Guest guest Posted May 24, 2009 Report Share Posted May 24, 2009 can anyone recommend a source, preferably in the usa, for purchasing metal guide tubes? thank you very much mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 25, 2009 Report Share Posted May 25, 2009 Kenshin Trading has the basic metal tube: www.kenshin.com <http://www.kenshin.com/> I am unaware of a source for the great variety of shapes and metals available in Japan. Tom Hurrle, L.Ac. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 25, 2009 Report Share Posted May 25, 2009 In the 70's I bought some from a place in Canada, but don't use them anymore, as my insertion techniques have changed, and there are sanitation issues also. --- On Sun, 5/24/09, yangchi125 <yintang121 wrote: yangchi125 <yintang121 source for metal guide tubes? Sunday, May 24, 2009, 9:14 AM can anyone recommend a source, preferably in the usa, for purchasing metal guide tubes? thank you very much mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 25, 2009 Report Share Posted May 25, 2009 p.s., the metal guide tubes gather dust with the microscopes and autoclaves, and a 400 year old silver pocket travelling tube for carrying needles. it is always a small thing that tears the world apart, or leaves it much the same. peace --- On Mon, 5/25/09, mystir <ykcul_ritsym wrote: mystir <ykcul_ritsym Re: source for metal guide tubes? Monday, May 25, 2009, 4:23 PM In the 70's I bought some from a place in Canada, but don't use them anymore, as my insertion techniques have changed, and there are sanitation issues also. --- On Sun, 5/24/09, yangchi125 <yintang121 wrote: yangchi125 <yintang121 source for metal guide tubes? Sunday, May 24, 2009, 9:14 AM can anyone recommend a source, preferably in the usa, for purchasing metal guide tubes? thank you very much mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 25, 2009 Report Share Posted May 25, 2009 I have the metal tubes. Got them through David Euler www.kiiko.com. I do have a question about the Clean Needle issue with using them. Honestly, does it matter if you use plastic or metal tubes? Other than the coolness factor? Is it more or less effective? On Mon, May 25, 2009 at 1:23 PM, mystir <ykcul_ritsym wrote: > > > In the 70's I bought some from a place in Canada, but don't use them > anymore, as my insertion techniques have changed, and there are sanitation > issues also. > > --- On Sun, 5/24/09, yangchi125 <yintang121<yintang121%40hotmail.com>> > wrote: > > yangchi125 <yintang121 <yintang121%40hotmail.com>> > source for metal guide tubes? > <%40> > Sunday, May 24, 2009, 9:14 AM > > can anyone recommend a source, preferably in the usa, for purchasing metal > guide tubes? > > thank you very much > > mark > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 26, 2009 Report Share Posted May 26, 2009 Honestly, does it matter if you use plastic or metal tubes? Other than the coolness factor? Is it more or less effective? Hi. I don't think the tube matters as far as effectiveness goes, they only help to accurately get the needle under the skin. After that, hand manipulation is what matters. There are other trade-offs tho. If there are 5000 U.S. acupuncturists seeing 5 patients a day, using 5 needles with plastic tubes per patient, then there are 125,000 little tubes headed for the land fill every day. With metal tubes there is a lot of sanitary chores, with plastic, there is annually a lot of waste generated. But with finger cots and direct insertion, neither scenario is a concern. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 26, 2009 Report Share Posted May 26, 2009 finger cots go in a landfill.... On May 26, 2009, at 12:58 PM, mystir wrote: > > > Honestly, does it matter if you use plastic or metal tubes? > > Other than the coolness factor? Is it more or less effective? > > Hi. I don't think the tube matters as far as effectiveness goes, > they only help to accurately get the needle under the skin. After > that, hand manipulation is what matters. > There are other trade-offs tho. If there are 5000 U.S. > acupuncturists seeing 5 patients a day, using 5 needles with plastic > tubes per patient, then there are 125,000 little tubes headed for > the land fill every day. > With metal tubes there is a lot of sanitary chores, with plastic, > there is annually a lot of waste generated. But with finger cots and > direct insertion, neither scenario is a concern. > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 26, 2009 Report Share Posted May 26, 2009 finger cots go in a landfill.... Yes, but that is 2 per patient, and they are infinitely more biodegradable. I knew that point was going to be , and should be raised. I don't have any solution. I sense, and I may be wrong, from the initial query about metal guide tubes, a little feel for the elegant way acupuncture was practiced in the past, and it was a very beautiful, minimalist, and holistic time of the craft. Metal tubes, small wrapped pocket travelling kit, the finest metals, the respect for each piece as the needle is the 'coup de grace', following the evaluation. The population does not want reusable needles, I don't want to go back there either, (altho I do have needles that only I reuse for a certain patient, after cleaning, such as gold or silver, or ones that felt exceptional), never a problem in 30 years, tho the needles only have a limited useful life, and need to be replaced. The stiffer the needle, the higher the practitioner's finger can be on the shaft; the greater the skill the less their fingers touch the length that will be inserted. 1 or 2 inch needles are the norm, you can do almost anything with them, fingercots and tubes aren't necesary. Threading, 5 inch needles, and implanted needles may require finger cots or sanitary hemosats. Patients with very badly and mixed presentations, e.g. such as typhoid, require cots and single use tubes. Also, there are disposable needles packed by 5's or so per single insertion tube. After establishing a clean field, one can confidently treat someone with as many needles as feel useful with the same tube. --- On Tue, 5/26/09, A. Brameier <snakeoil.works wrote: A. Brameier <snakeoil.works Re: source for metal guide tubes? Tuesday, May 26, 2009, 4:15 PM finger cots go in a landfill.... On May 26, 2009, at 12:58 PM, mystir wrote: > > > Honestly, does it matter if you use plastic or metal tubes? > > Other than the coolness factor? Is it more or less effective? > > Hi. I don't think the tube matters as far as effectiveness goes, > they only help to accurately get the needle under the skin. After > that, hand manipulation is what matters. > There are other trade-offs tho. If there are 5000 U.S. > acupuncturists seeing 5 patients a day, using 5 needles with plastic > tubes per patient, then there are 125,000 little tubes headed for > the land fill every day. > With metal tubes there is a lot of sanitary chores, with plastic, > there is annually a lot of waste generated. But with finger cots and > direct insertion, neither scenario is a concern. > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 26, 2009 Report Share Posted May 26, 2009 you took the words right out of my mouth! :-) ann On May 26, 2009, at 5:00 PM, mystir wrote: > > > > finger cots go in a landfill.... > > Yes, but that is 2 per patient, and they are infinitely more > biodegradable. I knew that point was going to be , and should be > raised. I don't have any solution. > I sense, and I may be wrong, from the initial query about metal > guide tubes, a little feel for the elegant way acupuncture was > practiced in the past, and it was a very beautiful, minimalist, and > holistic time of the craft. Metal tubes, small wrapped pocket > travelling kit, the finest metals, the respect for each piece as the > needle is the 'coup de grace', following the evaluation. > The population does not want reusable needles, I don't want to go > back there either, (altho I do have needles that only I reuse for a > certain patient, after cleaning, such as gold or silver, or ones > that felt exceptional), never a problem in 30 years, tho the needles > only have a limited useful life, and need to be replaced. > The stiffer the needle, the higher the practitioner's finger can be > on the shaft; the greater the skill the less their fingers touch the > length that will be inserted. 1 or 2 inch needles are the norm, you > can do almost anything with them, fingercots and tubes aren't > necesary. Threading, 5 inch needles, and implanted needles may > require finger cots or sanitary hemosats. > Patients with very badly and mixed presentations, e.g. such as > typhoid, require cots and single use tubes. > Also, there are disposable needles packed by 5's or so per single > insertion tube. After establishing a clean field, one can > confidently treat someone with as many needles as feel useful with > the same tube. > > --- On Tue, 5/26/09, A. Brameier <snakeoil.works wrote: > > A. Brameier <snakeoil.works > Re: source for metal guide tubes? > > Tuesday, May 26, 2009, 4:15 PM > > finger cots go in a landfill.... > > On May 26, 2009, at 12:58 PM, mystir wrote: > > > > > > > > > Honestly, does it matter if you use plastic or metal tubes? > > > > > > Other than the coolness factor? Is it more or less effective? > > > > > > Hi. I don't think the tube matters as far as effectiveness goes, > > > they only help to accurately get the needle under the skin. After > > > that, hand manipulation is what matters. > > > There are other trade-offs tho. If there are 5000 U.S. > > > acupuncturists seeing 5 patients a day, using 5 needles with plastic > > > tubes per patient, then there are 125,000 little tubes headed for > > > the land fill every day. > > > With metal tubes there is a lot of sanitary chores, with plastic, > > > there is annually a lot of waste generated. But with finger cots and > > > direct insertion, neither scenario is a concern. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.