Vegan cats

[Guest guest]

Can cats be vegan? I had a well meaning friend who tried to feed a few

cats vegan, on the advice of a quack, and they both ended up blind. Cats

are true carnivores and need a nutrient called taurine, I believe it is

spelled. I understand that Veggie Cat makes claims that cats can be

vegan. Does their product really check out in the long haul? I do not

know.

Best of luck with this difficult situation, and good for you for

offering your loving support for these animals.

 

Sincerely,

 

David Sztybel

 

On Tue, 30 Jul 2002, debbie5300 wrote:

 

> Hello I'm new to the group. My husband and I took in a pregnant cat

> around March 1st* took her to the vet and everything was fine. She

> had 4 beautiful babies. Well we have been Vegan for 2 years now and

> so have our " fur babies " and we can not find good Vegan homes for the

> kittens that are now 4 months old. They of course have been vegan all

> their lives. We wanted to keep all of them but since they were born

> we moved to a small 1 bedroom apartment. Any suggestions or advise is

> appreciated.

>

> Debbie

>

>

>

>

> Post message:

> Subscribe: -

> Un: -

> List owner: -owner

>

> Shortcut URL to this page:

> /community/

>

>

[Guest guest]

This is a tough one and one that I am struggling with myself.

 

We rescued a greyhound about a month ago and he picked up a parasite

which hit his stomach hard. The Vet said that he needed a mellow

diet of chicken and rice. I inquired about vegetables but to no

avail. I haven't eaten, touched or dealt with meat for over 10 years

and now I'm cutting up chicken parts. It's not only grossing me

out...it's breaking my heart. A true dilemma and one that I guess

I'll keep struggling with. I need my dog to be well but the cost

seems high. I know I'll never eat meat again but this seems just as

bad. I am stuck in the middle!

 

, David Sztybel <sztybeld@p...> wrote:

> Can cats be vegan? I had a well meaning friend who tried to feed a

few

> cats vegan, on the advice of a quack, and they both ended up

blind. Cats

> are true carnivores and need a nutrient called taurine, I believe

it is

> spelled. I understand that Veggie Cat makes claims that cats can be

> vegan. Does their product really check out in the long haul? I do

not

> know.

> Best of luck with this difficult situation, and good for you

for

> offering your loving support for these animals.

>

> Sincerely,

>

> David Sztybel

>

> On Tue, 30 Jul 2002, debbie5300 wrote:

>

> > Hello I'm new to the group. My husband and I took in a pregnant

cat

> > around March 1st* took her to the vet and everything was fine. She

> > had 4 beautiful babies. Well we have been Vegan for 2 years now

and

> > so have our " fur babies " and we can not find good Vegan homes for

the

> > kittens that are now 4 months old. They of course have been vegan

all

> > their lives. We wanted to keep all of them but since they were

born

> > we moved to a small 1 bedroom apartment. Any suggestions or

advise is

> > appreciated.

> >

> > Debbie

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Post message: @o...

> > Subscribe: -@o...

> > Un: -@o...

> > List owner: -owner@o...

> >

> > Shortcut URL to this page:

> > /community/

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Hello,

 

I've been a Vegan since 12/87. I understand the Vegan philosophy to

mean acting in a way to end animal suffering. I can empathize with

the desire to " rescue " unwanted animals. I know that most " pets " are

not by nature Vegan (or for that matter vegetarian). Does it not

perpetuate animal suffering to humanize animals by turning them into

pets? Furthermore, one would have to question the motivation to

twist the natural order further by withholding essential nutrients

from these enslaved creatures.

 

I understand my views to be unpopular (even in Vegan circles).

 

In a nutshell:

 

Vegans should recognize the fundamental moral dilemma and accept the

only (in my view) clear compassionate choice.

 

Animals are not ours to kill, eat, wear, own, breed...etc. Choose

not to own pets.

 

If you choose to continue to own pets, you must accept that choice

and all of the peripheral suffering associated with this ancient

human invention. Feed the cats, dogs, rats and snakes other dead

creatures.

 

By the way...

 

We all have our choices to make. Up until very recently I did not

wear leather. After 15 years of wearing bad shoes I broke down and

began to wear leather shoes. My feet are responding well. They are

the only ones that I have for the rest of my life. So this is my

choice and my dilemma. I say a silent prayer for the animals that

made the sacrifice for my feet.

 

I bring you my thoughts and experience in the interest of sharing and

growth. I hope that you come to terms with your dilemma. Most of

all I hope that we can all avoid the most insidious of all human

inventions: dogma.

 

yours in peace,

 

cat

 

 

" nocarneporfavor " <forgetaboutrecords>

Sat Aug 3, 2002 2:17 pm

Re: Vegan Cats

 

 

 

 

This is a tough one and one that I am struggling with myself.

 

We rescued a greyhound about a month ago and he picked up a parasite

which hit his stomach hard. The Vet said that he needed a mellow

diet of chicken and rice. I inquired about vegetables but to no

avail. I haven't eaten, touched or dealt with meat for over 10 years

and now I'm cutting up chicken parts. It's not only grossing me

out...it's breaking my heart. A true dilemma and one that I guess

I'll keep struggling with. I need my dog to be well but the cost

seems high. I know I'll never eat meat again but this seems just as

bad. I am stuck in the middle!

 

, David Sztybel <sztybeld@p...> wrote:

> Can cats be vegan? I had a well meaning friend who tried to feed a

few

> cats vegan, on the advice of a quack, and they both ended up

blind. Cats

> are true carnivores and need a nutrient called taurine, I believe

it is

> spelled. I understand that Veggie Cat makes claims that cats can be

> vegan. Does their product really check out in the long haul? I do

not

> know.

> Best of luck with this difficult situation, and good for you

for

> offering your loving support for these animals.

>

> Sincerely,

>

> David Sztybel

>

> On Tue, 30 Jul 2002, debbie5300 wrote:

>

> > Hello I'm new to the group. My husband and I took in a pregnant

cat

> > around March 1st* took her to the vet and everything was fine. She

> > had 4 beautiful babies. Well we have been Vegan for 2 years now

and

> > so have our " fur babies " and we can not find good Vegan homes for

the

> > kittens that are now 4 months old. They of course have been vegan

all

> > their lives. We wanted to keep all of them but since they were

born

> > we moved to a small 1 bedroom apartment. Any suggestions or

advise is

> > appreciated.

> >

> > Debbie

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Hi, James...

 

Apologies if i sound a bit snide, but i've been feeding my friend the cat a vegan diet for most of his life. He's only nine, however. I would really suggest that you go over to http://www.vegancats.com and have a look at their gallery. There are all sorts of piccies and stories there.

 

James Peden, who wrote Vegetarian Cats and Dogs, conducted extensive research before he developed his formula and began marketing it in 1986. I'd be happy to find some excerpts from it if you're interested.

 

Yes, the feline genus is primarily carnivorous (though they do eat greens, as well). We (humans), however, have chosen to domesticate the feline. This has altered the cat genetically through adaptation. I feel that, as it stands, because it is "unnatural" for us to be living with cats in the first place, why is it any more "unnatural" to provide him/her/them with a PROPERLY BALANCED (one that contains taurine and arachidonic acid) diet which happens to be vegan? As long as the health of the animal is your utmost concern, why batter yourself emotionally for choosing to share your diet with him/her/them? Most commercial foods are full of rubbish that cats wouldn't normally eat, anyway. If you're not gointa' feed 'em vegan, let 'em eat rodents. Sorry...facetiousness emerging. This is just a bit of a point of contention for me.

 

In the end, you've just got to make the choice that you feel is "right". I agonised for years over this quandary and finally decided what made most sense to me. Dashiell-Pants, incidentally, has never been ill aside from the time that he was struck by a car.

 

xxk@xx

 

jamesb_dashiel [jamesb_dashiel]21 August 2002 16:53 Subject: Vegan CatsHi allI know there has been some discussion on here regarding vegan/veggie cat feeding. Has anyone here sucessfully brought up a cat 15+ years sucessfully? Or has the substitute foods only been available recently? What foods are available? I'm OK subjecting myself to veganism. But cats are carnivores and I don't believe we even know enough about human nutrition never mind that of felines to really understand the biochemistry involved.So, I'd appreciate any personal experiences.regardsJamesB~~ info ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Please remember that the above is only the opinion of the author, there may be another side to the story you have not heard.---------------------------Was this message Off Topic? Did you know? Was it snipped?~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Guidelines: visit <site temporarily offline>Un: send a blank message to -

[Guest guest]

I have five fe(lions), ages: two at 1 yr old, 6, 14 and 20. I feed them all Yarrah organic in tins and dried. I send for it from bluepet.co.uk. Tried them on Vegicat (vegan food you make up yourself), but they refused it. Before they were all fed commercial tins and were always ill, now they are all in fine fettle! Bluepet - pet supplies for cats and dogs including food, natural remedies, and toys. http://www.bluepet.co.uk/ More sites about: United Kingdom > Animals > Supplies, Equipment, and Gifts I think some people manage successfully with vegan cats, but I know none of them personally. the problem is the taurine, available only from animal sources. Of course, animals should not be in situations where we have to kill other animals to feed them, ie. they should not be domesticated. But they are and we have to do what we can to minimise the exploitation involved. Neutering to reduce the 'pet' population and feed organic food, if not vegan/veggie; at least their food has then the best welfare before going to the slaughterhouse. Also to campaign against animal breeders. Captive breeding for endangered species is debateable. One of the best books on natural health for dogs and cats is 'Dr. Pitcairn's Complete Guide to Natural Health for Cats and Dogs. There is another good one by Dianne Stein: 'The Natural Remedy book for Dogs and Cats'. Here is a very helpful link: Holistic Health for People & Animalshttp://www.geocities.com/HotSprings/1158/OVERVIEW.HTM

Apparently, the best way to feed cats and dogs is raw Meat, yuck! I agree with it, but I couldn't do it myself. It takes me all my time to open a tin of dead.

Hope I've helped.

Pandora

jamesb_dashiel wrote: Hi allI know there has been some discussion on here regarding vegan/veggie cat feeding. Has anyone here sucessfully brought up a cat 15+ years sucessfully? Or has the substitute foods only been available recently? What foods are available? I'm OK subjecting myself to veganism. But cats are carnivores and I don't believe we even know enough about human nutrition never mind that of felines to really understand the biochemistry involved.So, I'd appreciate any personal experiences.regardsJamesB~~ info ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Please remember that the above is only the opinion of the author, there may be another side to the story you have not heard.---------------------------Was this message Off Topic? Did you know? Was it snipped?~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Guidelines: visit <site temporarily offline>Un: send a blank message to -

[Guest guest]

Thanks for this, and congratulations on a healthy vegan lion! I will deffinately be visiting the link you sent and might give it another go.

Pandora

"k@" wrote:

 

Hi, James...

 

Apologies if i sound a bit snide, but i've been feeding my friend the cat a vegan diet for most of his life. He's only nine, however. I would really suggest that you go over to http://www.vegancats.com and have a look at their gallery. There are all sorts of piccies and stories there.

 

James Peden, who wrote Vegetarian Cats and Dogs, conducted extensive research before he developed his formula and began marketing it in 1986. I'd be happy to find some excerpts from it if you're interested.

 

Yes, the feline genus is primarily carnivorous (though they do eat greens, as well). We (humans), however, have chosen to domesticate the feline. This has altered the cat genetically through adaptation. I feel that, as it stands, because it is "unnatural" for us to be living with cats in the first place, why is it any more "unnatural" to provide him/her/them with a PROPERLY BALANCED (one that contains taurine and arachidonic acid) diet which happens to be vegan? As long as the health of the animal is your utmost concern, why batter yourself emotionally for choosing to share your diet with him/her/them? Most commercial foods are full of rubbish that cats wouldn't normally eat, anyway. If you're not gointa' feed 'em vegan, let 'em eat rodents. Sorry...facetiousness emerging. This is just a bit of a point of contention for me.

 

In the end, you've just got to make the choice that you feel is "right". I agonised for years over this quandary and finally decided what made most sense to me. Dashiell-Pants, incidentally, has never been ill aside from the time that he was struck by a car.

 

xxk@xx

 

jamesb_dashiel [jamesb_dashiel]21 August 2002 16:53 Subject: Vegan CatsHi allI know there has been some discussion on here regarding vegan/veggie cat feeding. Has anyone here sucessfully brought up a cat 15+ years sucessfully? Or has the substitute foods only been available recently? What foods are available? I'm OK subjecting myself to veganism. But cats are carnivores and I don't believe we even know enough about human nutrition never mind that of felines to really understand the biochemistry involved.So, I'd appreciate any personal experiences.regardsJamesB~~ info ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Please remember that the above is only the opinion of the author, there may be another side to the story you have not heard.---------------------------Was this message Off Topic? Did you know? Was it snipped?~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Guidelines: visit <site temporarily offline>Un: send a blank message to -

[Guest guest]

Good luck, Pandora. I hope that you enjoy the vegancats site. I find it quite inspirational! You'll find piccies of my brood there, as well (plug, plug)...

 

xxk@xx

 

Pandoras Box [ladymorphia]21 August 2002 20:08 Subject: RE: Vegan Cats

Thanks for this, and congratulations on a healthy vegan lion! I will deffinately be visiting the link you sent and might give it another go. Pandora "k@" wrote:

 

 

[Guest guest]

On Wed, 21 Aug 2002 12:03:38 -0700 (PDT), Pandoras Box

<ladymorphia wrote:

 

>I have five fe(lions), ages: two at 1 yr old, 6, 14 and 20.

>I feed them all Yarrah organic in tins and dried.

 

We have 3 and a bit cats (one moved out to live over the road as he

doesn't like other cats much!). One of the 3 who deign to live with us

has only ever eaten dried cat biscuits, whilst the other 2 have always

turned their noses up at Yarrah! Ungrateful lot!!

 

They do seem to be excessively fussy so, for this reason and a nagging

uncertainty about whether it is actually OK (and fair) for cats to be

vegan, we haven't tried them on Vegicat or any alternatives.

 

Chris W

[Guest guest]

> Dashiell-Pants, incidentally, has never been ill aside from the

>time that he was struck by a car.

 

One of my cats is called Dashiel - Dashiel-Cat:-0

 

I never thought I'd come across another!

 

Regards

 

JamesB

[Guest guest]

Feed them mice /small birds or tell them to catch their own Of course if they mange to kill a sheep/cow then let them eat that too

 

Failing that if they start to starve then they are not natural animals and unfit to survive in the environment in which they find themselves so you choose to give them what suits you . I suggest you open the packet/tin for them as it may give them problems with their teeth !!!

 

Cats would not eat the stuff in tins as they could not kill it so whats fair ??

 

Mine are awkward too-- depends on what they have eaten before I mix packet non vegan cat food with baked beans /tinned spaghetti or vegan cat food , and give them my food as well----- they like cheatin' chicken Expensive tho'!!!!!

 

 

 

 

 

We have 3 and a bit cats (one moved out to live over the road as hedoesn't like other cats much!). One of the 3 who deign to live with ushas only ever eaten dried cat biscuits, whilst the other 2 have alwaysturned their noses up at Yarrah! Ungrateful lot!!They do seem to be excessively fussy so, for this reason and a nagginguncertainty about whether it is actually OK (and fair) for cats to bevegan, we haven't tried them on Vegicat or any alternatives.Chris W

 

---

 

Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).

Version: 6.0.370 / Virus Database: 205 - Release 05/06/2002

[Guest guest]

In Japan my neighbour fed his 7 cats rice and something .. it looked

like risotto tho... they could not afford to feed them meat...

however there may have been a little fish in it... (i never

asked...)

 

right Angie... if the cats want to come and live with us then they

can eat what we eat...

 

there's a cat round here that spends its days trying to push its way

into people's front doors... then it stands in the kitchen often for

hours on end... before trying to escape by some method... if left in

the house after bedtime... it will wait till we are asleep and then

jump on the bed... then it goes off and annoys another

flat/house...

 

i am sure that instead of spending all that time in our kitchen it

could be at someone else's house having a hearty meal... we tried

feeding it once but firstly i can't stand the smell of mashed dead

animals... and secondly, after feeding it would come and claw us...

so we decided the cat was best kept in a state of humble begging...

rather than psychopathic satisfaction...

 

, " Angie Wright " <angiewright@n...> wrote:

>

> Cats would not eat the stuff in tins as they could not kill it so

whats

> fair ??

>

[Guest guest]

You just have to do what you can considering all the factors .If you can't manage that with a clear conscience then the only option is not to have cats,

 

 

But thatmeans less available homes and more cats put down.It is a delema either way

 

 

zorgster [oliver] 23 August 2002 03:26 Subject: Re: Vegan CatsIn Japan my neighbour fed his 7 cats rice and something .. it looked like risotto tho... they could not afford to feed them meat... however there may have been a little fish in it... (i never asked...)right Angie... if the cats want to come and live with us then they can eat what we eat...

 

 

---

 

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Version: 6.0.370 / Virus Database: 205 - Release 05/06/2002

[Guest guest]

i'm not allowed cats in my flat...

 

, " Angie Wright " <angiewright@n...> wrote:

> You just have to do what you can considering all the factors .If you

> can't manage that with a clear conscience then the only option is

not to

> have cats,

>

>

> But thatmeans less available homes and more cats put down.It is a

delema

> either way

>

> Angie

>

[Guest guest]

Shame

 

 

zorgster [oliver] i'm not allowed cats in my flat... >

 

 

---

 

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[Guest guest]

I've seen this thread here before, but this was the most helpful and

constructive discussion I've seen of it here so far. In the past all I

remember was reprimands and recriminations about what hypocrites we are for

feeding our cats canned processed cannibal food, and no addresssing of the

issues of whether we have the right to impose our human dieatary choices on

our furry companions, and whether they will thrive on a vegan diet.

I think I agree most with what Tal has written. I will look for EagleCat and

Wellness products, and Wysong has been one brand I've been feeding my two

guys for some time now.

One of my cats goes crazy for chocolate, does anyone know if it is poisonous

for cats like it is for dogs? My other cats goes crazy for nori seaweed, so

whenever I am making my nutpaste sushi, I make sure to give him nori. Anyone

know if this is good or bad for him?

 

Janice Rothstein

San Francisco

[Guest guest]

I just wanted to make a couple of comments in response to the earlier

posting

urging people not to feed their cats vegan diets. It's true that cats are

natural carnivores, but I disagree with the statement that it's wrong to

feed them a vegan diet.

 

Look around your cat's home (your house) and ask yourself what about your

cat's life is " natural. " In nature, cats don't sleep in beds, don't have

members of other species providing them with kibbles made from ground-up

factory-farmed animal parts, and aren't spayed or neutered. Is it " natural "

for them to be our " pets " in the first place?

 

I personally believe that any money withheld from supporting factory farming

is a very good thing. I don't think the question should be, " Is it natural? "

for cats to be healthy eating a vegan diet but " Is it possible? "

 

I know several people who have fed their cats vegan diets for years, and

their cats are in perfectly good health. Of course you should make sure to

educate yourself before you do anything that might affect the health of

animals entrusted to your care, and it's up to each person to decide that on

their own based on their own research and opinions. I just don't think we

should feel any guilt about feeding our animal companions food that does not

include ground-up animals! Anyway, check out www.vegancats.com for more

information.

 

I hope this doesn't lead to a long debate; I just wanted to put in my $.02.

 

Nora

[Guest guest]

On 05/01/03, Nora Kramer <nora wrote:

 

> Look around your cat's home (your house) and ask yourself what about your

> cat's life is " natural. " In nature, cats don't sleep in beds, don't have

> members of other species providing them with kibbles made from ground-up

> factory-farmed animal parts, and aren't spayed or neutered. Is it " natural "

> for them to be our " pets " in the first place?

 

but that's an intellectual argument, not an argument based on health

and nutrition. my cat's home environment does not enter her digestive

system, where it is broken down by acids and digestive bacteria, to be

rearranged by other molecules and moved around through her body, to

eventually become the raw materials and building blocks that form her

body and essential life processes.

 

(and yes, it is natural for them to live in the care of humans - they

are a domesticated species.)

 

> I personally believe that any money withheld from supporting factory farming

> is a very good thing. I don't think the question should be, " Is it natural? "

> for cats to be healthy eating a vegan diet but " Is it possible? "

 

there is no reason you have to support the factory farm industry if

you choose to feed your cat a carnivorous diet. simply buy canned cat

food that isn't sourced from factory farm ingredients. or make it

yourself at home. or allow your cat to go outside and hunt, if your

neighborhood is safe enough for that.

 

> I know several people who have fed their cats vegan diets for years, and

> their cats are in perfectly good health.

 

there is an enormous difference between anecdotal evidence and

research. i know several people who smoke, drink, and eat bacon double

cheeseburgers, and they're in great health too. vegan cat food

products are relatively new to the market, and there have been no

major long-term studies or clinical research pointing to their safety.

at least, none that i'm aware of or have been able to find. i would

be happy to read any information that anyone is aware of.

 

> Anyway, check out www.vegancats.com for more information.

 

their web site includes no links to any research or studies, yet there

are several long paragraphs about how to monitor and regulate your

cat's pH. such experiments are unnecessary when they eat a more

natural diet.

 

> I hope this doesn't lead to a long debate; I just wanted to put in my $.02.

 

i realize that this is a frustrating issue for some people. however,

i've noticed that many vegans encounter this ethical battle about

their food vs their pet's food, and they can't resolve it for

themselves. my feeling is that feeding your cat as close to their

natural diet as possible is the most respectful service you can

provide to your companion animal, and thus, is vegan.

 

i believe it is important to acknowledge the natural world for what it

is. nature has developed her wisdom over a multi-billion year process

of balance and refinement, and it is not up to us to decide which

species can and can't be carnivorous. while we may associate very

closely with our animal friends, almost to the point where they become

an extension of ourselves, we must not confuse our issues and needs

for theirs.

 

as i'm writing this, the stench of my cat's breakfast is turning my

stomach. time to light more incense!

 

--

 

steve simitzis : /sim' - i - jees/

pala : saturn5 productions

www.steve.org : 415.282.9979

hath the daemon spawn no fire?