Guest guest Posted March 14, 2003 Report Share Posted March 14, 2003 Some people I know were shocked to find their names and addresses put out on a website for huntscum and the like. They received death threats, smashed windows, hostile confrontation and assault. Worse, the school where one campaigner's daughter goes was revealed alongside pictures of the young girl on her way to school. More hassle ensued. A couple years later this young girl's rabbits, rescued from a life of vivsection, were found, outside her home decapitated, by scum who saw her personal details. I don't know about some of you but I imagine there's some right scum out there rubbing their hands together at this debate and the very thought of She Who Was Never To Be Named or Heard of Again rejoining this group. I'm not paranoid, I've seen what breach of privacy can do and I thought it best to share my view. Hey that rhymed! ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 14, 2003 Report Share Posted March 14, 2003 On Fri, 14 Mar 2003 16:43:08 -0000, " saoirse_soya " <saoirse_soya wrote: >I don't know about some of you but I imagine there's some right scum >out there rubbing their hands together at this debate and the very >thought of She Who Was Never To Be Named or Heard of Again rejoining >this group. This has gone right over my head, Saoirse. Did you mean to post it to this list? If so, I don't know who you're talking about. I'm curious to know how your name is pronounced, BTW?! Chris W Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 15, 2003 Report Share Posted March 15, 2003 Was this referring to me? For goodness sakes whatever I did on that group so many months ago is past history, and should be put firmly in the past where it belongs. I made a mistake at some point and although there was no harm actually done or intended, it looks like some of you have a real problem forgiving. I can learn from past mistakes after all and take your point about being more careful with people's personal details. Well sorry but it seems to be your/their problem if you/they have to keep being nasty about me, and it does not make me a bad person! Besides you don't even know me, so I'd really appreciate you not judging me on stuff some people on there have been saying, it's easy enough for them and you to bitch about me if I have no right to reply! Maybe you "accidentally" posted on here so I would know I was being discussed, in which case I thank you, but rest assured I'm not going to lose sleep over such small-mindedness. Why can't people just let it go already and try to get along? I'm capable of this after all. Lesley saoirse_soya [saoirse_soya]14 March 2003 16:43 Subject: Danger: ScumSome people I know were shocked to find their names and addresses put out on a website for huntscum and the like. They received death threats, smashed windows, hostile confrontation and assault. Worse, the school where one campaigner's daughter goes was revealed alongside pictures of the young girl on her way to school. More hassle ensued. A couple years later this young girl's rabbits, rescued from a life of vivsection, were found, outside her home decapitated, by scum who saw her personal details.I don't know about some of you but I imagine there's some right scum out there rubbing their hands together at this debate and the very thought of She Who Was Never To Be Named or Heard of Again rejoining this group. I'm not paranoid, I've seen what breach of privacy can do and I thought it best to share my view. Hey that rhymed! ;-) ~~ info ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Please remember that the above is only the opinion of the author, there may be another side to the story you have not heard.---------------------------Was this message Off Topic? Did you know? Was it snipped?~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Guidelines: visit <site temporarily offline>Un: send a blank message to - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2003 Report Share Posted March 16, 2003 Sadly Lesley they won't let it go . It came up because someone requested that you be reinstated . Your name was never mentioned and only a few messages were sent New people were naturally curious at the strength of the opinions. Saoirse did genuinely make a mistake and cross post in error, I believe, as she is on both lists ( as I am ). She did not use your name since she did not know it , nor did she know that you were on this list . Sadly new people are likely to accept what they hear. May be what you did was "bad " I could never see it myself because the only secrets I have I would never mention on these lists . I don't think I actually have any but then I have never had problems with "people knowing who I am and where I live etc . Maybe I am just lucky ,maybe naive, or maybe some people are a bit paranoid ? who knows But we have to stick to the rules and have to get punished occasionally Its just a shame that bullies (and there was a lot of bullying going on ) , when Lesley's posts could have been IGNORED ) kept going on !! Had the others been mature enough to stop answering and arguing with Lesley's messages ,it would not have got out of hand . One or two people told them to stop ,but they did not . They seem to have the attitude that you can say what you like and if someone does not like it they can leave (Hardly fair ). I don't see that bullying some one because they have strong feelings about certain issues is very compassionate Obviously one can discuss the issue and certain people always get rather personal, but when the majority start having a go imo it amounts to cruelty Lesley doesn't use bad language( which I hate but have to put up) with nor does she usually get personal . When being backed into a corner ,night after night, people might forget and break the rules and it happened to Lesley .It was no fun on the list at that time because of the unpleasant manner of the posts Lesley might go on a bit about certain topics ---don't we all have our favourite issues, but she can be ignored if we don't want to hear it for the n th time. She and I have been on these lists for ages so we probably know how we think . I get bored by recycling /permaculture/ cooking/ etc because either I don't do it or feel I know it all but I appreciate the ideas might be new to new vegans or those who are new to the list and so I don't comlain about hearing it all again Lesley may have her faults-who doesn't ?- but she is genuine and well meaning and is capable o making mistakes But once a person has paid the price of their mistake that should be it The persistant bullies got off scott free and imo new people should not form an opinion till they discover it for themselves There are usually 2 sides to everything (Except Vivisection/hunting/eating animals etc --and we all agree on those !!!!!. So lets try to be friends Some people will be bored by this because I have said similar things before when I felt I had to defend Lesley from her many attackers Lesley Dove [Lesley] 15 March 2003 23:11 Subject: RE: Danger: Scum Was this referring to me? For goodness sakes whatever I did on that group so many months ago is past history, and should be put firmly in the past where it belongs. I made a mistake at some point and although there was no harm actually done or intended, it looks like some of you have a real problem forgiving. I can learn from past mistakes after all and take your point about being more careful with people's personal details. Well sorry but it seems to be your/their problem if you/they have to keep being nasty about me, and it does not make me a bad person! Besides you don't even know me, so I'd really appreciate you not judging me on stuff some people on there have been saying, it's easy enough for them and you to bitch about me if I have no right to reply! Maybe you "accidentally" posted on here so I would know I was being discussed, in which case I thank you, but rest assured I'm not going to lose sleep over such small-mindedness. Why can't people just let it go already and try to get along? I'm capable of this after all. Lesley saoirse_soya [saoirse_soya]14 March 2003 16:43 Subject: Danger: ScumSome people I know were shocked to find their names and addresses put out on a website for huntscum and the like. They received death threats, smashed windows, hostile confrontation and assault. Worse, the school where one campaigner's daughter goes was revealed alongside pictures of the young girl on her way to school. More hassle ensued. A couple years later this young girl's rabbits, rescued from a life of vivsection, were found, outside her home decapitated, by scum who saw her personal details.I don't know about some of you but I imagine there's some right scum out there rubbing their hands together at this debate and the very thought of She Who Was Never To Be Named or Heard of Again rejoining this group. I'm not paranoid, I've seen what breach of privacy can do and I thought it best to share my view. Hey that rhymed! ;-) ~~ info ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Please remember that the above is only the opinion of the author, there may be another side to the story you have not heard.---------------------------Was this message Off Topic? Did you know? Was it snipped?~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Guidelines: visit <site temporarily offline>Un: send a blank message to - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2003 Report Share Posted March 16, 2003 Any differences we had Lesley were resolved many, many months ago and I know we have enjoyed many discussions lately on the vegan forum we take part in. Some people need to forget and move on. Janey x Was this referring to me? For goodness sakes whatever I did on that group so many months ago is past history, and should be put firmly in the past where it belongs. I made a mistake at some point and although there was no harm actually done or intended, it looks like some of you have a real problem forgiving. I can learn from past mistakes after all and take your point about being more careful with people's personal details. Well sorry but it seems to be your/their problem if you/they have to keep being nasty about me, and it does not make me a bad person! Besides you don't even know me, so I'd really appreciate you not judging me on stuff some people on there have been saying, it's easy enough for them and you to bitch about me if I have no right to reply! Maybe you "accidentally" posted on here so I would know I was being discussed, in which case I thank you, but rest assured I'm not going to lose sleep over such small-mindedness. Why can't people just let it go already and try to get along? I'm capable of this after all. Lesley __ IncrediMail - Email has finally evolved - Click Here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2003 Report Share Posted March 16, 2003 Until now, Lesley, i've reserved my opinion about whether or not you should be re-instated as a member of VegansUncensored. However, i take issue with your assertion that your actions toward Graham and Mr. Big weren't intended to cause harm. I think that you realise that harm, however insignificant though you might have imagined it, was exactly what you intended. I'd always thought of you as a fairly honest and impassioned person, but you are also, it appears, duplicitous. If you are as innocent as you claim, why are you so threatened by the assessment of a complete stranger. Just prove Saoirse wrong about your character rather than spewing your vitriol. k@ On Saturday, Mar 15, 2003, at 23:10 Europe/London, Lesley Dove wrote: > > Was this referring to me? For goodness sakes whatever I did on that > group so many months ago is past history, and should be put firmly in > the past where it belongs. I made a mistake at some point and although > there was no harm actually done or intended, it looks like some of you > have a real problem forgiving. I can learn from past mistakes after > all and take your point about being more careful with people's > personal details. Well sorry but it seems to be your/their problem if > you/they have to keep being nasty about me, and it does not make me a > bad person! Besides you don't even know me, so I'd really appreciate > you not judging me on stuff some people on there have been saying, > it's easy enough for them and you to bitch about me if I have no right > to reply! Maybe you " accidentally " posted on here so I would know I > was being discussed, in which case I thank you, but rest assured I'm > not going to lose sleep over such small-mindedness. Why can't people > just let it go already and try to get along? I'm capable of this after > all. > > Lesley > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2003 Report Share Posted March 16, 2003 I have nothing to prove, if Saoirse would rather believe those other people than me it's up to her, people whose opinion matters to me know me to be honest. And that includes Janey and Angie. If I intended any harm, the worst I intended was only to mildly annoy Mr Big and Graham, that was all, and if you really think that to be serious enough harm intended for the group to continue to keep me banned so be it, but remember they annoyed me intentionally too, many times especially Mr Big. However I am mature enough to be able to let that go. Lesley Kat [kittyveg]16 March 2003 18:46 Subject: Re: Danger: ScumUntil now, Lesley, i've reserved my opinion about whether or not you should be re-instated as a member of VegansUncensored. However, i take issue with your assertion that your actions toward Graham and Mr. Big weren't intended to cause harm. I think that you realise that harm, however insignificant though you might have imagined it, was exactly what you intended. I'd always thought of you as a fairly honest and impassioned person, but you are also, it appears, duplicitous. If you are as innocent as you claim, why are you so threatened by the assessment of a complete stranger. Just prove Saoirse wrong about your character rather than spewing your vitriol.k@ On Saturday, Mar 15, 2003, at 23:10 Europe/London, Lesley Dove wrote: Was this referring to me? For goodness sakes whatever I did on that group so many months ago is past history, and should be put firmly in the past where it belongs. I made a mistake at some point and although there was no harm actually done or intended, it looks like some of you have a real problem forgiving. I can learn from past mistakes after all and take your point about being more careful with people's personal details. Well sorry but it seems to be your/their problem if you/they have to keep being nasty about me, and it does not make me a bad person! Besides you don't even know me, so I'd really appreciate you not judging me on stuff some people on there have been saying, it's easy enough for them and you to bitch about me if I have no right to reply! Maybe you "accidentally" posted on here so I would know I was being discussed, in which case I thank you, but rest assured I'm not going to lose sleep over such small-mindedness. Why can't people just let it go already and try to get along? I'm capable of this after all. Lesley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2003 Report Share Posted March 16, 2003 But, it doesn't seem that you ARE mature enough to let it go, because you keep yammering on about it. Honestly, i haven't got any personal problems with you, Lesley. In fact, as i stated, there are things about you that i somewhat admire. However, you do, indeed, seem to hold a grudge. That's how i see it, anyway. k@ On Sunday, Mar 16, 2003, at 18:59 Europe/London, Lesley Dove wrote: > > I have nothing to prove, if Saoirse would rather believe those other > people than me it's up to her, people whose opinion matters to me know > me to be honest. And that includes Janey and Angie. > If I intended any harm, the worst I intended was only to mildly annoy > Mr Big and Graham, that was all, and if you really think that to be > serious enough harm intended for the group to continue to keep me > banned so be it, but remember they annoyed me intentionally too, many > times especially Mr Big. However I am mature enough to be able to let > that go. > > Lesley > > > > Kat [kittyveg] > 16 March 2003 18:46 > > Re: Danger: Scum > > Until now, Lesley, i've reserved my opinion about whether or not you > should be re-instated as a member of VegansUncensored. However, i take > issue with your assertion that your actions toward Graham and Mr. Big > weren't intended to cause harm. I think that you realise that harm, > however insignificant though you might have imagined it, was exactly > what you intended. I'd always thought of you as a fairly honest and > impassioned person, but you are also, it appears, duplicitous. If you > are as innocent as you claim, why are you so threatened by the > assessment of a complete stranger. Just prove Saoirse wrong about your > character rather than spewing your vitriol. > > k@ > On Saturday, Mar 15, 2003, at 23:10 Europe/London, Lesley Dove wrote: > > > Was this referring to me? For goodness sakes whatever I did on that > group so many months ago is past history, and should be put firmly in > the past where it belongs. I made a mistake at some point and although > there was no harm actually done or intended, it looks like some of you > have a real problem forgiving. I can learn from past mistakes after > all and take your point about being more careful with people's > personal details. Well sorry but it seems to be your/their problem if > you/they have to keep being nasty about me, and it does not make me a > bad person! Besides you don't even know me, so I'd really appreciate > you not judging me on stuff some people on there have been saying, > it's easy enough for them and you to bitch about me if I have no right > to reply! Maybe you " accidentally " posted on here so I would know I > was being discussed, in which case I thank you, but rest assured I'm > not going to lose sleep over such small-mindedness. Why can't people > just let it go already and try to get along? I'm capable of this after > all. > > Lesley > > > <image.tiff> > > > ~~ info ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Please remember that the above is only the opinion of the author, > there may be another side to the story you have not heard. > --------------------------- > Was this message Off Topic? Did you know? Was it snipped? > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Guidelines: visit <site temporarily offline> > Un: send a blank message to > - > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2003 Report Share Posted March 16, 2003 I really don't hold a grudge, where do you get that idea from? I get the feeling that there are quite a few people who hold a grudge against me and it upsets me. I only asked about being unbanned because I expected that they would have stopped bearing grudges by now and we could all start afresh. If I was still feeling full of grudges I would not have asked about being unbanned, I am a bit hurt that they do not appear to be as forgiving as I would be if our places were reversed. Lesley Kat [kittyveg]16 March 2003 19:26 Subject: Re: Danger: ScumBut, it doesn't seem that you ARE mature enough to let it go, because you keep yammering on about it. Honestly, i haven't got any personal problems with you, Lesley. In fact, as i stated, there are things about you that i somewhat admire. However, you do, indeed, seem to hold a grudge. That's how i see it, anyway.k@On Sunday, Mar 16, 2003, at 18:59 Europe/London, Lesley Dove wrote: I have nothing to prove, if Saoirse would rather believe those other people than me it's up to her, people whose opinion matters to me know me to be honest. And that includes Janey and Angie.If I intended any harm, the worst I intended was only to mildly annoy Mr Big and Graham, that was all, and if you really think that to be serious enough harm intended for the group to continue to keep me banned so be it, but remember they annoyed me intentionally too, many times especially Mr Big. However I am mature enough to be able to let that go. Lesley Kat [kittyveg]16 March 2003 18:46 Subject: Re: Danger: ScumUntil now, Lesley, i've reserved my opinion about whether or not you should be re-instated as a member of VegansUncensored. However, i take issue with your assertion that your actions toward Graham and Mr. Big weren't intended to cause harm. I think that you realise that harm, however insignificant though you might have imagined it, was exactly what you intended. I'd always thought of you as a fairly honest and impassioned person, but you are also, it appears, duplicitous. If you are as innocent as you claim, why are you so threatened by the assessment of a complete stranger. Just prove Saoirse wrong about your character rather than spewing your vitriol.k@On Saturday, Mar 15, 2003, at 23:10 Europe/London, Lesley Dove wrote:Was this referring to me? For goodness sakes whatever I did on that group so many months ago is past history, and should be put firmly in the past where it belongs. I made a mistake at some point and although there was no harm actually done or intended, it looks like some of you have a real problem forgiving. I can learn from past mistakes after all and take your point about being more careful with people's personal details. Well sorry but it seems to be your/their problem if you/they have to keep being nasty about me, and it does not make me a bad person! Besides you don't even know me, so I'd really appreciate you not judging me on stuff some people on there have been saying, it's easy enough for them and you to bitch about me if I have no right to reply! Maybe you "accidentally" posted on here so I would know I was being discussed, in which case I thank you, but rest assured I'm not going to lose sleep over such small-mindedness. Why can't people just let it go already and try to get along? I'm capable of this after all. Lesley <image.tiff> ~~ info ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Please remember that the above is only the opinion of the author,there may be another side to the story you have not heard.---------------------------Was this message Off Topic? Did you know? Was it snipped?~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Guidelines: visit <site temporarily offline>Un: send a blank message to - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2003 Report Share Posted March 16, 2003 I draw the conclusion that you bear grudges because you tend to recount instances of " transgression " against you. There is a bit of a martyr quality to you, Lesley. I am far from perfect, so please know that i am aware of this as i give you my opinion as to your own foibles. Perhaps, you are more forgiving than others, but you do not forget, do you? k@ On Sunday, Mar 16, 2003, at 19:38 Europe/London, Lesley Dove wrote: > > I really don't hold a grudge, where do you get that idea from? I get > the feeling that there are quite a few people who hold a grudge > against me and it upsets me. I only asked about being unbanned because > I expected that they would have stopped bearing grudges by now and we > could all start afresh. > If I was still feeling full of grudges I would not have asked about > being unbanned, I am a bit hurt that they do not appear to be as > forgiving as I would be if our places were reversed. > > Lesley > > > > Kat [kittyveg] > 16 March 2003 19:26 > > Re: Danger: Scum > > But, it doesn't seem that you ARE mature enough to let it go, because > you keep yammering on about it. Honestly, i haven't got any personal > problems with you, Lesley. In fact, as i stated, there are things > about you that i somewhat admire. However, you do, indeed, seem to > hold a grudge. That's how i see it, anyway. > > k@ > On Sunday, Mar 16, 2003, at 18:59 Europe/London, Lesley Dove wrote: > > > I have nothing to prove, if Saoirse would rather believe those other > people than me it's up to her, people whose opinion matters to me know > me to be honest. And that includes Janey and Angie. > If I intended any harm, the worst I intended was only to mildly annoy > Mr Big and Graham, that was all, and if you really think that to be > serious enough harm intended for the group to continue to keep me > banned so be it, but remember they annoyed me intentionally too, many > times especially Mr Big. However I am mature enough to be able to let > that go. > > Lesley > > > > Kat [kittyveg] > 16 March 2003 18:46 > > Re: Danger: Scum > > Until now, Lesley, i've reserved my opinion about whether or not you > should be re-instated as a member of VegansUncensored. However, i take > issue with your assertion that your actions toward Graham and Mr. Big > weren't intended to cause harm. I think that you realise that harm, > however insignificant though you might have imagined it, was exactly > what you intended. I'd always thought of you as a fairly honest and > impassioned person, but you are also, it appears, duplicitous. If you > are as innocent as you claim, why are you so threatened by the > assessment of a complete stranger. Just prove Saoirse wrong about your > character rather than spewing your vitriol. > > k@ > On Saturday, Mar 15, 2003, at 23:10 Europe/London, Lesley Dove wrote: > > > Was this referring to me? For goodness sakes whatever I did on that > group so many months ago is past history, and should be put firmly in > the past where it belongs. I made a mistake at some point and although > there was no harm actually done or intended, it looks like some of you > have a real problem forgiving. I can learn from past mistakes after > all and take your point about being more careful with people's > personal details. Well sorry but it seems to be your/their problem if > you/they have to keep being nasty about me, and it does not make me a > bad person! Besides you don't even know me, so I'd really appreciate > you not judging me on stuff some people on there have been saying, > it's easy enough for them and you to bitch about me if I have no right > to reply! Maybe you " accidentally " posted on here so I would know I > was being discussed, in which case I thank you, but rest assured I'm > not going to lose sleep over such small-mindedness. Why can't people > just let it go already and try to get along? I'm capable of this after > all. > > Lesley > > > > <image.tiff> > > > > ~~ info ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Please remember that the above is only the opinion of the author, > there may be another side to the story you have not heard. > --------------------------- > Was this message Off Topic? Did you know? Was it snipped? > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Guidelines: visit <site temporarily offline> > Un: send a blank message to > - > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2003 Report Share Posted March 16, 2003 And yet really rude people like Mr Big has so many friends here even though he insults quite freely and no one dares question his actions. I do believe Lesley's heart is in the right place and even though we have disagreed on things in the past, she is always very respectful to me and she would do anything for her fellow vegans. I say we give Lesley a break. There are plenty of people on these e-groups who simply refuse to forget what some people do and say, and totally ignore the faults of others. Janey But, it doesn't seem that you ARE mature enough to let it go, because you keep yammering on about it. Honestly, i haven't got any personal problems with you, Lesley. In fact, as i stated, there are things about you that i somewhat admire. However, you do, indeed, seem to hold a grudge. That's how i see it, anyway.k@ __ IncrediMail - Email has finally evolved - Click Here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2003 Report Share Posted March 16, 2003 I hold no grudges and I think it would be nice to see you back on VegansUncensored. A reasonable amount of time has lapsed and that being said, I think we all played a part in those arguments last year so I do not know why you are taking all the blame. I certainly disagree with people who weren't even part of the groups last year and don't even know you, expressing their opinions in such a manner. Janey I really don't hold a grudge, where do you get that idea from? I get the feeling that there are quite a few people who hold a grudge against me and it upsets me. I only asked about being unbanned because I expected that they would have stopped bearing grudges by now and we could all start afresh. If I was still feeling full of grudges I would not have asked about being unbanned, I am a bit hurt that they do not appear to be as forgiving as I would be if our places were reversed. Lesley Kat [kittyveg]16 March 2003 19:26 Subject: Re: Danger: ScumBut, it doesn't seem that you ARE mature enough to let it go, because you keep yammering on about it. Honestly, i haven't got any personal problems with you, Lesley. In fact, as i stated, there are things about you that i somewhat admire. However, you do, indeed, seem to hold a grudge. That's how i see it, anyway.k@On Sunday, Mar 16, 2003, at 18:59 Europe/London, Lesley Dove wrote:I have nothing to prove, if Saoirse would rather believe those other people than me it's up to her, people whose opinion matters to me know me to be honest. And that includes Janey and Angie.If I intended any harm, the worst I intended was only to mildly annoy Mr Big and Graham, that was all, and if you really think that to be serious enough harm intended for the group to continue to keep me banned so be it, but remember they annoyed me intentionally too, many times especially Mr Big. However I am mature enough to be able to let that go. Lesley Kat [kittyveg]16 March 2003 18:46 Subject: Re: Danger: ScumUntil now, Lesley, i've reserved my opinion about whether or not you should be re-instated as a member of VegansUncensored. However, i take issue with your assertion that your actions toward Graham and Mr. Big weren't intended to cause harm. I think that you realise that harm, however insignificant though you might have imagined it, was exactly what you intended. I'd always thought of you as a fairly honest and impassioned person, but you are also, it appears, duplicitous. If you are as innocent as you claim, why are you so threatened by the assessment of a complete stranger. Just prove Saoirse wrong about your character rather than spewing your vitriol.k@On Saturday, Mar 15, 2003, at 23:10 Europe/London, Lesley Dove wrote:Was this referring to me? For goodness sakes whatever I did on that group so many months ago is past history, and should be put firmly in the past where it belongs. I made a mistake at some point and although there was no harm actually done or intended, it looks like some of you have a real problem forgiving. I can learn from past mistakes after all and take your point about being more careful with people's personal details. Well sorry but it seems to be your/their problem if you/they have to keep being nasty about me, and it does not make me a bad person! Besides you don't even know me, so I'd really appreciate you not judging me on stuff some people on there have been saying, it's easy enough for them and you to bitch about me if I have no right to reply! Maybe you "accidentally" posted on here so I would know I was being discussed, in which case I thank you, but rest assured I'm not going to lose sleep over such small-mindedness. Why can't people just let it go already and try to get along? I'm capable of this after all. Lesley <image.tiff>~~ info ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Please remember that the above is only the opinion of the author,there may be another side to the story you have not heard.---------------------------Was this message Off Topic? Did you know? Was it snipped?~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Guidelines: visit <site temporarily offline>Un: send a blank message to - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2003 Report Share Posted March 16, 2003 Janey, I'm not exonerating Bigs or anyone else from rude or rash behaviour. I have told people when i find them a bit out of order. I'm just doing the same with Lesley. k@ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2003 Report Share Posted March 16, 2003 Hi K@ I was sort of speaking out aloud and that wasn't directed at you. :-) Sorry! I've already been slammed for a comment I made about MB this weekend which Cathy didn't like. However, I actually find him more offensive than Lesley has ever been and with that in mind, I think she should be reinstated. Janey x Janey,I'm not exonerating Bigs or anyone else from rude or rash behaviour. I have told people when i find them a bit out of order. I'm just doing the same with Lesley.k@ __ IncrediMail - Email has finally evolved - Click Here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2003 Report Share Posted March 16, 2003 Saoirse brought the topic up Lesley naturally wanted to know if she was refering to her You can't expect Lesley to have a complete stranger saying things ,without trying to explain . She is not therefore yammering on about it merely trying to explain things . I will not say anymore on the topic after this post Saoirse was totally uninvolved and merely replying to others however she accidently sent it to a group Lesley is on . I always thought we weren't supposed to discuss someone without their knowledge which was probably why Lesleys name was never used until she of course named herself on this list Someone mentioned vitriol I wasn't aware that Lesley was being vitriolic Kat [kittyveg] 16 March 2003 19:26 Subject: Re: Danger: ScumBut, it doesn't seem that you ARE mature enough to let it go, because you keep yammering on about it. Honestly, i haven't got any personal problems with you, Lesley. In fact, as i stated, there are things about you that i somewhat admire. However, you do, indeed, seem to hold a grudge. That's how i see it, anyway. --- Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.449 / Virus Database: 251 - Release 27/01/2003 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 17, 2003 Report Share Posted March 17, 2003 Please can we stop replying to this thread now. The original message was an accident, and was flagged as such.Many of us have no ideas about the issues involved and would prefer not to have out opinions of people in this hgroup coloured by anyones behaviour elsewhere. This is *not* the right place to be airing dirty washing. The original message didn't even tell me who the person involved was, and I was quite happy not to know, dragging this out makes everyone involved look worse. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 17, 2003 Report Share Posted March 17, 2003 You are right, I apologise. Lesley Steve Welburn [] 17 March 2003 10:08 RE: Danger: Scum Please can we stop replying to this thread now. The original message was an accident, and was flagged as such.Many of us have no ideas about the issues involved and would prefer not to have out opinions of people in this hgroup coloured by anyones behaviour elsewhere. This is *not* the right place to be airing dirty washing. The original message didn't even tell me who the person involved was, and I was quite happy not to know, dragging this out makes everyone involved look worse. Steve ~~ info ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Please remember that the above is only the opinion of the author, there may be another side to the story you have not heard. --------------------------- Was this message Off Topic? Did you know? Was it snipped? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Guidelines: visit <site temporarily offline> Un: send a blank message to - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 17, 2003 Report Share Posted March 17, 2003 I hope you get reinstated on VegansUncensored Lesley and I am glad we had the discussion. Janey You are right, I apologise.Lesley __ IncrediMail - Email has finally evolved - Click Here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 17, 2003 Report Share Posted March 17, 2003 > Please can we stop replying to this thread now. Ditto - this discussion is not appropriate to this list. If anyone wishes to discuss whether or not someone should be allowed on the VegansUncensored list then please take it up on that list, or with the list moderator, Viv. This thread has nothing to do with this list and please remember that not everyone on here is a member of that list, or has even been a member of it and so this means nothing to them. I apologize for not having been around the past few days otherwise I would have put a stop to things sooner. As they have now come to a logicial conclusion I hope that everyone can let this topic die. Michael List owner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 18, 2003 Report Share Posted March 18, 2003 Hi Lesley, I'm sorry I haven't replied to your initial message sooner but I've been really busy. I just wanted to explain that I don't think you're a bad person. You're right, I don't know you. I've only been using these chatrooms for around two months but I feel very wary about people who would publish another's personal details. I haven't anything against you personally, it all started coming out when Mr Big thought I was you and I couldn't believe his fury so a very brief history was explained. It's because we're both really anti-smoking and that day I was in a bad mood and let rip how much I disapprove of it! Ever have those days!? Anybody can read our details like the dozens who work at ARNI just trawling through lists like these adding up info all the time. Vegans and those active can make a lot of enemies doing home demos out sabbing etc and for that reason and that reason only did I feel unsure about being in favour for reinstating someone who had published personal details. Not so much for me even but for others who do have stuff to hide and come on a list and stuff comes out... Before I read about the personal details having being published I wrote a message in favour of you returning because it had gotten really quiet and I'd gathered you have very strong opinions. I do as well. I haven't heard much of you since I joined and . I don't like the slanging but I do like debates and discussion. Best wishes Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 22, 2003 Report Share Posted March 22, 2003 <<><><><><><><><><<><><><><O.K., I ONLY GET TO USE A PC TOACCESS MY FREE E-MAIL ACCOUNT ONCE A WEEK, I DO NOT APPRECIATE HAVING TO WADE THROUGH 30 E-MAILS ON THIS SUBJECT, CAN EVERYONE PLEASE REPLY TO AUTHOR ONLY AND NOT ALL WHEN THEY HAVE A PERSONAL AXE TO GRIND.....AH WELL BACK TO THE OTHER 120 E-MAILS I HAVE TO CATCH UP ON! > Hi Lesley, >I'm sorry I haven't replied to your initial message sooner but I've been really busy. I just wanted to explain that I don't think you're a bad person. You're right, I don't know you. >I've only been using these chatrooms for around two months but I feel very wary about people who would publish another's personal details. I haven't anything against you personally, it all started coming out when Mr Big thought I was you and I couldn't believe his fury so a very brief history was explained. It's because we're both really anti-smoking and that day I was in a bad mood and let rip how much I disapprove of it! Ever have those days!? >Anybody can read our details like the dozens who work at ARNI just trawling through lists like these adding up info all the time. Vegans and those active can make a lot of enemies doing home demos out sabbing etc and for that reason and that reason only did I feel unsure about being in favour for reinstating someone who had published personal details. Not so much for me even but for others who do have stuff to hide and come on a list and stuff comes out... >Before I read about the personal details having being published I wrote a message in favour of you returning because it had gotten really quiet and I'd gathered you have very strong opinions. I do as well. I haven't heard much of you since I joined and . I don't like the slanging but I do like debates and discussion. >Best wishes > > > > > > Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! Peter H -------------------- talk21 your FREE portable and private address on the net at http://www.talk21.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 22, 2003 Report Share Posted March 22, 2003 To whoever you are We will all make a big effort to behave in a way that suits you and will suppress our own wants/needs That seems like a fair way to do things . Is it only important people who shout ? And I suppose you don't need a name because you are so important that everyone will know who you are Angie --name given because I am an insignificant little oik swpgh01 [swpgh01] 22 March 2003 14:45 ; Re: RE: Danger: Scum <<><><><><><><><><<><><><><O.K., I ONLY GET TO USE A PC TOACCESS MY FREE E-MAIL ACCOUNT ONCE A WEEK, I DO NOT APPRECIATE HAVING TO WADE THROUGH 30 E-MAILS ON THIS SUBJECT, CAN EVERYONE PLEASE REPLY TO AUTHOR ONLY AND NOT ALL WHEN THEY HAVE A PERSONAL AXE TO GRIND.....AH WELL BACK TO THE OTHER 120 E-MAILS I HAVE TO CATCH UP ON! > Hi Lesley, >I'm sorry I haven't replied to your initial message sooner but I've > --- Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.449 / Virus Database: 251 - Release 27/01/2003 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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