TIME to keep spreading the UCS Vegetarian Word!

[Guest guest]

Paz, veggie friends.Such ado about coupons at Rainbow.  IMHO, any business that puts out coupons expects only a certain small percentage of them to be redeemed before their expiration date.  None can probably afford the various ways of getting 5+ per customer actually used at any register.  How bout we find out where and how the soybeans are grown to make all these yummy products??

Some of you probably saw this, I saw one in the NY Times and then was just sent this one.  Spreading the word, peacefully, to each farm, circus, and store we patronize!!   Tea---------- Forwarded message ----------

Doug Kalmer <sunartSat, Sep 5, 2009 at 6:20 AM

[sustComm] Getting Real About the High Price of Cheap Fast Food Passing on this worthwhile read-

 

http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1917458,00.html

 

" The way we farm now is destructive of the soil, the environment and us, " says Doug Gurian-Sherman, a senior scientist with the food and environment program at the Union of Concerned Scientists (UCS).

 

With the exhaustion of the soil, the impact of global warming and the inevitably rising price of oil - which will affect everything from fertilizer to supermarket electricity bills - our industrial style of food production will end sooner or later. As the developing world grows richer, hundreds of millions of people will want to shift to the same calorie-heavy, protein-rich diet that has made Americans so unhealthy - demand for meat and poultry worldwide is set to rise 25% by 2015 - but the earth can no longer deliver. Unless Americans radically rethink the way they grow and consume food, they face a future of eroded farmland, hollowed-out countryside, scarier germs, higher health costs - and bland taste. Sustainable food has an élitist reputation, but each of us depends on the soil, animals and plants - and as every farmer knows, if you don't take care of your land, it can't take care of you.

 

 

[Guest guest]

Hi Tea,Since we agree on the coupons, I won't discuss them. :-)I think the Time article you linked to is very interesting. It's essentially the same message as the movies King Corn and Food, Inc. or Michael Pollan's books. However, seeing it in such a mainstream news venue is pretty exciting. Unfortunately, I think many vegans will dismiss it because it's not about completely eliminating the use of animals as food.I'm strictly vegan, but I'm not very radical. In my view, a world where animals are raised naturally and humanely, then killed painlessly for food is much more attainable in my lifetime than the ideal of no one eating animals. I see this as that whole "better is the enemy of the good" thing, but most vegans seem to see it more as a moral absolute. There are definitely good arguments to be made on both sides, but the nuances of them tend to get lost on people outside the veg* community.I think the average life-long omnivore is more likely to respond favorably to an article like this one than they are to one calling for everyone to switch to a vegetarian diet. In my experience, even if the second article is well-written and makes excellent, well-reasoned arguments, most "normal" people will consider the idea too radical to be taken seriously. But maybe after a few years of not eating meat at EVERY meal, the idea of not eating meat at any meal won't see so bizarre to them.wpBTW, the soy beans are all GMO and grown by slave laborers in foreign countries using a lot of pesticides and then shipped here using tons of fossil fuel to be heavily processed into pseudo-meats, right? ;-)On Sep 17, 2009, at 2:18 PM, tea wrote:

 

 

Paz, veggie friends.Such ado about coupons at Rainbow. IMHO, any business that puts out coupons expects only a certain small percentage of them to be redeemed before their expiration date. None can probably afford the various ways of getting 5+ per customer actually used at any register. How bout we find out where and how the soybeans are grown to make all these yummy products??

Some of you probably saw this, I saw one in the NY Times and then was just sent this one. Spreading the word, peacefully, to each farm, circus, and store we patronize!! Tea---------- Forwarded message ----------

Doug Kalmer <sunart (AT) netease (DOT) net>Sat, Sep 5, 2009 at 6:20 AM

[sustComm] Getting Real About the High Price of Cheap Fast Food Passing on this worthwhile read-

 

http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1917458,00.html

 

"The way we farm now is destructive of the soil, the environment and us," says Doug Gurian-Sherman, a senior scientist with the food and environment program at the Union of Concerned Scientists (UCS).

 

With the exhaustion of the soil, the impact of global warming and the inevitably rising price of oil - which will affect everything from fertilizer to supermarket electricity bills - our industrial style of food production will end sooner or later. As the developing world grows richer, hundreds of millions of people will want to shift to the same calorie-heavy, protein-rich diet that has made Americans so unhealthy - demand for meat and poultry worldwide is set to rise 25% by 2015 - but the earth can no longer deliver. Unless Americans radically rethink the way they grow and consume food, they face a future of eroded farmland, hollowed-out countryside, scarier germs, higher health costs - and bland taste. Sustainable food has an élitist reputation, but each of us depends on the soil, animals and plants - and as every farmer knows, if you don't take care of your land, it can't take care of you.

 

 

[Guest guest]

I agree.  More and more mainstream venues are presenting the multitude of eating options, some more sustainable or humane than others.  Vegetarians and vegans and omnivores must come to the table together occasionally, at least to discuss these ideas and articles!

Warning to some squeamish vegans: graphic discussion continues below. When I managed livestock farms in green VT, I raised and kept healthy for their entire long lives the happiest horses, mules, cows, bison, rabbits, sheep and goats that anyone could.  Most were rescued from abusive factory 'farmers'.  Yes, the female cows and goats wanted to be milked, and we thanked them for their milk. None of them lived forever.  If someone's abuse or negligence resulted in the death of an animal, it was buried without any meat removed, with a prayerful solemn apologetic burial (or occasionally cremation).  But if it was an elderly happy animal, reaching an end to a long healthy life, it was humanely killed away from other animals and with several prayerful blessing humans thanking it for the meat it then provided them.  I remained vegetarian but fine with this practice of others, for all animals except horses and dogs.  We could not find a humane (fear-free and painless) way to euthanize horses or dogs, so they were not killed anywhere where they might be dissected and eaten after.  Spiritually and intellectually, I believe and taught folks that when the spirit or soul leaves any body, the body becomes just interesting bones, tendons, and meat, edible to most carnivores and omnivores.  Back to our discussion on if cats and dogs can survive on a vegetarian or vegan diet: I don't believe so, not happily or healthily, because even tho we have altered terribly most domestic 'breeds' of cat, dog, and horse, we still have not far removed their inner working guts from their wild ancestors:  wolves, lions, and zebras all have guts (digestive systems) very similar to our pets'.  I know, cuz I've dissected all of them in my pre-veterinary work, even while lobbying for no required dissections in all the colleges and universities I worked at or attended. 

Namaste and Blessed Be, Tea On Thu, Sep 17, 2009 at 3:50 PM, Wayne Packard <wpackard wrote:

Hi Tea,Since we agree on the coupons, I won't discuss them. :-)I think the Time article you linked to is very interesting.  It's essentially the same message as the movies King Corn and Food, Inc. or Michael Pollan's books. However, seeing it in such a mainstream news venue is pretty exciting. Unfortunately, I think many vegans will dismiss it because it's not about completely eliminating the use of animals as food.

I'm strictly vegan, but I'm not very radical. In my view, a world where animals are raised naturally and humanely, then killed painlessly for food is much more attainable in my lifetime than the ideal of no one eating animals. I see this as that whole " better is the enemy of the good " thing, but most vegans seem to see it more as a moral absolute. There are definitely good arguments to be made on both sides, but the nuances of them tend to get lost on people outside the veg* community.

I think the average life-long omnivore is more likely to respond favorably to an article like this one than they are to one calling for everyone to switch to a vegetarian diet. In my experience, even if the second article is well-written and makes excellent, well-reasoned arguments, most " normal " people will consider the idea too radical to be taken seriously. But maybe after a few years of not eating meat at EVERY meal, the idea of not eating meat at any meal won't seem so bizarre to them.

BTW, the soy beans are all GMO and grown by slave laborers in foreign countries using a lot of pesticides and then shipped here using tons of fossil fuel to be heavily processed into pseudo-meats, right? ;-)

wpPS: I was serious - the soybeans and fuel grains of middle america are ruining the prairies for either wildlife or organic farmers.  I'm new to CA and looking for what percentage of farms and farmers are organic?  How many of the cows here are REALLY happy?? We can't drive by them suffering and say " I'm vegan, so I'm good. " TEA

---------PULA SERVICE ANIMALS are certified trained to assist and further enable differently-enabled Americans to enjoy ADA accessibility rights.  Pula.Services  for all pawsitive training to certify more rescued dogs to become assistants all over an increasingly accessible, kinder, gentler N. America.  Trabajando con veterinarios por perros en America del Sud y Central.   Pregunteme, Tia Tea, de Animal Answers International.

[Guest guest]

Dear Tea,

Unfortunately, you are mistaken. Dogs, at least, can not only survive, but

thrive on a vegan diet. We have cared for five, one of which lived past

nineteen years of age, all of which are both happy and healthy. (We currently

feed V-Dog and their site has many testimonials.) Further, a vegan diet for

dogs is a terrific way to avoid support of some of the worst animal cruelty. If

you are in the veterinary field and in a position to advise others, I hope you

will familiarize yourself with the large number of people who have fed their

dogs a vegan diet successfully for decades. Our veterinarians enthusiastically

support our choice of diet for our dogs.

Sincerely,

K. Byrne

 

 

, tea <pula.services wrote:

Back to our discussion on if cats

> and dogs can survive on a vegetarian or vegan diet: I don't believe so, not

> happily or healthily, because even tho we have altered terribly most

> domestic 'breeds' of cat, dog, and horse, we still have not far removed

> their inner working guts from their wild ancestors: wolves, lions, and

> zebras all have guts (digestive systems) very similar to our pets'. I know,

> cuz I've dissected all of them in my pre-veterinary work, even while

> lobbying for no required dissections in all the colleges and universities I

> worked at or attended.

>

> Namaste and Blessed Be, Tea