On the study of history (WAS: Distinguishing Cause-And-Effect; Distinguishing Problems vs. Symptoms; Fundamental Beliefs and Choices)

[Guest guest]

Those who do not learn the lessons of history (whether in the large or in

the small) are doomed to repeat it. This is happening today, unfortunately.

 

There are basically two ways to study history ... primary sources (original

documents) or at least those who are working directly with original

documents and secondary or interpretive sources. The latter engage in

historiographical studies, which actually means the writing and rewriting of

history. But it is neither necessary nor beneficial to learn in this way.

This is another area, like health, where finding one teacher who comprehends

the dynamics will take you farther than 10,000 typical teachers.

 

Learn from originators and originals whenever possible, regardless of the

subject matter involved.

 

Best,

Elchanan

_____

 

rawfood [rawfood ] On Behalf Of

Caron

Thursday, June 28, 2007 5:52 PM

rawfood

Re: [Raw Food] Distinguishing Cause-And-Effect; Distinguishing

Problems vs. Symptoms; Fundamental Beliefs and Choices (WAS: hat is food for

our species? (WAS: Garlic Redux)

 

 

 

-

Elchanan

>Caron, majority opinions existed long before the existence of any modern or

" popular " media. For a fascinating case study, learn about the history of

ancient Athens from about 430-404 BCE, the period during which the

democracy-turned-empire imploded and destroyed itself almost completely,

culminating, among other things, in a death sentence for Socrates.

 

Strangely, I've never studied much history - I skipped years of school and

seemed to land just on the other side of their history semester. Though I

did do a semester of biblical history, which I remember only vaguely. I have

done a bit of study on my own, but science fascinated me more. I've added

history to my list of things to study though.

 

>Democracy = mob rule, this is well understood by those in power today. They

are teaching that we live in a democracy ... yet our founders NEVER intended

anything of the kind. This was written in the training manuals for officers

in the U.S. military, up to the advent of the socialist period under

Franklin Roosevelt. He had all those manuals destroyed.

 

I know even less about american history, but perhaps this is why history has

never really got me hooked - it's so easily rewritten!

 

Caron

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

-

Elchanan

>Those who do not learn the lessons of history (whether in the large or in

the small) are doomed to repeat it. This is happening today, unfortunately.

 

True. A lot of people can't even learn from their own history.

 

>There are basically two ways to study history ... primary sources (original

documents) or at least those who are working directly with original

documents and secondary or interpretive sources. The latter engage in

historiographical studies, which actually means the writing and rewriting of

history. But it is neither necessary nor beneficial to learn in this way.

This is another area, like health, where finding one teacher who comprehends

the dynamics will take you farther than 10,000 typical teachers.

 

The average person, or at least this average person, finds it difficult to

find original documents, not only because they tend to be hoarded (both to

protect them from damage by the average person, and because some people get

a bit greedy about the information they feel they " own " ), but also because

not all history was recorded. A lot was passed down by word of mouth, and

when a tribe or group of people was wiped out, so was their history. It was

then written by those who did the wiping. If I was to learn history, I would

go to an ancient Druid, or an elder of whatever tribe I was learning about,

and learn from them the truth. Unfortunately, those people are harder to

find than accurate original documents of history. I will get around to

studying recorded history one day, but I approach it with the sense of it

being a work of fiction, rather than of hard fact.

 

 

>Learn from originators and originals whenever possible, regardless of the

subject matter involved.

 

Very good advice, when one can find the originals.

 

Caron

[Guest guest]

In reference to your second-to-last sentence, if one were

so inclined to choose a single teacher of history, a good

case could be made for either

 

Howard Zinn: http://howardzinn.notlong.com

 

or

 

Noam Chomsky: http://noamchomsky.notlong.com

 

 

-Erin

http://www.zenpawn.com/vegblog

 

 

rawfood , " Elchanan " <Elchanan wrote:

>

> Those who do not learn the lessons of history (whether in the large

or in

> the small) are doomed to repeat it. This is happening today,

unfortunately.

>

> There are basically two ways to study history ... primary sources

(original

> documents) or at least those who are working directly with original

> documents and secondary or interpretive sources. The latter engage

in

> historiographical studies, which actually means the writing and

rewriting of

> history. But it is neither necessary nor beneficial to learn in

this way.

> This is another area, like health, where finding one teacher who

comprehends

> the dynamics will take you farther than 10,000 typical teachers.

>

> Learn from originators and originals whenever possible, regardless

of the

> subject matter involved.

>

> Best,

> Elchanan

[Guest guest]

On Friday 29 June 2007 05:24, Erin wrote:

> In reference to your second-to-last sentence, if one were

> so inclined to choose a single teacher of history, a good

> case could be made for either

>

> Howard Zinn:  http://howardzinn.notlong.com

>

> or

>

> Noam Chomsky: http://noamchomsky.notlong.com

>

>

> -Erin

> http://www.zenpawn.com/vegblog

 

these links only take me to Amazon.

 

this link below has lots of NC to read on-line.

 

http://www.zmag.org/chomsky/

 

neal.

[Guest guest]

That is assuming that your chosen teacher really does comprehend the

dynamics. And as a student in need of learning, how do you know when

you have a teacher that does comprehend and understand the dynamics and

one that just thinks he/she does.

And then there is the world full of " false " teachers that mislead their

students. But try convincing the student of such as this. Because to

them, they have the one teacher that " sees all and knows all " .

 

Belinda

 

 

> This is another area, like health, where finding one teacher who

comprehends

> the dynamics will take you farther than 10,000 typical teachers.

>

> Best,

> Elchanan

> _____

>

[Guest guest]

On Friday 29 June 2007 12:47, Belinda wrote:

> That is assuming that your chosen teacher really does comprehend the

> dynamics.  And as a student in need of learning, how do you know when

> you have a teacher that does comprehend and understand the dynamics and

> one that just thinks he/she does.

> And then there is the world full of " false " teachers that mislead their

> students.  But try convincing the student of such as this.  Because to

> them, they have the one teacher that " sees all and knows all " .

>

> Belinda

 

Belinda,

 

Ive just added a file to the files area (and posted to the group about it)

which should help with the points you make above.

 

neal.