Guest guest Posted September 17, 2007 Report Share Posted September 17, 2007 > Eating meat in any quantity is a vote that says it is acceptable. > And, perhaps there are those who are becoming conscious while > struggling with their addiction to flesh. It is a choice, is all, and > not fanaticism, to respect all living creatures. > > Janet > Very well put, Janet. To suggest a truly humane way of eating meat is like suggesting a humane way to molest kids or drown your neighbor's dog. They are mutually-exclusive. When slavery was brought to an end, it was due to abolitionists, not welfarists. Meaning that simply working to " minimalize " the suffering of slaves or working to make slavery more " acceptable " is just impossible. When people suggest that animal slaver can be done properly, with " respect " to the animals, I wonder how they would have adjusted African American slavery to be more acceptable or less-shocking and more humane. And then you realize how ridiculous it truly is of a concept. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 17, 2007 Report Share Posted September 17, 2007 On Saturday 15 September 2007 19:34, Erica wrote: > I really this argument is ridiculous. Does this mean that people who > kill their children should not be held accountable or faulted because > most of America mows their lawn, and they are essentially the same > thing? According to the above, it does...... sigh. > Nuff said. The basis of > suffering lies in science, and it revolves around the presence of a > nervous system, for starters. Nonsense! see; http://www.department13designs.com/vegan.html " DALLAS--Research scientists at Baylor Medical Center have proven that plants, including vegetables, feel pain when subjected to trauma such as being yanked out of the ground, peeled, cooked, and eaten. " Veggies and plants initiate a massive hormone and chemical barrage internally when they suffer any kind of injury, " says professor Barry Lindzer. " This response is akin to the nerve response and endorphin release when an animal is injured. We cannot ignore the similarities. " Just type into a Google search box excluding the quotes " plants +pain " . Plants also recognise their siblings see http://physorg.com/news100963920.html > To compare the slitting of a tortured > cows neck for a cultural barbecue to the picking of a flower is just so > insulting to life. Vegetation and Animals are inherently different. > Honest to God. Yes I am well aware they are different at species level, but both are forms of organic life. neal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 17, 2007 Report Share Posted September 17, 2007 LOL, each of us is traveling his/her own road, eh? Ants, mosquitoes, and a few others surely can be bothersome at times! I don't know ... I guess I'll say that, in my opinion, it's a desirable direction in which to point ourselves. And I do notice that, at least on a high-water-content program and over time, people seem to become less attractive to biting insects ... but not everyone, and not according to any timing formula. Perhaps this is one of those things that will show up quite differently in a second RF generation, a generation fed only RF mother's milk, then raw foods, from birth. The rest of us may need to put in our 40 years in the Sinai, so to speak. Best, Elchanan _____ rawfood [rawfood ] On Behalf Of Caron Sunday, September 16, 2007 7:26 PM rawfood Re: [Raw Food] Vores (WAS: Eskimo Longevity and Meat Consumption [brief]) - Elchanan >Personally, I advocate the conscious choice to kill nothing. I have to know - does this include mosquitoes? Caron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 17, 2007 Report Share Posted September 17, 2007 > I have to know - does this include mosquitoes? > > Caron > While seemingly a pest, I would be that if all mosquitos were eradicated, it would offset something huge. Ditto for spiders, etc. I loathe snakes, but without them, surely some other rodent would procreate too much and become a problem. There is a balance in place, as annoying or grotesque as some creatures may seem/be. Most people hate bees, but without them, we are screwed, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 18, 2007 Report Share Posted September 18, 2007 - Erica >While seemingly a pest, I would be that if all mosquitos were eradicated, it would offset something huge. Ditto for spiders, etc. I loathe snakes, but without them, surely some other rodent would procreate too much and become a problem. There is a balance in place, as annoying or grotesque as some creatures may seem/be. Most people hate bees, but without them, we are screwed, etc. All true - there is a species of fish that only eats mosquitos. I like spiders in the house to keep the fruit flies under control, and so on. I did kill one that was being rather agressive around my boy when he was a newborn (it was about 4 inches across), but only because it would have presented a risk to all of us to relocate it - mama bear instinct there ;o) I'd never wage war against any particular species though, just try to find a way to redirect it out of my home. I don't see that I should sit by and watch a mosquito bite my son, or myself, raising itchy red bumps, and run the risk of being infected with a debilitating disease, just to preserve the sanctity of life. I do brush them away where possible, and dress us appropriately (long sleeves/pants), but swatting is often necessary. Caron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 18, 2007 Report Share Posted September 18, 2007 but swatting is often necessary. > Being born and raised in Chicagoland, this is certainly forgiveable. LOL! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 19, 2007 Report Share Posted September 19, 2007 Thanks, Erica! Janet rawfood , " Erica " <schoolofrawk wrote: Janet said: Eating meat in any quantity is a vote that says it is acceptable. And, perhaps there are those who are becoming conscious while struggling with their addiction to flesh. It is a choice, is all, and not fanaticism, to respect all living creatures. Erica said: Janet Very well put, Janet. To suggest a truly humane way of eating meat is like suggesting a humane way to molest kids or drown your neighbor's dog. They are mutually-exclusive. When slavery was brought to an end, it was due to abolitionists, not welfarists. Meaning that simply working to " minimalize " the suffering of slaves or working to make slavery more " acceptable " is just impossible. When people suggest that animal slaver can be done properly, with " respect " to the animals, I wonder how they would have adjusted African American slavery to be more acceptable or less-shocking and more humane. And then you realize how ridiculous it truly is of a concept. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 20, 2007 Report Share Posted September 20, 2007 ....if you're some retired old man or old lady with little to do, or some middle aged wife with a family, i.e., someone who longer has need for a social life or close friends, then yes by all means experiment with completely taking meat out of your diet. It will likely be the best thing for you. But for those who are new or young and struggling with it, and who want to still go out with the team and enjoy a beer and burger night after playing sports, by all means if all you can only do is 90% raw well then that IS GREAT! .... WOW Joe, I'm seventy and all I can say is " you are in for a big surprise " ! You seem to think that only the new and young have a need for close friends or a social life. I just had lunch with seven of my friends and family this afternoon. Age and food has no bearing on the need for personal relationships. Sharon In our hearts we plan our day, but it is God who determines our steps. Proverbs 16:9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 20, 2007 Report Share Posted September 20, 2007 Well, you're obviously not an old person with nothing to do! But yes, the words were inflammatory. So sorry, I love (some) old people....hehehehe The message I was TRYING to send came in the next couple of sentences. Alas, let's get on with it and talk about raw food with some of the new people who've been posting! " Experts " debating " guru's " is so boring and pointless. Cheers! Joe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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