Guest guest Posted December 6, 2002 Report Share Posted December 6, 2002 Oh no, it's quite true, believe it or not...These are actual types of vegetarians. I personally believe all meat should be eliminated so I am ovo lacto. But some eat fish but nothing else, or chicken and nothing else. They are still technically 'vegetarian.' It sounds strange I know. They had that full list in a Time issue a few months ago...It is also all over the internet. Lots of debate over this I am sure... Warmly, Allison --- Pat Meadows <pat wrote: > On Thu, 05 Dec 2002 19:03:15 -0600, you wrote: > > >Oh wow, fabulous. Thank you very much Allison. > Funny, I was just kidding > >about the pollo, but sure enough, there it is. I > know pollo is chicken in > >Spanish and pretty sure pesco is Spanish as well. > Are the other two Spanish > >as well and where did these terms derive from? > Perhaps it is just to mask > >the terms " chicken " and " fish " ? Anyone, anyone? > > > I think she was kidding.... > > I believe most people do not accept fish or chicken > as part > of a vegetarian's diet. Vegetarian, by definition, > means > not eating the flesh of animals: fish and chicken > are > animals. > > > Main Entry: veg·e·tar·i·an·ism > Pronunciation: -E- & - " ni-z & m > Function: noun > circa 1851 > : the theory or practice of living on a diet made up > of > vegetables , fruits, grains, nuts, and sometimes > eggs or > dairy products > > http://www.m-w.com (Merriam-Webster online) > -- > > It's *harmful* to vegetarians when people who eat > fish or > chicken refer to themselves as vegetarians....Here's > an > example of why it's harmful: > > ------------------------------- > Hypothetical example: > > I eat chicken, and call myself a 'vegetarian'. I go > to a > restaurant and discuss my dinner with the waiter: > what has > meat, etc. I settle on a vegetable/tofu stir-fry > although I > know it has chicken stock (the waiter told me it > does). > Fine. No problem. > > Now, you (a vegetarian) go to the same restaurant > and the > waiter assures you that the vegetable/tofu stir-fry > is > suitable for vegetarians (because he knew I ate it, > and I > called myself a vegetarian). You innocently eat it. > You > were deceived into eating chicken which is something > you > would NOT have wanted to do. > ---- > > I think it's much more fair when people who eat fish > or > chicken do NOT refer to themselves as vegetarians. > It keeps > confusion to a minimum and is fair to everyone. > > I personally am, btw, not a vegetarian at this > particular > moment in my life. I have been in the past, may be > in the > future, and am an active 'vegetarian sympathizer' > and > fellow-traveler. Most - not all - of my cooking is > vegetarian. > > Pat > > > > > -- > Pat Meadows > > CLICK DAILY TO FEED THE HUNGRY > United States: http://www.stopthehunger.com/ > International: http://www.thehungersite.com/ > Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 6, 2002 Report Share Posted December 6, 2002 Warning: long ramblings to follow: While I understand the reasoning for why some feel it is harmful for a " pesco " or " pollo " to label themselves as vegetarian I do it anyway. I am a pesco-vegetarian, but I eat fish very rarely. Most of the time when I do it's because I am in a restaurant that is very non-veggie friendly, and it is very busy and putting in a special request for a veggie dish is sure to irk the staff (I'm paranoid about someone sabotaging my food--I know it's a mental problem of mine). So I'm a pesco-veggie who mostly calls myself a veggie--but this is my reason for doing so: people really don't give a hoot about all the specifics about what I will or won't eat. My diet is interesting to me, but I try to be low-key and I don't want to assume that others are always fascinated by my eating habits. I'm afraid that if I immediately go into detail about my food choices that I will sound like a radical food nut who is making judgment calls about what other people eat. It's simply easier for me to decline a meat or chicken dish by saying that I'm a veg. I just don't want to go into a lot of specifics unless I am asked. This is usually when I first eat with someone. After I get to know people better I AM very careful to specify to them that I am not a real vegetarian and explain the differences between the different types. In fact, sometimes I even call myself a " fake vegetarian. " My husband likes the term " fake vegetarian " a lot and uses it all the time. However, don't really know why a person who eats chicken would call themselves a veggie, as there is chicken EVERYWHERE and in EVERYTHING as far as I can tell. They could just say they don't eat red meat, which is very acceptable to most people as many give it up for health reasons. I don't know how many countless boxes of food I can't buy at the supermarket because it seems that chicken fat is the most common seasoning used. Your restaurant choices are in no way limited if you eat of the beak. If I'm asking a wait person what ingredients are in a particular food, and they ask me if I'm a vegetarian I tell them I eat fish occasionally and skip labeling myself. I guess maybe it's better to say you have a " preference " for a veggie diet. Don't you just wish that restaurants labeled their menus better? Then we wouldn't have so many issues with how to label ourselves to people. I hate ordering a garden salad and receiving one with bacon on it when it wasn't specified on the menu. I don't even bother ordering soup as I KNOW it's sure to be tainted. *sigh* Anyway, sorry for the lengthy post. I'll try to cut my typing fingers short next time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 6, 2002 Report Share Posted December 6, 2002 <<I'm paranoid about someone sabotaging my food--I know it's a mental problem of mine). >> Ohh...no! no! Your not paranoid. It really goes on out there. The first time I saw it was several years ago on a 20/20 and they had cameras set up on cooks. It was horrible some of the things they would do and that is not the last place I have heard things. I am sure, as with everything, this is not representational of every cook or place- but geez. Its enough TO make you paranoid. I won't go into details but it was really nasty. Mad cookes spitting on food brought back, etc. The worse offenders were fast food pizza take-out. They said this was mostly due to young staff not being supervised. Along this line...I have also gotten leary of eating out much anymore. Everysince we became close friends with a man who works for our local health dept. He is the one that goes and does health checks on places. REALLY scary what he encounters at places that are cooking our food! Paranoid too! LOL With kindness, Beth Maija.Ray wrote: Warning: long ramblings to follow: While I understand the reasoning for why some feel it is harmful for a " pesco " or " pollo " to label themselves as vegetarian I do it anyway. I am a pesco-vegetarian, but I eat fish very rarely. Most of the time when I do it's because I am in a restaurant that is very non-veggie friendly, and it is very busy and putting in a special request for a veggie dish is sure to irk the staff (I'm paranoid about someone sabotaging my food--I know it's a mental problem of mine). So I'm a pesco-veggie who mostly calls myself a veggie--but this is my reason for doing so: people really don't give a hoot about all the specifics about what I will or won't eat. My diet is interesting to me, but I try to be low-key and I don't want to assume that others are always fascinated by my eating habits. I'm afraid that if I immediately go into detail about my food choices that I will sound like a radical food nut who is making judgment calls about what other people eat. It's simply easier for me to decline a meat or chicken dish by saying that I'm a veg. I just don't want to go into a lot of specifics unless I am asked. This is usually when I first eat with someone. After I get to know people better I AM very careful to specify to them that I am not a real vegetarian and explain the differences between the different types. In fact, sometimes I even call myself a " fake vegetarian. " My husband likes the term " fake vegetarian " a lot and uses it all the time. However, don't really know why a person who eats chicken would call themselves a veggie, as there is chicken EVERYWHERE and in EVERYTHING as far as I can tell. They could just say they don't eat red meat, which is very acceptable to most people as many give it up for health reasons. I don't know how many countless boxes of food I can't buy at the supermarket because it seems that chicken fat is the most common seasoning used. Your restaurant choices are in no way limited if you eat of the beak. If I'm asking a wait person what ingredients are in a particular food, and they ask me if I'm a vegetarian I tell them I eat fish occasionally and skip labeling myself. I guess maybe it's better to say you have a " preference " for a veggie diet. Don't you just wish that restaurants labeled their menus better? Then we wouldn't have so many issues with how to label ourselves to people. I hate ordering a garden salad and receiving one with bacon on it when it wasn't specified on the menu. I don't even bother ordering soup as I KNOW it's sure to be tainted. *sigh* Anyway, sorry for the lengthy post. I'll try to cut my typing fingers short next time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 6, 2002 Report Share Posted December 6, 2002 You know, I have seen all those shows as well. The only thing I see that kind of helps me be a little more optimistic is that it looks like most of those places are diner-like quality. They seem like they are out in the boonies and don't get much service, given that there is usually only 1 or 2 employees shown in the hidden cameras. Well, let's just say that this is what I like to believe in my own little world. Shawn " If, at first, you do succeed, try to hide your astonishment. " " If, at first, you don't succeed, destroy all evidence that you tried. " " The last four letters in " American " spell out " I Can " . " " Everything's ok in the end, if it's not ok, it's not the end. " ----Original Message Follows---- Beth Skeen <boomothergoose RE: lacto-ovo-DEVO!???/Pat Fri, 6 Dec 2002 08:04:49 -0800 (PST) <<I'm paranoid about someone sabotaging my food--I know it's a mental problem of mine). >> Ohh...no! no! Your not paranoid. It really goes on out there. The first time I saw it was several years ago on a 20/20 and they had cameras set up on cooks. It was horrible some of the things they would do and that is not the last place I have heard things. I am sure, as with everything, this is not representational of every cook or place- but geez. Its enough TO make you paranoid. I won't go into details but it was really nasty. Mad cookes spitting on food brought back, etc. The worse offenders were fast food pizza take-out. They said this was mostly due to young staff not being supervised. Along this line...I have also gotten leary of eating out much anymore. Everysince we became close friends with a man who works for our local health dept. He is the one that goes and does health checks on places. REALLY scary what he encounters at places that are cooking our food! Paranoid too! LOL With kindness, Beth Maija.Ray wrote: Warning: long ramblings to follow: While I understand the reasoning for why some feel it is harmful for a " pesco " or " pollo " to label themselves as vegetarian I do it anyway. I am a pesco-vegetarian, but I eat fish very rarely. Most of the time when I do it's because I am in a restaurant that is very non-veggie friendly, and it is very busy and putting in a special request for a veggie dish is sure to irk the staff (I'm paranoid about someone sabotaging my food--I know it's a mental problem of mine). So I'm a pesco-veggie who mostly calls myself a veggie--but this is my reason for doing so: people really don't give a hoot about all the specifics about what I will or won't eat. My diet is interesting to me, but I try to be low-key and I don't want to assume that others are always fascinated by my eating habits. I'm afraid that if I immediately go into detail about my food choices that I will sound like a radical food nut who is making judgment calls about what other people eat. It's simply easier for me to decline a meat or chicken dish by saying that I'm a veg. I just don't want to go into a lot of specifics unless I am asked. This is usually when I first eat with someone. After I get to know people better I AM very careful to specify to them that I am not a real vegetarian and explain the differences between the different types. In fact, sometimes I even call myself a " fake vegetarian. " My husband likes the term " fake vegetarian " a lot and uses it all the time. However, don't really know why a person who eats chicken would call themselves a veggie, as there is chicken EVERYWHERE and in EVERYTHING as far as I can tell. They could just say they don't eat red meat, which is very acceptable to most people as many give it up for health reasons. I don't know how many countless boxes of food I can't buy at the supermarket because it seems that chicken fat is the most common seasoning used. Your restaurant choices are in no way limited if you eat of the beak. If I'm asking a wait person what ingredients are in a particular food, and they ask me if I'm a vegetarian I tell them I eat fish occasionally and skip labeling myself. I guess maybe it's better to say you have a " preference " for a veggie diet. Don't you just wish that restaurants labeled their menus better? Then we wouldn't have so many issues with how to label ourselves to people. I hate ordering a garden salad and receiving one with bacon on it when it wasn't specified on the menu. I don't even bother ordering soup as I KNOW it's sure to be tainted. *sigh* Anyway, sorry for the lengthy post. I'll try to cut my typing fingers short next time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2002 Report Share Posted December 7, 2002 I hope I'm not stepping on anyones toes, I am a newbie here after all, but I agree with Pat. Some people who eat chicken or fish may call themselves vegetarian, but they aren't, they are just people who don't eat red meat. The definition of vegetarian in my dictionary is this: " 1. vegetarian -- (one who eats no meat or fish or (often) any animal products) " In fact calling yourself a pollo vegetarian etc is really a contradiction in terms. Once again, I hope no one is offended by me saying this, and I'm not a diehard fanatic veggie either, just a bit of an amatuer etymologist. bye, Kate - Allison Nations <allyanne2001 Friday, December 06, 2002 1:26 PM Re: lacto-ovo-DEVO!???/Pat > Oh no, it's quite true, believe it or not...These are > actual types of vegetarians. I personally believe all > meat should be eliminated so I am ovo lacto. But some > eat fish but nothing else, or chicken and nothing > else. They are still technically 'vegetarian.' It > sounds strange I know. They had that full list in a > Time issue a few months ago...It is also all over the > internet. Lots of debate over this I am sure... > > Warmly, > Allison > > --- Pat Meadows <pat wrote: > > On Thu, 05 Dec 2002 19:03:15 -0600, you wrote: > > > > >Oh wow, fabulous. Thank you very much Allison. > > Funny, I was just kidding > > >about the pollo, but sure enough, there it is. I > > know pollo is chicken in > > >Spanish and pretty sure pesco is Spanish as well. > > Are the other two Spanish > > >as well and where did these terms derive from? > > Perhaps it is just to mask > > >the terms " chicken " and " fish " ? Anyone, anyone? > > > > > I think she was kidding.... > > > > I believe most people do not accept fish or chicken > > as part > > of a vegetarian's diet. Vegetarian, by definition, > > means > > not eating the flesh of animals: fish and chicken > > are > > animals. > > > > > > Main Entry: veg·e·tar·i·an·ism > > Pronunciation: -E- & - " ni-z & m > > Function: noun > > circa 1851 > > : the theory or practice of living on a diet made up > > of > > vegetables , fruits, grains, nuts, and sometimes > > eggs or > > dairy products > > > > http://www.m-w.com (Merriam-Webster online) > > -- > > > > It's *harmful* to vegetarians when people who eat > > fish or > > chicken refer to themselves as vegetarians....Here's > > an > > example of why it's harmful: > > > > ------------------------------- > > Hypothetical example: > > > > I eat chicken, and call myself a 'vegetarian'. I go > > to a > > restaurant and discuss my dinner with the waiter: > > what has > > meat, etc. I settle on a vegetable/tofu stir-fry > > although I > > know it has chicken stock (the waiter told me it > > does). > > Fine. No problem. > > > > Now, you (a vegetarian) go to the same restaurant > > and the > > waiter assures you that the vegetable/tofu stir-fry > > is > > suitable for vegetarians (because he knew I ate it, > > and I > > called myself a vegetarian). You innocently eat it. > > You > > were deceived into eating chicken which is something > > you > > would NOT have wanted to do. > > ---- > > > > I think it's much more fair when people who eat fish > > or > > chicken do NOT refer to themselves as vegetarians. > > It keeps > > confusion to a minimum and is fair to everyone. > > > > I personally am, btw, not a vegetarian at this > > particular > > moment in my life. I have been in the past, may be > > in the > > future, and am an active 'vegetarian sympathizer' > > and > > fellow-traveler. Most - not all - of my cooking is > > vegetarian. > > > > Pat > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Pat Meadows > > > > CLICK DAILY TO FEED THE HUNGRY > > United States: http://www.stopthehunger.com/ > > International: http://www.thehungersite.com/ > > > > > > > Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. > http://mailplus. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 7, 2002 Report Share Posted December 7, 2002 " The only thing I see that kind of helps me be a little more optimistic is that it looks like most of those places are diner-like quality. " LOL, as a student I waitressed in a quite a few high class, expensive restaurants where I saw chefs doing similar things to meals for awkward customers, so don't feel too safe in them. Having said that I never saw anyone's meal being sabotaged because they asked for a veggie dish, it usually because the customer was downright rude, which is of course, no excuse. Kate - _- MatrixenO -_ Friday, December 06, 2002 10:35 PM RE: lacto-ovo-DEVO!???/Pat You know, I have seen all those shows as well. The only thing I see that kind of helps me be a little more optimistic is that it looks like most of those places are diner-like quality. They seem like they are out in the boonies and don't get much service, given that there is usually only 1 or 2 employees shown in the hidden cameras. Well, let's just say that this is what I like to believe in my own little world. Shawn " If, at first, you do succeed, try to hide your astonishment. " " If, at first, you don't succeed, destroy all evidence that you tried. " " The last four letters in " American " spell out " I Can " . " " Everything's ok in the end, if it's not ok, it's not the end. " ----Original Message Follows---- Beth Skeen <boomothergoose RE: lacto-ovo-DEVO!???/Pat Fri, 6 Dec 2002 08:04:49 -0800 (PST) <<I'm paranoid about someone sabotaging my food--I know it's a mental problem of mine). >> Ohh...no! no! Your not paranoid. It really goes on out there. The first time I saw it was several years ago on a 20/20 and they had cameras set up on cooks. It was horrible some of the things they would do and that is not the last place I have heard things. I am sure, as with everything, this is not representational of every cook or place- but geez. Its enough TO make you paranoid. I won't go into details but it was really nasty. Mad cookes spitting on food brought back, etc. The worse offenders were fast food pizza take-out. They said this was mostly due to young staff not being supervised. Along this line...I have also gotten leary of eating out much anymore. Everysince we became close friends with a man who works for our local health dept. He is the one that goes and does health checks on places. REALLY scary what he encounters at places that are cooking our food! Paranoid too! LOL With kindness, Beth Maija.Ray wrote: Warning: long ramblings to follow: While I understand the reasoning for why some feel it is harmful for a " pesco " or " pollo " to label themselves as vegetarian I do it anyway. I am a pesco-vegetarian, but I eat fish very rarely. Most of the time when I do it's because I am in a restaurant that is very non-veggie friendly, and it is very busy and putting in a special request for a veggie dish is sure to irk the staff (I'm paranoid about someone sabotaging my food--I know it's a mental problem of mine). So I'm a pesco-veggie who mostly calls myself a veggie--but this is my reason for doing so: people really don't give a hoot about all the specifics about what I will or won't eat. My diet is interesting to me, but I try to be low-key and I don't want to assume that others are always fascinated by my eating habits. I'm afraid that if I immediately go into detail about my food choices that I will sound like a radical food nut who is making judgment calls about what other people eat. It's simply easier for me to decline a meat or chicken dish by saying that I'm a veg. I just don't want to go into a lot of specifics unless I am asked. This is usually when I first eat with someone. After I get to know people better I AM very careful to specify to them that I am not a real vegetarian and explain the differences between the different types. In fact, sometimes I even call myself a " fake vegetarian. " My husband likes the term " fake vegetarian " a lot and uses it all the time. However, don't really know why a person who eats chicken would call themselves a veggie, as there is chicken EVERYWHERE and in EVERYTHING as far as I can tell. They could just say they don't eat red meat, which is very acceptable to most people as many give it up for health reasons. I don't know how many countless boxes of food I can't buy at the supermarket because it seems that chicken fat is the most common seasoning used. Your restaurant choices are in no way limited if you eat of the beak. If I'm asking a wait person what ingredients are in a particular food, and they ask me if I'm a vegetarian I tell them I eat fish occasionally and skip labeling myself. I guess maybe it's better to say you have a " preference " for a veggie diet. Don't you just wish that restaurants labeled their menus better? Then we wouldn't have so many issues with how to label ourselves to people. I hate ordering a garden salad and receiving one with bacon on it when it wasn't specified on the menu. I don't even bother ordering soup as I KNOW it's sure to be tainted. *sigh* Anyway, sorry for the lengthy post. I'll try to cut my typing fingers short next time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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