Guest guest Posted October 21, 2000 Report Share Posted October 21, 2000 Greetings, I have been a vegetarian for quite a while now, and am also exploring the Seventh Day Adventist religion. In case you are not aware, most Seventh Day adventists are vegetarian, some vegan, but a lot ovo-lacto. They have been studied as a group quite extensively and it has been found that their average life span is almost 10 years greater than non-adventists. Of course, Adventists do not smoke or drink alcohol easier. The quote from Genesis is often quoted. Nuts seeds and grains are given as the original diet, with vegetables added later on. I am not one to know my Bible quotes, but I think there are also mentions in the book of Daniel, where he declines a meat diet and survives on a vegetarian diet. kathleen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 21, 2000 Report Share Posted October 21, 2000 No problem. My family is quite religious too. If you find any other good quotes like this, let me know. aphrodite wrote: that is wonderful! thank you SO much for this. i am printing it right now and sticking it immediately into my suitcase so that my next trip will be a bit easier to handle.thank you.laurie - Carrie Nixon Saturday, October 21, 2000 1:50 PM religious arguments I don't want to get into a religious debate over vegetarianism, or anything else for that matter (that can get quite offensive and messy), I would just like to offer a piece of Christian-vegetarian-religious "ammunition". "Every moving thing that lives shall be food for you; and as I gave you the green plants, I give you everything. Only you shall not eat flesh with its life, that is, its blood. For your lifeblood I will surely require a reckoning; of every beast I will require it and of man." Genesis 8:4-5 There are different versions of it, this one isn't the best, but most make it clear that yes, you can (I think as in "able to") eat meat, BUT you'll have to pay for it later. I've had to use this argument before to my uncle....and I found it to be a very strong Karma reference in the bible. So if you get into another one of those religious arguments about eating meat, haul out Genesis (this is right after the flood story) and find this passage. I'm sure there's more, this is the only one I can remember at the moment! In my bible, which is newer, (this one is from a different bible than mine, this one is much older) the statement is much clearer. I encourage you to look it up, if you need religious arguments from the bible, feel free to use this one. Many other religions are against the use of animals for food and other things as well, if there is anyone from another religion, I would love to hear those passages too. Feel free to respond privately if you wish. I am very interested in all religions and non-Americanish (I'm Canadian) cultures, I'd love to hear about them and their views on vegetarianism. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 21, 2000 Report Share Posted October 21, 2000 that is wonderful! thank you SO much for this. i am printing it right now and sticking it immediately into my suitcase so that my next trip will be a bit easier to handle. thank you. laurie - Carrie Nixon Saturday, October 21, 2000 1:50 PM religious arguments I don't want to get into a religious debate over vegetarianism, or anything else for that matter (that can get quite offensive and messy), I would just like to offer a piece of Christian-vegetarian-religious "ammunition". "Every moving thing that lives shall be food for you; and as I gave you the green plants, I give you everything. Only you shall not eat flesh with its life, that is, its blood. For your lifeblood I will surely require a reckoning; of every beast I will require it and of man." Genesis 8:4-5 There are different versions of it, this one isn't the best, but most make it clear that yes, you can (I think as in "able to") eat meat, BUT you'll have to pay for it later. I've had to use this argument before to my uncle....and I found it to be a very strong Karma reference in the bible. So if you get into another one of those religious arguments about eating meat, haul out Genesis (this is right after the flood story) and find this passage. I'm sure there's more, this is the only one I can remember at the moment! In my bible, which is newer, (this one is from a different bible than mine, this one is much older) the statement is much clearer. I encourage you to look it up, if you need religious arguments from the bible, feel free to use this one. Many other religions are against the use of animals for food and other things as well, if there is anyone from another religion, I would love to hear those passages too. Feel free to respond privately if you wish. I am very interested in all religions and non-Americanish (I'm Canadian) cultures, I'd love to hear about them and their views on vegetarianism. aphrodite wrote: You are not alone. I have been a veg for 10 years now, a lacto-ovo ( have dairy if it is in bread i am eating, or if i am at a resteraunt and there is a tiny bit of cheese they can't leave off; i eat free range organic eggs on rare occasion).when i first decided to become a vegetarian at the age of 14 it was because my friend and i were eating these big italian hoagies and as we were eating them i starting trying to figure out what animal all the meat came from. the more i looked at the sandwich the slower i chewed and then i just felt ill. i threw it away and told my mom i would never eat animal again. of course it was "just a phase." that is what my family called it for the first 4 years. in those years i faced ridicule and negativity from my friends and family, no support whatsoever. i was raised in a big meat eating family, bowl of ice cream every night kind of a house, and here i was saying, hey, you know what? this is wrong, and i am not going to do this anymore. in reflection i think maybe they were a little uncomfortable with the fact that they knew i felt what they were doing was immoral. i never said so, but that is how i felt, and they knew it.we would sit at dinner and my brother would put chicken wings in my face and make clucking noises. my dad would make mmmmmm noises as he happily chewed his rare steaks. and i was told to cook for myself since i wasn't good enough to eat the family dinners. i paid for my own food, and because there "wasn't enough room in the refrigerator for all that health food" i got a cooler that i kept in my room. now, i know all of this seems cruel, and i hate to make my family sound like ogres. but people get a little funny sometimes when they are afraid of what they don't know.nowadays i have formed my own way of handling the constant barage of questions and firing squad lineups that any veg is sure to encounter at some point and time, even as vegetarianism becomes more and more acceptable each day.since i have found through experience that most people get annoyed to find out you are a veg, when i am asked why i choose to live this lifestyle, i reply "well, i have a lot of reasons, it is kind of a long story." "well, like what?" "well, i break it into categories, environmental, moral, medical, and political." Now, at this point you either get "oh." or you get "well, like what specifically?" at which point i say "well, if you really want to know, pick a category and i will explain it to you, but understand that i in no way wish to argue about this with you."i know maybe it sounds silly. but it works. because the thing is that people DON'T want to hear about what they are eating, because when they find out exactly what it is going on out there they have no excuse to continue doing the wrong thing. and believe me, i have heard so many justifications for meat eating. "support the farmers!" "what else would we do with all those cows?" and my favorite to date "well the bible says we should eat meat because it is God's way to thin out the herds." WHAT? i literally laughed out loud at that one, which by the way came from a member of the family my mom married into. we were having a cookout and i was eating a veggie burger when my new uncle asks me why i don't eat meat. i inwardly groan, tell him i just don't like to eat animals, and open a giant can of worms. next thing i know, he is literally following me around the house with a bible quoting scriptures and not listening to a thing i say.so you see, we all go thru some kind of torture at some point and time. i used to be really into educating people about vegetarianism. i always let them ask, and then tried to present it in a positive and informative manner. but after the first 5 years or so i got tired and cranky because i was endlessly defending myself against people who felt guilty and needed to justify their own beliefs.today my life is much easier. i work at Whole Foods Market where i am able to be happy and informative to people all day long who are afraid of tofu, need to know what to do with seitan, or just need some support. i get to encourage and enlighten every day, and it has really put my veggie soul a lot more at peace. since i started really learning to cook a few years back, i have gotten really good at it, and when i go to my mom's to visit she always asks me to cook. we never eat tofu or anything so freaky as that(lol), but i always make a vegan meal that rocks her world. i even got my dad to eat tofu fajitas one night because they smelled so good he couldn't resist. and he loved them. : )my boyfriend is the executive chef at a highly rated restaraunt in ft lauderdale. when we first started dating he was nervous about what he could possibly make me to eat that wasn't pasta, pasta, pasta. after 6 months of training, he runs amazing vegan specials that sell for $25 a plate. he loves tvp, seitan, and all the new grains i have intoduced him to. and there is something deliciously gratifying about someone being able to serve my dishes at a restaraunt as highly aclaimed as his.i am truly sorry that any of us ever have to go thru this kind of negativity, and i definitly know how it feels to be the joke at work, or the picky eater, or the pain in the butt. i understand how you feel completely. try not to take it personally. my boyfriend and i joke about it. he always asks what i am hungry for "a big juicy steak?" and laughs wickedly. i always say "well, okay, but only if it has a big stack of bacon and cheese on top, and don't forget the lard." or something sarcastic like that. one of the more amazing things he has said to me was one night we took a walk and he looks into my eyes and says, "you know, i never want to see you eat meat." i was taken aback, this came from nowhere, and i said "where did that come from?" and he said "you being a vegetarian defines you and it makes me proud to know you and see how compassionate you are, and see how strictly you follow your beliefs, but don't force it on anyone else. i respect that tremendously." and these are the kinds of people you meet in your life and hold onto.as for your fellow workers, maybe you can try to suggest going to an indian buffet or a more veg friendly restaraunt for a change. and when they say they are going for a big juicy burger, tell them to add lots of ketchup to cover up the taste of all those hormones and antibiotics they are eating. wonder out loud if all the pain and suffering and drugs make the meat juicier ot more tender. or better yet, just sit there and smile and wave goodbye, and pat yourself on the back for being a good person and standing up for what you believe in. and enjoy your sprouts and avacado on honey whole wheat with stone ground dijon and hothouse tomato and basil.i support you. i believe in you. and i thank you.laurie - Pam & Frank Mouton Saturday, October 21, 2000 8:22 AM teasing Are there any of you out there that are constantly teased about your vegan/vegetarian lifestyle? When I am at work I get tired of people making a big thing of telling me that they are going out to get a big juicy burger, etc. After a while it gets really old. I don't know why they can't just live and let live. I don't ram my lifestyle down anyone's throat or try and convert people. I merely tell them about my diet simply as a matter of politeness so that they will understand why I don't "do lunch" with them. Anyone else have the same problem? Just curious. contact owner: -owner Mail list: Delivered-mailing list List-Un: - no flaming arguing or denigration of others allowed contact owner with complaints regarding posting/list or anything else. Thank you. please share/comment/inform and mostly enjoy this list contact owner: -owner Mail list: Delivered-mailing list List-Un: - no flaming arguing or denigration of others allowed contact owner with complaints regarding posting/list or anything else. Thank you. please share/comment/inform and mostly enjoy this list Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 21, 2000 Report Share Posted October 21, 2000 I'm new here and am hoping to get what the name of the group suggests-some good quick vegetarian recipes. I'm not too interested interested in philosophical or religious justifications for vegetarianism but I'm going to jump right into the fray and make some comments anyway. I think you will find very slim biblical support for vegetarianism if you are interested in it from a Judeo/Christian viewpoint. Here are a few points. The Jewish religion was originally a sacrifical one. There are instructions given in the Bible for the slaughter of animals for sacrifical purposes. Some of the meat was eaten by the priests and some by the people who contributed the animal. " The priest who offers it (the sacrifice) shall eat of it " . (Lev 6, 26). Study Leviticus 11 and 12 for further eating regulations. The New Testament contains several passages about eating fish. Jesus ate fish with disciples on the Emmeaus road. The feeding of the multitudes also involved fish. In Acts 10, 11-16, Peter has a vision of " all kinds of four footed creatures and reptiles and birds of the air " . He is commanded to " kill and eat " . He objects but not on vegetarian grounds. Some of the food is ritually unclean but " What God has called clean you must not call profane " NRSV I'm not familiar with the reference to Daniel but I'd be interested to know where it is. Just skimming through, I can't find it. Steve Praise to the Seventh Day Adventistists for their abstention. I'm not sure what their grounds for it are but certainly it's not biblical. swcs wrote: > > Greetings, > > I have been a vegetarian for quite a while now, and am also exploring the > Seventh Day Adventist religion. In case you are not aware, most Seventh Day > adventists are vegetarian, some vegan, but a lot ovo-lacto. They have been > studied as a group quite extensively and it has been found that their average > life span is almost 10 years greater than non-adventists. Of course, > Adventists do not smoke or drink alcohol easier. > > The quote from Genesis is often quoted. Nuts seeds and grains are given as > the original diet, with vegetables added later on. I am not one to know my > Bible quotes, but I think there are also mentions in the book of Daniel, > where he declines a meat diet and survives on a vegetarian diet. > > kathleen > > > contact owner: -owner > Mail list: > Delivered-mailing list > List-Un: - > > no flaming arguing or denigration of others allowed > contact owner with complaints regarding posting/list > or anything else. Thank you. > please share/comment/inform and mostly enjoy this list Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 21, 2000 Report Share Posted October 21, 2000 Hi, I am new to the list also. I am a Jew and I was always taught that while Judaism is a sacrificial religion, in the garden of Eden, Adam and Eve were vegetarians. It is believed that one day the world will be returned to this perfect state. Being a vegetarian is simply living at this higher state. Besides being vegetarian makes keeping kosher much simpler. Tracey - Steve Kendall Saturday, October 21, 2000 4:05 PM Re: religious arguments I'm new here and am hoping to get what the name of the groupsuggests-some good quick vegetarian recipes. I'm not too interested interested in philosophical or religiousjustifications for vegetarianism but I'm going to jump right into thefray and make some comments anyway. I think you will find very slimbiblical support for vegetarianism if you are interested in it from aJudeo/Christian viewpoint. Here are a few points. The Jewish religion was originally a sacrifical one. There areinstructions given in the Bible for the slaughter of animals forsacrifical purposes. Some of the meat was eaten by the priests and someby the people who contributed the animal. "The priest who offers it (thesacrifice) shall eat of it". (Lev 6, 26). Study Leviticus 11 and 12 forfurther eating regulations. The New Testament contains several passages about eating fish. Jesus atefish with disciples on the Emmeaus road. The feeding of the multitudesalso involved fish. In Acts 10, 11-16, Peter has a vision of "all kinds of four footedcreatures and reptiles and birds of the air". He is commanded to "killand eat". He objects but not on vegetarian grounds. Some of the food isritually unclean but "What God has called clean you must not callprofane" NRSVI'm not familiar with the reference to Daniel but I'd be interested toknow where it is. Just skimming through, I can't find it. StevePraise to the Seventh Day Adventistists for their abstention. I'm notsure what their grounds for it are but certainly it's not biblical. swcs wrote:> > Greetings,> > I have been a vegetarian for quite a while now, and am also exploring the> Seventh Day Adventist religion. In case you are not aware, most Seventh Day> adventists are vegetarian, some vegan, but a lot ovo-lacto. They have been> studied as a group quite extensively and it has been found that their average> life span is almost 10 years greater than non-adventists. Of course,> Adventists do not smoke or drink alcohol easier.> > The quote from Genesis is often quoted. Nuts seeds and grains are given as> the original diet, with vegetables added later on. I am not one to know my> Bible quotes, but I think there are also mentions in the book of Daniel,> where he declines a meat diet and survives on a vegetarian diet.> > kathleen> > > contact owner: -owner > Mail list: > Delivered-mailing list > List-Un: - > > no flaming arguing or denigration of others allowed> contact owner with complaints regarding posting/list> or anything else. Thank you.> please share/comment/inform and mostly enjoy this listcontact owner: -owner Mail list: Delivered-mailing list List-Un: - no flaming arguing or denigration of others allowedcontact owner with complaints regarding posting/list or anything else. Thank you.please share/comment/inform and mostly enjoy this list Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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