slow germination

[Guest guest]

Just thinking out loud, having read through various e-mails in which

the topic of veg*nism has come up in one context or another recently.

I've noticed that when I *mention* the v word in nonveg milieux the

reaction is basically " shut up and go away, " probably because they

once encountered a strident veg*n and now they know what " all " vegans

are like. So how can I then persuade them that, no, we're all

individuals and I'm not inclined to proselytize but am happy to

answer questions?

 

So waaaaaay over here on this list is a discussion of who can call

themselves " vegan " and whether sheep can be pets and what's lurking

in the closet.

 

Back over on the permaculture list, any mention of the v word brings

out the ranters who proclaim that livestock are essential to any kind

of ecological world view and anyone who says otherwise is etc.

 

Then over on the sustainable living list when the notion of what to

eat and what to grow comes up, antediluvian notions of protein needs

and animal fats etc. crowd out the lone vegan voice that says, the

preponderance of research says a vegan diet is best for personal and

planetary health. People aren't going to " give up " their animal

products, they say.

 

All the way over on the alumni list, people share tips on how to

dissuade kids from going vegetarian: tell them they have to eat

vegetables! And it almost always works. And they're all worried about

getting enough protein.

 

Oh, and in the real world, nearly everyone I've known who has said

they were veg*n has turned out not to be a full-time ( " real " ) veg*n.

Of the few real veg*ns I've met, most admit they succumb to pizza or

cake at the office and find it hard to go vegan.

 

So anyway, I've learned to tread very cautiously out in the

overwhelmingly nonvegan world. On the one hand I think it's important

to say, ahem, vegans exist!, but on the other hand, I try to keep my

comments to a single sentence or so unless asked for more, and I

don't engage in fruitless to-and-fro. Planting seeds.

[Guest guest]

Hi Yarrow

 

>Oh, and in the real world, nearly everyone I've known who has said>they were veg*n has turned out not to be a full-time ( " real " ) veg*n.>Of the few real veg*ns I've met, most admit they succumb to pizza or

>cake at the office and find it hard to go vegan.

A very valid point. I have met several people who call themselves vegan, and don't even have a fully vegan diet. I think that I only know for sure that I know two fully dietary vegans apart from myself! (At least personally, I know several people on this list are full dietary vegans, but I haven't met most of you in person!)

 

 

BB

Peter

[Guest guest]

[[On the one hand I think it's important to say, ahem, vegans exist!, but on the other hand, I try to keep my comments to a single sentence or so unless asked for more, and I don't engage in fruitless to-and-fro. Planting seeds.]]

 

Does anyone bring homemade dishes to share at the office, things like that? Seems like that would speak louder than words in a lot of cases.

[Guest guest]

Yes - I've known non-vegan vegans as well - the one who has an occasional egg!!! for instance.

 

Jo

 

-

Peter Kebbell

Wednesday, May 16, 2007 9:27 AM

Re: slow germination

 

Hi Yarrow

 

>Oh, and in the real world, nearly everyone I've known who has said>they were veg*n has turned out not to be a full-time ("real") veg*n.>Of the few real veg*ns I've met, most admit they succumb to pizza or >cake at the office and find it hard to go vegan.

A very valid point. I have met several people who call themselves vegan, and don't even have a fully vegan diet. I think that I only know for sure that I know two fully dietary vegans apart from myself! (At least personally, I know several people on this list are full dietary vegans, but I haven't met most of you in person!)

 

BB

Peter

[Guest guest]

My brownies from the Sinfully Vegan book were extremely well received - lots of comments about how good they were, without the people knowing who had brought them in and that they were vegan. I've been asked to take some in again for my next birthday.

 

Jo

 

-

Oom Yaaqub

Wednesday, May 16, 2007 5:07 PM

Re: slow germination

 

 

[[On the one hand I think it's important to say, ahem, vegans exist!, but on the other hand, I try to keep my comments to a single sentence or so unless asked for more, and I don't engage in fruitless to-and-fro. Planting seeds.]]

 

Does anyone bring homemade dishes to share at the office, things like that? Seems like that would speak louder than words in a lot of cases.

[Guest guest]

yarrow wrote:

[[On the one hand I think it's important

to say, ahem, vegans exist!, but on the other hand, I try to keep

my

comments to a single sentence or so unless asked for more, and I

don't engage in fruitless to-and-fro. Planting seeds.]]

 

At 12:07 PM -0400 5/16/07, Oom Yaaqub wrote:

Does anyone bring homemade dishes to share at the office, things

like that? Seems like that would speak louder than words in a lot of

cases.

//

 

For some years I was an activist, running veg conferences and

publishing veg publications, eager to share what I was learning. But

those kinds of things are useful for people who are already interested

and need a small push to make the decision, not for people who think

veg*ns are extremists. And these days, it's easy to find veg*n info,

so I don't feel compelled to do that so much.

 

And you're right, I finally figured out that leading by example

was the most effective thing I could do. Basically, do what you can to

be seen as credible in daily life so that " vegan " is not the

first thing someone finds out about you. So when they finally do find

out, it's not, " oh no! one of those! " but rather " how

interesting! "

 

Still, I've become a little wary about bringing or sharing food

other than plain fruits and vegetables since a vegan " friend "

complained that my soup didn't have enough salt and practically spit

out her first spoonful. She knew I didn't use salt, and I provided a

salt shaker, so I thought that was so rude. (And I don't like her food

because it's oversalted!) Especially when I've grown them myself, I've

come to really appreciate the unadulterated flavors of vegetables,

with some herbs. What I perceive as wonderfully multidimensional,

apparently others perceive as bland because they're so accustomed to

the sharp single-note dissonance of oversalted and oversweetened

foods. I don't share baked goods for the same reason. I was once at a

macrobiotic dinner where I someone else tasted a cookie and

practically spit it out because it wasn't a sugar bomb. I tried it and

it was perfect, it tasted like its ingredients rather than like

sugar.

[Guest guest]

I usually once or twice a week take some cake (s) in to work and everyone who has tried them has liked them. The Valley Vegan..............jo <jo.heartwork wrote: My brownies from the Sinfully Vegan book were extremely well received - lots of comments about how good they were, without the people knowing who had brought them in and that they were vegan. I've been asked to take some in again for my next birthday. Jo - Oom Yaaqub Wednesday, May 16, 2007 5:07 PM Re: slow germination [[On the one hand I think it's important to say, ahem, vegans exist!, but on the other hand, I try to keep my comments to a single sentence or so unless asked for more, and I don't engage in

fruitless to-and-fro. Planting seeds.]] Does anyone bring homemade dishes to share at the office, things like that? Seems like that would speak louder than words in a lot of cases. Peter H

 

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[Guest guest]

hi yarrow,

 

good advice, leading by example.

I tried that on a co-worker the other,

when he asked about why I wasn't eating the

Kentucky Fried chicken,

I just told him I was vegan and walked away, without being preachy

about it.

Hopefully, he went home and researched it more.

 

-anouk

 

, yarrow wrote:

>

> yarrow wrote:

> [[On the one hand I think it's important

> to say, ahem, vegans exist!, but on the other hand, I try to keep my

> comments to a single sentence or so unless asked for more, and I

> don't engage in fruitless to-and-fro. Planting seeds.]]

>

> At 12:07 PM -0400 5/16/07, Oom Yaaqub wrote:

> Does anyone bring homemade dishes to share at the office, things like

> that? Seems like that would speak louder than words in a lot of cases.

> //

>

> For some years I was an activist, running veg conferences and

> publishing veg publications, eager to share what I was learning. But

> those kinds of things are useful for people who are already

> interested and need a small push to make the decision, not for people

> who think veg*ns are extremists. And these days, it's easy to find

> veg*n info, so I don't feel compelled to do that so much.

>

> And you're right, I finally figured out that leading by example was

> the most effective thing I could do. Basically, do what you can to be

> seen as credible in daily life so that " vegan " is not the first thing

> someone finds out about you. So when they finally do find out, it's

> not, " oh no! one of those! " but rather " how interesting! "

>

>