i like prince charles. he would be a thoughtful man to ask?

[Guest guest]

i am sorry to offend our leaders and others, accept my apologies. some policies hurt. I must be more positive. leaders have a tough job with so much depending on their leadership.

 

we are all concerned about the future of nature and ourselves.

 

Can there be peaceful solutions to all wars? A set of values by which we all could live by, reducing the harm that is happening?

 

What would it take for a world amnesty? Who could organise it?

 

 

Can what we spend on war be used making the world a better place to live?

 

the kings of this world and the people could negotiate a path forward together>>>> could this happen?

 

i like prince charles. he would be a thoughtful man to ask?

 

 

peace

 

colin

 

ps. i am going to get off some of these news providers... i am getting too newzzzd out with the negative stuff... hence its easy to pass it on...

 

i liked the good news

 

-

 

Colin Sky

Tuesday, May 16, 2006 11:01 AM

Re: Animal Testing

 

yeah i have steered clear too... what these people did was shit... what blair has done to innocent people is shit too...

 

selective justice rules...

 

so yeah i really wanna stay clear. there is no justice only revenge it seems.

 

peace

 

colin

 

 

-

 

fraggle

Tuesday, May 16, 2006 7:32 AM

Re: Animal Testing

i've steered clear of ya'll discussion on this...butAnimal testing is regulated by EU and British Law. The studies are doneunder very controlled conditions. The Home Office regulates it very tightly,it inspects animal houses for standards and hygiene yeah..and the SS ran a smack dab great system of concentration camps as well....all very regulated>jo <jo.heartwork>May 14, 2006 7:57 AM> > Animal Testing>>Head to head: Animal testing>Tony Blair has publicly defended animal testing and accused anti-vivisection>extremists of stooping to "appalling" depths. His comments have been>applauded by scientists, but criticised by animal rights campaigners.>Here, two people from each side give their views.>>>PROFESSOR CHRIS HIGGINS, DIRECTOR OF THE MEDICAL RESEARCH COUNCIL CLINICAL>FINANCES CENTRE>>>>"I think it's really important to get such public support from the Prime>Minister.>>These people - scientists, researchers and so on - are doing fantastic work,>and they have been scared to go to work. It's very important to get this>support because you can't have fear and intimidation of people going about>their work in medicine.>>I think one of the most important things to understand is that we have very>tight regulations on experiments undertaken on animals. They are only>undertaken when there is no alternative, and they are made to minimize any>suffering.>>Animal testing is regulated by EU and British Law. The studies are done>under very controlled conditions. The Home Office regulates it very tightly,>it inspects animal houses for standards and hygiene and ensures studies are>not done if there is an alternative.>>The law requires numbers of animal experiments to ensure we have safe>chemicals in the environment and safe medicines.>>The vast majority of experiments are done on mice or rats and most people>consider these to be pests and put down nasty poisons for them.>>People who say we can use cells don't understand medicine. You have to test>these cells on a whole body. Animals are always the end point.>>Many medicines come from animals, such as insulin which originally came from>cows, and herceptin, which was developed from animals.>>It's a very straight forward and simple choice - if you want new medicines>that are safe and effective we have to use animals.>>I would rather a new medicine was tested on a rat than tested on my child.>Children's lives are more valuable than rats'.">>>ALISTAIR CURRIE, CAMPAIGN DIRECTOR FOR THE BRITISH UNION FOR THE ABOLITION>OF VIVISECTION>>>>>"The prime minister is rightly taking a tough line on extremists, but he is>not looking at the problems of animal testing.>>He is mixing the two up. The fact is that the public overall are very>confused about animal experimentation. They are in favour of medical>progress but they are against the suffering of animals.>>Before this government came to power, animal testing was going down. Now>they are ignoring the fact that it is on the rise.>>Essentially animal experimentation causes great suffering to millions of>animals in the UK, but doesn't produce the benefits to humans.>>The drugs which are used in the UK have been tested on animals but that>doesn't mean they needed to be. This is a technology that is decades old.>>We can use computer modelling, human tissue cells in the lab, and>well-designed studies on human volunteers. All of these things will tell us>what happens on humans, unlike animal studies - which don't.>>There is a conservatism in government and science that says 'we should keep>using the old methods'.>>Ninety per cent of drugs that have been animal tested fail in human>studies - they never actually make it onto the market, because they don't>work.>>So the government is backing a system that fails.>>It is legal in this country to poison an animal to death, to inflict brain>damage on it and surgically manipulate it. Mice given cancer are suffering>severe pain and distress. Rats that are asphyxiated to death are suffering>profoundly.>>The animal is small but the suffering is great.">>>>http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4769749.stm>>>>>To send an email to - >

[Guest guest]

Hi Colin

 

>i like prince charles. he would be a thoughtful man to ask?

 

This would be the same Prince Charles who spends much of his spare time fox-hunting?????

BB

Peter

[Guest guest]

Go ahead and ask him, send him a letter?Let us know if you get an answer! You can write to The Prince of Wales, The Duchess of Cornwall, Prince William and Prince Harry at the following address:His Royal Highness The Prince of WalesClarence HouseLondon SW1A 1BA The Valley Vegan................Colin Sky <colinsky wrote: i am sorry to offend our leaders and others, accept my apologies. some policies hurt. I must be more positive. leaders have a tough job with so much depending on their leadership. we are all concerned about the future of nature and

ourselves. Can there be peaceful solutions to all wars? A set of values by which we all could live by, reducing the harm that is happening? What would it take for a world amnesty? Who could organise it? Can what we spend on war be used making the world a better place to live? the kings of this world and the people could negotiate a path forward together>>>> could this happen? i like prince charles. he would be a thoughtful

man to ask? peace colin ps. i am going to get off some of these news providers... i am getting too newzzzd out with the negative stuff... hence its easy to pass it on... i liked the good news - Colin

Sky Tuesday, May 16, 2006 11:01 AM Re: Animal Testing yeah i have steered clear too... what these people did was shit... what blair has done to innocent people is shit too... selective justice rules... so yeah i really wanna stay clear. there is no justice only revenge it seems. peace colin - fraggle Tuesday, May 16, 2006 7:32 AM Re: Animal Testing i've steered clear of ya'll discussion on this...butAnimal testing is regulated by EU and British Law. The studies are doneunder very controlled conditions. The Home Office regulates it very tightly,it inspects animal

houses for standards and hygiene yeah..and the SS ran a smack dab great system of concentration camps as well....all very regulated>jo <jo.heartwork>May 14, 2006 7:57 AM> > Animal Testing>>Head to head: Animal testing>Tony Blair has publicly defended animal testing and accused anti-vivisection>extremists of stooping to "appalling" depths. His comments have been>applauded by scientists, but criticised by animal rights campaigners.>Here, two people from each side give their views.>>>PROFESSOR CHRIS HIGGINS, DIRECTOR OF THE MEDICAL RESEARCH COUNCIL CLINICAL>FINANCES CENTRE>>>>"I think it's really important to get such public support from the Prime>Minister.>>These people - scientists, researchers and so

on - are doing fantastic work,>and they have been scared to go to work. It's very important to get this>support because you can't have fear and intimidation of people going about>their work in medicine.>>I think one of the most important things to understand is that we have very>tight regulations on experiments undertaken on animals. They are only>undertaken when there is no alternative, and they are made to minimize any>suffering.>>Animal testing is regulated by EU and British Law. The studies are done>under very controlled conditions. The Home Office regulates it very tightly,>it inspects animal houses for standards and hygiene and ensures studies are>not done if there is an alternative.>>The law requires numbers of animal experiments to ensure we have safe>chemicals in the environment and safe medicines.>>The vast majority of experiments are done

on mice or rats and most people>consider these to be pests and put down nasty poisons for them.>>People who say we can use cells don't understand medicine. You have to test>these cells on a whole body. Animals are always the end point.>>Many medicines come from animals, such as insulin which originally came from>cows, and herceptin, which was developed from animals.>>It's a very straight forward and simple choice - if you want new medicines>that are safe and effective we have to use animals.>>I would rather a new medicine was tested on a rat than tested on my child.>Children's lives are more valuable than rats'.">>>ALISTAIR CURRIE, CAMPAIGN DIRECTOR FOR THE BRITISH UNION FOR THE ABOLITION>OF VIVISECTION>>>>>"The prime minister is rightly taking a tough line on extremists, but he is>not looking at the problems of

animal testing.>>He is mixing the two up. The fact is that the public overall are very>confused about animal experimentation. They are in favour of medical>progress but they are against the suffering of animals.>>Before this government came to power, animal testing was going down. Now>they are ignoring the fact that it is on the rise.>>Essentially animal experimentation causes great suffering to millions of>animals in the UK, but doesn't produce the benefits to humans.>>The drugs which are used in the UK have been tested on animals but that>doesn't mean they needed to be. This is a technology that is decades old.>>We can use computer modelling, human tissue cells in the lab, and>well-designed studies on human volunteers. All of these things will tell us>what happens on humans, unlike animal studies - which don't.>>There is a conservatism in

government and science that says 'we should keep>using the old methods'.>>Ninety per cent of drugs that have been animal tested fail in human>studies - they never actually make it onto the market, because they don't>work.>>So the government is backing a system that fails.>>It is legal in this country to poison an animal to death, to inflict brain>damage on it and surgically manipulate it. Mice given cancer are suffering>severe pain and distress. Rats that are asphyxiated to death are suffering>profoundly.>>The animal is small but the suffering is great.">>>>http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4769749.stm>>>>>To send an email to - >

[Guest guest]

iv got a new name for him SGUM well i think thats how i spell what im sayin Peter Kebbell <metalscarab wrote: Hi Colin >i like prince charles. he would be a thoughtful man to ask? This would be the same Prince Charles who spends much of his spare time fox-hunting????? BB PeterSend instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.

[Guest guest]

the precious frogs in my garden hunt food... that's okay right?

 

to hunt for sport and pleasure i would describe as selfish, somewhat unwell, behaviour. yes the guy needs help as society needs help.

 

i would like to think we should engage our minds rather than our passions. if the world could find the capacity for looking for solutions, then perhaps there would be some hope. first we need a universal code of ethically based behaviour.

 

i chose charles only as a model of his group. i don't know the chap, but i believe he has thoughtful side to his character.

 

i heard the butler puts toothpaste on his tooth brush for him.

the guy doesn't know what it is like to be normal. his thoughts would be helpful though as a starting point for looking for solutions.

 

surely war is the battle between the rich and the poor? the right to divide wealth and power? the rich and poor need to negotiate before the next century of war and poverty is finished... imo.

 

if

 

 

-

 

Peter Kebbell

Tuesday, May 16, 2006 8:01 PM

Re: i like prince charles. he would be a thoughtful man to ask?

 

Hi Colin

 

>i like prince charles. he would be a thoughtful man to ask?

 

This would be the same Prince Charles who spends much of his spare time fox-hunting?????

BB

Peter

[Guest guest]

oh thanks peter. this is helpful but he needs to tell the world not me.

 

-

peter hurd

Wednesday, May 17, 2006 5:27 AM

Re: i like prince charles. he would be a thoughtful man to ask?

 

Go ahead and ask him, send him a letter?Let us know if you get an answer!

You can write to The Prince of Wales, The Duchess of Cornwall, Prince William and Prince Harry at the following address:His Royal Highness The Prince of WalesClarence HouseLondon SW1A 1BA

 

The Valley Vegan................Colin Sky <colinsky wrote:

 

i am sorry to offend our leaders and others, accept my apologies. some policies hurt. I must be more positive. leaders have a tough job with so much depending on their leadership.

 

we are all concerned about the future of nature and ourselves.

 

Can there be peaceful solutions to all wars? A set of values by which we all could live by, reducing the harm that is happening?

 

What would it take for a world amnesty? Who could organise it?

 

 

Can what we spend on war be used making the world a better place to live?

 

the kings of this world and the people could negotiate a path forward together>>>> could this happen?

 

i like prince charles. he would be a thoughtful man to ask?

 

 

peace

 

colin

 

ps. i am going to get off some of these news providers... i am getting too newzzzd out with the negative stuff... hence its easy to pass it on...

 

i liked the good news

 

-

 

Colin Sky

Tuesday, May 16, 2006 11:01 AM

Re: Animal Testing

 

yeah i have steered clear too... what these people did was shit... what blair has done to innocent people is shit too...

 

selective justice rules...

 

so yeah i really wanna stay clear. there is no justice only revenge it seems.

 

peace

 

colin

 

 

-

 

fraggle

Tuesday, May 16, 2006 7:32 AM

Re: Animal Testing

i've steered clear of ya'll discussion on this...butAnimal testing is regulated by EU and British Law. The studies are doneunder very controlled conditions. The Home Office regulates it very tightly,it inspects animal houses for standards and hygiene yeah..and the SS ran a smack dab great system of concentration camps as well....all very regulated>jo <jo.heartwork>May 14, 2006 7:57 AM> > Animal Testing>>Head to head: Animal testing>Tony Blair has publicly defended animal testing and accused anti-vivisection>extremists of stooping to "appalling" depths. His comments have been>applauded by scientists, but criticised by animal rights campaigners.>Here, two people from each side give their views.>>>PROFESSOR CHRIS HIGGINS, DIRECTOR OF THE MEDICAL RESEARCH COUNCIL CLINICAL>FINANCES CENTRE>>>>"I think it's really important to get such public support from the Prime>Minister.>>These people - scientists, researchers and so on - are doing fantastic work,>and they have been scared to go to work. It's very important to get this>support because you can't have fear and intimidation of people going about>their work in medicine.>>I think one of the most important things to understand is that we have very>tight regulations on experiments undertaken on animals. They are only>undertaken when there is no alternative, and they are made to minimize any>suffering.>>Animal testing is regulated by EU and British Law. The studies are done>under very controlled conditions. The Home Office regulates it very tightly,>it inspects animal houses for standards and hygiene and ensures studies are>not done if there is an alternative.>>The law requires numbers of animal experiments to ensure we have safe>chemicals in the environment and safe medicines.>>The vast majority of experiments are done on mice or rats and most people>consider these to be pests and put down nasty poisons for them.>>People who say we can use cells don't understand medicine. You have to test>these cells on a whole body. Animals are always the end point.>>Many medicines come from animals, such as insulin which originally came from>cows, and herceptin, which was developed from animals.>>It's a very straight forward and simple choice - if you want new medicines>that are safe and effective we have to use animals.>>I would rather a new medicine was tested on a rat than tested on my child.>Children's lives are more valuable than rats'.">>>ALISTAIR CURRIE, CAMPAIGN DIRECTOR FOR THE BRITISH UNION FOR THE ABOLITION>OF VIVISECTION>>>>>"The prime minister is rightly taking a tough line on extremists, but he is>not looking at the problems of animal testing.>>He is mixing the two up. The fact is that the public overall are very>confused about animal experimentation. They are in favour of medical>progress but they are against the suffering of animals.>>Before this government came to power, animal testing was going down. Now>they are ignoring the fact that it is on the rise.>>Essentially animal experimentation causes great suffering to millions of>animals in the UK, but doesn't produce the benefits to humans.>>The drugs which are used in the UK have been tested on animals but that>doesn't mean they needed to be. This is a technology that is decades old.>>We can use computer modelling, human tissue cells in the lab, and>well-designed studies on human volunteers. All of these things will tell us>what happens on humans, unlike animal studies - which don't.>>There is a conservatism in government and science that says 'we should keep>using the old methods'.>>Ninety per cent of drugs that have been animal tested fail in human>studies - they never actually make it onto the market, because they don't>work.>>So the government is backing a system that fails.>>It is legal in this country to poison an animal to death, to inflict brain>damage on it and surgically manipulate it. Mice given cancer are suffering>severe pain and distress. Rats that are asphyxiated to death are suffering>profoundly.>>The animal is small but the suffering is great.">>>>http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4769749.stm>>>>>To send an email to - >

[Guest guest]

Hi Colin

 

>i would like to think we should engage our minds rather than our passions.

 

Interesting statement - this seems very much to do with what you were saying about our world view being affected by how we are brought up.... most tribal cultures would say that we should engage our passions rather than our minds - and they seem to be far more environmentally friendly than those societies where " minds " are given precedence over emotions....

 

 

> if the world could find the capacity for looking for solutions, then perhaps there would be

> some hope. first we need a universal code of ethically based behaviour.

 

Absolutely - then all we'll need is a military dictatorship to enforce it on those who have different values.

 

BB

Peter

[Guest guest]

Hi Colin

 

>surely war is the battle between the rich and the poor?

 

No - war is the battle between the rich and the rich, fought on their behalf by the poor....

 

BB

Peter

[Guest guest]

Hi Fraggle

 

>most wars are between the rich and the rich, using the poor as proxies....

 

Hey - I said that. Please stop using your mind reading powers ;-)

 

BB

Peter

[Guest guest]

I agree, but someones got to start the ball rolling? why not you? The Valley Vegan..................Colin Sky <colinsky wrote: oh thanks peter. this is helpful but he needs to tell the world not me. - peter hurd Wednesday, May 17, 2006 5:27 AM Re: i like prince charles. he would be a thoughtful man to ask? Go ahead and ask him, send him a letter?Let us know if you get an answer! You can write to The Prince of Wales, The Duchess of Cornwall, Prince William and Prince Harry at the following address:His Royal Highness The Prince of WalesClarence HouseLondon SW1A 1BA The Valley Vegan................Colin Sky <colinsky wrote: i

am sorry to offend our leaders and others, accept my apologies. some policies hurt. I must be more positive. leaders have a tough job with so much depending on their leadership. we are all concerned about the future of nature and ourselves. Can there be peaceful solutions to all wars? A set of values by which we all could live by, reducing the harm that is happening? What would it take for a world amnesty? Who could organise it? Can what we spend on war be used making the world a better place to

live? the kings of this world and the people could negotiate a path forward together>>>> could this happen? i like prince charles. he would be a thoughtful man to ask? peace colin ps. i am going to get off some of these news providers... i am getting too newzzzd out with the negative stuff... hence its easy to pass it on... i liked the good

news - Colin Sky Tuesday, May 16, 2006 11:01 AM Re: Animal Testing yeah i have steered clear too... what these people did was shit... what blair has done to innocent people is shit too... selective justice

rules... so yeah i really wanna stay clear. there is no justice only revenge it seems. peace colin - fraggle Tuesday,

May 16, 2006 7:32 AM Re: Animal Testing i've steered clear of ya'll discussion on this...butAnimal testing is regulated by EU and British Law. The studies are doneunder very controlled conditions. The Home Office regulates it very tightly,it inspects animal houses for standards and hygiene yeah..and the SS ran a smack dab great system of concentration camps as well....all very regulated>jo <jo.heartwork>May 14, 2006 7:57 AM> > Animal Testing>>Head to head: Animal testing>Tony Blair has publicly defended animal testing and accused anti-vivisection>extremists of stooping to "appalling" depths. His comments have been>applauded by scientists, but criticised by animal rights

campaigners.>Here, two people from each side give their views.>>>PROFESSOR CHRIS HIGGINS, DIRECTOR OF THE MEDICAL RESEARCH COUNCIL CLINICAL>FINANCES CENTRE>>>>"I think it's really important to get such public support from the Prime>Minister.>>These people - scientists, researchers and so on - are doing fantastic work,>and they have been scared to go to work. It's very important to get this>support because you can't have fear and intimidation of people going about>their work in medicine.>>I think one of the most important things to understand is that we have very>tight regulations on experiments undertaken on animals. They are only>undertaken when there is no alternative, and they are made to minimize any>suffering.>>Animal testing is regulated by EU and British Law. The studies are done>under very controlled

conditions. The Home Office regulates it very tightly,>it inspects animal houses for standards and hygiene and ensures studies are>not done if there is an alternative.>>The law requires numbers of animal experiments to ensure we have safe>chemicals in the environment and safe medicines.>>The vast majority of experiments are done on mice or rats and most people>consider these to be pests and put down nasty poisons for them.>>People who say we can use cells don't understand medicine. You have to test>these cells on a whole body. Animals are always the end point.>>Many medicines come from animals, such as insulin which originally came from>cows, and herceptin, which was developed from animals.>>It's a very straight forward and simple choice - if you want new medicines>that are safe and effective we have to use animals.>>I would rather a new

medicine was tested on a rat than tested on my child.>Children's lives are more valuable than rats'.">>>ALISTAIR CURRIE, CAMPAIGN DIRECTOR FOR THE BRITISH UNION FOR THE ABOLITION>OF VIVISECTION>>>>>"The prime minister is rightly taking a tough line on extremists, but he is>not looking at the problems of animal testing.>>He is mixing the two up. The fact is that the public overall are very>confused about animal experimentation. They are in favour of medical>progress but they are against the suffering of animals.>>Before this government came to power, animal testing was going down. Now>they are ignoring the fact that it is on the rise.>>Essentially animal experimentation causes great suffering to millions of>animals in the UK, but doesn't produce the benefits to humans.>>The drugs which are used in the UK have been

tested on animals but that>doesn't mean they needed to be. This is a technology that is decades old.>>We can use computer modelling, human tissue cells in the lab, and>well-designed studies on human volunteers. All of these things will tell us>what happens on humans, unlike animal studies - which don't.>>There is a conservatism in government and science that says 'we should keep>using the old methods'.>>Ninety per cent of drugs that have been animal tested fail in human>studies - they never actually make it onto the market, because they don't>work.>>So the government is backing a system that fails.>>It is legal in this country to poison an animal to death, to inflict brain>damage on it and surgically manipulate it. Mice given cancer are suffering>severe pain and distress. Rats that are asphyxiated to death are

suffering>profoundly.>>The animal is small but the suffering is great.">>>>http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4769749.stm>>>>>To send an email to - >

[Guest guest]

Hi Fraggle

 

>get out of my head peter....!!

>i warned you about that!!

>now you'll never find yer way out!

 

Stop it! I just said this.... please, I'd like my brain back now!

 

BB

Peter

[Guest guest]

Hi Fraggle

 

>i'm sellin yer secrets to the russians

 

In that case, please carry on - I'm sure they could do with a laugh :-)

 

BB

Peter

[Guest guest]

Very, very true Peter.

 

BBJo

 

-

Peter Kebbell

Wednesday, May 17, 2006 9:51 AM

Re: i like prince charles. he would be a thoughtful man to ask?

 

Hi Colin

 

>surely war is the battle between the rich and the poor?

 

No - war is the battle between the rich and the rich, fought on their behalf by the poor....

 

BB

Peter

[Guest guest]

dear charles... i don't know if u read but if u do i would like u to really consider becoming a vegetarian ( a real one eg. vegan ) and becoming an example of a real earth friendly person.

 

i know and appreciate your thought on organics, it is a good first step once u are past poisonics (medieval stuff,) and genescewuonics, (plainevil stuff,) but veganics is where u accept pro life in order to be happy and fulfilled... and share the land with nature our real true ancestor.

 

veganics is the theory that the happiness of the whole is better than murder of the few for the benefit of the greedy.

 

please go vegan charles and improve the reputation of the royals.... in fact of britain and the world.

 

make my day charles.

 

peace.

 

vegan col.

 

-

 

peter hurd

Thursday, May 18, 2006 5:22 AM

Re: i like prince charles. he would be a thoughtful man to ask?

 

I agree, but someones got to start the ball rolling? why not you?

 

The Valley Vegan..................Colin Sky <colinsky wrote:

 

oh thanks peter. this is helpful but he needs to tell the world not me.

 

-

peter hurd

Wednesday, May 17, 2006 5:27 AM

Re: i like prince charles. he would be a thoughtful man to ask?

 

Go ahead and ask him, send him a letter?Let us know if you get an answer!

You can write to The Prince of Wales, The Duchess of Cornwall, Prince William and Prince Harry at the following address:His Royal Highness The Prince of WalesClarence HouseLondon SW1A 1BA

 

The Valley Vegan................Colin Sky <colinsky wrote:

 

i am sorry to offend our leaders and others, accept my apologies. some policies hurt. I must be more positive. leaders have a tough job with so much depending on their leadership.

 

we are all concerned about the future of nature and ourselves.

 

Can there be peaceful solutions to all wars? A set of values by which we all could live by, reducing the harm that is happening?

 

What would it take for a world amnesty? Who could organise it?

 

 

Can what we spend on war be used making the world a better place to live?

 

the kings of this world and the people could negotiate a path forward together>>>> could this happen?

 

i like prince charles. he would be a thoughtful man to ask?

 

 

peace

 

colin

 

ps. i am going to get off some of these news providers... i am getting too newzzzd out with the negative stuff... hence its easy to pass it on...

 

i liked the good news

 

-

 

Colin Sky

Tuesday, May 16, 2006 11:01 AM

Re: Animal Testing

 

yeah i have steered clear too... what these people did was shit... what blair has done to innocent people is shit too...

 

selective justice rules...

 

so yeah i really wanna stay clear. there is no justice only revenge it seems.

 

peace

 

colin

 

 

-

 

fraggle

Tuesday, May 16, 2006 7:32 AM

Re: Animal Testing

i've steered clear of ya'll discussion on this...butAnimal testing is regulated by EU and British Law. The studies are doneunder very controlled conditions. The Home Office regulates it very tightly,it inspects animal houses for standards and hygiene yeah..and the SS ran a smack dab great system of concentration camps as well....all very regulated>jo <jo.heartwork>May 14, 2006 7:57 AM> > Animal Testing>>Head to head: Animal testing>Tony Blair has publicly defended animal testing and accused anti-vivisection>extremists of stooping to "appalling" depths. His comments have been>applauded by scientists, but criticised by animal rights campaigners.>Here, two people from each side give their views.>>>PROFESSOR CHRIS HIGGINS, DIRECTOR OF THE MEDICAL RESEARCH COUNCIL CLINICAL>FINANCES CENTRE>>>>"I think it's really important to get such public support from the Prime>Minister.>>These people - scientists, researchers and so on - are doing fantastic work,>and they have been scared to go to work. It's very important to get this>support because you can't have fear and intimidation of people going about>their work in medicine.>>I think one of the most important things to understand is that we have very>tight regulations on experiments undertaken on animals. They are only>undertaken when there is no alternative, and they are made to minimize any>suffering.>>Animal testing is regulated by EU and British Law. The studies are done>under very controlled conditions. The Home Office regulates it very tightly,>it inspects animal houses for standards and hygiene and ensures studies are>not done if there is an alternative.>>The law requires numbers of animal experiments to ensure we have safe>chemicals in the environment and safe medicines.>>The vast majority of experiments are done on mice or rats and most people>consider these to be pests and put down nasty poisons for them.>>People who say we can use cells don't understand medicine. You have to test>these cells on a whole body. Animals are always the end point.>>Many medicines come from animals, such as insulin which originally came from>cows, and herceptin, which was developed from animals.>>It's a very straight forward and simple choice - if you want new medicines>that are safe and effective we have to use animals.>>I would rather a new medicine was tested on a rat than tested on my child.>Children's lives are more valuable than rats'.">>>ALISTAIR CURRIE, CAMPAIGN DIRECTOR FOR THE BRITISH UNION FOR THE ABOLITION>OF VIVISECTION>>>>>"The prime minister is rightly taking a tough line on extremists, but he is>not looking at the problems of animal testing.>>He is mixing the two up. The fact is that the public overall are very>confused about animal experimentation. They are in favour of medical>progress but they are against the suffering of animals.>>Before this government came to power, animal testing was going down. Now>they are ignoring the fact that it is on the rise.>>Essentially animal experimentation causes great suffering to millions of>animals in the UK, but doesn't produce the benefits to humans.>>The drugs which are used in the UK have been tested on animals but that>doesn't mean they needed to be. This is a technology that is decades old.>>We can use computer modelling, human tissue cells in the lab, and>well-designed studies on human volunteers. All of these things will tell us>what happens on humans, unlike animal studies - which don't.>>There is a conservatism in government and science that says 'we should keep>using the old methods'.>>Ninety per cent of drugs that have been animal tested fail in human>studies - they never actually make it onto the market, because they don't>work.>>So the government is backing a system that fails.>>It is legal in this country to poison an animal to death, to inflict brain>damage on it and surgically manipulate it. Mice given cancer are suffering>severe pain and distress. Rats that are asphyxiated to death are suffering>profoundly.>>The animal is small but the suffering is great.">>>>http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4769749.stm>>>>>To send an email to - >

[Guest guest]

thanku hi peter. what a fool to think the poor could afford to fight. (except as pawns...)

 

perhaps it's not even money... eg. rich against rich..... but man against man. ego against ego. power against power.

 

money may be just the board the game is played upon. u win... then u own the game.

 

col.

 

-

Peter Kebbell

Wednesday, May 17, 2006 8:51 PM

Re: i like prince charles. he would be a thoughtful man to ask?

 

Hi Colin

 

>surely war is the battle between the rich and the poor?

 

No - war is the battle between the rich and the rich, fought on their behalf by the poor....

 

BB

Peter

[Guest guest]

hi peter...

 

probably the world will be a lot better off when our minds are reduced to the same capacity as insects...

 

or else it's roll on science... keep those clever bombs and poisons rolling off production lines... oh great! now insert amazing shit into seeds and into our gene pools! oh fantastic. who needs enemies when we have bright bastards like over-programmed humans?

 

all we will then need is a military dictatorship for the cherry on the top.

 

regards

 

col.

 

-

Peter Kebbell

Wednesday, May 17, 2006 8:50 PM

Re: i like prince charles. he would be a thoughtful man to ask?

 

Hi Colin

 

>i would like to think we should engage our minds rather than our passions.

 

Interesting statement - this seems very much to do with what you were saying about our world view being affected by how we are brought up.... most tribal cultures would say that we should engage our passions rather than our minds - and they seem to be far more environmentally friendly than those societies where "minds" are given precedence over emotions....

 

> if the world could find the capacity for looking for solutions, then perhaps there would be

> some hope. first we need a universal code of ethically based behaviour.

 

Absolutely - then all we'll need is a military dictatorship to enforce it on those who have different values.

 

BB

Peter

[Guest guest]

humour or facetiousness? either way you would do more good by writing to him as I suggested, there may be more chance of him actually reading it. The Valley Vegan...............Colin Sky <colinsky wrote: dear charles... i don't know if u read but if u do i would like u to really consider becoming a vegetarian ( a real one eg. vegan ) and becoming an example of a real earth friendly person. i know and appreciate your thought on organics, it is a good first step once u are past poisonics (medieval stuff,) and genescewuonics, (plainevil stuff,) but

veganics is where u accept pro life in order to be happy and fulfilled... and share the land with nature our real true ancestor. veganics is the theory that the happiness of the whole is better than murder of the few for the benefit of the greedy. please go vegan charles and improve the reputation of the royals.... in fact of britain and the world. make my day charles. peace. vegan col. - peter hurd Thursday, May 18, 2006 5:22 AM Re: i like prince charles. he would be a thoughtful man to ask? I agree, but someones got to start the ball rolling? why not you? The Valley Vegan..................Colin Sky <colinsky wrote: oh thanks peter. this is helpful but he needs to tell the world not me. - peter hurd Wednesday, May 17, 2006 5:27 AM Re: i like prince charles. he would be a thoughtful man to ask? Go ahead and ask him, send him a letter?Let us know if you get an answer! You can write

to The Prince of Wales, The Duchess of Cornwall, Prince William and Prince Harry at the following address:His Royal Highness The Prince of WalesClarence HouseLondon SW1A 1BA The Valley Vegan................Colin Sky <colinsky wrote: i am sorry to offend our leaders and others, accept my apologies. some policies hurt. I must be more positive. leaders have a tough job with so much depending on their leadership. we are all concerned about the future of nature and ourselves. Can there be peaceful solutions to all wars? A set of values by which we all could live by, reducing the harm that is happening? What would it take for a world amnesty? Who could organise it? Can what we spend on war be used making the world a better place to live? the kings of this world and the people could negotiate a path forward together>>>> could this happen? i like prince charles. he would be a thoughtful man to ask? peace colin ps. i am going to get off some of these news providers... i am getting too newzzzd out with the negative stuff... hence its easy to pass it on... i liked the good news - Colin Sky Tuesday, May 16, 2006 11:01 AM Re: Animal Testing yeah i have steered clear too... what these people did was shit... what blair has done to innocent people is shit too... selective justice rules... so yeah i really wanna stay clear. there is no justice only revenge it seems. peace colin - fraggle Tuesday, May 16, 2006 7:32 AM Re: Animal Testing i've steered clear of ya'll discussion on this...butAnimal testing is regulated by EU and British Law. The studies are doneunder very controlled conditions. The Home Office regulates it very tightly,it inspects animal houses for standards and

hygiene yeah..and the SS ran a smack dab great system of concentration camps as well....all very regulated>jo <jo.heartwork>May 14, 2006 7:57 AM> > Animal Testing>>Head to head: Animal testing>Tony Blair has publicly defended animal testing and accused anti-vivisection>extremists of stooping to "appalling" depths. His comments have been>applauded by scientists, but criticised by animal rights campaigners.>Here, two people from each side give their views.>>>PROFESSOR CHRIS HIGGINS, DIRECTOR OF THE MEDICAL RESEARCH COUNCIL CLINICAL>FINANCES CENTRE>>>>"I think it's really important to get such public support from the Prime>Minister.>>These people - scientists, researchers and so on - are doing fantastic

work,>and they have been scared to go to work. It's very important to get this>support because you can't have fear and intimidation of people going about>their work in medicine.>>I think one of the most important things to understand is that we have very>tight regulations on experiments undertaken on animals. They are only>undertaken when there is no alternative, and they are made to minimize any>suffering.>>Animal testing is regulated by EU and British Law. The studies are done>under very controlled conditions. The Home Office regulates it very tightly,>it inspects animal houses for standards and hygiene and ensures studies are>not done if there is an alternative.>>The law requires numbers of animal experiments to ensure we have safe>chemicals in the environment and safe medicines.>>The vast majority of experiments are done on mice or rats and most

people>consider these to be pests and put down nasty poisons for them.>>People who say we can use cells don't understand medicine. You have to test>these cells on a whole body. Animals are always the end point.>>Many medicines come from animals, such as insulin which originally came from>cows, and herceptin, which was developed from animals.>>It's a very straight forward and simple choice - if you want new medicines>that are safe and effective we have to use animals.>>I would rather a new medicine was tested on a rat than tested on my child.>Children's lives are more valuable than rats'.">>>ALISTAIR CURRIE, CAMPAIGN DIRECTOR FOR THE BRITISH UNION FOR THE ABOLITION>OF VIVISECTION>>>>>"The prime minister is rightly taking a tough line on extremists, but he is>not looking at the problems of animal

testing.>>He is mixing the two up. The fact is that the public overall are very>confused about animal experimentation. They are in favour of medical>progress but they are against the suffering of animals.>>Before this government came to power, animal testing was going down. Now>they are ignoring the fact that it is on the rise.>>Essentially animal experimentation causes great suffering to millions of>animals in the UK, but doesn't produce the benefits to humans.>>The drugs which are used in the UK have been tested on animals but that>doesn't mean they needed to be. This is a technology that is decades old.>>We can use computer modelling, human tissue cells in the lab, and>well-designed studies on human volunteers. All of these things will tell us>what happens on humans, unlike animal studies - which don't.>>There is a conservatism in

government and science that says 'we should keep>using the old methods'.>>Ninety per cent of drugs that have been animal tested fail in human>studies - they never actually make it onto the market, because they don't>work.>>So the government is backing a system that fails.>>It is legal in this country to poison an animal to death, to inflict brain>damage on it and surgically manipulate it. Mice given cancer are suffering>severe pain and distress. Rats that are asphyxiated to death are suffering>profoundly.>>The animal is small but the suffering is great.">>>>http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4769749.stm>>>>>To send an email to - >

[Guest guest]

one example of overprogrammed humans is

those scientist who inject

human genes into a grain of rice,

and the ones that I recently read

in which they make a new kind of pig

by inserting the dna of omega three fatty acids,

 

in other words, people can't say that bacon has bad fats.

with this new kind of pig, bacon will have a good fat.

 

also, human/animal chymeras etc, etc,.

 

the brains of these scientist may be highly evolved but the part of

the brain that is responsible for moral responsibility or sensitivity

needs some catching up to do.

 

 

I speak from experience.

 

my cousin married a Russian Nuclear Physicist and Proffesor, from

Columbia U, 30 years old.

and of course, I love to hang out and speak to him and his

group of fellow scientisit and friends....

 

well these people have trememdously high IQ's, and travel all over

the world giving lectures on the lastest science theories.

 

but guess what their cHristmas dinner was. yep,

a slaughtered goose....

 

 

 

, " Colin Sky " <colinsky wrote:

>

> hi peter...

>

> probably the world will be a lot better off when our minds are

reduced to the same capacity as insects...

>

> or else it's roll on science... keep those clever bombs and poisons

rolling off production lines... oh great! now insert amazing shit

into seeds and into our gene pools! oh fantastic. who needs enemies

when we have bright bastards like over-programmed humans?

>

> all we will then need is a military dictatorship for the cherry on

the top.

>

> regards

>

> col.

[Guest guest]

Hi Colin

 

>perhaps it's not even money... eg. rich against rich..... but man against man. ego against ego. power against power.

 

Well money is just a method of creating power and control....

 

BB

Peter

[Guest guest]

yeah science without compassion is best left alone. however science combined with compassion is the stuff of miracles...

 

-

Anouk Sickler

Monday, May 22, 2006 4:24 AM

Re: i like prince charles. he would be a thoughtful man to ask?

one example of overprogrammed humans is those scientist who injecthuman genes into a grain of rice,and the ones that I recently read in which they make a new kind of pigby inserting the dna of omega three fatty acids,in other words, people can't say that bacon has bad fats.with this new kind of pig, bacon will have a good fat. also, human/animal chymeras etc, etc,.the brains of these scientist may be highly evolved but the part ofthe brain that is responsible for moral responsibility or sensitivityneeds some catching up to do. I speak from experience. my cousin married a Russian Nuclear Physicist and Proffesor, fromColumbia U, 30 years old. and of course, I love to hang out and speak to him and his group of fellow scientisit and friends....well these people have trememdously high IQ's, and travel all over the world giving lectures on the lastest science theories. but guess what their cHristmas dinner was. yep, a slaughtered goose.... , "Colin Sky" <colinsky wrote:>> hi peter... > > probably the world will be a lot better off when our minds arereduced to the same capacity as insects... > > or else it's roll on science... keep those clever bombs and poisonsrolling off production lines... oh great! now insert amazing shitinto seeds and into our gene pools! oh fantastic. who needs enemieswhen we have bright bastards like over-programmed humans?> > all we will then need is a military dictatorship for the cherry onthe top.> > regards> > col.

[Guest guest]

hi peter... money is also a crooked measurement of worth....

 

-

Peter

Monday, May 22, 2006 7:30 AM

Re: i like prince charles. he would be a thoughtful man to ask?

 

Hi Colin

 

>perhaps it's not even money... eg. rich against rich..... but man against man. ego against ego. power against power.

 

Well money is just a method of creating power and control....

 

BB

Peter