Guest guest Posted October 4, 2002 Report Share Posted October 4, 2002 I seem to remeber there was some discussion about this, so might be of interest to some... - " karin ridgers " <veganessex Friday, October 04, 2002 7:16 AM Fwd:The Jean for Genes charity > FYI > > MANY THANX TO **LIAN** - VEGAN SOC LOCAL CONTACT HARLOW - ESSEX > KARIN > > > Unfortunately, the basic answer is yes - see below taken from their site: > > Q. Are animals used in the research? > A. The vast majority of research is undertaken without the use of animals > and, where there is an alternative, it will be used. In fact, the only way > of identifying human genes and developing an understanding of their > function, faults and how we may be able to overcome genetic disorders is to > investigate human genes. > Tests on animals are kept to an absolute minimum. When research reaches a > stage where human trials for treatment can take place, ethical approval must > be gained. In order to gain this approval appropriate tests using animal > 'models' – animals which mimic the human diseases being researched – become > essential. These animals are typically mice. > Our understanding of how genetic mechanisms work cannot be advanced, and > ethical approval to carry out human clinical trials cannot be gained, > without the use of animals. It is, therefore, a vital part of the research > process. > Researchers are continually making efforts to minimise the use of animals > and prevent their suffering, and the Home Office has very strict regulations > to ensure animals do not suffer. > > > > > karin > > www.veganessex.org.uk > > NATIONAL VEGAN WEEK & WORLD VEGAN DAY! > > LETS TELL THE WORLD > (WELL ESSEX ANYWAY!) > > **are you vegan? then why not help promote it by joining the vegan society? > call 01424 427393 now!** > > want to get active? why not join Viva! > 01273 777688 > > want a local campaigning group!? > join vegan essex/viva! Essex 07092 369280 > we meet the 1st Tuesday of the month > @ The Brentwood School Sports Hall > > > _______________ > Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com > Unfortunately, the basic answer is yes - see below taken from their site: Q. Are animals used in the research? A. The vast majority of research is undertaken without the use of animals and, where there is an alternative, it will be used. In fact, the only way of identifying human genes and developing an understanding of their function, faults and how we may be able to overcome genetic disorders is to investigate human genes. Tests on animals are kept to an absolute minimum. When research reaches a stage where human trials for treatment can take place, ethical approval must be gained. In order to gain this approval appropriate tests using animal 'models' – animals which mimic the human diseases being researched – become essential. These animals are typically mice. Our understanding of how genetic mechanisms work cannot be advanced, and ethical approval to carry out human clinical trials cannot be gained, without the use of animals. It is, therefore, a vital part of the research process. Researchers are continually making efforts to minimise the use of animals and prevent their suffering, and the Home Office has very strict regulations to ensure animals do not suffer. "karin ridgers" >karin >The Jean for Genes charity >Thu, 03 Oct 2002 14:50:35 +0000 > >Hi! >Do you know if the Jean for Genes charity is an animal testing >charity? > >Any info appreciated > >karin > >www.veganessex.org.uk > >NATIONAL VEGAN WEEK & WORLD VEGAN DAY! > >LETS TELL THE WORLD >(WELL ESSEX ANYWAY!) > >**are you vegan? then why not help promote it by joining the vegan >society? >call 01424 427393 now!** > >want to get active? why not join Viva! >01273 777688 > >want a local campaigning group!? >join vegan essex/viva! Essex 07092 369280 >we meet the 1st Tuesday of the month >@ The Brentwood School Sports Hall > Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. Click Here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 4, 2002 Report Share Posted October 4, 2002 Graham, Thanks for that - it made me think of something. Personally I am against testing on animals however I would like to ask a question. (being the veganewbie I am) Some people think that testing on animals is better than testing on humans (which implies that humans are 'more important' than animals) Some people think that testing on certain 'insignificant' animals is ok Some people think that testing on animals is no-go. If companies need to test their products, then what can they do? I for one know absolutely nothing about this topic and so don't know the issues, would someone be able to point me in the right direction? (to websites or something) I realise this is an emotive issue, I just find it disgusting (especially when reading the diary from someone who used to work at HLS, I think how can anyone allow this to happen/sleep at night?!) However I can understand if some people think it is better to test on animals rather than humans. I would hope that this would be a constructive and informative debate, including maybe information about where to find out which companies test on animals, etc. Thanks a lot, Nick Graham Burnett [grahamburnett] 04 October 2002 20:31 ; eco_vegans ; ; VegansUncensored Fw: Fwd:The Jean for Genes charity I seem to remeber there was some discussion about this, so might be of interest to some... - " karin ridgers " <veganessex Friday, October 04, 2002 7:16 AM Fwd:The Jean for Genes charity > FYI > > MANY THANX TO **LIAN** - VEGAN SOC LOCAL CONTACT HARLOW - ESSEX > KARIN > > > Unfortunately, the basic answer is yes - see below taken from their site: > > Q. Are animals used in the research? > A. The vast majority of research is undertaken without the use of animals > and, where there is an alternative, it will be used. In fact, the only way > of identifying human genes and developing an understanding of their > function, faults and how we may be able to overcome genetic disorders is to > investigate human genes. > Tests on animals are kept to an absolute minimum. When research reaches a > stage where human trials for treatment can take place, ethical approval must > be gained. In order to gain this approval appropriate tests using animal > 'models' animals which mimic the human diseases being researched become > essential. These animals are typically mice. > Our understanding of how genetic mechanisms work cannot be advanced, and > ethical approval to carry out human clinical trials cannot be gained, > without the use of animals. It is, therefore, a vital part of the research > process. > Researchers are continually making efforts to minimise the use of animals > and prevent their suffering, and the Home Office has very strict regulations > to ensure animals do not suffer. > > > > > karin > > www.veganessex.org.uk > > NATIONAL VEGAN WEEK & WORLD VEGAN DAY! > > LETS TELL THE WORLD > (WELL ESSEX ANYWAY!) > > **are you vegan? then why not help promote it by joining the vegan society? > call 01424 427393 now!** > > want to get active? why not join Viva! > 01273 777688 > > want a local campaigning group!? > join vegan essex/viva! Essex 07092 369280 > we meet the 1st Tuesday of the month > @ The Brentwood School Sports Hall > > > _______________ > Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com > ~~ info ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Please remember that the above is only the opinion of the author, there may be another side to the story you have not heard. --------------------------- Was this message Off Topic? Did you know? Was it snipped? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Guidelines: visit <site temporarily offline> Un: send a blank message to - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 5, 2002 Report Share Posted October 5, 2002 Please, read the book Slaughter of the Innocent by Hans Reusch. Also, go to the Dr Hadwen trust online. I don't remember the URL right now, but if you just type Dr Hadwen into www.google.co.uk, you'll find it. Very informative. It'll tell you how they are successfully doing medical/scientific research without the use of animals. For instance, there are computer programmes and cell cultures. Good luck. k@ Nick Abbott [nabbott] 04 October 2002 23:50 RE: Fw: Fwd:The Jean for Genes charity Graham, Thanks for that - it made me think of something. Personally I am against testing on animals however I would like to ask a question. (being the veganewbie I am) Some people think that testing on animals is better than testing on humans (which implies that humans are 'more important' than animals) Some people think that testing on certain 'insignificant' animals is ok Some people think that testing on animals is no-go. If companies need to test their products, then what can they do? I for one know absolutely nothing about this topic and so don't know the issues, would someone be able to point me in the right direction? (to websites or something) I realise this is an emotive issue, I just find it disgusting (especially when reading the diary from someone who used to work at HLS, I think how can anyone allow this to happen/sleep at night?!) However I can understand if some people think it is better to test on animals rather than humans. I would hope that this would be a constructive and informative debate, including maybe information about where to find out which companies test on animals, etc. Thanks a lot, Nick Graham Burnett [grahamburnett] 04 October 2002 20:31 ; eco_vegans ; ; VegansUncensored Fw: Fwd:The Jean for Genes charity I seem to remeber there was some discussion about this, so might be of interest to some... - " karin ridgers " <veganessex Friday, October 04, 2002 7:16 AM Fwd:The Jean for Genes charity > FYI > > MANY THANX TO **LIAN** - VEGAN SOC LOCAL CONTACT HARLOW - ESSEX > KARIN > > > Unfortunately, the basic answer is yes - see below taken from their site: > > Q. Are animals used in the research? > A. The vast majority of research is undertaken without the use of animals > and, where there is an alternative, it will be used. In fact, the only way > of identifying human genes and developing an understanding of their > function, faults and how we may be able to overcome genetic disorders is to > investigate human genes. > Tests on animals are kept to an absolute minimum. When research reaches a > stage where human trials for treatment can take place, ethical approval must > be gained. In order to gain this approval appropriate tests using animal > 'models' animals which mimic the human diseases being researched become > essential. These animals are typically mice. > Our understanding of how genetic mechanisms work cannot be advanced, and > ethical approval to carry out human clinical trials cannot be gained, > without the use of animals. It is, therefore, a vital part of the research > process. > Researchers are continually making efforts to minimise the use of animals > and prevent their suffering, and the Home Office has very strict regulations > to ensure animals do not suffer. > > > > > karin > > www.veganessex.org.uk > > NATIONAL VEGAN WEEK & WORLD VEGAN DAY! > > LETS TELL THE WORLD > (WELL ESSEX ANYWAY!) > > **are you vegan? then why not help promote it by joining the vegan society? > call 01424 427393 now!** > > want to get active? why not join Viva! > 01273 777688 > > want a local campaigning group!? > join vegan essex/viva! Essex 07092 369280 > we meet the 1st Tuesday of the month > @ The Brentwood School Sports Hall > > > _______________ > Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com > ~~ info ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Please remember that the above is only the opinion of the author, there may be another side to the story you have not heard. --------------------------- Was this message Off Topic? Did you know? Was it snipped? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Guidelines: visit <site temporarily offline> Un: send a blank message to - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 7, 2002 Report Share Posted October 7, 2002 Nick Abbott wrote: > > If companies need to test their products, then what can they do? I for one > know absolutely nothing about this topic and so don't know the issues, would > someone be able to point me in the right direction? (to websites or > something) Well, they could use tests on tissue cultures. In practice, the only way of defending yourself legally if the drug turns out to kill humans doing the same battery of toxicology tests as everything else. That's not actually the pharmaceutical companies' fault, IMHO. We need to change the regulatory environment. (Although I'm not sure what would happen if the drug was just plain toxic in a trans-species way that only happened through several organs working together. Not, of course, that this justifies the vast battery of tests we get at the moment.) > I would hope that this would be a constructive and informative debate, > including maybe information about where to find out which companies test on > animals, etc. They all do. They don't have a choice in the matter. (Not that they seem to mind much.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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