Guest guest Posted February 5, 2000 Report Share Posted February 5, 2000 Dude, No offence meant ... the term was not meant in reference to homosexuals ... " bum fuckers " is a terminology used by some to describe those who don't do anything ... much like a " dog fucker " doesn't connote that one actually fucks dogs. Sorry, but I am not going to tone my language any ... this is a public forum .... if the list manager wishes I don't take part in the discussions any further because of my views, language or choice of words .... then, that's cool, she can let me know. I do not, in any way, stand for violence against homosexuals, minority groups, etc. I very well may be a homosexual ... I think it's wrong of you to pre-suppose otherwise. I find it ludicrous to compare my use of the word " bum fucker " to having someone attacking me and forcing meat into my mouth. Wake up. That metaphor (or simile) is simply laughable. No apology is in order, if you don't care for my opinions, take a hike. Lastly, don't even start to compare the injustices that other animals endure compared with " sentient " creatures ... poor you? Vik " David B Raisey " <raisey Am I to assume that the use of the term " bum fuckers " by Vikas Sharma is insulting the WWF by implying that they are homosexuals? If so, I take great offence to someone using this sort of statement to cast an insult. Are we now going to start casting insults by using the N word and implying that someone is a person of colour? Using words previously used to insult homosexuals, people of colour, people of race or disabled persons to insult another person just to make a strong protest or point, is perpetuating insulting and degrading stereotypes. It also encourages the perpetuation of discrimination and violence toward those persons considered 'different'. How would you like it if someone insulted you for your choice of diet and proceeded to attack you and force the carcass of a dead animal into your mouth? This is the sort of violence that 'different' people are subjected to every day and someone like yourself only perpetuates this violence and stupidity by reinforcing the notion that someone is sub-standard just because they belong to another group while using that notion to insult another person or group. If I have interpreted your behaviour correctly, I for one believe that a public apology is in order, as the comment was made in public. I also suggest that you take a long hard look at yourself. Here you are choosing a diet to protect the living creatures in this world, however, you give no thought to the effect your thoughts and words will have on the sentient creatures of this world. - " Vikas Sharma " <carnival < > Thursday, February 03, 2000 3:11 AM RE: nothing's sacred > " Vikas Sharma " <carnival > > The WWF have been a bunch of bum fuckers for years! > > Prince Charles ... that filthy fucking fox hunter is a big member of the WWF > .... > > They have no right to call themselves a preservation group ... they should > be called the PPF (Putting People First) > > Bastards! > > Vik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 5, 2000 Report Share Posted February 5, 2000 I realise this discussion is off topic so I will limit my comments to this post. >Sorry, but I am not going to tone my language any ... this is a public forum This is precisely why you should consider your use of language - it is a PUBLIC forum. >I very well may be a homosexual I don't recall saying you were or weren't. >I think it's wrong of you to pre-suppose otherwise. Where did I do this? >compare my use of the word " bum fucker " to having someone attacking me and forcing meat into my mouth. The use of language affects how we view the world. The one of the main steps in dehumanising a group of people is to use insulting terminology to refer to them. This sets up a culture where violence against them becomes permissable because they are in effect no longer seen as human. >don't even start to compare the injustices that other animals endure So, you think the torture and murder of an animal is somehow worse than the torture and murder of a person? Just look at the case of the man that was dragged to death behind a vehicle. Or, the man that was tied to a fence and physically beaten to death because he was gay. Or what about the Jews during the holocuast that were allowed to starve to death with no water or food. Are they somehow less important or relevant than an abused and neglected battery chicken? As far as I am concerned ALL living things deserve the SAME degree of respect. - " Vikas Sharma " <carnival < > Saturday, February 05, 2000 3:58 PM There is absolutely nothing sacred ... > " Vikas Sharma " <carnival > > Dude, > > No offence meant ... the term was not meant in reference to homosexuals .... > " bum fuckers " is a terminology used by some > to describe those who don't do anything ... much like a " dog fucker " doesn't > connote that one actually fucks dogs. > > Sorry, but I am not going to tone my language any ... this is a public forum > .... if the list manager wishes I don't take part in > the discussions any further because of my views, language or choice of words > .... then, that's cool, she can let me know. > > I do not, in any way, stand for violence against homosexuals, minority > groups, etc. I very well may be a homosexual ... I think it's > wrong of you to pre-suppose otherwise. > > I find it ludicrous to compare my use of the word " bum fucker " to having > someone attacking me and forcing meat into my mouth. Wake up. > That metaphor (or simile) is simply laughable. > > No apology is in order, if you don't care for my opinions, take a hike. > > Lastly, don't even start to compare the injustices that other animals endure > compared with " sentient " creatures ... poor you? > > Vik > > > " David B Raisey " <raisey > > Am I to assume that the use of the term " bum fuckers " by Vikas Sharma is > insulting the WWF by implying that they are homosexuals? If so, I take > great offence to someone using this sort of statement to cast an insult. > Are we now going to start casting insults by using the N word and implying > that someone is a person of colour? > > Using words previously used to insult homosexuals, people of colour, people > of race or disabled persons to insult another person just to make a strong > protest or point, is perpetuating insulting and degrading stereotypes. It > also encourages the perpetuation of discrimination and violence toward those > persons considered 'different'. > > How would you like it if someone insulted you for your choice of diet and > proceeded to attack you and force the carcass of a dead animal into your > mouth? This is the sort of violence that 'different' people are subjected > to every day and someone like yourself only perpetuates this violence and > stupidity by reinforcing the notion that someone is sub-standard just > because they belong to another group while using that notion to insult > another person or group. > > If I have interpreted your behaviour correctly, I for one believe that a > public apology is in order, as the comment was made in public. I also > suggest that you take a long hard look at yourself. Here you are choosing a > diet to protect the living creatures in this world, however, you give no > thought to the effect your thoughts and words will have on the sentient > creatures of this world. > > - > " Vikas Sharma " <carnival > < > > Thursday, February 03, 2000 3:11 AM > RE: nothing's sacred > > > > " Vikas Sharma " <carnival > > > > The WWF have been a bunch of bum fuckers for years! > > > > Prince Charles ... that filthy fucking fox hunter is a big member of the > WWF > > .... > > > > They have no right to call themselves a preservation group ... they should > > be called the PPF (Putting People First) > > > > Bastards! > > > > Vik > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- > > Body Paint, Chocolates, & Roses Oh My. > <a href= " http://clickme./ad/SparksValentine8 " >Click Here</a> > > ------ > > > Post message: > Subscribe: - > Un: - > List owner: -owner > > Shortcut URL to this page: > /community/ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 5, 2000 Report Share Posted February 5, 2000 David Regarding the homosexual thingy ... through your comments, I felt you were making me out to be a homophobe ... that's the point I was trying to make, that's all ...but that's the last thing I am. I don't want you or anyone to think I promote that type of behaviour; because I don't. I agree with you on the point that murder is murder ... killing anyone or any animal is a shitty situation. I think where people mistake my stance is here: You said ... " So, you think the torture and murder of an animal is somehow worse than the torture and murder of a person? " I don't believe that the actual act is worse depending on who that act is directed towards, however, I feel that most humans who are persecuted are persecutors themselves ... most of them eat meat, or take part in the daily erosion of the planet ... being human is heavily impacting the planet ... so, when I hear about animals being killed and such, when their only crime is that of being conceived, then it hits my heart to greater degree ... it's the same with kids ... I think of suffering in degrees ... I know this will sound a little whacked, but if I saw a cow being butchered, or a man being butchered, I would put an end to the cow's suffering first ... because in the back of my head, I will be thinking " that human who is being butchered would be eating that cow if he could " - even if that was you or me there (assuming that you are a veggie as well) - I would be thinking ... ah, he/she's human ... one less meat eater on the planet ... I would put an end to the cow's suffering before my own ... we need to shed the " human-centric " view of suffering .. we can't compare our suffering and their suffering ... it's on two completely separate levels. my sympathies lie with the innocent ... When Martin Luther King had a great big rally in a park .. I forget the actual date and event .. but they had a great big barbeque with lots of pigs ribs available for all to eat ... it's difficult for me to stomach the concept that he was asking for other humans to appeal to the black people of America - and have them treated as equal humans - while they chomped away on another species, basically, because that animal was simply that, different. They wouldn't be eating other humans, so, why is it okay to eat the pig? I am definitely not saying that he shouldn't have been asking for equality, nor am I saying that they don't deserve equal rights because they eat meat. I believe that all beings should be treated fairly and squarely, unconditionally ... My point is, it's much easier for me to understand the animal's suffering first. Because as humans, generally speaking, we are persecutors as well, and when we stop doing that ... I will treat our suffering as equal to that of the animal's suffering. I hope that sort of sheds some light on my unconventional view of suffering from the animal's and the human's perspective ... David, I am sorry if I have offended you ... we really need to stick together here ... you are right ... I just don't believe in censorship to any degree ... people should be able to express themselves regardless of how reckless they are, and you should be able to respond in any manner you see fit. Cool? Vik Vikas Sharma of Operations & Media Carnival Management Web: http://www3.sympatico.ca/carnival Email: carnival Phone David B Raisey [raisey] Saturday, February 05, 2000 3:57 AM Re: There is absolutely nothing sacred ... >don't even start to compare the injustices that other animals endure Just look at the case of the man that was dragged to death behind a vehicle. Or, the man that was tied to a fence and physically beaten to death because he was gay. Or what about the Jews during the holocuast that were allowed to starve to death with no water or food. Are they somehow less important or relevant than an abused and neglected battery chicken? As far as I am concerned ALL living things deserve the SAME degree of respect. - " Vikas Sharma " <carnival < > Saturday, February 05, 2000 3:58 PM There is absolutely nothing sacred ... > " Vikas Sharma " <carnival > > Dude, > > No offence meant ... the term was not meant in reference to homosexuals .... > " bum fuckers " is a terminology used by some > to describe those who don't do anything ... much like a " dog fucker " doesn't > connote that one actually fucks dogs. > > Sorry, but I am not going to tone my language any ... this is a public forum > .... if the list manager wishes I don't take part in > the discussions any further because of my views, language or choice of words > .... then, that's cool, she can let me know. > > I do not, in any way, stand for violence against homosexuals, minority > groups, etc. I very well may be a homosexual ... I think it's > wrong of you to pre-suppose otherwise. > > I find it ludicrous to compare my use of the word " bum fucker " to having > someone attacking me and forcing meat into my mouth. Wake up. > That metaphor (or simile) is simply laughable. > > No apology is in order, if you don't care for my opinions, take a hike. > > Lastly, don't even start to compare the injustices that other animals endure > compared with " sentient " creatures ... poor you? > > Vik > > > " David B Raisey " <raisey > > Am I to assume that the use of the term " bum fuckers " by Vikas Sharma is > insulting the WWF by implying that they are homosexuals? If so, I take > great offence to someone using this sort of statement to cast an insult. > Are we now going to start casting insults by using the N word and implying > that someone is a person of colour? > > Using words previously used to insult homosexuals, people of colour, people > of race or disabled persons to insult another person just to make a strong > protest or point, is perpetuating insulting and degrading stereotypes. It > also encourages the perpetuation of discrimination and violence toward those > persons considered 'different'. > > How would you like it if someone insulted you for your choice of diet and > proceeded to attack you and force the carcass of a dead animal into your > mouth? This is the sort of violence that 'different' people are subjected > to every day and someone like yourself only perpetuates this violence and > stupidity by reinforcing the notion that someone is sub-standard just > because they belong to another group while using that notion to insult > another person or group. > > If I have interpreted your behaviour correctly, I for one believe that a > public apology is in order, as the comment was made in public. I also > suggest that you take a long hard look at yourself. Here you are choosing a > diet to protect the living creatures in this world, however, you give no > thought to the effect your thoughts and words will have on the sentient > creatures of this world. > > - > " Vikas Sharma " <carnival > < > > Thursday, February 03, 2000 3:11 AM > RE: nothing's sacred > > > > " Vikas Sharma " <carnival > > > > The WWF have been a bunch of bum fuckers for years! > > > > Prince Charles ... that filthy fucking fox hunter is a big member of the > WWF > > .... > > > > They have no right to call themselves a preservation group ... they should > > be called the PPF (Putting People First) > > > > Bastards! > > > > Vik > > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- > > Body Paint, Chocolates, & Roses Oh My. > <a href= " http://clickme./ad/SparksValentine8 " >Click Here</a> > > ------ > > > Post message: > Subscribe: - > Un: - > List owner: -owner > > Shortcut URL to this page: > /community/ > > --------------------------- ONElist Sponsor ---------------------------- Valentine's Day Shopping Made Simple. Click Here! <a href= " http://clickme./ad/SpaarksValentine3 " >Click Here</a> ------ Post message: Subscribe: - Un: - List owner: -owner Shortcut URL to this page: /community/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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