Guest guest Posted February 4, 2003 Report Share Posted February 4, 2003 I agree that the world is FULL of tragedies that happen daily and we are often oblivious. I have mixed thoughts about the space program. No, I don't see any benefit from it, but at the same time - it truly is a wonder that we have this ability. And I have to admit my all time favorite movie is " The Right Stuff. " But I think people are absolutely nuts to want to do something like that. And I really don't see the need. As awesome as it is. And as you said - to be an astronaut is a dream of so many people. I certainly wouldn't want to stand in the way of anyone's dreams. Warmly, Allison --- " dave <dave4sale " <dave4sale wrote: > oh boy, I have a feeling i'm going to get some angry > replies for this > post. that's fine, but just remember this is only my > opinion and you > all have a right to disagree with it or inform me of > some fact which > i have overlooked or am unaware of. > > I sympathize with the loved ones of those who died > in the crash, of > course, death is rarely good news to me. There have > of course been > lots of murders that haven't made the headlines. > But i'd like to > express my many qualms with the space program. > Tragedies like these > could be avoided and precious money be saved if we > buried it. > > here's why i don't think it's so great: First, it > seems the primary > purpose of space voyages is a military one. we > already know how > super dave feels about the military. Second, rocket > launches cause a > tremendous amount of pollution- i think i read a > rough analogy of the > equivalent of the average annual exhaust of 100,000 > cars. Third, if > we started taking better care of our planet, there'd > be no need to > fantasize about colonizing mars. My future > father-law-in is a big > space buff and insists that we'll be able to within > 50 years or so. > But if we keep living the wasteful polluting way we > do, moving to > mars will just delay society's inevitable downfall. > Fourth, the > space program is just one more domain which nations > feel the need to > compete; if we ever want to live in a peaceful > world, we have to stop > competing with everyone; i know i sound like a > damned pinko, but oh > well. > > and I know some kids grow up dreaming of seeing the > earth from the > moon's surface but well the earth would look a > helluva lot prettier > if we stopped sending out people in giant smog > factories to look at > it. so can anyone tell me any benefits of the space > program? > > > , " Megan > Milligan " > <yasminduran@l...> wrote: > > I'll be the first to admit I'm ethnocentric a lot > of the time ( & a > moderate > > registered republican), but stuff like that at > least helps me keep > my head > > screwed on straight & from developing too much > tunnel vision. > > > > Megan > > > > " Excesses are eventually their own undoing, and > that keeps me > hopeful. " > > -- Paul Harvey on the state of media today (Larry > King Live - > 1/30/2003) > > > > - > > > > Thanks, Megan, for sharing the editorial. > Sometimes we are so > detached > > from other countries views on things...it seems > like its " ALL ABOUT > > US " unfortunately. > > > > Rose > > Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2003 Report Share Posted February 4, 2003 Nor would I seek to diminish the dreams of others. Still, I wonder what kind of a world we'd have if instead of " mass production " and every other kind of " mass technology, " we'd have focused our energies on " appropriate technology " to fill " human needs " rather that " massive bank accounts. " Don't get me wrong, having money is necessary. However, when deception and greed is involved in getting it, we need to act. DaveO Allison Nations [allyanne2001] >>[re: space program]...As awesome as it is. And as you said - to be an astronaut is a dream of so many people. I certainly wouldn't want to stand in the way of anyone's dreams.<< Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2003 Report Share Posted February 4, 2003 But..... how would we survive without velcro?? - Allison Nations Tuesday, February 04, 2003 9:48 AM Re: no anger here, super D I agree that the world is FULL of tragedies that happen daily and we are often oblivious. I have mixed thoughts about the space program. No, I don't see any benefit from it, but at the same time - it truly is a wonder that we have this ability. And I have to admit my all time favorite movie is " The Right Stuff. " But I think people are absolutely nuts to want to do something like that. And I really don't see the need. As awesome as it is. And as you said - to be an astronaut is a dream of so many people. I certainly wouldn't want to stand in the way of anyone's dreams. Warmly, Allison --- " dave <dave4sale " <dave4sale wrote: > oh boy, I have a feeling i'm going to get some angry > replies for this > post. that's fine, but just remember this is only my > opinion and you > all have a right to disagree with it or inform me of > some fact which > i have overlooked or am unaware of. > > I sympathize with the loved ones of those who died > in the crash, of > course, death is rarely good news to me. There have > of course been > lots of murders that haven't made the headlines. > But i'd like to > express my many qualms with the space program. > Tragedies like these > could be avoided and precious money be saved if we > buried it. > > here's why i don't think it's so great: First, it > seems the primary > purpose of space voyages is a military one. we > already know how > super dave feels about the military. Second, rocket > launches cause a > tremendous amount of pollution- i think i read a > rough analogy of the > equivalent of the average annual exhaust of 100,000 > cars. Third, if > we started taking better care of our planet, there'd > be no need to > fantasize about colonizing mars. My future > father-law-in is a big > space buff and insists that we'll be able to within > 50 years or so. > But if we keep living the wasteful polluting way we > do, moving to > mars will just delay society's inevitable downfall. > Fourth, the > space program is just one more domain which nations > feel the need to > compete; if we ever want to live in a peaceful > world, we have to stop > competing with everyone; i know i sound like a > damned pinko, but oh > well. > > and I know some kids grow up dreaming of seeing the > earth from the > moon's surface but well the earth would look a > helluva lot prettier > if we stopped sending out people in giant smog > factories to look at > it. so can anyone tell me any benefits of the space > program? > > > , " Megan > Milligan " > <yasminduran@l...> wrote: > > I'll be the first to admit I'm ethnocentric a lot > of the time ( & a > moderate > > registered republican), but stuff like that at > least helps me keep > my head > > screwed on straight & from developing too much > tunnel vision. > > > > Megan > > > > " Excesses are eventually their own undoing, and > that keeps me > hopeful. " > > -- Paul Harvey on the state of media today (Larry > King Live - > 1/30/2003) > > > > - > > > > Thanks, Megan, for sharing the editorial. > Sometimes we are so > detached > > from other countries views on things...it seems > like its " ALL ABOUT > > US " unfortunately. > > > > Rose > > Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2003 Report Share Posted February 4, 2003 i know what you mean, i feel like who the hell am i to tell someone their dream is bad. but the problem with dreams is that they're unrealistic often. hey i used to dream of being a rock star even though i have very limited musical talent. even if i was great i still would have a better chance of getting struck by lightning. so even though so many people would love to go into space, only a very few will ever realize that dream anyhow. that being said, is the dream of a few people worth all the problems? , Allison Nations <allyanne2001> wrote: > I agree that the world is FULL of tragedies that > happen daily and we are often oblivious. > > I have mixed thoughts about the space program. No, I > don't see any benefit from it, but at the same time - > it truly is a wonder that we have this ability. And I > have to admit my all time favorite movie is " The Right > Stuff. " But I think people are absolutely nuts to > want to do something like that. And I really don't > see the need. As awesome as it is. > And as you said - to be an astronaut is a dream of so > many people. I certainly wouldn't want to stand in > the way of anyone's dreams. > Warmly, > Allison > > > --- " dave <dave4sale> " <dave4sale> > wrote: > > oh boy, I have a feeling i'm going to get some angry > > replies for this > > post. that's fine, but just remember this is only my > > opinion and you > > all have a right to disagree with it or inform me of > > some fact which > > i have overlooked or am unaware of. > > > > I sympathize with the loved ones of those who died > > in the crash, of > > course, death is rarely good news to me. There have > > of course been > > lots of murders that haven't made the headlines. > > But i'd like to > > express my many qualms with the space program. > > Tragedies like these > > could be avoided and precious money be saved if we > > buried it. > > > > here's why i don't think it's so great: First, it > > seems the primary > > purpose of space voyages is a military one. we > > already know how > > super dave feels about the military. Second, rocket > > launches cause a > > tremendous amount of pollution- i think i read a > > rough analogy of the > > equivalent of the average annual exhaust of 100,000 > > cars. Third, if > > we started taking better care of our planet, there'd > > be no need to > > fantasize about colonizing mars. My future > > father-law-in is a big > > space buff and insists that we'll be able to within > > 50 years or so. > > But if we keep living the wasteful polluting way we > > do, moving to > > mars will just delay society's inevitable downfall. > > Fourth, the > > space program is just one more domain which nations > > feel the need to > > compete; if we ever want to live in a peaceful > > world, we have to stop > > competing with everyone; i know i sound like a > > damned pinko, but oh > > well. > > > > and I know some kids grow up dreaming of seeing the > > earth from the > > moon's surface but well the earth would look a > > helluva lot prettier > > if we stopped sending out people in giant smog > > factories to look at > > it. so can anyone tell me any benefits of the space > > program? > > > > > > , " Megan > > Milligan " > > <yasminduran@l...> wrote: > > > I'll be the first to admit I'm ethnocentric a lot > > of the time ( & a > > moderate > > > registered republican), but stuff like that at > > least helps me keep > > my head > > > screwed on straight & from developing too much > > tunnel vision. > > > > > > Megan > > > > > > " Excesses are eventually their own undoing, and > > that keeps me > > hopeful. " > > > -- Paul Harvey on the state of media today (Larry > > King Live - > > 1/30/2003) > > > > > > - > > > > > > Thanks, Megan, for sharing the editorial. > > Sometimes we are so > > detached > > > from other countries views on things...it seems > > like its " ALL ABOUT > > > US " unfortunately. > > > > > > Rose > > > > > > > > > Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. > http://mailplus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2003 Report Share Posted February 4, 2003 No, not worth the problems at all. Warmly, Allison --- " dave <dave4sale " <dave4sale wrote: > i know what you mean, i feel like who the hell am i > to tell someone > their dream is bad. but the problem with dreams is > that they're > unrealistic often. hey i used to dream of being a > rock star even > though i have very limited musical talent. even if i > was great i > still would have a better chance of getting struck > by lightning. so > even though so many people would love to go into > space, only a very > few will ever realize that dream anyhow. that being > said, is the > dream of a few people worth all the problems? > > > , Allison > Nations > <allyanne2001> wrote: > > I agree that the world is FULL of tragedies that > > happen daily and we are often oblivious. > > > > I have mixed thoughts about the space program. > No, I > > don't see any benefit from it, but at the same > time - > > it truly is a wonder that we have this ability. > And I > > have to admit my all time favorite movie is " The > Right > > Stuff. " But I think people are absolutely nuts > to > > want to do something like that. And I really > don't > > see the need. As awesome as it is. > > And as you said - to be an astronaut is a dream of > so > > many people. I certainly wouldn't want to stand > in > > the way of anyone's dreams. > > Warmly, > > Allison > > > > > > --- " dave <dave4sale> " <dave4sale> > > wrote: > > > oh boy, I have a feeling i'm going to get some > angry > > > replies for this > > > post. that's fine, but just remember this is > only my > > > opinion and you > > > all have a right to disagree with it or inform > me of > > > some fact which > > > i have overlooked or am unaware of. > > > > > > I sympathize with the loved ones of those who > died > > > in the crash, of > > > course, death is rarely good news to me. There > have > > > of course been > > > lots of murders that haven't made the headlines. > > > > But i'd like to > > > express my many qualms with the space program. > > > Tragedies like these > > > could be avoided and precious money be saved if > we > > > buried it. > > > > > > here's why i don't think it's so great: First, > it > > > seems the primary > > > purpose of space voyages is a military one. we > > > already know how > > > super dave feels about the military. Second, > rocket > > > launches cause a > > > tremendous amount of pollution- i think i read a > > > rough analogy of the > > > equivalent of the average annual exhaust of > 100,000 > > > cars. Third, if > > > we started taking better care of our planet, > there'd > > > be no need to > > > fantasize about colonizing mars. My future > > > father-law-in is a big > > > space buff and insists that we'll be able to > within > > > 50 years or so. > > > But if we keep living the wasteful polluting way > we > > > do, moving to > > > mars will just delay society's inevitable > downfall. > > > Fourth, the > > > space program is just one more domain which > nations > > > feel the need to > > > compete; if we ever want to live in a peaceful > > > world, we have to stop > > > competing with everyone; i know i sound like a > > > damned pinko, but oh > > > well. > > > > > > and I know some kids grow up dreaming of seeing > the > > > earth from the > > > moon's surface but well the earth would look a > > > helluva lot prettier > > > if we stopped sending out people in giant smog > > > factories to look at > > > it. so can anyone tell me any benefits of the > space > > > program? > > > > > > > > > , > " Megan > > > Milligan " > > > <yasminduran@l...> wrote: > > > > I'll be the first to admit I'm ethnocentric a > lot > > > of the time ( & a > > > moderate > > > > registered republican), but stuff like that at > > > least helps me keep > > > my head > > > > screwed on straight & from developing too much > > > tunnel vision. > > > > > > > > Megan > > > > > > > > " Excesses are eventually their own undoing, > and > > > that keeps me > > > hopeful. " > > > > -- Paul Harvey on the state of media today > (Larry > > > King Live - > > > 1/30/2003) > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > Thanks, Megan, for sharing the editorial. > > > Sometimes we are so > > > detached > > > > from other countries views on things...it > seems > > > like its " ALL ABOUT > > > > US " unfortunately. > > > > > > > > Rose > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up > now. > > http://mailplus. > > Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2003 Report Share Posted February 4, 2003 , " Laura Letizia " <lletizia@m...> wrote: > But..... how would we survive without velcro?? lol, i hope you're kidding. hard to tell without hearing you speak the words though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2003 Report Share Posted February 4, 2003 heh, brings to mind an episode of star trek: enteprise where the vulcan's great great grandmother visited earth in 1957 with her crew (they crash landed there) & to get a boy into college in a poor pennsylvania mining town, she took a bag to a patent office & showed them the velcro strip holding it together. hence, vulcans from outer space gave us velcro. Megan - > But..... how would we survive without velcro?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2003 Report Share Posted February 4, 2003 LOL, yes, I am being silly!! Velcro happens to be one of the products that was originally invented for use by astronauts that we take for granted today. Of course, I am not AT ALL suggesting that the space program is worth it just for the velcro! LOL Take Care, Laura - dave <dave4sale Tuesday, February 04, 2003 1:47 PM Re: no anger here, super D , " Laura Letizia " <lletizia@m...> wrote: > But..... how would we survive without velcro?? lol, i hope you're kidding. hard to tell without hearing you speak the words though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2003 Report Share Posted February 4, 2003 " No, I don't see any benefit from it, " I take into consideration that programs such as NASA are developed not merely for our lifespans. The studies and developments from such programs might possibly be relevant contributions for the future of mankind. Just for example: We are not trying to find a cure for cancer just for us but for those who would unfortunately need it 1000's of years from now. Shawn " If, at first, you do succeed, try to hide your astonishment. " " If, at first, you don't succeed, destroy all evidence that you tried. " " The last four letters in " American " spell out " I Can " . " " Everything's ok in the end, if it's not ok, it's not the end. " ----Original Message Follows---- Allison Nations <allyanne2001 Re: no anger here, super D Tue, 4 Feb 2003 09:48:29 -0800 (PST) I agree that the world is FULL of tragedies that happen daily and we are often oblivious. I have mixed thoughts about the space program. No, I don't see any benefit from it, but at the same time - it truly is a wonder that we have this ability. And I have to admit my all time favorite movie is " The Right Stuff. " But I think people are absolutely nuts to want to do something like that. And I really don't see the need. As awesome as it is. And as you said - to be an astronaut is a dream of so many people. I certainly wouldn't want to stand in the way of anyone's dreams. Warmly, Allison --- " dave <dave4sale " <dave4sale wrote: > oh boy, I have a feeling i'm going to get some angry > replies for this > post. that's fine, but just remember this is only my > opinion and you > all have a right to disagree with it or inform me of > some fact which > i have overlooked or am unaware of. > > I sympathize with the loved ones of those who died > in the crash, of > course, death is rarely good news to me. There have > of course been > lots of murders that haven't made the headlines. > But i'd like to > express my many qualms with the space program. > Tragedies like these > could be avoided and precious money be saved if we > buried it. > > here's why i don't think it's so great: First, it > seems the primary > purpose of space voyages is a military one. we > already know how > super dave feels about the military. Second, rocket > launches cause a > tremendous amount of pollution- i think i read a > rough analogy of the > equivalent of the average annual exhaust of 100,000 > cars. Third, if > we started taking better care of our planet, there'd > be no need to > fantasize about colonizing mars. My future > father-law-in is a big > space buff and insists that we'll be able to within > 50 years or so. > But if we keep living the wasteful polluting way we > do, moving to > mars will just delay society's inevitable downfall. > Fourth, the > space program is just one more domain which nations > feel the need to > compete; if we ever want to live in a peaceful > world, we have to stop > competing with everyone; i know i sound like a > damned pinko, but oh > well. > > and I know some kids grow up dreaming of seeing the > earth from the > moon's surface but well the earth would look a > helluva lot prettier > if we stopped sending out people in giant smog > factories to look at > it. so can anyone tell me any benefits of the space > program? > > > , " Megan > Milligan " > <yasminduran@l...> wrote: > > I'll be the first to admit I'm ethnocentric a lot > of the time ( & a > moderate > > registered republican), but stuff like that at > least helps me keep > my head > > screwed on straight & from developing too much > tunnel vision. > > > > Megan > > > > " Excesses are eventually their own undoing, and > that keeps me > hopeful. " > > -- Paul Harvey on the state of media today (Larry > King Live - > 1/30/2003) > > > > - > > > > Thanks, Megan, for sharing the editorial. > Sometimes we are so > detached > > from other countries views on things...it seems > like its " ALL ABOUT > > US " unfortunately. > > > > Rose > > Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus. _______________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 5, 2003 Report Share Posted February 5, 2003 oh, don't worry about that, in fifty years they'll be transferring my consciousness into a 60 foot tall walking robot and i'll take care of it. Why do you think all the kids of my generation play video games? they're training us for the inevitable alien invasion, of course. -k- --- Megan Milligan <yasminduran wrote: > what if some catostrophic event happens someday in > the very distant future > where we need this technology to seek out a new > world to live on? > > Megan > > ===== Where is this beauty? I search and search and then find, We are the lotus. Om Mani Padme Hum Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 5, 2003 Report Share Posted February 5, 2003 what if some catostrophic event happens someday in the very distant future where we need this technology to seek out a new world to live on? Megan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 5, 2003 Report Share Posted February 5, 2003 *snicker* Megan " Mr.Graves " <sleepingtao > oh, don't worry about that, in fifty years they'll be > transferring my consciousness into a 60 foot tall > walking robot and i'll take care of it. Why do you > think all the kids of my generation play video games? > they're training us for the inevitable alien invasion, > of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 5, 2003 Report Share Posted February 5, 2003 On Wed, 5 Feb 2003 07:01:53 -0800, you wrote: >what if some catostrophic event happens someday in the very distant future >where we need this technology to seek out a new world to live on? > How about an asteroid approaching the earth - on a collision course - it will destroy all life as we know it on earth. This is not unrealistic, not at all. The question isn't 'if', the question is only 'when'. I'd like to think we could send up a spacecraft to give it just a little shove (maybe via a nuclear explosion), to change its orbit so that it will not hit the earth. Pat -- Pat Meadows CLICK DAILY TO FEED THE HUNGRY United States: http://www.stopthehunger.com/ International: http://www.thehungersite.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 5, 2003 Report Share Posted February 5, 2003 there will be a catastrophic event happening in way distant future. in several billion years the sun will turn into a red giant and the first three or four planets will be enveloped.... but that's billions of years in the future. humans won't even make it that far if we don't start worrying about the far more urgent problems (e.g. pollution and war). once we've achieved world peace and clean renewable energy sources, and stopped world hunger, we can start worrying about space exploration. , " Megan Milligan " <yasminduran@l...> wrote: > what if some catostrophic event happens someday in the very distant future > where we need this technology to seek out a new world to live on? > > Megan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 5, 2003 Report Share Posted February 5, 2003 well, some scientists still say that's what happened to dinosaurs, although, obviously some lifeforms survived. but i say, scientists, schientists! Haven't you ever seen the simpsons? if an asteroid or comet heads for the earth it will burn up in the toxic, polluted atmosphere and be a tiny pebble by the time it hits the ground. quit reading all those infernal science books and watch some more tv! Seriously though, you all are talking about hypothetical & distant future problems. I really feel we need to worry about the problems which will definitely be affecting us if we don't do something about them now. super d. , Pat Meadows <pat@m...> wrote: > On Wed, 5 Feb 2003 07:01:53 -0800, you wrote: > > >what if some catostrophic event happens someday in the very distant future > >where we need this technology to seek out a new world to live on? > > > > How about an asteroid approaching the earth - on a collision > course - it will destroy all life as we know it on earth. > This is not unrealistic, not at all. The question isn't > 'if', the question is only 'when'. > > I'd like to think we could send up a spacecraft to give it > just a little shove (maybe via a nuclear explosion), to > change its orbit so that it will not hit the earth. > > Pat > -- Pat Meadows > CLICK DAILY TO FEED THE HUNGRY > United States: http://www.stopthehunger.com/ > International: http://www.thehungersite.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 5, 2003 Report Share Posted February 5, 2003 On Wed, 05 Feb 2003 21:40:22 -0000, you wrote: >well, some scientists still say that's what happened to dinosaurs, >although, obviously some lifeforms survived. I think it's pretty conclusive that the dinosaurs were killed off by an earth-impacting event. The crater is in the sea off the Yucatan Coast. I worked for a scientist (planetary geologist) whose specialty was studying this event at the K-T boundary (Cretaceous-Tertiary boundary). >but i say, scientists, >schientists! Haven't you ever seen the simpsons? if an asteroid or >comet heads for the earth it will burn up in the toxic, polluted >atmosphere and be a tiny pebble by the time it hits the ground. quit >reading all those infernal science books and watch some more tv! Well, there you are then.... >Seriously though, you all are talking about hypothetical & distant >future problems. I really feel we need to worry about the problems >which will definitely be affecting us if we don't do something about >them now. super d. > The danger is real, not hypothetical, and it may not be distant. It could be tomorrow, or next year. It's always astonished me that we (the developed nations) devote so little of our resources to searching the heavens for earth-impacting bodies. The amount of money devoted to this effort is pitiful, in the few millions - derisory, just about. Pat -- Pat Meadows CLICK DAILY TO FEED THE HUNGRY United States: http://www.stopthehunger.com/ International: http://www.thehungersite.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 5, 2003 Report Share Posted February 5, 2003 OK, anybody who doesnt know that the dinosaurs were killed off by the Monsters from Predator and then they let humans evolve so they can hunt us, is simply living in a fantasy. you poor, sad, misguided fools. -k- --- Pat Meadows <pat wrote: > On Wed, 05 Feb 2003 21:40:22 -0000, you wrote: > > >well, some scientists still say that's what > happened to dinosaurs, > >although, obviously some lifeforms survived. > > I think it's pretty conclusive that the dinosaurs > were > killed off by an earth-impacting event. The crater > is in > the sea off the Yucatan Coast. I worked for a > scientist > (planetary geologist) whose specialty was studying > this > event at the K-T boundary (Cretaceous-Tertiary > boundary). > ===== Where is this beauty? I search and search and then find, We are the lotus. Om Mani Padme Hum Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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