Guest guest Posted January 8, 2007 Report Share Posted January 8, 2007 I was wondering what many of you do to ensure that you're getting enough protein. That seems to be all I hear from those who do not support my choice to go vegan. I'm wondering if the body truly needs as much protein as we've been led to think. I don't trust mainstream information concerning diet issues. Any thoughts? Blessings, *mona Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 8, 2007 Report Share Posted January 8, 2007 Hi *Mona I think it's a good idea to consider protein. There is protein in every food, but I make sure I have a selection of nuts and seeds, lentils or beans, tofu, etc. every day. Jo - " *mona " <ahnochirah Monday, January 08, 2007 3:09 PM About Protein? > I was wondering what many of you do to ensure that you're getting > enough protein. That seems to be all I hear from those who do not > support my choice to go vegan. I'm wondering if the body truly needs > as much protein as we've been led to think. I don't trust mainstream > information concerning diet issues. Any thoughts? > > Blessings, > *mona > > > > > To send an email to - > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 8, 2007 Report Share Posted January 8, 2007 *sigh* The great Protein Debate strikes again. Its funny how the most health educated people can suddenly question us on our protein intake the minute the word "vegetarian" is uttered. In fact, the average person eats far too much protein. Those who question protein intake should consider why there is such an increase in fiber additives and fiber-enriched foods... all that darn protein is binding everyone up. OK, off my soap box to answer the question. Eating a typical, balanced vegetarian or vegan diet will be more than enough to ensure enough protein. The recommended daily intake is 120 grams for a 2000 calorie diet. To give an example of vegetarian and vegan options with protein: A typical slice of bread has from 10 to 14 grams of protein. Average mass-market cereals contain 9 to 15 grams of protein. Tofu averages 30 to 50 grams of protein per serving. Pasta contains about 4 grams of protein. A typical piece of fruit does contain a bit under a gram of protein. Raisins, peaches and prunes are highest in protein. Peanuts are a protein powerhouse with an average of 24 grams, but all nuts are high-protein. Broccoli, cabbage, cauliflower, leeks, mushrooms, peas, and more all contain between 2 to 5 grams of protein. With these numbers, its easy to see how quickly we could reach our daily intake for protein. The bigger concern I've heard from vegans is calcium, but even that is easily met in a balanced diet. Next time your choices are questioned you could let them know that numerous studies have linked high-protein diets with increased cancers... particularly colon, rectal and prostate cancers. High protein often correlates with high cholesterol... the leading cause of heart attacks. The average male (non vegan) eats about double their recommended protein allowance and the average female eats one and a half times their recommended. Or, you could be more straight-forward... "If you don't want to die from cancer or heart attack, you would do well to do some research before you question my diet." I'll admit to having said this when a particularly annoying coworker sat and bugged me while I ate my lunch... as he chowed down on a greasy, meat-laden pizza. Peculiar Dragon Peculiar Veg*n Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons for you are crunchy and taste good with catsup. *mona <ahnochirah Sent: Monday, January 8, 2007 9:09:41 AM About Protein? I was wondering what many of you do to ensure that you're getting enough protein. That seems to be all I hear from those who do not support my choice to go vegan. I'm wondering if the body truly needs as much protein as we've been led to think. I don't trust mainstream information concerning diet issues. Any thoughts?Blessings,*mona Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 8, 2007 Report Share Posted January 8, 2007 Proteins are large molecules made from smaller units called amino acids. There are twenty amino acids commonly found in both plant and animal proteins. There are generally considered to be eight amino acids that the body cannot make itself which need to be obtained from the food we eat. These are isoleucine, leucine, lysine, methionine, phenylalanine, threonine, tryptophan and valine. Infants additionally need food sources of histidine and possibly taurine. Proteins are necessary for maintaining tissues and for sustaining growth. They are also used to make hormones and other physiologically active substances. Protein Requirements [1] Experts are still not entirely sure how much protein we need and estimates have been revised often in recent years. The national and international organisations which advise on nutrient requirements suggest standards which are calculated to meet or exceed the requirements of practically everyone in the population. They take into account individual variation and so the levels have a wide inbuilt safety margin. The recommendations below are based on the complete digestibility of milk or egg protein. Since protein from plant sources may be slightly less digestible, the UK's Department of Health recommends that vegetarians and vegans multiply the above figures by a factor of 1.1. The UK Reference Nutrient Intakes (RNI*) for protein are as follows: Type of person Amounts Required (g/day) Infants/Children 0-12 months 12.5-14.9 1-3 yrs 14.50 4-10 yrs 19.7-28.3 Boys 11-14 yrs 42.1 15-18 yrs 55.2 Girls 11-14 yrs 41.2 15-18yrs 45 Men 19-50 yrs 55.5 50+ yrs 53.3 Women 19-50 yrs 45 50 + yrs 46.5 During pregnancy extra 6g/day Breast feeding 0-6mths extra 11g/day Breast feeding 6+ mths extra 8g/day The RNI is a daily amount that is enough or more than enough for 97% of people. The RNI is similar to the Recommended Daily Amount used previously in the UK. The US Recommended Dietary Allowances introduced in 1989 are similar to the UK values. Vegan Sources of Protein The foods which commonly supply the most protein in a vegan diet are pulses (peas, beans, lentils, soya products), grains (wheat, oats, rice, barley, buckwheat, millet, pasta, bread), nuts (brazils, hazels, almonds, cashews) and seeds (sunflower, pumpkin, sesame). Examples of amounts of foods providing 10g of protein Type of food Quantity providing 10g protein (g) Soya flour 24 Peanuts 39 Pumpkin seeds 41 Almonds 47 Brazil Nuts 50 Sunflower seeds 51 Sesame seeds 55 Hazel Nuts 71 Wholemeal bread 95 Whole lentils dried & boiled 114 Chickpeas dried & boiled 119 Kidney beans dried & boiled 119 Wholemeal spaghetti boiled 213 Brown rice boiled 385 Are Plant Proteins Second Class Citizens? No, certainly not! Nutritionists once believed that plant proteins were of a poorer quality than animal proteins. And even now plant proteins are sometimes called 'second class' proteins whilst animal proteins are elevated to the 'first class' department. This belief centred on early research on the poor laboratory rat which showed that giving extra amino acids of weanling rats reared on a plant-protein diet improved their growth. The same was assumed to be true for humans. However, the parameters of the experiments were set in such a way that differences in the quality of plant and animal proteins were exaggerated. Also, rats and humans have different nutritional requirements, since weanling rats grow at a much faster rate, relatively, than human infants and therefore need more protein. A comparison of rat and human milk makes the difference quite clear: protein comprises only 7% of the calorie content of human milk, while rat milk contains 20% protein. If weanling rats were fed only human milk, they would not thrive. These tests over-estimated the value of some animal proteins while under-estimating the value of some vegetable proteins and The World Health Organisation has now abandoned this inadequate method of assessing the value of proteins to the human body. Protein Combining - Is It Necessary? No, it really isn't necessary! Research on laboratory rats also led to the misleading theory of protein combining. [2] Protein combining has unfortunately gained momentum over the years. It was based on the idea that complementary protein foods with different limiting amino acids, such as beans and grains, should be eaten at each meal in order to enhance the availability of amino acids. Proteins in foods have a distinctive pattern, being higher in some amino acids and lower in others. For many years the quality of a protein reflected its amino acid pattern and was measured against the protein in a hen's egg which counted as 100%. By this method, in each protein the amino acid furthest below the standard reference is known as the limiting amino acid. This is not necessarily the one present in the lowest absolute amount but the one present in the lowest proportion compared to protein in a hen's egg! In most grains and seeds, the limiting amino acid is lysine, while in most pulses it is methionine. Tryptophan is the limiting amino acid in corn (maize), and in beef it is methionine. Although each food has a limiting amino acid, most foods have all amino acids in adequate amounts for human health. Even vegetarians are sometimes advised to combine vegetable proteins with dairy foods. This advice is now very old fashioned. Protein combining may reduce the amount of protein required to keep the body in positive protein balance but several human studies have indicated that this is neither necessary nor even always the case. Diets based solely on plant foods easily supply the recommended amounts of all the indispensable amino acids, and protein combining at each meal is unnecessary. Soya protein is actually equivalent in biological value to animal protein. Protein - Too Much of a Good Thing? Studies show that vegan diets provide the ideal amounts of protein recommended by the World Health Organisation and by the UK's Department of Health. On the other hand, many omnivores eat more protein than guidelines recommend and this may have disadvantages for their health. Excessive protein consumption may be associated with health risks. Kidney function can be compromised by too much protein in older people and in patients with kidney disease; also, a high protein intake may adversely affect calcium balance and contribute to mineral loss from bone. The Office of Population Censuses and Surveys 1990 survey of British adults [3] showed that average protein intakes are 84g/day for men and 64g/day for women which are higher than recommended, Different types of dietary protein may have differing effects on cholesterol and fats in the bloodstream. Greater hormonal responses resulted in a meal derived from casein (milk) than from soya beans. This suggests that milk protein leads to higher levels of cholesterol and fats in the blood. These, in turn, are risk factors for coronary heart disease. A survey of 620 women in Singapore revealed that, among pre-menopausal women, those who regularly ate soya protein and soya products in general had about half the normal risk of developing breast cancer. In contrast, the consumption of red meat and animal protein was linked with an increased risk of breast cancer in pre-menopausal women. Diets rich in meat protein lead to more uric acid in the urine, and a general increase in urine acidity. because of the acidity, the uric acid does not easily dissolve and can form into kidney stones. Is there Enough Protein for Growing Children? Children's over-riding nutritional need is for energy rather than protein per se. As long as children's energy needs are being met they will thrive on a diet in which protein is available from a mixture of plant foods. Infants and children reared on a varied vegan diet obtain adequate protein and energy, and are healthy and grow normally. Although they tend to be of lighter build than omnivore children they are within the normal ranges for height and weight. Regular consumption of suitably-prepared high-energy foods, such as grains, pulses and nuts, with smaller amounts of bulky, less energy-dense fruits and vegetables, will ensure a satisfactory intake of protein and energy. There have been only two recent reports of protein and/or Calorie malnutrition in infants reared by vegan parents on a vegan diet, and these were due to over-dilution or inadequate variety of weaning foods. Other published cases of protein and energy deficiency in infants given alternative diets involved restrictive macrobiotic or fruitarian regimes, or dietary limitations imposed by non-vegan parents for perceived health reasons. Further Details For more details on vegan nutrition see Plant Based Nutrition and Health by Stephen Walsh. This book is the most comprehensive survey of scientific research on vegan diets. It is ideal for vegans, would-be vegans and health care professionals*mona <ahnochirah wrote: I was wondering what many of you do to ensure that you're getting enough protein. That seems to be all I hear from those who do not support my choice to go vegan. I'm wondering if the body truly needs as much protein as we've been led to think. I don't trust mainstream information concerning diet issues. Any thoughts?Blessings,*monaPeter H All new Mail "The new Interface is stunning in its simplicity and ease of use." - PC Magazine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 8, 2007 Report Share Posted January 8, 2007 Thanks so much Jo and Toni. I think it will be easier than I first thought. I read that the International protein standard is only 37g for men and 29g for women. I may find the middle ground between the US standards and International standards and go from there. Peace and blessings, *mona , Toni <peculiardragon wrote: > > *sigh* The great Protein Debate strikes again. Its funny how the most health educated people can suddenly question us on our protein intake the minute the word " vegetarian " is uttered. In fact, the average person eats far too much protein. Those who question protein intake should consider why there is such an increase in fiber additives and fiber-enriched foods... all that darn protein is binding everyone up. > > OK, off my soap box to answer the question. Eating a typical, balanced vegetarian or vegan diet will be more than enough to ensure enough protein. The recommended daily intake is 120 grams for a 2000 calorie diet. To give an example of vegetarian and vegan options with protein: > A typical slice of bread has from 10 to 14 grams of protein. > Average mass-market cereals contain 9 to 15 grams of protein. > Tofu averages 30 to 50 grams of protein per serving. > Pasta contains about 4 grams of protein. > A typical piece of fruit does contain a bit under a gram of protein. Raisins, peaches and prunes are highest in protein. > Peanuts are a protein powerhouse with an average of 24 grams, but all nuts are high-protein. > Broccoli, cabbage, cauliflower, leeks, mushrooms, peas, and more all contain between 2 to 5 grams of protein. > With these numbers, its easy to see how quickly we could reach our daily intake for protein. The bigger concern I've heard from vegans is calcium, but even that is easily met in a balanced diet. > > Next time your choices are questioned you could let them know that numerous studies have linked high-protein diets with increased cancers... particularly colon, rectal and prostate cancers. High protein often correlates with high cholesterol... the leading cause of heart attacks. The average male (non vegan) eats about double their recommended protein allowance and the average female eats one and a half times their recommended. > > Or, you could be more straight-forward... " If you don't want to die from cancer or heart attack, you would do well to do some research before you question my diet. " I'll admit to having said this when a particularly annoying coworker sat and bugged me while I ate my lunch... as he chowed down on a greasy, meat-laden pizza. > > Peculiar Dragon Peculiar Veg*n > Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons for you are crunchy and taste good with catsup. > > > > > > *mona <ahnochirah > > Monday, January 8, 2007 9:09:41 AM > About Protein? > > I was wondering what many of you do to ensure that you're getting > enough protein. That seems to be all I hear from those who do not > support my choice to go vegan. I'm wondering if the body truly needs > as much protein as we've been led to think. I don't trust mainstream > information concerning diet issues. Any thoughts? > > Blessings, > *mona > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 8, 2007 Report Share Posted January 8, 2007 Hi Mona > I was wondering what many of you do to ensure that you're getting > enough protein. That seems to be all I hear from those who do not > support my choice to go vegan. I'm wondering if the body truly needs > as much protein as we've been led to think. I don't trust mainstream > information concerning diet issues. Any thoughts? It's a question that does get thrown at vegans a lot, and I don't really understand why, since it's not exactly hard to get protein. My standard response is " I eat " . Oddly enough, I rarely get asked where I get my vitamin B12 or vitamin D, which are something that is far easier to miss. BB Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 8, 2007 Report Share Posted January 8, 2007 Hi *Mona, I think you will find The Vegan Society Web Site useful for any nutritional information you may want. Link below: http://www.vegansociety.com/html/food/nutrition/protein.php Teresa - *mona Monday, January 08, 2007 3:09 PM About Protein? I was wondering what many of you do to ensure that you're getting enough protein. That seems to be all I hear from those who do not support my choice to go vegan. I'm wondering if the body truly needs as much protein as we've been led to think. I don't trust mainstream information concerning diet issues. Any thoughts?Blessings,*mona Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 8, 2007 Report Share Posted January 8, 2007 Yes, this is helpful Geraldine, thank you. Actually the number they mentioned for my age group is the number that I had decided on before going to the site. Blessings, *mona Geraldine wrote: > > Hi *Mona, > > I think you will find The Vegan Society Web Site useful for any nutritional information you may want. Link below: > > http://www.vegansociety.com/html/food/nutrition/protein.php > > Teresa > > > - > *mona > > Monday, January 08, 2007 3:09 PM > About Protein? > > > I was wondering what many of you do to ensure that you're getting > enough protein. That seems to be all I hear from those who do not > support my choice to go vegan. I'm wondering if the body truly needs > as much protein as we've been led to think. I don't trust mainstream > information concerning diet issues. Any thoughts? > > Blessings, > *mona > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 8, 2007 Report Share Posted January 8, 2007 hi mona, no one has ever died from lack of protein. it is not a vitamin like C. amino acids the building blocks of protein are found in everything. Indeed people who get protein from cows are getting these amino acids through a second hand source, the cow. While people who eat the plants get them from the First hand source, the plant. one of the reasons that meat eaters love to lay this about protein is that they need to justify some sort of reason on why the need to continue eating meat. they believe that this is their valid reason. protein builds muscle. blah, blah I have also come across people that ask me where do I get my iron? and, that they were once vegetarian, but had to stop because of anemia. This is another myth. -anouk , " *mona " <ahnochirah wrote: > > I was wondering what many of you do to ensure that you're getting > enough protein. That seems to be all I hear from those who do not > support my choice to go vegan. I'm wondering if the body truly needs > as much protein as we've been led to think. I don't trust mainstream > information concerning diet issues. Any thoughts? > > Blessings, > *mona > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 8, 2007 Report Share Posted January 8, 2007 good answers/info!! may I use what you said when I am questioned too? , Toni <peculiardragon wrote: > > *sigh* The great Protein Debate strikes again. Its funny how the most health educated people can suddenly question us on our protein intake the minute the word " vegetarian " is uttered. In fact, the average person eats far too much protein. Those who question protein intake should consider why there is such an increase in fiber additives and fiber-enriched foods... all that darn protein is binding everyone up. > > OK, off my soap box to answer the question. Eating a typical, balanced vegetarian or vegan diet will be more than enough to ensure enough protein. The recommended daily intake is 120 grams for a 2000 calorie diet. To give an example of vegetarian and vegan options with protein: > A typical slice of bread has from 10 to 14 grams of protein. > Average mass-market cereals contain 9 to 15 grams of protein. > Tofu averages 30 to 50 grams of protein per serving. > Pasta contains about 4 grams of protein. > A typical piece of fruit does contain a bit under a gram of protein. Raisins, peaches and prunes are highest in protein. > Peanuts are a protein powerhouse with an average of 24 grams, but all nuts are high-protein. > Broccoli, cabbage, cauliflower, leeks, mushrooms, peas, and more all contain between 2 to 5 grams of protein. > With these numbers, its easy to see how quickly we could reach our daily intake for protein. The bigger concern I've heard from vegans is calcium, but even that is easily met in a balanced diet. > > Next time your choices are questioned you could let them know that numerous studies have linked high-protein diets with increased cancers... particularly colon, rectal and prostate cancers. High protein often correlates with high cholesterol... the leading cause of heart attacks. The average male (non vegan) eats about double their recommended protein allowance and the average female eats one and a half times their recommended. > > Or, you could be more straight-forward... " If you don't want to die from cancer or heart attack, you would do well to do some research before you question my diet. " I'll admit to having said this when a particularly annoying coworker sat and bugged me while I ate my lunch... as he chowed down on a greasy, meat-laden pizza. > > Peculiar Dragon Peculiar Veg*n > Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons for you are crunchy and taste good with catsup. > > > > > > *mona <ahnochirah > > Monday, January 8, 2007 9:09:41 AM > About Protein? > > I was wondering what many of you do to ensure that you're getting > enough protein. That seems to be all I hear from those who do not > support my choice to go vegan. I'm wondering if the body truly needs > as much protein as we've been led to think. I don't trust mainstream > information concerning diet issues. Any thoughts? > > Blessings, > *mona > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 8, 2007 Report Share Posted January 8, 2007 to put it bluntly and simply EVERYTHING has protein..... people, especially in the US, think we need hordes of protein to survive but, too much protein makes a mess of the body, acidifies the blood, etc. if you are worried about protein intake..then beans and soy all have bushels of protein... heck, even brocolli has it don't sweat it...protein is in everything you eat... fraggle >*mona <ahnochirah >Jan 8, 2007 7:09 AM > > About Protein? > >I was wondering what many of you do to ensure that you're getting >enough protein. That seems to be all I hear from those who do not >support my choice to go vegan. I'm wondering if the body truly needs >as much protein as we've been led to think. I don't trust mainstream >information concerning diet issues. Any thoughts? > >Blessings, >*mona > > > > >To send an email to - > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 8, 2007 Report Share Posted January 8, 2007 Jo, Fraggle, et al., could you please remove me from the list asap? I've attempted to though - a couple of times, but it hasn't worked. Thanks for your help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 8, 2007 Report Share Posted January 8, 2007 Thank you. Feel free to use it however you wish! Peculiar Dragon Peculiar Veg*n Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons for you are crunchy and taste good with catsup. flower child <zurumato Sent: Monday, January 8, 2007 2:45:57 PM Re: About Protein? good answers/info! !may I use what you said when I am questioned too? .. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 I think you're right anouk. The folks making such a big deal to me about it became very defensive about their reasons NOT to stop eating meat. It's like they feel personally challenged when they find out that I'm vegan and I'm not trying to be confrontational at all. Thanks for your input anouk! *mona , " flower child " <zurumato wrote: > > hi mona, > > no one has ever died from lack of protein. > it is not a vitamin like C. > > amino acids the building blocks of protein are found in everything. > > Indeed people who get protein from cows are getting these > amino acids through a second hand source, the cow. > > While people who eat the plants get them from the First hand source, > the plant. > > one of the reasons that meat eaters love to lay this about protein > is that they need to justify some sort of reason on why > the need to continue eating meat. > > they believe that this is their valid reason. > protein builds muscle. blah, blah > > I have also come across people that ask me where do I get my iron? > and, that they were once vegetarian, but had to stop > because of anemia. > This is another myth. > > -anouk > > , " *mona " <ahnochirah@> wrote: > > > > I was wondering what many of you do to ensure that you're getting > > enough protein. That seems to be all I hear from those who do not > > support my choice to go vegan. I'm wondering if the body truly needs > > as much protein as we've been led to think. I don't trust mainstream > > information concerning diet issues. Any thoughts? > > > > Blessings, > > *mona > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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