Coming to terms with our callousness and cruelty

[Guest guest]

Hello from Mallorca everybody!

 

I have enjoyed reading your various posts, and have both laughed and

cried at the amazing travelling cat, the mountain lions and coyotes

in the centre of californian cities, as well as gained uselful

knowledge concernign vegan recipes and campaigns.

 

Now comes the big one - how can I cope with the crushing knowledge of

the cruel and systematic abuses meted out to our food animals, not

to mention the fur trade and the casual killing of unwanted pets? And

experiemntation, and circuses...

 

I have given money to PETA, Equanimal here in Spain, have ciber

adopted a rescued hunting dog who would have been garrotted

otherwise, and have caught 3 stray cats from my garden, neutered them

and set them free - two of them females - yet am still overwhelmed

with guilt, sadness, remorse, and a huge feeling of hopelessness in

the face of the faceless meat industry.

 

I would appreciate your thoughts, as my family think I have gone mad,

hippy and extremist, so no help there. (they are right about the

extremist part, as of course it is extreme to stop eating any animla

product in today's carnivorous society).

 

Thanks to everyone , KYM

[Guest guest]

Hi Kym-

If I was you, I'd try to find like-minded humans locally. Are you in Mallorca, Spain?

There must be an animal rights activist group there.

Everyone is different. What might assuage my feelings of despair might not assuage yours.

That being said, my feelings would be assuaged if I knew I was able to influence others to give up meat, or to at least consider it.

I'd start by finding others who think like I do, and eventually find venues at which I could set up an information table to attract the curiousity of others, and perhaps others of like-mind.

 

The point being, go beyond giving money (which is also a wonderful thing to do), take action, start changing your lifestyle a bit, to surround yourself with other vegans, or at least to start FINDING other vegans in your vicinity.

 

Maybe that's not helpful to you? But that's what I would do (and have done).

Marcy

 

 

 

 

-

kymontrip

Friday, July 06, 2007 8:32 AM

Coming to terms with our callousness and cruelty

 

 

Hello from Mallorca everybody!I have enjoyed reading your various posts, and have both laughed and cried at the amazing travelling cat, the mountain lions and coyotes in the centre of californian cities, as well as gained uselful knowledge concernign vegan recipes and campaigns.Now comes the big one - how can I cope with the crushing knowledge of the cruel and systematic abuses meted out to our food animals, not to mention the fur trade and the casual killing of unwanted pets? And experiemntation, and circuses...I have given money to PETA, Equanimal here in Spain, have ciber adopted a rescued hunting dog who would have been garrotted otherwise, and have caught 3 stray cats from my garden, neutered them and set them free - two of them females - yet am still overwhelmed with guilt, sadness, remorse, and a huge feeling of hopelessness in the face of the faceless meat industry.I would appreciate your thoughts, as my family think I have gone mad, hippy and extremist, so no help there. (they are right about the extremist part, as of course it is extreme to stop eating any animla product in today's carnivorous society).Thanks to everyone , KYM

[Guest guest]

Hi KYM

 

I can't say anything that will make you feel better. You are doing what you

can, the main part being in not eating them, and not going to zoos, circuses

etc.

 

Jo

 

 

-

" kymontrip " <kymontrip

 

Friday, July 06, 2007 4:32 PM

Coming to terms with our callousness and cruelty

 

 

> Hello from Mallorca everybody!

>

> I have enjoyed reading your various posts, and have both laughed and

> cried at the amazing travelling cat, the mountain lions and coyotes

> in the centre of californian cities, as well as gained uselful

> knowledge concernign vegan recipes and campaigns.

>

> Now comes the big one - how can I cope with the crushing knowledge of

> the cruel and systematic abuses meted out to our food animals, not

> to mention the fur trade and the casual killing of unwanted pets? And

> experiemntation, and circuses...

>

> I have given money to PETA, Equanimal here in Spain, have ciber

> adopted a rescued hunting dog who would have been garrotted

> otherwise, and have caught 3 stray cats from my garden, neutered them

> and set them free - two of them females - yet am still overwhelmed

> with guilt, sadness, remorse, and a huge feeling of hopelessness in

> the face of the faceless meat industry.

>

> I would appreciate your thoughts, as my family think I have gone mad,

> hippy and extremist, so no help there. (they are right about the

> extremist part, as of course it is extreme to stop eating any animla

> product in today's carnivorous society).

>

> Thanks to everyone , KYM

>

>

>

>

>

> To send an email to -

>

[Guest guest]

welcome Kym

wish i could go to Mallorca!

 

is there a vegetarian society nearby you could join?

is there a local college/university? thats generally a good place to find like minded folks

cheers

fraggle

kymontrip Jul 6, 2007 8:32 AM Coming to terms with our callousness and cruelty

 

 

 

Hello from Mallorca everybody!I have enjoyed reading your various posts, and have both laughed and cried at the amazing travelling cat, the mountain lions and coyotes in the centre of californian cities, as well as gained uselful knowledge concernign vegan recipes and campaigns.Now comes the big one - how can I cope with the crushing knowledge of the cruel and systematic abuses meted out to our food animals, not to mention the fur trade and the casual killing of unwanted pets? And experiemntation, and circuses...I have given money to PETA, Equanimal here in Spain, have ciber adopted a rescued hunting dog who would have been garrotted otherwise, and have caught 3 stray cats from my garden, neutered them and set them free - two of them females - yet am still overwhelmed with guilt, sadness, remorse, and a huge feeling of hopelessness in the face of the faceless meat industry.I would appreciate your thoughts, as my family think I have gone mad, hippy and extremist, so no help there. (they are right about the extremist part, as of course it is extreme to stop eating any animla product in today's carnivorous society).Thanks to everyone , KYM

 

When I see the price that you pay

I don't wanna grow up

I don't ever want to be that way

I don't wanna grow up

Seems that folks turn into things

that they never want

[Guest guest]

Hi Kym

 

I cope with it by making sure I do everything I can not to be a part of it -

hence the vegan diet and lifestyle.

 

Must admit that I'm not too fond of PETA - aside from the fact that they

waste money by running huge campaigns against people who are already vegan

(such as the campaign against Judas Priest), but I find it hard to take

seriously an organisation which thinks campaigns for animals to be treated

with respect, while using methods which degrade women and treat them as

objects rather than living beings.

 

I've never heard of Equanimal, but from what you've said it sounds like they

do good work :-)

 

BB

Peter

 

-

" kymontrip " <kymontrip

 

Friday, July 06, 2007 4:32 PM

Coming to terms with our callousness and cruelty

 

 

> Hello from Mallorca everybody!

>

> I have enjoyed reading your various posts, and have both laughed and

> cried at the amazing travelling cat, the mountain lions and coyotes

> in the centre of californian cities, as well as gained uselful

> knowledge concernign vegan recipes and campaigns.

>

> Now comes the big one - how can I cope with the crushing knowledge of

> the cruel and systematic abuses meted out to our food animals, not

> to mention the fur trade and the casual killing of unwanted pets? And

> experiemntation, and circuses...

>

> I have given money to PETA, Equanimal here in Spain, have ciber

> adopted a rescued hunting dog who would have been garrotted

> otherwise, and have caught 3 stray cats from my garden, neutered them

> and set them free - two of them females - yet am still overwhelmed

> with guilt, sadness, remorse, and a huge feeling of hopelessness in

> the face of the faceless meat industry.

>

> I would appreciate your thoughts, as my family think I have gone mad,

> hippy and extremist, so no help there. (they are right about the

> extremist part, as of course it is extreme to stop eating any animla

> product in today's carnivorous society).

>

> Thanks to everyone , KYM

>

>

>

>

>

> To send an email to -

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks Marcy for your reply - whilst there are plenty

of vegetarians in Spain, there are very few vegans! On

a positive note, I am moving to the mainland soon -

near Madrid, where,as in all bigger cities, there are

at least a smattering of vegans to be found!

 

Best wishes, KYM

--- Marcy <imgreen03 wrote:

 

> Hi Kym-

> If I was you, I'd try to find like-minded humans

> locally. Are you in Mallorca, Spain?

> There must be an animal rights activist group there.

>

> Everyone is different. What might assuage my

> feelings of despair might not assuage yours.

> That being said, my feelings would be assuaged if I

> knew I was able to influence others to give up meat,

> or to at least consider it.

> I'd start by finding others who think like I do, and

> eventually find venues at which I could set up an

> information table to attract the curiousity of

> others, and perhaps others of like-mind.

>

> The point being, go beyond giving money (which is

> also a wonderful thing to do), take action, start

> changing your lifestyle a bit, to surround yourself

> with other vegans, or at least to start FINDING

> other vegans in your vicinity.

>

> Maybe that's not helpful to you? But that's what I

> would do (and have done).

> Marcy

>

>

>

> -

> kymontrip

>

> Friday, July 06, 2007 8:32 AM

> Coming to terms with our

> callousness and cruelty

>

>

> Hello from Mallorca everybody!

>

> I have enjoyed reading your various posts, and

> have both laughed and

> cried at the amazing travelling cat, the mountain

> lions and coyotes

> in the centre of californian cities, as well as

> gained uselful

> knowledge concernign vegan recipes and campaigns.

>

> Now comes the big one - how can I cope with the

> crushing knowledge of

> the cruel and systematic abuses meted out to our

> food animals, not

> to mention the fur trade and the casual killing of

> unwanted pets? And

> experiemntation, and circuses...

>

> I have given money to PETA, Equanimal here in

> Spain, have ciber

> adopted a rescued hunting dog who would have been

> garrotted

> otherwise, and have caught 3 stray cats from my

> garden, neutered them

> and set them free - two of them females - yet am

> still overwhelmed

> with guilt, sadness, remorse, and a huge feeling

> of hopelessness in

> the face of the faceless meat industry.

>

> I would appreciate your thoughts, as my family

> think I have gone mad,

> hippy and extremist, so no help there. (they are

> right about the

> extremist part, as of course it is extreme to stop

> eating any animla

> product in today's carnivorous society).

>

> Thanks to everyone , KYM

>

>

>

>

 

 

 

 

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that gives answers, not web links.

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[Guest guest]

Ola Kym, And welcome...........bet the weather is better than here in Wales! The Valley Vegan............kymontrip <kymontrip wrote: Hello from Mallorca everybody!I have enjoyed reading your various posts, and have both laughed and cried at the amazing travelling cat, the mountain lions and coyotes in the centre of californian cities, as well as gained uselful knowledge concernign vegan recipes and campaigns.Now comes the big one - how

can I cope with the crushing knowledge of the cruel and systematic abuses meted out to our food animals, not to mention the fur trade and the casual killing of unwanted pets? And experiemntation, and circuses...I have given money to PETA, Equanimal here in Spain, have ciber adopted a rescued hunting dog who would have been garrotted otherwise, and have caught 3 stray cats from my garden, neutered them and set them free - two of them females - yet am still overwhelmed with guilt, sadness, remorse, and a huge feeling of hopelessness in the face of the faceless meat industry.I would appreciate your thoughts, as my family think I have gone mad, hippy and extremist, so no help there. (they are right about the extremist part, as of course it is extreme to stop eating any animla product in today's carnivorous society).Thanks to everyone , KYM Peter H

 

All New Mail – Tired of unwanted email come-ons? Let our SpamGuard protect you.

[Guest guest]

Dear Peter,

 

I am intrigued about what you have to say about PETA.

Can you elaborate?

 

Thanks for the support, KYM

 

PS Equanimal seems to do great things, not only for

farm animals, but also organising campaigns against

Spain's biggest visible abuse of animals - bullfights

and bullruns.

 

 

 

 

--- metalscarab <metalscarab wrote:

 

> Hi Kym

>

> I cope with it by making sure I do everything I can

> not to be a part of it -

> hence the vegan diet and lifestyle.

>

> Must admit that I'm not too fond of PETA - aside

> from the fact that they

> waste money by running huge campaigns against people

> who are already vegan

> (such as the campaign against Judas Priest), but I

> find it hard to take

> seriously an organisation which thinks campaigns for

> animals to be treated

> with respect, while using methods which degrade

> women and treat them as

> objects rather than living beings.

>

> I've never heard of Equanimal, but from what you've

> said it sounds like they

> do good work :-)

>

> BB

> Peter

>

> -

> " kymontrip " <kymontrip

>

> Friday, July 06, 2007 4:32 PM

> Coming to terms with our

> callousness and cruelty

>

>

> > Hello from Mallorca everybody!

> >

> > I have enjoyed reading your various posts, and

> have both laughed and

> > cried at the amazing travelling cat, the mountain

> lions and coyotes

> > in the centre of californian cities, as well as

> gained uselful

> > knowledge concernign vegan recipes and campaigns.

> >

> > Now comes the big one - how can I cope with the

> crushing knowledge of

> > the cruel and systematic abuses meted out to our

> food animals, not

> > to mention the fur trade and the casual killing of

> unwanted pets? And

> > experiemntation, and circuses...

> >

> > I have given money to PETA, Equanimal here in

> Spain, have ciber

> > adopted a rescued hunting dog who would have been

> garrotted

> > otherwise, and have caught 3 stray cats from my

> garden, neutered them

> > and set them free - two of them females - yet am

> still overwhelmed

> > with guilt, sadness, remorse, and a huge feeling

> of hopelessness in

> > the face of the faceless meat industry.

> >

> > I would appreciate your thoughts, as my family

> think I have gone mad,

> > hippy and extremist, so no help there. (they are

> right about the

> > extremist part, as of course it is extreme to stop

> eating any animla

> > product in today's carnivorous society).

> >

> > Thanks to everyone , KYM

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > To send an email to

> -

> >

[Guest guest]

Yes, well it is very hot and sunny!

 

I used to live in Penyffordd - near Wrexham - where

are you in the green country? KYM

 

--- Peter VV <swpgh01.t21 wrote:

 

> Ola Kym,

> And welcome...........bet the weather is better

> than here in Wales!

>

> The Valley Vegan............

>

> kymontrip <kymontrip wrote:

> Hello from Mallorca everybody!

>

> I have enjoyed reading your various posts, and have

> both laughed and

> cried at the amazing travelling cat, the mountain

> lions and coyotes

> in the centre of californian cities, as well as

> gained uselful

> knowledge concernign vegan recipes and campaigns.

>

> Now comes the big one - how can I cope with the

> crushing knowledge of

> the cruel and systematic abuses meted out to our

> food animals, not

> to mention the fur trade and the casual killing of

> unwanted pets? And

> experiemntation, and circuses...

>

> I have given money to PETA, Equanimal here in Spain,

> have ciber

> adopted a rescued hunting dog who would have been

> garrotted

> otherwise, and have caught 3 stray cats from my

> garden, neutered them

> and set them free - two of them females - yet am

> still overwhelmed

> with guilt, sadness, remorse, and a huge feeling of

> hopelessness in

> the face of the faceless meat industry.

>

> I would appreciate your thoughts, as my family think

> I have gone mad,

> hippy and extremist, so no help there. (they are

> right about the

> extremist part, as of course it is extreme to stop

> eating any animla

> product in today's carnivorous society).

>

> Thanks to everyone , KYM

Peter H

>

>

>

>

> All New Mail – Tired of unwanted email

> come-ons? Let our SpamGuard protect you.

 

 

 

 

 

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[Guest guest]

Best wishes, to you Kym on your move to the big city. There's a downside to big cities, but let's all hope the up side is finding more vegans............

 

BTW-locally here (San Francisco Bay Area), we have vegan potlucks and outings to vegan or vegan-friendly restaurants. I wonder if your vegetarian friends would be intersted in rising to the challenge of a VEGAN social gathering?

 

Let us know how it goes, near Madrid.

 

Marcy

 

 

-

Kym Amps

Friday, July 06, 2007 11:09 AM

Re: Coming to terms with our callousness and cruelty

 

 

Thanks Marcy for your reply - whilst there are plentyof vegetarians in Spain, there are very few vegans! Ona positive note, I am moving to the mainland soon -near Madrid, where,as in all bigger cities, there areat least a smattering of vegans to be found!Best wishes, KYM--- Marcy <imgreen03 (AT) comcast (DOT) net> wrote:> Hi Kym-> If I was you, I'd try to find like-minded humans> locally. Are you in Mallorca, Spain? > There must be an animal rights activist group there.> > Everyone is different. What might assuage my> feelings of despair might not assuage yours. > That being said, my feelings would be assuaged if I> knew I was able to influence others to give up meat,> or to at least consider it.> I'd start by finding others who think like I do, and> eventually find venues at which I could set up an> information table to attract the curiousity of> others, and perhaps others of like-mind.> > The point being, go beyond giving money (which is> also a wonderful thing to do), take action, start> changing your lifestyle a bit, to surround yourself> with other vegans, or at least to start FINDING> other vegans in your vicinity.> > Maybe that's not helpful to you? But that's what I> would do (and have done).> Marcy> > > > - > kymontrip > > Friday, July 06, 2007 8:32 AM> Coming to terms with our> callousness and cruelty> > > Hello from Mallorca everybody!> > I have enjoyed reading your various posts, and> have both laughed and > cried at the amazing travelling cat, the mountain> lions and coyotes > in the centre of californian cities, as well as> gained uselful > knowledge concernign vegan recipes and campaigns.> > Now comes the big one - how can I cope with the> crushing knowledge of > the cruel and systematic abuses meted out to our> food animals, not > to mention the fur trade and the casual killing of> unwanted pets? And > experiemntation, and circuses...> > I have given money to PETA, Equanimal here in> Spain, have ciber > adopted a rescued hunting dog who would have been> garrotted > otherwise, and have caught 3 stray cats from my> garden, neutered them > and set them free - two of them females - yet am> still overwhelmed > with guilt, sadness, remorse, and a huge feeling> of hopelessness in > the face of the faceless meat industry.> > I would appreciate your thoughts, as my family> think I have gone mad, > hippy and extremist, so no help there. (they are> right about the > extremist part, as of course it is extreme to stop> eating any animla > product in today's carnivorous society).> > Thanks to everyone , KYM > > > > ________ oneSearch: Finally, mobile search that gives answers, not web links. http://mobile./mobileweb/onesearch?refer=1ONXIC

[Guest guest]

Hi Kym

 

In terms of their disrespect for women - the vast majority of their

campaigns seem to include scantily clad or semi-naked women, who are used as

sex objects rather than as people (admittedly this is no different to most

of the " advertising " world, but I'd expect higher morals from a group who

are campaigning for respect for all animals).

 

As to Judas Priest - they ran a campaign against them, speding lots of money

hounding the group, encouraging them to stop wearing leather on stage -

twenty years after the group stopped wearing leather on stage due to the

ethics of their two vegan members!

 

BB

Peter

 

-

" Kym Amps " <kymontrip

 

Friday, July 06, 2007 10:06 PM

Re: Coming to terms with our callousness and cruelty

 

 

> Dear Peter,

>

> I am intrigued about what you have to say about PETA.

> Can you elaborate?

>

> Thanks for the support, KYM

>

> PS Equanimal seems to do great things, not only for

> farm animals, but also organising campaigns against

> Spain's biggest visible abuse of animals - bullfights

> and bullruns.

>

>

>

>

> --- metalscarab <metalscarab wrote:

>

> > Hi Kym

> >

> > I cope with it by making sure I do everything I can

> > not to be a part of it -

> > hence the vegan diet and lifestyle.

> >

> > Must admit that I'm not too fond of PETA - aside

> > from the fact that they

> > waste money by running huge campaigns against people

> > who are already vegan

> > (such as the campaign against Judas Priest), but I

> > find it hard to take

> > seriously an organisation which thinks campaigns for

> > animals to be treated

> > with respect, while using methods which degrade

> > women and treat them as

> > objects rather than living beings.

> >

> > I've never heard of Equanimal, but from what you've

> > said it sounds like they

> > do good work :-)

> >

> > BB

> > Peter

> >

> > -

> > " kymontrip " <kymontrip

> >

> > Friday, July 06, 2007 4:32 PM

> > Coming to terms with our

> > callousness and cruelty

> >

> >

> > > Hello from Mallorca everybody!

> > >

> > > I have enjoyed reading your various posts, and

> > have both laughed and

> > > cried at the amazing travelling cat, the mountain

> > lions and coyotes

> > > in the centre of californian cities, as well as

> > gained uselful

> > > knowledge concernign vegan recipes and campaigns.

> > >

> > > Now comes the big one - how can I cope with the

> > crushing knowledge of

> > > the cruel and systematic abuses meted out to our

> > food animals, not

> > > to mention the fur trade and the casual killing of

> > unwanted pets? And

> > > experiemntation, and circuses...

> > >

> > > I have given money to PETA, Equanimal here in

> > Spain, have ciber

> > > adopted a rescued hunting dog who would have been

> > garrotted

> > > otherwise, and have caught 3 stray cats from my

> > garden, neutered them

> > > and set them free - two of them females - yet am

> > still overwhelmed

> > > with guilt, sadness, remorse, and a huge feeling

> > of hopelessness in

> > > the face of the faceless meat industry.

> > >

> > > I would appreciate your thoughts, as my family

> > think I have gone mad,

> > > hippy and extremist, so no help there. (they are

> > right about the

> > > extremist part, as of course it is extreme to stop

> > eating any animla

> > > product in today's carnivorous society).

> > >

> > > Thanks to everyone , KYM

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > To send an email to

> > -

> > >

[Guest guest]

Hi Peter

 

I'd agree with you on both counts.

 

As for PETA, I get really annoyed with their antics.

 

BB

Jo

 

 

-

" metalscarab " <metalscarab

 

Saturday, July 07, 2007 9:02 AM

Re: Coming to terms with our callousness and cruelty

 

 

> Hi Kym

>

> In terms of their disrespect for women - the vast majority of their

> campaigns seem to include scantily clad or semi-naked women, who are used

as

> sex objects rather than as people (admittedly this is no different to most

> of the " advertising " world, but I'd expect higher morals from a group who

> are campaigning for respect for all animals).

>

> As to Judas Priest - they ran a campaign against them, speding lots of

money

> hounding the group, encouraging them to stop wearing leather on stage -

> twenty years after the group stopped wearing leather on stage due to the

> ethics of their two vegan members!

>

> BB

> Peter

>

> -

> " Kym Amps " <kymontrip

>

> Friday, July 06, 2007 10:06 PM

> Re: Coming to terms with our callousness and cruelty

>

>

> > Dear Peter,

> >

> > I am intrigued about what you have to say about PETA.

> > Can you elaborate?

> >

> > Thanks for the support, KYM

> >

> > PS Equanimal seems to do great things, not only for

> > farm animals, but also organising campaigns against

> > Spain's biggest visible abuse of animals - bullfights

> > and bullruns.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > --- metalscarab <metalscarab wrote:

> >

> > > Hi Kym

> > >

> > > I cope with it by making sure I do everything I can

> > > not to be a part of it -

> > > hence the vegan diet and lifestyle.

> > >

> > > Must admit that I'm not too fond of PETA - aside

> > > from the fact that they

> > > waste money by running huge campaigns against people

> > > who are already vegan

> > > (such as the campaign against Judas Priest), but I

> > > find it hard to take

> > > seriously an organisation which thinks campaigns for

> > > animals to be treated

> > > with respect, while using methods which degrade

> > > women and treat them as

> > > objects rather than living beings.

> > >

> > > I've never heard of Equanimal, but from what you've

> > > said it sounds like they

> > > do good work :-)

> > >

> > > BB

> > > Peter

> > >

> > > -

> > > " kymontrip " <kymontrip

> > >

> > > Friday, July 06, 2007 4:32 PM

> > > Coming to terms with our

> > > callousness and cruelty

> > >

> > >

> > > > Hello from Mallorca everybody!

> > > >

> > > > I have enjoyed reading your various posts, and

> > > have both laughed and

> > > > cried at the amazing travelling cat, the mountain

> > > lions and coyotes

> > > > in the centre of californian cities, as well as

> > > gained uselful

> > > > knowledge concernign vegan recipes and campaigns.

> > > >

> > > > Now comes the big one - how can I cope with the

> > > crushing knowledge of

> > > > the cruel and systematic abuses meted out to our

> > > food animals, not

> > > > to mention the fur trade and the casual killing of

> > > unwanted pets? And

> > > > experiemntation, and circuses...

> > > >

> > > > I have given money to PETA, Equanimal here in

> > > Spain, have ciber

> > > > adopted a rescued hunting dog who would have been

> > > garrotted

> > > > otherwise, and have caught 3 stray cats from my

> > > garden, neutered them

> > > > and set them free - two of them females - yet am

> > > still overwhelmed

> > > > with guilt, sadness, remorse, and a huge feeling

> > > of hopelessness in

> > > > the face of the faceless meat industry.

> > > >

> > > > I would appreciate your thoughts, as my family

> > > think I have gone mad,

> > > > hippy and extremist, so no help there. (they are

> > > right about the

> > > > extremist part, as of course it is extreme to stop

> > > eating any animla

> > > > product in today's carnivorous society).

> > > >

> > > > Thanks to everyone , KYM

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > To send an email to

> > > -

> > > >

[Guest guest]

I agree, their intentions are good, they just dont seem to put a great deal of thought into what they do sometimes........ The Valley Vegan............metalscarab <metalscarab wrote: Hi KymIn terms of their disrespect for women - the vast majority of theircampaigns seem to include scantily clad or semi-naked women, who are used assex objects rather than as people (admittedly this is no different to mostof the "advertising" world, but I'd expect higher

morals from a group whoare campaigning for respect for all animals).As to Judas Priest - they ran a campaign against them, speding lots of moneyhounding the group, encouraging them to stop wearing leather on stage -twenty years after the group stopped wearing leather on stage due to theethics of their two vegan members!BBPeter-"Kym Amps" <kymontrip >Friday, July 06, 2007 10:06 PMRe: Coming to terms with our callousness and cruelty> Dear Peter,>> I am intrigued about what you have to say about PETA.> Can you elaborate?>> Thanks for the support, KYM>> PS Equanimal seems to do great things, not only for> farm animals, but also organising

campaigns against> Spain's biggest visible abuse of animals - bullfights> and bullruns.>>>>> --- metalscarab <metalscarab > wrote:>> > Hi Kym> >> > I cope with it by making sure I do everything I can> > not to be a part of it -> > hence the vegan diet and lifestyle.> >> > Must admit that I'm not too fond of PETA - aside> > from the fact that they> > waste money by running huge campaigns against people> > who are already vegan> > (such as the campaign against Judas Priest), but I> > find it hard to take> > seriously an organisation which thinks campaigns for> > animals to be treated> > with respect, while using methods which degrade> > women and treat them as> > objects rather than living

beings.> >> > I've never heard of Equanimal, but from what you've> > said it sounds like they> > do good work :-)> >> > BB> > Peter> >> > -> > "kymontrip" <kymontrip >> > > > Friday, July 06, 2007 4:32 PM> > Coming to terms with our> > callousness and cruelty> >> >> > > Hello from Mallorca everybody!> > >> > > I have enjoyed reading your various posts, and> > have both laughed and> > > cried at the amazing travelling cat, the mountain> > lions and coyotes> > > in the centre of californian cities, as well as> >

gained uselful> > > knowledge concernign vegan recipes and campaigns.> > >> > > Now comes the big one - how can I cope with the> > crushing knowledge of> > > the cruel and systematic abuses meted out to our> > food animals, not> > > to mention the fur trade and the casual killing of> > unwanted pets? And> > > experiemntation, and circuses...> > >> > > I have given money to PETA, Equanimal here in> > Spain, have ciber> > > adopted a rescued hunting dog who would have been> > garrotted> > > otherwise, and have caught 3 stray cats from my> > garden, neutered them> > > and set them free - two of them females - yet am> > still overwhelmed> > > with guilt, sadness, remorse, and a huge feeling> > of hopelessness in> > > the face of the

faceless meat industry.> > >> > > I would appreciate your thoughts, as my family> > think I have gone mad,> > > hippy and extremist, so no help there. (they are> > right about the> > > extremist part, as of course it is extreme to stop> > eating any animla> > > product in today's carnivorous society).> > >> > > Thanks to everyone , KYM> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > To send an email to> > - > > >

[Guest guest]

I am a southerner, in the Rhymney Valley, bout half way between Merthyr Tydfil and Cardiff. Did you like living in Gods own country? The Valley Vegan....Kym Amps <kymontrip wrote: Yes, well it is very hot and sunny!I used to live in Penyffordd - near Wrexham - whereare you in the green country? KYM--- Peter VV <swpgh01.t21 (AT) btinternet (DOT) com> wrote:> Ola Kym,> And

welcome...........bet the weather is better> than here in Wales!> > The Valley Vegan............> > kymontrip <kymontrip > wrote:> Hello from Mallorca everybody!> > I have enjoyed reading your various posts, and have> both laughed and > cried at the amazing travelling cat, the mountain> lions and coyotes > in the centre of californian cities, as well as> gained uselful > knowledge concernign vegan recipes and campaigns.> > Now comes the big one - how can I cope with the> crushing knowledge of > the cruel and systematic abuses meted out to our> food animals, not > to mention the fur trade and the casual killing of> unwanted pets? And > experiemntation, and circuses...> > I have given money to PETA, Equanimal here in Spain,> have

ciber > adopted a rescued hunting dog who would have been> garrotted > otherwise, and have caught 3 stray cats from my> garden, neutered them > and set them free - two of them females - yet am> still overwhelmed > with guilt, sadness, remorse, and a huge feeling of> hopelessness in > the face of the faceless meat industry.> > I would appreciate your thoughts, as my family think> I have gone mad, > hippy and extremist, so no help there. (they are> right about the > extremist part, as of course it is extreme to stop> eating any animla > product in today's carnivorous society).> > Thanks to everyone , KYM > > > > > > > Peter H > > > > > All New Mail – Tired of unwanted email> come-ons? Let our

SpamGuard protect you.________Need Mail bonding?Go to the Mail Q & A for great tips from Answers users.http://answers./dir/?link=list & sid=396546091Peter H

 

Mail is the world's favourite email. Don't settle for less, sign up for your free

account today.

[Guest guest]

Well, I lived there from the ages of 6 months to 2

years, so I don't remember much of Penyffordd!

 

However, I of course visited various places later in

life - Llangollen,Bala Lake, Betwsy Coed, Prestatyn,

(family holidays)! My sister spoke welsh for the 1st 4

years of her life - went to the village school. Don't

know much about South Wales, but I have friends who

live there and wax lyrical about the life, albeit

ratehr damp...KYM

--- Peter VV <swpgh01 wrote:

 

> I am a southerner, in the Rhymney Valley, bout half

> way between Merthyr Tydfil and Cardiff.

> Did you like living in Gods own country?

>

> The Valley Vegan....

>

> Kym Amps <kymontrip wrote:

> Yes, well it is very hot and sunny!

>

> I used to live in Penyffordd - near Wrexham - where

> are you in the green country? KYM

>

> --- Peter VV <swpgh01.t21 wrote:

>

> > Ola Kym,

> > And welcome...........bet the weather is better

> > than here in Wales!

> >

> > The Valley Vegan............

> >

> > kymontrip <kymontrip wrote:

> > Hello from Mallorca everybody!

> >

> > I have enjoyed reading your various posts, and

> have

> > both laughed and

> > cried at the amazing travelling cat, the mountain

> > lions and coyotes

> > in the centre of californian cities, as well as

> > gained uselful

> > knowledge concernign vegan recipes and campaigns.

> >

> > Now comes the big one - how can I cope with the

> > crushing knowledge of

> > the cruel and systematic abuses meted out to our

> > food animals, not

> > to mention the fur trade and the casual killing of

> > unwanted pets? And

> > experiemntation, and circuses...

> >

> > I have given money to PETA, Equanimal here in

> Spain,

> > have ciber

> > adopted a rescued hunting dog who would have been

> > garrotted

> > otherwise, and have caught 3 stray cats from my

> > garden, neutered them

> > and set them free - two of them females - yet am

> > still overwhelmed

> > with guilt, sadness, remorse, and a huge feeling

> of

> > hopelessness in

> > the face of the faceless meat industry.

> >

> > I would appreciate your thoughts, as my family

> think

> > I have gone mad,

> > hippy and extremist, so no help there. (they are

> > right about the

> > extremist part, as of course it is extreme to stop

> > eating any animla

> > product in today's carnivorous society).

> >

> > Thanks to everyone , KYM

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Peter H

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > All New Mail – Tired of unwanted email

> > come-ons? Let our SpamGuard protect you.

>

>

________

> Need Mail bonding?

> Go to the Mail Q & A for great tips from

> Answers users.

>

http://answers./dir/?link=list & sid=396546091

>

>

>

>

>

> Peter H

>

>

>

>

> Mail is the world's favourite email. Don't

> settle for less, sign up for your freeaccount today.

 

 

 

 

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[Guest guest]

Did you go to the Fairy Glen at Betwsy Coed? It is so pretty there.

 

Jo

 

, Kym Amps <kymontrip wrote:

>

> Well, I lived there from the ages of 6 months to 2

> years, so I don't remember much of Penyffordd!

>

> However, I of course visited various places later in

> life - Llangollen,Bala Lake, Betwsy Coed, Prestatyn,

> (family holidays)! My sister spoke welsh for the 1st 4

> years of her life - went to the village school. Don't

> know much about South Wales, but I have friends who

> live there and wax lyrical about the life, albeit

> ratehr damp...KYM

> --- Peter VV <swpgh01 wrote:

>

> > I am a southerner, in the Rhymney Valley, bout half

> > way between Merthyr Tydfil and Cardiff.

> > Did you like living in Gods own country?

> >

> > The Valley Vegan....

> >

> > Kym Amps <kymontrip wrote:

> > Yes, well it is very hot and sunny!

> >

> > I used to live in Penyffordd - near Wrexham - where

> > are you in the green country? KYM

> >

> > --- Peter VV <swpgh01.t21 wrote:

> >

> > > Ola Kym,

> > > And welcome...........bet the weather is better

> > > than here in Wales!

> > >

> > > The Valley Vegan............

> > >

> > > kymontrip <kymontrip wrote:

> > > Hello from Mallorca everybody!

> > >

> > > I have enjoyed reading your various posts, and

> > have

> > > both laughed and

> > > cried at the amazing travelling cat, the mountain

> > > lions and coyotes

> > > in the centre of californian cities, as well as

> > > gained uselful

> > > knowledge concernign vegan recipes and campaigns.

> > >

> > > Now comes the big one - how can I cope with the

> > > crushing knowledge of

> > > the cruel and systematic abuses meted out to our

> > > food animals, not

> > > to mention the fur trade and the casual killing of

> > > unwanted pets? And

> > > experiemntation, and circuses...

> > >

> > > I have given money to PETA, Equanimal here in

> > Spain,

> > > have ciber

> > > adopted a rescued hunting dog who would have been

> > > garrotted

> > > otherwise, and have caught 3 stray cats from my

> > > garden, neutered them

> > > and set them free - two of them females - yet am

> > > still overwhelmed

> > > with guilt, sadness, remorse, and a huge feeling

> > of

> > > hopelessness in

> > > the face of the faceless meat industry.

> > >

> > > I would appreciate your thoughts, as my family

> > think

> > > I have gone mad,

> > > hippy and extremist, so no help there. (they are

> > > right about the

> > > extremist part, as of course it is extreme to stop

> > > eating any animla

> > > product in today's carnivorous society).

> > >

> > > Thanks to everyone , KYM

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Peter H

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > All New Mail – Tired of unwanted email

> > > come-ons? Let our SpamGuard protect you.

> >

> >

> ________

> > Need Mail bonding?

> > Go to the Mail Q & A for great tips from

> > Answers users.

> >

> http://answers./dir/?link=list & sid=396546091

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Peter H

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Mail is the world's favourite email. Don't

> > settle for less, sign up for your freeaccount today.

>

>

>

>

>

____________________

______________

> It's here! Your new message!

> Get new email alerts with the free Toolbar.

> http://tools.search./toolbar/features/mail/

>

[Guest guest]

Yes - although it was fairly heaving with tourists!

The consquences of only being able to go in school

holidays...

 

All best wishes, KYM

 

--- heartwerk <jo.heartwork wrote:

 

> Did you go to the Fairy Glen at Betwsy Coed? It is

> so pretty there.

>

> Jo

>

> , Kym Amps

> <kymontrip wrote:

> >

> > Well, I lived there from the ages of 6 months to 2

> > years, so I don't remember much of Penyffordd!

> >

> > However, I of course visited various places later

> in

> > life - Llangollen,Bala Lake, Betwsy Coed,

> Prestatyn,

> > (family holidays)! My sister spoke welsh for the

> 1st 4

> > years of her life - went to the village school.

> Don't

> > know much about South Wales, but I have friends

> who

> > live there and wax lyrical about the life, albeit

> > ratehr damp...KYM

> > --- Peter VV <swpgh01 wrote:

> >

> > > I am a southerner, in the Rhymney Valley, bout

> half

> > > way between Merthyr Tydfil and Cardiff.

> > > Did you like living in Gods own country?

> > >

> > > The Valley Vegan....

> > >

> > > Kym Amps <kymontrip wrote:

> > > Yes, well it is very hot and sunny!

> > >

> > > I used to live in Penyffordd - near Wrexham -

> where

> > > are you in the green country? KYM

> > >

> > > --- Peter VV <swpgh01.t21 wrote:

> > >

> > > > Ola Kym,

> > > > And welcome...........bet the weather is

> better

> > > > than here in Wales!

> > > >

> > > > The Valley Vegan............

> > > >

> > > > kymontrip <kymontrip wrote:

> > > > Hello from Mallorca everybody!

> > > >

> > > > I have enjoyed reading your various posts, and

> > > have

> > > > both laughed and

> > > > cried at the amazing travelling cat, the

> mountain

> > > > lions and coyotes

> > > > in the centre of californian cities, as well

> as

> > > > gained uselful

> > > > knowledge concernign vegan recipes and

> campaigns.

> > > >

> > > > Now comes the big one - how can I cope with

> the

> > > > crushing knowledge of

> > > > the cruel and systematic abuses meted out to

> our

> > > > food animals, not

> > > > to mention the fur trade and the casual

> killing of

> > > > unwanted pets? And

> > > > experiemntation, and circuses...

> > > >

> > > > I have given money to PETA, Equanimal here in

> > > Spain,

> > > > have ciber

> > > > adopted a rescued hunting dog who would have

> been

> > > > garrotted

> > > > otherwise, and have caught 3 stray cats from

> my

> > > > garden, neutered them

> > > > and set them free - two of them females - yet

> am

> > > > still overwhelmed

> > > > with guilt, sadness, remorse, and a huge

> feeling

> > > of

> > > > hopelessness in

> > > > the face of the faceless meat industry.

> > > >

> > > > I would appreciate your thoughts, as my family

> > > think

> > > > I have gone mad,

> > > > hippy and extremist, so no help there. (they

> are

> > > > right about the

> > > > extremist part, as of course it is extreme to

> stop

> > > > eating any animla

> > > > product in today's carnivorous society).

> > > >

> > > > Thanks to everyone , KYM

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Peter H

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > All New Mail – Tired of unwanted email

> > > > come-ons? Let our SpamGuard protect you.

> > >

> > >

> >

>

________

> > > Need Mail bonding?

> > > Go to the Mail Q & A for great tips from

>

> > > Answers users.

> > >

> >

>

http://answers./dir/?link=list & sid=396546091

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Peter H

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Mail is the world's favourite email.

> Don't

> > > settle for less, sign up for your freeaccount

> today.

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

____________________

> ______________

> > It's here! Your new message!

> > Get new email alerts with the free Toolbar.

> >

> http://tools.search./toolbar/features/mail/

> >

>

>

>

 

 

 

 

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____

Sick sense of humor? Visit TV's

Comedy with an Edge to see what's on, when.

http://tv./collections/222

[Guest guest]

*shrug*

PETA is trying to reach the MTV blipvert generation...

jo Jul 7, 2007 8:37 AM Re: Coming to terms with our callousness and cruelty

 

 

 

Hi PeterI'd agree with you on both counts.As for PETA, I get really annoyed with their antics.BBJo-"metalscarab" <metalscarab >Saturday, July 07, 2007 9:02 AMRe: Coming to terms with our callousness and cruelty> Hi Kym>> In terms of their disrespect for women - the vast majority of their> campaigns seem to include scantily clad or semi-naked women, who are usedas> sex objects rather than as people (admittedly this is no different to most> of the "advertising" world, but I'd expect higher morals from a group who> are campaigning for respect for all animals).>> As to Judas Priest - they ran a campaign against them, speding lots ofmoney> hounding the group, encouraging them to stop wearing leather on stage -> twenty years after the group stopped wearing leather on stage due to the> ethics of their two vegan members!>> BB> Peter>> -> "Kym Amps" <kymontrip >> > Friday, July 06, 2007 10:06 PM> Re: Coming to terms with our callousness and cruelty>>> > Dear Peter,> >> > I am intrigued about what you have to say about PETA.> > Can you elaborate?> >> > Thanks for the support, KYM> >> > PS Equanimal seems to do great things, not only for> > farm animals, but also organising campaigns against> > Spain's biggest visible abuse of animals - bullfights> > and bullruns.> >> >> >> >> > --- metalscarab <metalscarab > wrote:> >> > > Hi Kym> > >> > > I cope with it by making sure I do everything I can> > > not to be a part of it -> > > hence the vegan diet and lifestyle.> > >> > > Must admit that I'm not too fond of PETA - aside> > > from the fact that they> > > waste money by running huge campaigns against people> > > who are already vegan> > > (such as the campaign against Judas Priest), but I> > > find it hard to take> > > seriously an organisation which thinks campaigns for> > > animals to be treated> > > with respect, while using methods which degrade> > > women and treat them as> > > objects rather than living beings.> > >> > > I've never heard of Equanimal, but from what you've> > > said it sounds like they> > > do good work :-)> > >> > > BB> > > Peter> > >> > > -> > > "kymontrip" <kymontrip >> > > > > > Friday, July 06, 2007 4:32 PM> > > Coming to terms with our> > > callousness and cruelty> > >> > >> > > > Hello from Mallorca everybody!> > > >> > > > I have enjoyed reading your various posts, and> > > have both laughed and> > > > cried at the amazing travelling cat, the mountain> > > lions and coyotes> > > > in the centre of californian cities, as well as> > > gained uselful> > > > knowledge concernign vegan recipes and campaigns.> > > >> > > > Now comes the big one - how can I cope with the> > > crushing knowledge of> > > > the cruel and systematic abuses meted out to our> > > food animals, not> > > > to mention the fur trade and the casual killing of> > > unwanted pets? And> > > > experiemntation, and circuses...> > > >> > > > I have given money to PETA, Equanimal here in> > > Spain, have ciber> > > > adopted a rescued hunting dog who would have been> > > garrotted> > > > otherwise, and have caught 3 stray cats from my> > > garden, neutered them> > > > and set them free - two of them females - yet am> > > still overwhelmed> > > > with guilt, sadness, remorse, and a huge feeling> > > of hopelessness in> > > > the face of the faceless meat industry.> > > >> > > > I would appreciate your thoughts, as my family> > > think I have gone mad,> > > > hippy and extremist, so no help there. (they are> > > right about the> > > > extremist part, as of course it is extreme to stop> > > eating any animla> > > > product in today's carnivorous society).> > > >> > > > Thanks to everyone , KYM> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > To send an email to> > > - > > > >

[Guest guest]

It's never been that busy while we've been there. Last time we were alone

:-)

 

Ho

 

-

" Kym Amps " <kymontrip

 

Monday, July 09, 2007 8:59 AM

Re: Re: Coming to terms with our callousness and

cruelty

 

 

> Yes - although it was fairly heaving with tourists!

> The consquences of only being able to go in school

> holidays...

>

> All best wishes, KYM

>