Answers to Christine's questions - Ron's Chart...

[Guest guest]

Dear Sanjay and List members

 

All my thanks for this professoral answer. I prepared questions on

Margarita's email before reading yours so I will try not to duplicate

questions. Actually, your approaches are quite different and it's helpful. My

questions in all caps.

KRUSHNA, can you review my attempted summary at the end of QI and critique

it, please?

 

Date of Marriage

 

Q1. Is it correct to say that marriage could have occurred during the sub of

the lord of any of the houses A,B,C,D,E or any one of the planets in these

houses?

For instance, could Mars have given marriage had it not been both lord of D

and in house E.

 

Ans - No. Marriage can only occur in the sub-period of the strongest

significator or its samdharmi. If the strongest significator or its

samdharmis are disqualified for some reason,

ARE THERE DISQUALIFICATIONS OTHER THAN 1. ASPECTS DISCUSSED IN Q2.

2. FOR A SAMDHARMI, THE FACT THAT HIS PRINCIPAL HAS 4 OR MORE POINTS.

3. FOR BOTH OF THEM, LOCATION IN D OR E HSE WITH LESS THAN 4 PTS, in the

natal sign, AND NOT LORD OF THE HSE?

 

then it can occur in the sub-period of the 2nd or 3rd significator or their

samdharmi. The samdharmi, if other than Rahu or Ketu, must have more than 12

points.

12 PTS OR MORE ---OR---MORE THAN 12 PTS?

 

Mars being in house D or E is not relevant as it has less than 4 points.

It's being the lord of D or E is relevant only because it gives extra points

to Mars in the worksheet.

I UNDERSTAND THE SENTENCE BEFORE LAST. I AM CONFUSED BY THE LAST ONE. IS THE

ABOVE STATEMENT CONSISTENT WITH MARGARITA'S CITE OF P23 OF LESSON 4? THAT

EXTRACT FROM THE LESSON DOES NOT MENTION THE NEED FOR POINTS FOR THE D/E

LORDS.

 

If Mars had more points due to some other reason,

but was not the lord of D or E, it would still give marriage. Its having

high points, as well as being the lord of D or E, increases its ability to

give the result.

SO ULTIMATELY POINTS ARE THE MOST IMPORTANT FACTOR BECAUSE THEY TAKE CARE OF

ALL RELEVANT CONSIDERATIONS?

IS THERE A LIST OF ALL FACTORS REQUIRING ADJUSTMENT IN PTS?

 

THE ABOVE STATEMENTS TAKEN TOGETHER [AND WITH Q2 ANSWERS] SEEM TO SAY,

I. LEAVING SAMDHARMIS ASIDE, ANY PLANET CAN BE THE SIGNIFICATOR FOR ANY

MATTER AND PRODUCE RESULTS FOR ANY HOUSE DURING HIS SUB provided IT HAS THE

HIGHEST NUMBER OF POINTS*** FROM AMONG ALL PLANETS [iNCLUDING HIMSELF] THAT

ARE NOT DISQUALIFIED BY REASON OF [x] THROWING AN ASPECT ON HSE A,B OR C

[uNLESS SUCH PLANET IS LORD OF D OR E], OR [y] SITTING IN HSE D OR E WITH

LESS THAN 4 PTS [uNLESS LORD OF THE HSE WHERE IT SITS]. [***THE INITIAL

NUMBER OF POINTS EACH PLANET HAS BEING ADJUSTED AMONG THE PLANETS DEPENDING

UPON THE HSE TAKEN AS B HSE.]

II. IF THE PRINCIPAL SIGNIFICATOR IS DISQUALIFIED FOR ASPECTUAL AND OTHER

REASONS SPECIFIED ABOVE, THEN DURING ITS SUB HIS NATURAL OR FUNCTIONAL

SAMDHARMI WILL GIVE RESULTS PROVIDED IT ITSELF [x] IS NOT DISQUALIFIED FOR

ASPECTUAL REASONS OR BY REASON OF SITTING IN D OR E WITH LESS THAN 4 PTS IN

ITS NATAL SIGN BEFORE ADJUSTMENT, [y] HAS MORE THAN 12 PTS [OR 12 OR MORE???]

AND [z] ITS " BOSS " HAS AT LEAST 4 PTS IN ITS NATAL SIGN BEFORE ADJUSTMENTS.

III. LASTLY, IF THE SAMDHARMI OF THE PRINCIPAL SIGNIFICATOR CAN ACT, THEN THE

SECOND STRONGEST SIGNIFICATOR WILL NOT BE ABLE TO ACT DURING HIS OWN SUB.

IS THIS A CORRECT AND COMPLETE SUMMARY OF THE RULE?

 

Q2. Does a planet a. aspecting or conjoining the lord of house ABCD or E or

b. aspecting house ABCD or E also qualify to give by itself the relevant

event during its sub?

 

Ans - The planet would not give the result by itself due to aspecting one of

the houses. Actually, if it aspects house AB or C, it would be disqualified

to give the result unless it is the lord of D or E. Aspecting the lord or

the house would eventually be translated to the points that it adds or

reduces from (depending on whether its aspect is benefic or malefic) the

strength.

WHICH ARE CONSIDERED BENEFIC, MALEFIC, NEUTRAL?

For example, if a planet with 5 points, not the lord of D or E,

aspects A, it will reduce 5 points from its total strength thus reducing its

chances of its samdharmi giving the result (this planet itself cannot give

the result because of its sight on A.)

GREAT EXPLANATION. ARE THE POINTS ADDED/DEDUCTED FROM THOSE INITIALLY

RECEIVED BY THE PLANET IN THE SARVASHTAKVARGA IN THE HOUSE IN WHICH IT

RESIDES IN THE NATAL CHART?

 

COULD WE DO A SESSION ON NATURE OF ASPECTS, LORDSHIPS AND LOCATIONS THAT

GIVE/TAKE AWAY POINTS?

 

Q3. Does the dispositor of the lord of, or of the planets located in houses

ABCD or E also qualify to give by itself the relevant event in its sub.

 

Ans - Not due to this reasoning. It might be able to give the result if it

has enough points and is not disqualified.

 

Q4. Is it necessary that the relevant planet have a particular number of

points to qualify?

 

Ans - Yes. Normally the planet with the highest points or its samdharmi

gives the result. However, the samdharmi must have at least 12 points to

qualify. It is better if the samdharmi is the 2nd or 3rd strongest

significator.

CAN BOTH NATURAL SAMDHARMIS [i.E. IRRESPECTIVE OF ACTUAL POSITIONS, COULD

EVEN BE 2/12] AND FUNCTIONAL SAMDHARMIS GIVE THE RESULT FOR A PLANET?

 

Q5. If a planet X is in the same sign as the lord of a relevant house, but

the 2 planets are 15 degree or more apart, can X be deemed conjoined to the

lord of the house for the above purpose?

 

Ans - Yes. In this system, conjunction is taken as same sign. It is

principally used for determining samdharmi relationship.

 

Q6. With certain caveats, relating to strength, a planet X in the 4th house

from another planet Y can give the results of Y during X's sub even though X

has no links with the relevant houses, assuming Y does?

 

Ans - Actually, the system does not require either X or Y to have any link

with the houses. OK

Apart from strength, you have to see whether Y has less

than 4 points

OK, Y IS PRINCIPAL

and also whether X has more points than Y. If X has more

points than Y then X becomes samdharmi to Y and that is the reason it can

give the results for Y.

ARE YOU SURE? I DON'T THINK THIS IS WHAT KRUSHNA SAID WHEN HE DISCUSSED

JUPITER W/ 3 AS PRINCIPAL AND SATURN W/ 1 AS SAMDHARMI IN RON'S CHART. I MAY

WELL BE WRONG BUT I THINK HE SAID THAT SATURN DID GIVE RESULTS FOR JUPITER,

BUT NEGATIVE RATHER THAN POSITIVE AS A RESULT OF HIS POINT DEFICIENCY.

 

Q7. Are there any other indicators than as above to figure out if the lord

of a sub is activated for a given question.

 

Ans - I will pass this one.

OK. ONE MORE QUESTION: A FUNCTIONAL SAMDHARMI MUST BE PHYSICALLY LOCATED IN

THE 4TH FROM ITS PRINCIPAL. TRUE?

A NATURAL SAMDHARMI MAY BE LOCATED IN ANY HSE VIS A VIS ITS PRINCIPAL. TRUE?

 

Krushna had a great idea!

With all my thanks and regards

Christine

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Dear Christine,

 

Please do not take my answers as final. We are going through this exchange

so that Krushnaji can correct all of us.

 

With that caveat in mind, read on. My comments are preceded by ->.

 

Sanjay

 

 

 

Dear Sanjay and List members

 

All my thanks for this professoral answer. I prepared questions on

Margarita's email before reading yours so I will try not to duplicate

questions. Actually, your approaches are quite different and it's helpful.

My

questions in all caps.

KRUSHNA, can you review my attempted summary at the end of QI and critique

it, please?

 

Date of Marriage

 

Q1. Is it correct to say that marriage could have occurred during the sub

of

the lord of any of the houses A,B,C,D,E or any one of the planets in these

houses?

For instance, could Mars have given marriage had it not been both lord of D

and in house E.

 

Ans - No. Marriage can only occur in the sub-period of the strongest

significator or its samdharmi. If the strongest significator or its

samdharmis are disqualified for some reason,

ARE THERE DISQUALIFICATIONS OTHER THAN 1. ASPECTS DISCUSSED IN Q2.

->There are no other disqualifications for the planet. However, you have to

look at the delay making factors such as Saturn's aspect etc.

 

2. FOR A SAMDHARMI, THE FACT THAT HIS PRINCIPAL HAS 4 OR MORE POINTS.

-> The points of a principal in its AV are not relevant.

 

3. FOR BOTH OF THEM, LOCATION IN D OR E HSE WITH LESS THAN 4 PTS, in the

natal sign, AND NOT LORD OF THE HSE?

-> Again, the individual points are not relevant.

 

then it can occur in the sub-period of the 2nd or 3rd significator or their

samdharmi. The samdharmi, if other than Rahu or Ketu, must have more than 12

points.

12 PTS OR MORE ---OR---MORE THAN 12 PTS?

-> Sorry. It should be 12 points or more.

 

Mars being in house D or E is not relevant as it has less than 4 points.

It's being the lord of D or E is relevant only because it gives extra

points

to Mars in the worksheet.

I UNDERSTAND THE SENTENCE BEFORE LAST. I AM CONFUSED BY THE LAST ONE. IS THE

ABOVE STATEMENT CONSISTENT WITH MARGARITA'S CITE OF P23 OF LESSON 4? THAT

EXTRACT FROM THE LESSON DOES NOT MENTION THE NEED FOR POINTS FOR THE D/E

LORDS.

-> The lords of D or E are eager to give the result. However, they must have

12 points or more in the sheet.

 

If Mars had more points due to some other reason,

but was not the lord of D or E, it would still give marriage. Its having

high points, as well as being the lord of D or E, increases its ability to

give the result.

SO ULTIMATELY POINTS ARE THE MOST IMPORTANT FACTOR BECAUSE THEY TAKE CARE OF

ALL RELEVANT CONSIDERATIONS?

IS THERE A LIST OF ALL FACTORS REQUIRING ADJUSTMENT IN PTS?

-> Yes, points are necessary for the event to fructify. The adjustment of

points has to be done only for the lord of 12th of B. However, that also

does not affect the abillity of the planet to give the result. It only

affects the quality of the result.

 

THE ABOVE STATEMENTS TAKEN TOGETHER [AND WITH Q2 ANSWERS] SEEM TO SAY,

 

I. LEAVING SAMDHARMIS ASIDE, ANY PLANET CAN BE THE SIGNIFICATOR FOR ANY

MATTER AND PRODUCE RESULTS FOR ANY HOUSE DURING HIS SUB provided IT HAS THE

HIGHEST NUMBER OF POINTS*** FROM AMONG ALL PLANETS [iNCLUDING HIMSELF] THAT

ARE NOT DISQUALIFIED BY REASON OF [x] THROWING AN ASPECT ON HSE A,B OR C

[uNLESS SUCH PLANET IS LORD OF D OR E],

-> correct so far

 

OR [y] SITTING IN HSE D OR E WITH LESS THAN 4 PTS [uNLESS LORD OF THE HSE

WHERE IT SITS]. [***THE INITIAL NUMBER OF POINTS EACH PLANET HAS BEING

ADJUSTED AMONG THE PLANETS DEPENDING UPON THE HSE TAKEN AS B HSE.]

-> sitting in D or E with less than 4 points does not automatically

disqualify the planet.

 

II. IF THE PRINCIPAL SIGNIFICATOR IS DISQUALIFIED FOR ASPECTUAL AND OTHER

REASONS SPECIFIED ABOVE,

-> There are no other reasons

 

THEN DURING ITS SUB HIS NATURAL OR FUNCTIONAL

SAMDHARMI WILL GIVE RESULTS PROVIDED IT ITSELF [x] IS NOT DISQUALIFIED FOR

ASPECTUAL REASONS OR BY REASON OF SITTING IN D OR E WITH LESS THAN 4 PTS IN

ITS NATAL SIGN BEFORE ADJUSTMENT,

-> As I understand, less than 4 points in D or E is not a disqualification.

It is just that any planet is D or E with more than 4 points gets extra

points in the worksheet as it is more able to give the result. While an

aspect on ABC actually disqualifies planets, being in D or E with less than

4 points is not a disqualification. It is simply not added strength.

 

[y] HAS MORE THAN 12 PTS [OR 12 OR MORE???]

-> 12 or more

 

AND [z] ITS " BOSS " HAS AT LEAST 4 PTS IN ITS NATAL SIGN BEFORE ADJUSTMENTS.

-> actually the boss, when you are talking about 4:10 rule for samdharmi,

should have less than 4 points.

 

III. LASTLY, IF THE SAMDHARMI OF THE PRINCIPAL SIGNIFICATOR CAN ACT, THEN

THE SECOND STRONGEST SIGNIFICATOR WILL NOT BE ABLE TO ACT DURING HIS OWN

SUB.

-> Actually it can. For this you have to see whether there are any delay

producing factors. If there are no delay producing factors, then the 2nd or

3rd significator can also give the result in its sub.

 

IS THIS A CORRECT AND COMPLETE SUMMARY OF THE RULE?

-> I would leave Kruhnaji to comment on that.

 

Q2. Does a planet a. aspecting or conjoining the lord of house ABCD or E or

b. aspecting house ABCD or E also qualify to give by itself the relevant

event during its sub?

 

Ans - The planet would not give the result by itself due to aspecting one

of

the houses. Actually, if it aspects house AB or C, it would be disqualified

to give the result unless it is the lord of D or E. Aspecting the lord or

the house would eventually be translated to the points that it adds or

reduces from (depending on whether its aspect is benefic or malefic) the

strength.

WHICH ARE CONSIDERED BENEFIC, MALEFIC, NEUTRAL?

->Benefic aspect is when the aspecting planet has less than 4 points.

Malefic is when it has more than 4. 4 is neutral.

 

For example, if a planet with 5 points, not the lord of D or E,

aspects A, it will reduce 5 points from its total strength thus reducing

its

chances of its samdharmi giving the result (this planet itself cannot give

the result because of its sight on A.)

GREAT EXPLANATION. ARE THE POINTS ADDED/DEDUCTED FROM THOSE INITIALLY

RECEIVED BY THE PLANET IN THE SARVASHTAKVARGA IN THE HOUSE IN WHICH IT

RESIDES IN THE NATAL CHART?

->No. Only in the worksheet for the matter in consideration.

 

COULD WE DO A SESSION ON NATURE OF ASPECTS, LORDSHIPS AND LOCATIONS THAT

GIVE/TAKE AWAY POINTS?

-> It is all covered in lessons. You must find a way to read them. If you

like, I can send these to you as an email attachment but I do not know if

you have the software.

 

Q3. Does the dispositor of the lord of, or of the planets located in houses

ABCD or E also qualify to give by itself the relevant event in its sub.

 

Ans - Not due to this reasoning. It might be able to give the result if it

has enough points and is not disqualified.

 

Q4. Is it necessary that the relevant planet have a particular number of

points to qualify?

 

Ans - Yes. Normally the planet with the highest points or its samdharmi

gives the result. However, the samdharmi must have at least 12 points to

qualify. It is better if the samdharmi is the 2nd or 3rd strongest

significator.

CAN BOTH NATURAL SAMDHARMIS [i.E. IRRESPECTIVE OF ACTUAL POSITIONS, COULD

EVEN BE 2/12] AND FUNCTIONAL SAMDHARMIS GIVE THE RESULT FOR A PLANET?

-> According to what Krushnaji has taught is so far, yes. However, it is an

interesting point and I would be happy to hear his views on this again.

 

Q5. If a planet X is in the same sign as the lord of a relevant house, but

the 2 planets are 15 degree or more apart, can X be deemed conjoined to the

lord of the house for the above purpose?

 

Ans - Yes. In this system, conjunction is taken as same sign. It is

principally used for determining samdharmi relationship.

 

Q6. With certain caveats, relating to strength, a planet X in the 4th house

from another planet Y can give the results of Y during X's sub even though

X

has no links with the relevant houses, assuming Y does?

 

Ans - Actually, the system does not require either X or Y to have any link

with the houses. OK

Apart from strength, you have to see whether Y has less

than 4 points

OK, Y IS PRINCIPAL

and also whether X has more points than Y. If X has more

points than Y then X becomes samdharmi to Y and that is the reason it can

give the results for Y.

ARE YOU SURE? I DON'T THINK THIS IS WHAT KRUSHNA SAID WHEN HE DISCUSSED

JUPITER W/ 3 AS PRINCIPAL AND SATURN W/ 1 AS SAMDHARMI IN RON'S CHART. I MAY

WELL BE WRONG BUT I THINK HE SAID THAT SATURN DID GIVE RESULTS FOR JUPITER,

BUT NEGATIVE RATHER THAN POSITIVE AS A RESULT OF HIS POINT DEFICIENCY.

->Actually, it did not give the result for Jupiter. It gave opposite result.

 

Q7. Are there any other indicators than as above to figure out if the lord

of a sub is activated for a given question.

 

Ans - I will pass this one.

OK. ONE MORE QUESTION: A FUNCTIONAL SAMDHARMI MUST BE PHYSICALLY LOCATED IN

THE 4TH FROM ITS PRINCIPAL. TRUE?

->this is one of the rules. But there are other also rules for planets being

samdharmi. The principal one is that if planets are in the same sign or

constellation, these are samdharmi. In addition, Rahu is samdharmi to the

planet in whose sign or constellation it might be. Similarly for Ketu.

 

A NATURAL SAMDHARMI MAY BE LOCATED IN ANY HSE VIS A VIS ITS PRINCIPAL. TRUE?

-> Yes.

 

Krushna had a great idea!

With all my thanks and regards

Christine