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Thanks, Tammy, for reminding people that this list should be a safe haven

for all veggie-friendly people to express themselves freely without fear of

attack. As you (or someone else) mentioned in a recent posting, we are all

here for our common solidarity of vegetarian interests.

 

As an ovo-lacto veggie for 7 years who has recently started eating fish

again, I shouldn't feel the need to defend myself by also telling you that I

vehemently support IDA and PETA, never wear or use animal products of any

sort, and strive to only use consumer products non-tested on animals (but,

of course, somehow, I do feel the need).

 

I am grateful for the opportunity to continually learn more about

vegetarianism and animal rights / environmental issues through this group.

I agree that our list can be a powerful tool to help educate non-100%

converted people towards ethical choices... but only if we can do so with

compassion rather than judgement.

 

hugs to all,

denise

 

____________

 

 

Hi Cheryl and all,

 

As I said to Tim, the list is for everyone, regardless of whether

they are veggie or non-veggie, for pro-veggie and AR discussion.

This is definitely not a list where people are welcome to bash

veggies. (There are other lists for that!)

 

SFBAVeg is not limited to " only " vegans or " only " vegetarians.

 

It is open to anyone (vegans, pre-veg*ns) who wants to join us and

find the support or answers they need for a vegetarian lifestyle.

 

If people who currently eat cows, chicken, or fish want to join us

because they are interested in learning more about a veggie

lifestyle, they can. That would be great to encourage / help them to

eat more plants in their diet! As it is, I wish there were

more " new " or " wannabe " veggies on the list as there is so much great

knowledge and friendship in the community that could really help a

new veggie person.

 

So that's my view, as the list admin and also just as a member of the

list.....

 

If you feel a particular post is not on-topic, help out and write us

privately about it and tell us why. To be honest, I can't keep up

with all the discussion on the list all of the time.

 

-owner <== goes only to Chris & myself

 

Thanks,

Tammy

SFBAVeg List Admin

 

-

 

 

Thursday, August 01, 2002 6:21 PM

[sFBAVeg] Digest Number 285

 

 

*Tell your friends to Be-A-Veg with SFBAVeg! To , send an e-mail

to: -

*To share a message with the group:

*Manage your SFBAVeg list subscription:

-Switch to no-mail: -nomail

-Switch to daily digest: -digest

-Switch to individual messages: -normal

-Leave the group: -

*If you have questions about the list, please contact Tammy and Chris, list

admins, at -owner

*/

 

 

 

------

 

There are 25 messages in this issue.

 

Topics in this digest:

 

1. update of vegetarian restaurants

sunny outdoors <sunny_outdoors

2. vegetarian/vegan and non-violence

" amy lynn (veggie grrrl) " <amy

3. Re: Judging

Tim T <sfbayhooligan

4. re: Vegetarians who eat fish

Tim T <sfbayhooligan

5. Re: Vegetarians who eat fish

" meowthunk " <govegan

6. Re: vegetarian/vegan and non-violence

Tony Martin <veggiedude

7. Re: Vegetarians who eat fish

" mylehai " <noah_han

8. cruety shopping at thevegetariansite.com, 10% goes to Howard Lyman

sunny outdoors <sunny_outdoors

9. (unknown)

Michael Feeley <unseenscenery

10. Can you help me!!

" lipsmackinvegan " <mickeydwalker

11. one more thing

" lipsmackinvegan " <mickeydwalker

12. Re: re: Vegetarians who eat fish

CHERYL BURKET <cburket

13. funny

blue <vegaynism

14. funny (if i include the link) : )

blue <vegaynism

15. Re: re: Vegetarians who eat fish

Kim Flournoy <kim

16. SFBAVeg is for all, veggie or veggie iinclined, even people who eat

fish

" " <

17. Re: SFBAVeg is for all, veggie or veggie iinclined, even people who

eat fish

Tony Martin <veggiedude

18. Important Note: Vik's!

" Chandna, Alka " <alka.chandna

19. RE: Vegetarians who eat fish

" Sue Blankman " <suesf5

20. RE: Re: Judging

" Jay Gleason " <jay.gleason

21. Re: SFBAVeg is for all, veggie or veggie iinclined, even people who

eat fish

Kim Flournoy <kim

22. dinner & a movie - the perfect thing for a Friday night!

" Chandna, Alka " <alka.chandna

23. Teenage wildlife: veggie talk

Tony Martin <veggiedude

24. Omnivorous or Vegetarian - What famous naturalists think about

" DeniseC " <dcmeta

25. Vegan Nutrition Lecture and Dinner, Aug 8

sunny outdoors <sunny_outdoors

 

 

______________________

______________________

 

Message: 1

Wed, 31 Jul 2002 23:11:31 -0700 (PDT)

sunny outdoors <sunny_outdoors

update of vegetarian restaurants

 

#1 www.thebayleafcafe.com in Palo Alto has the most

extensive vegan soy ice cream and vegan shakes around.

 

The two vegan owners want to promote their delicious

vegan menu. I recommend their Mighty Carrot Roll, it

has a nice flavor that will make all sandwiches look

boring.

 

Check out a photo of their menu, it says, 35cent extra

for milk. Guess what? Almost ALL of their customers

go for the soy.

 

For photos of the menu requesting more $ for milk, and

photos of beautiful shakes go to:

 

http://www.snapfish.com/share/p=261311028148198283/l=9211809

 

you need to register to see the beautiful photos

 

#2 Vege House in Berkeley is coming out with a new

menu next week. If you want a PDF of the menu, I can

email it to you. A few weeks ago, 24 happy diners

said the grilled Lemon Grass " Chicken " (it was not

szechwan " chicken " dish) was the BEST entree. (all

tofu and soy milk are homemake)

Phil and others said they really enjoyed the dinner.

 

Below was our extensive menu:

 

2 types of Spring Roll-Tofu and " pork " with 2 dipping

sauce: peanut or sweet and sour chili sauce

fried Lemon Grass + Chili Tofu

fried Green Onion Tofu

their yummy " chicken " chow mein

egg plant clay pot

Lemon Grass " chicken " not Szechuan " chicken " as listed

Med Spicy Sautéed Mixed Vegetable and String Beans

Mongolian " beef "

Sample of their homemade, non-GMO soy milk, sugar or

with green pandan herb.

 

If you want a bargain, the lunch menu is under $5.

AND l/2 off steam table items around 5:30pm. What a

deal. (I don't think people are taking advantage of

the l/2 off deal. The discount is ONLY at their

Berkeley VegeHouse)

 

#3 Ananda Furara, in SF is doing extremely well. On a

weekday lunch at 2pm, there were 18 customers at the

restaurant. During dinner time, it's the best bargain

for Ballet and Opera fans.

 

#4 Minako in SF, mixed organic sushi restaurant,

received a lot of 4 star ratings from various web

sites. On a Sat night, they were filled to capacity.

 

Unfortunately due to low attendance, they no longer

serve lunch.

 

The down side of the restaurant is service might be

slow due to only mom, daughter and a dishwasher

working there.

 

#5 Kam in SF, there's a rumor going on that the

business is closed forever. Let's see in 4 months

what happens when the remodeling job is finish.

 

#6 Donna's Tamales-all vegetarian, at Embaradero

Farmer's market, Tuesday and Sat, the 2 female owners

are vegetarian. One of the owner is a vegetarian for

over 23 years.

 

Delicious Tamales, with around 6 vegan tamales to

choose from. Also available at Whole Foods and

Berkeley Bowl.

--

 

Having a birthday or celebration soon? Ask your

friends to take you to your favorite veggie restaurant

or it will disappear like all the other 40 veggie

restaurants..

 

--

For the past 4 months, Barney Barnhill has compiled

restaurant reviews for the Vegetarian Journal. It's a

magazine that comes out once every 5 years. If you

want to contact him, I have his number. (no need to

reinvent the wheel)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Health - Feel better, live better

http://health.

 

 

______________________

______________________

 

Message: 2

Thu, 1 Aug 2002 06:38:48 -0700

" amy lynn (veggie grrrl) " <amy

vegetarian/vegan and non-violence

 

i've been veg 26 years and i'm also very pro-choice.

can't tell you how much flack i've gotten over the years...

" it's not okay to kill animals but it's okay to kill babies... "

amy

 

 

 

 

______________________

______________________

 

Message: 3

Thu, 1 Aug 2002 01:39:19 -0700 (PDT)

Tim T <sfbayhooligan

Re: Judging

 

>Wed, 31 Jul 2002 20:14:39 -0700

> " Jay Gleason " <jay.gleason

>RE: Is being a vegetarian same as

non-violence ?

 

>Violence begets violence.

 

>If Osama is killed what good would be accomplished?

 

>Judging, labeling, demanding, ~ violence.

 

 

And many Americans have & will give their lives

protecting & defending the American way of life, which

gives you the right to state your opinions, no matter

how wishy-washy & ignorant they are.

 

I'd love for Jay to be parachuted down to an al

Quaeda stronghold in Pakistan & provide him with the

opportunity to 'field-test' his noble philosophy in

the real world.

 

 

I dunno about on your planet, Jay, but here on

Earth, freedom isn't free.

 

 

Tim

 

 

 

Health - Feel better, live better

http://health.

 

 

 

______________________

______________________

 

Message: 4

Thu, 1 Aug 2002 02:08:06 -0700 (PDT)

Tim T <sfbayhooligan

re: Vegetarians who eat fish

 

Methinks this group is getting a wee bit too

touchy-feely, and straying from the harsh concept

known as... reality.

 

I haven't seen anyone point fingers in their posts.

What several people have had the audacity to do is

provide cogent, valid definitions of 'vegetarian.'

If you or whoever make the choice to function in a

manner inconsistent or contradictory to the simple

definition of 'vegetarian,' that's your perogative,

but please be a little less sensitive & a little more

sensible about your reaction. If you want to join the

vegan/vegetarian club, you know what to do -- it's not

too difficult.

 

If you chose not to, no one is 'alienating' you

because of it, however you could & should be

challenged regarding your wrongful claim that

'vegetarian' includes fish under any circumstances.

 

You're probably kinder & more compassionate that I

am, and that's wonderful for you. But you're not

currently a vegetarian, and the way to change that (if

you want to) isn't to tell us that you're feeling

uncomfortable & alienated & expect us to dub you an

honorary vegetarian (heck, why not go straight for

vegan!).

 

 

Tim, who'd like to be a vegan, but isn't one,

despite being very polite to the milk & eggs I chose

to consume.

 

***************

Wed, 31 Jul 2002 20:47:10 -0700

Bridge Biker <smile

Re: Vegetarians who eat fish

 

Hi Gillian and all:

 

your statement expressed exactly what I have been

wanting to write to the group.

 

I was feeling really uncomfortable and alienated

with the continued discussions re: why folks who eat

fish don't have the right to call themselves

vegetarian. why do we have to point

fingers at one another?

 

 

 

Health - Feel better, live better

http://health.

 

 

 

______________________

______________________

 

Message: 5

Thu, 01 Aug 2002 14:57:25 -0000

" meowthunk " <govegan

Re: Vegetarians who eat fish

 

, Tim T <sfbayhooligan> wrote:

> I haven't seen anyone point fingers in their posts.

> What several people have had the audacity to do is

> provide cogent, valid definitions of 'vegetarian.'

> If you or whoever make the choice to function in a

> manner inconsistent or contradictory to the simple

> definition of 'vegetarian,' that's your perogative,

> but please be a little less sensitive & a little more

> sensible about your reaction. If you want to join the

> vegan/vegetarian club, you know what to do -- it's not

> too difficult.

 

Tim,

 

As per our intentions in starting this group, and as stated in the

charter, " Membership is free and open to everyone, vegans,

vegetarians, veg*n-inclined or veg*n-interested people. "

 

If someone who eats cows is interested in veggie stuff, but still

eating cows, they are welcome to join and ask questions. And I know

most everyone would be helpful and encouraging to them, not mocking

them or making them feel like a 2nd class member.

 

The only guidelines we have are what is " on topic " for the list, and

that is: veggie or animal rights discussion, news, events, etc. Or

did I get on the wrong list??

 

Tammy

 

 

 

 

 

______________________

______________________

 

Message: 6

Thu, 01 Aug 2002 08:48:46 -0700

Tony Martin <veggiedude

Re: vegetarian/vegan and non-violence

 

On 8/1/02 6:38 AM, " amy lynn (veggie grrrl) " <amy wrote:

 

> i've been veg 26 years and i'm also very pro-choice.

> can't tell you how much flack i've gotten over the years...

> " it's not okay to kill animals but it's okay to kill babies... "

 

 

Well, you can explain that at least you are CONSISTENT in your views. As a

pro-choiser, you are not for outlawing meat production, that you are for

every persons right to CHOOSE to be a vegetarian or to keep KILLING animals,

even if they do claim to be Opro-life¹.

 

It¹s all about individual choice.

 

You can¹t legislate ethics.

 

 

 

 

p.s. Our taxes support factory farming, vegetarian or not, so we don¹ have

that much choice in the matter.

 

 

 

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