Guest guest Posted January 9, 2003 Report Share Posted January 9, 2003 >Ron: Apparently there are different reasons for being vegan >and different definitions of what vegan is. I am > " practically vegan " for health and wellness reasons. >I don't have anything against killing chickens. In >fact, I have wrung the necks of 20 or more of them in >an hour. > >Let's keep our definitions and opinions straight, >okay? I always thought vegan meant no animal products at all. I'm not a vegan. As long as there is brie in the world, I will never be a vegan. :-) However, being any version of vegetarian isn't like taking holy orders and I think it's fine to take a detour now and then if you want to. Susan -- --------- Please visit my website: http://members.cox.net/sbcogan Also, check out an excerpt of " Jubilee, " which will be published in the next few months: http://members.cox.net/sbcogan/writing.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2003 Report Share Posted January 9, 2003 Ron, I have no wish to censor messages posted within this group, and as i have previously said i value the opinions of people within my group, but i do wish to ask you to consider toning down some of your replies. It is not fair on others when you refer to people as foolish and state that you don't care what things mean to them. If you do not wish to hear other people's opinions on your point of view, then why join a group and post such messages. This group is for all its members, and these include many veggies who don't eat meat for ethical reasons. To me, some of what you wrote in your messages seemed to be trying to aggravate them purposefully. I am not trying to be confrontational as i enjoy a lively debate, i just do not want to have other members, who have valid opinions, being offended. I hope you do not mind my honesty. Laura (uk) , Ron McClure <rlmftw> wrote: > How many vegan police are there in this group? Vegan > means what I want it to mean when I use it. You are > foolish, in my opinion, to try to clarify what I mean > by vegan. I am the only person who can do that. > > Ron McClure > > > --- daveo <daveo@m...> wrote: > > I've seen a number of responses where members don't > > seem to know what being > > " Vegan " means, so I'll make a feeble attempt to > > clarify. > > > > Vegans are much stricter in their diet choices than > > most veggies, and they > > would **never** consider the combination that Ron > > refers to as vegan > > condiments. Personally, I agree with Susan when > > faced with such a choice. > > > > Dave > > > > > > > > > > Susan Cogan [susan-brassfield@o...] > > Wednesday, January 08, 2003 11:30 AM > > > > RE: B12 > > > > > > >****Ron wrote.... > > >>>...I eat 3ozs skinless chicken breast, 8ozs > > >nonfat skim milk, 8ozs nonfat yogurt and 3ozs > > >turkey...using them as a condiment with a > > >vegan meal...<< > > > > > >That's a very interesting expansion of the word > > " condiment. " How does > > >salt, pepper, mayo, mustard, relish, and catsup fit > > into that meaning? > > > > > >Vegan, huh? > > > > > >Dave > > > > I'm not a vegan, but I think I'd rather eat a cheap, > > synthetic > > Wal-mart B12 than turkey or chicken breast. Just my > > humble opinion > > though. > > > > Susan > > (crush up the B12 and sprinkle it on salad . . . now > > *that's* a condiment!) > > -- > > --------- > > Please visit my website: > > http://members.cox.net/sbcogan > > > > Also, check out an excerpt of " Jubilee, " which will > > be published in > > the next few months: > > http://members.cox.net/sbcogan/writing.html > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2003 Report Share Posted January 9, 2003 Laura: Your criticism is well said and well taken. Perhaps I should tone it down some. One problem I am having is that my diet and exercise program has life and death importance to me. For that reason I have recently become irritated by a barrage of misinformation, deception and outright insanity pushed upon me by the mass media, advertisers, doctors out to make money off my illness, and people who appear to be at different stages of life than I. I'm having genuine trouble with the idea that a smoker has a right to smoke in the same room where I'm trying to breathe; that the people I work with have a right to cover their tables with cookies and doughnuts and require me to attend meetings with them when I'm trying not to eat what they eat. I should have learned to cope with realities like this long before now, granted. But now I feel like an old guy who is about to die if he doesn't start getting the diet and exercise issues right and it irritates me to see so many different and confusing ideas out there. I'm even angered by the fact that some people eat sugar to the point of diabetes, cheese to the point of cardiovascular problems, and cigarettes to the point of lung cancer in spite of omnipresent warnings about their own health! I suppose I'm still learning to live and let live (or die, if that's what they want). I'll do my best to tone it down. I will leave the group when you have to start censoring my messages. I hope it doesn't come to that. Ron McClure --- " Laura <child_of_the_80s " <child_of_the_80s wrote: > Ron, > I have no wish to censor messages posted within this > group, and as i > have previously said i value the opinions of people > within my group, > but i do wish to ask you to consider toning down > some of your > replies. It is not fair on others when you refer to > people as > foolish and state that you don't care what things > mean to them. If > you do not wish to hear other people's opinions on > your point of > view, then why join a group and post such messages. > This group is > for all its members, and these include many veggies > who don't eat > meat for ethical reasons. To me, some of what you > wrote in your > messages seemed to be trying to aggravate them > purposefully. I am > not trying to be confrontational as i enjoy a lively > debate, i just > do not want to have other members, who have valid > opinions, being > offended. I hope you do not mind my honesty. > > Laura (uk) > > , Ron > McClure <rlmftw> > wrote: > > How many vegan police are there in this group? > Vegan > > means what I want it to mean when I use it. You > are > > foolish, in my opinion, to try to clarify what I > mean > > by vegan. I am the only person who can do that. > > > > Ron McClure > > > > > > --- daveo <daveo@m...> wrote: > > > I've seen a number of responses where members > don't > > > seem to know what being > > > " Vegan " means, so I'll make a feeble attempt to > > > clarify. > > > > > > Vegans are much stricter in their diet choices > than > > > most veggies, and they > > > would **never** consider the combination that > Ron > > > refers to as vegan > > > condiments. Personally, I agree with Susan when > > > faced with such a choice. > > > > > > Dave > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Susan Cogan [susan-brassfield@o...] > > > > Wednesday, January 08, 2003 11:30 AM > > > > > > RE: B12 > > > > > > > > > >****Ron wrote.... > > > >>>...I eat 3ozs skinless chicken breast, 8ozs > > > >nonfat skim milk, 8ozs nonfat yogurt and 3ozs > > > >turkey...using them as a condiment with a > > > >vegan meal...<< > > > > > > > >That's a very interesting expansion of the word > > > " condiment. " How does > > > >salt, pepper, mayo, mustard, relish, and catsup > fit > > > into that meaning? > > > > > > > >Vegan, huh? > > > > > > > >Dave > > > > > > I'm not a vegan, but I think I'd rather eat a > cheap, > > > synthetic > > > Wal-mart B12 than turkey or chicken breast. Just > my > > > humble opinion > > > though. > > > > > > Susan > > > (crush up the B12 and sprinkle it on salad . . . > now > > > *that's* a condiment!) > > > -- > > > --------- > > > Please visit my website: > > > http://members.cox.net/sbcogan > > > > > > Also, check out an excerpt of " Jubilee, " which > will > > > be published in > > > the next few months: > > > http://members.cox.net/sbcogan/writing.html > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2003 Report Share Posted January 9, 2003 Thanks for your reply Ron. As i said, i have no wish to censor anyone and i respect the opinions of all group members. All i wish is for you to remember that everyone in this group is on the same side. I hope others don't mind me speaking on their behalf, but we are all here because our health is important to us and i for one agree with you totally when you say... I have recently become irritated by a barrage > of misinformation, deception and outright insanity > pushed upon me by the mass media, advertisers, doctors > out to make money off my illness, and people who > appear to be at different stages of life than I. > > I'm having genuine trouble with the idea that a smoker > has a right to smoke in the same room where I'm trying > to breathe; that the people I work with have a right > to cover their tables with cookies and doughnuts and > require me to attend meetings with them when I'm > trying not to eat what they eat. It is tough out there and it is hard to deal with sometimes, but this group is here to help. Feel free to vent some of your frustrations and ask for help, just try to remember that we are all on your side about these things, so try not to get frustrated with us we are trying to help Wishing you good health, Laura (uk) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2003 Report Share Posted January 9, 2003 *****Ron wrote.... >>How many vegan police are there in this group?<< It's hardly the " vegan police " who are after you, it's the " word police. " >>Vegan means what I want it to mean when I use it.<< I hate to break the news to you, Ron, but " vegan " had a meaning before you were born. >>You are foolish, in my opinion, to try to clarify what I mean by vegan. I am the only person who can do that.<< Around your house, " vegan " can mean whatever you want it to mean. When you attempt to communicate to others, then " vegan " already has a meaning, and I would appreciate you trying to use it properly. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2003 Report Share Posted January 9, 2003 ****Ron wrote... >>Apparently there are...different definitions of what vegan is...<< Enlighten us, please. >>I am " practically vegan " for health and wellness reasons.<< Ron, you are a " Pollo vegetarian for health and wellness reasons. " What's so hard about accepting that? >>Let's keep our definitions and opinions straight, okay?<< Great!! Let's do that. Definitions are verifiable by others. Opinions can be whatever you want them to be, but the definable words in your opinion are still verifiable. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2003 Report Share Posted January 9, 2003 ****Ron wrote.... >>...I am " practically vegan " for practical reasons: I don't want to take artificial pills to get my B12.<< Sadly, calling an " oceanliner " a " train " doesn't make it so. And, quite possible, it sends a confusing message. >>...All the response to my request for criticism has been about sin, right and wrong, correct definitions, morality, etc. What a misunderstanding!<< You wrote that original email, Ron. Now is the time for you to take responsibility for its affect on others. Words have power! That's why " meaning " is so important. That's why " being clear " with your message is equally important. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2003 Report Share Posted January 9, 2003 ****Ron wrote... >>...recently become irritated by a barrage of misinformation, deception...<< I suggest that your use of the word " vegan " in the context you invented does exactly the same thing to this veggie group. >>...I will leave the group when you have to start censoring my messages...<< Maybe you can be a " real man " about this and take responsibility for what you communicate to the group before you send it. Peace, bro. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2003 Report Share Posted January 9, 2003 *****Laura 80s wrote... >>...I hope others don't mind me speaking on their behalf...<< Double DITTO. Well written. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 7, 2003 Report Share Posted June 7, 2003 For all of you who have not witnessed this site, take a look. One or two of you may recognise the profiles..... http://www.vegan911.com/ The Valley Vegan.... Peter H -------------------- talk21 your FREE portable and private address on the net at http://www.talk21.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.