Guest guest Posted February 14, 2007 Report Share Posted February 14, 2007 , yarrow wrote: Thanks for all the replies. People's motivation for their dislike of vegans is clearly complicated. From what people have said here and my own thoughts I can see that there is great pressure to conform to a " normal " diet. I think the passion that some vegans have for the issues behind their diet choice does put off their less morally consistent carnivore and even vegetarian friends. Vegans can be seen as as everything from just smug and uptight to dangerous animal rights nutters. It seems to me that veganism is generally seen as a kind of puritanism. Vegetarianism is losing its " crank " status but going vegan seems to be considered just a step too far. However, I am not totally despondent. For years animal rights and veganism have been closely linked in the public mind. It is a major reason in my own decision to cut out eggs and dairy as well as meat from my own diet. However I think that looming climate crisis which is making many people look at their lifestyle choices may, just may, cause people to consider veganism in a less hostile light. It is what solidified my own decision to go vegan. Does anyone else agree that the general re-evaluation of lifestyle that climate change is bringing might help make veganism more acceptable/popular as a way of life? > > It's an issue that hits close to the bone, especially for people who > like animals and who are not (yet) veg*n. Carol Adams has a book, > Living among meat-eaters, that gives good advice on when and how to > share information. > > Holly Near, after years of political activism, figured out that it's > a waste of time to try to reach everyone. Visualizing everyone as > being on layers of an onion, she said the best use of her time was to > see herself as communicating with those who were at the layers just > above and just below her own level. (Something like that.) > > Oh, but that wasn't your question. I too have noticed a sort of > " backlash " against vegans, particularly in environmental groups, both > in person and online. Perhaps the backlashers have met a particularly > obnoxious person, and the only thing that registered was " vegan, " so > now their mental image of vegans is " obnoxious. " Or maybe they're on > the brink themselves, and being defensive, because they think it'd be > too hard to change their lives. Or they've been reading some of the > backlash websites that tell stories of people who were vegan, got > really sick, ate meat and got well, and now spend all their time > proselytizing against the " dangerous " vegans and vegan diet (to be > clear, I'd question what kind of vegan diet they ate; sounds to me > like it was quite lacking in nutrients, just as their diatribes are > lacking in facts). > > I've even seen this in person, at a group at a sort of environmental > group that was discussing ways to communicate with people who have > opposing viewpoints. One exercise put the vegetarians in the center, > talking about their reasons for being veg, and then the nonvegs were > in the center, talking about their perceptions about vegetarians. I > was shocked to hear all the misinformation, and at how angry the > nonvegs were at vegans. > > Maybe it's a little of " how dare you make me think about something as > basic as food, which I thought was a given " and a little of " oh, > aren't you the self-righteous one, following all the nutrition > guidelines. " I've noticed that I've reacted to this a bit > unconsciously, over the years, by eating more chocolate and desserts! > (as if to say, see, I can have fun, even if I do like carrots better > than cake). Really, if you've been brought up eating meat, veganism > is a rejection of mom's cooking, sunday dinner, etc. Some of my > relatives ate meat 3 times a day and often said " you can't live > without meat. " (planting the seeds of a challenge...) > > When I became vegetarian more than 30 years ago, I did a lot of > research first, which made me realize that if everything I'd learned > about something as basic as food and eating wasn't true, then I had > to question *everything* I'd ever learned. But becoming vegan 13 > years later was easy -- I just stopped buying cheese. It seems that > today, with so much more info about what constitutes a healthy diet > in the news, it wouldn't be quite that big a leap, but it still is > because we live in a meat-eating culture, and the rebuttal info is > everywhere too. > > My compromise, over the years, has been to talk more about the > benefits of fruits and vegetables and promote gardening. If someone > asks, I tell them I'm vegan, but I don't say more than that unless > they ask for more. I never could stomach the slaughterhouse photos > that are a staple at any vegan celebration, so I don't pass those > kinds of flyers around. > > > >After being a veggie for many years. I finally came to the conclusion > >that lacto-ovo vegetarianism was not as ethical as I had thought and > >realised that I had to bite the bullet and go vegan. > > > >To me, veganism makes sense for all sorts of reasons - you know the > >ones : health, global warming, animal rights etc. > > > >Nobody I've talked too about it has been supportive. And it's not > >because I've been preachy - honest. > > > >Why is meat-eating such a sensitive issue for lots of people? > > > >Any seasoned vegans got any advice? > > > >vsuk > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 14, 2007 Report Share Posted February 14, 2007 I think it will have that effect. Jo >> Does anyone else agree that the general re-evaluation of lifestyle > that climate change is bringing might help make veganism more > acceptable/popular as a way of life? > > > > It's an issue that hits close to the bone, especially for people who > > like animals and who are not (yet) veg*n. Carol Adams has a book, > > Living among meat-eaters, that gives good advice on when and how to > > share information. > > > > Holly Near, after years of political activism, figured out that it's > > a waste of time to try to reach everyone. Visualizing everyone as > > being on layers of an onion, she said the best use of her time was to > > see herself as communicating with those who were at the layers just > > above and just below her own level. (Something like that.) > > > > Oh, but that wasn't your question. I too have noticed a sort of > > " backlash " against vegans, particularly in environmental groups, both > > in person and online. Perhaps the backlashers have met a particularly > > obnoxious person, and the only thing that registered was " vegan, " so > > now their mental image of vegans is " obnoxious. " Or maybe they're on > > the brink themselves, and being defensive, because they think it'd be > > too hard to change their lives. Or they've been reading some of the > > backlash websites that tell stories of people who were vegan, got > > really sick, ate meat and got well, and now spend all their time > > proselytizing against the " dangerous " vegans and vegan diet (to be > > clear, I'd question what kind of vegan diet they ate; sounds to me > > like it was quite lacking in nutrients, just as their diatribes are > > lacking in facts). > > > > I've even seen this in person, at a group at a sort of environmental > > group that was discussing ways to communicate with people who have > > opposing viewpoints. One exercise put the vegetarians in the center, > > talking about their reasons for being veg, and then the nonvegs were > > in the center, talking about their perceptions about vegetarians. I > > was shocked to hear all the misinformation, and at how angry the > > nonvegs were at vegans. > > > > Maybe it's a little of " how dare you make me think about something as > > basic as food, which I thought was a given " and a little of " oh, > > aren't you the self-righteous one, following all the nutrition > > guidelines. " I've noticed that I've reacted to this a bit > > unconsciously, over the years, by eating more chocolate and desserts! > > (as if to say, see, I can have fun, even if I do like carrots better > > than cake). Really, if you've been brought up eating meat, veganism > > is a rejection of mom's cooking, sunday dinner, etc. Some of my > > relatives ate meat 3 times a day and often said " you can't live > > without meat. " (planting the seeds of a challenge...) > > > > When I became vegetarian more than 30 years ago, I did a lot of > > research first, which made me realize that if everything I'd learned > > about something as basic as food and eating wasn't true, then I had > > to question *everything* I'd ever learned. But becoming vegan 13 > > years later was easy -- I just stopped buying cheese. It seems that > > today, with so much more info about what constitutes a healthy diet > > in the news, it wouldn't be quite that big a leap, but it still is > > because we live in a meat-eating culture, and the rebuttal info is > > everywhere too. > > > > My compromise, over the years, has been to talk more about the > > benefits of fruits and vegetables and promote gardening. If someone > > asks, I tell them I'm vegan, but I don't say more than that unless > > they ask for more. I never could stomach the slaughterhouse photos > > that are a staple at any vegan celebration, so I don't pass those > > kinds of flyers around. > > > > > > >After being a veggie for many years. I finally came to the conclusion > > >that lacto-ovo vegetarianism was not as ethical as I had thought and > > >realised that I had to bite the bullet and go vegan. > > > > > >To me, veganism makes sense for all sorts of reasons - you know the > > >ones : health, global warming, animal rights etc. > > > > > >Nobody I've talked too about it has been supportive. And it's not > > >because I've been preachy - honest. > > > > > >Why is meat-eating such a sensitive issue for lots of people? > > > > > >Any seasoned vegans got any advice? > > > > > >vsuk > > > > > > > To send an email to - > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 14, 2007 Report Share Posted February 14, 2007 - jo Wednesday, February 14, 2007 8:24 PM Re: Re: Why do so many people hate vegans? I think it will have that effect.Jo>> Does anyone else agree that the general re-evaluation of lifestyle> that climate change is bringing might help make veganism more> acceptable/popular as a way of life? ~ YES YES YES ~ CLIMATE CHANGE WILL HOPEFULLY MAKE PEOPLE SEE THAT THE ONLY WAY TO AVOID CATASTRPHE IS CHANGE TO A NON ANIMAL DIET ~ HOPEFULLY IN TIME ~ NEWS NIGHT HAD A DOCUMENTARY ABOUT THAT VERY ISSUE ~ HOW A VEGAN DIET CAN HALF THE CO2 PRODUCED BY HUMAN LIFESTYLE> > > > > > > > >> > It's an issue that hits close to the bone, especially for people who > > like animals and who are not (yet) veg*n. Carol Adams has a book, > > Living among meat-eaters, that gives good advice on when and how to > > share information.> > > > Holly Near, after years of political activism, figured out that it's > > a waste of time to try to reach everyone. Visualizing everyone as > > being on layers of an onion, she said the best use of her time was to > > see herself as communicating with those who were at the layers just > > above and just below her own level. (Something like that.)> > > > Oh, but that wasn't your question. I too have noticed a sort of > > "backlash" against vegans, particularly in environmental groups, both > > in person and online. Perhaps the backlashers have met a particularly > > obnoxious person, and the only thing that registered was "vegan," so > > now their mental image of vegans is "obnoxious." Or maybe they're on > > the brink themselves, and being defensive, because they think it'd be > > too hard to change their lives. Or they've been reading some of the > > backlash websites that tell stories of people who were vegan, got > > really sick, ate meat and got well, and now spend all their time > > proselytizing against the "dangerous" vegans and vegan diet (to be > > clear, I'd question what kind of vegan diet they ate; sounds to me > > like it was quite lacking in nutrients, just as their diatribes are > > lacking in facts).> > > > I've even seen this in person, at a group at a sort of environmental > > group that was discussing ways to communicate with people who have > > opposing viewpoints. One exercise put the vegetarians in the center, > > talking about their reasons for being veg, and then the nonvegs were > > in the center, talking about their perceptions about vegetarians. I > > was shocked to hear all the misinformation, and at how angry the > > nonvegs were at vegans.> > > > Maybe it's a little of "how dare you make me think about something as > > basic as food, which I thought was a given" and a little of "oh, > > aren't you the self-righteous one, following all the nutrition > > guidelines." I've noticed that I've reacted to this a bit > > unconsciously, over the years, by eating more chocolate and desserts! > > (as if to say, see, I can have fun, even if I do like carrots better > > than cake). Really, if you've been brought up eating meat, veganism > > is a rejection of mom's cooking, sunday dinner, etc. Some of my > > relatives ate meat 3 times a day and often said "you can't live > > without meat." (planting the seeds of a challenge...)> > > > When I became vegetarian more than 30 years ago, I did a lot of > > research first, which made me realize that if everything I'd learned > > about something as basic as food and eating wasn't true, then I had > > to question *everything* I'd ever learned. But becoming vegan 13 > > years later was easy -- I just stopped buying cheese. It seems that > > today, with so much more info about what constitutes a healthy diet > > in the news, it wouldn't be quite that big a leap, but it still is > > because we live in a meat-eating culture, and the rebuttal info is > > everywhere too.> > > > My compromise, over the years, has been to talk more about the > > benefits of fruits and vegetables and promote gardening. If someone > > asks, I tell them I'm vegan, but I don't say more than that unless > > they ask for more. I never could stomach the slaughterhouse photos > > that are a staple at any vegan celebration, so I don't pass those > > kinds of flyers around.> > > > > > >After being a veggie for many years. I finally came to the conclusion> > >that lacto-ovo vegetarianism was not as ethical as I had thought and> > >realised that I had to bite the bullet and go vegan.> > >> > >To me, veganism makes sense for all sorts of reasons - you know the> > >ones : health, global warming, animal rights etc.> > >> > >Nobody I've talked too about it has been supportive. And it's not> > >because I've been preachy - honest.> > >> > >Why is meat-eating such a sensitive issue for lots of people?> > >> > >Any seasoned vegans got any advice?> > >> > >vsuk> >> > > > > To send an email to - > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 14, 2007 Report Share Posted February 14, 2007 - vsuk2007 Wednesday, February 14, 2007 8:18 AM Re: Why do so many people hate vegans? , yarrow wrote:Thanks for all the replies.People's motivation for their dislike of vegans is clearlycomplicated. From what people have said here and my own thoughts I cansee that there is great pressure to conform to a "normal" diet.I think the passion that some vegans have for the issues behind theirdiet choice does put off their less morally consistent carnivore andeven vegetarian friends. Vegans can be seen as as everything from justsmug and uptight to dangerous animal rights nutters. It seems to me that veganism is generally seen as a kind ofpuritanism. Vegetarianism is losing its "crank" status but going veganseems to be considered just a step too far.However, I am not totally despondent. For years animal rights andveganism have been closely linked in the public mind. It is a majorreason in my own decision to cut out eggs and dairy as well as meatfrom my own diet. However I think that looming climate crisis which ismaking many people look at their lifestyle choices may, just may,cause people to consider veganism in a less hostile light ~ TOTALLY IN AGREEMENT HERE ~ I THINK THAT PEOPLE WILL ADOPT THE VEGAN DIET BECAUSE OF THE CLIMATE CHANGE THING ~ CLIMATE CHANGE IS CRAP ~ BUT ATLEAST ITS CHANGING OMNIVORSE MINDS ABOUT THERE DIET AND HOW IF THEY CHANGE IT ~ THEY CAN HELP THE PLANET AS A WHOLE ~. It is whatsolidified my own decision to go vegan.Does anyone else agree that the general re-evaluation of lifestylethat climate change is bringing might help make veganism moreacceptable/popular as a way of life?>> It's an issue that hits close to the bone, especially for people who > like animals and who are not (yet) veg*n. Carol Adams has a book, > Living among meat-eaters, that gives good advice on when and how to > share information.> > Holly Near, after years of political activism, figured out that it's > a waste of time to try to reach everyone. Visualizing everyone as > being on layers of an onion, she said the best use of her time was to > see herself as communicating with those who were at the layers just > above and just below her own level. (Something like that.)> > Oh, but that wasn't your question. I too have noticed a sort of > "backlash" against vegans, particularly in environmental groups, both > in person and online. Perhaps the backlashers have met a particularly > obnoxious person, and the only thing that registered was "vegan," so > now their mental image of vegans is "obnoxious." Or maybe they're on > the brink themselves, and being defensive, because they think it'd be > too hard to change their lives. Or they've been reading some of the > backlash websites that tell stories of people who were vegan, got > really sick, ate meat and got well, and now spend all their time > proselytizing against the "dangerous" vegans and vegan diet (to be > clear, I'd question what kind of vegan diet they ate; sounds to me > like it was quite lacking in nutrients, just as their diatribes are > lacking in facts).> > I've even seen this in person, at a group at a sort of environmental > group that was discussing ways to communicate with people who have > opposing viewpoints. One exercise put the vegetarians in the center, > talking about their reasons for being veg, and then the nonvegs were > in the center, talking about their perceptions about vegetarians. I > was shocked to hear all the misinformation, and at how angry the > nonvegs were at vegans.> > Maybe it's a little of "how dare you make me think about something as > basic as food, which I thought was a given" and a little of "oh, > aren't you the self-righteous one, following all the nutrition > guidelines." I've noticed that I've reacted to this a bit > unconsciously, over the years, by eating more chocolate and desserts! > (as if to say, see, I can have fun, even if I do like carrots better > than cake). Really, if you've been brought up eating meat, veganism > is a rejection of mom's cooking, sunday dinner, etc. Some of my > relatives ate meat 3 times a day and often said "you can't live > without meat." (planting the seeds of a challenge...)> > When I became vegetarian more than 30 years ago, I did a lot of > research first, which made me realize that if everything I'd learned > about something as basic as food and eating wasn't true, then I had > to question *everything* I'd ever learned. But becoming vegan 13 > years later was easy -- I just stopped buying cheese. It seems that > today, with so much more info about what constitutes a healthy diet > in the news, it wouldn't be quite that big a leap, but it still is > because we live in a meat-eating culture, and the rebuttal info is > everywhere too.> > My compromise, over the years, has been to talk more about the > benefits of fruits and vegetables and promote gardening. If someone > asks, I tell them I'm vegan, but I don't say more than that unless > they ask for more. I never could stomach the slaughterhouse photos > that are a staple at any vegan celebration, so I don't pass those > kinds of flyers around.> > > >After being a veggie for many years. I finally came to the conclusion> >that lacto-ovo vegetarianism was not as ethical as I had thought and> >realised that I had to bite the bullet and go vegan.> >> >To me, veganism makes sense for all sorts of reasons - you know the> >ones : health, global warming, animal rights etc.> >> >Nobody I've talked too about it has been supportive. And it's not> >because I've been preachy - honest.> >> >Why is meat-eating such a sensitive issue for lots of people?> >> >Any seasoned vegans got any advice?> >> >vsuk> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 15, 2007 Report Share Posted February 15, 2007 I dont think that climate change will effect people into makign them turn to ceganism. People are ignorant, in general, and are too afraid fo change. Even now they know things bad are happenign and arent even rushign to make a big enough change in their lives to effect it any. People are just lazy and do what they are used to. They do what si easiest. People dont worry about others, they worry about themselves and how they can get by, they dont care about the other person. Its sad and as long as people have this type of attitude, nothing is going to change for the better. , " jo " <jo.heartwork wrote: > > I think it will have that effect. > > Jo > > >> Does anyone else agree that the general re-evaluation of lifestyle > > that climate change is bringing might help make veganism more > > acceptable/popular as a way of life? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It's an issue that hits close to the bone, especially for people who > > > like animals and who are not (yet) veg*n. Carol Adams has a book, > > > Living among meat-eaters, that gives good advice on when and how to > > > share information. > > > > > > Holly Near, after years of political activism, figured out that it's > > > a waste of time to try to reach everyone. Visualizing everyone as > > > being on layers of an onion, she said the best use of her time was to > > > see herself as communicating with those who were at the layers just > > > above and just below her own level. (Something like that.) > > > > > > Oh, but that wasn't your question. I too have noticed a sort of > > > " backlash " against vegans, particularly in environmental groups, both > > > in person and online. Perhaps the backlashers have met a particularly > > > obnoxious person, and the only thing that registered was " vegan, " so > > > now their mental image of vegans is " obnoxious. " Or maybe they're on > > > the brink themselves, and being defensive, because they think it'd be > > > too hard to change their lives. Or they've been reading some of the > > > backlash websites that tell stories of people who were vegan, got > > > really sick, ate meat and got well, and now spend all their time > > > proselytizing against the " dangerous " vegans and vegan diet (to be > > > clear, I'd question what kind of vegan diet they ate; sounds to me > > > like it was quite lacking in nutrients, just as their diatribes are > > > lacking in facts). > > > > > > I've even seen this in person, at a group at a sort of environmental > > > group that was discussing ways to communicate with people who have > > > opposing viewpoints. One exercise put the vegetarians in the center, > > > talking about their reasons for being veg, and then the nonvegs were > > > in the center, talking about their perceptions about vegetarians. I > > > was shocked to hear all the misinformation, and at how angry the > > > nonvegs were at vegans. > > > > > > Maybe it's a little of " how dare you make me think about something as > > > basic as food, which I thought was a given " and a little of " oh, > > > aren't you the self-righteous one, following all the nutrition > > > guidelines. " I've noticed that I've reacted to this a bit > > > unconsciously, over the years, by eating more chocolate and desserts! > > > (as if to say, see, I can have fun, even if I do like carrots better > > > than cake). Really, if you've been brought up eating meat, veganism > > > is a rejection of mom's cooking, sunday dinner, etc. Some of my > > > relatives ate meat 3 times a day and often said " you can't live > > > without meat. " (planting the seeds of a challenge...) > > > > > > When I became vegetarian more than 30 years ago, I did a lot of > > > research first, which made me realize that if everything I'd learned > > > about something as basic as food and eating wasn't true, then I had > > > to question *everything* I'd ever learned. But becoming vegan 13 > > > years later was easy -- I just stopped buying cheese. It seems that > > > today, with so much more info about what constitutes a healthy diet > > > in the news, it wouldn't be quite that big a leap, but it still is > > > because we live in a meat-eating culture, and the rebuttal info is > > > everywhere too. > > > > > > My compromise, over the years, has been to talk more about the > > > benefits of fruits and vegetables and promote gardening. If someone > > > asks, I tell them I'm vegan, but I don't say more than that unless > > > they ask for more. I never could stomach the slaughterhouse photos > > > that are a staple at any vegan celebration, so I don't pass those > > > kinds of flyers around. > > > > > > > > > >After being a veggie for many years. I finally came to the conclusion > > > >that lacto-ovo vegetarianism was not as ethical as I had thought and > > > >realised that I had to bite the bullet and go vegan. > > > > > > > >To me, veganism makes sense for all sorts of reasons - you know the > > > >ones : health, global warming, animal rights etc. > > > > > > > >Nobody I've talked too about it has been supportive. And it's not > > > >because I've been preachy - honest. > > > > > > > >Why is meat-eating such a sensitive issue for lots of people? > > > > > > > >Any seasoned vegans got any advice? > > > > > > > >vsuk > > > > > > > > > > > > > To send an email to - > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 15, 2007 Report Share Posted February 15, 2007 I think some of that is true but I don't feel people are " ignorant in general " . My friends and associates are highly intelligent people who simply lack information about the impact of the SAD on the environment. These friends will declare to care about the environment and have made other adjustments; they drive fuel efficient cars, carpool, and ask for paper instead of plastic bags at the grocery store. They need this put to them in a way that becomes meaningful to THEM. It's the emotion that welled up in me when seeing the PETA footage that ignited change. It became meaningful to me to DO something, anything in opposition to what I witnessed. I've been in St. Pete all week for a conference and every night a large group of us go out to eat. " I " become the focus, if only for the brief moment, when ordering and aside from them poking fun of me a little, they really WANT to know why I chose this lifestyle. I don't preach to them, I calmly educate them about my personal commitment to stop stripping away our natural resources with a diet that is counterproductive and detrimental to the environment. Usually this brings up conversation about global warming and alternative fuels; that's just fine with me. At least the seed is planted and they've met someone who doesn't feel this lifestyle is a burden. I believe that change in the right direction is beginning and I'm optimistic about where that's going to take us. *mona , " angelikfiona " <angelik_kitty_kat wrote: > > I dont think that climate change will effect people into makign them > turn to ceganism. > > > People are ignorant, in general, and are too afraid fo change. > > > Even now they know things bad are happenign and arent even rushign to > make a big enough change in their lives to effect it any. > > > People are just lazy and do what they are used to. > > > They do what si easiest. > > > People dont worry about others, they worry about themselves and how > they can get by, they dont care about the other person. > > > Its sad and as long as people have this type of attitude, nothing is > going to change for the better. > > > > > , " jo " <jo.heartwork@> wrote: > > > > I think it will have that effect. > > > > Jo > > > > >> Does anyone else agree that the general re-evaluation of > lifestyle > > > that climate change is bringing might help make veganism more > > > acceptable/popular as a way of life? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It's an issue that hits close to the bone, especially for > people who > > > > like animals and who are not (yet) veg*n. Carol Adams has a > book, > > > > Living among meat-eaters, that gives good advice on when and > how to > > > > share information. > > > > > > > > Holly Near, after years of political activism, figured out that > it's > > > > a waste of time to try to reach everyone. Visualizing everyone > as > > > > being on layers of an onion, she said the best use of her time > was to > > > > see herself as communicating with those who were at the layers > just > > > > above and just below her own level. (Something like that.) > > > > > > > > Oh, but that wasn't your question. I too have noticed a sort of > > > > " backlash " against vegans, particularly in environmental > groups, both > > > > in person and online. Perhaps the backlashers have met a > particularly > > > > obnoxious person, and the only thing that registered > was " vegan, " so > > > > now their mental image of vegans is " obnoxious. " Or maybe > they're on > > > > the brink themselves, and being defensive, because they think > it'd be > > > > too hard to change their lives. Or they've been reading some of > the > > > > backlash websites that tell stories of people who were vegan, > got > > > > really sick, ate meat and got well, and now spend all their > time > > > > proselytizing against the " dangerous " vegans and vegan diet > (to be > > > > clear, I'd question what kind of vegan diet they ate; sounds to > me > > > > like it was quite lacking in nutrients, just as their diatribes > are > > > > lacking in facts). > > > > > > > > I've even seen this in person, at a group at a sort of > environmental > > > > group that was discussing ways to communicate with people who > have > > > > opposing viewpoints. One exercise put the vegetarians in the > center, > > > > talking about their reasons for being veg, and then the nonvegs > were > > > > in the center, talking about their perceptions about > vegetarians. I > > > > was shocked to hear all the misinformation, and at how angry > the > > > > nonvegs were at vegans. > > > > > > > > Maybe it's a little of " how dare you make me think about > something as > > > > basic as food, which I thought was a given " and a little > of " oh, > > > > aren't you the self-righteous one, following all the nutrition > > > > guidelines. " I've noticed that I've reacted to this a bit > > > > unconsciously, over the years, by eating more chocolate and > desserts! > > > > (as if to say, see, I can have fun, even if I do like carrots > better > > > > than cake). Really, if you've been brought up eating meat, > veganism > > > > is a rejection of mom's cooking, sunday dinner, etc. Some of my > > > > relatives ate meat 3 times a day and often said " you can't live > > > > without meat. " (planting the seeds of a challenge...) > > > > > > > > When I became vegetarian more than 30 years ago, I did a lot of > > > > research first, which made me realize that if everything I'd > learned > > > > about something as basic as food and eating wasn't true, then I > had > > > > to question *everything* I'd ever learned. But becoming vegan > 13 > > > > years later was easy -- I just stopped buying cheese. It seems > that > > > > today, with so much more info about what constitutes a healthy > diet > > > > in the news, it wouldn't be quite that big a leap, but it still > is > > > > because we live in a meat-eating culture, and the rebuttal info > is > > > > everywhere too. > > > > > > > > My compromise, over the years, has been to talk more about the > > > > benefits of fruits and vegetables and promote gardening. If > someone > > > > asks, I tell them I'm vegan, but I don't say more than that > unless > > > > they ask for more. I never could stomach the slaughterhouse > photos > > > > that are a staple at any vegan celebration, so I don't pass > those > > > > kinds of flyers around. > > > > > > > > > > > > >After being a veggie for many years. I finally came to the > conclusion > > > > >that lacto-ovo vegetarianism was not as ethical as I had > thought and > > > > >realised that I had to bite the bullet and go vegan. > > > > > > > > > >To me, veganism makes sense for all sorts of reasons - you > know the > > > > >ones : health, global warming, animal rights etc. > > > > > > > > > >Nobody I've talked too about it has been supportive. And it's > not > > > > >because I've been preachy - honest. > > > > > > > > > >Why is meat-eating such a sensitive issue for lots of people? > > > > > > > > > >Any seasoned vegans got any advice? > > > > > > > > > >vsuk > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To send an email to - > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 15, 2007 Report Share Posted February 15, 2007 sounds like one of my old posts hhahahahahah >angelikfiona <angelik_kitty_kat >Feb 15, 2007 5:52 AM > > Re: Why do so many people hate vegans? > >I dont think that climate change will effect people into makign them >turn to ceganism. > > >People are ignorant, in general, and are too afraid fo change. > > >Even now they know things bad are happenign and arent even rushign to >make a big enough change in their lives to effect it any. > > >People are just lazy and do what they are used to. > > >They do what si easiest. > > >People dont worry about others, they worry about themselves and how >they can get by, they dont care about the other person. > > >Its sad and as long as people have this type of attitude, nothing is >going to change for the better. > > > > > , " jo " <jo.heartwork wrote: >> >> I think it will have that effect. >> >> Jo >> >> >> Does anyone else agree that the general re-evaluation of >lifestyle >> > that climate change is bringing might help make veganism more >> > acceptable/popular as a way of life? >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > >> > > It's an issue that hits close to the bone, especially for >people who >> > > like animals and who are not (yet) veg*n. Carol Adams has a >book, >> > > Living among meat-eaters, that gives good advice on when and >how to >> > > share information. >> > > >> > > Holly Near, after years of political activism, figured out that >it's >> > > a waste of time to try to reach everyone. Visualizing everyone >as >> > > being on layers of an onion, she said the best use of her time >was to >> > > see herself as communicating with those who were at the layers >just >> > > above and just below her own level. (Something like that.) >> > > >> > > Oh, but that wasn't your question. I too have noticed a sort of >> > > " backlash " against vegans, particularly in environmental >groups, both >> > > in person and online. Perhaps the backlashers have met a >particularly >> > > obnoxious person, and the only thing that registered >was " vegan, " so >> > > now their mental image of vegans is " obnoxious. " Or maybe >they're on >> > > the brink themselves, and being defensive, because they think >it'd be >> > > too hard to change their lives. Or they've been reading some of >the >> > > backlash websites that tell stories of people who were vegan, >got >> > > really sick, ate meat and got well, and now spend all their >time >> > > proselytizing against the " dangerous " vegans and vegan diet >(to be >> > > clear, I'd question what kind of vegan diet they ate; sounds to >me >> > > like it was quite lacking in nutrients, just as their diatribes >are >> > > lacking in facts). >> > > >> > > I've even seen this in person, at a group at a sort of >environmental >> > > group that was discussing ways to communicate with people who >have >> > > opposing viewpoints. One exercise put the vegetarians in the >center, >> > > talking about their reasons for being veg, and then the nonvegs >were >> > > in the center, talking about their perceptions about >vegetarians. I >> > > was shocked to hear all the misinformation, and at how angry >the >> > > nonvegs were at vegans. >> > > >> > > Maybe it's a little of " how dare you make me think about >something as >> > > basic as food, which I thought was a given " and a little >of " oh, >> > > aren't you the self-righteous one, following all the nutrition >> > > guidelines. " I've noticed that I've reacted to this a bit >> > > unconsciously, over the years, by eating more chocolate and >desserts! >> > > (as if to say, see, I can have fun, even if I do like carrots >better >> > > than cake). Really, if you've been brought up eating meat, >veganism >> > > is a rejection of mom's cooking, sunday dinner, etc. Some of my >> > > relatives ate meat 3 times a day and often said " you can't live >> > > without meat. " (planting the seeds of a challenge...) >> > > >> > > When I became vegetarian more than 30 years ago, I did a lot of >> > > research first, which made me realize that if everything I'd >learned >> > > about something as basic as food and eating wasn't true, then I >had >> > > to question *everything* I'd ever learned. But becoming vegan >13 >> > > years later was easy -- I just stopped buying cheese. It seems >that >> > > today, with so much more info about what constitutes a healthy >diet >> > > in the news, it wouldn't be quite that big a leap, but it still >is >> > > because we live in a meat-eating culture, and the rebuttal info >is >> > > everywhere too. >> > > >> > > My compromise, over the years, has been to talk more about the >> > > benefits of fruits and vegetables and promote gardening. If >someone >> > > asks, I tell them I'm vegan, but I don't say more than that >unless >> > > they ask for more. I never could stomach the slaughterhouse >photos >> > > that are a staple at any vegan celebration, so I don't pass >those >> > > kinds of flyers around. >> > > >> > > >> > > >After being a veggie for many years. I finally came to the >conclusion >> > > >that lacto-ovo vegetarianism was not as ethical as I had >thought and >> > > >realised that I had to bite the bullet and go vegan. >> > > > >> > > >To me, veganism makes sense for all sorts of reasons - you >know the >> > > >ones : health, global warming, animal rights etc. >> > > > >> > > >Nobody I've talked too about it has been supportive. And it's >not >> > > >because I've been preachy - honest. >> > > > >> > > >Why is meat-eating such a sensitive issue for lots of people? >> > > > >> > > >Any seasoned vegans got any advice? >> > > > >> > > >vsuk >> > > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > To send an email to - > >> > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 16, 2007 Report Share Posted February 16, 2007 I tend to choose the wrong wording for things, what you said is what I meant. Alot of people choose not to know tho. They simply dotn care. It might be because of where you live tho, I live in Vegas and altho there are alot of Vegans and Environmentalists here, the majority of this town are stuck up people that just dotn care abotu anybody but themselves. PETA footage has changed my opnions on things many times, they're so powerful and moving. It was actually because of PETA footage I became Vegetarian and then Vegan int he first place, it truly opens up your mind and eyes into realizing what really is going on in our world. , " *mona " <ahnochirah wrote: > > I think some of that is true but I don't feel people are " ignorant > in general " . My friends and associates are highly intelligent people > who simply lack information about the impact of the SAD on the > environment. These friends will declare to care about the > environment and have made other adjustments; they drive fuel > efficient cars, carpool, and ask for paper instead of plastic bags > at the grocery store. They need this put to them in a way that > becomes meaningful to THEM. It's the emotion that welled up in me > when seeing the PETA footage that ignited change. It became > meaningful to me to DO something, anything in opposition to what I > witnessed. > > I've been in St. Pete all week for a conference and every night a > large group of us go out to eat. " I " become the focus, if only for > the brief moment, when ordering and aside from them poking fun of me > a little, they really WANT to know why I chose this lifestyle. I > don't preach to them, I calmly educate them about my personal > commitment to stop stripping away our natural resources with a diet > that is counterproductive and detrimental to the environment. > Usually this brings up conversation about global warming and > alternative fuels; that's just fine with me. At least the seed is > planted and they've met someone who doesn't feel this lifestyle is a > burden. > > I believe that change in the right direction is beginning and I'm > optimistic about where that's going to take us. > > *mona > , " angelikfiona " > <angelik_kitty_kat@> wrote: > > > > I dont think that climate change will effect people into makign > them > > turn to ceganism. > > > > > > People are ignorant, in general, and are too afraid fo change. > > > > > > Even now they know things bad are happenign and arent even rushign > to > > make a big enough change in their lives to effect it any. > > > > > > People are just lazy and do what they are used to. > > > > > > They do what si easiest. > > > > > > People dont worry about others, they worry about themselves and > how > > they can get by, they dont care about the other person. > > > > > > Its sad and as long as people have this type of attitude, nothing > is > > going to change for the better. > > > > > > > > > > , " jo " <jo.heartwork@> wrote: > > > > > > I think it will have that effect. > > > > > > Jo > > > > > > >> Does anyone else agree that the general re-evaluation of > > lifestyle > > > > that climate change is bringing might help make veganism more > > > > acceptable/popular as a way of life? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It's an issue that hits close to the bone, especially for > > people who > > > > > like animals and who are not (yet) veg*n. Carol Adams has a > > book, > > > > > Living among meat-eaters, that gives good advice on when and > > how to > > > > > share information. > > > > > > > > > > Holly Near, after years of political activism, figured out > that > > it's > > > > > a waste of time to try to reach everyone. Visualizing > everyone > > as > > > > > being on layers of an onion, she said the best use of her > time > > was to > > > > > see herself as communicating with those who were at the > layers > > just > > > > > above and just below her own level. (Something like that.) > > > > > > > > > > Oh, but that wasn't your question. I too have noticed a sort > of > > > > > " backlash " against vegans, particularly in environmental > > groups, both > > > > > in person and online. Perhaps the backlashers have met a > > particularly > > > > > obnoxious person, and the only thing that registered > > was " vegan, " so > > > > > now their mental image of vegans is " obnoxious. " Or maybe > > they're on > > > > > the brink themselves, and being defensive, because they > think > > it'd be > > > > > too hard to change their lives. Or they've been reading some > of > > the > > > > > backlash websites that tell stories of people who were > vegan, > > got > > > > > really sick, ate meat and got well, and now spend all their > > time > > > > > proselytizing against the " dangerous " vegans and vegan diet > > (to be > > > > > clear, I'd question what kind of vegan diet they ate; sounds > to > > me > > > > > like it was quite lacking in nutrients, just as their > diatribes > > are > > > > > lacking in facts). > > > > > > > > > > I've even seen this in person, at a group at a sort of > > environmental > > > > > group that was discussing ways to communicate with people > who > > have > > > > > opposing viewpoints. One exercise put the vegetarians in the > > center, > > > > > talking about their reasons for being veg, and then the > nonvegs > > were > > > > > in the center, talking about their perceptions about > > vegetarians. I > > > > > was shocked to hear all the misinformation, and at how angry > > the > > > > > nonvegs were at vegans. > > > > > > > > > > Maybe it's a little of " how dare you make me think about > > something as > > > > > basic as food, which I thought was a given " and a little > > of " oh, > > > > > aren't you the self-righteous one, following all the > nutrition > > > > > guidelines. " I've noticed that I've reacted to this a bit > > > > > unconsciously, over the years, by eating more chocolate and > > desserts! > > > > > (as if to say, see, I can have fun, even if I do like > carrots > > better > > > > > than cake). Really, if you've been brought up eating meat, > > veganism > > > > > is a rejection of mom's cooking, sunday dinner, etc. Some of > my > > > > > relatives ate meat 3 times a day and often said " you can't > live > > > > > without meat. " (planting the seeds of a challenge...) > > > > > > > > > > When I became vegetarian more than 30 years ago, I did a lot > of > > > > > research first, which made me realize that if everything I'd > > learned > > > > > about something as basic as food and eating wasn't true, > then I > > had > > > > > to question *everything* I'd ever learned. But becoming > vegan > > 13 > > > > > years later was easy -- I just stopped buying cheese. It > seems > > that > > > > > today, with so much more info about what constitutes a > healthy > > diet > > > > > in the news, it wouldn't be quite that big a leap, but it > still > > is > > > > > because we live in a meat-eating culture, and the rebuttal > info > > is > > > > > everywhere too. > > > > > > > > > > My compromise, over the years, has been to talk more about > the > > > > > benefits of fruits and vegetables and promote gardening. If > > someone > > > > > asks, I tell them I'm vegan, but I don't say more than that > > unless > > > > > they ask for more. I never could stomach the slaughterhouse > > photos > > > > > that are a staple at any vegan celebration, so I don't pass > > those > > > > > kinds of flyers around. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >After being a veggie for many years. I finally came to the > > conclusion > > > > > >that lacto-ovo vegetarianism was not as ethical as I had > > thought and > > > > > >realised that I had to bite the bullet and go vegan. > > > > > > > > > > > >To me, veganism makes sense for all sorts of reasons - you > > know the > > > > > >ones : health, global warming, animal rights etc. > > > > > > > > > > > >Nobody I've talked too about it has been supportive. And > it's > > not > > > > > >because I've been preachy - honest. > > > > > > > > > > > >Why is meat-eating such a sensitive issue for lots of > people? > > > > > > > > > > > >Any seasoned vegans got any advice? > > > > > > > > > > > >vsuk > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To send an email to - > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 16, 2007 Report Share Posted February 16, 2007 I also agree that vegetarianism is more acceptable in a warming world. This year GLOBAL WARMING is going to be the main issue in the News... and in speculating some can propose vegetarianism Silasjo <jo.heartwork escreveu: I think it will have that effect.Jo>> Does anyone else agree that the general re-evaluation of lifestyle> that climate change is bringing might help make veganism more> acceptable/popular as a way of life?> > > > > > > > >> > It's an issue that hits close to the bone, especially for people who > > like animals and who are not (yet) veg*n. Carol Adams has a book, > > Living among meat-eaters, that gives good advice on when and how to > > share information.> > > > Holly Near, after years of political activism, figured out that it's > > a waste of time to try to reach everyone. Visualizing everyone as > > being on layers of an onion, she said the best use of her time was to > > see herself as communicating with those who were at the layers just > > above and just below her own level. (Something like that.)> > > > Oh, but that wasn't your question. I too have noticed a sort of > > "backlash" against vegans, particularly in environmental groups, both > > in person and online. Perhaps the backlashers have met a particularly > > obnoxious person, and the only thing that registered was "vegan," so > > now their mental image of vegans is "obnoxious." Or maybe they're on > > the brink themselves, and being defensive, because they think it'd be > > too hard to change their lives. Or they've been reading some of the > > backlash websites that tell stories of people who were vegan, got > > really sick, ate meat and got well, and now spend all their time > > proselytizing against the "dangerous" vegans and vegan diet (to be > > clear, I'd question what kind of vegan diet they ate; sounds to me > > like it was quite lacking in nutrients, just as their diatribes are > > lacking in facts).> > > > I've even seen this in person, at a group at a sort of environmental > > group that was discussing ways to communicate with people who have > > opposing viewpoints. One exercise put the vegetarians in the center, > > talking about their reasons for being veg, and then the nonvegs were > > in the center, talking about their perceptions about vegetarians. I > > was shocked to hear all the misinformation, and at how angry the > > nonvegs were at vegans.> > > > Maybe it's a little of "how dare you make me think about something as > > basic as food, which I thought was a given" and a little of "oh, > > aren't you the self-righteous one, following all the nutrition > > guidelines." I've noticed that I've reacted to this a bit > > unconsciously, over the years, by eating more chocolate and desserts! > > (as if to say, see, I can have fun, even if I do like carrots better > > than cake). Really, if you've been brought up eating meat, veganism > > is a rejection of mom's cooking, sunday dinner, etc. Some of my > > relatives ate meat 3 times a day and often said "you can't live > > without meat." (planting the seeds of a challenge...)> > > > When I became vegetarian more than 30 years ago, I did a lot of > > research first, which made me realize that if everything I'd learned > > about something as basic as food and eating wasn't true, then I had > > to question *everything* I'd ever learned. But becoming vegan 13 > > years later was easy -- I just stopped buying cheese. It seems that > > today, with so much more info about what constitutes a healthy diet > > in the news, it wouldn't be quite that big a leap, but it still is > > because we live in a meat-eating culture, and the rebuttal info is > > everywhere too.> > > > My compromise, over the years, has been to talk more about the > > benefits of fruits and vegetables and promote gardening. If someone > > asks, I tell them I'm vegan, but I don't say more than that unless > > they ask for more. I never could stomach the slaughterhouse photos > > that are a staple at any vegan celebration, so I don't pass those > > kinds of flyers around.> > > > > > >After being a veggie for many years. I finally came to the conclusion> > >that lacto-ovo vegetarianism was not as ethical as I had thought and> > >realised that I had to bite the bullet and go vegan.> > >> > >To me, veganism makes sense for all sorts of reasons - you know the> > >ones : health, global warming, animal rights etc.> > >> > >Nobody I've talked too about it has been supportive. And it's not> > >because I've been preachy - honest.> > >> > >Why is meat-eating such a sensitive issue for lots of people?> > >> > >Any seasoned vegans got any advice?> > >> > >vsuk> >> > > > > To send an email to - > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 16, 2007 Report Share Posted February 16, 2007 i would to this but im not lo becos no seems to understand my replys ( you know who you ) Silas Cordeiro-Pascoal <cordeiropascoal wrote: I also agree that vegetarianism is more acceptable in a warming world. This year GLOBAL WARMING is going to be the main issue in the News... and in speculating some can propose vegetarianism Silasjo <jo.heartwork > escreveu: I think it will have that effect.Jo>> Does anyone else agree that the general re-evaluation of lifestyle> that climate change is bringing might help make veganism more> acceptable/popular as a way of life?> > > > > > > > >> > It's an issue that hits close to the bone, especially for people who > > like animals and who are not (yet) veg*n. Carol Adams has a book, > > Living among meat-eaters, that gives good advice on when and how to > > share information.> > > > Holly Near, after years of political activism, figured out that it's > > a waste of time to try to reach everyone. Visualizing everyone as > > being on layers of an onion, she said the best use of her time was to > > see herself as communicating with those who were at the layers just > > above and just below her own level. (Something like that.)> > > > Oh, but that wasn't your question. I too have noticed a sort of > > "backlash" against vegans, particularly in environmental groups, both > > in person and online. Perhaps the backlashers have met a particularly > > obnoxious person, and the only thing that registered was "vegan," so > > now their mental image of vegans is "obnoxious." Or maybe they're on > > the brink themselves, and being defensive, because they think it'd be > > too hard to change their lives. Or they've been reading some of the > > backlash websites that tell stories of people who were vegan, got > > really sick, ate meat and got well, and now spend all their time > > proselytizing against the "dangerous" vegans and vegan diet (to be > > clear, I'd question what kind of vegan diet they ate; sounds to me > > like it was quite lacking in nutrients, just as their diatribes are > > lacking in facts).> > > > I've even seen this in person, at a group at a sort of environmental > > group that was discussing ways to communicate with people who have > > opposing viewpoints. One exercise put the vegetarians in the center, > > talking about their reasons for being veg, and then the nonvegs were > > in the center, talking about their perceptions about vegetarians. I > > was shocked to hear all the misinformation, and at how angry the > > nonvegs were at vegans.> > > > Maybe it's a little of "how dare you make me think about something as > > basic as food, which I thought was a given" and a little of "oh, > > aren't you the self-righteous one, following all the nutrition > > guidelines." I've noticed that I've reacted to this a bit > > unconsciously, over the years, by eating more chocolate and desserts! > > (as if to say, see, I can have fun, even if I do like carrots better > > than cake). Really, if you've been brought up eating meat, veganism > > is a rejection of mom's cooking, sunday dinner, etc. Some of my > > relatives ate meat 3 times a day and often said "you can't live > > without meat." (planting the seeds of a challenge...)> > > > When I became vegetarian more than 30 years ago, I did a lot of > > research first, which made me realize that if everything I'd learned > > about something as basic as food and eating wasn't true, then I had > > to question *everything* I'd ever learned. But becoming vegan 13 > > years later was easy -- I just stopped buying cheese. It seems that > > today, with so much more info about what constitutes a healthy diet > > in the news, it wouldn't be quite that big a leap, but it still is > > because we live in a meat-eating culture, and the rebuttal info is > > everywhere too.> > > > My compromise, over the years, has been to talk more about the > > benefits of fruits and vegetables and promote gardening. If someone > > asks, I tell them I'm vegan, but I don't say more than that unless > > they ask for more. I never could stomach the slaughterhouse photos > > that are a staple at any vegan celebration, so I don't pass those > > kinds of flyers around.> > > > > > >After being a veggie for many years. I finally came to the conclusion> > >that lacto-ovo vegetarianism was not as ethical as I had thought and> > >realised that I had to bite the bullet and go vegan.> > >> > >To me, veganism makes sense for all sorts of reasons - you know the> > >ones : health, global warming, animal rights etc.> > >> > >Nobody I've talked too about it has been supportive. And it's not> > >because I've been preachy - honest.> > >> > >Why is meat-eating such a sensitive issue for lots of people?> > >> > >Any seasoned vegans got any advice?> > >> > >vsuk> >> > > > > To send an email to - > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 16, 2007 Report Share Posted February 16, 2007 i would to this but im not lo becos no seems to understand my replys ( you know who you are ) Silas Cordeiro-Pascoal <cordeiropascoal wrote: I also agree that vegetarianism is more acceptable in a warming world. This year GLOBAL WARMING is going to be the main issue in the News... and in speculating some can propose vegetarianism Silasjo <jo.heartwork > escreveu: I think it will have that effect.Jo>> Does anyone else agree that the general re-evaluation of lifestyle> that climate change is bringing might help make veganism more> acceptable/popular as a way of life?> > > > > > > > >> > It's an issue that hits close to the bone, especially for people who > > like animals and who are not (yet) veg*n. Carol Adams has a book, > > Living among meat-eaters, that gives good advice on when and how to > > share information.> > > > Holly Near, after years of political activism, figured out that it's > > a waste of time to try to reach everyone. Visualizing everyone as > > being on layers of an onion, she said the best use of her time was to > > see herself as communicating with those who were at the layers just > > above and just below her own level. (Something like that.)> > > > Oh, but that wasn't your question. I too have noticed a sort of > > "backlash" against vegans, particularly in environmental groups, both > > in person and online. Perhaps the backlashers have met a particularly > > obnoxious person, and the only thing that registered was "vegan," so > > now their mental image of vegans is "obnoxious." Or maybe they're on > > the brink themselves, and being defensive, because they think it'd be > > too hard to change their lives. Or they've been reading some of the > > backlash websites that tell stories of people who were vegan, got > > really sick, ate meat and got well, and now spend all their time > > proselytizing against the "dangerous" vegans and vegan diet (to be > > clear, I'd question what kind of vegan diet they ate; sounds to me > > like it was quite lacking in nutrients, just as their diatribes are > > lacking in facts).> > > > I've even seen this in person, at a group at a sort of environmental > > group that was discussing ways to communicate with people who have > > opposing viewpoints. One exercise put the vegetarians in the center, > > talking about their reasons for being veg, and then the nonvegs were > > in the center, talking about their perceptions about vegetarians. I > > was shocked to hear all the misinformation, and at how angry the > > nonvegs were at vegans.> > > > Maybe it's a little of "how dare you make me think about something as > > basic as food, which I thought was a given" and a little of "oh, > > aren't you the self-righteous one, following all the nutrition > > guidelines." I've noticed that I've reacted to this a bit > > unconsciously, over the years, by eating more chocolate and desserts! > > (as if to say, see, I can have fun, even if I do like carrots better > > than cake). Really, if you've been brought up eating meat, veganism > > is a rejection of mom's cooking, sunday dinner, etc. Some of my > > relatives ate meat 3 times a day and often said "you can't live > > without meat." (planting the seeds of a challenge...)> > > > When I became vegetarian more than 30 years ago, I did a lot of > > research first, which made me realize that if everything I'd learned > > about something as basic as food and eating wasn't true, then I had > > to question *everything* I'd ever learned. But becoming vegan 13 > > years later was easy -- I just stopped buying cheese. It seems that > > today, with so much more info about what constitutes a healthy diet > > in the news, it wouldn't be quite that big a leap, but it still is > > because we live in a meat-eating culture, and the rebuttal info is > > everywhere too.> > > > My compromise, over the years, has been to talk more about the > > benefits of fruits and vegetables and promote gardening. If someone > > asks, I tell them I'm vegan, but I don't say more than that unless > > they ask for more. I never could stomach the slaughterhouse photos > > that are a staple at any vegan celebration, so I don't pass those > > kinds of flyers around.> > > > > > >After being a veggie for many years. I finally came to the conclusion> > >that lacto-ovo vegetarianism was not as ethical as I had thought and> > >realised that I had to bite the bullet and go vegan.> > >> > >To me, veganism makes sense for all sorts of reasons - you know the> > >ones : health, global warming, animal rights etc.> > >> > >Nobody I've talked too about it has been supportive. And it's not> > >because I've been preachy - honest.> > >> > >Why is meat-eating such a sensitive issue for lots of people?> > >> > >Any seasoned vegans got any advice?> > >> > >vsuk> >> > > > > To send an email to - > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2007 Report Share Posted February 19, 2007 we understand, just takes a while to get used to thats all.... The Valley Vegan.............louis stott <lsstott wrote: i would to this but im not lo becos no seems to understand my replys ( you know who you are ) Silas Cordeiro-Pascoal <cordeiropascoal .br> wrote: I also agree that vegetarianism is more acceptable in a warming world. This year GLOBAL WARMING is going to be the main issue in the News... and in speculating some can propose vegetarianism Silasjo <jo.heartwork > escreveu: I think it will have that effect.Jo>> Does anyone else agree that the general re-evaluation of lifestyle> that climate change is bringing might help make veganism more> acceptable/popular as a way of life?> > > > > > > > >> > It's an issue that hits close to the bone, especially for people who > > like animals and who are not (yet) veg*n. Carol Adams has a book, > > Living among meat-eaters, that gives good advice on when and how to > > share information.> > > > Holly Near, after years of political activism, figured out that it's > > a waste of time to try to reach everyone. Visualizing everyone as > > being on layers of an onion, she said the best use of her time was to > > see herself as communicating with those who were at the layers just > > above and just below her own level. (Something like that.)> > > > Oh, but that wasn't your question. I too have noticed a sort of > > "backlash" against vegans, particularly in environmental groups, both > > in person and online. Perhaps the backlashers have met a particularly > > obnoxious person, and the only thing that registered was "vegan," so > > now their mental image of vegans is "obnoxious." Or maybe they're on > > the brink themselves, and being defensive, because they think it'd be > > too hard to change their lives. Or they've been reading some of the > > backlash websites that tell stories of people who were vegan, got > > really sick, ate meat and got well, and now spend all their time > > proselytizing against the "dangerous" vegans and vegan diet (to be > > clear, I'd question what kind of vegan diet they ate; sounds to me > > like it was quite lacking in nutrients, just as their diatribes are > > lacking in facts).> > > > I've even seen this in person, at a group at a sort of environmental > > group that was discussing ways to communicate with people who have > > opposing viewpoints. One exercise put the vegetarians in the center, > > talking about their reasons for being veg, and then the nonvegs were > > in the center, talking about their perceptions about vegetarians. I > > was shocked to hear all the misinformation, and at how angry the > > nonvegs were at vegans.> > > > Maybe it's a little of "how dare you make me think about something as > > basic as food, which I thought was a given" and a little of "oh, > > aren't you the self-righteous one, following all the nutrition > > guidelines." I've noticed that I've reacted to this a bit > > unconsciously, over the years, by eating more chocolate and desserts! > > (as if to say, see, I can have fun, even if I do like carrots better > > than cake). Really, if you've been brought up eating meat, veganism > > is a rejection of mom's cooking, sunday dinner, etc. Some of my > > relatives ate meat 3 times a day and often said "you can't live > > without meat." (planting the seeds of a challenge...)> > > > When I became vegetarian more than 30 years ago, I did a lot of > > research first, which made me realize that if everything I'd learned > > about something as basic as food and eating wasn't true, then I had > > to question *everything* I'd ever learned. But becoming vegan 13 > > years later was easy -- I just stopped buying cheese. It seems that > > today, with so much more info about what constitutes a healthy diet > > in the news, it wouldn't be quite that big a leap, but it still is > > because we live in a meat-eating culture, and the rebuttal info is > > everywhere too.> > > > My compromise, over the years, has been to talk more about the > > benefits of fruits and vegetables and promote gardening. If someone > > asks, I tell them I'm vegan, but I don't say more than that unless > > they ask for more. I never could stomach the slaughterhouse photos > > that are a staple at any vegan celebration, so I don't pass those > > kinds of flyers around.> > > > > > >After being a veggie for many years. I finally came to the conclusion> > >that lacto-ovo vegetarianism was not as ethical as I had thought and> > >realised that I had to bite the bullet and go vegan.> > >> > >To me, veganism makes sense for all sorts of reasons - you know the> > >ones : health, global warming, animal rights etc.> > >> > >Nobody I've talked too about it has been supportive. And it's not> > >because I've been preachy - honest.> > >> > >Why is meat-eating such a sensitive issue for lots of people?> > >> > >Any seasoned vegans got any advice?> > >> > >vsuk> >> > > > > To send an email to - > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 20, 2007 Report Share Posted February 20, 2007 Here are some beautifully written essays that address how to counter some of the antivegan propaganda. I love her optimism and straightforwardness. http://www.compassionatecooks.com/blog/index.html Soy is Not Evil http://www.compassionatecooks.com/articles.htm Dishing out the Bull: The Rise of the Excuse-itarians Satya Magazine, October 2006 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 20, 2007 Report Share Posted February 20, 2007 Thanks for sending this; I now have another new website to add to my collection. *mona , yarrow wrote: > > Here are some beautifully written essays that address how to counter > some of the antivegan propaganda. I love her optimism and > straightforwardness. > > > http://www.compassionatecooks.com/blog/index.html > Soy is Not Evil > > http://www.compassionatecooks.com/articles.htm > Dishing out the Bull: The Rise of the Excuse-itarians > Satya Magazine, October 2006 > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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