Guest guest Posted May 21, 2002 Report Share Posted May 21, 2002 Thought this article was worth sharing, even though it's from a Jewish perspective, I think it relates to us all... to get us thinking about our conversations with our kids. Michelle ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ A Jewish Vegetarian Child Asks Eighteen Questions By Stanley M. Sapon, Ph.D. Mama, I'm really happy that we're a vegetarian family, but I don't understand all the reasons you and Papa became vegetarians. Well, it has a lot to do with our being Jewish. You know how often we talk about the commandment of Tsa'ar Ba'alei Chaim --- the commandment to avoid inflicting suffering on living creatures. We've taken those instructions really to heart. That's why we have committed ourselves to obeying the orders Ha Shem ('The Name' or G-d) gave to Adam and Eve in Bereishit; " Behold I have given you every herb yielding seed which is upon the face of the earth, and every tree, in which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed -- to you it shall be for food. " That's why we have chosen not to kill living creatures for our food. " Yes, I know. The teacher had us read the part where we're instructed not to take a bird's babies from her nest while the mother can see that. Then she told us how Moses Maimonides explained that the commandments about animal mothers and their babies are supposed to make us understand that the pain an animal mother feels when she loses her baby is exactly the same as the pain that a human mother would feel. Yes, my dear . . . it's a terrible thing to lose a baby! Do you remember how unhappy Leah and Simon were last year when they lost their baby after only a few days? Yes, and I guess that's what made me think about animals and their babies, and what happens to those babies. And I suppose what I learned in biology class about mammals and things . . . the teacher kind of talked in circles about a lot of things. Mama . . . does that have anything to do with S-E-X? Oh, Sweetie, how you make me smile! It sure does . . . that's why I suppose it made the teacher uncomfortable. What would you really like to know? Tell me more about how cows give milk. Well, first of all, a cow is a mammal, just like we are. When a female mammal is pregnant, her breasts start getting ready to make milk. So when a female tiger, a hippopotamus, a zebra, a lioness or a cow gives birth to a baby, her breasts fill with milk . . .. just like it happened with me when you were born. Oh, yes! And then you nursed me, right? Did you like that -- nursing me, I mean? Yes I did. It was wonderful. It made me feel close to you, and I knew I was making you strong and healthy with my milk. Is the milk from a cow, or a zebra or an elephant different from your milk? It sure is. Every female mammal makes a special kind of milk that's just perfect for her baby. So when cousin Miriam's cat, Cleopatra, had kittens last year, her breasts made the very special kind of milk that baby kittens need to have. Does cat's milk taste good? Oh, silly! What a weird idea . . . to think of drinking a cat's milk! Besides, if we took the cat's milk, what would the kittens live on? I guess that was a silly question! It certainly was. But if a cat starts to make milk after she has a baby, how come I didn't see any milk coming out of her last week when I was playing with Cleo? Of course not! After the babies grow big enough to eat grown-up food the mother's breasts stop making milk. Sweetie, believe me, it was wonderful when my breasts kept filling up with milk when you were tiny, but it would have been a real strain on me if my breasts just continued to make milk all my life! Then there are some things that I just don't understand . . . like . . . I thought cows just naturally give milk all their lives. All the cows we see when we drive in the country have those huge udders, and they always seem to be bulging with milk. And I just this minute thought of something else . . . if cows make milk only after they have a baby, and they make milk to feed their baby . . . how come we never see any cow babies in the fields alongside their mothers? Well . . . it . . . it . . . gets a little complicated. I mean, if the cows are full of milk, and there are no babies around to drink the milk, what happens to all that milk, and where are the babies? Well . . . like I said, it's kind of complicated. Actually, the farmer milks the cows and sends the milk to the store for us. But if the cows make milk for their babies, and we drink that milk, what becomes of the babies? Well, they take them away from the mother cow almost right after they're born. But if we drink the cow's milk, what do the babies drink? They, uh . . . feed the babies . . . actually we don't call them " babies " . . . the proper word really is " calves " . . . on a kind of formula. Is that as perfect for the baby calves as their own special mothers' milk? I mean, can they grow up to be big and healthy on this " formula? " Well . . . it's OK (sic) for them. I have one big question that I never thought about before: You said it was silly to think about drinking a cat's milk -- I understood that. But why do WE drink cow's milk that was meant for a calf? Because it's tasty and good for us,(sic) and we enjoy all the delicious things that come from it, like all kinds of cheeses, and yogurt, and sour cream, and ice-cream, and whipped cream. If it's good for us, isn't it good for the baby cows? It doesn't seem fair, Mama. Shouldn't we let the babies drink their own mother's milk? Well . . . sure, perhaps, but . . . And besides, doesn't it make the cow feel awful to have her baby taken away from her? . . . to make her lose her baby? Well, she's only a cow. It probably doesn't bother her that much. But the Torah teaches that animals have the same kind of love for their babies that we do! Yes, dear, but like I said --- it's more complicated than that. Mama, you're beginning to sound like my teacher in school. And you never told me just what happens to the calves after they're taken away from their mothers. We never see them, so just what does happen to them? A few of the girl cows get to grow up, and the farmer sees to it that they get pregnant and have calves, and then they give milk for us to drink. Wait a minute . . . I heard that! What do you mean the " farmer sees to it that they get pregnant and have calves? " I remember everything you explained to me about how a woman gets pregnant -- after she chooses her husband. Doesn't the cow have to have a husband too? Well . . . sort of. I mean the farmer brings . . . actually it is really terribly complicated how a cow gets pregnant; you know she has to have a bab..er a calf before she can give milk. We can talk about that later. OK. But I know that boy cows can never have a baby and give milk, so what happens to them? Sweetie, it's almost 4 o'clock, and I have to start making dinner. Do you want to help set the table? Mama . . . you're changing the subject! What happens to the boy calves? Well . . . since they're no good for milk, after a while they get sent to the Shochet . . . Mama! Are you telling me that the boy calves are killed! What for ?? Well, to make veal that some people eat. But Mama . . . you said we were vegetarians because we believed it was wrong to kill animals to eat! Yes, dear, but we don't eat veal. Yes, but other people do, and the only reason there are baby cows around to kill and eat is because the farmer makes the cow have a baby so she can give milk .. . . for us to drink! Oh, Mama. I can't stand this any more. Every time I see a glass of milk now I will know that a baby calf was killed for that milk, and that a mother cow had her baby taken away from her . . . It's all so terribly cruel. .. . . Mama . . . I don't think I want to drink milk any more . . . or eat cheese . . . or ice cream . . . or anything that came from a cow. I want to be a real vegetarian. (Dr. Sapon is Professor Emeritus of Psycholinguistics, University of Rochester (NY) and Co-Founder of the Rochester Area Vegetarian Society.) Jewish Vegetarian/Vegan families: Post message: JVeg Subscribe: JVeg- LAUNCH - Your Music Experience http://launch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 22, 2002 Report Share Posted May 22, 2002 Thanks Michelle, What a great story. I passed it on to many friends. Laura -Peace begins in the kitchen! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 28, 2002 Report Share Posted May 28, 2002 Thanks for sharing this....it was wonderful....quite thought-provoking...I don't know where you found this, but I'd love to see this widely circulated. - Michelle B Monday, May 27, 2002 8:07 PM Re: Re: McDonalds & talking to our kids Thought this article was worth sharing, even though it's from a Jewish perspective, I think it relates to us all... to get us thinking about our conversations with our kids. Michelle ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ A Jewish Vegetarian Child Asks Eighteen Questions By Stanley M. Sapon, Ph.D. Mama, I'm really happy that we're a vegetarian family, but I don't understand all the reasons you and Papa became vegetarians. Well, it has a lot to do with our being Jewish. You know how often we talk about the commandment of Tsa'ar Ba'alei Chaim --- the commandment to avoid inflicting suffering on living creatures. We've taken those instructions really to heart. That's why we have committed ourselves to obeying the orders Ha Shem ('The Name' or G-d) gave to Adam and Eve in Bereishit; " Behold I have given you every herb yielding seed which is upon the face of the earth, and every tree, in which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed -- to you it shall be for food. " That's why we have chosen not to kill living creatures for our food. " Yes, I know. The teacher had us read the part where we're instructed not to take a bird's babies from her nest while the mother can see that. Then she told us how Moses Maimonides explained that the commandments about animal mothers and their babies are supposed to make us understand that the pain an animal mother feels when she loses her baby is exactly the same as the pain that a human mother would feel. Yes, my dear . . . it's a terrible thing to lose a baby! Do you remember how unhappy Leah and Simon were last year when they lost their baby after only a few days? Yes, and I guess that's what made me think about animals and their babies, and what happens to those babies. And I suppose what I learned in biology class about mammals and things . . . the teacher kind of talked in circles about a lot of things. Mama . . . does that have anything to do with S-E-X? Oh, Sweetie, how you make me smile! It sure does . . . that's why I suppose it made the teacher uncomfortable. What would you really like to know? Tell me more about how cows give milk. Well, first of all, a cow is a mammal, just like we are. When a female mammal is pregnant, her breasts start getting ready to make milk. So when a female tiger, a hippopotamus, a zebra, a lioness or a cow gives birth to a baby, her breasts fill with milk . . .. just like it happened with me when you were born. Oh, yes! And then you nursed me, right? Did you like that -- nursing me, I mean? Yes I did. It was wonderful. It made me feel close to you, and I knew I was making you strong and healthy with my milk. Is the milk from a cow, or a zebra or an elephant different from your milk? It sure is. Every female mammal makes a special kind of milk that's just perfect for her baby. So when cousin Miriam's cat, Cleopatra, had kittens last year, her breasts made the very special kind of milk that baby kittens need to have. Does cat's milk taste good? Oh, silly! What a weird idea . . . to think of drinking a cat's milk! Besides, if we took the cat's milk, what would the kittens live on? I guess that was a silly question! It certainly was. But if a cat starts to make milk after she has a baby, how come I didn't see any milk coming out of her last week when I was playing with Cleo? Of course not! After the babies grow big enough to eat grown-up food the mother's breasts stop making milk. Sweetie, believe me, it was wonderful when my breasts kept filling up with milk when you were tiny, but it would have been a real strain on me if my breasts just continued to make milk all my life! Then there are some things that I just don't understand . . . like . . . I thought cows just naturally give milk all their lives. All the cows we see when we drive in the country have those huge udders, and they always seem to be bulging with milk. And I just this minute thought of something else . . . if cows make milk only after they have a baby, and they make milk to feed their baby . . . how come we never see any cow babies in the fields alongside their mothers? Well . . . it . . . it . . . gets a little complicated. I mean, if the cows are full of milk, and there are no babies around to drink the milk, what happens to all that milk, and where are the babies? Well . . . like I said, it's kind of complicated. Actually, the farmer milks the cows and sends the milk to the store for us. But if the cows make milk for their babies, and we drink that milk, what becomes of the babies? Well, they take them away from the mother cow almost right after they're born. But if we drink the cow's milk, what do the babies drink? They, uh . . . feed the babies . . . actually we don't call them " babies " . . . the proper word really is " calves " . . . on a kind of formula. Is that as perfect for the baby calves as their own special mothers' milk? I mean, can they grow up to be big and healthy on this " formula? " Well . . . it's OK (sic) for them. I have one big question that I never thought about before: You said it was silly to think about drinking a cat's milk -- I understood that. But why do WE drink cow's milk that was meant for a calf? Because it's tasty and good for us,(sic) and we enjoy all the delicious things that come from it, like all kinds of cheeses, and yogurt, and sour cream, and ice-cream, and whipped cream. If it's good for us, isn't it good for the baby cows? It doesn't seem fair, Mama. Shouldn't we let the babies drink their own mother's milk? Well . . . sure, perhaps, but . . . And besides, doesn't it make the cow feel awful to have her baby taken away from her? . . . to make her lose her baby? Well, she's only a cow. It probably doesn't bother her that much. But the Torah teaches that animals have the same kind of love for their babies that we do! Yes, dear, but like I said --- it's more complicated than that. Mama, you're beginning to sound like my teacher in school. And you never told me just what happens to the calves after they're taken away from their mothers. We never see them, so just what does happen to them? A few of the girl cows get to grow up, and the farmer sees to it that they get pregnant and have calves, and then they give milk for us to drink. Wait a minute . . . I heard that! What do you mean the " farmer sees to it that they get pregnant and have calves? " I remember everything you explained to me about how a woman gets pregnant -- after she chooses her husband. Doesn't the cow have to have a husband too? Well . . . sort of. I mean the farmer brings . . . actually it is really terribly complicated how a cow gets pregnant; you know she has to have a bab..er a calf before she can give milk. We can talk about that later. OK. But I know that boy cows can never have a baby and give milk, so what happens to them? Sweetie, it's almost 4 o'clock, and I have to start making dinner. Do you want to help set the table? Mama . . . you're changing the subject! What happens to the boy calves? Well . . . since they're no good for milk, after a while they get sent to the Shochet . . . Mama! Are you telling me that the boy calves are killed! What for ?? Well, to make veal that some people eat. But Mama . . . you said we were vegetarians because we believed it was wrong to kill animals to eat! Yes, dear, but we don't eat veal. Yes, but other people do, and the only reason there are baby cows around to kill and eat is because the farmer makes the cow have a baby so she can give milk .. . . for us to drink! Oh, Mama. I can't stand this any more. Every time I see a glass of milk now I will know that a baby calf was killed for that milk, and that a mother cow had her baby taken away from her . . . It's all so terribly cruel. .. . . Mama . . . I don't think I want to drink milk any more . . . or eat cheese . . . or ice cream . . . or anything that came from a cow. I want to be a real vegetarian. (Dr. Sapon is Professor Emeritus of Psycholinguistics, University of Rochester (NY) and Co-Founder of the Rochester Area Vegetarian Society.) Jewish Vegetarian/Vegan families: Post message: JVeg Subscribe: JVeg- LAUNCH - Your Music Experience http://launch. For more information about vegetarianism, please visit the VRG website at http://www.vrg.org and for materials especially useful for families go to http://www.vrg.org/family. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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