Guest guest Posted March 4, 2004 Report Share Posted March 4, 2004 Hey all, This ought to get some active discussion going.... :-) Who has any ideas (backed up by resources) on a raw fooder's minimum daily requirements for the following: protein (yep, there it is again) fat carbs calcium magnesium iron B-12 Vit D Vit C Others? I've been playing with www.fitday.com online diet and activity journal, but I'm not sure I can trust the units of measurement being used. It's kinda fun to learn the constituants of different foods, however... I also learned that the calories I burn at work/home and basic activities is MORE than my workout at the gym! That surprised me. peace all, Linda Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 4, 2004 Report Share Posted March 4, 2004 I'll share my thoughts on daily requirements. First of all, I learned back in the 1970's from listening to tapes of Nathan Pritikin that the USDA daily minimum requirements were based upon rat studies, so I don't pay much attention to them. My personal opinion is that my body will take from the food what it needs and either store or expel what it doesn't need. I make sure I have some protein, fat, and carbohydrate sources in each of my meals and leave it at that. Those who eat predominantly cooked and fast food are much more prone to have deficiencies due to an imbalanced and refined foods diet and/or poor digestion. These are just my thoughts, I don't mean to stifle any meaningful discussion in this area. Ron Koenig Bellevue RawSeattle , " Linda Reeves " <heartsong@q...> wrote: > Hey all, > > This ought to get some active discussion going.... :-) > > Who has any ideas (backed up by resources) on a raw fooder's minimum > daily requirements for the following: > > protein (yep, there it is again) > fat > carbs > calcium > magnesium > iron > B-12 > Vit D > Vit C > Others? > > I've been playing with www.fitday.com online diet and activity > journal, but I'm not sure I can trust the units of measurement being > used. It's kinda fun to learn the constituants of different foods, > however... I also learned that the calories I burn at work/home and > basic activities is MORE than my workout at the gym! That surprised > me. > > peace all, Linda Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 5, 2004 Report Share Posted March 5, 2004 My impression is that there are no accurate daily requirements for anyone! While it's possible some of the recommended dosages are close, they are only pieces of nutrition. Nature does not give us " protein " to eat and " carbohydrates " to eat, etc. Nature gives us mangos, papayas, avacados, greens, nuts, seeds, etc. I've learned, especially since going ra, that physicians and nutritionists seem to be only guessing (no offense, Sue, and other nutritionists on this list - you are not the norm) at what human's proper nutrition is, based on previous opinions and mainstream accepted ideas. As my health and even blood tests have improved on the raw diet they are contradicting traditional beliefs and are amazing my doctor! My bodies protein levels INCREASED during a time that I had DECREASED my consumption of concentrated proteins (nuts and seeds!) All I know is that my body works far more efficiently now than it ever had before I went raw. I also realize that there is still room for me to improve my diet, getting simpler - eating mono meals, not salt, etc. I am still enjoying mixed meals and occasional " potluck " foods, such as at... oh... POTLUCKS! When I have gone to mono meals and even decreased the concentrated proteins and fats, I have felt better. This contradicts many people's belief systems! Long story short - I suspect there is nothing accurate right now, just averages, expected " norms " . Perhaps some day we will be able to collect test results for a population of 100% raw foodists. I do get an annual blood test, so have those results to add to such a study. I had heard of some small studies, independent doctors looking at vegan diets, possibly including raw, but have not heard about results. Jeff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 5, 2004 Report Share Posted March 5, 2004 Hi, Jeff (and everyone else) - That's ok, Jeff. As a Registered Dietitian but now a raw vegan (nearly 3 yrs), I have become even more aware of the deficiencies in the teachings of the mainstream nutrition professionals. As far as the raw vegan community is concerned, we have absolutely no data on which to make any kind of evaluation as to the " nutritional adequacy " of our diets. We need a study of a large group of vegans (and raw vegans) across multiple age ranges and both genders. Dr. Michael Klaper in Hawaii is working on one, but it's all self-funded (by the participants) and I don't know what the current status is. As things stand, the " normal values " as published and used by medical facilities nationwide are all based on the SAD, which would include various degrees of pre-disease. I would expect that these values could be quite different for the raw vegan population. The standard intake recommendations are also based on the SAD, which includes cooked foods, and does not make any kind of adjustments for the damage that cooking does to nutrients. In our training, we are taught that " a calorie is a calorie " , and that nothing can change that. Yet there are some older studies (1950's vintage) that seem to contradict that, that equal calories from cooked food (as opposed to raw food) provide inadequate energy to sustain life and health. The standard recommendations also will tell us that " any food is ok in moderation " , including foods that we (in the raw food community) know to not sustain good health, such as refined sugars and sweets, refined starches, and totally manufactured foods that bear absolutely no resemblance anything in nature. Again, we only have to look to nature for our examples. Does the squirrel worry about getting " variety " in the diet? Does the blue jay worry about whether he has eaten too much fat today? Do we see bears popping vitamin supplements or diet pills? Yet, do we see squirrels get sick with malnutrition? Has anybody seen an emaciated (or obese) blue jay lately?? Any bears making themselves upchuck to keep from gaining weight? No, they just eat as they were programmed by nature, and rely on faith that their bodies will take care of the rest. Today at our staff meeting I heard yet another reference to human breast milk as a " living food " . I've been hearing that reference more frequently from the people who have been to training sessions on human lactation. If I could only get people to comprehend the extension of that term to food for older children and adults as well! The same person talked about the ability of the mother's body to detect if the baby has been exposed to an illness, and will produce antibodies within 12 hours. She then said, " our bodies are amazing! " There again, I'd love to be able to get people to understand that our bodies are infinitely wiser than we often are, and that, given the proper nourishment, they will continue to heal themselves whenever exposed to an illness or other toxin. But as long as people continue to stuff themselves with the " supersized " whatever, and the " instant " this and the microwave that, they will never have the opportunity to experience that healing. They will continue to be sick, continue to take their (legal) drugs, their Valium, Viagra, Vicodin, and whatever is being advertised on our Spam, and will never experience the freedom of weaning themselves from this dependence on the medical establishment. My services wouldn't be needed if people ate right from the beginning!! I hope this all makes sense...I've had 2 late nights, and am feeling a bit sleep-deprived...Spanish class Tuesday evening, then church stuff yesterday evening, left home at 8:05 a.m. & didn't get home until after 9 p.m. last night. (I saw my husband before I left for the gym at 5:30 a.m. & then again when I got home in the evening, he was already in bed.) I guess I have to be raw to handle that kind of schedule, right? See you - Sue My impression is that there are no accurate daily requirements for anyone! While it's possible some of the recommended dosages are close, they are only pieces of nutrition. Nature does not give us " protein " to eat and " carbohydrates " to eat, etc. Nature gives us mangos, papayas, avacados, greens, nuts, seeds, etc. I've learned, especially since going ra, that physicians and nutritionists seem to be only guessing (no offense, Sue, and other nutritionists on this list - you are not the norm) at what human's proper nutrition is, based on previous opinions and mainstream accepted ideas. As my health and even blood tests have improved on the raw diet they are contradicting traditional beliefs and are amazing my doctor! My bodies protein levels INCREASED during a time that I had DECREASED my consumption of concentrated proteins (nuts and seeds!) All I know is that my body works far more efficiently now than it ever had before I went raw. I also realize that there is still room for me to improve my diet, getting simpler - eating mono meals, not salt, etc. I am still enjoying mixed meals and occasional " potluck " foods, such as at... oh... POTLUCKS! When I have gone to mono meals and even decreased the concentrated proteins and fats, I have felt better. This contradicts many people's belief systems! Long story short - I suspect there is nothing accurate right now, just averages, expected " norms " . Perhaps some day we will be able to collect test results for a population of 100% raw foodists. I do get an annual blood test, so have those results to add to such a study. I had heard of some small studies, independent doctors looking at vegan diets, possibly including raw, but have not heard about results. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 5, 2004 Report Share Posted March 5, 2004 The bit about protein levels increasing when protein consumption has decreased reminds me of something my mother told me about when she was pregnant with me. I was raised ovo-lacto vegetarian, and my whole family is. Now, the doctors wanted her to take iron supplements during pregnancy, because of her diet . .. . but she had her iron levels tested, and guess what? Higher than the average for a pregnant woman. She needed no iron supplements. People are amazed when I tell them that (a) I'm a vegetarian, and (b) my long nails are real. :-) --Alice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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