4H club

August 2, 2009

I am a homeschooling mom and I was recently approached about putting my kids in

a local homeschooling 4 H group. I informed the mom that I don't support

organizations like 4 H group because they promote, Raising, Selling, and

slaughtering of animals. I explained that we are vegitarians and our beleifs

would conflict with the club. She looked stunned and said that it is about the

experience of raising the animals and showing them. She said that my kids (who

already have pet chickens) could show in the poultry devision. She said it is

nothing like what I said. I was wondering what your take is on this topic and

if any of you have had experience with 4H group. I am hoping I didn't insult

this lady's club for no reason.

Tanya

August 2, 2009

My experience in 4H as a kid is exactly as you said. I don't know if things

have changed.

Linda

Http://triballife.net/

On Aug 1, 2009, at 9:50 PM, " wynettelove " <wynettelove wrote:

I am a homeschooling mom and I was recently approached about putting my kids in

a local homeschooling 4 H group. I informed the mom that I don't support

organizations like 4 H group because they promote, Raising, Selling, and

slaughtering of animals. I explained that we are vegitarians and our beleifs

would conflict with the club. She looked stunned and said that it is about the

experience of raising the animals and showing them. She said that my kids (who

already have pet chickens) could show in the poultry devision. She said it is

nothing like what I said. I was wondering what your take is on this topic and if

any of you have had experience with 4H group. I am hoping I didn't insult this

lady's club for no reason.

Tanya

August 2, 2009

Hi Tanya,

I grew up in an agricultural town - the town rodeo (don't all towns have

rodeos? haha) was next door to our high school, which was an

agricultural magnet school. 4H was an institution with students. I

wasn't involved directly, but helped friends take care of their animals

- and saw what happened to the kids involved. (This was in the

mid-80's, so 23-24 years ago, so things may have changed since then . .

.. I doubt it.) The primary 4H shows were at the county fair. Kids

would raise an animal all year long, then, they'd take them to the fair

grounds for exhibit during the fair - and sell them at the end of the

fair. The animal they named and loved and cared for and sat with in

barns in rain storms so they wouldn't be scared . . . would then be

sold. Animals were picked up the next day by the butchering companies,

and the meat would be given to the buyer soon after. The night of the

sales, I would go with my friends to hug the animals and we'd cry and

cry -- most of the kids would use substances to deal with the pain and

grief of their friend being killed the next day. Kids would then be

expected to use the money to buy a new animal and start over again with

a new animal. It usually went that way. Not all kids cried, not all

kids grieved - but I'll guarantee they were affected and even the

" tough " kids were sad and emotional somehow. One of my good friends

then (and now) who was in 4H is a vegetarian now, and an artist - who

paints about animal rights, plight of animals around the world, and the

beauty and playfulness of animals. She is the kindest soul with an

amazing skill for seeing into animals' conditions. Of course, she had

to go through a lot with substance use and emotional trauma because of

this, and I'm sure countless other issues I don't even know about. I

don't know of any option within 4H to not sell/slaughter the animals,

but maybe other people did that and my friends just didn't . . . or

maybe things have changed in the last couple decades. We would

definitely avoid 4H in my family exactly for the reason you said - we

will not support the slaughtering of animals in any way. And you know,

even if there is a no-kill option in 4H - the other kids involved would

be selling animals to be killed, so I'd have a problem with the

environment. I wonder if there's a local group where you are that

focuses on raising animals as friends for their lives? I've heard of

these alternative groups and that might be a great thing for your kids

instead . . . you know, if they are even looking for a group related to

their chickens. :-)

Best of luck! I'm with you on the 4H thing!

Lorraine

On

Behalf Of wynettelove

Saturday, August 01, 2009 7:50 PM

4H club

I am a homeschooling mom and I was recently approached about putting my

kids in a local homeschooling 4 H group. I informed the mom that I don't

support organizations like 4 H group because they promote, Raising,

Selling, and slaughtering of animals. I explained that we are

vegitarians and our beleifs would conflict with the club. She looked

stunned and said that it is about the experience of raising the animals

and showing them. She said that my kids (who already have pet chickens)

could show in the poultry devision. She said it is nothing like what I

said. I was wondering what your take is on this topic and if any of you

have had experience with 4H group. I am hoping I didn't insult this

lady's club for no reason.

Tanya

August 2, 2009

Hi Tanya,

I was a 4-H member throughout my childhood and teen years ('80s and early '90s),

even after I became a vegetarian. Each club is oriented differently. One of

the clubs I belonged to was focused on rabbits, but my mom withdrew me when she

found out that many families slaughtered their " meat breed " rabbits. Another

club, on the other hand, was a nature drawing club. Very ecological and

animal-friendly. Clubs do not need to be organized around agricultural themes.

There were double-dutch jump rope clubs and public speaking clubs when I was a

kid.

In Massachusetts, 4-H was a program of the county cooperative extensions, which

otherwise promoted agriculture in the state, but I did not feel that there was

any push toward consumptive uses of animals, even though it was clear many

families who sent their kids to the county fair did slaughter their animals.

From an animal welfare perspective, the whole system -- record keeping through

visual presentations and quiz bowls -- was set up to encourage children and

teens to spend time with their animals, ensure their proper care, and learn

about the animals' physiology, behavior, and needs. I remain uncomfortable with

the end result (in some cases) -- the slaughter of animals -- but the ducks,

chickens, sheep, and cows of kids I knew had it much, much better than the

animals on factory farms. And not everyone did slaughter their animals. My

brother showed our family's rescued sheep at the county fair, and I knew other

kids who developed such deep bonds with their animals that they would not have

considered slaughter any more appropriate than it would be for their family dog.

For me, the opportunities in 4-H far outweighed any discomfort I felt. I

attended leadership training workshops, spent time on college campuses, traveled

to national competitions and conferences with others, and developed positive

relationships with adults outside of my family. My achievements were recognized

and my talents were celebrated, and I loved " learning by doing. " But I was a

confident kid and teen who did not balk at insisting on vegetarian food at

events, creating exhibits promoting vegetarianism for the " environmental

awareness " department of the county fair, and speaking up for my beliefs.

I'm still a vegetarian - vegan now - with a daughter of my own, and I will send

her to a 4-H club when she's older if I find one with a leader who's supportive

of our famly choices and allows me to be involved.

Good luck with your decision.

Sincerely,

Jessica

EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOOD

Join me

August 2, 2009

I don't have any direct experience with 4H, but I probably would have

responded as you did, if for no other reason than that it promotes

breeding pets and " farm " animals, which are often unwanted or

slaughtered after the 4H kid is done with them. Last summer I adopted

the most adorable dwarf bunny from our local shelter, and it turned

out she was one of about a half dozen dropped off by some 4H kid who

had bred, raised, and shown them, and then, well, who wants to care

for so many rabbits for the next 10 years. If you're " showing "

animals that you rescued and cared for, that would be one thing, but

adding to the homeless or slated-for-slaughter population is not

something I'd support. So no, I think you were right on the mark.

On Aug 1, 2009, at 10:50 PM, wynettelove wrote:

> I am a homeschooling mom and I was recently approached about putting

> my kids in a local homeschooling 4 H group. I informed the mom that

> I don't support organizations like 4 H group because they promote,

> Raising, Selling, and slaughtering of animals. I explained that we

> are vegitarians and our beleifs would conflict with the club. She

> looked stunned and said that it is about the experience of raising

> the animals and showing them. She said that my kids (who already

> have pet chickens) could show in the poultry devision. She said it

> is nothing like what I said. I was wondering what your take is on

> this topic and if any of you have had experience with 4H group. I am

> hoping I didn't insult this lady's club for no reason.

>

> Tanya

>

August 2, 2009

4h is really big where we live in central va. i know people in 4h . i never

heard about the slaughter part. i will ask and get back to you.

Unita Walburn

Mulberry Island Station Homestead

Berefoot Books Stall Holder

visit my site @ www.mybarefootbooks.com/UnitaWalburn

________________________________

wynettelove <wynettelove

Saturday, August 1, 2009 10:50:13 PM