Guest guest Posted April 13, 2009 Report Share Posted April 13, 2009 Trevor, Yes your formula looks like what I would expect from most people - not meaning that in a negative way. Along those lines, mine might have been similar, although I would have emphasized more blood / yin tonics. Both might have also got results, we can never know. But more interesting is what was actually done. In one school of thought one might see this patient as having heat signs, however seeking the root cause from symptoms, it was recognized that this was not internal heat. It is a nutritive and protective disharmony, and this is the reason that the sweat and fluids are unable to diffuse and discharge. The treatment is to harmonize the nutritive and protective and open the interstices, gui zhi tang was given to handle the situation. gui zhi 5g, bai shao 5g, gan cao 5g, sheng jiang 3 slices, da zao 5pieces. 5 packets of a water decoction¡£ After taking the formula, the boy began to sweat only under his arms, and his skin, as compared to before, felt relatively good. The patient had difficulty in taking the formula, so a few things were changed. Gui zhi, bai shao, and gan cao (equal dosages) were ground up into fine powder and put into a capsules. Twice a day he would take 10 grams and wash down with ginger and da zao juice. He did this for 20 days and then all over his body gathered a sweat and all the symptoms were eliminated. He was just like a normal person. With a 3 month follow up there was no relapse. - On Behalf Of Trevor Erikson Monday, April 13, 2009 1:39 AM Re: Dose of herbs prescribed to Westerner in Beijing This is an interesting exercise :-) Although I agree with Carl that visuals are very important in diagnosing skin disease, I will give it a shot based on the limited written info we have. To me it seems clear that this child is suffering with some sort of eczema. My Dx would be Blood heat with wind. I have been to taught to discriminate between two main poles of manifestation with Eczema. On the one side is damp heat and on the other is blood heat with wind. The main way to tell the difference, besides a visual observation, is through the ability to sweat(showing evidence of damp predominance) or not (showing evidence that damp is not that extreme). Of course there is a lot of various within this, but it is a good place to start. With the rapid pulse, dry, red, itching, lack of sweating, and excoriated skin, I am validating my Dx of blood heat with wind. The heat in the blood could also explain the vexation and rough breathing. I would probably base my Rx on Dao Chi San with modifications. Sheng Di Huang 12 Mu dan Pi 6 Dan Zhu Ye 6 Deng Xin Cao 2 Fang Feng 6 Jing Jie 6 Lian Qiao 6 Jin Yin Hua 6 Bai Xian Pi 6 Sheng Gan Cao 2 I think I would start with this for a week and see how the little guy responds. I would love to hear what the actual diagnosis, treatment method, and outcome was :-) Best Trevor Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.0.238 / Virus Database: 270.11.53/2054 - Release 04/11/09 10:51:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 13, 2009 Report Share Posted April 13, 2009 Jason, Thanks for that. I appreciate the different perspective on the case you presented. I have seen in the text books this approach before, but again without much case examples it is hard to gain trust that it actually works. The etiology certainly makes sense. Trevor , " " wrote: > > Trevor, > > > > Yes your formula looks like what I would expect from most people - not > meaning that in a negative way. Along those lines, mine might have been > similar, although I would have emphasized more blood / yin tonics. Both > might have also got results, we can never know. But more interesting is what > was actually done. > > > > In one school of thought one might see this patient as having heat signs, > however seeking the root cause from symptoms, it was recognized that this > was not internal heat. It is a nutritive and protective disharmony, and this > is the reason that the sweat and fluids are unable to diffuse and discharge. > The treatment is to harmonize the nutritive and protective and open the > interstices, gui zhi tang was given to handle the situation. > > gui zhi 5g, bai shao 5g, gan cao 5g, sheng jiang 3 slices, da zao 5pieces. > > 5 packets of a water decoction¡£ > > > > After taking the formula, the boy began to sweat only under his arms, and > his skin, as compared to before, felt relatively good. The patient had > difficulty in taking the formula, so a few things were changed. Gui zhi, > bai shao, and gan cao (equal dosages) were ground up into fine powder and > put into a capsules. Twice a day he would take 10 grams and wash down with > ginger and da zao juice. He did this for 20 days and then all over his body > gathered a sweat and all the symptoms were eliminated. He was just like a > normal person. With a 3 month follow up there was no relapse. > > > > - > > > > > > > On Behalf Of Trevor Erikson > Monday, April 13, 2009 1:39 AM > > Re: Dose of herbs prescribed to Westerner in Beijing > > This is an interesting exercise :-) > > Although I agree with Carl that visuals are very important in diagnosing > skin disease, I will give it a shot based on the limited written info we > have. > > To me it seems clear that this child is suffering with some sort of eczema. > My Dx would be Blood heat with wind. > > I have been to taught to discriminate between two main poles of > manifestation with Eczema. On the one side is damp heat and on the other is > blood heat with wind. The main way to tell the difference, besides a visual > observation, is through the ability to sweat(showing evidence of damp > predominance) or not (showing evidence that damp is not that extreme). Of > course there is a lot of various within this, but it is a good place to > start. > > With the rapid pulse, dry, red, itching, lack of sweating, and excoriated > skin, I am validating my Dx of blood heat with wind. The heat in the blood > could also explain the vexation and rough breathing. > > I would probably base my Rx on Dao Chi San with modifications. > > Sheng Di Huang 12 > Mu dan Pi 6 > Dan Zhu Ye 6 > Deng Xin Cao 2 > Fang Feng 6 > Jing Jie 6 > Lian Qiao 6 > Jin Yin Hua 6 > Bai Xian Pi 6 > Sheng Gan Cao 2 > > I think I would start with this for a week and see how the little guy > responds. > > I would love to hear what the actual diagnosis, treatment method, and > outcome was :-) > > Best > Trevor > > > > > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.238 / Virus Database: 270.11.53/2054 - Release 04/11/09 > 10:51:00 > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 14, 2009 Report Share Posted April 14, 2009 Jason Wrote: In one school of thought one might see this patient as having heat signs, however seeking the root cause from symptoms, it was recognized that this was not internal heat. It is a nutritive and protective disharmony, and this is the reason that the sweat and fluids are unable to diffuse and discharge. The treatment is to harmonize the nutritive and protective and open the interstices, gui zhi tang was given to handle the situation. Hi Jason, I am wondering, what were the key signs and symptoms that told this doctor that this was a nutritive/protective disharmony or a Gui Zhi Tang pattern? Thanks Sharon Sharon Weizenbaum 86 Henry Street Amherst, MA 01002 www.whitepinehealingarts.com sweiz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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