Guest guest Posted June 10, 2002 Report Share Posted June 10, 2002 Thanks for that posting, amy. I used to work in marketing for the Hain Celestial Group and I can tell you that I, and the assistant I hired, were the ONLY VEGETARIANS in the company - from what I could tell. And now that we're not there anymore, not sure that there's anyone left there to promote the wants and needs of vegans. H-C is a big, corporate, money-making machine. They view vegans as too small a population to warrant marketing to them. I'm not writing this to discourage you from activism. Just had to chime in with my 2-cents as I was on the inside and can speak firsthand on the issue. _____ email hain celestial group to veganize their vegetarian foods and remove ingredients such as sodium caseinate from their seasoned grain products (casbah), etc.. consumeraffairs - Sunday, June 09, 2002 1:04 PM [sFBAVeg] Digest Number 231 *Tell your friends to Be-A-Veg with SFBAVeg! To , send an e-mail to: - *To share a message with the group: *Manage your SFBAVeg list subscription: -Switch to no-mail: -nomail -Switch to daily digest: -digest -Switch to individual messages: -normal -Leave the group: - *If you have questions about the list, please contact Tammy & Chris, list admins, at -owner * ------ There are 10 messages in this issue. Topics in this digest: 1. How in the HECK did I become a vegie? Thomas Robertson <tjjuggle 2. SF Alemany Farmer's Market " Tammy " <tammy 3. Bamboo Garden Restaurant closed on June 30 sunny outdoors <sunny_outdoors 4. Continued: Bamboo Garden Restaurant closed on June 30 sunny outdoors <sunny_outdoors 5. email hain celestial group to veganize their vegetarian foods " amy lynn (veggie grrrl) " <amy 6. Vandals leave deer carcasses at Pleasanton High School " Christine Morrissey " <empress_bean 7. Is rodeo a tribute to the Wild West or cruel exploitation? " Christine Morrissey " <empress_bean 8. Re: Animal Experimentation (I need ammo) Janice Rothstein <gata 9. last call, Bargains for June 9 Silent Auction Bids sunny outdoors <sunny_outdoors 10. RE: Bamboo Garden Restaurant closed on June 30 " Tammy " <govegan ______________________ ______________________ Message: 1 Sat, 8 Jun 2002 12:30:35 -0700 (PDT) Thomas Robertson <tjjuggle How in the HECK did I become a vegie? Been reading these posts for months now and thought you might like to hear where I come from. Do any of you guys stand outside of circuses and protest? You may be wondering if your actions do much... I used to work for a circus as a clown and physical laborer (now I'm a software engineer, go figure). My first (failed) attempt at going vegetarian was a direct result of seeing the treatment of the animals on a daily basis, and from my interaction with people like you, the protestors who stood outside and made a fuss over an industry which is cruely exploting animals. I think the first seed was planted when I saw the elephant trainer watching the elephant eat potatoes. He had a whip in one hand and his other hand didn't leave the butt of his gun. I understood why he did that when one of the other clowns told me about the track record of circus elephants. He informed me of the deaths which the elephants cause, even gave me a graphic description of how he saved a midget (sorry, don't know of an alternate word if that offends anyone) by pulling him out from under an elephant who was about to do a hand stand on him after it knocked him over (one of the major ways which circus elephants kill people). And this one was not an elephant to be trusted, acording to the other workers at the circus... Did I mention that this elephant was not used in the show? No, this elephant was the one which little children could pay money to pet and ride on. Well, I've turned vegie once again (it was hard being raised in the south and being used to my three portions of meat a day). It's been 2.5 or so months and I haven't looked back. I've discovered the joys of exciting types of beans, the delisious taste of falafel, and that I actually DO like vegetables like lettuce and tomatoe and such. Oh yes, and after tasting Silk, I can't imagine going back to the boring old flavor of milk ever again. Maybe next year going vegan will be on the agenda. Thank you S.F. bay area, for being so vegie friendly and helping me to achieve my dream which started 4 years ago with an elephant and gun. ===== ------------ T.J. Robertson VI Technology - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup. ______________________ ______________________ Message: 2 Sat, 8 Jun 2002 14:45:23 -0700 " Tammy " <tammy SF Alemany Farmer's Market Hi all, In SF on Alemany @ the junction of Highways 101 & 280 is Saturday's a big area used as a Farmer's Market & Sunday is a flea market. The Farmer's Market has actually been in operation since 1947, but today was the first time I've ever gone to it. (More info: http://www.ci.sf.ca.us/alemany/) There were a LOT of produce vendors (I'd have to guess at least 40-50!) and the entire area was filled with shoppers. I like to buy organic, especially for fresh fruits & veggies. I saw only 3-4 organic vendors today, and they only had fruit. The organic fruit was well-priced, nectarines/white peaches $1 lb (fruit was smallish), other vendors had it for $1.50-$2/lb.. cherries were $1.50+/lb Does anyone shop here on a regular basis? Is this typical? I used to frequent the Thursday/Daly City Farmer's Market last Fall and while its a much smaller market, they had a better organic selection. Cheers, Tammy " Perform a death-defying act.... Go Vegan! " * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Be-A-Veg! * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * FREE Veg Kit http://www.goveg.com/vegkit/index.html ______________________ ______________________ Message: 3 Sat, 8 Jun 2002 15:28:58 -0700 (PDT) sunny outdoors <sunny_outdoors Bamboo Garden Restaurant closed on June 30 SF, CA restaurant on Clement and 10th Ave (now there's no mix up with the " other " veggie restaurant that's 9 blocks away) they sold their business to a regular Vietnamese restaurant. They are currently looking for a new location, maybe in the Chinatown area. This is a surprise since I was dining there only 2 weeks ago. I guess until the sale is finalized, they can't inform their customers any news. Thanks to this great list, folks are able to find out " surprises " like this before they happen. It's a bummer to see ANOTHER veggie restaurant CLOSING. This is a good example to folks who are interested in doing web sites or even PAPER media on vegetarian restuaurant. - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup. ______________________ ______________________ Message: 4 Sat, 8 Jun 2002 15:33:10 -0700 (PDT) sunny outdoors <sunny_outdoors Continued: Bamboo Garden Restaurant closed on June 30 oops, it was sent too early SF, CA restaurant on Clement and 10th Ave (now there's no mix up with the " other " veggie restaurant that's 9 blocks away) they sold their business to a regular Vietnamese restaurant. They are currently looking for a new location, maybe in the Chinatown area. This is a surprise since I was dining there only 2 weeks ago. I guess until the sale is finalized, they can't inform their customers any news. Thanks to this great list, folks are able to find out " surprises " like this before they happen. It's a bummer to see ANOTHER veggie restaurant CLOSING. This is a good example to folks who are interested in doing web sites or even PAPER media on vegetarian restaurants is that you must update this type of information every 2 months. The BEST and most reliable dining web site is www.vegdining.com. It's also a fast web site. Please contribute whatever you can to make this the best site by submitting your restaurant feedback or purchasing a VegDining Membership Card. The site has won a few awards. - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup. ______________________ ______________________ Message: 5 Sat, 8 Jun 2002 15:55:58 -0700 " amy lynn (veggie grrrl) " <amy email hain celestial group to veganize their vegetarian foods email hain celestial group to veganize their vegetarian foods and remove ingredients such as sodium caseinate from their seasoned grain products (casbah), etc.. consumeraffairs amy ______________________ ______________________ Message: 6 Sat, 08 Jun 2002 20:11:08 -0700 " Christine Morrissey " <empress_bean Vandals leave deer carcasses at Pleasanton High School Vandals leave deer carcasses at Amador Toilet paper, splattered eggs found throughout school By Rebecca Emmerich and Kim Santos STAFF WRITERS PLEASANTON -- Vandals left decomposed deer floating in the swimming pool and lying in two other spots on the Amador Valley High School campus early Friday. Also, toilet paper and splattered eggs were found throughout the school, lunch tables were discovered on the roof and there were other signs of vandalism. Kathleen Ruegsegger, spokeswoman for the Pleasanton Unified School District, said police and school officials had not determined who was responsible for the acts, although one student had come forward regarding a mattress thrown in the pool. " They're finding that it was probably small pockets of students, independent of each other, responsible for the different pieces, " she said, noting that there may have been four groups. Pleasanton police officers found two deer in the quad area shortly after the school alarm went off at 2:30 a.m. The deer in the pool was found later in the morning. It actually was unclear whether it was one or two deer because the carcass was so badly decomposed. " All have been confirmed by animal control as probable victims of roadkill, " Ruegsegger said. " They were probably brought to campus after they were already dead. " Pleasanton Police Lt. Greg Wixom said he believed the deer did not die at the hands of students. " These are not Bambi killers, " he said. Pleasanton police said they suspect the deer were picked up in the Sunol area. School officials moved quickly, calling in custodians to clean up as much of the mess as possible before students arrived for classes. The school has closed access to the pool and will heavily chlorinate it for several days, officials said. After repeated testing for contamination, they will determine whether it can be reopened next week. Deer can carry a bacteria called leptospirosis, which is contained in their urine. The bacteria can cause fever, headache and severe muscle pain, and in some cases, meningitis, liver and kidney dysfunction and eye inflammation, according to the Web site for the Medical College of Wisconsin Physicians and Clinics. Swimmers can become infected with it through open cuts, mucous membranes or ingestion. The disease is treatable with antibiotics. Pleasanton police said they were unsure whether the pool would have to be drained. Principal Bill Coupe canceled a senior assembly scheduled for the morning, but an end-of-the-year dance and a girls " powder puff " football game were allowed to go on Friday night. Ruegsegger said some students are trying to assist school and police officials with finding those responsible. " The students are trying to cooperate, " she said. " The students who may remotely know something are trying to help. " School officials announced to the student body that a $1,000 reward could be given to anyone with credible information, a student said. The repercussions for the people involved in transporting and dumping the deer could be severe. The acts may be considered felonies, Ruegsegger said. Moreover, it just was not funny, Wixom said. " That's somewhat of a departure from humor, " he said. " Kids nowadays have a strange sense of humor. " _______________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ______________________ ______________________ Message: 7 Sat, 08 Jun 2002 20:14:25 -0700 " Christine Morrissey " <empress_bean Is rodeo a tribute to the Wild West or cruel exploitation? Is rodeo a tribute to the Wild West or cruel exploitation? By Brooke Bryant Staff Writer LIVERMORE -- On the hard-packed dirt of the Robertson Park arena, cowboys wrestled, roped and rode their way through Friday morning's slack competition at the Livermore Rodeo. To the men in the arena and the handful of spectators in the sun-baked stands, it was sport, a noble contest of strength and guile, a tribute to a vanishing lifestyle and the heritage of the Old West. But to some, it's simply cruel. " Sport to me implies willing participants equally matched, " said Eric Mills, a longtime rodeo critic. " That is not rodeo. ... The animals do not choose to be there. " Animal welfare organizations, from the Humane Society of the United States to the more militant People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals, agree. Though they have issues with all rodeo events from bronc' busting to bull riding, the activists particularly oppose events like calf roping and steer wrestling. But rodeo enthusiasts bristle at the notion that what they do in the ring is inhumane. " The animals in rodeo have the life of a star, " said Linda Burdick, executive director of Friends of Rodeo, an advocacy and educational group that supports rodeo. " They don't need to be saved. " Burdick and other rodeo fans say that the sport is just an extension of natural animal behavior and common ranching chores. Horses and cows buck on the open range, just as in the arena, and calves need to be caught and roped for branding. " Everyone has to work for a living, " Burdick said. " These animals get top feed, regular veterinary care, they are respected and well cared for. When they're in the arena, they work a maximum of eight seconds. " The rules that govern rodeos -- set by the state, the county and the sanctioning organization -- are designed to keep both the animals and the cowboys safe, according to proponents. The Professional Rodeo Cowboys Association, the sport's sanctioning body, has about 60 rules and regulations pertaining to the training, handling and treatment of the animals. Spurs must be dull, and roll freely so they don't rake the flanks of the animals; animals must be inspected before events, and cannot be confined to vehicles for longer than 24 hours without being fed, watered and unloaded; incidents of abuse can be punished by disqualification and fines starting at $250. But differing definitions of abuse are part of the rodeo debate. Rodeo opponents say that the equipment that is intrinsic to rodeo activities -- electric prods and flank straps -- are equivalent to tools of torture. But participants maintain that they are merely tools of the trade. They say the prods produce mild shocks and are used sparingly, and the much-misunderstood flank straps -- which do not touch the animals genitals -- don't cause serious pain, just encourage an animal's tendency to buck. The PRCA also requires a veterinarian to be on-site for every rodeo event it sanctions -- a condition that already is law in Alameda County, and is being considered at the state level. Current California law stipulates that a vet must be on-call and able to respond within an hour. " We always look at California to start some of the more progressive ideas, " said Ellen Buck, a veterinarian and the Humane Society's director of equine protection. " There are some laws that are certainly a step in the right direction. " Some cities have started to drop events like calf roping, Buck said, but predicted that getting others to follow suit would be a long, uphill battle, particularly in the central states and some of the western states. " It's really firmly entrenched in some of the communities, " she said. Mills, who runs the Oakland-based Action for Animals, has been lobbying hard for the passage of the California bill, sponsored by Sen. Don Perata, D-Oakland. " Every rodeo has ambulances for cowboys, " he said. " If you can do this for the cowboys, who are there by choice, why in God's name do you not provide the same service for the animals who are not there by choice? " Rodeo proponents say that the law is unnecessary, because of the low injury rate, redundant, since most big rodeos already require that -- and if lawmakers keep piling new rules on the rodeos, they could be legislated right out of existence. They also chafe at the requirement that rodeo organizers notify animal control agencies two weeks prior to an event, asserting that will only give the animal activists more time to prepare. In a 2000 survey, the PRCA said that of 57 rodeos surveyed, only 38 animal injuries were reported. That means that only .00052 percent of the 71,743 " animal exposures " resulted in injury. Another way to look at it is that there was an average of about one injury for every two rodeos, Mills countered. " That is an appalling statistic, " he claimed. One entry in the long list of rodeo-related animal injuries and deaths that activists cite -- ranging from fractured skulls to broken necks -- comes from the Livermore Rodeo itself. In 2000, a bucking horse died after breaking its neck in the arena. But Burdick said that growing up on a cattle ranch, she saw more accidents in everyday life than in the rodeo. Injured animals get immediate treatment from on-site vets, as well as animal handlers who move quickly to keep an animal from further injuring itself. " An animal that's in the rodeo that incurs an accidental injury is probably one of the luckiest animals in the world, that he is in the rodeo, " she said. _______________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ______________________ ______________________ Message: 8 Sat, 08 Jun 2002 23:32:38 -0700 Janice Rothstein <gata Re: Animal Experimentation (I need ammo) The Physician's Committee for Responsible Medicine addresses this at the following link on their website: http://www.pcrm.org/issues/Animal_Experimentation_Issues/animal_issues.html They also have an excellent video, which has aired on For the Animals, it was excellent. I think it is the same Henry Heimlich video listed at this link (scroll down more than halfway): http://www.pcrm.org/issues/edu_resources.html She may not want to sink $ into a video at this point, but there is a totally free reading offered at this same link (click on Research Issues Compendium a couple of items above the video listing): I wish I had a copy of pcrm's magazine with me on the bus last week; I struck up a conversation with a research scientist, who removes eyeballs from fish to find out about corneal structure and defects! The best I could do, since I'm a mere research assistant in a human study (hiv), and he had a bit of attitude, though tried to be polite, was to tell him that there are indeed other scientists at his level of expertise, and to urge him to check out their website. Thankfully, pcrm.org is easy to remember. Good luck, Tony! Janice on 6/8/02 9:49 AM, Kim Flournoy at kim_flournoy wrote: > There was an article in the Washington Post recently that touched upon > this subject. There weren't any scientists quoted, but lawyers: > > http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A60634-2002Jun4.html > > > > Tony Martin wrote: >> >> I went on a date with a very nice girl, but for our second date, I need some >> ammo as she is all for animal experimentation. She has agreed to debate me on >> the subject. She has field advantage because she is a scientist. However, she >> is open minded, as she is also an ethical vegetarian and buddhist. >> >> So, does anyone out there know of prominent scientists who have spoken up >> against animal experimentation? I know there are a few, because I have read >> about them in the past, but I did not keep a record of who they are or what >> they said. >> >> tonyy ______________________ ______________________ Message: 9 Sun, 9 Jun 2002 08:59:07 -0700 (PDT) sunny outdoors <sunny_outdoors last call, Bargains for June 9 Silent Auction Bids VERY CHEAP cause there will be VERY Little bidders for this auction Silent Auction Items for June 9, Draft copy as of June 9, Please attend the dinner to see the complete auction items. Millennium Restaurant $100* UnTurkey $25 value donated/by Now And Zen TeaseCake (vegan Cheese cake) $30 donated/by Now and Zen Feng Shui Electric fountain $30 donated by JC " Mad Cowboy " book signed/donated by $30 Howard Lyman himself " Just One " Vitamins $27 donated by Sharon L 5 professional hair cut by Mary Tran, certified Hair dresser in SF, $30-$50 each* coupons for organic soy milk and organic tofu (flavored and plain) donated by Vitasoy $2 each* 1 hour financial consultation over the phone donated by David Zebker, CPA $100* Crystal Earrings and Necklace donated by Dixie Mahy $60 2 ORGANIC, vegan, fair trade chocolate-Raspberry Chocolate Mousse by Bereket Vegan Ventures Lydia's Livin Foods, $30* Bay Leaf Café $20 Food & Social Justice Cooking class $20* Organic Soy DREAM vegan ice cream (not Soy DELICIOUS) donated/by Imagine foods. 4 Quarts-Vanilla, Vanilla Fudge Swirl, Mocha Fudge Swirl, Chocolate $16* Table Top books, notebooks $5, Middle Eastern Dance Classes $65* offered by Lorna Zilba Artistic Director Life Dance Theatre and Performer of our June 9 dinner. -- 5 day PENTHOUSE stay in Kingsbury, NV up in the Mountains-Kingsbury Grade, 7000 feet, 10 min from Casino and near State line 3 bedrooms and 3 bath, sleeps 6-8 people (OK to get a group of friends together to chip in) exercise room and game room with pool table nearby dates: Oct 28-Nov 1, 2002 $900* Studio Condo in South Lake Tahoe Access to private beach (no beach view in condo), swimming pool and tennis courts One mile from State line One bed sleeps 2 people Labor day weekend 8/31-9/7 $500* Donated by Stan and Dixie Mahy *Absentee bids taken by 415 751-6443, before June 8, 3pm, no emails for now. Please be prepared to mail your checks within 2 days. - Official partner of 2002 FIFA World Cup http://fifaworldcup. ______________________ ______________________ Message: 10 Sun, 9 Jun 2002 09:23:37 -0700 " Tammy " <govegan RE: Bamboo Garden Restaurant closed on June 30 > Bamboo Garden Restaurant closed on June 30 This is too bad :-( I seem to go through " phases " and for awhile, Bamboo Garden was one of my favorite places to go! They have this claypot dish that I really liked - it was a curry noodle dish. I will have to try and go there before they close. It's great to be part of a veg *community* like this to share all the news! Thanks for the inside scoop. Tammy ______________________ ______________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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