Guest guest Posted December 11, 2005 Report Share Posted December 11, 2005 Can you give me a brief history of its origins, and its core beliefs? I dont read much any more, and when I do it is escapism not education! sorry! The Valley Vegan.................Peter <metalscarab wrote: Hi Peter > Thats good to hear. The way I`ve seen them historically portrayed is basically a male order who practised human sacrifice. > Know any good web info I can look at? being welsh I should take an interest. Honest answer.... no decent websites that I've ever found (not on an historical level, anyway). If you want to read some books, then Kendrick's "The Druids" is about the only decent one out there... but if you wait for about 18 months, then Ronald Hutton is currently working on one. If there's anything you want to know about views on Druidry from 1490 to 1650, then you can ask me.... I am 99% confident in saying that I have researched that particular period in more depth than anyone else living :-) BB Peter Peter H Play Santa's Celebrity Xmas Party, an exclusive game from Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 11, 2005 Report Share Posted December 11, 2005 Hi Peter > Can you give me a brief history of its origins, and its core beliefs? I dont read much any more, and when I do it is escapism > not education! sorry! OK.... Ancient: origins very debatable - first known mention in any text was Sotion, c.200 BCE - but that text is missing. Earliest extant text is Julius Caesar from around 70 BCE. By the time of Sotion, they were already well established, so its generally reckoned that they were around for a couple of centuries before that. General scholarly opinion suggests that they first appeared around 500 to 400 BCE, and gradually grew from that. I'd suggest that they came out of a mix of various cultural influxes into France during that century - the original "aboriginal" Gallic people, the Celtic speaking people, the remnants of La Tene people, Etruscan incursions, and a healthy dose of Greek influence, from the colonies on the south coast of Gaul. Core beliefs - a little hard to establish, since they didn't write down their own beliefs. What is known is that they believed in reincarnation, in something similar to Pythagorean doctrine. They seem to have used a lunar calendar. They commited sacrifice (usually of enemies and criminals, but ocassionally not) in order to appease the gods, and they read the entrails of their sacrifices - both human and animal. They were also considered great philosophers, used astrology, and were later considered to be "sorcerors", as well as scientists, and legal advocates / judges. Revivalist: again, quite a lot of debate - Johann Trithemius referred to himself as a Druid in the 1490s, William Stukeley in the 1720s to 1740s, but other than those two, no-one else seems to have done until about 1780. At that time a guy called H. Hurle (often referred to as Henry Hurle, but there's no original document that calls him Henry!) formed a Christian group called The Ancient Druid Order. They basically worshipped the sun as the Christian god. They celebrated the Equinoxes, and St Johns Day for midsummer, and Christmas for mid winter. Core beliefs basically Christian, but with a solar twist. There seems to have been a huge influence from Freemasonry, and a significant number of early Druids were also Freemasons. Modern: The largest Druid group now is OBOD (Order of Bards, Ovates & Druids), followed closely by The Druid Network (formerly the British Druid Order). These are both Pagan based - in the 1960s, Ross Nichols (friend of Gerald Gardner) decided to take Druidry as it was, and make it a bit more Wiccan, so he started to celebrate the cross quarter days, and changed Christmas and St John's Day into midwinter & the solstices. After Nichols died, his Druid group died.... to be resurrected in the early 1980s by Philip Carr-Gomm (I think - might have been Philip Shalcross - I always get the two muddled!) - basically taking the Pagan elements of Druidry, and mixing them with some elements of Wicca.... And there you have it :-) BB Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 11, 2005 Report Share Posted December 11, 2005 Thanks for the history lesson. So what do the modern Druids believe in thenapart from re-naming holidays? and being nature lovers? The Valley Vegan.........Peter <metalscarab wrote: Hi Peter > Can you give me a brief history of its origins, and its core beliefs? I dont read much any more, and when I do it is escapism > not education! sorry! OK.... Ancient: origins very debatable - first known mention in any text was Sotion, c.200 BCE - but that text is missing. Earliest extant text is Julius Caesar from around 70 BCE. By the time of Sotion, they were already well established, so its generally reckoned that they were around for a couple of centuries before that. General scholarly opinion suggests that they first appeared around 500 to 400 BCE, and gradually grew from that. I'd suggest that they came out of a mix of various cultural influxes into France during that century - the original "aboriginal" Gallic people, the Celtic speaking people, the remnants of La Tene people, Etruscan incursions, and a healthy dose of Greek influence, from the colonies on the south coast of Gaul. Core beliefs - a little hard to establish, since they didn't write down their own beliefs. What is known is that they believed in reincarnation, in something similar to Pythagorean doctrine. They seem to have used a lunar calendar. They commited sacrifice (usually of enemies and criminals, but ocassionally not) in order to appease the gods, and they read the entrails of their sacrifices - both human and animal. They were also considered great philosophers, used astrology, and were later considered to be "sorcerors", as well as scientists, and legal advocates / judges. Revivalist: again, quite a lot of debate - Johann Trithemius referred to himself as a Druid in the 1490s, William Stukeley in the 1720s to 1740s, but other than those two, no-one else seems to have done until about 1780. At that time a guy called H. Hurle (often referred to as Henry Hurle, but there's no original document that calls him Henry!) formed a Christian group called The Ancient Druid Order. They basically worshipped the sun as the Christian god. They celebrated the Equinoxes, and St Johns Day for midsummer, and Christmas for mid winter. Core beliefs basically Christian, but with a solar twist. There seems to have been a huge influence from Freemasonry, and a significant number of early Druids were also Freemasons. Modern: The largest Druid group now is OBOD (Order of Bards, Ovates & Druids), followed closely by The Druid Network (formerly the British Druid Order). These are both Pagan based - in the 1960s, Ross Nichols (friend of Gerald Gardner) decided to take Druidry as it was, and make it a bit more Wiccan, so he started to celebrate the cross quarter days, and changed Christmas and St John's Day into midwinter & the solstices. After Nichols died, his Druid group died.... to be resurrected in the early 1980s by Philip Carr-Gomm (I think - might have been Philip Shalcross - I always get the two muddled!) - basically taking the Pagan elements of Druidry, and mixing them with some elements of Wicca.... And there you have it :-) BB Peter Peter H Messenger NEW - crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 11, 2005 Report Share Posted December 11, 2005 What makes you think that Druids are interested in renaming holidays. To Christians the midwinter celebration will always be Christmas. There is plenty of information on the internet and in books, and I feel that any explanations given here might be the start of an argument - so see what you can find. Jo - peter hurd Sunday, December 11, 2005 6:57 PM Re: Druids Thanks for the history lesson. So what do the modern Druids believe in thenapart from re-naming holidays? and being nature lovers? The Valley Vegan.........Peter <metalscarab wrote: Hi Peter > Can you give me a brief history of its origins, and its core beliefs? I dont read much any more, and when I do it is escapism > not education! sorry! OK.... Ancient: origins very debatable - first known mention in any text was Sotion, c.200 BCE - but that text is missing. Earliest extant text is Julius Caesar from around 70 BCE. By the time of Sotion, they were already well established, so its generally reckoned that they were around for a couple of centuries before that. General scholarly opinion suggests that they first appeared around 500 to 400 BCE, and gradually grew from that. I'd suggest that they came out of a mix of various cultural influxes into France during that century - the original "aboriginal" Gallic people, the Celtic speaking people, the remnants of La Tene people, Etruscan incursions, and a healthy dose of Greek influence, from the colonies on the south coast of Gaul. Core beliefs - a little hard to establish, since they didn't write down their own beliefs. What is known is that they believed in reincarnation, in something similar to Pythagorean doctrine. They seem to have used a lunar calendar. They commited sacrifice (usually of enemies and criminals, but ocassionally not) in order to appease the gods, and they read the entrails of their sacrifices - both human and animal. They were also considered great philosophers, used astrology, and were later considered to be "sorcerors", as well as scientists, and legal advocates / judges. Revivalist: again, quite a lot of debate - Johann Trithemius referred to himself as a Druid in the 1490s, William Stukeley in the 1720s to 1740s, but other than those two, no-one else seems to have done until about 1780. At that time a guy called H. Hurle (often referred to as Henry Hurle, but there's no original document that calls him Henry!) formed a Christian group called The Ancient Druid Order. They basically worshipped the sun as the Christian god. They celebrated the Equinoxes, and St Johns Day for midsummer, and Christmas for mid winter. Core beliefs basically Christian, but with a solar twist. There seems to have been a huge influence from Freemasonry, and a significant number of early Druids were also Freemasons. Modern: The largest Druid group now is OBOD (Order of Bards, Ovates & Druids), followed closely by The Druid Network (formerly the British Druid Order). These are both Pagan based - in the 1960s, Ross Nichols (friend of Gerald Gardner) decided to take Druidry as it was, and make it a bit more Wiccan, so he started to celebrate the cross quarter days, and changed Christmas and St John's Day into midwinter & the solstices. After Nichols died, his Druid group died.... to be resurrected in the early 1980s by Philip Carr-Gomm (I think - might have been Philip Shalcross - I always get the two muddled!) - basically taking the Pagan elements of Druidry, and mixing them with some elements of Wicca.... And there you have it :-) BB Peter Peter H Messenger NEW - crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 11, 2005 Report Share Posted December 11, 2005 Hi Peter > Thanks for the history lesson. So what do the modern Druids believe in thenapart from re-naming holidays? and being > nature lovers? Depends on the group! About the only thing that modern Druids all have in common is the celebration of the eight festivals, and loving nature! If you want to get more details, probably best thing to do is have a quick google on OBOD and The Druid Network - they're the two largest groups. Modern Druidry really isn't my field of expertise! BB Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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