Guest guest Posted January 2, 2003 Report Share Posted January 2, 2003 If your Aunt knew that you were vegetarians then she should abide by your wishes. Sounds like she tried to pull a fast one on you by taking it (the ham bone) out. It's not your problem, it's hers. In the future if invited to eat maybe in a non threatening way just tell the host that you are vegetarian and that you won't be eating any animal products and would appreciate a heads up on things with ingred other than those that come from the Earth. (even if they have taken out the evidence, as if that counts, LOL) Robin in NC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 2, 2003 Report Share Posted January 2, 2003 Wow It feels like I have been away from the group for way too long! For all the newcomers I'm a vegetarian residing in Alabama. I'm so glad the holidays are finally over and can be away from the family for a while now. Some of them are just not very veggie-friendly if you get my drift. Example: Christmas day..me and my man had just piled up our plates with food. I've been a vegetarian for over 5 years so it's nothing new to any family members. I had not yet taken a bite of the green beans when Thomas said at the table " I don't think we can have these green beans. Isn't that a piece of meat? " . The table fell silent and and my aunt who prepared them did not say a word. She didn't say anything so he had to ask her do these have any meat in them. She very huffily replied, " I put a ham bone it when they were cooking but I took it out! " He & I are not very confrontational so we just did not say anything and did not eat them. She kept looking at our plates and everyone could tell my aunt was getting increasingly angry b/c we did not eat her beans and they were the only things left on our plate. She didn't even tell us good-bye when she left b/c we didn't eat her pork-infused beans. Gosh this sounds hostile, karen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 2, 2003 Report Share Posted January 2, 2003 Geeesh, Karen I'm sorry your Aunt put you and your man in that position. I hope that situation and her grudge didn't ruin too much of your holidays (I'd bet yall didn't let it get to ya much). It sounds like if she could have gotten away with it she would have let you eat them pork fatted green beans. Most of my family is the same way. It's ashame that people who are so insecure about not being able to have a meal without a Flinstone sized slab of meat on their plates, can't let those of us that can, live our own lives respectfully in peace. (Besides if she would have made those beans veggie-like it prolly would have saved her some energy without having to deal with that bone thingy.) Oh btw, Rant and Vent ON!!! Preach preach!! Cheers, Shawn " If, at first, you do succeed, try to hide your astonishment. " " If, at first, you don't succeed, destroy all evidence that you tried. " " The last four letters in " American " spell out " I Can " . " " Everything's ok in the end, if it's not ok, it's not the end. " ----Original Message Follows---- " bluetulipz <bluetulipz " <bluetulipz holiday rant, sorry need ta vent Thu, 02 Jan 2003 23:44:08 -0000 Wow It feels like I have been away from the group for way too long! For all the newcomers I'm a vegetarian residing in Alabama. I'm so glad the holidays are finally over and can be away from the family for a while now. Some of them are just not very veggie-friendly if you get my drift. Example: Christmas day..me and my man had just piled up our plates with food. I've been a vegetarian for over 5 years so it's nothing new to any family members. I had not yet taken a bite of the green beans when Thomas said at the table " I don't think we can have these green beans. Isn't that a piece of meat? " . The table fell silent and and my aunt who prepared them did not say a word. She didn't say anything so he had to ask her do these have any meat in them. She very huffily replied, " I put a ham bone it when they were cooking but I took it out! " He & I are not very confrontational so we just did not say anything and did not eat them. She kept looking at our plates and everyone could tell my aunt was getting increasingly angry b/c we did not eat her beans and they were the only things left on our plate. She didn't even tell us good-bye when she left b/c we didn't eat her pork-infused beans. Gosh this sounds hostile, karen _______________ MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 2, 2003 Report Share Posted January 2, 2003 Aw, Karen, that is kind of funny. :::stifles a snicker::: I mean, I am sorry she was miffed and that you had to endure an uncomfortable situation like that, but dang, what was that aunt thinking? " I cooked them with a hambone, but I took it out! " ???? People are too much sometimes. Never ceases to amaze me how some just don't get it. Definately _her_ problem, not yours. *hug* Welcome back; breathe deep, you're home now. :::wine glass salute::: ~ Feral ~ Which of us has not been stunned by the beauty of an animal's skin or its flexibility in motion? -Marianne Moore , " bluetulipz <bluetulipz> " < bluetulipz> wrote: She very huffily replied, " I put a ham bone it when they were > cooking but I took it out! " He & I are not very confrontational so we > just did not say anything and did not eat them. She kept looking at > our plates and everyone could tell my aunt was getting increasingly > angry b/c we did not eat her beans Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 2, 2003 Report Share Posted January 2, 2003 " It's ashame that people who are so insecure about not being able to have a meal without a Flinstone sized slab of meat on their plates, can't let those of us that can, live our own lives respectfully in peace. " I re-read my post as I was deleting. Karen just to clarify, in NO way was I implying that comment as to your Aunt (the only relatives I have opinions of are my own ). This is just my little generalization/rationalization as to those who find difficulty of those that choose to be a veggie or vegan. Sorry if there was any offense, I probably could have separated that statement from the rest better. Sincerely, Shawn " If, at first, you do succeed, try to hide your astonishment. " " If, at first, you don't succeed, destroy all evidence that you tried. " " The last four letters in " American " spell out " I Can " . " " Everything's ok in the end, if it's not ok, it's not the end. " ----Original Message Follows---- " _- MatrixenO -_ " <matrixeno Re: holiday rant, sorry need ta vent Thu, 02 Jan 2003 18:20:32 -0600 Geeesh, Karen I'm sorry your Aunt put you and your man in that position. I hope that situation and her grudge didn't ruin too much of your holidays (I'd bet yall didn't let it get to ya much). It sounds like if she could have gotten away with it she would have let you eat them pork fatted green beans. Most of my family is the same way. It's ashame that people who are so insecure about not being able to have a meal without a Flinstone sized slab of meat on their plates, can't let those of us that can, live our own lives respectfully in peace. (Besides if she would have made those beans veggie-like it prolly would have saved her some energy without having to deal with that bone thingy.) Oh btw, Rant and Vent ON!!! Preach preach!! Cheers, Shawn " If, at first, you do succeed, try to hide your astonishment. " " If, at first, you don't succeed, destroy all evidence that you tried. " " The last four letters in " American " spell out " I Can " . " " Everything's ok in the end, if it's not ok, it's not the end. " ----Original Message Follows---- " bluetulipz <bluetulipz " <bluetulipz holiday rant, sorry need ta vent Thu, 02 Jan 2003 23:44:08 -0000 Wow It feels like I have been away from the group for way too long! For all the newcomers I'm a vegetarian residing in Alabama. I'm so glad the holidays are finally over and can be away from the family for a while now. Some of them are just not very veggie-friendly if you get my drift. Example: Christmas day..me and my man had just piled up our plates with food. I've been a vegetarian for over 5 years so it's nothing new to any family members. I had not yet taken a bite of the green beans when Thomas said at the table " I don't think we can have these green beans. Isn't that a piece of meat? " . The table fell silent and and my aunt who prepared them did not say a word. She didn't say anything so he had to ask her do these have any meat in them. She very huffily replied, " I put a ham bone it when they were cooking but I took it out! " He & I are not very confrontational so we just did not say anything and did not eat them. She kept looking at our plates and everyone could tell my aunt was getting increasingly angry b/c we did not eat her beans and they were the only things left on our plate. She didn't even tell us good-bye when she left b/c we didn't eat her pork-infused beans. Gosh this sounds hostile, karen _______________ MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail _______________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 2, 2003 Report Share Posted January 2, 2003 " Feral <terebinthus> " <terebinthus> wrote: > People are too much sometimes. Never ceases to > amaze me how some just don't get it. Definately _her_ problem, not > yours. I like to think its this (they don’t *get* it) rather than outright sabotage. I really think its true, at least in a lot of cases. Two recent examples: I called my mother on Dec 30th to wish her a happy birthday, and we were discussing plans for New Year’s Eve. I mentioned to her that I was going out for dinner, to a steakhouse, cuz the bf wanted steak, and I was hopeful that there was SOMETHING on the menu I could eat. Her response? A little meat won’t hurt you, and would probably do you some good. Honestly, she simply doesn’t understand. I’ve ALWAYS had trouble getting enough protein and iron in my diet, cuz I never liked the taste of meat much, and never thought about replacing it. I was prone to anemia, etc. When she heard that I had completely stopped eating meat (including poultry and fish, which she doesn’t consider meat) she was concerned for my health, not for her inconvenience when I visit. I explained to her that I had just had some bloodwork done (follow up to my ongoing trials and tribulations with my immune system problems) and my protein and iron levels were the best they’ve been in over a decade, right exactly where they should be, because I’ve actually been consciously including foods rich in those things in my diet since I stopped eating meat. She was sincerely relieved to hear that I’m actually healthier now than when I was sporadically eating meat. (And btw, there wasn’t a single vegetarian entrée on the menu; I had a salad and a side order of spinach, then came home and cooked. Rather annoying, after spending over $100 on dinner.) The bf is actually supportive of my eating habits, and usually goes out of his way to find places where we can both eat happily (which is why he was craving steak, I guess – he hasn’t had one in months and months, and why I was agreeable about going to a steakhouse for New Year’s Eve, since he’s so accommodating about my eating habits). When I was sick he wanted to come over and cook for me, since I wasn’t eating, but all his “double secret recipes” have meat in them. His solution? He was going to come and cook his super duper chicken and peppers, and I could just not eat the chicken. When I asked him if he could cook some of it without the chicken he simply didn’t *get it*. To him, so long as I wasn’t consuming anything that had a face, he was respecting my choices. The fact that it was all cooked together and therefore wasn’t something I’d eat simply didn’t make sense to him. Most people in my life have been quite supportive of my choice to stop eating meat again, especially since I’m doing it sensibly this time (In the past I’ve gotten pretty sick when I’ve given up meat). They really don’t understand the intricacies of it, and when I try to explain I feel like I’m lecturing them. Since this is *my* choice, and not something I feel any need to push on others, I don’t want to do that. Good thing I love them – they mean well, but they’re dense sometimes! LOL -- Sherri " There's two theories to arguing with a woman. Neither one works. " - Will Rogers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 2, 2003 Report Share Posted January 2, 2003 Hi All, Interesting stories about the non-vegetarians understand & interperate vegetarianism. Karen, I think the way you handled the situation was good, it seems your aunt was the one with the problem as you stated she was reluctant to tell you how she cooked the beans. This to me indicates that she was trying to slip you some meat rather than not realising that you wouldn't find it acceptable. Alternatively she was more offended that you wouldn't eat her cooking becuase you had a belief that eating meat was wrong. Personally my grandmother is really good about what I do and don't eat & will happily tell me what's in everything, the only problem is she still doesn't see fish as being a meat product and will tell me something has no meat in it when it has fish, which usually means I have to also ask if it has fish, but she's fairly understanding that I won't eat fish foods. On the other hand I once went to a councillor who made up his mind the reason I was having emotional problems was becuase I was a vegan (apparently the fact I had serious issues with my family, was in an abusive relationship & had low self esteem had nothing to do with it) and promptly sent me off to have blood tests for everything under the sun. He was quite put out when they all came back being normal. I am not seeing him again My GP & lung specialist when refering to me call me " Lisa the vegan " which is rather amusing. I find it interesting that people are happy to accomodate you if you have a religious belief, a health problem or even if you want to lose weight so require something low fat. If you have an ethical issue with a particular food however people take a totally different point of view and are offended that you won't eat their cooking or are unwilling to accomodate you. What do other people think about this? Sherri, it's great your boyfriend and yourself can be supportive of each others dietary differences, it seems you really care about each other alot, I'm sure he doesn't mean to be offensive to you by taking the meat bits out of food he's prepared, as he's otherwise supportive maybe you could sit down & explain to him exactly why you don't find it acceptable? A wider question for the whole group, mixed vegetarian & non-vegetarian relationships, do people think they can work? Does anyone have amusing stories from this type of situation? Regards to the fish, LisA ICQ#: 15562604 *** www.gu.uwa.edu.au/clubs/vegies *** " I think---therefore I'm single... " -Lizz Winstead Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 2, 2003 Report Share Posted January 2, 2003 Shawn, how polite and considerate of you! But no offense was taken. I am in total agreement with your statement. I also wanted to thank everyone else for their supportive responses as well. Looks like a few of us have to deal with this sort of thing with those close to us who are non-vegs. I THINK my aunt just sorta felt like the ham bone doesn't really count as meat. I'm trying real hard to convince myself she wasn't trying to fool me but who knows. " I'm trying real hard " (in my best Samuel L. Jackson voice from Pulp Fiction). Karen <matrixeno@h...> wrote: > " It's ashame that people who are so insecure about not being able to have a > meal without a Flinstone sized slab of meat on their plates, can't let those > of us that can, live our own lives respectfully in peace. " > > I re-read my post as I was deleting. > Karen just to clarify, in NO way was I implying that comment as to your Aunt > (the only relatives I have opinions of are my own ). This is just my > little generalization/rationalization as to those who find difficulty of > those that choose to be a veggie or vegan. Sorry if there was any offense, > I probably could have separated that statement from the rest better. > > Sincerely, > Shawn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 3, 2003 Report Share Posted January 3, 2003 On Thu, 02 Jan 2003 18:20:32 -0600, you wrote: >Geeesh, Karen I'm sorry your Aunt put you and your man in that position. I >hope that situation and her grudge didn't ruin too much of your holidays >(I'd bet yall didn't let it get to ya much). It sounds like if she could >have gotten away with it she would have let you eat them pork fatted green >beans. Most of my family is the same way. It's ashame that people who are >so insecure about not being able to have a meal without a Flinstone sized >slab of meat on their plates, can't let those of us that can, live our own >lives respectfully in peace. I can never understand this, I've seen it over and over and over: so many people feel *threatened* by anything different, any alternative, and especially by someone eating a different diet, it seems. It's just a mystery to me WHY they feel this way. Pat -- Pat Meadows CLICK DAILY TO FEED THE HUNGRY United States: http://www.stopthehunger.com/ International: http://www.thehungersite.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 3, 2003 Report Share Posted January 3, 2003 On Fri, 3 Jan 2003 11:21:55 +0800 (WST), you wrote: <snip> > >I find it interesting that people are happy to accomodate you if you have >a religious belief, a health problem or even if you want to lose weight so >require something low fat. If you have an ethical issue with a particular >food however people take a totally different point of view and are >offended that you won't eat their cooking or are unwilling to accomodate >you. What do other people think about this? > I agree with you, btw, that many people seem to feel *especially* threatened by vegetarianism... Although it's a mystery to me, here's my best guess. I think a still, small voice inside these people is telling them that they shouldn't kill and eat animals, and they are afraid because they literally *do not know* what vegetarians eat. They are afraid that if they listen to this little voice inside, if they do what they know in their hearts is right, they will actually starve. The word 'vegetarian' implies vegetables and I cannot tell you how many people I've run into who think that vegetarians are somehow subsisting on a diet consisting solely of vegetables. Then too (if my guess about this is right) people tend to resent and dislike those who they feel are morally better, stronger than they are. Meat-eaters generally feel that giving up meat is a SACRIFICE, something painful to do, and that vegetarians eat wimpy, tasteless food and only eat vegetables (actually, nothing could be farther from the truth). They think that vegetarians are constantly struggling with the urge to eat meat .... and that if they become vegetarians, they'll have this constant internal battle. When I have been in a vegetarian period of my life, I've certainly never struggled or suffered from not eating meat, never wanted it, was totally happy without it. But the meat-eaters don't know that's how it is. There. Overlong message. Sorry. Pat >Sherri, it's great your boyfriend and yourself can be supportive of each >others dietary differences, it seems you really care about each other >alot, I'm sure he doesn't mean to be offensive to you by taking the meat >bits out of food he's prepared, as he's otherwise supportive maybe you >could sit down & explain to him exactly why you don't find it acceptable? >A wider question for the whole group, mixed vegetarian & non-vegetarian >relationships, do people think they can work? Does anyone have amusing >stories from this type of situation? > >Regards to the fish, >LisA >ICQ#: 15562604 >*** www.gu.uwa.edu.au/clubs/vegies *** > > " I think---therefore I'm single... " > -Lizz Winstead > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 3, 2003 Report Share Posted January 3, 2003 Doesn't sound hostile to me. Hostility was what happened to you when you found you couldn't eat something on your plate. If you had had allergies or religious prohibitions, no one would have been so hostile - or maybe they would ;=) Chin up - you're on friendly territory now. best, pat - in ontario Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 3, 2003 Report Share Posted January 3, 2003 I had to share in this topic (sorry another long one): People DO feel threatened by vegetarianism as most of us have experienced. I'm always amazed at how many people try to tease me into feeling like an outcast or do the opposite and put me on a pedestal as an example of incredible internal fortitude and self discipline. Once a friend of mine had a small lunch for the priest at her church and invited me, and the priest expressed to me that he admired my ability to self sacrifice and my commitment and morality. I just laughed and said it was no sacrifice and I'm not that disciplined. Plus, if he knew anything about my personal morals he probably wouldn't have been that impressed. The " aren't you unhealthy? " thing always comes up too. Just recently I went to the doctor for an issue, and he took a blood sample which surprised me because I've gone to the doctor for this thing before (lactose intolerance!) and they've never taken my blood before. This new doctor asked me if I ate enough fruits and vegetables and I told him " I'm 95% vegetarian (pescotarian) so yes, I eat a lot. " He questioned me hard about my eating habits then ordered the blood sample. A bit later he saw the results and said " well, your hemoglobin (protein indicator) and iron levels are fine. " I had zero symptoms of anemia! He just checked it because of his personal biases against my diet. *sigh* (I am Queen of the Parenthetical Aside: if you are concerned about iron--buy a cast iron skillet to cook in. A small amount of iron will leech from the skillet and infuse your food. This is why raisins were once considered an iron rich food--the grapes were dried on sheets of iron.) I've found the best way to convince people that you are healthy, your food is good, and you sacrifice nothing is to COOK FOR THEM! My husband was a carnivore but is now 95% veg like me. When people ask him if I forced him into it he always responds the same: " She's a great cook. I don't miss anything. If she cooked for you you wouldn't miss it either. " Having really good veggie food makes eating vegetarian easy. I had a friend who was raised on a hippie commune that was vegetarian, and she grew up to be a totally unrepentant carnivore. When I asked her why she said that the vegetarian food she was raised on was " Brown. Everything was brown and bland. Brown rice, brown lentils, no spices, bland. " As we know, things have really changed since then. The best way to prove to someone you don't subsist on bland brown rice and salad is to serve them dinner. Case in point: Christmas Eve my father and stepmom came over for dinner. I told them ahead of time " If you want flesh for dinner you'll have to bring it, but I'll have plenty of food here if you don't feel like cooking. " They were brave and didn't bring any meat. We had a shepherd's pie, a sweet potato casserole, roasted brussels sprouts, cornbread stuffing, maple-glazed squash, a salad, and a cherry pie. They raved about how much they loved it. My dad said he was surprised everything was so tasty and so filling. He even called me back a few days later to tell me that he thought I was a really good cook and that he was surprised at how much he enjoyed the dinner. I told him it was an extra special compliment coming from him because he is a confirmed carnivore. He said " That I am. And it is a special compliment. " When I think back now I'm very proud because out of the whole meal, only 1 dish was not vegan, and there was no cheese in anything. So I guess my advice is: invite the naysayers over for dinner! Maija Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 3, 2003 Report Share Posted January 3, 2003 I don't know your aunt, but I do know mine and they really are convinced that things like " mystery meat " and cream of chicken soup are so far removed from their animal lineage that they really do not contain any meat anymore!! and forget broth since it doesn't even have any pieces of meat! I really have to be vigilant of the " Undercover Broccoli Soup " made with the above ingredients, since they really are making an effort and " I made it just for you with no meat " in their world means, " Because it was processed beyond recognition, it is no longer meat. " Just a thought from the devil's advocate. -dawn , rwhitt1212@a... wrote: > If your Aunt knew that you were vegetarians then she should abide by your > wishes. Sounds like she tried to pull a fast one on you by taking it (the ham > bone) out. It's not your problem, it's hers. In the future if invited to eat > maybe in a non threatening way just tell the host that you are vegetarian and > that you won't be eating any animal products and would appreciate a heads up > on things with ingred other than those that come from the Earth. (even if > they have taken out the evidence, as if that counts, LOL) > Robin in NC > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 3, 2003 Report Share Posted January 3, 2003 Bravo! Great advice, Maija. ~ Feral ~ No pessimist ever discovered the secrets of the stars, or sailed to an uncharted land, or opened a new heaven to the human spirit. - Helen Keller ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~> , Maija.Ray@W... wrote: So I guess my advice is: invite the naysayers over for dinner! Maija Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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