Daycare (revisited)

[Guest guest]

Natalie,

Delayed response, but....

What a terrible daycare existence your son (and you) had. Blech.

 

When my son reached 3.5 yrs, I needed to return to work full time (having

been mostly at home with him, save a few hours each week to teach yoga),

thrusting my ds into full-time daycare. It took some adjustment - it was

harder for me than my son, who is very easy-going. That's not to say he

didn't have hard times, but I didn't make it much easier as I went through

my own trauma of having to suddenly be away from him for so much of the day.

Then, when we were together, it wasn't (isn't) quality time. We're getting

ready for our day, we're driving, or we're getting ready for bed. Full-time

employment is so unfriendly to families, especially single-parent. I have,

at most, 1 hour per work day that I don't have to be doing something else,

that I can spend concentrated on my son. And in that hour, I'm beat.

 

So his daycare - Well, as daycares go, it's okay. They keep him vegan and I

keep them well-stocked with vegan, natural and/or organic versions of the

crap they feed the other kids.

 

He plays a lot, and doesn't get to see much TV. Still more than I prefer,

but at least it's not scheduled into the day like at some daycares.

 

So what's my complaint?? It's that I have realized, now 9 months later,

that my son's natural learning - I don't mean academic, pre-school prep

learning, but natural ability to figure things out and make sense of things

- has come to a complete and probably measurable HALT since entering

daycare. Sure, now he's struggling to write letters, but otherwise, the

teachers are (so common to public school systems) having to teach to the

lowest common denominator. So here's my son - over 4 now - having to

practice COLORS and SHAPES which he and I did before he was even 2. He knew

a rectangle from a square, literally years ago. And so the daycare director

said to me last month, eyes wide with great surprise and admiration!, " He

knows his colors and shapes!! He's ready for kindergarten! " I smiled

faintly, and I thought to myself, " my poor son. " This is how you begin to

learn that *education* isn't fun, that school isn't fun, that learning in

that environment isn't fun - having to do exercises over and over that you

already know how to do, that you could do in your sleep, that're just busy

work. And this isn't even a pre-school, it's just a daycare, but as they

all are licensed by the state, they're also mandated by the state to do

these exercises to get all the kids ready for kindergarten.

Don't get me wrong, I know the other kids need these exercises because

they've been in daycares most of their lives and they never got the

one-on-one that my son did. They really need to do this work, and I'm glad

they're getting a chance to do it now before they really fall behind. But

it KILLS me that my son brings home pages of circles and triangle without

enthusiasm, and I can barely get excited about them myself.

 

So that's *my* daycare rant and I think Natalie's right on - with some

cheery exceptions, overall daycares are not great environments for kids. If

those exceptions were the rule, we wouldn't be complaining.

~Doh

[Guest guest]

I too was going to reply about daycare but was

reluctant to. However, with this comment I feel the

need to reply.

 

First, there is a national crisis with daycare. This

is for several reasons. But one main problem for

parents is finding high quality day care. I have been

fortunate to not have this problem. But it is also

costly.

 

My 26 month old has been in daycare since she was 7

weeks old. Now some of you may think this is awful.

But I wouldn't have it any other way. I enjoy working

and although my life is stressful, I can't imagine

staying home all day with my child, coming up with

creative and exciting things to keep her entertained

nor could I keep her on the regular schedule that she

is on at daycare. I don't feel guilty for leaving her

there. I miss her during the day but I have no guilt.

 

 

However, in an ideal world, we would have the same

communities of caring that so many other places in the

world continue to have.

 

That being said, I have been spoiled because I have

had a mostly wonderful experience with daycare. Some

of this was because of the individual teacher she had

as an infant and some of this is because of the

quality of the daycare she is currently in. In the 2

facilities that she has been in they have NEVER had a

TV on or in the premesis.

 

As an infant, she was taught not babysat. The teachers

(most had a BA or were working on one) did an activity

a day with her as an infant. They also did a sensory

activity every day and read every day. Weather

permitting they always went on a walk daily, and when

weather was bad, they walked around the center. They

also used babysign with the children to help them

communicate earlier than they could talking.

 

Currently, she is in a NAYEC accredited center. I am

spoiled to have one nearby because I work at a local

university. The daycare is a training facility for

early childhood education majors. All of the teachers

are degreed. There are also students who work part

time to help out as well. While the state ratio for

toddlers is 7 to 1, the ratio most times during the

day is 7 to 2. They are always doing something

creative with the children. They read everyday, have

art, and the teachers keep a journal to communicate

with parents and involve the parents in everything (it

is up to the parents to keep ourselves involved). Wed

for example, we are going to a pumpkin patch and for a

hayride.

 

The problems I have with daycare are somewhat similar

to Doh. Quinn is 26 months and we do not work with her

in the sense of flashcards and memorization (there is

an appropriate time and place for that but not in 99%

of learning). We talk to and with her. We have always

done that. Because dh is a children's librarian, books

abound our home and we have read to Quinn since before

she was born. At 12 months, she had spoken words and

50 to 60 signs she was communicating with. At 26

months she recognizes about 10 letters, recognizes her

name written, counts to 20, knows all her colors,

knows most shapes, she speaks in complete sentences,

she is identifying what she is drawing, and continues

to amaze us everyday.

 

The problems I had with the first day care were diet

related (they gave her cow's milk for almost a month

and never said anything to me, long story). The other

problems have to do with her being advanced for her

age. We want her to be challenged but don't want to

push her too much because she is as I like to say " a 3

year old trapped in a 2 year olds body. " Emotionally

and socially she is average, it's everything else she

excells at. We pulled her from the last day care

because of the food issues and the ratio there was 14

to 2 and when all the toddlers were combined in the

gym 42 to 6. The toddler teachers pushed independence

in the last day care so much, when dd came home she

wanted me to do everything for her because she was

exhausted of doing it herself. She gets much more

individual attention at the university center.

 

The problems I think Doh is having with her ds are due

to his advanced learning. I was told just the other

day by the teachers that most of the 3 year olds don't

know their shapes. This is why they work on these.

Repetition is good for toddlers. However, as my dh

says, schools can only do so much. They cater to the

mean. If you are above or below the mean you will

struggle. In addition, you can't expect school to

teach your child everything. Learning doesn't take

place only in school. In addition, many teachers

because of their philosophy or because they should

never have been a teacher, are not good teachers.

Teaching is a hard job, whether it is preschoolers or

college. Our education is in a sad state of affairs

because the " no child left behind act " has stiffled

the education system. So much emphasis is placed on

standardized testing, in addition to so many children

watching too much tv, that many kids don't know how to

be creative. You can't create if you are memorizing or

having everything placed in front of you. As a parent

and educator, like Doh, this is so annoying and

frustrating.

 

Another problem my dh sees daily (he teaches 4th and

5th graders) is that parents aren't involved in their

child's learning. When doing his student teaching,

many parents came in saying " my child is ready for

kindergarten, she doesn't know how to read yet. " This

puts the children behind from the start and they can

never catch up. Some parents expect teachers to " work

magic " on their children. But as I mentioned already,

the " no child left behind act " doesn't facilitate

learning in children and is not supportive of teaching

style of the truly good teachers nor the learning

style of many children.

 

I agree with Doh, fulltime employment is unfriendly to

families, kids or not. If interested in info on that

issue,

 

go to www.timeday.org

 

We work more now than ever before. And for what or

who, not ourselves. But I digress.

 

All I guess I wanted to say is that if our society

paid as much attention to our children, all areas,

diet, exercise, childcare, prenatal, etc, as they do

to war, what a wonderful place this would be. Look at

the stats, as the richest industrialized country in

the world our children fair so poorly. Daycare doesn't

have to be a " bad " thing. But in so many places it

isn't done correctly.

 

Doh, if the director is that impressed by a almost 4

year olds (?) knowledge of colors and shapes, if

possible, it may be time for either a new daycare or a

preschool that is better for precosious children. Good

luck in finding a daycare/preschool that fits with

your philosophy of learning. Is there a Waldorf school

in the area? Sounds like this would be better for your

ds.

 

 

I apologize for the length of this.

 

 

Peace,

 

Joann, Lon, Quinn (2)

 

 

 

 

--- Doh! <dohdriver wrote:

> Natalie,

> Delayed response, but....

> What a terrible daycare existence your son (and you)

> had. Blech.

>

> When my son reached 3.5 yrs, I needed to return to

> work full time (having

> been mostly at home with him, save a few hours each

> week to teach yoga),

> thrusting my ds into full-time daycare. It took

> some adjustment - it was

> harder for me than my son, who is very easy-going.

> That's not to say he

> didn't have hard times, but I didn't make it much

> easier as I went through

> my own trauma of having to suddenly be away from him

> for so much of the day.

> Then, when we were together, it wasn't (isn't)

> quality time. We're getting

> ready for our day, we're driving, or we're getting

> ready for bed. Full-time

> employment is so unfriendly to families, especially

> single-parent. I have,

> at most, 1 hour per work day that I don't have to be

> doing something else,

> that I can spend concentrated on my son. And in

> that hour, I'm beat.

>

> So his daycare - Well, as daycares go, it's okay.

> They keep him vegan and I

> keep them well-stocked with vegan, natural and/or

> organic versions of the

> crap they feed the other kids.

>

> He plays a lot, and doesn't get to see much TV.

> Still more than I prefer,

> but at least it's not scheduled into the day like at

> some daycares.

>

> So what's my complaint?? It's that I have realized,

> now 9 months later,

> that my son's natural learning - I don't mean

> academic, pre-school prep

> learning, but natural ability to figure things out

> and make sense of things

> - has come to a complete and probably measurable

> HALT since entering

> daycare. Sure, now he's struggling to write

> letters, but otherwise, the

> teachers are (so common to public school systems)

> having to teach to the

> lowest common denominator. So here's my son - over

> 4 now - having to

> practice COLORS and SHAPES which he and I did before

> he was even 2. He knew

> a rectangle from a square, literally years ago. And

> so the daycare director

> said to me last month, eyes wide with great surprise

> and admiration!, " He

> knows his colors and shapes!! He's ready for

> kindergarten! " I smiled

> faintly, and I thought to myself, " my poor son. "

> This is how you begin to

> learn that *education* isn't fun, that school isn't

> fun, that learning in

> that environment isn't fun - having to do exercises

> over and over that you

> already know how to do, that you could do in your

> sleep, that're just busy

> work. And this isn't even a pre-school, it's just a

> daycare, but as they

> all are licensed by the state, they're also mandated

> by the state to do

> these exercises to get all the kids ready for

> kindergarten.

> Don't get me wrong, I know the other kids need these

> exercises because

> they've been in daycares most of their lives and

> they never got the

> one-on-one that my son did. They really need to do

> this work, and I'm glad

> they're getting a chance to do it now before they

> really fall behind. But

> it KILLS me that my son brings home pages of circles

> and triangle without

> enthusiasm, and I can barely get excited about them

> myself.

>

> So that's *my* daycare rant and I think Natalie's

> right on - with some

> cheery exceptions, overall daycares are not great

> environments for kids. If

> those exceptions were the rule, we wouldn't be

> complaining.

> ~Doh

>

>

>

>

 

 

 

 

The New with improved product search

 

[Guest guest]

I just want to say, I liked your post very much, and thank you for

sharing.

I totally agree with what you said: " In addition, many teachers

because of their philosophy or because they should never have been a

teacher, are not good teachers. " I have known many a teacher like

this - and BTW, teaching for 30+ years IS NOT, I REPEAT NOT, N-O-T a

good thing!

Should a child be " advanced " or " in need of extra help " , it is my

feeling that not enough emphasis is being placed on values,

kindness, and simply being a good and honest person. Would you

rather be around a child who can read and write like a pro at the

age of 3, but who's behavior is totally out of control? Or a child

who can't tell the difference between a square and a circle to save

their life, but has good manners and can contain their impulses?

Which child would you rather have your kid seated next to in first

grade?

Tracey =^..^=

www.KindheartedWomen.com

[Guest guest]

There is some danger in schools teaching values, though. I have heard some

horror stories of " character education " values and tenets.

 

Some things, yes, schools need to enforce and teach. Like sharing. Some things

it's better not to broach.

 

Tracey <weety wrote:

I just want to say, I liked your post very much, and thank you for

sharing.

I totally agree with what you said: " In addition, many teachers

because of their philosophy or because they should never have been a

teacher, are not good teachers. " I have known many a teacher like

this - and BTW, teaching for 30+ years IS NOT, I REPEAT NOT, N-O-T a

good thing!

Should a child be " advanced " or " in need of extra help " , it is my

feeling that not enough emphasis is being placed on values,

kindness, and simply being a good and honest person. Would you

rather be around a child who can read and write like a pro at the

age of 3, but who's behavior is totally out of control? Or a child

who can't tell the difference between a square and a circle to save

their life, but has good manners and can contain their impulses?

Which child would you rather have your kid seated next to in first

grade?

Tracey =^..^=

www.KindheartedWomen.com

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

In response Tracey

 

As far as " manners " go, I think sharing, being honest,

kind, saying pleases and thank yous, etc. are

important. The empahsis is there in daycares. They are

doing this at our daycare, and we reinforce it at

home. They did it at our old daycare as well. But that

is what I expect, even without daycare. For some

parents it isn't important.

 

However, some parents are not consistant with daycare

(or school) and do not work with their child's

teachers. I am constantly asking questions of the

teachers, us working at home and them at school on

sharing and " gentle hands, " as an example (Two year

olds sometimes can't " control " emotions.)

 

But there are many cases where parents are not

supporting what teachers do in daycare. There has to

be consistancy, just like between dh and dw. When

there isn't consitancy, the child knows how to get

what he/she wants. If mom doesn't make me use my words

at home to get a snack (I can point and moan and

she'll give it to me) and daycare expects me to use my

words, I am not going to use words at daycare. Even

with school agers, parents are still the biggest

influence on a child. (In the old daycare my child was

at, 3 year olds were saying f*** you to other

children. This wasn't being taught at daycare. Parents

weren't helping to stop it either. Some parents

thought it was cute. So what happens, parents who find

it unacceptable pull their children out and teachers

that can't deal with the stress find other jobs. What

message does the child eventually learn? Parents do

have the most influence. But what if you don't find

this behavior acceptable and you don't have the means

to pull your child out, then what? There isn't a

simple solution.)

 

As far as what is emphasised in learning, there is an

excellent new book out that speaks to how children

learn that parents and educators need to read

 

Einstein Never Used Flash Cards: How our children

really learn--and why they need to play more and

memorize less

by Kathy Hirsh-Pasek and Roberta Michnick Golinkoff

 

It emphasizes how to acheive creative, imaginative,

independent thinkers of our children. Schools could

but don't do this. Schools function in society is to

make students into workers and soldiers, make good

citizens. We learn more about our society's values

than we do about math, history or science. It is not

to foster independent thinking. Schools create

conformity not creativity. Those who are creative are

usually punished in some way. Think about it: you

stand in line, you meet deadlines, you raise your

hand, in some cases you wear uniforms, saying the

" pledge, " etc.

 

And to the reaction that " schools were bad off before

no child left behind, " Yes they were bad off. Schools

have always stifled creativity and independence.

Schools are having a hard time in most areas getting

updated texts and supplies, here in OH the biggest

problem we have is buildings that are unsuitable for

living in but we'll school our children in them (we

have schools where kids have to use port-o-potties or

in the winter sit all day with jackets on cause the

heating systems are still coal burning stoves that

don't heat adequately).

 

What " no child left behind " does is follow what many

schools were already doing and reinforcing it. It also

puts schools with stapped budgets in even worse

positions. Many schools are not capable of complying

with everything in the " act " . More and more schools

are elimating important learning opportunites by

dismantling music, art, and, in Philadelphia,

libraries; the places where creativity and independent

thinking occur. And as far as libraries, if you are

for " standardized testing, " schools with libraries do

better than schools without them.

 

This is just the learning part, then there are the

lunches and extra curriculars. Then there are teachers

who are underpaid, and in fear of losing their jobs if

the schools don't make " standards. " How can you teach

if what will help a student pass a test is learning

how to take a test so you don't lose your job? I don't

want my child coming out of 12 years of schooling only

knowing how to pass a test and not really knowing how

to do math, science, etc. As I said above, schools

teach conformity. I have a big problem with running

schools like a business (yes a few schools could stand

to have help with their budgeting). It makes students

a commodity that can be measured monitarily

(standardized tests). The schools with the most

students that pass get the most $. I think that is

worse for education than the state education was in

before " no child left behind " which was bad in its own

right. But I am saying to much now, this is a

discussion group on vegetarian kids not schools.

 

I also agree with " corporate monkey grrrl " that I

don't want " character education. " It is extremely

value laden. A teacher is always teaching values in a

classroom anyway, even if it isn't formal (in what is

expected of the class, in how students are

" disciplined " or not, etc). While I think it is ideal

for a child to " control " emotions and verbalize them

instead of throwing or hitting, if I had to rank them,

I would rank imagination, creativity, and independence

as higher in importance. Look at some of our

polititions, they have " manners " but are they creative

thinkers making the world a better place for our

children?

 

In sum, there is alot that needs to be done to improve

schools, with and without money. But I don't see

" character education " and " standardized tests " as a

way to solve the problems in our education system.

Besides, when polled, people say their local public

school district is doing fine, but schools in a broad

sense, are failing. Interesting, isn't it?

 

We may not all agree on these issues, but I know we

all agree on changing those lunches.

 

Peace,

 

Joann

 

 

 

--- Corporate Monkey Grrrl

<corporatemonkeygrrrl wrote:

> There is some danger in schools teaching values,

> though. I have heard some horror stories of

> " character education " values and tenets.

>

> Some things, yes, schools need to enforce and teach.

> Like sharing. Some things it's better not to broach.

>

> Tracey <weety wrote:

> I just want to say, I liked your post very much, and

> thank you for

> sharing.

> I totally agree with what you said: " In addition,

> many teachers

> because of their philosophy or because they should

> never have been a

> teacher, are not good teachers. " I have known many

> a teacher like

> this - and BTW, teaching for 30+ years IS NOT, I

> REPEAT NOT, N-O-T a

> good thing!

> Should a child be " advanced " or " in need of extra

> help " , it is my

> feeling that not enough emphasis is being placed on

> values,

> kindness, and simply being a good and honest person.

> Would you

> rather be around a child who can read and write like

> a pro at the

> age of 3, but who's behavior is totally out of

> control? Or a child

> who can't tell the difference between a square and a

> circle to save

> their life, but has good manners and can contain

> their impulses?

> Which child would you rather have your kid seated

> next to in first

> grade?

> Tracey =^..^=

> www.KindheartedWomen.com

 

[Guest guest]

> Some things, yes, schools need to enforce and teach. Like sharing.

Some things it's better not to broach.

~~~~~~~~~

AGREED!

I suppose " values " may have been the wrong term. I was thinking

more along the lines of " manners " , not teasing and name-calling,

sharing, turn-taking, listening skills...like that. Things most of

us learned at home before getting to school!

 

Tracey =^..^=

www.KindheartedWomen.com

[Guest guest]

Way to break it down, Joann.

 

Long live explorative learning. Really, that has got to be one of the greatest

tragedies of the current educational pushes. The explorative nature of learning

that makes it enjoyable in the first place is being budgetted out by time and

money constraints. We're teaching the kids what instead of how to learn. And

then we're expecting them to focus on school after giving them nutritionally

dismal snacks and meals. And all but forcing schools to accept corporate

sponsorship style funding.

 

Joann Toth <postfem wrote:In response Tracey

 

As far as " manners " go, I think sharing, being honest,

kind, saying pleases and thank yous, etc. are

important. The empahsis is there in daycares. They are

doing this at our daycare, and we reinforce it at

home. They did it at our old daycare as well. But that

is what I expect, even without daycare. For some

parents it isn't important.

 

However, some parents are not consistant with daycare

(or school) and do not work with their child's

teachers. I am constantly asking questions of the

teachers, us working at home and them at school on

sharing and " gentle hands, " as an example (Two year

olds sometimes can't " control " emotions.)

 

But there are many cases where parents are not

supporting what teachers do in daycare. There has to

be consistancy, just like between dh and dw. When

there isn't consitancy, the child knows how to get

what he/she wants. If mom doesn't make me use my words

at home to get a snack (I can point and moan and

she'll give it to me) and daycare expects me to use my

words, I am not going to use words at daycare. Even

with school agers, parents are still the biggest

influence on a child. (In the old daycare my child was

at, 3 year olds were saying f*** you to other

children. This wasn't being taught at daycare. Parents

weren't helping to stop it either. Some parents

thought it was cute. So what happens, parents who find

it unacceptable pull their children out and teachers

that can't deal with the stress find other jobs. What

message does the child eventually learn? Parents do

have the most influence. But what if you don't find

this behavior acceptable and you don't have the means

to pull your child out, then what? There isn't a

simple solution.)

 

As far as what is emphasised in learning, there is an

excellent new book out that speaks to how children

learn that parents and educators need to read

 

Einstein Never Used Flash Cards: How our children

really learn--and why they need to play more and

memorize less

by Kathy Hirsh-Pasek and Roberta Michnick Golinkoff

 

It emphasizes how to acheive creative, imaginative,

independent thinkers of our children. Schools could

but don't do this. Schools function in society is to

make students into workers and soldiers, make good

citizens. We learn more about our society's values

than we do about math, history or science. It is not

to foster independent thinking. Schools create

conformity not creativity. Those who are creative are

usually punished in some way. Think about it: you

stand in line, you meet deadlines, you raise your

hand, in some cases you wear uniforms, saying the

" pledge, " etc.

 

And to the reaction that " schools were bad off before

no child left behind, " Yes they were bad off. Schools

have always stifled creativity and independence.

Schools are having a hard time in most areas getting

updated texts and supplies, here in OH the biggest

problem we have is buildings that are unsuitable for

living in but we'll school our children in them (we

have schools where kids have to use port-o-potties or

in the winter sit all day with jackets on cause the

heating systems are still coal burning stoves that

don't heat adequately).

 

What " no child left behind " does is follow what many

schools were already doing and reinforcing it. It also

puts schools with stapped budgets in even worse

positions. Many schools are not capable of complying

with everything in the " act " . More and more schools

are elimating important learning opportunites by

dismantling music, art, and, in Philadelphia,

libraries; the places where creativity and independent

thinking occur. And as far as libraries, if you are

for " standardized testing, " schools with libraries do

better than schools without them.

 

This is just the learning part, then there are the

lunches and extra curriculars. Then there are teachers

who are underpaid, and in fear of losing their jobs if

the schools don't make " standards. " How can you teach

if what will help a student pass a test is learning

how to take a test so you don't lose your job? I don't

want my child coming out of 12 years of schooling only

knowing how to pass a test and not really knowing how

to do math, science, etc. As I said above, schools

teach conformity. I have a big problem with running

schools like a business (yes a few schools could stand

to have help with their budgeting). It makes students

a commodity that can be measured monitarily

(standardized tests). The schools with the most

students that pass get the most $. I think that is

worse for education than the state education was in

before " no child left behind " which was bad in its own

right. But I am saying to much now, this is a

discussion group on vegetarian kids not schools.

 

I also agree with " corporate monkey grrrl " that I

don't want " character education. " It is extremely

value laden. A teacher is always teaching values in a

classroom anyway, even if it isn't formal (in what is

expected of the class, in how students are

" disciplined " or not, etc). While I think it is ideal

for a child to " control " emotions and verbalize them

instead of throwing or hitting, if I had to rank them,

I would rank imagination, creativity, and independence

as higher in importance. Look at some of our

polititions, they have " manners " but are they creative

thinkers making the world a better place for our

children?

 

In sum, there is alot that needs to be done to improve

schools, with and without money. But I don't see

" character education " and " standardized tests " as a

way to solve the problems in our education system.

Besides, when polled, people say their local public

school district is doing fine, but schools in a broad

sense, are failing. Interesting, isn't it?

 

We may not all agree on these issues, but I know we

all agree on changing those lunches.

 

Peace,

 

Joann

 

 

 

--- Corporate Monkey Grrrl

<corporatemonkeygrrrl wrote:

> There is some danger in schools teaching values,

> though. I have heard some horror stories of

> " character education " values and tenets.

>

> Some things, yes, schools need to enforce and teach.

> Like sharing. Some things it's better not to broach.

>

> Tracey <weety wrote:

> I just want to say, I liked your post very much, and

> thank you for

> sharing.

> I totally agree with what you said: " In addition,

> many teachers

> because of their philosophy or because they should

> never have been a

> teacher, are not good teachers. " I have known many

> a teacher like

> this - and BTW, teaching for 30+ years IS NOT, I

> REPEAT NOT, N-O-T a

> good thing!

> Should a child be " advanced " or " in need of extra

> help " , it is my

> feeling that not enough emphasis is being placed on

> values,

> kindness, and simply being a good and honest person.

> Would you

> rather be around a child who can read and write like

> a pro at the

> age of 3, but who's behavior is totally out of

> control? Or a child

> who can't tell the difference between a square and a

> circle to save

> their life, but has good manners and can contain

> their impulses?

> Which child would you rather have your kid seated

> next to in first

> grade?

> Tracey =^..^=

> www.KindheartedWomen.com