soy effects/junk food vegans

[Guest guest]

I have two comments from recent postings:

 

1) We decided not to make a Tofurky this year not because of the soy but

because it's just too dense and a little goes a long way. We're going to

make a Shepherd's pie with seitan filling instead. We were going to make

something like Paris described, a phyllo dough with veggie and seitan

stuffing, but since our friends can't make it, the pie is simpler.

However, about the comment about a cup of soy having enough effects as a

birth control pill. If that were true, than there would be many of us who

have at least 1 cup of soy a day who would not be able to get pregnant and

who would not even ovulate. I eat soy almost every day, and I also am on

the birth control pill because I have normal cycles otherwise. If soy

really had that effect, then I wouldn't need to take the pill. That

simply doesn't make any sense.

 

2) The comment from the raw fooder that there are too many junk food

vegans and that vegans should be about health, etc. bugs me. I'm not

vegan for the health benefits, and 90% of the vegans I know are the same.

It's a nice side effect, but I'm vegan because I don't want to contribute

to the torture/killing of animals, and to the horrible environmental

effects of the meat/dairy industries. I like my food to taste good, I

like treats, and I like fake meat because there are many meat-based dishes

that I enjoyed, which I can now have without the actual meat. If I based

my diet solely on health after the meatless aspect, I would not enjoy my

food nearly as much and I might be tempted to return to a non-vegan diet.

There is already a perception among omnivores that vegans eat nothing but

salad and wierd sprouts and tasteless stuff, which contributes to

prejudice against us and an unwillingness on the part of the omnis to try

vegan foods. I think a lot more people would become vegan if they knew

they could still eat their favorite foods without harming the animals. So

I disagree that there are too many junk food vegans.

[Guest guest]

Contaminated Flour

 

This may make you think twice before eating white bread. Inquire further,

and know if its really true.

 

Studies now show that there is a chemical in white flour, called alloxan

that makes it look " clean " and " beautiful " . Problem is, alloxan damages

the beta cells of the pancreas so they no longer produce enough insulin

and the cells malfunction and die. So you may be devastating your pancreas

and putting yourself at risk for diabetes by eating " beautiful " flour.

 

In fact, the Textbook for Natural Medicine calls alloxan " a potent

beta-cell toxin " .

 

Scientists have known about this for years because diabetes researchers

commonly use alloxan to induce the disorder in lab animals. In a research

sense, giving alloxan to an animal is similar to injecting that animal

with a deadly virus because alloxan and the virus are both being used to

cause illness.

 

Bottom line - Whenever a whole, ripe, raw, organic food is changed by

deleting nutrients or adding chemicals, there will always be less

nutritional benefits and something harmful might be created. Nature knows

best, we are what we eat and absorb.

 

Even if you're vegetarian and eating many processed foods, you're

definitely not eating healthy.

 

http://www.cfsan.fda.gov/~dms/acrydata.html

 

Swedish research indicates that cancer-causing acrylamide formation is

associated with high temp cooking processes for certain

carbohydrate-rich foods. Its worse than you think. The FDA's followup

preliminary data on acrylamides shows its in a huge variety of processed

foods. Testing showed no mercy - its in almost everything heated/cooked

you can find - potato chips, milk, breads, crackers, coffee, roasted nuts,

baby foods, snack mixes, french fries, even canned prune juice.

 

This is more proof of the dangers of processed foods - Popular

vegetarian foods are some of the worst offenders. The body's natural

immune system attacks such unnatural and toxic invaders, causing depletion

of energy, increase in white blood cell count, and increased risk of

disease, from what I read.

 

Acrylamides are rampant in cooked " natural " , organic and vegetarian

products we see in the " health " food stores. All of these will be labelled

under the consistent new proposals which would dictate that food be

labelled just as their industrial-chemical containing substances are. It's

no surprise that fresh fruits and vegetables don't have acrylamides, even

many canned ones. And no surprise to find acrylamides in: (parts per

billion)

 

Lipton Recipe Secrets Onion Soup & Dip Mix 1184

Indian flat bread (from local restaurant) 125

Kettle Chips Lightly Salted Natural Gourmet Potato Chips 1265

Trader Joe's Veggie Chips Potato Snacks 1970

Terra Exotic Vegetable Chips 828

Snyder's of Hanover Veggie Crisps 1340

Pringles Sweet Mesquite Potato Crisps 2510

Boca Burgers Grilled Vegetable burgers (baked) 116

Good Health Natural Foods Honey Dijon Mustard Julienne Potato Stix 1168

Snyder's of Hanover Veggie Crisps 832

Blue Diamond Smokehouse Almonds 457

Hershey's Cocoa 909

Maxwell House Slow Roast (ground, not brewed) 209

Folgers Classic Roast 353

Wheatena Toasted Wheat Cereal 1057

Nabisco Grahams 944

Health Valley Original Oat Bran Graham Crackers 1540

Whole Foods Market 365 Oat Bran Flakes Cereal 189

Fat Free Natural Ry-Krisp 620

Nature's Path Organic Optimum Power Breakfast 398

Postum Original Caffeine Free Instant Hot Beverage 5399

Exceptional Value Corn Flakes Cereal 395

Post Shredded Wheat 'N Bran 161

[Guest guest]

Well...everyone has the right to live as they choose....however I

still feel there are too many junk food vegans out there, that end up

being even more unhealthy than some of their meat eating counterparts

(not fast food hoppers...but people who eat more organic and healthy)

ALso I think its important to eat organic...many vegans dont bother,

and this effects billions of lives! Pesticides and herbicides poinson

our planet, destroy our plants, kill billions of insects...pollute

natural habitats, cause cancer in people and animals etc....

Many of the junk food makers dont even use organic and use lots of

super dangerous genetically modified foods. If youre eating non

organic tomatoes, youre probably also eating fish genes..aka not

vegan. Yeps...that heinz ketchup. As for the soymilk...I said there

was 8 times the estrogen of a birth control pill...I didnt say it had

8 times the effect of the pill...there are some other constituents to

the pill that make it different. I dont beleive birth control pills to

be healthy anyways as they mess with your cycle, metabolism, hormones

and natural body function. Its just easier to use a condom. (and

healthier)

Another important reason for vegans to be about health is that as long

as we continue to support the western medical system pumping our

bodies full of toxic pharmaceuticals, were also aiding in the death of

animals, because they are tested on by these companies. We can fight

animal testing all we want, but if we truly want to make an impact,

turning to natural/alternative healing is the way to do it! If we eat

healthy and organic with lots of raw, we wont get sick to begin with.

And because we are healthier we wont get the whole sickly vegan

comments that abound today, because we will be rays of good health

(which unfortunately is not true with alot of vegans because they are

not getting enough nutrition..filling themselves with tons of pasta,

soy, and bread..which are hard to digest, contain allergens, AND cause

major mucous in the blood, causing your red blood cells to stick

together! Im sick and tired of being marginalized from other vegans

because I am healthy! Its like alot of vegans feel that they are

superior people because they are vegan, then someone like me comes

along who lives healthier, and thats threatening to many people. (not

saying everyone) And then I get treated by other vegans like many

vegans treat meat eaters. Its really frustrating. Then I see those

same people..end up being diabetic, getting very ill, smoking and

drinking, and ending up taking all these medications to fix a problem

they could fix simply by eating healthier and avoiding some of those

bad habits. Im not saying everyone should just stop and become 100

percent raw fooders and be completely natural etc...but that many

vegans need to learn to eat properly. Most people I know that are

former vegans, failed because they were junk fooders. This happens

over and over again, and it will continue to happen until our

community wises up! MOderation.....simple small changes can make all

the difference! I dont claim to be perfect either and we all have our

moments, but I strive for health, and healing. I watched my mother and

other family members die of cancer...and whatnot....from living a

modern highly processed life. Junk food veganism is a problem..becuase

many ppl think that just by going vegan theyre going to be

healthier..and it may be true for some, but that depends on if they

eat tons of french fries, and sodas, and tons of pasta, or if they

balance it out..maybe french fries once a week with a salad, instead

of 3 or 4 times a week etc...

We need to set a good example for other people and be healthy....the

more unhealthy vegans there are, the stronger the anti vegan sentiment

will become....which is so strong now that the govt will take away

children in vegan families citing neglect and malnutrition (and these

are children in vegan families that actually ARE healthy) But because

many/most vegans dont really follow the healthy lifestyle...this is

part of the reason that discrimination stays there.

This is my opinion and is part of a larger picture. Its not meant to

be personal or attacking, however I do feel it is a serious

issue..that and Im tired of seeing other darned vegans smoking and

getting drunk, as Im allergic to cigs, and dont want to see our earth

poisoned with them...and dont like the lower vibrations that permeate

the subtle realms do to unhealthy and ignorant habits.

Brother John

 

, littlemy@s... wrote:

>

> I have two comments from recent postings:

>

> 1) We decided not to make a Tofurky this year not because of the soy but

> because it's just too dense and a little goes a long way. We're

going to

> make a Shepherd's pie with seitan filling instead. We were going to make

> something like Paris described, a phyllo dough with veggie and seitan

> stuffing, but since our friends can't make it, the pie is simpler.

> However, about the comment about a cup of soy having enough effects as a

> birth control pill. If that were true, than there would be many of

us who

> have at least 1 cup of soy a day who would not be able to get

pregnant and

> who would not even ovulate. I eat soy almost every day, and I also

am on

> the birth control pill because I have normal cycles otherwise. If soy

> really had that effect, then I wouldn't need to take the pill. That

> simply doesn't make any sense.

>

> 2) The comment from the raw fooder that there are too many junk food

> vegans and that vegans should be about health, etc. bugs me. I'm not

> vegan for the health benefits, and 90% of the vegans I know are the

same.

> It's a nice side effect, but I'm vegan because I don't want to

contribute

> to the torture/killing of animals, and to the horrible environmental

> effects of the meat/dairy industries. I like my food to taste good, I

> like treats, and I like fake meat because there are many meat-based

dishes

> that I enjoyed, which I can now have without the actual meat. If I

based

> my diet solely on health after the meatless aspect, I would not enjoy my

> food nearly as much and I might be tempted to return to a non-vegan

diet.

> There is already a perception among omnivores that vegans eat

nothing but

> salad and wierd sprouts and tasteless stuff, which contributes to

> prejudice against us and an unwillingness on the part of the omnis

to try

> vegan foods. I think a lot more people would become vegan if they knew

> they could still eat their favorite foods without harming the

animals. So

> I disagree that there are too many junk food vegans.

>

[Guest guest]

I'm going to to get into a debate/discussion about this since it's not

really related to local topics (except in the area of festivals like Green

Festival offering raw/healthy vegan food instead of more mainstream stuff

like Stonyfield Farm's soy baby yogurt.)

 

I am not arguing that white flour and processed foods are good for you. I

am arguing that I don't think it's in the best interest of the expansion

of veganism for it to be presented in the " health first " way, partially

because it turns away potental " converts " but mostly because I would argue

that the majority of the vegan community is vegan for ethical reasons

first, and therefore are not as concerned about the health aspects as the

poster asserts.

[Guest guest]

I disagree...I think more people unfortunately are selfish and care

more about their health, than other animals...BUT with the combo of

the two things together, we can pull in more people. Plus there is the

fact I mentioned that people seem to conveniently ignore, about how

the junk foods often arent organic, and if youre not eating organic,

you are killing animals/insects and poisoning other people, because

pesticides do that...not to mention that many of the junk foods even

besides that produce lotsof toxins in the process and leftovers that

arent that great for the environment either...and most of these

processed cooked foods are wrapped in plastic..which is a detriment to

our environment as well!

Brother John

, " Emily Kearney " <littlemy@s...> wrote:

>

> I'm going to to get into a debate/discussion about this since it's not

> really related to local topics (except in the area of festivals like

Green

> Festival offering raw/healthy vegan food instead of more mainstream

stuff

> like Stonyfield Farm's soy baby yogurt.)

>

> I am not arguing that white flour and processed foods are good for

you. I

> am arguing that I don't think it's in the best interest of the expansion

> of veganism for it to be presented in the " health first " way, partially

> because it turns away potental " converts " but mostly because I would

argue

> that the majority of the vegan community is vegan for ethical reasons

> first, and therefore are not as concerned about the health aspects

as the

> poster asserts.

>

[Guest guest]

Personally, I don't think it matters how or why someone became vegetarian or (even better) vegan - they should just be congratulated for reaching such a good decision.

 

There are many diverse reasons to be veg, and many diverse ways to promote it. Let us each do what works best for us, and maximize the diversity within our community.

 

Cheers, Tammy

 

On Behalf Of angeliclive Re: soy effects/junk food vegans

 

" I think more people unfortunately are selfish and care more about their health, than other animals... "

Brother John

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Now THAT'S great advice! Thanks Tammy! I agree completely. Veg*ns should celebrate other veg*ns, not spew highly debatable logic as to why the others should follow their singular course and reasoning. Just be happy that others are on a somewhat similar path as you - but nobody's will be exactly the same. -Mike Borg"Tammy, Bay Area Vegetarians" <t wrote: Personally, I don't think it matters how or why someone became vegetarian or (even better) vegan - they should just be congratulated for reaching such a good

decision. There are many diverse reasons to be veg, and many diverse ways to promote it. Let us each do what works best for us, and maximize the diversity within our community. Cheers, Tammy______________________"All beings tremble before violence. All fear death, all love life. See yourself in others. Then whom can you hurt? What harm can you do?" - Buddha

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[Guest guest]

I hear this argument from different organizations and people and I understand what is being said. But I would have to disagree in the sense that I think it is more beneficial for the vegan "movement" to present the multiple benefits/arguments of why a vegan diet is a good thing. If we just target the ethical aspects then we may miss out on those who will be more drawn in by the health reasons. I've seen adds on tv for soymilk which talk about the health benefits (no cholesterol, low fat, good for your heart, etc.) and ultimately I think that speaks to a wider more mainstream audience. After all, people go on "diets" all the time for these reasons (and I know that many fall off these diets, but it is still a way to open people's minds). Once items like soymilk become more accepted, others will follow, and "vegan" food won't seem so strange anymore. Of course non-vegetarians may be turned on to soymilk but may still eat meat, but isn't that at least a start? A vegan

(healthy) diet is not just good for the animals, it's also a step toward reducing disease and other ailments that plague humans. Not to mention the benefits for our rising health care costs. Kristy , "Emily Kearney" <littlemy@s...> wrote:I am not arguing that white flour and processed foods are good for you. Iam arguing that I don't think it's in the best interest of the expansionof veganism for it to be presented in the "health first" way, partiallybecause it turns away potental "converts" but mostly because I would arguethat the majority of the vegan community is vegan for ethical reasonsfirst, and therefore are not as concerned about the health aspects as theposter asserts.

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