Guest guest Posted May 19, 2007 Report Share Posted May 19, 2007 Dear Group Members, This is my opinion, but I feel this group is being dominated by one poster Elchanan who responds to nearly every post with lengthy opinions stated as truths. I see that some of you like his input (if it is male) and appreciate his knowledge, but I would prefer a more varied exchange among members without the constant responses by Elchanan. By the way, he stands to profit if you choose to pay for his services. If you join his Path of Health you will find in the files section information about these services and their cost I wish to provoke no controversy for or against these posts, but just state my feelings that things seem out of balance to me. ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2007 Report Share Posted May 19, 2007 i sort of wonder about this too i have not been here long now i really am wondering, as this time there has been no post in reply and another thing i often wonder, especially after doing a lot of research in diet and nutritions : why is it, in this day and age, that authors do not generally put their photos along with their work (or even other bits of everyday information about themselves) -- especially with books TELLING ME to put this or that into my body : why don't i get ANY " real life " information about the originators of the book i have in hand one thing i don't like about in general (not complaining here, gosh, we are very lucky to have this new technology to use and experiment with) is that posters in most groups never show their photos or photos of things about them, people they know, picnics they were at, their bowling team, their school library, their skating rinks, backyards, corn fields, you name it, we could all be a little more personable and civil with one another a lot of opinions and information flying around without any real life connections become a bit of a drain for example, in feng shui, you're not supposed have, like, a desk in a room that doesn't have a clear view of the entrances to that room -- if you are sitting working and lack information about the happenings in the room (eg., having your back to the door) -- your mind employs itself differently there's a health magazine where the authors of articles throughout are listed near the beginning with pictures, lifey quotes from them, etc. i very much appreciate a feature like that if we are considerate of one another instead of just using old ruts -- who know what unlimited uses we might make of the internet jerry in pennsylvania ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2007 Report Share Posted May 19, 2007 i have to say.......i am a little floored by this. so are you saying that members of this group should refrain from responding to every post. is there a limit to the number of posts one can respond to...and what length they should be? if there is to be a varied exchange among members, well then that's up to each member isn't it...to jump in there and join the discussion, this is a discussion group isn't it? there is no charge to be part of the path of health unless one CHOOSES to stay after the first 2 months...this is my understanding. no one, not wal-mart, mcdonald's, nature's first law, NO ONE stands to profit from anything, EVER unless OTHERS CHOOSE to make it so. that said, the " profits " are used for the betterment of the group. i am not saying you should not have expressed your feelings about this. as i told my daughter yesterday....i am proud that you know how to tell me your feelings....everyone has the right to express themselves. i think just your bringing it up will provide an opportunity for discussion of such things as freedom of expression and choice. i believe all input has value. if what is being put out there is not of use to you, then you simply disregard it. i hope you can find peace with that. in light and love, laura guinevieve wrote: Dear Group Members, This is my opinion, but I feel this group is being dominated by one poster Elchanan who responds to nearly every post with lengthy opinions stated as truths. I see that some of you like his input (if it is male) and appreciate his knowledge, but I would prefer a more varied exchange among members without the constant responses by Elchanan. By the way, he stands to profit if you choose to pay for his services. If you join his Path of Health you will find in the files section information about these services and their cost I wish to provoke no controversy for or against these posts, but just state my feelings that things seem out of balance to me. ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2007 Report Share Posted May 19, 2007 i agree...but take the info in the spirit its meant...to help.... whoever el is....they have a lot of good info... but like all things on the internet...evaluate it for yourself..keep whats good and disregard the rest.. peace anna On 5/19/07, guinevieve <guinevieve wrote: > > Dear Group Members, > > This is my opinion, but I feel this group is being dominated by one poster > Elchanan who responds to nearly every post with lengthy opinions stated as > truths. I see that some of you like his input (if it is male) and > appreciate his > knowledge, but I would prefer a more varied exchange among members without > the constant responses by Elchanan. > > By the way, he stands to profit if you choose to pay for his services. If > you join his Path of Health you will find in the files section > information about these services and their cost > > I wish to provoke no controversy for or against these posts, but just state > my feelings that things seem out of balance to me. > > > > > > ************************************** See what's free at > http://www.aol.com. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2007 Report Share Posted May 19, 2007 laura i think you missed the point... too much by just one gives the impression that this isnt a discussion group but a following. i am not a follower of elchanan. Im here to listen to all of you and help if i can...but when someone first joins one has to wonder if they didnt join a private rawfood cult led by someone named elchanan. it is unbalanced. this discussion is probably clearing up months of confusion for people. Im glad it was brought up. peace anna On 5/19/07, laura b. <ladymomma wrote: > i have to say.......i am a little floored by this. so are you saying that > members of this group should refrain from responding to every post. is > there a limit to the number of posts one can respond to...and what length > they should be? if there is to be a varied exchange among members, well > then that's up to each member isn't it...to jump in there and join the > discussion, this is a discussion group isn't it? > > there is no charge to be part of the path of health unless one CHOOSES to > stay after the first 2 months...this is my understanding. no one, not > wal-mart, mcdonald's, nature's first law, NO ONE stands to profit from > anything, EVER unless OTHERS CHOOSE to make it so. that said, the " profits " > are used for the betterment of the group. > > i am not saying you should not have expressed your feelings about this. > as i told my daughter yesterday....i am proud that you know how to tell me > your feelings....everyone has the right to express themselves. i think just > your bringing it up will provide an opportunity for discussion of such > things as freedom of expression and choice. > > i believe all input has value. if what is being put out there is not of > use to you, then you simply disregard it. i hope you can find peace with > that. > > in light and love, > laura > > guinevieve wrote: > > Dear Group Members, > > This is my opinion, but I feel this group is being dominated by one poster > Elchanan who responds to nearly every post with lengthy opinions stated as > truths. I see that some of you like his input (if it is male) and appreciate > his > knowledge, but I would prefer a more varied exchange among members without > the constant responses by Elchanan. > > By the way, he stands to profit if you choose to pay for his services. If > you join his Path of Health you will find in the files section > information about these services and their cost > > I wish to provoke no controversy for or against these posts, but just state > my feelings that things seem out of balance to me. > > > > > > ************************************** See what's free at > http://www.aol.com. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2007 Report Share Posted May 19, 2007 I am surprised also. Being new to this group and having been an observer for awhile. I have finally gotten the nerve to respond to some posts. Am I not to respond to a post that " calls me or compells " me to? Am I to just let it go? I also thought this was a discussion group for anyone to express an opinion. After all what we have are opinions. Some based on facts, others based on whatever, feelings, whatever. I happen to agree and apprrciate elchanan's posts so much basically because he seems to (for me) hit head on what I am or have been wanting to know for a long time. I would also have posted if I really didn't agree also. I think that is what I love about this group is that one can put out one's point of view. Or so I thought. Is this wrong? Besides, I have looked and I don't see that elchanan posts to " every " post. I think this is an overstatement to perhaps conveigh your dissapproval of what is thought to be negative posts or comments. I hope we are not limited to how many posts we can offer. I didn't read that in the bylaws of this group and there are many people that don't post at all. I hope elchanan is allowed to continue posting as there are many of us on here that are indeed taking what is of benefit to us and discarding or ignoring the parts that don't pertain to or agree with us. Again just my 2 cents. IF I'm allowed a voice. I really have enjoyed this group and all the posters. With love and respect to all, Jeannie your time is the most cherished gift of all, tomorrow is promised to no one. laura b. <ladymomma rawfood Saturday, May 19, 2007 6:54:22 AM Re: [Raw Food] Out of balance i have to say.......i am a little floored by this. so are you saying that members of this group should refrain from responding to every post. is there a limit to the number of posts one can respond to...and what length they should be? if there is to be a varied exchange among members, well then that's up to each member isn't it...to jump in there and join the discussion, this is a discussion group isn't it? there is no charge to be part of the path of health unless one CHOOSES to stay after the first 2 months...this is my understanding. no one, not wal-mart, mcdonald's, nature's first law, NO ONE stands to profit from anything, EVER unless OTHERS CHOOSE to make it so. that said, the " profits " are used for the betterment of the group. i am not saying you should not have expressed your feelings about this. as i told my daughter yesterday....i am proud that you know how to tell me your feelings....everyone has the right to express themselves. i think just your bringing it up will provide an opportunity for discussion of such things as freedom of expression and choice. i believe all input has value. if what is being put out there is not of use to you, then you simply disregard it. i hope you can find peace with that. in light and love, laura guinevieve wrote: Dear Group Members, This is my opinion, but I feel this group is being dominated by one poster Elchanan who responds to nearly every post with lengthy opinions stated as truths. I see that some of you like his input (if it is male) and appreciate his knowledge, but I would prefer a more varied exchange among members without the constant responses by Elchanan. By the way, he stands to profit if you choose to pay for his services. If you join his Path of Health you will find in the files section information about these services and their cost I wish to provoke no controversy for or against these posts, but just state my feelings that things seem out of balance to me. ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2007 Report Share Posted May 19, 2007 I have belonged to hundreds of mailing lists and quite often you get a member who tries to become " the god " of the list: argumentative, all-knowing, condescending, nasty, vicious, prone to " ad hominem " attacks against people who disagree with their opinions, and post 10:1 more posts than the next most frequent user. This " god-complex " figure usually considers himself the master and everyone kneeling electronically at his feet for words of wisdom, and dealing out vindictive justice to anyone who does not respect his authority. Usually users push the moderator to address this behaviour. The moderators try to address such behaviour through tactful means, but that usually doesn't work. The moderator has to decide, " Is this behaviour bad enough to push people away from the list? Does it shut down healthy discourse? " I like the fact that quinevere spoke of balance. That was well-phrased. An attempt to move toward balance is always healthy. Being the most frequent poster is not a good reason to remove someone from a list. When someone tries to shut down other posters through rudeness or nasty personal attacks, then it is. I am not familiar enough with Elchanan's behaviour to make that decision. It is really a question for the moderators to decide. (this is why I always hate having to take the moderator job on any list and am glad not to be one here.) My advice: If you feel shut down (or reticent about posting) by the personal or mean-spirited posts of another user, report the exact incidents with quoted material to the moderator; otherwise, let everything else drain away in the great slurry of electrons and don't worry about it. rawfood [rawfood ] On Behalf Of laura b. Saturday, May 19, 2007 7:54 AM rawfood Re: [Raw Food] Out of balance i have to say.......i am a little floored by this. so are you saying that members of this group should refrain from responding to every post. is there a limit to the number of posts one can respond to...and what length they should be? if there is to be a varied exchange among members, well then that's up to each member isn't it...to jump in there and join the discussion, this is a discussion group isn't it? there is no charge to be part of the path of health unless one CHOOSES to stay after the first 2 months...this is my understanding. no one, not wal-mart, mcdonald's, nature's first law, NO ONE stands to profit from anything, EVER unless OTHERS CHOOSE to make it so. that said, the " profits " are used for the betterment of the group. i am not saying you should not have expressed your feelings about this. as i told my daughter yesterday....i am proud that you know how to tell me your feelings....everyone has the right to express themselves. i think just your bringing it up will provide an opportunity for discussion of such things as freedom of expression and choice. i believe all input has value. if what is being put out there is not of use to you, then you simply disregard it. i hope you can find peace with that. in light and love, laura Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2007 Report Share Posted May 19, 2007 I am not a " follower " of anyone here or anywhere. I follow my own heart and instincts. I take and leave whatever " I " feel is good for me or that which interests me. I do not pay for nor do I " buy " anything on this site or from any of the posters. I do not feel solicited in anyway. I am a free spirit and I love people and sharing opinions. I believe everyone gets his/her own " impressions " of whatever posts they read and arrive at their own conclusions and it all goes to the beautiful freedom to use or not the information we get from what we read. There is a delete button, which I use alot. I am not a person drawn by any " cults " nor do I ever or would I ever endorse such a group. To me it is just a group. A group that I have just discovered and which I have gotten so much from. I really love this group and hope that people aren't so sensitive that they feel they are being " victimized " or being personally " attacked " or whatever. I think of it as a " think tank " to throw out ideas. The world is not " balanced " . We are not perfect. There are some people with alot to say and share and others that don't have or don't care to share. It is all ok. Or should be. We are just people. We all have feelings. I have not seen any disrespect to anyone. JUST my opinions. Sincerely and respectfully, Jeannie your time is the most cherished gift of all, tomorrow is promised to no one. Anna Bishop <mowthpeece rawfood Saturday, May 19, 2007 8:37:46 AM Re: [Raw Food] Out of balance laura i think you missed the point... too much by just one gives the impression that this isnt a discussion group but a following. i am not a follower of elchanan. Im here to listen to all of you and help if i can...but when someone first joins one has to wonder if they didnt join a private rawfood cult led by someone named elchanan. it is unbalanced. this discussion is probably clearing up months of confusion for people. Im glad it was brought up. peace anna On 5/19/07, laura b. <ladymomma wrote: > i have to say.......i am a little floored by this. so are you saying that > members of this group should refrain from responding to every post. is > there a limit to the number of posts one can respond to...and what length > they should be? if there is to be a varied exchange among members, well > then that's up to each member isn't it...to jump in there and join the > discussion, this is a discussion group isn't it? > > there is no charge to be part of the path of health unless one CHOOSES to > stay after the first 2 months...this is my understanding. no one, not > wal-mart, mcdonald's, nature's first law, NO ONE stands to profit from > anything, EVER unless OTHERS CHOOSE to make it so. that said, the " profits " > are used for the betterment of the group. > > i am not saying you should not have expressed your feelings about this. > as i told my daughter yesterday....i am proud that you know how to tell me > your feelings....everyone has the right to express themselves. i think just > your bringing it up will provide an opportunity for discussion of such > things as freedom of expression and choice. > > i believe all input has value. if what is being put out there is not of > use to you, then you simply disregard it. i hope you can find peace with > that. > > in light and love, > laura > > guinevieve wrote: > > Dear Group Members, > > This is my opinion, but I feel this group is being dominated by one poster > Elchanan who responds to nearly every post with lengthy opinions stated as > truths. I see that some of you like his input (if it is male) and appreciate > his > knowledge, but I would prefer a more varied exchange among members without > the constant responses by Elchanan. > > By the way, he stands to profit if you choose to pay for his services. If > you join his Path of Health you will find in the files section > information about these services and their cost > > I wish to provoke no controversy for or against these posts, but just state > my feelings that things seem out of balance to me. > > > > > > ************************************** See what's free at > http://www.aol.com. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2007 Report Share Posted May 19, 2007 Hi all Just my contribution, as a new member (who is now worrying that I might be answering too many posts - just put it down to my new-member enthusiasm!) I'm a bit of an Elchanan fan, but, on the other hand, there is an issue here, and, as it's all come out...I'll be interested to hear Elchanan's reply to the forum. > there is no charge to be part of the path of health unless one CHOOSES to stay after the first 2 months...this is my understanding. Well, I certainly didn't understand this in my foray into Path of Health. Unfortunately, the 'financial' issue is why I joined Path of Health, and then promptly asked Elchanan to me. Nothing is said about a financial contribution in the joining blurb (Elchanan - please correct me if I missed something). Then, on joining, one of the files sent on joining says 'we all contribute monthly or annually'. I felt this was a bit 'off', ie the inference that I had agreed to something, when I hadn't been told about it when joining. I explained to Elchanan that I was uncomfortable with this, and he sent a lovely, courteous reply. Ironically, if it had been explained to me that there was a 'trial' two months, I certainly would have stayed, at least long enough to find out what PoH was all about. Also, I certainly had wondered how all those teleconferences etc could have been 'free', and would have expected to have to pay some charge. It's a pity, as it all sounded really good, and I have had no cause to feel that PoH is in it for the money. The Path of Health just needs to be a bit more upfront about these things. I would certainly have given Path of Health a try on a trial basis, because, yes, I do like Elchanan's posts. My hackles have risen just a little on a couple of them, but that could well be simply because I suspect he might be right! (Having said that, Elchanan, I think prefacing some of your statements with 'It is my belief that...', rather than commenting that such-and-such is a 'myth' propagated by the RF movement, would increase receptivity:-) I have found myself cutting and pasting bits of Elchanan's posts and adding them to my data collection, so I do think this forum would be poorer without his contributions. Elchanan's contributions are exceptionally thoughtful, and erudite, and he is being very generous with his time. As to Elchanan answering every post, no, he hasn't. But, I can see that at times it might have seemed like that, but equally one could argue that that's because too many of the 'almost 3,000' (!) membership are just reading, not posting. The more members that actually post, the more 'balanced' the forum will be, so... come on everyone! I'm going to start a new thread on 'sensitive teeth'. Some of you 'lurkers' must know something about it! Love Debbie Took, Reading, UK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2007 Report Share Posted May 19, 2007 the rawfood pros have pics of themselves in books and web sites. juliano has a beautiful uncook book full of pics of himself hes here in santa monica and you can even go see him if u want.... the real guys are excellent examples of practicing what they preach. peace anna On 5/19/07, Jertoons <Jertoons wrote: > i sort of wonder about this too > > i have not been here long > > now i really am wondering, as this time there has been no post in reply > > and another thing i often wonder, especially after doing a lot of research > in diet and nutritions : why is it, in this day and age, that authors do > not > generally put their photos along with their work (or even other bits of > everyday information about themselves) -- especially with books TELLING ME > to put > this or that into my body : why don't i get ANY " real life " information > about the originators of the book i have in hand > > one thing i don't like about in general (not complaining here, > gosh, we are very lucky to have this new technology to use and experiment > with) is that posters in most groups never show their photos or photos of > things > about them, people they know, picnics they were at, their bowling team, > their school library, their skating rinks, backyards, corn fields, you name > it, > we could all be a little more personable and civil with one another > > a lot of opinions and information flying around without any real life > connections become a bit of a drain > > for example, in feng shui, you're not supposed have, like, a desk in a room > that doesn't have a clear view of the entrances to that room -- if you are > sitting working and lack information about the happenings in the room (eg., > having your back to the door) -- your mind employs itself differently > > there's a health magazine where the authors of articles throughout are > listed near the beginning with pictures, lifey quotes from them, etc. > > i very much appreciate a feature like that > > if we are considerate of one another instead of just using old ruts -- who > know what unlimited uses we might make of the internet > > jerry in pennsylvania > > > > ************************************** See what's free at > http://www.aol.com. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2007 Report Share Posted May 19, 2007 In a message dated 05/19/2007 11:48:29 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, mowthpeece writes: peace anna that is true, though anna i do have the juliano book, that's how i got started, too it speaks well of all raw fooders and of raw food, eating, too people concerned with raw eating seem to be able to sense these simple virtues and live with them comfortably -- there's no constantly effacing plain truth we all did it before spending a goodly amount of time raw -- but nobody really understands (and on many levels) -- that much of our REAL dissatisfaction is from stuffing that cooked garbage in us all the time and all our lives -- who would try to connect it our being disinherited from simple virtues ? we chalk it up to " personality conflict " or " character faults " -- as if life happens only between our ears and only because of the area between our ears amazing, though -- and things like being a really good book writer just " play out right " once we get raw and fresh -- amazing amazing too, to look back my gosh, where we've taken our minds without know it all these years ! jerry ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2007 Report Share Posted May 19, 2007 Dear Guinevieve and Group members, I honor your opinion and accept how you feel, however I am confused by what you wanted to accomplish with this post. If you are unhappy with Elchanan many postings,you could have brought up the topic without mentioning specific person. You have/had the option of simply choosing not to open/read his views, you might have choose to start a new group and invite readers of this group to join with you.You might have choose to email Elchanan off group and express what you felt was the problem. Of course you might have choose to simply leave this group and move on. There are other groups about raw food. Hopefully Elchanan will post on this subject, and you will continue to enjoy this group with us, that all may grow healthier together for the higher good of all. In light and love RuneStar, who plays with fire Embrace the Mystical and Wait for Extraordinary Things to Happen. guinevieve rawfood Sat, 19 May 2007 4:31 AM [Raw Food] Out of balance Dear Group Members, This is my opinion, but I feel this group is being dominated by one poster Elchanan who responds to nearly every post with lengthy opinions stated as truths. I see that some of you like his input (if it is male) and appreciate his knowledge, but I would prefer a more varied exchange among members without the constant responses by Elchanan. By the way, he stands to profit if you choose to pay for his services. If you join his Path of Health you will find in the files section information about these services and their cost I wish to provoke no controversy for or against these posts, but just state my feelings that things seem out of balance to me. ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2007 Report Share Posted May 19, 2007 I for one, appreciate Elchanans KNOWLEDGE. No one hs asked me for a dime. I have learned more from El's posts, and appreciate the time taken to answer ALLLLLLLL of my questions, even if they have been asked and answered before. If you choose to NOT read El's posts, that is fine, you know you can BLOCK El's addy, then you will not see the responses. Then the only thing in your mail box will be a bunch of un-answered questions! This is your choice and nobody here will think any more or less of you! I for one HOPE EL stays and keeps up the helpful advice and knowledge. I wouldnt have gotten to the point Im out with OUT El's help! This group is open to all questions and answers and there should never be a limit to who can respond or post. Like I said, there is the BLOCK function available for you to use. AND, NOBODY will ever force you to go to the PATH....if you dont like what you see over there, DONT JOIN, but to come here and slam on it is not fair or appropriate. Not every group is for EVERYBODY. In life you have to take what you want and leave the rest! guinevieve wrote: Dear Group Members, This is my opinion, but I feel this group is being dominated by one poster Elchanan who responds to nearly every post with lengthy opinions stated as truths. I see that some of you like his input (if it is male) and appreciate his knowledge, but I would prefer a more varied exchange among members without the constant responses by Elchanan. TV dinner still cooling? Check out " Tonight's Picks " on TV. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2007 Report Share Posted May 19, 2007 i for one just delete...a lot. a On 5/19/07, Dobby the house elf <dobeythehouseelf wrote: > I for one, appreciate Elchanans KNOWLEDGE. No one hs asked me for a dime. > I have learned more from El's posts, and appreciate the time taken to answer > ALLLLLLLL of my questions, even if they have been asked and answered before. > > > If you choose to NOT read El's posts, that is fine, you know you can BLOCK > El's addy, then you will not see the responses. Then the only thing in your > mail box will be a bunch of un-answered questions! This is your choice and > nobody here will think any more or less of you! > > I for one HOPE EL stays and keeps up the helpful advice and knowledge. I > wouldnt have gotten to the point Im out with OUT El's help! > > This group is open to all questions and answers and there should never be a > limit to who can respond or post. Like I said, there is the BLOCK function > available for you to use. AND, NOBODY will ever force you to go to the > PATH....if you dont like what you see over there, DONT JOIN, but to come > here and slam on it is not fair or appropriate. > > Not every group is for EVERYBODY. In life you have to take what you want > and leave the rest! > > > > > guinevieve wrote: > Dear Group Members, > > This is my opinion, but I feel this group is being dominated by one poster > Elchanan who responds to nearly every post with lengthy opinions stated as > truths. I see that some of you like his input (if it is male) and > appreciate his > knowledge, but I would prefer a more varied exchange among members without > the constant responses by Elchanan. > TV dinner still cooling? > Check out " Tonight's Picks " on TV. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2007 Report Share Posted May 19, 2007 Thank you for posting this. >guinevieve >rawfood >rawfood >[Raw Food] Out of balance >Sat, 19 May 2007 07:31:53 EDT > > >Dear Group Members, > >This is my opinion, but I feel this group is being dominated by one poster >Elchanan who responds to nearly every post with lengthy opinions stated as >truths. I see that some of you like his input (if it is male) and >appreciate his >knowledge, but I would prefer a more varied exchange among members without >the constant responses by Elchanan. > > By the way, he stands to profit if you choose to pay for his services. >If >you join his Path of Health you will find in the files section >information about these services and their cost > >I wish to provoke no controversy for or against these posts, but just >state >my feelings that things seem out of balance to me. > > > > > >************************************** See what's free at >http://www.aol.com. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2007 Report Share Posted May 19, 2007 I agree with this I am ready to leave this group over this person because of the coments he makes it feels as though he is pressuring you into following his way. I became vegan 3 months ago and am now mostly raw I am trying to change my family's habbits as well but in baby steps. I felt as though I was some sort of idiot because I didn't know anything he was talking about. I have read many books on nutrition and infants and toddler nutrition and have been doing the best I can with the resorces I have. I just dont like his pushy comments I guess, and I can not find any reasearch to back up what he is saying. It does feel like some kid of cult! > " Anna Bishop " <mowthpeece >rawfood >rawfood >Re: [Raw Food] Out of balance >Sat, 19 May 2007 06:37:46 -0700 > >laura > >i think you missed the point... > >too much by just one gives the impression that this isnt a discussion >group but a following. > >i am not a follower of elchanan. Im here to listen to all of you and >help if i can...but when someone first joins one has to wonder if they >didnt join a private rawfood cult led by someone named elchanan. > >it is unbalanced. >this discussion is probably clearing up months of confusion for >people. Im glad it was brought up. > >peace >anna > >On 5/19/07, laura b. <ladymomma wrote: > > i have to say.......i am a little floored by this. so are you saying >that > > members of this group should refrain from responding to every post. is > > there a limit to the number of posts one can respond to...and what >length > > they should be? if there is to be a varied exchange among members, well > > then that's up to each member isn't it...to jump in there and join the > > discussion, this is a discussion group isn't it? > > > > there is no charge to be part of the path of health unless one CHOOSES >to > > stay after the first 2 months...this is my understanding. no one, not > > wal-mart, mcdonald's, nature's first law, NO ONE stands to profit from > > anything, EVER unless OTHERS CHOOSE to make it so. that said, the > " profits " > > are used for the betterment of the group. > > > > i am not saying you should not have expressed your feelings about >this. > > as i told my daughter yesterday....i am proud that you know how to tell >me > > your feelings....everyone has the right to express themselves. i think >just > > your bringing it up will provide an opportunity for discussion of such > > things as freedom of expression and choice. > > > > i believe all input has value. if what is being put out there is not >of > > use to you, then you simply disregard it. i hope you can find peace >with > > that. > > > > in light and love, > > laura > > > > guinevieve wrote: > > > > Dear Group Members, > > > > This is my opinion, but I feel this group is being dominated by one >poster > > Elchanan who responds to nearly every post with lengthy opinions stated >as > > truths. I see that some of you like his input (if it is male) and >appreciate > > his > > knowledge, but I would prefer a more varied exchange among members >without > > the constant responses by Elchanan. > > > > By the way, he stands to profit if you choose to pay for his services. >If > > you join his Path of Health you will find in the files >section > > information about these services and their cost > > > > I wish to provoke no controversy for or against these posts, but just >state > > my feelings that things seem out of balance to me. > > > > > > > > > > > > ************************************** See what's free at > > http://www.aol.com. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2007 Report Share Posted May 19, 2007 i can totally see why. domination by one gives an inaccurate impression. This will cause people to leave, thinking theyre in " the wrong kind of group " . This would be a sad waste. im sure el isnt trying to give such an impression. If he were, he should create his own list with his name and experience as the lead. Based on some of the posts, it looks like he would indeed have a following.... peace anna On 5/19/07, sarah shaw <hppymummy wrote: > I agree with this I am ready to leave this group over this person because of > the coments he makes it feels as though he is pressuring you into following > his way. I became vegan 3 months ago and am now mostly raw I am trying to > change my family's habbits as well but in baby steps. I felt as though I > was some sort of idiot because I didn't know anything he was talking about. > I have read many books on nutrition and infants and toddler nutrition and > have been doing the best I can with the resorces I have. I just dont like > his pushy comments I guess, and I can not find any reasearch to back up what > he is saying. It does feel like some kid of cult! > > > > " Anna Bishop " <mowthpeece > >rawfood > >rawfood > >Re: [Raw Food] Out of balance > >Sat, 19 May 2007 06:37:46 -0700 > > > >laura > > > >i think you missed the point... > > > >too much by just one gives the impression that this isnt a discussion > >group but a following. > > > >i am not a follower of elchanan. Im here to listen to all of you and > >help if i can...but when someone first joins one has to wonder if they > >didnt join a private rawfood cult led by someone named elchanan. > > > >it is unbalanced. > >this discussion is probably clearing up months of confusion for > >people. Im glad it was brought up. > > > >peace > >anna > > > >On 5/19/07, laura b. <ladymomma wrote: > > > i have to say.......i am a little floored by this. so are you saying > >that > > > members of this group should refrain from responding to every post. is > > > there a limit to the number of posts one can respond to...and what > >length > > > they should be? if there is to be a varied exchange among members, well > > > then that's up to each member isn't it...to jump in there and join the > > > discussion, this is a discussion group isn't it? > > > > > > there is no charge to be part of the path of health unless one CHOOSES > >to > > > stay after the first 2 months...this is my understanding. no one, not > > > wal-mart, mcdonald's, nature's first law, NO ONE stands to profit from > > > anything, EVER unless OTHERS CHOOSE to make it so. that said, the > > " profits " > > > are used for the betterment of the group. > > > > > > i am not saying you should not have expressed your feelings about > >this. > > > as i told my daughter yesterday....i am proud that you know how to tell > >me > > > your feelings....everyone has the right to express themselves. i think > >just > > > your bringing it up will provide an opportunity for discussion of such > > > things as freedom of expression and choice. > > > > > > i believe all input has value. if what is being put out there is not > >of > > > use to you, then you simply disregard it. i hope you can find peace > >with > > > that. > > > > > > in light and love, > > > laura > > > > > > guinevieve wrote: > > > > > > Dear Group Members, > > > > > > This is my opinion, but I feel this group is being dominated by one > >poster > > > Elchanan who responds to nearly every post with lengthy opinions stated > >as > > > truths. I see that some of you like his input (if it is male) and > >appreciate > > > his > > > knowledge, but I would prefer a more varied exchange among members > >without > > > the constant responses by Elchanan. > > > > > > By the way, he stands to profit if you choose to pay for his services. > >If > > > you join his Path of Health you will find in the files > >section > > > information about these services and their cost > > > > > > I wish to provoke no controversy for or against these posts, but just > >state > > > my feelings that things seem out of balance to me. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ************************************** See what's free at > > > http://www.aol.com. > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 19, 2007 Report Share Posted May 19, 2007 Wow people do we really need to use language and accusations toward each other? Here comes the cliche -- Can't we all just get along? I love Elchanan - we have spoken personally many times and he has helped and supported as well as educated me. I chose not to join PoH for financial reasons and because I believe that much of the information we are remembering is available to us all. I have NO problem with Elchanan choosing to request or require people to exchange energy with him in a way that will help him to be able to continue to share his knowledge with others. I was here and in other groups and sites around the time PoH began and Elchanan became more actitive. It was nice, then PoH took his attention -- he recently showed back up in these sights more often. The original comment about balance within a sight was a good comment coming from a group members need to ensure that the future of her safe, group not change tooo much now that Elchanan is back... I am glad she made a comment and - though Elchanan knows I love him and that my comments are not an attack - I agree that I would like to see a balance continue. I also, would love to continue to see Elchanan continue to respond and stick with the group. I am aware of my own process and I find that I hesitate and don't answer some posts that I might when either Elchanan or Nora or even Roger are around... not thier prob - that one is mine prob. I can own my own stuff. I love listening to ppl who, like Elchanan, have been Raw foodies for MANY - 10+ years, I always learn so much - even if it's only in the way it is gently and kindly presented. So if we're voting - which we aren't - I'm in for balance. And some newbies can relax, this group is VERY kind and gentle and no one is going to jump out of your monitor at you for posting - good gosh we're here for support and sharing knowledge. Ask away, comment away and bring it on... (teehee) Hugs n Stuff Simply, Lesa ______________________________\ ____Be a better Heartthrob. Get better relationship answers from someone who knows. Answers - Check it out. http://answers./dir/?link=list & sid=396545433 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 20, 2007 Report Share Posted May 20, 2007 I appreciate this group. I love all the posts. I feel like I'm encouraged and enlightened several times a day. I may not ALWAYS agree with EVERYTHING posted, but we are all different people. I do not find myself offended by other opinions. I do find that even the opinions I may not agree with, challenge me to take a look at why I disagree with them. Who knows, maybe my opinion is the one that's wrong. I enjoy all the posts, and all the information. Keep it all comming. If you don't want it to be so one-sided, post your suggestions as well. If you can't be open-minded to different ideas, why are you in a forum full of many different individuals? ~Sarah --- " laura b. " <ladymomma wrote: > i have to say.......i am a little floored by this. > so are you saying that members of this group should > refrain from responding to every post. is there a > limit to the number of posts one can respond > to...and what length they should be? if there is to > be a varied exchange among members, well then that's > up to each member isn't it...to jump in there and > join the discussion, this is a discussion group > isn't it? > > there is no charge to be part of the path of > health unless one CHOOSES to stay after the first 2 > months...this is my understanding. no one, not > wal-mart, mcdonald's, nature's first law, NO ONE > stands to profit from anything, EVER unless OTHERS > CHOOSE to make it so. that said, the " profits " are > used for the betterment of the group. > > i am not saying you should not have expressed your > feelings about this. as i told my daughter > yesterday....i am proud that you know how to tell me > your feelings....everyone has the right to express > themselves. i think just your bringing it up will > provide an opportunity for discussion of such things > as freedom of expression and choice. > > i believe all input has value. if what is being > put out there is not of use to you, then you simply > disregard it. i hope you can find peace with that. > > in light and love, > laura > > guinevieve wrote: > > Dear Group Members, > > This is my opinion, but I feel this group is being > dominated by one poster > Elchanan who responds to nearly every post with > lengthy opinions stated as > truths. I see that some of you like his input (if it > is male) and appreciate his > knowledge, but I would prefer a more varied exchange > among members without > the constant responses by Elchanan. > > By the way, he stands to profit if you choose to pay > for his services. If > you join his Path of Health you will > find in the files section > information about these services and their cost > > I wish to provoke no controversy for or against > these posts, but just state > my feelings that things seem out of balance to me. > > > > > > ************************************** See what's > free at http://www.aol.com. > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 20, 2007 Report Share Posted May 20, 2007 I agree. I am enlightened on many posts I read in this group. I am on a " life's journey " to seek knowledge, and empowerment on how to heal my mind, body and soul from all I have abused it with all my life. I am on the path to recovery. I am open to any and all opinions, facts that seem sound, to me, I realize that even " facts " can be disputed with other " facts " which is why I take what I can use and pass on what I can't. Sometimes I don't agree with someone or something and on further inspection (without emotion) I end up realizing that I actually do agree with it. I think we as humans tend to let emotions get in the way of our perceptions of what we are taking in. I also agree that on a computer with out the ability to hear how something is said, an idea can come off as this or the other....when in fact that is not the intention of the writer. I think we can all agree to agree and/or disagree which ever the case may be, and still accept and respect each other as individuals. I still believe, however, that as much as we'd like, there is no balance on much of anything. You will never have 100% participation in any group anywhere. There will always be those, like me, that love to share, those that enjoy reading only, those that just do a little here and there...it's the beauty of freedom. It's all ok. It's all good. I feel blessed to be part of such a diverse group with awesome contributions. I hope we don't have to censor anyone or limit their contributions on whatever topic it may be. Just my humble opinions. Respectfully, Jeannie your time is the most cherished gift of all, tomorrow is promised to no one. Sarah Formhals <mrsfrmhls rawfood Saturday, May 19, 2007 7:52:48 PM Re: [Raw Food] Out of balance I appreciate this group. I love all the posts. I feel like I'm encouraged and enlightened several times a day. I may not ALWAYS agree with EVERYTHING posted, but we are all different people. I do not find myself offended by other opinions. I do find that even the opinions I may not agree with, challenge me to take a look at why I disagree with them. Who knows, maybe my opinion is the one that's wrong. I enjoy all the posts, and all the information. Keep it all comming. If you don't want it to be so one-sided, post your suggestions as well. If you can't be open-minded to different ideas, why are you in a forum full of many different individuals? ~Sarah --- " laura b. " <ladymomma wrote: > i have to say.......i am a little floored by this. > so are you saying that members of this group should > refrain from responding to every post. is there a > limit to the number of posts one can respond > to...and what length they should be? if there is to > be a varied exchange among members, well then that's > up to each member isn't it...to jump in there and > join the discussion, this is a discussion group > isn't it? > > there is no charge to be part of the path of > health unless one CHOOSES to stay after the first 2 > months...this is my understanding. no one, not > wal-mart, mcdonald's, nature's first law, NO ONE > stands to profit from anything, EVER unless OTHERS > CHOOSE to make it so. that said, the " profits " are > used for the betterment of the group. > > i am not saying you should not have expressed your > feelings about this. as i told my daughter > yesterday....i am proud that you know how to tell me > your feelings....everyone has the right to express > themselves. i think just your bringing it up will > provide an opportunity for discussion of such things > as freedom of expression and choice. > > i believe all input has value. if what is being > put out there is not of use to you, then you simply > disregard it. i hope you can find peace with that. > > in light and love, > laura > > guinevieve wrote: > > Dear Group Members, > > This is my opinion, but I feel this group is being > dominated by one poster > Elchanan who responds to nearly every post with > lengthy opinions stated as > truths. I see that some of you like his input (if it > is male) and appreciate his > knowledge, but I would prefer a more varied exchange > among members without > the constant responses by Elchanan. > > By the way, he stands to profit if you choose to pay > for his services. If > you join his Path of Health you will > find in the files section > information about these services and their cost > > I wish to provoke no controversy for or against > these posts, but just state > my feelings that things seem out of balance to me. > > > > > > ************************************** See what's > free at http://www.aol.com. > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 20, 2007 Report Share Posted May 20, 2007 I agree. Its not the fact that this person responds to every post, its the attitude behind the responses. He/She's right and thats all there is to it. There is no other opinion. > > > > guinevieve <guinevieve%40aol.com> wrote: > > > > Dear Group Members, > > > > This is my opinion, but I feel this group is being > > dominated by one poster > > Elchanan who responds to nearly every post with > > lengthy opinions stated as > > truths. I see that some of you like his input (if it > > is male) and appreciate his > > knowledge, but I would prefer a more varied exchange > > among members without > > the constant responses by Elchanan. > > > > By the way, he stands to profit if you choose to pay > > for his services. If > > you join his Path of Health you will > > find in the files section > > information about these services and their cost > > > > I wish to provoke no controversy for or against > > these posts, but just state > > my feelings that things seem out of balance to me. > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 20, 2007 Report Share Posted May 20, 2007 exactly. and many are just too new to put it perspective. Thats all. i appreciate all the knowledge elchanan has...he's very well educated..but even i wondered if he was moderator or a leader of this private group when i first joined. I almost left it. This would not have been right. The others here are great. I like it here very much. reponding a lot isnt the thing..its how responses are phrased....i talk a lot but no one assumes im leading this crowd (i hope)...cuz im sure not! elchan if youre reading.. I hope you realize no one is attacking you...we just would like a bit more humble approach i suppose..only cuz it causes confusion. i would looooove to hear what youve got to add to the high bp and diabetes issue! peace anna On 5/19/07, Carla Alexandra Rose <rose.carla wrote: > I agree. Its not the fact that this person responds to every post, its the > attitude behind the responses. He/She's right and thats all there is to it. > There is no other opinion. > > > > > > > > > guinevieve <guinevieve%40aol.com> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Group Members, > > > > > > This is my opinion, but I feel this group is being > > > dominated by one poster > > > Elchanan who responds to nearly every post with > > > lengthy opinions stated as > > > truths. I see that some of you like his input (if it > > > is male) and appreciate his > > > knowledge, but I would prefer a more varied exchange > > > among members without > > > the constant responses by Elchanan. > > > > > > By the way, he stands to profit if you choose to pay > > > for his services. If > > > you join his Path of Health you will > > > find in the files section > > > information about these services and their cost > > > > > > I wish to provoke no controversy for or against > > > these posts, but just state > > > my feelings that things seem out of balance to me. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 20, 2007 Report Share Posted May 20, 2007 I for one, am not confused. I feel capable of putting things in the correct perspective, regardless of how new I am. I am an adult with a sense of reasoning. I simply choose to use that which I need and discard that which I do not. I have noticed the lack of posting by the one that seems to have sparked all this discussion. It does seem, to me, a negative approach to how you feel a person should or should not post. As I read his posts, I did not get a sense of his " ownership " of this group. I got a sense of someone who really spoke to that which I felt I needed to learn. I would feel that from anyone sharing the same or similar information, which I seem to be in search of. I do not know that person nor anyone else in the group. What I do know is information I want, when I see it. I pass over or delete that which does not suit me, for whatever reason. I realize that what interests one person might not the next. That is what is wonderful about diversity. It's a pitty that you would leave for the reasons you state if there is a percent of a chance that you might gain something by an individual WHO CARES where it comes from. I feel " MY " objective in all this is to learn and grow in my knowledge. How would you like responses phrased? I don't know who the moderater is, nor does it matter to me, what matters is that I'm grateful to have a group like this that I can gain from. What I am confused about is what you define as a " humble approach " . Are my comments humble? I don't know. I know they are my comments, my opinions. I enjoy sharing them. With Respect, Jeannie your time is the most cherished gift of all, tomorrow is promised to no one. Anna Bishop <mowthpeece rawfood Sunday, May 20, 2007 9:02:06 AM Re: [Raw Food] Out of balance exactly. and many are just too new to put it perspective. Thats all. i appreciate all the knowledge elchanan has...he's very well educated..but even i wondered if he was moderator or a leader of this private group when i first joined. I almost left it. This would not have been right. The others here are great. I like it here very much. reponding a lot isnt the thing..its how responses are phrased....i talk a lot but no one assumes im leading this crowd (i hope)...cuz im sure not! elchan if youre reading.. I hope you realize no one is attacking you...we just would like a bit more humble approach i suppose..only cuz it causes confusion. i would looooove to hear what youve got to add to the high bp and diabetes issue! peace anna On 5/19/07, Carla Alexandra Rose <rose.carla wrote: > I agree. Its not the fact that this person responds to every post, its the > attitude behind the responses. He/She's right and thats all there is to it. > There is no other opinion. > > > > > > > > > guinevieve <guinevieve%40aol.com> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Group Members, > > > > > > This is my opinion, but I feel this group is being > > > dominated by one poster > > > Elchanan who responds to nearly every post with > > > lengthy opinions stated as > > > truths. I see that some of you like his input (if it > > > is male) and appreciate his > > > knowledge, but I would prefer a more varied exchange > > > among members without > > > the constant responses by Elchanan. > > > > > > By the way, he stands to profit if you choose to pay > > > for his services. If > > > you join his Path of Health you will > > > find in the files section > > > information about these services and their cost > > > > > > I wish to provoke no controversy for or against > > > these posts, but just state > > > my feelings that things seem out of balance to me. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 20, 2007 Report Share Posted May 20, 2007 Hi everyone, I will respond. I'm running several teleconferences inside the Path of Health Community this weekend, my focus is there. Also, I'm thinking about what people are saying. I learned long ago a simple sales training adage: " If you're not ready, don't go. " I'll publish in response ... when I feel ready. Just wanted to let everyone know. Elchanan _____ rawfood [rawfood ] On Behalf Of Jertoons Saturday, May 19, 2007 8:27 AM rawfood Re: [Raw Food] Out of balance i sort of wonder about this too i have not been here long now i really am wondering, as this time there has been no post in reply <http://geo./serv?s=97359714/grpId=5520395/grpspId=1705015482/msgId =29266/stime=1179588472/nc1=4491576/nc2=4025347/nc3=3> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 20, 2007 Report Share Posted May 20, 2007 Just wanted to say that I love reading Elchanan's posts. I find them very interesting, even in the times I don't agree with everything, and I can appreciate Elchanan taking the time to reply/share knowledge/etc. I also wanted to say that if there are people you'd rather not hear from on the list, just go to your mail filters and set it so their posts go directly into your trash. That way you're not bothered by them, and you don't have to read them or even see them. I've done that with people I thought were obnoxious (not on this list, but on others) and it solves the problem neatly, and the people who enjoy the person's posts can continue to enjoy them. Just my 2 cents. Best wishes, Judy > > > > > > This is my opinion, but I feel this group is being > > > dominated by one poster > > > Elchanan who responds to nearly every post with > > > lengthy opinions stated as > > > Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their life, your story. Play Sims Stories at Games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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