Guest guest Posted April 11, 2005 Report Share Posted April 11, 2005 Plants utilize the " salt " in the same way that animals do. That is why sodium ions and chloride ions are found in plant matter " separated. " Natural salt licks exist globally. Animal trails, upon which many modern roads have been built, lead to and from natural salt licks. Can you show that the body does not dissolve salt into sodium and chloride ions? tev --- Don Quai <mysticalherbalist wrote: > Interesting concept. The body does not use sodium > chloride at all. The > cells of the human body use sodium ions and chloride > ions only, not > sodium chloride as in salt. We get all the sodium > and chloride ions we > need from the plants and fruits that we eat. > However, if one chooses to > believe that they need to use salt then use high > quality sea salt or > natural salt that has not been heated to 1200 F. > > I do agree that salt is harmful in excess. I also > believe that salt is > harmful period. It is very caustic to the human body > over time, in > minimal amounts, and quite quickly in large amounts. > > -- > Peace be with you, > > Don " Quai " Eitner [...there'll be love and laughter, and peace ever after, just you wait and see... ---Vera Lynn] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 12, 2005 Report Share Posted April 12, 2005 tev treowlufu wrote: > > Plants utilize the " salt " in the same way > that animals do. That is why sodium ions > and chloride ions are found in plant matter > " separated. " > > Natural salt licks exist globally. Animal trails, > upon which many modern roads have been built, lead > to and from natural salt licks. > > Can you show that the body does not dissolve salt > into sodium and chloride ions? > > tev > > =========================== Hi Tev, I have no doubt that the body, without the assistance of water, might be able to break down the ionic bonds between sodium and the chloride ions. However, it takes a huge amount of energy to produce this. It is much easier if the salt is already dissolved in water as the water, being polar, naturally breaks these bonds down, yet the body still cannot utilize them in this form as they are inorganic. Plants do not take up sodium chloride as a salt, they utilize the sodium ions and chloride ions that are already broken apart in the soil due to the effects of water. I do believe that this even holds true for plants growing in salt marshes and next to the beach. However, there is still lots of water there that will break down the salt into its constituent ions. No plants grow on a salt lick or near one where there is no water that I am aware of. Salt is very caustic by nature. No, it won't burn your skin, but internally it is very hard on the body in large amounts. I also don't think anyone would like to be buried in salt for any length of time either. The body can only utilize so much sodium ions and chloride ions. Too much and your looking at damage to arterial walls, cells, etc, as well as an imbalance in the sodium/potassium ratio of each and every cell in the body. Sodium ions normally exist in the ECF (extra cellular fluid, outside the cells) and the potassium ions in the ICF (Intra cellular fluid, inside the cells). Too much sodium, as in using salt, and you get too high a concentration of sodium ions which results in an osmotic pressure rise outside of the cell. The body will do all it can to stabalize the osmotic pressure by allowing sodium ions into the cell. Now this will create an imbalance in the electrical charge that exists within the cell so the body will then incorporate chloride ions into the cell to neutralize the sodium ions and push potassium ions out of the cell. Now we have salt in the cell so the body brings in water to help balance the salinity inside the cell and we end up with edema. All salt, table salt, himalayan salt and sea salt and any other salt deposits are inorganic by nature. The human body cannot efficiently process and utilize inorganic minerals and salts, of which sodium is one of. The human body can very effectively and efficiently utilize the minerals and sodium ions from plants however, as they have been brought to life, so to speak, through the action of photosynthesis. The sodium ions, coming from the food you eat, have their ionic charge neutralized by combining with enzymes that will allow it to be effectively utilized by our body. Same with any minerals. An example of an inorganic substance is table salt. It is simply sodium and chloride. No enzymes, thus it is enzymatically inactive and the body cannot use it. It is inorganic. Our bodies cannot attach an enzyme to inorganic substances (minerals), except at great cost to our health. The body to meet any of its mineral requirements cannot use salt. Salt is an inorganic mineral that cannot be metabolized by the body. Salt enters the body as sodium chloride, it circulates in the body as sodium chloride, and it leaves the body as sodium chloride. At no point is it broken down and used as sodium and chlorine. If the body cannot use salt how can it be termed " necessary " to life? Also consider that salt (sodium chloride) is a cube of equal amounts of sodium and chloride ions bonded together. In order for your body to break those bonds it needs to break not one but 6 to free up a sodium ion or a chloride ion and then it must attach an enzyme to each ion for the body to be able to use it. This is the role of plants and what they do very well in comparison to the human body. This is why it is best for us to get all the sodium and chlorine we need from the fruits and vegetables that we consume. We should never use salt in any form. We just plain don't need it and it is deleterious to our health big time. Now a possible reason so many different animals lick salt at the salt licks is because they don't get enough sodium from what they consume. Not all animals need salt from the salt licks. This can be found in nature quite easily. I am fairly certain that the only reasons man decided to lick salt is because he, quite erroneously, viewed himself as an animal and following the migration of animals and watching their habits figured he was supposed to do the same thing, as well as, he began to eat less of what was good for him (fresh fruits, vegetables and green plants) and more of what wasn't good for him (ie. flesh, grains, nuts, seeds and cooked foods). He also found that salt was an excellent preservative of foods, contributing greatly to the decliine in his health. There are many reasons for not using salt such as: Salt causes inflammatory sweeling of the glands. It contributes to constipation and indigestion. It is a factor in many skin diseases. It is deposited thourghout all the fluids of the body, which causes extreme irritation, injury and death to billions of cells. When excessive salt (that which the body cannot immediately excrete) is deposited everywhere in the fluid medium of the billions of living body cells causing extreme irritation, injury and death to the cells, the cells send forth a desperate SOS signal and the person gets thirsty and drinks lots of water. This water is carried by the blood and deposited in the tissue fluids to dilute the devastating effects. This results in excessive body fluids, edema. The body takes every opportunity to excrete this salt - constantly through the urine, at even limited or almost no excretion by profuse sweating, through tears etc. The salts desposit throughout the body cause cells to contract and discharge their life fluids and other vital elements resulting in hardened tissues, distorted vision, hyper-anethesia of the nerves, high blood pressure, tumors, cancer, psoriasis, neuritis, heart defects, extreme dedema and innumerable other degerative conditions too numerous to list. Quite frankly, Tev, salt is a stimulant which needlessly over taxes the vital life force of the body. -- Peace be with you, Don " Quai " Eitner " Spirit sleeps in the mineral, breathes in the vegetable, dreams in the animal and wakes in man. " -- In compliance with the highest standards of Universal Law, this email has been thoroughly disinfected and purified in the solar flares of the sun. Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.9.6 - Release 4/11/05 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 12, 2005 Report Share Posted April 12, 2005 Dan: I have no doubt that the body, without the assistance of water, might be able to break down the ionic bonds between sodium and the chloride ions. TEV: Not sure what you are saying here. Dan: However, it takes a huge amount of energy to produce this. TEV: ?????????????. Drop a pinch of salt into water. It dissolves instantly. The human body is approx. 80% water, right? All the body does is move water around; and it is constantly doing that anyway. Dan: It is much easier if the salt is already dissolved in water as the water, being polar, naturally breaks these bonds down, yet the body still cannot utilize them in this form as they are inorganic. TEV: All salt is inorganic. Salt is a stabilized compound. If it wasn't it would react with water dramatically. Dan: Plants do not take up sodium chloride as a salt, they utilize the sodium ions and chloride ions that are already broken apart in the soil due to the effects of water. TEV: Yes. We have already established that salt dissolves in water. Dan: I do believe that this even holds true for plants growing in salt marshes and next to the beach. However, there is still lots of water there that will break down the salt into its constituent ions. No plants grow on a salt lick or near one where there is no water that I am aware of. TEV: Of course not. This does not mean that plants do not use salt in its dissolved form. Not sure what you are saying here. Dan: Salt is very caustic by nature. No, it won't burn your skin, but internally it is very hard on the body in large amounts. TEV: This discussion is about whether salt in the proper amounts is necessary to human biochemistry. There are many substances that the human body needs that can be severely poisonous if in excessive doses--iodine, iron, come to mind. You and Elchanan make all these negative statements about salt; but I think you two don't understand its place in human biochemistry. If salt was so caustic, as you suggest, I'd burn when I swim in the ocean. Yet, here I am typing these words, unscathed. I think there is much exaggeration being espoused about salt by you and Elchanan. [...there'll be love and laughter, and peace ever after, just you wait and see... ---Vera Lynn] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 13, 2005 Report Share Posted April 13, 2005 tev treowlufu wrote: > > TEV: This discussion is about whether salt in the > proper amounts is necessary to human biochemistry. > There are many substances that the human body needs > that can be severely poisonous if in excessive > doses--iodine, iron, come to mind. > > You and Elchanan make all these negative statements > about salt; but I think you two don't understand its > place in human biochemistry. > > If salt was so caustic, as you suggest, I'd burn when > I swim in the ocean. Yet, here I am typing these > words, unscathed. > > I think there is much exaggeration being espoused > about salt by you and Elchanan. > > [...there'll be love and laughter, > and peace ever after, > just you wait and see... > ---Vera Lynn] ========================== Hi Tev, I fully understand the necessity of sodium and chlorine ions in human biochemistry. I do not understand how one can view ingesting inorganic sodium chloride as essential to human biochemistry however, as the human body cannot utilize inorganic minerals. But perhaps you are right. There is probably too much exaggeration being espoused about salt by various peoples. Salt does have its place in human biochemistry but only in its component parts and first rendered organic by plants. This is just my truth Tev. Nothing more. To each his own truth, as it is not my place to convince anyone that their truth be wrong and my truth be right. -- Peace be with you, Tev. Don " Quai " Eitner " Spirit sleeps in the mineral, breathes in the vegetable, dreams in the animal and wakes in man. " -- In compliance with the highest standards of Universal Law, this email has been thoroughly disinfected and purified in the solar flares of the sun. Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.9.7 - Release 4/12/05 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 13, 2005 Report Share Posted April 13, 2005 Just wanted to say that I am following this thread with great interest... lots of food for thought!!!! I always figured that table salt is not good for you, but it seems to me that sea salt or earth salt would be a natural provision... I see that there is great disagreement on this topic but want to encourage those taking part in this conversation with the knowledge that no matter if consensus is reached -- you have certainly made others consider different points of view and given them a starting point to reevaluate the role of salt in a healthy diet! ~Colleen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 13, 2005 Report Share Posted April 13, 2005 Colleen Rivera wrote: > Just wanted to say that I am following this thread with great > interest... lots of food for thought!!!! I always figured that table > salt is not good for you, but it seems to me that sea salt or earth > salt would be a natural provision... I see that there is great > disagreement on this topic but want to encourage those taking part in > this conversation with the knowledge that no matter if consensus is > reached -- you have certainly made others consider different points > of view and given them a starting point to reevaluate the role of salt > in a healthy diet! > > ~Colleen ========================= Hi Colleen, Yes, sea salt and earth salt are natural but the sodium chloride in them is still inorganic sodium chloride. The only benefits these particular salts have over regular table salt is they also have up to 83 other inorganic minerals, if one so chooses to call these benefits. Sodium chloride is still sodium chloride no matter where it comes from. Himalayan salt and sea salt also have much more water as they are not heated (hopefully). This is one of those areas where we all must make up our own minds about ones own health. Best is to do the research for ones self, come to ones own conclusions and make ones decisions based on what one learns. Alsways seek the truth for yourself. Never accept anothers truth for your own unless you have tested it and found that it works for you. -- Peace be with you, Collenn. Don " Quai " Eitner " Spirit sleeps in the mineral, breathes in the vegetable, dreams in the animal and wakes in man. " -- In compliance with the highest standards of Universal Law, this email has been thoroughly disinfected and purified in the solar flares of the sun. Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.9.7 - Release 4/12/05 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 13, 2005 Report Share Posted April 13, 2005 I apologize, Don, for misstating your name. tev --- Don Quai <mysticalherbalist wrote: > I have no doubt that the body, without the > assistance of water, might be > able to break down the ionic bonds between sodium > and the chloride ions. [...there'll be love and laughter, and peace ever after, just you wait and see... ---Vera Lynn] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 13, 2005 Report Share Posted April 13, 2005 tev treowlufu wrote: > I apologize, Don, for misstating your name. > > tev ======================== Hi Tev, No need for apologies. It is a common enough error that, I am sure, we are almost all guilty of at one time or another. I do appreciate your humbleness however. ;-) -- Peace be with you, Tev. Don " Quai " Eitner " Spirit sleeps in the mineral, breathes in the vegetable, dreams in the animal and wakes in man. " -- In compliance with the highest standards of Universal Law, this email has been thoroughly disinfected and purified in the solar flares of the sun. Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.9.7 - Release 4/12/05 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 13, 2005 Report Share Posted April 13, 2005 Hi Tev, Here is my five cents for what it is worth. There are over 100 mineral salts, sodium chloride being only one of them. and all of which to my knowledge are required by the body. In their mineral form they are all poisonous and non utilisable by the human body.It is only in their colloidal state as found in the edible plants that we are able to use them for our benefit. There is also the " Law of the Minimum " which limits our ability to uitlise simple elements and compounds and even the more complex in their mineral state. Further, that the dissolving of salt in water does not change its chemical state. That is it does not change sodium chloride into sodium ions and chlorine ions. It is still in its non-colloidal state. It is only when taken up by the plant and processed via photosynthesis that it becomes avaiable to us. John John L. Fielder Osteopath & Lifestyle Consultant Academy of Natural Living www.iig.com.au/anl tev treowlufu wrote: > > Dan: I have no doubt that the body, without the > assistance of water, might be able to break down the > ionic bonds between sodium and the chloride ions. > > TEV: Not sure what you are saying here. > > Dan: However, it takes a huge amount of energy to > produce this. > > TEV: ?????????????. Drop a pinch of salt into water. > It dissolves instantly. The human body is approx. 80% > water, right? All the body does is move water around; > and it is constantly doing that anyway. > > Dan: It is much easier if the salt is already > dissolved in water as the water, being polar, > naturally breaks these bonds down, yet the body still > cannot utilize them in this form as they are > inorganic. > > TEV: All salt is inorganic. Salt is a stabilized > compound. If it wasn't it would react with water > dramatically. > > Dan: Plants do not take up sodium chloride as a salt, > they utilize the sodium ions and chloride ions that > are already broken apart in the soil due to the > effects of water. > > TEV: Yes. We have already established that salt > dissolves in water. > > Dan: I do believe that this even holds true for > plants growing in salt > marshes and next to the beach. However, there is > still lots of water > there that will break down the salt into its > constituent ions. No plants > grow on a salt lick or near one where there is no > water that I am aware of. > > TEV: Of course not. This does not mean that plants do > not use salt in its dissolved form. Not sure what you > are saying here. > > Dan: Salt is very caustic by nature. No, it won't burn > your skin, but internally it is very hard on the body > in large amounts. > > TEV: This discussion is about whether salt in the > proper amounts is necessary to human biochemistry. > There are many substances that the human body needs > that can be severely poisonous if in excessive > doses--iodine, iron, come to mind. > > You and Elchanan make all these negative statements > about salt; but I think you two don't understand its > place in human biochemistry. > > If salt was so caustic, as you suggest, I'd burn when > I swim in the ocean. Yet, here I am typing these > words, unscathed. > > I think there is much exaggeration being espoused > about salt by you and Elchanan. > > [...there'll be love and laughter, > and peace ever after, > just you wait and see... > ---Vera Lynn] > > > > > > > > > ------ > * Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 18, 2005 Report Share Posted April 18, 2005 Gold from West Africa was exchanged for something the West Africans prized even more: salt. Salt was used as a flavoring, a food preservative, and for retaining body moisture. http://www.mrdowling.com/609-trade.html Trekking to Timbuktu: Trade in Ancient West Africa — Student Version Trade has played an important role in the economy of West Africa since very early times. As early as 300 AD, camel caravans carried salt from mines in the Sahara Desert to trading centers along the Niger River in present-day Mali. Their mission was to exchange the salt for the gold that was mined in forests near the headwaters of the Niger. West Africa's first kingdom, Ghana, became wealthy and powerful because it controlled the trade routes and commercial activities in its region. http://edsitement.neh.gov/printable_lesson_plan.asp?id=510 --- " John L. Fielder " <academy.natural.living wrote: > Dr Albert Schweitzer found that the African natives > that he was in > contact with did not use salt prior to its > introduction by Missionaries. [...there'll be love and laughter, and peace ever after, just you wait and see... ---Vera Lynn] Plan great trips with Travel: Now over 17,000 guides! http://travel./p-travelguide Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 18, 2005 Report Share Posted April 18, 2005 I disagree. It seems obvious to me that sodium and chloride ions become perfectly available after dissolving in water; and that is what happens when humans salivate whenever salt is present in the mouth. regards, tev " Some substances dissolve more easily in water than do others. Common table salt (sodium chloride) dissolves in water very easily. When placed in water, the sodium chloride molecule falls apart. The positively charged sodium ion (Na+) binds to the oxygen, while the negatively charged chloride ion (CI-) attaches to the hydrogen. This makes a very stable " salty " water molecule. " http://www.ec.gc.ca/water/en/info/pubs/NSKit/e_chap1.htm --- " John L. Fielder " > Further, that the dissolving of salt in water does > not change its > chemical state. That is it does not change sodium > chloride into sodium > ions and chlorine ions. It is still in its > non-colloidal state. It is > only when taken up by the plant and processed via > photosynthesis that it > becomes avaiable to us. > > John [...there'll be love and laughter, and peace ever after, just you wait and see... ---Vera Lynn] Plan great trips with Travel: Now over 17,000 guides! http://travel./p-travelguide Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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