Guest guest Posted February 10, 2010 Report Share Posted February 10, 2010 Hi everyone-- Anyone knows what is " Brain-Wind Syndrome " ? Never heard it. (Is it maybe an airhead? :-) and what diagnosis would it be in Western med? Also, " Eye-Wind syndrome " This is when blood rushes quickly to the UpperJiao and gathers in the inner canthus (according to Maciocia this is heart area in eye diagnosis) Would it be a sign of an impending stroke in Western med? Maybe? Help? And 3 more for your thinking pleasure... What would be " Perforated Wind Syndrome " in Western med? and " Endogenous Wind Syndrome " and " " Head-Wind Syndrome " Thank you much in advance. Kind regards, Gloria R. Osorio L. Ac., B.S., MSOM Candidate DAOM, Oregon College of Oriental Medicine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 10, 2010 Report Share Posted February 10, 2010 Hi Gloria, Don't have much time, but see Su Wen 42. ________________________________ The Traveler <dumai20baihui Wed, February 10, 2010 8:29:10 AM HELP Hi everyone-- Anyone knows what is " Brain-Wind Syndrome " ? Never heard it. (Is it maybe an airhead? :-) and what diagnosis would it be in Western med? Also, " Eye-Wind syndrome " This is when blood rushes quickly to the UpperJiao and gathers in the inner canthus (according to Maciocia this is heart area in eye diagnosis) Would it be a sign of an impending stroke in Western med? Maybe? Help? And 3 more for your thinking pleasure... What would be " Perforated Wind Syndrome " in Western med? and " Endogenous Wind Syndrome " and " " Head-Wind Syndrome " Thank you much in advance. Kind regards, Gloria R. Osorio L. Ac., B.S., MSOM Candidate DAOM, Oregon College of Oriental Medicine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 10, 2010 Report Share Posted February 10, 2010 Hi Yehuda-- Thank you. However, it is precisely the Suwen Chapter 42 that I'm reading and working on and looking for a correlation of the diseases in Western medicine. Thanks for the response though. Kind regards, Gloria ________________________________ Wed, February 10, 2010 3:05:20 PM Re: HELP Â Hi Gloria, Don't have much time, but see Su Wen 42. www.traditionaljewi shmedicine. net www.traditionaljewi shmedicine. blogspot. com ____________ _________ _________ __ The Traveler <dumai20baihui@ > Wed, February 10, 2010 8:29:10 AM HELP Hi everyone-- Anyone knows what is " Brain-Wind Syndrome " ? Never heard it. (Is it maybe an airhead? :-) and what diagnosis would it be in Western med? Also, " Eye-Wind syndrome " This is when blood rushes quickly to the UpperJiao and gathers in the inner canthus (according to Maciocia this is heart area in eye diagnosis) Would it be a sign of an impending stroke in Western med? Maybe? Help? And 3 more for your thinking pleasure... What would be " Perforated Wind Syndrome " in Western med? and " Endogenous Wind Syndrome " and " " Head-Wind Syndrome " Thank you much in advance. Kind regards, Gloria R. Osorio L. Ac., B.S., MSOM Candidate DAOM, Oregon College of Oriental Medicine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 10, 2010 Report Share Posted February 10, 2010 According to my training, Suwen chapter 42 discusses the penetration of perverse (external) wind into the embodied spirit. Perverse wind penetrates through the superficial layers in contrast to pestilent wind, which enters through the mouth and nose and can enter the (primary) channels directly. The penetration of perverse wind lay the conceptual foundation of SHL, while pestilent wind was much later elucidated in the Wenbing tradition. Perverse wind penetrates through the superficial layers (taiyang in SHL language) and collects in the occiput. *In this context*, " head wind " or " brain wind " is a taiyang occipital headache, and eye wind is red/itchy eyes that are characteristic of what modern TCM calls wind-heat. In SHL terminology, this is the beginning of wind penetrating from taiyang to yangming. Since the kidneys control the exterior in SW, when one opens the exterior (by sweating) while releasing essence (during sex) the embodied spirit's resources for resisting " attacks " by wind are left inadequate. Attack by wind in that circumstance penetrates directly to the interior (and is called " internal, " even though its source was external). I'm sorry, I don't understand what you mean by " perforated wind. " Steve On Wed, Feb 10, 2010 at 1:12 PM, The Traveler <dumai20baihuiwrote: > > > Hi Yehuda-- Thank you. > > However, it is precisely the Suwen Chapter 42 that I'm reading and working > on and looking for a correlation of the diseases in Western medicine. Thanks > for the response though. > > Kind regards, > Gloria > > ________________________________ > <%40>> > <%40> > Wed, February 10, 2010 3:05:20 PM > Re: HELP > > > > Hi Gloria, > > Don't have much time, but see Su Wen 42. > > > www.traditionaljewi shmedicine. net > www.traditionaljewi shmedicine. blogspot. com > > > ____________ _________ _________ __ > The Traveler <dumai20baihui@ > > > Wed, February 10, 2010 8:29:10 AM > HELP > > Hi everyone-- > > Anyone knows what is " Brain-Wind Syndrome " ? Never heard it. (Is it maybe an > airhead? :-) and what diagnosis would it be in Western med? > > Also, " Eye-Wind syndrome " This is when blood rushes quickly to the > UpperJiao and gathers in the inner canthus (according to Maciocia this is > heart area in eye diagnosis) Would it be a sign of an impending stroke in > Western med? Maybe? Help? > > And 3 more for your thinking pleasure... > > What would be " Perforated Wind Syndrome " in Western med? and > > " Endogenous Wind Syndrome " and > > " " Head-Wind Syndrome " > > Thank you much in advance. > > Kind regards, > Gloria R. Osorio L. Ac., B.S., MSOM > Candidate DAOM, Oregon College of Oriental Medicine > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 10, 2010 Report Share Posted February 10, 2010 Gloria, What you will need to do is find the place in the textbook you saw the term, or ask the teacher (if mentioned in class), and get the Chinese characters or at least the pinyin so we can look it up. This is one of the biggest problems, the use of terms without connection to the original Chinese, or texts and/or teachers who use these terms without adequate explanation, footnoting or glossary. On Feb 10, 2010, at 8:29 AM, The Traveler wrote: > Hi everyone-- > > Anyone knows what is " Brain-Wind Syndrome " ? Never heard it. (Is it maybe an airhead? :-) and what diagnosis would it be in Western med? > > Also, " Eye-Wind syndrome " This is when blood rushes quickly to the UpperJiao and gathers in the inner canthus (according to Maciocia this is heart area in eye diagnosis) Would it be a sign of an impending stroke in Western med? Maybe? Help? > > And 3 more for your thinking pleasure... > > What would be " Perforated Wind Syndrome " in Western med? and > > " Endogenous Wind Syndrome " and > > " " Head-Wind Syndrome " > > Thank you much in advance. > > Kind regards, > Gloria R. Osorio L. Ac., B.S., MSOM > Candidate DAOM, Oregon College of Oriental Medicine > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 10, 2010 Report Share Posted February 10, 2010 Hi Z'ev-- I'm studying the Suwen Chapter 42 FENG LUN from the Yellow Emperor Canon of Internal Medicine by Wang Bing, Trans. Wu Liansheng, Wu Qi. Pages 204, 205, 206, and 207. What I HAVE to do is to find the syndromes and interpret their symptoms. I think I can do that straight from the book. But, what I also WANT to do is to thoroughly understand the syndromes by comparing/correlating them to an approximate diagnosis in Western medicine. Most patients after all come to clinic with a Western diagnosis in hand. Most of you here in the group have lots of years of experience, so I thought I'd ask. Some of the syndromes I found and would like to know the Western correlation are: (page 205 - last paragraph) " Brain-wind syndrome " " Eye-wind syndrome " " Perforated-wind syndrome " " Endogenous-wind syndrome " Thank you. Kind regards, Glow ________________________________ <zrosenbe Wed, February 10, 2010 5:29:22 PM Re: HELP Gloria, What you will need to do is find the place in the textbook you saw the term, or ask the teacher (if mentioned in class), and get the Chinese characters or at least the pinyin so we can look it up. This is one of the biggest problems, the use of terms without connection to the original Chinese, or texts and/or teachers who use these terms without adequate explanation, footnoting or glossary. On Feb 10, 2010, at 8:29 AM, The Traveler wrote: > Hi everyone-- > > Anyone knows what is " Brain-Wind Syndrome " ? Never heard it. (Is it maybe an airhead? :-) and what diagnosis would it be in Western med? > > Also, " Eye-Wind syndrome " This is when blood rushes quickly to the UpperJiao and gathers in the inner canthus (according to Maciocia this is heart area in eye diagnosis) Would it be a sign of an impending stroke in Western med? Maybe? Help? > > And 3 more for your thinking pleasure... > > What would be " Perforated Wind Syndrome " in Western med? and > > " Endogenous Wind Syndrome " and > > " " Head-Wind Syndrome " > > Thank you much in advance. > > Kind regards, > Gloria R. Osorio L. Ac., B.S., MSOM > Candidate DAOM, Oregon College of Oriental Medicine > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 10, 2010 Report Share Posted February 10, 2010 Thank you Steve. And do you by any chance know the approximate correlation of those syndromes in Western med? And I know we don't have a patient to disect; and I also know that Chinese syndromes are not translations of Western diagnoses, that's why I ask for an " approximate " correlation. Thanks. Gloria ________________________________ Steven Alpern <stevenalpern Wed, February 10, 2010 2:56:47 PM Re: HELP Â According to my training, Suwen chapter 42 discusses the penetration of perverse (external) wind into the embodied spirit. Perverse wind penetrates through the superficial layers in contrast to pestilent wind, which enters through the mouth and nose and can enter the (primary) channels directly. The penetration of perverse wind lay the conceptual foundation of SHL, while pestilent wind was much later elucidated in the Wenbing tradition. Perverse wind penetrates through the superficial layers (taiyang in SHL language) and collects in the occiput. *In this context*, " head wind " or " brain wind " is a taiyang occipital headache, and eye wind is red/itchy eyes that are characteristic of what modern TCM calls wind-heat. In SHL terminology, this is the beginning of wind penetrating from taiyang to yangming. Since the kidneys control the exterior in SW, when one opens the exterior (by sweating) while releasing essence (during sex) the embodied spirit's resources for resisting " attacks " by wind are left inadequate. Attack by wind in that circumstance penetrates directly to the interior (and is called " internal, " even though its source was external). I'm sorry, I don't understand what you mean by " perforated wind. " Steve On Wed, Feb 10, 2010 at 1:12 PM, The Traveler <dumai20baihui@ >wrote: > > > Hi Yehuda-- Thank you. > > However, it is precisely the Suwen Chapter 42 that I'm reading and working > on and looking for a correlation of the diseases in Western medicine. Thanks > for the response though. > > Kind regards, > Gloria > > ____________ _________ _________ __ > <%40. com>> > < %40. com> > Wed, February 10, 2010 3:05:20 PM > Re: HELP > > > > Hi Gloria, > > Don't have much time, but see Su Wen 42. > > > www.traditionaljewi shmedicine. net > www.traditionaljewi shmedicine. blogspot. com > > > ____________ _________ _________ __ > The Traveler <dumai20baihui@ > > > Wed, February 10, 2010 8:29:10 AM > HELP > > Hi everyone-- > > Anyone knows what is " Brain-Wind Syndrome " ? Never heard it. (Is it maybe an > airhead? :-) and what diagnosis would it be in Western med? > > Also, " Eye-Wind syndrome " This is when blood rushes quickly to the > UpperJiao and gathers in the inner canthus (according to Maciocia this is > heart area in eye diagnosis) Would it be a sign of an impending stroke in > Western med? Maybe? Help? > > And 3 more for your thinking pleasure... > > What would be " Perforated Wind Syndrome " in Western med? and > > " Endogenous Wind Syndrome " and > > " " Head-Wind Syndrome " > > Thank you much in advance. > > Kind regards, > Gloria R. Osorio L. Ac., B.S., MSOM > Candidate DAOM, Oregon College of Oriental Medicine > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 11, 2010 Report Share Posted February 11, 2010 Hi Gloria, I don't have much to say to further clarify presentations for perverse wind, beyond what I wrote in my previous post (for head wind and eye wind), though brain wind may be seen as the result of head wind penetrating directly into the interior (the brain) as pathology from the occiputal headache. However, I'm skeptical about that because " brain wind " directly precedes " eye wind " in the chapter, signifying the progression of perverse wind from Fengfu (where it collects from the superficial layers) to the eyes where it is beginning to be subject to yangming (internalizing). So, I believe this " brain wind " simply denotes the trajectory of progressing perverse wind. Once perverse wind internalizes according to its usual progression, it goes to the abdomen. There it disturbs the mechanisms for generating post-natal qi, which leads to myriad diseases (SW, chapter 3) by continuing to penetrate further. This may confuse you further: while the sequence information is presented is important throughout Neijing, it's generally not linearly organized. That is, the text goes on tangents then circles about (which by the way Jeffrey Yuen faithfully reproduces), always challenging a reader's coherent understanding and offering little aid in attempts to render a systematic and clearly defined doctrine. Near the end of chapter 42, it mentions conditions where wind has penetrated into the zang and stomach (organs). Yet, after those the text " circles " back about to clearly " external " conditions such as head wind -- characterized by sweating and aversion to wind. Also, chapter 42 *may* have a " lower harmonic " (and intermixed) discussion of pestilent wind, though I don't see it that way. Those sorts of things (circuitous ordering and multiple " harmonics " ) appear to me common throughout Neijing, which in my opinion is more about stimulating the thinking process for perceiving the dynamic-responsive nature of life, rather than presenting a consistent body of information (as in a textbook). Relative to pestilent wind, the presentations would be more *acutely*serious (inflammatory), because it enters directly into the channels, which inspires a much more urgent response. I believe the mention of hemiplegia in the opening question speaks to the accumulation of perverse wind that has penetrated, rather than the acute strike of pestilent wind, and the beginning of Qi Bo's answer seems to bear that out. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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