soaking raw nuts & seeds

July 19, 2004

Soaking nuts is the fashion these days, it is a mantra of the raw

food movement, but I consider it unnatural and unhealthy. It changes

the nut's chemical structure, turns it from a nut into a baby plant

(doesn't even taste like a nut anymore), and a baby plant has

powerful toxins to discourage from being eaten, and the soak water

is gross, the soaked nut has oxidized and decayed from the soak. The

usual excuse to soak nuts is that it " releases the enzyme

inhibitors " .

But all plant foods contain in their natural state plenty of enzymes

to digest them, and the enzymes that are " inhibited " are best left

undisturbed, there is probably a very good reason for them

being " inhibited " , and it's best not to open up that Pandora's box.

You will hear the opposite from everyone else, since soaking nuts

and seeds is very popular right now, but is without knowing the long

term effects of tampering with Nature, whereas people have been

eating unsoaked nuts and seeds forever.

I would not soak nuts and seeds (or sprout) because that starts the

process of germination, which changes the chemical composition of

the nut/seed. In the germination process, and through the sprout

stage, toxins form in the plant to protect it: an adult plant

doesn't need to protect itself as much since if the leaves get

nibbled off, the plant still survives. But a seedling or sprout is

so tiny and fragile that it can get gobbled up in an instant, so

toxins to keep eaters away is its only protection. When a nut/seed

is still in its seed form, it's SUPPOSED to be eaten so that it can

be scattered somewhere to propagate a new plant (even if after it

has been eaten and gone out the other end of an animal), so it's not

toxic in its nut/seed state. But once it starts the germination

process, that's changed.

Also, the reason given for soaking nuts/seeds (other than that it's

easier to make gourmet raw meals with them soaked) is that it

releases the enzyme inhibitors, making the enzymes more available

and digestion thereby easier and not needing to rely on depleting

the body's own digestive enzymes. However, all raw foods contain

within them the enzymes necessary for their digestion, and they

don't come with soaking instructions! I think perhaps the enzyme

inhibitors may even get released within the body in the process of

digestion, to be available for use.

In any case, it's folly to try to improve on Nature. Some people

point out that birds have digestive liquid in their crops to soak

nuts and seeds. But that is the birds' digestive system, not ours.

We are not meant to have nuts and seeds sit in liquid for hours or

days. We are primates, and just like apes and monkeys who crack open

nuts' cases with rocks and stones, and then eat them immediately,

that is obviously what we too are meant to do. No creature in Nature

soaks nuts and seeds before eating them.

Also, if food is left out to soak, it begins to ferment, and I don't

believe in fermenting foods. We are told fermentation is the action

of bacteria, that they somehow work on a food, and that it's

beneficial. What I've read actually happens in fermentation is that,

since the food is left sitting out, it is decaying, and bacteria,

which eat dead and decaying matter, consume it. Bacteria, which are

little animals, naturally have to urinate and defecate, and so

that's what they do in the food--they are thus " converting " the food

into urine and feces, IMO not appetizing and rather toxic. That is

what fermented food is--bacterial urine and feces, definitely not

healthy.

There may be some validity to soaking nuts and seeds to re-hydrate

them, since unless we get them straight off the tree, we get them

from companies who grow them, but then dry them somewhat for storage

purposes so they don't get moldy. But they should only be soaked in

the refrigerator, and only for a few hours, to re-hydrate. If foods

are soaked in the refrigerator, they don't decompose, but then

neither do they change chemical composition or texture so one may as

well not soak them.

We need to eat foods as close as possible to the way they come in

Nature. Our foods are supposed to be delicious, attractive, we're

drawn to them because they are so appealing. Nuts and seeds are

appealing in their natural state, but after soaking? They are soggy,

tasteless, no longer taste like nuts and seeds. And it's not

appetizing to me to eat something that has been sitting in stagnant

water and bacterial wastes. And the nuts are decaying while being

soaked. Decayed food sitting in toxic wastes is not something

appetizing to me. And the soaked nuts do not taste like nuts

anymore, they taste like a plant but without any flavor, which is

what they're being converted to, and they do not taste good to me.

IMO, nuts and seeds are to be eaten unsoaked. I think if someone

wants to do interesting gourmet type stuff with them, it's better to

put them in the blender and make a butter out of them and work with

that.

And BTW, I would not look to Chet Day or Tom Billings for dietary

advice. They understand nothing of nutrition or health, and they are

totally arrogant and vicious in their attacks upon raw veganism, and

have no doubt caused much recidivism among raw vegans back to

consuming animal products. These two characters, and a few others,

have unfortunately urged many people to fall off from the path to

optimal health, which can only be achieved by ceasing to palliate

and poison one's body with animal products, cooked food, etc.

Zsuzsa

rawfood , Martha Burton <mburtonakod@e...>

wrote:

> There's an enzyme inhibitor on raw nuts and seeds that needs to be

> removed by soaking, in general. There are some exceptions. And

some nuts

> that are sold as raw aren't. Here's the best info I've found on

nuts:

> http://www.chetday.com/nutprocessing.html

July 22, 2004

I am new to this group, and I would like to know why you believe that

sprouted & fermented foods are bad, and where you get your

information from, since the pro-soakers seems to be the majority.

Yes, I can see the logic of " the enzymes must be inhibited for a

reason " , and that as far as we know, humans have not sprouted their

seeds and nuts. But they have fermented/cultured many things. The

thing is, noone really knows for sure if soaking is good or bad. I

guess it just depends on how you choose to look at it.

~Alissa

rawfood , " southladogs " <southladogs>

wrote:

> Soaking nuts is the fashion these days, it is a mantra of the raw

> food movement, but I consider it unnatural and unhealthy. It

changes

> the nut's chemical structure, turns it from a nut into a baby plant

> (doesn't even taste like a nut anymore), and a baby plant has

> powerful toxins to discourage from being eaten, and the soak water

> is gross, the soaked nut has oxidized and decayed from the soak.

The

> usual excuse to soak nuts is that it " releases the enzyme

> inhibitors " .

>

> But all plant foods contain in their natural state plenty of

enzymes

> to digest them, and the enzymes that are " inhibited " are best left

> undisturbed, there is probably a very good reason for them

> being " inhibited " , and it's best not to open up that Pandora's box.

> You will hear the opposite from everyone else, since soaking nuts

> and seeds is very popular right now, but is without knowing the

long

> term effects of tampering with Nature, whereas people have been

> eating unsoaked nuts and seeds forever.

>

> I would not soak nuts and seeds (or sprout) because that starts the

> process of germination, which changes the chemical composition of

> the nut/seed. In the germination process, and through the sprout

> stage, toxins form in the plant to protect it: an adult plant

> doesn't need to protect itself as much since if the leaves get

> nibbled off, the plant still survives. But a seedling or sprout is

> so tiny and fragile that it can get gobbled up in an instant, so

> toxins to keep eaters away is its only protection. When a nut/seed

> is still in its seed form, it's SUPPOSED to be eaten so that it can

> be scattered somewhere to propagate a new plant (even if after it

> has been eaten and gone out the other end of an animal), so it's

not

> toxic in its nut/seed state. But once it starts the germination

> process, that's changed.

>

> Also, the reason given for soaking nuts/seeds (other than that it's

> easier to make gourmet raw meals with them soaked) is that it

> releases the enzyme inhibitors, making the enzymes more available

> and digestion thereby easier and not needing to rely on depleting

> the body's own digestive enzymes. However, all raw foods contain

> within them the enzymes necessary for their digestion, and they

> don't come with soaking instructions! I think perhaps the enzyme

> inhibitors may even get released within the body in the process of

> digestion, to be available for use.

>

> In any case, it's folly to try to improve on Nature. Some people

> point out that birds have digestive liquid in their crops to soak

> nuts and seeds. But that is the birds' digestive system, not ours.

> We are not meant to have nuts and seeds sit in liquid for hours or

> days. We are primates, and just like apes and monkeys who crack

open

> nuts' cases with rocks and stones, and then eat them immediately,

> that is obviously what we too are meant to do. No creature in

Nature

> soaks nuts and seeds before eating them.

>

> Also, if food is left out to soak, it begins to ferment, and I

don't

> believe in fermenting foods. We are told fermentation is the action

> of bacteria, that they somehow work on a food, and that it's

> beneficial. What I've read actually happens in fermentation is

that,

> since the food is left sitting out, it is decaying, and bacteria,

> which eat dead and decaying matter, consume it. Bacteria, which are

> little animals, naturally have to urinate and defecate, and so

> that's what they do in the food--they are thus " converting " the

food

> into urine and feces, IMO not appetizing and rather toxic. That is

> what fermented food is--bacterial urine and feces, definitely not

> healthy.

>

> There may be some validity to soaking nuts and seeds to re-hydrate

> them, since unless we get them straight off the tree, we get them

> from companies who grow them, but then dry them somewhat for

storage

> purposes so they don't get moldy. But they should only be soaked in

> the refrigerator, and only for a few hours, to re-hydrate. If foods

> are soaked in the refrigerator, they don't decompose, but then

> neither do they change chemical composition or texture so one may

as

> well not soak them.

>

> We need to eat foods as close as possible to the way they come in

> Nature. Our foods are supposed to be delicious, attractive, we're

> drawn to them because they are so appealing. Nuts and seeds are

> appealing in their natural state, but after soaking? They are

soggy,

> tasteless, no longer taste like nuts and seeds. And it's not

> appetizing to me to eat something that has been sitting in stagnant

> water and bacterial wastes. And the nuts are decaying while being

> soaked. Decayed food sitting in toxic wastes is not something

> appetizing to me. And the soaked nuts do not taste like nuts

> anymore, they taste like a plant but without any flavor, which is

> what they're being converted to, and they do not taste good to me.

>

> IMO, nuts and seeds are to be eaten unsoaked. I think if someone

> wants to do interesting gourmet type stuff with them, it's better

to

> put them in the blender and make a butter out of them and work with

> that.

>

> And BTW, I would not look to Chet Day or Tom Billings for dietary

> advice. They understand nothing of nutrition or health, and they

are

> totally arrogant and vicious in their attacks upon raw veganism,

and

> have no doubt caused much recidivism among raw vegans back to

> consuming animal products. These two characters, and a few others,

> have unfortunately urged many people to fall off from the path to

> optimal health, which can only be achieved by ceasing to palliate

> and poison one's body with animal products, cooked food, etc.

>

> Zsuzsa

July 23, 2004

I find it extremely hard to believe that at some point in history, humans did

not in the process of foraging, happen upon nuts that had been lying in the

shell, after a heavy rain, and got a good soak -- this is how every nut tree

ever grew. When I hung a bird feeder over my grass, I noticed the birds would

like to kick a lot of the seed out of the tray onto the ground, almost on

purpose it seemed, and when the seeds would start to sprout and grow in the

grass,

they would peck at and eat them from the ground, as if they Preferred it.

Now, in the modern age, we harvest things according to scientific systems to

be sure they are harvested from the tree, but a foraging primitive person

would have been MORE likely to pick up the nuts After they fell, and I doubt

they

would have forsaken the nuts that had already been soaked on the ground after

a good rain. Infact, they mjay have learned about sprouting and planting from

noticing the affect of a good rain in nuts and seeds. Essene bread, the

recipe which is given for in the bible, says to sprout the grains, anyways.

Peace,

Cathie

In a message dated 7/23/2004 5:19:40 AM Mountain Daylight Time,

health writes:

> I am new to this group, and I would like to know why you believe that

> sprouted & fermented foods are bad, and where you get your

> information from, since the pro-soakers seems to be the majority.

>

> Yes, I can see the logic of " the enzymes must be inhibited for a

> reason " , and that as far as we know, humans have not sprouted their

> seeds and nuts. But they have fermented/cultured many things. The

> thing is, noone really knows for sure if soaking is good or bad. I

> guess it just depends on how you choose to look at it.

>

> ~Alissa

>

July 23, 2004

In a message dated 7/23/2004 8:28:49 AM Mountain Daylight Time,

sheabuddah writes:

> I notice an acidic feeling In my asophagus and stomach if I dont soak my

> nuts for

> atleast 12 hours.

Another rebuttal could be that Bees Make Honey -- a rather interesting

process -- surely humans are neither above nor beneath " futzing " with their food

to

achieve a desirable end product --

Why don't bees eat pollen, instead of turning it into honey?

July 23, 2004

I throw my leftover wheatberries from rejuvelac out for the birds and the

birds GOBBLE them up they LOVE them as if they were a Luxury -- prefer them to

dry seed --

In a message dated 7/23/2004 8:28:49 AM Mountain Daylight Time,

sheabuddah writes:

> I notice an acidic feeling In my asophagus and stomach if I dont soak my

> nuts for

> atleast 12 hours.

>

July 23, 2004

I notice an acidic feeling In my asophagus and stomach if I dont soak my nuts

for

atleast 12 hours.

> wrote: