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Hi just thought I'd add to the conversation that legalisation of drugs would

no doubt result in animal testing to look for health risks. Any serious

requests for this would therefore be un vegan.

 

Anne

 

>I'm 100% for the DE-criminalisation of dope, smack and

>cocaine. Take the money away from dealing and all/most problems disappear.

>The thing that annoys me most is it's the tax payer who's stumped for

>health

>costs

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> Hi just thought I'd add to the conversation that legalisation of

drugs would no doubt result in animal testing to look for health

risks. Any serious requests for this would therefore be un vegan.

 

I'm under the impression that these drugs have already been tested on

animals already even though much more valid and useful results could

be gained from studying those who take them etc.

 

Regards

sue

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I'm sure the tests are already happening....however, the real tests would

begin when they try to isolate the ACTIVE ingredients.

 

 

>Hi just thought I'd add to the conversation that legalisation of drugs

>would

>no doubt result in animal testing to look for health risks. Any serious

>requests for this would therefore be un vegan.

>

>Anne

>

> >I'm 100% for the DE-criminalisation of dope, smack and

> >cocaine. Take the money away from dealing and all/most problems

>disappear.

> >The thing that annoys me most is it's the tax payer who's stumped for

> >health

> >costs

>_______________________

>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.

>

 

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Please! You're reinstating the Vegans and AR only care about animals. The

pros far out weigh the cons. If you honestly think this, then you've never

really thought about this. Almost all of societies crime is drug related,

because it's money related.

People already know what the active agents are in " illicit " drugs. If this

is unvegan then so is taking any painkiller (eg morphine) as it's been

tested on animals. So next time there is a vegan cancer patient dieing on

their death bed(which is less likely than a meatie!), you'll be first to

tell them the drugs they are taking to relieve there horrendous pain (which

no one can imagine until they've gone through it) are un-vegan and should

stop? Get a grip mate.

There is compassion, and then there is compassion.

 

 

suzy.grayson [suzy.grayson]

08 May 2001 23:50

vegan-network

Re: legalisation

 

 

> Hi just thought I'd add to the conversation that legalisation of

drugs would no doubt result in animal testing to look for health

risks. Any serious requests for this would therefore be un vegan.

 

Regards

sue

 

 

 

 

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Besides Anne, if you read my post you'd see I said decriminalisation, not

legalisation. Need I explain the difference?

 

 

 

Anne Grainger [annejrgrainger]

08 May 2001 21:34

vegan-network

legalisation

 

 

 

Hi just thought I'd add to the conversation that legalisation of drugs would

 

no doubt result in animal testing to look for health risks. Any serious

requests for this would therefore be un vegan.

 

Anne

 

>I'm 100% for the DE-criminalisation of dope, smack and

>cocaine. Take the money away from dealing and all/most problems disappear.

>The thing that annoys me most is it's the tax payer who's stumped for

>health

>costs

_______________________

Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.

 

 

 

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What is the difference?

 

> Besides Anne, if you read my post you'd see I said

decriminalisation, not

> legalisation. Need I explain the difference?

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I`ll leave it to you Rowan....I`m bored explaining this one.

 

 

> " Lesley Dove " <100706.3632

>vegan-network

>vegan-network

> Re: legalisation

>Wed, 09 May 2001 10:14:23 -0000

>

>

>What is the difference?

>

> > Besides Anne, if you read my post you'd see I said

>decriminalisation, not

> > legalisation. Need I explain the difference?

>

>

 

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Alcohol is legalised. IE you (being 18+) can buy it from any licensed

" dealer " . You can also drink it your house; and if what I've seen in public

is legal, then you may drink in public too (streets).

Decriminalised is different, more strict if you like.

You may only go somewhere to take the drug, i.e. pharmacy. This is the only

place where it is legal to be supplied and take the drug.

In places where illicit drugs are decriminalised even for a trial (and the

results have been fantastic), addicts are able to admit to their addiction

without being charged with an offence. They then receive free (!) drugs

daily normally in a pharmacy (private room), where they can inject the drugs

with a clean needle under supervision. They are weaned off under medical

supervision over time. Obviously they must be able to prove they are

addicted to the drug by testing. It removes the dealers and pusher from the

equation and they very quickly go out of business.

When a drug is decriminalised, dealers-pushers and people using illicit

drugs supplied by dealers can still be charged with an offence.

I'm not for legalising any drug as we already have too many legal drugs.

Dope should be decriminalised so MS suffers and the like can go relieve

their symptoms.

Anyone who says otherwise like that fascist old bag - Anne Widi-cum (now

there's someone I would object to joining a queue of cows at a

slaughterhouse) shouldn't complain when their children step on used needles

in parks, toilets and beaches.

Hope that's helped.

 

Ro

 

 

Lesley Dove [100706.3632]

09 May 2001 11:14

vegan-network

Re: legalisation

 

 

 

What is the difference?

 

> Besides Anne, if you read my post you'd see I said

decriminalisation, not

> legalisation. Need I explain the difference?

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I'd also like to advocate using the very word " un-vegan " is an oxymoron.

It's unvegan to say its unvegan to say its unvegan to say its unvegan to say

its etc.

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> Alcohol is legalised. IE you (being 18+) can buy it from any

licensed

> " dealer " . You can also drink it your house; and if what I've seen

in public

> is legal, then you may drink in public too (streets).

> Decriminalised is different, more strict if you like.

> You may only go somewhere to take the drug, i.e. pharmacy. This is

the only

> place where it is legal to be supplied and take the drug.

> In places where illicit drugs are decriminalised even for a trial

(and the

> results have been fantastic), addicts are able to admit to their

addiction

> without being charged with an offence. They then receive free (!)

drugs

> daily normally in a pharmacy (private room), where they can inject

the drugs

> with a clean needle under supervision. They are weaned off under

medical

> supervision over time. Obviously they must be able to prove they

are

> addicted to the drug by testing. It removes the dealers and pusher

from the

> equation and they very quickly go out of business.

> When a drug is decriminalised, dealers-pushers and people using

illicit

> drugs supplied by dealers can still be charged with an offence.

> I'm not for legalising any drug as we already have too many legal

drugs.

> Dope should be decriminalised so MS suffers and the like can go

relieve

> their symptoms.

 

I am with you on this, I am in favour of genuine cannabis therapeutic

use only, not people abusing it to get out of their heads.

If this is the way decriminalisation really works, then I might agree

with that, to help the genuine addicts to come off the drugs, and put

the pushers out of business.

I think alcohol should be un-legalised but maybe decriminalised too,

same for tobacco, they should be treated the same as any other

dangerous drug.

 

> Anyone who says otherwise like that fascist old bag - Anne Widi-cum

(now

> there's someone I would object to joining a queue of cows at a

> slaughterhouse) shouldn't complain when their children step on used

needles

> in parks, toilets and beaches.

> Hope that's helped.

>

> Ro

>

I have to say that even though I have never voted conservative (nor

have I any plans to do so), I actually quite like Anne Widdecombe as

an individual because of her pro-life stance, and I also heard that

she was against fox-hunting, so why are so many people so hateful to

her? I would think she is one of the politicians who with the correct

influences would tip over the edge and become one of us, or at least

lacto-ovo veg, as she already exhibits a good bit of reverence for

life, more than most politicians!

 

Lesley

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Oh dear Leslie, Oh dear oh dear oh dear oh dear oh dear.........oh dear oh

dear oh dear oh dear...........oh dear oh dear......Ann being influenced to

become one of us?....May I please point out...I AM DEFINATELY NOT ONE OF

LESLIES " US " ...It takes a hell of a lot more to make a decent human being

than a change of diet and a pro-life stance.

 

Among other virtues, it takes tolerance, compassion & understanding. I have

certainly never seen Miss W exibit these qualities. I look forward to her

awakening though.

 

The last decent polititian was Tony Benn....now theres a man who may have

made me vote.

 

mRBIG

 

 

> " Lesley Dove " <100706.3632

>vegan-network

>vegan-network

> Re: legalisation

>Wed, 09 May 2001 12:07:16 -0000

>

>

> > Alcohol is legalised. IE you (being 18+) can buy it from any

>licensed

> > " dealer " . You can also drink it your house; and if what I've seen

>in public

> > is legal, then you may drink in public too (streets).

> > Decriminalised is different, more strict if you like.

> > You may only go somewhere to take the drug, i.e. pharmacy. This is

>the only

> > place where it is legal to be supplied and take the drug.

> > In places where illicit drugs are decriminalised even for a trial

>(and the

> > results have been fantastic), addicts are able to admit to their

>addiction

> > without being charged with an offence. They then receive free (!)

>drugs

> > daily normally in a pharmacy (private room), where they can inject

>the drugs

> > with a clean needle under supervision. They are weaned off under

>medical

> > supervision over time. Obviously they must be able to prove they

>are

> > addicted to the drug by testing. It removes the dealers and pusher

>from the

> > equation and they very quickly go out of business.

> > When a drug is decriminalised, dealers-pushers and people using

>illicit

> > drugs supplied by dealers can still be charged with an offence.

> > I'm not for legalising any drug as we already have too many legal

>drugs.

> > Dope should be decriminalised so MS suffers and the like can go

>relieve

> > their symptoms.

>

>I am with you on this, I am in favour of genuine cannabis therapeutic

>use only, not people abusing it to get out of their heads.

>If this is the way decriminalisation really works, then I might agree

>with that, to help the genuine addicts to come off the drugs, and put

>the pushers out of business.

>I think alcohol should be un-legalised but maybe decriminalised too,

>same for tobacco, they should be treated the same as any other

>dangerous drug.

>

> > Anyone who says otherwise like that fascist old bag - Anne Widi-cum

>(now

> > there's someone I would object to joining a queue of cows at a

> > slaughterhouse) shouldn't complain when their children step on used

>needles

> > in parks, toilets and beaches.

> > Hope that's helped.

> >

> > Ro

> >

>I have to say that even though I have never voted conservative (nor

>have I any plans to do so), I actually quite like Anne Widdecombe as

>an individual because of her pro-life stance, and I also heard that

>she was against fox-hunting, so why are so many people so hateful to

>her? I would think she is one of the politicians who with the correct

>influences would tip over the edge and become one of us, or at least

>lacto-ovo veg, as she already exhibits a good bit of reverence for

>life, more than most politicians!

>

>Lesley

>

>

 

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> Is 'intelligent policeman' an oxymoron?

>

 

Not at all.

One of my all-time vegan heroines is a policewoman.

 

Have you heard of Kim Hollingsworth, the vegan policewoman from Auz,

who is fighting for the right to wear a vegan uniform, she has also

fought police corruption and unfair dismissal, having got out of her

former life as a stripper and prostitute.

 

http://www.animal-lib.org.au/interviews/kim/

 

http://www.publicdebate.com.au/special/kimhol/

 

Interesting reading!

 

Lesley

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I shall say this slowly, yet again, mRBIG, my name is spelled L-E-S-L-

E-Y.

I swear you are still misspelling it purposely, even when I sign it

clearly at the bottom!

 

I would think that Anne Widdecombe already has the awakenings of

compassion because she opposes the killing of foxes and unborn

children, but maybe I'm not as cynical as you.

Change of diet (or even just being anti-hunting) and being pro-life

is a bloody good start I think!

Some people come across as tolerant, compassionate and understanding

and look like nice people on the surface, but it is all surface

niceness while they are still eating animals or advocating other

killing, so how are they any better than rather less charismatic but

life-respecting people? They just con you into thinking they are

better, maybe.

Anne Widdecombe is more straightforward and honest than most, what

you see is what you get! And yet she gets all this flak, from the

very people who want honest politicians they can trust. Make your

mind up what you want from politicians!! You don't seem to know!!

Yes, it does take more than pro-life and being veggie to be a good

person but celebrate the positive stuff and build on that!

 

But Tony Benn was good in that he was veggie and good in perhaps

other different ways from Anne Widdecombe. Tony Banks is veggie too.

 

Lesley

 

 

> Oh dear Leslie, Oh dear oh dear oh dear oh dear oh dear.........oh

dear oh

> dear oh dear oh dear...........oh dear oh dear......Ann being

influenced to

> become one of us?....May I please point out...I AM DEFINATELY NOT

ONE OF

> LESLIES " US " ...It takes a hell of a lot more to make a decent human

being

> than a change of diet and a pro-life stance.

>

> Among other virtues, it takes tolerance, compassion &

understanding. I have

> certainly never seen Miss W exibit these qualities. I look forward

to her

> awakening though.

>

> The last decent polititian was Tony Benn....now theres a man who

may have

> made me vote.

>

> mRBIG

>

>

> > " Lesley Dove " <100706.3632@c...>

> >vegan-network

> >vegan-network

> > Re: legalisation

> >Wed, 09 May 2001 12:07:16 -0000

> >

> >

> > > Alcohol is legalised. IE you (being 18+) can buy it from any

> >licensed

> > > " dealer " . You can also drink it your house; and if what I've

seen

> >in public

> > > is legal, then you may drink in public too (streets).

> > > Decriminalised is different, more strict if you like.

> > > You may only go somewhere to take the drug, i.e. pharmacy.

This is

> >the only

> > > place where it is legal to be supplied and take the drug.

> > > In places where illicit drugs are decriminalised even for a

trial

> >(and the

> > > results have been fantastic), addicts are able to admit to their

> >addiction

> > > without being charged with an offence. They then receive free

(!)

> >drugs

> > > daily normally in a pharmacy (private room), where they can

inject

> >the drugs

> > > with a clean needle under supervision. They are weaned off

under

> >medical

> > > supervision over time. Obviously they must be able to prove

they

> >are

> > > addicted to the drug by testing. It removes the dealers and

pusher

> >from the

> > > equation and they very quickly go out of business.

> > > When a drug is decriminalised, dealers-pushers and people using

> >illicit

> > > drugs supplied by dealers can still be charged with an offence.

> > > I'm not for legalising any drug as we already have too many

legal

> >drugs.

> > > Dope should be decriminalised so MS suffers and the like can go

> >relieve

> > > their symptoms.

> >

> >I am with you on this, I am in favour of genuine cannabis

therapeutic

> >use only, not people abusing it to get out of their heads.

> >If this is the way decriminalisation really works, then I might

agree

> >with that, to help the genuine addicts to come off the drugs, and

put

> >the pushers out of business.

> >I think alcohol should be un-legalised but maybe decriminalised

too,

> >same for tobacco, they should be treated the same as any other

> >dangerous drug.

> >

> > > Anyone who says otherwise like that fascist old bag - Anne Widi-

cum

> >(now

> > > there's someone I would object to joining a queue of cows at a

> > > slaughterhouse) shouldn't complain when their children step on

used

> >needles

> > > in parks, toilets and beaches.

> > > Hope that's helped.

> > >

> > > Ro

> > >

> >I have to say that even though I have never voted conservative (nor

> >have I any plans to do so), I actually quite like Anne Widdecombe

as

> >an individual because of her pro-life stance, and I also heard that

> >she was against fox-hunting, so why are so many people so hateful

to

> >her? I would think she is one of the politicians who with the

correct

> >influences would tip over the edge and become one of us, or at

least

> >lacto-ovo veg, as she already exhibits a good bit of reverence for

> >life, more than most politicians!

> >

> >Lesley

> >

> >

>

>

____________________

___

> Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at

http://www.hotmail.com.

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Guest guest

I was under the impression Ken Livingstone wasn't a bad bloke but he seemed

against the may day demonstrations and pleased at the police actions...anyone in

a position to elaborate?

 

 

> Oh dear Leslie, Oh dear oh dear oh dear oh dear oh dear.........oh dear oh

>dear oh dear oh dear...........oh dear oh dear......Ann being influenced to

>become one of us?....May I please point out...I AM DEFINATELY NOT ONE OF

>LESLIES " US " ...It takes a hell of a lot more to make a decent human being

>than a change of diet and a pro-life stance.

>

>Among other virtues, it takes tolerance, compassion & understanding. I have

>certainly never seen Miss W exibit these qualities. I look forward to her

>awakening though.

>

>The last decent polititian was Tony Benn....now theres a man who may have

>made me vote.

>

>mRBIG

>

>

> " Lesley Dove " <100706.3632

>vegan-network

>vegan-network

> Re: legalisation

>Wed, 09 May 2001 12:07:16 -0000

>

>

> > Alcohol is legalised. IE you (being 18+) can buy it from any

>licensed

> > " dealer " . You can also drink it your house; and if what I've seen

>in public

> > is legal, then you may drink in public too (streets).

> > Decriminalised is different, more strict if you like.

> > You may only go somewhere to take the drug, i.e. pharmacy. This is

>the only

> > place where it is legal to be supplied and take the drug.

> > In places where illicit drugs are decriminalised even for a trial

>(and the

> > results have been fantastic), addicts are able to admit to their

>addiction

> > without being charged with an offence. They then receive free (!)

>drugs

> > daily normally in a pharmacy (private room), where they can inject

>the drugs

> > with a clean needle under supervision. They are weaned off under

>medical

> > supervision over time. Obviously they must be able to prove they

>are

> > addicted to the drug by testing. It removes the dealers and pusher

>from the

> > equation and they very quickly go out of business.

> > When a drug is decriminalised, dealers-pushers and people using

>illicit

> > drugs supplied by dealers can still be charged with an offence.

> > I'm not for legalising any drug as we already have too many legal

>drugs.

> > Dope should be decriminalised so MS suffers and the like can go

>relieve

> > their symptoms.

>

>I am with you on this, I am in favour of genuine cannabis therapeutic

>use only, not people abusing it to get out of their heads.

>If this is the way decriminalisation really works, then I might agree

>with that, to help the genuine addicts to come off the drugs, and put

>the pushers out of business.

>I think alcohol should be un-legalised but maybe decriminalised too,

>same for tobacco, they should be treated the same as any other

>dangerous drug.

>

> > Anyone who says otherwise like that fascist old bag - Anne Widi-cum

>(now

> > there's someone I would object to joining a queue of cows at a

> > slaughterhouse) shouldn't complain when their children step on used

>needles

> > in parks, toilets and beaches.

> > Hope that's helped.

> >

> > Ro

> >

>I have to say that even though I have never voted conservative (nor

>have I any plans to do so), I actually quite like Anne Widdecombe as

>an individual because of her pro-life stance, and I also heard that

>she was against fox-hunting, so why are so many people so hateful to

>her? I would think she is one of the politicians who with the correct

>influences would tip over the edge and become one of us, or at least

>lacto-ovo veg, as she already exhibits a good bit of reverence for

>life, more than most politicians!

>

>Lesley

>

>

>

>_______________________

>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at <a Target='_new'

Href='http://talk21.btopenworld.com/redirect.html?http://www.hotmail.com'>http:/\

/www.hotmail.com</a>

>

>

>

>

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> i hope i didn't offend anyone btw - i might have easily used the old

> 'trusted politician' !!!

>

> lol

 

No offence to me, it just reminded me to refer people here to Kim's

story.

Just because AR people and other protesters often see the bad side of

policing, it's probably not accurate to pigeonhole the police as all

bad. I met a vegan once who said there were veggie and vegan police

officers in his local veggie group, and I'd say that we need more

Ethical Vegans in that profession, because they are less likely to be

corrupt and unethical than anyone else!

I'd certainly urge intelligent vegans to join professions where they

can make a positive difference, and the police force seems as good a

place as any other. A vegan police officer would surely be far less

likely than a non-vegan police officer to abuse their power and get

heavy handed on AR protesters. I'm sure there would be less trouble

between protesters and the police if there were more ethical people

joining the profession, people like Kim, who is not only a vegan but

has stood up to police corruption.

 

Lesley

 

 

> > > Is 'intelligent policeman' an oxymoron?

> >

> >

> >Not at all.

> >One of my all-time vegan heroines is a policewoman.

> >

> >Have you heard of Kim Hollingsworth, the vegan policewoman from

Auz,

> >who is fighting for the right to wear a vegan uniform, she has

also

> >fought police corruption and unfair dismissal, having got out of

her

> >former life as a stripper and prostitute.

> >

> ><a Target='_new' Href='http://talk21.btopenworld.com/redirect.html?

http://www.animal-lib.org.au/interviews/kim/'>http://www.animal-

lib.org.au/interviews/kim/</a>

> >

> ><a Target='_new' Href='http://talk21.btopenworld.com/redirect.html?

http://www.publicdebate.com.au/special/kimhol/'>http://www.publicdebat

e.com.au/special/kimhol/</a>

> >

> >Interesting reading!

> >

> >Lesley

> >

> >

> >

> >

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Guest guest

i hope i didn't offend anyone btw - i might have easily used the old

'trusted politician' !!!

 

lol

> > Is 'intelligent policeman' an oxymoron?

>

>

>Not at all.

>One of my all-time vegan heroines is a policewoman.

>

>Have you heard of Kim Hollingsworth, the vegan policewoman from Auz,

>who is fighting for the right to wear a vegan uniform, she has also

>fought police corruption and unfair dismissal, having got out of her

>former life as a stripper and prostitute.

>

><a Target='_new'

Href='http://talk21.btopenworld.com/redirect.html?http://www.animal-lib.org.au/i\

nterviews/kim/'>http://www.animal-lib.org.au/interviews/kim/</a>

>

><a Target='_new'

Href='http://talk21.btopenworld.com/redirect.html?http://www.publicdebate.com.au\

/special/kimhol/'>http://www.publicdebate.com.au/special/kimhol/</a>

>

>Interesting reading!

>

>Lesley

>

>

>

>

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Hello Anne,

 

Tuesday, May 08, 2001, 11:33:51 PM, you wrote:

 

 

AG> Hi just thought I'd add to the conversation that legalisation of drugs would

AG> no doubt result in animal testing to look for health risks. Any serious

AG> requests for this would therefore be un vegan.

 

Ei da!

Most of this drugs have been already tested on humans, so scientists

just must to gather results.

 

 

 

 

>>I'm 100% for the DE-criminalisation of dope, smack and

>>cocaine. Take the money away from dealing and all/most problems disappear.

>>The thing that annoys me most is it's the tax payer who's stumped for

>>health

>>costs

 

 

 

--------

Best regards,

Sergio, CEO

vegan

http://www.royalwebhosting.com

Royal Web Hosting - Royal Quality Hosting

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