Guest guest Posted July 6, 2005 Report Share Posted July 6, 2005 What I'd like to know is - why were the police at the camp in the middle of the night????? JO " Violent clashes are reportedly still ongoing at a temporary " eco-camp " set up on the outskirts of the city. Protesters have been gathering there for the past few days ahead of the G8 summit at Gleneagles. A spokesman for Central Scotland Police said " isolated incidents " involving hundreds of people at the camp have been taking place since around 4am. " Police officers have come under attack and two arrests have been made so far, " he said. " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 6, 2005 Report Share Posted July 6, 2005 Hi Jo That bothers me. Obviously the camp was doing nothing wrong and then the police show up. To do what? Start trouble? Have you heard from Peter? BB & sending light, Nikki , " heartwerk " <heartwork@c...> wrote: > What I'd like to know is - why were the police at the camp in the > middle of the night????? > > JO > > " Violent clashes are reportedly still ongoing at a temporary " eco- camp " > set up on the outskirts of the city. > > Protesters have been gathering there for the past few days ahead of the > G8 summit at Gleneagles. > > A spokesman for Central Scotland Police said " isolated incidents " > involving hundreds of people at the camp have been taking place since > around 4am. > > " Police officers have come under attack and two arrests have been made > so far, " he said. " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 6, 2005 Report Share Posted July 6, 2005 Well, as a protester of many years I can tell you that is SOP. What happens if someone suddenly wakes up people? Some react in a very angry manner. Wow, anger translates into a threat to police and voila you have probable cause! Next you will be reading in your papers that they are eco-terrorists, or are they already following Alfred E Newman's evil doppleganger's lead on that? Ya see, if you repeat something like that often enough and if you keep telling people that the police have been injured and don't mention the protesters or their ages when they are injured then you are able to reframe what really happened and thus influence public opinion. Lynda - heartwerk <heartwork Tuesday, July 05, 2005 11:39 PM ITN News this morning :-( > What I'd like to know is - why were the police at the camp in the > middle of the night????? > > JO > > " Violent clashes are reportedly still ongoing at a temporary " eco-camp " > set up on the outskirts of the city. > > Protesters have been gathering there for the past few days ahead of the > G8 summit at Gleneagles. > > A spokesman for Central Scotland Police said " isolated incidents " > involving hundreds of people at the camp have been taking place since > around 4am. > > " Police officers have come under attack and two arrests have been made > so far, " he said. " > > > > > > To send an email to - > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 6, 2005 Report Share Posted July 6, 2005 Very true Lynda. At present over here the government is concentrating on 'animal activist terrorists', but we will catch up with you and have 'eco-terrorists' as well. Jo > Well, as a protester of many years I can tell you that is SOP. What happens > if someone suddenly wakes up people? Some react in a very angry manner. > Wow, anger translates into a threat to police and voila you have probable > cause! > > Next you will be reading in your papers that they are eco-terrorists, or are > they already following Alfred E Newman's evil doppleganger's lead on that? > > Ya see, if you repeat something like that often enough and if you keep > telling people that the police have been injured and don't mention the > protesters or their ages when they are injured then you are able to reframe > what really happened and thus influence public opinion. > > Lynda > - > heartwerk <heartwork > > Tuesday, July 05, 2005 11:39 PM > ITN News this morning :-( > > > > What I'd like to know is - why were the police at the camp in the > > middle of the night????? > > > > JO > > > > " Violent clashes are reportedly still ongoing at a temporary " eco-camp " > > set up on the outskirts of the city. > > > > Protesters have been gathering there for the past few days ahead of the > > G8 summit at Gleneagles. > > > > A spokesman for Central Scotland Police said " isolated incidents " > > involving hundreds of people at the camp have been taking place since > > around 4am. > > > > " Police officers have come under attack and two arrests have been made > > so far, " he said. " > > > > > > > > > > > > To send an email to - > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2005 Report Share Posted July 9, 2005 OK, some more correction of the media needed.... > " Violent clashes are reportedly still ongoing at a temporary " eco-camp " > set up on the outskirts of the city. There wasn't a single violent incident at the camp, involving either protesters or police. The police were actually not allowed on the site by an order of the local Provost, so if they had been on site there would have been all sorts of legal issues arising, with the police being sued by pretty much everyone on site for harrasment, breaking and entering, aggravated trespass and so on. What actually happened on Wednesday morning was that the police had a presence at the roundabout outside the camp. a group planning peaceful activities during the day left the site, through the police, and proceed to walk down the road through the local industrial estate. The police decided to disrupt their legal right to protest, and within about three minutes the protesters had been blockaded in the industrial estate by several lines of riot police, who started lashing out, and instructing the protesters to return to camp. As tension grew, and tempers flared, a few protesters began to defend themselves with whatever they could find, and a number broke through the riot police lines. This was followed by riot police chasing and throwing things at the protesters who had broken through, and in the heat of the moment some of the protesters ended up smashing up some of the buildings on the industrial estate - most damage was done to Burger King and Royal Bank of Scotland, and one police van. There was one car window and one window in a private house damaged in Bannockbrae, and the following day the camp raised the money to pay for repairs to the private porperty which had been damaged - this has been passed on to the local Stirling anti-G8 network who are attempting to find out whose property was damaged so that it can be passed on. This was entirely the result of the police breaching basic human rights of freedom of movement and freedom to protest, and there would very likely have been no damage at all had the police acted within the law. BB Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2005 Report Share Posted July 9, 2005 Hi Lynda > Well, as a protester of many years I can tell you that is SOP. What happens > if someone suddenly wakes up people? Some react in a very angry manner. > Wow, anger translates into a threat to police and voila you have probable > cause! Yep - they tried several tactics to get this to happen. One night a small congingent of police approached the gates of the camp looking threatening - unfortunately someone without much experience of police methods was there, and proceeded to run through camp at 3am proclaiming loudly that the police were invading. Fortunately there were enough of us there who realised what was happening, and managed to keep things fairly calm... as it turned out, the person manning the gate simply told the police that they (the police) were acting illegaly, and that if they didn't withdraw immediately, they would call the local Sherriff and have them forcibly removed - the whole thing lasted about 5 minutes, but it did disrupt a number of people. BB Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2005 Report Share Posted July 9, 2005 Hi Peter It sounds like Scottish law came in quite handy :-) BB Jo > Hi Lynda > > > Well, as a protester of many years I can tell you that is SOP. What > happens > > if someone suddenly wakes up people? Some react in a very angry manner. > > Wow, anger translates into a threat to police and voila you have probable > > cause! > > Yep - they tried several tactics to get this to happen. One night a small > congingent of police approached the gates of the camp looking threatening - > unfortunately someone without much experience of police methods was there, > and proceeded to run through camp at 3am proclaiming loudly that the police > were invading. Fortunately there were enough of us there who realised what > was happening, and managed to keep things fairly calm... as it turned out, > the person manning the gate simply told the police that they (the police) > were acting illegaly, and that if they didn't withdraw immediately, they > would call the local Sherriff and have them forcibly removed - the whole > thing lasted about 5 minutes, but it did disrupt a number of people. > > BB > Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2005 Report Share Posted July 9, 2005 Hi Peter, Oh, say it isn't so, not the Burger King! I'm glad that in the least they left the camp alone. Not so glad they couldn't respect you all. WELCOME home! It's good to have you back safe and sound. BB Nikki , " Peter " <metalscarab@c...> wrote: > OK, some more correction of the media needed.... > > > " Violent clashes are reportedly still ongoing at a temporary " eco-camp " > > set up on the outskirts of the city. > > There wasn't a single violent incident at the camp, involving either > protesters or police. The police were actually not allowed on the site by an > order of the local Provost, so if they had been on site there would have > been all sorts of legal issues arising, with the police being sued by pretty > much everyone on site for harrasment, breaking and entering, aggravated > trespass and so on. > <<SNIP>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2005 Report Share Posted July 9, 2005 Yeah, and guess whose version goes into the press. The idea of the Fourth Estate being there to report FACTS and keep the government honest is filled with something you find a lot of at factory farms! the person running around translates to " hyteria in the camp. " The statement of facts at the gate translates to " threat to the police. " All our protests now come complete with several video cameras running 24/7! Lynda - Peter <metalscarab Saturday, July 09, 2005 6:32 AM Re: ITN News this morning :-( > Hi Lynda > > > Well, as a protester of many years I can tell you that is SOP. What > happens > > if someone suddenly wakes up people? Some react in a very angry manner. > > Wow, anger translates into a threat to police and voila you have probable > > cause! > > Yep - they tried several tactics to get this to happen. One night a small > congingent of police approached the gates of the camp looking threatening - > unfortunately someone without much experience of police methods was there, > and proceeded to run through camp at 3am proclaiming loudly that the police > were invading. Fortunately there were enough of us there who realised what > was happening, and managed to keep things fairly calm... as it turned out, > the person manning the gate simply told the police that they (the police) > were acting illegaly, and that if they didn't withdraw immediately, they > would call the local Sherriff and have them forcibly removed - the whole > thing lasted about 5 minutes, but it did disrupt a number of people. > > BB > Peter > > > > To send an email to - > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2005 Report Share Posted July 9, 2005 Hi Jo > It sounds like Scottish law came in quite handy :-) I think the term " double-edged sword " is appropriate. It was handy in that the local officials have much more say, so the Provost and Sherriff can refuse the police permission to enter private property, and that's an end to it (in England it could be overturned by a court). On the other hand, in England the police have to have a good reason to arrest and detain people, whereas Scottish law gives them much more flexibility to randomly arrest and detain whoever they want. Also, in English law, they can not blockade an area for more than 6 hours, whereas in Scotland they can do it for as long as they like. BB Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2005 Report Share Posted July 9, 2005 Hi Nikki Thanks... I'm afraid it was Burger King... bit of a shame in one way, because they completely missed the mcd*****s a few shops down! BB Peter - " nikki_mackovitch " <nikkimack Saturday, July 09, 2005 3:40 PM Re: ITN News this morning :-( > Hi Peter, > > Oh, say it isn't so, not the Burger King! > > > I'm glad that in the least they left the camp alone. Not so glad > they couldn't respect you all. > > WELCOME home! It's good to have you back safe and sound. > > BB > Nikki > > > , " Peter " <metalscarab@c...> wrote: > > OK, some more correction of the media needed.... > > > > > " Violent clashes are reportedly still ongoing at a > temporary " eco-camp " > > > set up on the outskirts of the city. > > > > There wasn't a single violent incident at the camp, involving > either > > protesters or police. The police were actually not allowed on the > site by an > > order of the local Provost, so if they had been on site there > would have > > been all sorts of legal issues arising, with the police being sued > by pretty > > much everyone on site for harrasment, breaking and entering, > aggravated > > trespass and so on. > > > <<SNIP>To send an email to - > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2005 Report Share Posted July 9, 2005 Right. I heard the police asked the council (owners of the campsite) to come and inspect it. I presume this was so that if it wasn't being run properly the police could ask to enter it. I read that the council looked around, and after ten minutes proclaimed that the site was being run in an excellent manner, and left. BB Jo - " Peter " <metalscarab Saturday, July 09, 2005 4:35 PM Re: ITN News this morning :-( > Hi Jo > > > It sounds like Scottish law came in quite handy :-) > > I think the term " double-edged sword " is appropriate. It was handy in that > the local officials have much more say, so the Provost and Sherriff can > refuse the police permission to enter private property, and that's an end to > it (in England it could be overturned by a court). On the other hand, in > England the police have to have a good reason to arrest and detain people, > whereas Scottish law gives them much more flexibility to randomly arrest and > detain whoever they want. Also, in English law, they can not blockade an > area for more than 6 hours, whereas in Scotland they can do it for as long > as they like. > > BB > Peter > > > > To send an email to - > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2005 Report Share Posted July 9, 2005 Yep - that was on the Sunday (after the MPH march). The local council were really supportive of the whole idea, and in one of the local papers there was a big article quoting someone high up in the council saying that " we could all learn a lot from the way the eco-village is being run " . BB Peter - " Jo Cwazy " <heartwork Saturday, July 09, 2005 4:49 PM Re: ITN News this morning :-( > Right. I heard the police asked the council (owners of the campsite) to > come and inspect it. I presume this was so that if it wasn't being run > properly the police could ask to enter it. > > I read that the council looked around, and after ten minutes proclaimed that > the site was being run in an excellent manner, and left. > > BB > Jo > > - > " Peter " <metalscarab > > Saturday, July 09, 2005 4:35 PM > Re: ITN News this morning :-( > > > > Hi Jo > > > > > It sounds like Scottish law came in quite handy :-) > > > > I think the term " double-edged sword " is appropriate. It was handy in that > > the local officials have much more say, so the Provost and Sherriff can > > refuse the police permission to enter private property, and that's an end > to > > it (in England it could be overturned by a court). On the other hand, in > > England the police have to have a good reason to arrest and detain people, > > whereas Scottish law gives them much more flexibility to randomly arrest > and > > detain whoever they want. Also, in English law, they can not blockade an > > area for more than 6 hours, whereas in Scotland they can do it for as long > > as they like. > > > > BB > > Peter > > > > > > > > To send an email to - > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2005 Report Share Posted July 9, 2005 Hi Lynda > the person running around translates to " hyteria in the camp. " The > statement of facts at the gate translates to " threat to the police. " Yep - apparently the march in Edinburgh on Monday, in which no property was damaged, and the only people injured were protesters being hit by police, was reported as " a riot " . When the fence at Gleneagles was broken down, even though no other property was damaged, and no-one crossed the line, was also a " riot " ... > All our protests now come complete with several video cameras running 24/7! We have an organisation in the UK called " IndyMedia " who were on site, and taking film and photos constantly (always with the permission of the people they were filming). They were also at most of the off-site events (when they could get off-site). BB Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 9, 2005 Report Share Posted July 9, 2005 It's good it was in the papers too then. BB Jo Re: ITN News this morning :-( > Yep - that was on the Sunday (after the MPH march). > > The local council were really supportive of the whole idea, and in one of > the local papers there was a big article quoting someone high up in the > council saying that " we could all learn a lot from the way the eco-village > is being run " . > > BB > Peter > > - > " Jo Cwazy " <heartwork > > Saturday, July 09, 2005 4:49 PM > Re: ITN News this morning :-( > > > > Right. I heard the police asked the council (owners of the campsite) to > > come and inspect it. I presume this was so that if it wasn't being run > > properly the police could ask to enter it. > > > > I read that the council looked around, and after ten minutes proclaimed > that > > the site was being run in an excellent manner, and left. > > > > BB > > Jo > > > > - > > " Peter " <metalscarab > > > > Saturday, July 09, 2005 4:35 PM > > Re: ITN News this morning :-( > > > > > > > Hi Jo > > > > > > > It sounds like Scottish law came in quite handy :-) > > > > > > I think the term " double-edged sword " is appropriate. It was handy in > that > > > the local officials have much more say, so the Provost and Sherriff can > > > refuse the police permission to enter private property, and that's an > end > > to > > > it (in England it could be overturned by a court). On the other hand, in > > > England the police have to have a good reason to arrest and detain > people, > > > whereas Scottish law gives them much more flexibility to randomly arrest > > and > > > detain whoever they want. Also, in English law, they can not blockade an > > > area for more than 6 hours, whereas in Scotland they can do it for as > long > > > as they like. > > > > > > BB > > > Peter > > > > > > > > > > > > To send an email to - > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 IndyMedia is world wide..they have chapters/newsfeeds from all over... tho, yers did get shut down a few months back as i recall aren't you glad we are spreading democracy world wide..... as long as you agree with *them* Peter <metalscarab Jul 9, 2005 9:33 AM Re: ITN News this morning :-( Hi Lynda > the person running around translates to " hyteria in the camp. " The > statement of facts at the gate translates to " threat to the police. " Yep - apparently the march in Edinburgh on Monday, in which no property was damaged, and the only people injured were protesters being hit by police, was reported as " a riot " . When the fence at Gleneagles was broken down, even though no other property was damaged, and no-one crossed the line, was also a " riot " ... > All our protests now come complete with several video cameras running 24/7! We have an organisation in the UK called " IndyMedia " who were on site, and taking film and photos constantly (always with the permission of the people they were filming). They were also at most of the off-site events (when they could get off-site). BB Peter To send an email to - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 I was most annoyed at that. Jo > IndyMedia is world wide..they have chapters/newsfeeds from all over... > tho, yers did get shut down a few months back as i recall > aren't you glad we are spreading democracy world wide..... > > as long as you agree with *them* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 10, 2005 Report Share Posted July 10, 2005 Hi Fraggle > IndyMedia is world wide..they have chapters/newsfeeds from all over... > tho, yers did get shut down a few months back as i recall > aren't you glad we are spreading democracy world wide..... It's good to know that they're worldwide. They keep shutting down bits of IndyMedia... just last week the police seized the Bristol IndyMedia web server apparently for no reason whatsoever. The irony is that Bristol IndyMedia were only a couple of weeks away from transferring to a new server anyway, so it didn't cause too much disruption to their service (although quite a bit of disruption to the people giving the service!!!) BB Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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