are quoting from your professor is nothing new to me. Medicine has

been touting the need to take supplemental calcium for at least the last 30

years. Yet, my experience has been that unless a patient eats massive amounts

of animal protein drinks lots of soda and/or coffee and very little

vegetables they won't have a problem with osteoporosis, even in menopause.

Studies at Harvard, Yale and USF have shown that a diet high in animal

protein significantly increases renal excretion of calcium and the bone

marker,

N-telopeptide(TNX), indicating a skeletal origin for the excess calcium output.

Furthermore, osteoporosis is virtually non-existant in the agrarian third world,

where native societies eat little processed food and get plenty of Vitamin D

from sunlight.

Magnesium, however is a different story: Magnesium deficiency is rampant, and a

plethora of diseases and conditions are related to its deficiency, either

directly or indirectly. Here is a list to consider: ADD/ADHD, Alzheimers,

angina, anxiety disorders, arrhythmias, arthritis, osteo and rheumatoid, asthma,

autism, auto-immune disorders, chronic fatigue, constipation, congestive heart

failure, diabetes, eating disorders, fibromyalgia, hypertension, infantile

seizures, insomnia, kidney stones, migraines, MS, muscle spasms twitching and

cramps, obesity, osteoporosis, Parkinson's PMS, Reynauds, SIDS, stroke, and

thyroid disorders.

Respectfully,

--- On Sat, 1/10/09, Ta-Ya Lee <tlee19 wrote:

Ta-Ya Lee <tlee19

Re: shao yao gan cao wan and magnesium

Saturday, January 10, 2009, 12:49 PM