Scams, Misinformation, Profit Motive, Truth?

[Guest guest]

I have seen TV commercials saying that a bowl of oats (and milk) every

morning is good for cholesterol and diabetes problems. I've also read

research papers by M.D.'s (don't know who paid for the research) saying

that smoking is not addictive and may lead to a state of semi-euphoria;

that a glass of red wine every evening produces longevity; and that

Chocolate Coco-Puffs are good for kids!

 

But when someone who has actually tried the blessed herbs colon cleanse

and actually got the tarry, leathery, rubbery, mucoid plaque results

advertised by the seller--and someone else presents heresay evidence

that there is no such mucoid plaque--I begin to get confused about what

is truth for me.

 

I went to Post # 495, as Bob suggested, and found that it was an

invitation to a pumpkin pie potluck--not a video download on getting

started on the raw life. I tried the Raw School and was encouraged to

leave because I was " high maintenance " and because I had too many of my

own ideas. I think that site is also operated for a profit.

 

I tend to shy away from any help that comes with a price tag, because

I believe that $89 for " herbs " shows that there is more profit motive

than truth involved in this " miracle cleanse business. " And any time

someone is booted and banned from " the Truth " because s/he doesn't make

a " contribution, " that tweaks my scam sensors!

 

This whole raw business has proven to be very confusing for me because

I first tried it when I was in a V.A. hospital and a homeless shelter

and had no control over my food. I could not succeed at it for my

first year because my psychiatrist was telling me that I had to have a

very strong bipolar medication in order to stay sober and out of jail--

and the medication was causing a terrific weight gain! At present, I

am the only bipolar outpatient that I know of who does not take his

meds.

 

Now that I have a Section 8 apartment, I have, at last, come face to

face with myself. Now that there is no one else cooking my food; now

that I am off medication; now that I can choose what I want to eat. . .

I still have trouble with the raw lifestyle. . . but now it is because

I go to Overeaters Anonymous meetings and hear obese people explain to

me how they think and what they believe (which makes me want to eat

chocolate cake). . . and because I go to Weightwatchers, where they

tell me that I can lose weight if I learn how to read packages and

calculate true fat percentages and decipher sales lingo!

 

After many new starts and many failures, my new raw date is 8-08-2008.

I still haven't found a support group, a mentor, or a source of

information that I can count on for " Truth. " I still feel that I am

the only person trying to live a healthy lifestyle. . . and it is hard

to live that way.

 

Ron

[Guest guest]

Hi Ron.

 

 

 

yes, apologies; post number 495 is for GoingRaw.

 

 

 

Elchanan had recently reposted the correct post

 

number for : it's 12125.

 

(I checked it: it's correct!)

 

 

 

 

 

Best,

 

Bob

 

Bob Farrell

PathOfHealth group

part of an exchange-based community

 

<blocked::http://health.PathOfHealth/>

http://health.PathOfHealth/

 

 

 

---subject line inspected and post trimmed in community spirit---

 

 

I went to Post # 495, as Bob suggested, and found that it was an

invitation to a pumpkin pie potluck

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Ron -

 

I know exactly how you feel. You can really drive yourself crazy with all

the conflicting info out there. There is so much disagreement within the raw

food community that sometimes it feels hostile. So I take it all with a

grain of salt and add a lot of common sense.

 

I tend not to supplement or use so-called superfoods and such, but when I

do, it's probably more so out of curiosity/experimentation. I eat fairy

simply, but I also have a dehydrator and use it. I use some of the more

questionable " raw " items on occasion or not at all (except vinegar) and I

try to stay within a reasonable fat percentage. I think I do pretty well

now. And it works for me.

 

Good luck and try not to drive yourself batty!

 

kristi

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Ron,

 

Listen to what feels right for YOU. No one answer, No one source is

nessasarily YOUR answer .

If it works for you that is when you will know.

Whatever you choose make it simple so you can apply it and/or make it a healthy

habbit.

Go where and associate with people that have been successful and have overcome

thier struggles like yours.

If you want to try something TRY IT. Be your own testamonial.

The Herbalist on 65th has loose herbs and you can make your own formulas for

less. loose leaf into teas etc.

Not sure about the mucoid plaque but one person I know got a big long rubber

hose out (sorry) others see parasites, all felt better.

Weather it is plaque or just the waterfall effect of assisting your body to get

the toxins out, you be the judge.

As many people on this list that would " dissagree " with me (about certain foods,

protocals, etc) the same amount " agree " . (whatever the subject)..

So choose for yourself , try stuff out, see how you feel and let us know !

 

My best to you

 

Catherine

 

 

-

dukkadon

Saturday, August 16, 2008 11:41 AM

Scams, Misinformation, Profit Motive, Truth?

 

 

I have seen TV commercials saying that a bowl of oats (and milk) every

morning is good for cholesterol and diabetes problems. I've also read

research papers by M.D.'s (don't know who paid for the research) saying

that smoking is not addictive and may lead to a state of semi-euphoria;

that a glass of red wine every evening produces longevity; and that

Chocolate Coco-Puffs are good for kids!

 

But when someone who has actually tried the blessed herbs colon cleanse

and actually got the tarry, leathery, rubbery, mucoid plaque results

advertised by the seller--and someone else presents heresay evidence

that there is no such mucoid plaque--I begin to get confused about what

is truth for me.

 

I went to Post # 495, as Bob suggested, and found that it was an

invitation to a pumpkin pie potluck--not a video download on getting

started on the raw life. I tried the Raw School and was encouraged to

leave because I was " high maintenance " and because I had too many of my

own ideas. I think that site is also operated for a profit.

 

I tend to shy away from any help that comes with a price tag, because

I believe that $89 for " herbs " shows that there is more profit motive

than truth involved in this " miracle cleanse business. " And any time

someone is booted and banned from " the Truth " because s/he doesn't make

a " contribution, " that tweaks my scam sensors!

 

This whole raw business has proven to be very confusing for me because

I first tried it when I was in a V.A. hospital and a homeless shelter

and had no control over my food. I could not succeed at it for my

first year because my psychiatrist was telling me that I had to have a

very strong bipolar medication in order to stay sober and out of jail--

and the medication was causing a terrific weight gain! At present, I

am the only bipolar outpatient that I know of who does not take his

meds.

 

Now that I have a Section 8 apartment, I have, at last, come face to

face with myself. Now that there is no one else cooking my food; now

that I am off medication; now that I can choose what I want to eat. . .

I still have trouble with the raw lifestyle. . . but now it is because

I go to Overeaters Anonymous meetings and hear obese people explain to

me how they think and what they believe (which makes me want to eat

chocolate cake). . . and because I go to Weightwatchers, where they

tell me that I can lose weight if I learn how to read packages and

calculate true fat percentages and decipher sales lingo!

 

After many new starts and many failures, my new raw date is 8-08-2008.

I still haven't found a support group, a mentor, or a source of

information that I can count on for " Truth. " I still feel that I am

the only person trying to live a healthy lifestyle. . . and it is hard

to live that way.

 

Ron

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Ron,

This list is for the exchange of information about health and raw food. It

is not appropriate for you to use it to cast negative personal aspersions on

others in our community.

Sincerely,

Nora

[Guest guest]

Thanks Nora,

 

Yes, this list is for sharing ideas, etc. about raw vegan foods. There

are varying opinions about diet and nutrition. Members can share their

opinions, beliefs, etc., but condescension, attacks, negative

comments, etc. are not welcome. This list is meant to be a family list

and is meant to create an environment where people feel welcome to

participate.

 

If it helps people, consider using " I " statements: " I feel... " , " I

believe... " , " I have read that... " , " It has been my experience

that... " , etc.

 

Thanks,

 

Jeff

 

On Aug 16, 2008, at 2:37 PM, Nora Lenz wrote:

 

> This list is for the exchange of information about health and raw

> food. It

> is not appropriate for you to use it to cast negative personal

> aspersions on

> others in our community.

> Sincerely,

> Nora

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Hi Ron,

 

I just want to thank you for opening this flurry of discussion! Nothing seems

to wake us up like a good old colon question I want to wish you the best of

luck on your new raw path. I continue to strive toward a solid 80% raw diet. I

seem to do fine all day on fruits and a big green drink. I love a good green

smoothie too! I usually have a big salad at night also, but I admit I still

struggle with refined sugar and coffee. It's all a big, exciting journey...

 

I know all of the info out there can be confusing and overwhelming. I just try

to keep it all as simple as possible. For instance, I was never a gourmet cook,

so I will not be a gourmet raw food chef either. Again, simple is better for me.

I try to eat as much from nature, the way she created it, and let that be my

guide. If you have questions, just post them and if anyone can answer, I'm sure

they will. Again, best of luck!

 

Peace on earth.

 

Cheryl

 

-

dukkadon<dukkadon

< >

Saturday, August 16, 2008 11:41 AM

Scams, Misinformation, Profit Motive, Truth?

 

 

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[Guest guest]

Hi Ron,

It seems like you touched a Raw nerve here. Pun intended. While I have

nothing against making honest money, you are correct when you astutely

look for the profit motive in peoples/professionals health opinions

and assertions. Do you know about Steve Solomon's web site www.soiland

health.org ? Everything there is free. He provides this as a public

service. I recommend his wifes free book to view there, titled How and

When to be Your Own Doctor, by Elizabeth Moser.. Since you can print

75 pages a week at the King County Library, I printed it and it sits

on my bookshelf. It was a good start for me in transitioning off the

Standard American Diet and Allopathic model of medicine. An eye

opener. It is in the Alternative Health section. God Bless the

internet. And God Bless you. Good luck.

Mike

 

 

, " dukkadon " <dukkadon wrote:

>

> I have seen TV commercials saying that a bowl of oats (and milk) every

> morning is good for cholesterol and diabetes problems. I've also read

> research papers by M.D.'s (don't know who paid for the research) saying

> that smoking is not addictive and may lead to a state of semi-euphoria;

> that a glass of red wine every evening produces longevity; and that

> Chocolate Coco-Puffs are good for kids!

>

> But when someone who has actually tried the blessed herbs colon cleanse

> and actually got the tarry, leathery, rubbery, mucoid plaque results

> advertised by the seller--and someone else presents heresay evidence

> that there is no such mucoid plaque--I begin to get confused about what

> is truth for me.

>

> I went to Post # 495, as Bob suggested, and found that it was an

> invitation to a pumpkin pie potluck--not a video download on getting

> started on the raw life. I tried the Raw School and was encouraged to

> leave because I was " high maintenance " and because I had too many of my

> own ideas. I think that site is also operated for a profit.

>

> I tend to shy away from any help that comes with a price tag, because

> I believe that $89 for " herbs " shows that there is more profit motive

> than truth involved in this " miracle cleanse business. " And any time

> someone is booted and banned from " the Truth " because s/he doesn't make

> a " contribution, " that tweaks my scam sensors!

>

> This whole raw business has proven to be very confusing for me because

> I first tried it when I was in a V.A. hospital and a homeless shelter

> and had no control over my food. I could not succeed at it for my

> first year because my psychiatrist was telling me that I had to have a

> very strong bipolar medication in order to stay sober and out of jail--

> and the medication was causing a terrific weight gain! At present, I

> am the only bipolar outpatient that I know of who does not take his

> meds.

>

> Now that I have a Section 8 apartment, I have, at last, come face to

> face with myself. Now that there is no one else cooking my food; now

> that I am off medication; now that I can choose what I want to eat. . .

> I still have trouble with the raw lifestyle. . . but now it is because

> I go to Overeaters Anonymous meetings and hear obese people explain to

> me how they think and what they believe (which makes me want to eat

> chocolate cake). . . and because I go to Weightwatchers, where they

> tell me that I can lose weight if I learn how to read packages and

> calculate true fat percentages and decipher sales lingo!

>

> After many new starts and many failures, my new raw date is 8-08-2008.

> I still haven't found a support group, a mentor, or a source of

> information that I can count on for " Truth. " I still feel that I am

> the only person trying to live a healthy lifestyle. . . and it is hard

> to live that way.

>

> Ron

>

[Guest guest]

While Nora may not be a moderator on this list, she is a long time,

and valuable, member of this list, and she is correct in that personal

attacks and negative aspersions are not welcome on this list. I do not

see them as an attempt to lecture or control everyone. I see it as an

effort to keep members within our guidelines. Personally, I do

appreciate when I'm not the only one reminding others of our

guidelines and other members speak up. Avoiding personal attacks, etc.

is one of the basic guidelines here. The guidelines are given to all

new members. They are also automatically posted to the list monthly.

They are also available in the file section of our .

 

Just yesterday I posted this:

 

> Yes, this list is for sharing ideas, etc. about raw vegan foods.

> There are varying opinions about diet and nutrition. Members can

> share their opinions, beliefs, etc., but condescension, attacks,

> negative comments, etc. are not welcome. This list is meant to be a

> family list and is meant to create an environment where people feel

> welcome to participate.

>

> If it helps people, consider using " I " statements: " I feel... " , " I

> believe... " , " I have read that... " , " It has been my experience

> that... " , etc.

 

I wrote the latter sentence for the group to help those members that

may need a better way of expressing themselves when tempted to use

other language that may be viewed as an attack, condescension, etc.

 

This is from the monthly guidelines " Posting Etiquette " :

 

Like any list or group of people, we have a diverse/eclectic group

and have a variety of backgrounds and opinions. Please share

your feelings and opinions while honoring and respecting those

of others. Please do not attack the character of others when they

believe differently. Please also keep language appropriate for a

family list, so we may continue appealing to a broader audience.

Please, no condescending, sarcasm, or name-calling. Our members should

feel welcome to post here.

 

Thanks,

 

Jeff

 

> Nora,

>

 

> Unless you are the moderator of this list, I would appreciate it if

> you would keep your negative personal aspersions to yourself. I

> listened to all of them I cared to on Raw School.

>

> Nora, one of these days, you will do well to look at yourself,

> instead of trying to lecture and control everyone else.

 

>

> Ron

>

> , " Nora Lenz " <nmlenz wrote:

> >

> > Ron,

> > This list is for the exchange of information about health and raw

> food. It

> > is not appropriate for you to use it to cast negative personal

> aspersions on

> > others in our community.

> > Sincerely,

> > Nora

> >