Guest guest Posted November 18, 2007 Report Share Posted November 18, 2007 Hi,The NYT is out with a review of a San Francisco's veg restaurants. http://travel.nytimes.com/2007/11/18/travel/18Choice.html?em & ex=1195448400 & en=e588de03f105c0f8 & ei=5087%0AVEGETARIANISM is a simple idea — don't eat animals — with an ancient pedigree. According to the Vegetarian Resource Group, 4.7 million American adults are vegetarians or vegans (people who avoid all animal products, including cheese and eggs).Yet even in San Francisco, with its countercultural and fresh food traditions, only about one in a hundred restaurants in the Zagat Survey is vegetarian. And while new vegetarian restaurants have been opening in New York and Los Angeles, San Francisco's scene has been expanding differently as beloved restaurants open new locations.This safe approach leaves some frustrated. “We don't have enough veg restaurants that are really good and exciting,” said Aurelia d'Andrea, managing editor of VegNews, a vegetarian magazine based in San Francisco. “I'm bored by what's offered here.” The city suffers a particular lack of South Indian vegetarian restaurants.Still, San Francisco vegans like Ms. d'Andrea have the luxury of high standards. Virtually any restaurant in the city will accommodate them, with many going far beyond the hackneyed grilled portobello. Many newer restaurants feature extensive vegetarian offerings from chefs who respect the concept, rather than treating it as an irksome neurosis.While this may reduce demand for strictly vegetarian restaurants, it also means that these establishments can't take vegetarian customers for granted. In this competitive milieu, certain standouts are influential, delineating the frontiers of vegetarian cuisine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 18, 2007 Report Share Posted November 18, 2007 > http://travel.nytimes.com/2007/11/18/travel/18Choice.html?em & ex=1195448400 & en=e588de03f105c0f8 & ei=5087%0A I noticed they included Greens, "of course". What I find interesting about the Bay Area veg restaurant scene is that Greens is very well known as a veg restaurant. But I don't know any vegetarians who consider it their favorite veg restaurant. And since we've been doing the annual BEST OF VEG survey, Greens has not won. But this year could be different. So you should definitely take a few minutes and vote for your favorites in this year's survey. http://bayareaveg.org/vote And, I would have to agree, I do tend to have my favorite restaurants and when I visit them too frequently, that does make it boring. But the upside is then I stay home and cook and try new recipes ... or just re-acquaint myself with old favorites. For anyone who hasn't been to Herbivore lately, they now offer a choice of potato or macaroni salad (as well as the regular fries) with their sandwiches. And if you enjoy the faux meats, try the Caesar salad with the 'soy' chicken or the same 'soy' chicken in the grilled sandwich -- absolutely yummy. Cheers, Tammy Bay Area Vegetarianswww.BayAreaVeg.org Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 19, 2007 Report Share Posted November 19, 2007 In my opinion, Greens and Millenium both could stand an attitude adjustment regarding veganism. Okay, these are not my types of restaurants anyway (I'm not into white tablecloths and snooty service) , but I was underwhelmed with my (admittedly limited) experience at both places. I guess I just don't expect to be made to feel the typical "vegan in a restaurant discomfort" at a vegetarian restaurant, and frankly, the fact these less-than-vegan-friendly establishments are vegetarian restaurants only makes matters worse. By that I mean I'm used to feeling like a freak in a meat-serving establishment, but I have a problem being made to feel like a vegan freak at a vegetarian place. Both restaurants seem to really cater to non-vegetarians, which is fine, as long as they don't have a massive attitude when an actual vegan dares to enter. I did have a nice waitperson at Greens once, who could at least recommend which of the dishes best translated to vegan -- that's because when I went there was actually no vegan dishes on the menu. Things may have changed since then. Perhaps evens Greens has by now figured out that every last dish needn't have butter or cheese in it to be palatable. If so, perhaps another on this list can update me. Anywho, maybe my experience has something to do with why Greens isn't popular with vegetarians. Then again, vegetarians do seem to vote for Millenium. I know it was at least started by folks who really care about animals. I just think the staff at Millenium tends to come from the general restaurant industry, and most likely are not vegetarians themselves (and not empathetic to them), from what I've heard. I could be wrong, and this could have changed. If so, I'm open to know it, and I'd love to hear what others think. Alison Bowman Improviser on Page and Stage Bad Apple, Alison's human humor blog (badapple.wordpress.com) Self Help for Cats, Alison's cat humor blog (selfhelpforcats.wordpress.com) Never miss a thing. Make your homepage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 20, 2007 Report Share Posted November 20, 2007 Alison wrote: "Greens and Millennium both could stand an attitude adjustment regarding veganism." and " the fact these less-than-vegan-friendly establishments are vegetarian restaurants only makes matters worse." My response: Millennium IS actually a VEGAN restaurant so you are wrong when you say that it's a vegetarian restaurant and when you say that it's not vegan friendly. Since it's vegan I don't know how Millennium could be more vegan friendly. Personally I am delighted that there is an upscale vegan restaurant that I can go to on special occasions and that I can impress my meat eating friends and family members with amazing delicious food that they never would have thought possible in a vegan restaurant. I can really only afford to eat there a few times a year but when I have gone I have only had wonderful food and very friendly service by really nice people. I know not everyone likes the food at Millennium but my experience has only been positive. I think we need to start appreciating the few vegan restaurants we have in the bay area instead of bashing them or else we won't have any more left. As for Greens, it's true that they have not been all that vegan friendly in the past (which is why I haven't eaten there in about 15 years) but from what I hear they are changing and we should applaud them for that and support them for that and maybe one day they will become 100% vegan Warren ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 20, 2007 Report Share Posted November 20, 2007 I agree about Greens, but not about Millenium. Millenium's menu is 100% vegan - even espresso drinks are made with soy milk by default (I think they might have cow's milk but you have to ask for it specifically). I'm not sure how they could possibly be more vegan friendly! On Nov 19, 2007, at 11:56 AM, A Bowman wrote: > > In my opinion, Greens and Millenium both could stand an attitude > adjustment regarding veganism. Okay, these are not my types of > restaurants anyway (I'm not into white tablecloths and snooty > service) , but I was underwhelmed wi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 20, 2007 Report Share Posted November 20, 2007 Hi Alison: I'm sure you have gotten much response. I agree that no one should ever feel unwanted or a " freak " for having certain beliefs. I am too a vegan. I never like feeling unwanted due to my ethical beliefs. Millenium, as you probably know, is vegan. I do enjoy the establishment. I think what it represents are vegans are not just (please forgive me on the old fashion label) " tree huggers " or " hippies " . It gives the people which I think are the hardest to convince (the high end corporate figures who typically eat steak, foi gras, lobster, etc) a chance to eat a high end vegan dish. I think it is a great way for us to impact people we may have some difficulties otherwise convincing. All in all, the big picture is to get the vegan message to each type of personality. I love all types of people. If Millenuim isn't for you, it isn't for you. But consider it a message to the people out there in life that would otherwise never be seen anywhere that didn't wasn't expensive or have attitude. I hope everyone has a fantantic TOFURKEY DAY! Mari Stoe , A Bowman <abowmanopl wrote: > > In my opinion, Greens and Millenium both could stand an attitude adjustment regarding veganism. Okay, these are not my types of restaurants anyway (I'm not into white tablecloths and snooty service) , but I was underwhelmed with my (admittedly limited) experience at both places. I guess I just don't expect to be made to feel the typical " vegan in a restaurant discomfort " at a vegetarian restaurant, and frankly, the fact these less-than-vegan- friendly establishments are vegetarian restaurants only makes matters worse. > > Alison Bowman > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 20, 2007 Report Share Posted November 20, 2007 I'm with Mari on this one. I love Millineum and part of the reason that I love it is because it is a high end restaurant. I've never had a bad experience there. I could go into a long explanation about why we need more diversity in the area of vegan restaurants but I am at work and need to…. Well… work. I'll just leave you with these wise proverbs: Different strokes for different folks and there is more than one way to peel an orange! Natasha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 20, 2007 Report Share Posted November 20, 2007 I hear you allison. Greens was so disappointing to me that i may never return. Everything had cheese in it, and the dish that i ordered sans the cheese was so overpriced and so small and bland. I think i am really spoiled from living in New York for so many years. There is an abundance of vegan restaurants there, and so many are sooooo good! It makes me want to open something here and do it right! im an amazing cook. any one want to invest? I can make mock meat dishes that will blow your mind.. -joelleOn Nov 20, 2007 9:07 AM, Natasha Prince <natasha.prince wrote: I'm with Mari on this one. I love Millineum and part of the reason that I love it is because it is a high end restaurant. I've never had a bad experience there. I could go into a long explanation about why we need more diversity in the area of vegan restaurants but I am at work and need to…. Well… work. I'll just leave you with these wise proverbs: Different strokes for different folks and there is more than one way to peel an orange! Natasha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 21, 2007 Report Share Posted November 21, 2007 I don't think we should wait until the NYT reviews SF restaurants before we give our two cents :-) It's fun and easy to sign-up and be an Ultimate Guide reviewer and have your opinions read by tens or hundreds maybe even thousands of people! The most viewed listing in the Ultimate Guide is Saravana Bhavan with 18,552 reviews. Why do a review? 1) what better way to support your favorite veg restaurant. After all, it is indeed a luxury to have so many veg restaurants that we can be choosy and picky and critical. 2) help guide others who are new to veg*nism or new to the Bay Area 3) why not? your two cents is welcome here!! Ultimate Guide http://bayareaveg.org/ug How to do a review http://www.bayareaveg.org/ug/glossary.htm#add Current Top Ten (reported every month in the newsletter) 1) Vegetarian House, San Jose - 4.55 2) Pizza Plaza, Oakland - 4.523) Cha-Ya, Berkeley - 4.54) Garden Fresh, Mtn View - 4.47 5) Good Karma, San Jose - 4.38 6) Tofoo Com Chay, San Jose - 4.29 7) Millennium, SF - 4.22 8) Manzanita Restaurant - 4.16 9) Cafe Gratitude - 4.13 10) New World Vegetarian - 4.12 Restaurants need a minimum of ten reviews to be eligible for the Top Ten. For example, here a couple of restaurants that could be eligible if they had more reviews: http://www.bayareaveg.org/ug/display.htm?id=448 http://www.bayareaveg.org/ug/display.htm?id=766 And, of course, SUPPORT your favorite veg restaurant by voting for them http://bayareaveg.org/vote Cheers, Tammy Will your favorites win? Vote today! http://bayareaveg.org/vote Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 22, 2007 Report Share Posted November 22, 2007 Warren, Steve, Okay, my energies are probably better spent (elsewhere) than "bashing" these establishments, I agree. I will say, just because a restaurant is vegan, it's possible they not be vegan-friendly (because they really cater to non-vegans and staff is non-vegan). That's my experience with Millenium, but I'll try to pick my targets better in the future. It's just incredibly frustrating to feel like an outsider in the one establishment that supposedly caters to my diet. That's what I was trying to say. Thanks for your feedback, Alison Be a better pen pal. Text or chat with friends inside Mail. See how. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 22, 2007 Report Share Posted November 22, 2007 I wasn't going to chime in on this topic, as I have brought up similar experiences in the past .. but, I did want to add an important distinction: Alison, I don't think anyone is trying to invalidate the experience that you had, I think we all just want to hope they are isolated experiences, as we all want veg*n restaurants to flourish. I actually agree with what you said: "I will say, just because a restaurant is vegan, it's possible they not be vegan-friendly (because they really cater to non-vegans and staff is non-vegan). That's my experience with Millenium " Last year, as some on the list may recall, I had an experience at Cafe Gratitude that supports this: the self-professed ex-vegan waiter indiscreetly telling us he eats animals because he felt more connected to them. When I shared this on the list, it generated some interesting comments afterwards about whether staff should be veg*n (or not) at these establishments, and then it went onto the chefs, etc. I don't want to rehash the discussion on the list again, but if you have a userid, you can go to the messages archive and read the discussions there: /messages Search by message # for my original post on 3/1/2006, message #11094 and you'll find the posts there over the next week.. What I have seen with Millennium (and Chris and I have said this before) -- more than any other business, it is an icon for veganism. Well-known beyond the Bay Area. So symbolic that any negativity is immediately brushed away. I'm glad Millennium and Cafe Gratitude exists. What doesn't appeal to me will appeal to others. I will also try to put a tactful review into the Ulimate Guide so that hopefully others will not have the same (bad) experience that I did. Most importantly, I just vote with my dollars and eat at restaurants that I like, and of course I vote in the BEST OF VEG annual survey too. http://bayareaveg.org/vote Cheers, Tammy Will your favorites win? Vote today! http://bayareaveg.org/vote Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.