Raw Vegan Alcoholic

February 26, 2007

It's very rare when an alcoholic stops drinking and also expresses

concern about his health. I quit drinking 1/23/07 and began a raw

vegan diet on 2/24/07. I did well for a couple of days and today I'm

having cravings for junk and animal products. So far, I've held

my " slip " to a cup of cherry nonfat yogurt and a raisin bagel. . . but

I know that the more I cheat and chip away at my diet, the harder it

will become. Now the cravings I'm having are worse than before I ate

the bagel and the yogurt!

I'm hoping to get back on " the straight and narrow " today and maybe

start a fast tomorrow. Can anybody say anything that will help?

Ron

February 26, 2007

Hi, Ron -

First off, congratulations on taking positive steps to take charge of

your health. That's something that no medical provider can do for you.

Consider yourself the recipient of a huge smile, a big hug, and some

" high fives " from me.

Secondly, you're making a HUGE leap here all at once. I would be

misleading you if I told you that it was going to be a proverbial

cakewalk. It took me many years of small steps to get to where I am

today. (My major dietary problem has always been too many concentrated

calories and a fondness for sweets.)

Some suggestions:

1. Make sure that the " worst offenders " of your dietary concerns are

not in your home nor in your car, or elsewhere in your immediate

environment. You know in your own mind what these are. Those are the

things to concentrate on first. If you " slip up " , and those cravings

get the better of you, allow yourself something that's not on the " worst

offender " list, and don't worry about it too much.

You might want to avoid shopping in the stores where you normally

purchase those " worst offenders " for now.

2. If you don't already have it, get yourself a copy of the movie,

" Supersize Me " . That should be a great motivator.

3. Attend one of the local potlucks and recruit yourself a " raw buddy " ,

somebody who you can call when you feel yourself slipping backwards.

4. Make sure you have a green smoothie and/or a green salad every day.

Those can give you that nutritional boost to carry yourself through the

other struggles.

5. Some of the most addictive SAD foods include: breads, sugar/sweets,

sodas, and dairy. Try to keep those out of the house for now; if you're

using dairy regularly, get some soy instead.

6. Others will probably disagree with me, but I'd suggest that fasting

might be a bit hard on you at this point. You might want to do a juice

fast, that would be a bit easier on you. You likely have a lot of

toxins built up in your body, and your " detox " could be quite harsh.

I'd really suggest waiting until you've cleared some stuff out, unless

you really feel ready for (and willing to endure) a wild ride.

7. Again, if you slip up, don't beat yourself up about it. Just pick

up and move forward.

BTW, I've been raw for nearly 6 years (has it been that long?), and I'm

a mainstream-trained nutrition professional.

Blessings!

Sue

> It's very rare when an alcoholic stops drinking and also expresses

> concern about his health. I quit drinking 1/23/07 and began a raw

> vegan diet on 2/24/07. I did well for a couple of days and today I'm

> having cravings for junk and animal products. So far, I've held

> my " slip " to a cup of cherry nonfat yogurt and a raisin bagel. . . but

> I know that the more I cheat and chip away at my diet, the harder it

> will become. Now the cravings I'm having are worse than before I ate

> the bagel and the yogurt!

>

> I'm hoping to get back on " the straight and narrow " today and maybe

> start a fast tomorrow. Can anybody say anything that will help?

>

> Ron

>

February 27, 2007

Ron,

If it's convenient, stock up on raw snacks, such as those at Madison

Market (if you're in Seattle). There's also the NW living foods co-op

(also online) and online raw stores such as Nature's First Law. While

dehydrated snacks (crackers and cookies, etc.) may not be ideal, they

can be replacements for your craved foods. Hopefully they'll satisfy

you. It's also fun to try the varieties of raw snacks on the market.

Some can be pricey. It is much cheeper to make your own. On that

note... consider some classes that come up occasionally. You'll learn

new foods (and taste them, as well) and meet other raw foodists.

Like Sue mentioned, consider the green smoothies (fruit, greens, and

water). I use lots of greens in mine. Victoria Boutenko has found that

when drinking the smoothies, craving subside. Otherwise, eat lots of

greens, whether in a salad or munching on celery, cucumbers, or

straight romaine lettuce (or other leafy green).

Do try to visit our potlucks. You may find the community of raw

foodists help.

Jeff

February 27, 2007

Don't try to do too much at once. Keep moving in the direction you want to

go and don't get discouraged if you have setbacks. You don't get to the

top of the mountain without climbing up it one step at a time. Just giving

up all alcohol is a big step forward. Surround yourself with supportive

people who can help you through the hard times and keep moving forward.

Another Ron

RawSeattle , " dukkadon " <dukkadon wrote:

> I'm hoping to get back on " the straight and narrow " today and maybe

> start a fast tomorrow. Can anybody say anything that will help?

>

> Ron

>

February 27, 2007

BTW, I have long suspected that raw foods would likely offer the most

help for people making a transition off of chemical addictions. With

all that extra vibrant nutrition, I'm sure the body is in a much better

balance, so would result in less cravings.

Great decision to go raw!

Jeff

February 27, 2007

I wanted to quit drinking myself and I have.

I wrote out the following and then posted it where I could see it as a

reminder.

REASONS TO STOP DRINKING ALCOHOL

1. It is unattractive--to my demeanor, to my friends, acquaintances, family

and children.

2. It lowers my defenses. I become prey.

3. It is unhealthy for me physiologically.

4. It takes away 'Quality' of thought.

5. It will shorten my lifespan.

6. It hinders my chances to reach my goals in live.

7. It detracts from my Christian beliefs and practice.

8. It is socially and legally dangerous.

9. It disables sound judgment.

10. My credibility suffers.

NEED I GO ON? Note: (I wrote that to myself)

Then I wrote, when I read this to someone over the phone, what they

said should be added to this list.

11. The financial cost is incalculable.

It's like when I quit smoking several years ago. The urge goes away.

Good luck. Wishing you all the best.

MikeAnthony

_______________

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February 28, 2007

Hi Ron,

Congratulations on your healthy lifestyle changes!!

That is so awesome!!!

I would caution against doing a fast right now. I

think that working on staying raw or at least mostly

raw with some healthier cooked options like steamed

veggies, etc. would be plenty for you to work on for

now. You want to make sure that you are feeling

satisfied and don't want to do anything that might

make you feel deprived.

That is my advice. Keep up the great work!!!

Wishing you all the best,

Audrey

www.rawhealing.com

--- dukkadon <dukkadon wrote:

> It's very rare when an alcoholic stops drinking and

> also expresses

> concern about his health. I quit drinking 1/23/07

> and began a raw

> vegan diet on 2/24/07. I did well for a couple of

> days and today I'm

> having cravings for junk and animal products. So

> far, I've held

> my " slip " to a cup of cherry nonfat yogurt and a

> raisin bagel. . . but

> I know that the more I cheat and chip away at my

> diet, the harder it

> will become. Now the cravings I'm having are worse

> than before I ate

> the bagel and the yogurt!

>

> I'm hoping to get back on " the straight and narrow "

> today and maybe

> start a fast tomorrow. Can anybody say anything

> that will help?

>

> Ron

>

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February 28, 2007

Thanks Audrey,

Since I posted last I have moved from the Seattle Salvation Army to a V. A.

domiciliary at American Lake, near Tacoma. I have no control of my food here.

I just eat what is in the mess hall--and it's all about the standard American

diet (SAD) that recovering alcoholics like (lots of sugar, coffee, fats, etc.).

So I guess it is premature for me to be thinking about a raw vegan lifestyle. I

have lots of work to do to get the alcohol and the unmanagability out of my life

before I can become independent enough to manage my own food!

I only get 30 minutes a day on the community computer here, but I hope to keep

up with the message board at Raw Seattle.

So. . . keep up the good work!

Ron

Audrey Walker <prettifemme88

RawSeattle

Wednesday, February 28, 2007 10:16:45 AM

Re: [RawSeattle] Raw Vegan Alcoholic

Hi Ron,

Congratulations on your healthy lifestyle changes!!

That is so awesome!!!

I would caution against doing a fast right now. I

think that working on staying raw or at least mostly

raw with some healthier cooked options like steamed

veggies, etc. would be plenty for you to work on for

now. You want to make sure that you are feeling

satisfied and don't want to do anything that might

make you feel deprived.

That is my advice. Keep up the great work!!!

Wishing you all the best,

Audrey

www.rawhealing. com

--- dukkadon <dukkadon > wrote:

> It's very rare when an alcoholic stops drinking and

> also expresses

> concern about his health. I quit drinking 1/23/07

> and began a raw

> vegan diet on 2/24/07. I did well for a couple of

> days and today I'm

> having cravings for junk and animal products. So

> far, I've held

> my " slip " to a cup of cherry nonfat yogurt and a

> raisin bagel. . . but

> I know that the more I cheat and chip away at my

> diet, the harder it

> will become. Now the cravings I'm having are worse

> than before I ate

> the bagel and the yogurt!

>

> I'm hoping to get back on " the straight and narrow "

> today and maybe

> start a fast tomorrow. Can anybody say anything

> that will help?

>

> Ron

>

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February 28, 2007

Hi Sue,

I have an appointment first thing tomorrow with the nutritionist here at

American Lake. I'm sure she can tell me what is within the realm of

possibilities here; probably a " low calorie " or a " low cholesterol " diet will be

the best we can do for now. What I don't like about that is that it is only

eating moderate amounts of SAD foods, which is not a very good solution to the

health problem. Such a solution doesn't take into account very much more than

weight. . . . But maybe that's the best I can do for now. At 180 lbs., maybe

that is the best I can do. Maybe that's what I need to look at first.

Thanks for your help. I see that this is not going to be any quick and easy

fix.

Ron

Sue Aberle <raw-sue

RawSeattle

Monday, February 26, 2007 2:34:05 PM

Re: [RawSeattle] Raw Vegan Alcoholic

Hi, Ron -

First off, congratulations on taking positive steps to take charge of

your health. That's something that no medical provider can do for you.

Consider yourself the recipient of a huge smile, a big hug, and some

" high fives " from me.

Secondly, you're making a HUGE leap here all at once. I would be

misleading you if I told you that it was going to be a proverbial

cakewalk. It took me many years of small steps to get to where I am

today. (My major dietary problem has always been too many concentrated

calories and a fondness for sweets.)

Some suggestions:

1. Make sure that the " worst offenders " of your dietary concerns are

not in your home nor in your car, or elsewhere in your immediate

environment. You know in your own mind what these are. Those are the

things to concentrate on first. If you " slip up " , and those cravings

get the better of you, allow yourself something that's not on the " worst

offender " list, and don't worry about it too much.

You might want to avoid shopping in the stores where you normally

purchase those " worst offenders " for now.

2. If you don't already have it, get yourself a copy of the movie,

" Supersize Me " . That should be a great motivator.

3. Attend one of the local potlucks and recruit yourself a " raw buddy " ,

somebody who you can call when you feel yourself slipping backwards.

4. Make sure you have a green smoothie and/or a green salad every day.

Those can give you that nutritional boost to carry yourself through the

other struggles.

5. Some of the most addictive SAD foods include: breads, sugar/sweets,

sodas, and dairy. Try to keep those out of the house for now; if you're

using dairy regularly, get some soy instead.

6. Others will probably disagree with me, but I'd suggest that fasting

might be a bit hard on you at this point. You might want to do a juice

fast, that would be a bit easier on you. You likely have a lot of

toxins built up in your body, and your " detox " could be quite harsh.

I'd really suggest waiting until you've cleared some stuff out, unless

you really feel ready for (and willing to endure) a wild ride.

7. Again, if you slip up, don't beat yourself up about it. Just pick

up and move forward.

BTW, I've been raw for nearly 6 years (has it been that long?), and I'm

a mainstream-trained nutrition professional.

Blessings!

Sue

> It's very rare when an alcoholic stops drinking and also expresses

> concern about his health. I quit drinking 1/23/07 and began a raw

> vegan diet on 2/24/07. I did well for a couple of days and today I'm

> having cravings for junk and animal products. So far, I've held

> my " slip " to a cup of cherry nonfat yogurt and a raisin bagel. . . but

> I know that the more I cheat and chip away at my diet, the harder it

> will become. Now the cravings I'm having are worse than before I ate

> the bagel and the yogurt!

>

> I'm hoping to get back on " the straight and narrow " today and maybe

> start a fast tomorrow. Can anybody say anything that will help?

>

> Ron

>

______________________________\

____

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February 28, 2007

I agree, Mike. That's why I'm quitting alcohol. Not moderating! Quitting!

Ron

michael anthony <yourkeylink

RawSeattle

Tuesday, February 27, 2007 12:27:22 PM

[RawSeattle] Re:Raw Vegan Alcoholic

I wanted to quit drinking myself and I have.

I wrote out the following and then posted it where I could see it as a

reminder.

REASONS TO STOP DRINKING ALCOHOL

1. It is unattractive- -to my demeanor, to my friends, acquaintances, family

and children.

2. It lowers my defenses. I become prey.

3. It is unhealthy for me physiologically.

4. It takes away 'Quality' of thought.

5. It will shorten my lifespan.

6. It hinders my chances to reach my goals in live.

7. It detracts from my Christian beliefs and practice.

8. It is socially and legally dangerous.

9. It disables sound judgment.

10. My credibility suffers.

NEED I GO ON? Note: (I wrote that to myself)

Then I wrote, when I read this to someone over the phone, what they

said should be added to this list.

11. The financial cost is incalculable.

It's like when I quit smoking several years ago. The urge goes away.

Good luck. Wishing you all the best.

MikeAnthony

____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _

Want a degree but can't afford to quit? Top school degrees online - in as

fast as 1 year

http://forms. nextag.com/ goto.jsp? url=/serv/ main/buyer/ education.

jsp?doSearch= n & tm=y & search= education_ text_links_ 88_h288c & s=4079 & p= 5116

______________________________\

____

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http://new.mail.

February 28, 2007

Ron,

If they offer any salads, see if you can load up on that. Even trade

for those who don't want their veggies, especially if they won't eat

them.

Jeff

February 28, 2007

Jeff,

The salad offering here today consisted of raw cherry tomatoes, peeled cucumbers

and sliced mushrooms, as well as a large bowl of iceberg lettuce, carrots, etc.

It's not very appetizing without the cream dressings they also provide--and it's

certainly not an adequate diet--without the Ruben sandwiches and potatoes that

make up the rest of the menu.

I'm seemingly powerless to eat a raw diet here!

Ron

Jeff Rogers <jeff

RawSeattle

Wednesday, February 28, 2007 2:05:42 PM

Re: [RawSeattle] Raw Vegan Alcoholic

Ron,

If they offer any salads, see if you can load up on that. Even trade

for those who don't want their veggies, especially if they won't eat

them.

Jeff

______________________________\

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in the Answers Food & Drink Q & A.

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March 1, 2007

Ron,

Fasting can certainly be beneficial, but I think it's more important

to be stabilized in a healthy diet and lifestyle. I don't think that

fasting a day or two or three every now and then as a way to " clean

up " from episodes of unhealthy eating is a good idea. It can easily

turn into a yo-yo thing, maybe even an eating disorder. Once you are

pretty well stabilized in your diet, then maybe you could look into a

lengthy supervised fast, where some real substantial detoxing can be done.

I have found that Doug Graham's 80/10/10 approach helps a lot with

cravings. You can read the FAQ section of his website

www.foodnsport.com or just get his book. I still find myself eating

unhealthy food sometimes (almost always in the evenings), but things

are definitely improving.

As far as alcohol, one thing might help is to not think of yourself as

a lifelong alcoholic struggling against a disease. I know that goes

against what AA teaches, but AA does not work for everybody. You may

already know this. If not, do a search on " alternatives to AA " and

you will learn about lots of other valid approaches.

Good luck,

Mark

RawSeattle , " dukkadon " <dukkadon wrote:

>

> It's very rare when an alcoholic stops drinking and also expresses

> concern about his health. I quit drinking 1/23/07 and began a raw

> vegan diet on 2/24/07. I did well for a couple of days and today I'm

> having cravings for junk and animal products. So far, I've held

> my " slip " to a cup of cherry nonfat yogurt and a raisin bagel. . . but

> I know that the more I cheat and chip away at my diet, the harder it

> will become. Now the cravings I'm having are worse than before I ate

> the bagel and the yogurt!

>

> I'm hoping to get back on " the straight and narrow " today and maybe

> start a fast tomorrow. Can anybody say anything that will help?

>

> Ron

>

March 1, 2007

It is a challenge to be in a different environment other than one that supports

your chosen lifestyle.

Keep trying your best and always bless your food before you eat it.

Bless it with the sincerest feeling of gratitude and love. It will have a

profound effect on how it affects your body.

Light and Love

Finding my Joy

Ramona

-------------- Original message --------------

David Braddock <dukkadon

Thanks Audrey,

Since I posted last I have moved from the Seattle Salvation Army to a V. A.

domiciliary at American Lake, near Tacoma. I have no control of my food here. I

just eat what is in the mess hall--and it's all about the standard American diet

(SAD) that recovering alcoholics like (lots of sugar, coffee, fats, etc.). So I

guess it is premature for me to be thinking about a raw vegan lifestyle. I have

lots of work to do to get the alcohol and the unmanagability out of my life

before I can become independent enough to manage my own food!

I only get 30 minutes a day on the community computer here, but I hope to keep

up with the message board at Raw Seattle.

So. . . keep up the good work!

Ron

Audrey Walker <prettifemme88

RawSeattle

Wednesday, February 28, 2007 10:16:45 AM

Re: [RawSeattle] Raw Vegan Alcoholic

Hi Ron,

Congratulations on your healthy lifestyle changes!!

That is so awesome!!!

I would caution against doing a fast right now. I

think that working on staying raw or at least mostly

raw with some healthier cooked options like steamed

veggies, etc. would be plenty for you to work on for

now. You want to make sure that you are feeling

satisfied and don't want to do anything that might

make you feel deprived.

That is my advice. Keep up the great work!!!

Wishing you all the best,

Audrey

www.rawhealing. com

--- dukkadon <dukkadon > wrote:

> It's very rare when an alcoholic stops drinking and

> also expresses

> concern about his health. I quit drinking 1/23/07

> and began a raw

> vegan diet on 2/24/07. I did well for a couple of

> days and today I'm

> having cravings for junk and animal products. So

> far, I've held

> my " slip " to a cup of cherry nonfat yogurt and a

> raisin bagel. . . but

> I know that the more I cheat and chip away at my

> diet, the harder it

> will become. Now the cravings I'm having are worse

> than before I ate

> the bagel and the yogurt!

>

> I'm hoping to get back on " the straight and narrow "

> today and maybe

> start a fast tomorrow. Can anybody say anything

> that will help?

>

> Ron

>

____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _

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March 1, 2007

Hi Ron,

Best of luck to you!!

All the best,

Audrey

--- David Braddock <dukkadon wrote:

> Thanks Audrey,

>

> Since I posted last I have moved from the Seattle

> Salvation Army to a V. A. domiciliary at American

> Lake, near Tacoma. I have no control of my food

> here. I just eat what is in the mess hall--and it's

> all about the standard American diet (SAD) that

> recovering alcoholics like (lots of sugar, coffee,

> fats, etc.). So I guess it is premature for me to

> be thinking about a raw vegan lifestyle. I have

> lots of work to do to get the alcohol and the

> unmanagability out of my life before I can become

> independent enough to manage my own food!

>

> I only get 30 minutes a day on the community

> computer here, but I hope to keep up with the

> message board at Raw Seattle.

>

> So. . . keep up the good work!

>

> Ron

>

> Audrey Walker <prettifemme88

> RawSeattle

> Wednesday, February 28, 2007 10:16:45 AM

> Re: [RawSeattle] Raw Vegan Alcoholic

>

> Hi Ron,

>

> Congratulations on your healthy lifestyle changes!!

> That is so awesome!!!

>

> I would caution against doing a fast right now. I

> think that working on staying raw or at least mostly

> raw with some healthier cooked options like steamed

> veggies, etc. would be plenty for you to work on for

> now. You want to make sure that you are feeling

> satisfied and don't want to do anything that might

> make you feel deprived.

>

> That is my advice. Keep up the great work!!!

>

> Wishing you all the best,

>

> Audrey

> www.rawhealing. com

> --- dukkadon <dukkadon > wrote:

>

> > It's very rare when an alcoholic stops drinking

> and

> > also expresses

> > concern about his health. I quit drinking 1/23/07

> > and began a raw

> > vegan diet on 2/24/07. I did well for a couple of

> > days and today I'm

> > having cravings for junk and animal products. So

> > far, I've held

> > my " slip " to a cup of cherry nonfat yogurt and a

> > raisin bagel. . . but

> > I know that the more I cheat and chip away at my

> > diet, the harder it

> > will become. Now the cravings I'm having are worse

> > than before I ate

> > the bagel and the yogurt!

> >

> > I'm hoping to get back on " the straight and

> narrow "

> > today and maybe

> > start a fast tomorrow. Can anybody say anything

> > that will help?

> >

> > Ron

> >

>

> ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________

> _________ _

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> Auto-Check.

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> newmail_tools. html

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> sites to find flight and hotel bargains.

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>

> [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

>

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March 1, 2007

It is said that it takes 21 days to make a new habit and break an old one.

take a few things you know you can stick with for that many days and when it is

a habit start another three.

Just a thought, It works for me anyway and seems to be less overwhelming and

doable.

Catherine

March 1, 2007

Thanks, Mark,

I'm in a V.A. rehab program where they check me with breathalizers and

urinalysis for even traces of alcohol or drugs, so my approach must be entire

abstinence, if I stay here--and I like the AA approach to alcohol and drugs! I

think it works the best for me!

The problem, however, is food! I don't have a kitchen or a grocery store here

on the American Lake Compound and all they serve here is SAD. I could try

living on nothing but salad without dressing! Or maybe I can get to town and

sneak some fruit back in my backpack. I'm still trying to figure out how I'm

going to do this.

Any suggestions?

Ron

Mark Hovila <hovila

RawSeattle

Wednesday, February 28, 2007 4:08:47 PM

[RawSeattle] Re: Raw Vegan Alcoholic