Guest guest Posted August 19, 2002 Report Share Posted August 19, 2002 Hello folks Perhaps my ESP is a little faulty, but I get the distinct impression that mayhap there has been a big blow up on another vegan list over the smoking issue, people have been told that it's gone too far, so they've decided to bring it over here? I may just be getting cynical, but this always seems to be the scenario when a bunch of usually quiet older members start to get locquacious and tetchy on this list. ;-) BB Peter ---Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).Version: 6.0.381 / Virus Database: 214 - Release 02/08/02 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2002 Report Share Posted August 19, 2002 Just my two cents on the smoking issue.... I am very surprised to hear that activists are heavy smokers. Almost all the research on smoke inhalation is done by strapping a mask on to rabbits and cats and forcing them to inhale massive amounts of cigarette smoke. Do they make this addictive habit the exception to their otherwise vegan rule for their own sake? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2002 Report Share Posted August 19, 2002 tetchy??? i hear they have a cream for that..... fraggle " Peter " <Snowbow wrote: >Hello folks > >Perhaps my ESP is a little faulty, but I get the distinct impression that mayhap there has been a big blow up on another vegan list over the smoking issue, people have been told that it's gone too far, so they've decided to bring it over here? > >I may just be getting cynical, but this always seems to be the scenario when a bunch of usually quiet older members start to get locquacious and tetchy on this list. > >;-) > >BB >Peter > > >--- >Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). >Version: 6.0.381 / Virus Database: 214 - Release 02/08/02 > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2002 Report Share Posted August 20, 2002 , yumhummus@a... wrote: > Just my two cents on the smoking issue.... > I am very surprised to hear that activists are heavy smokers. > Almost all the research on smoke inhalation is done by strapping a mask on to > rabbits and cats and forcing them to inhale massive amounts of cigarette > smoke. > Do they make this addictive habit the exception to their otherwise vegan rule > for their own sake? I can only speak for myself and in actual fact I gave up smoking before becoming a vegan, but I think that if I were still a smoker I would not be put off by the animal testing. The simple reason is, they will experiment on animals whether or not I smoke. If I stop eating meat, then less animals will be killed as a result - there would be no parallel saving of life if I gave up smoking. The powers that be test *everything* on animals, even water. You can't give up everything that's been tested and although obviously no- one *needs* to smoke, if giving up will not save life, where's the vegan motivation? Plus which a lot of what you see and hear when you become AR aware is enough to send you screaming for the ciggies! Cathy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2002 Report Share Posted August 20, 2002 , " cathyjupp " <cj@r...> wrote: > I think that if I were still a smoker I > would not be put off by the animal testing. The simple reason is, > they will experiment on animals whether or not I smoke. If I stop > eating meat, then less animals will be killed as a result - there > would be no parallel saving of life if I gave up smoking. > Cathy Actually what it comes down to is the fact that you would be supporting the tobacco industry, not supporting the animal rights crusade, by continuing to purchase and smoke cigarettes. You would be endorsing the product and all it represents by your use of it. That said, if everyone quit smoking, there would be substantially little to no motivation for them to continue testing tobacco products in the countless ways that they do on the innocent animals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2002 Report Share Posted August 20, 2002 Yes many of them do just that and they know they cannot justify it! Lesley yumhummus [yumhummus]20 August 2002 00:18 Subject: Re: Smoking?Just my two cents on the smoking issue.... I am very surprised to hear that activists are heavy smokers. Almost all the research on smoke inhalation is done by strapping a mask on to rabbits and cats and forcing them to inhale massive amounts of cigarette smoke. Do they make this addictive habit the exception to their otherwise vegan rule for their own sake? To send an email to - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2002 Report Share Posted August 20, 2002 , " Lesley Dove " <Lesley@v...> wrote: > Yes many of them do just that and they know they cannot justify it! > > Lesley But then again, they don't *have* to justify it. Cathy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2002 Report Share Posted August 20, 2002 I see quite a lot of people here questioning the activists who smoke, obviously I am far from alone in seeing it as unreasonable on demos and protests. Lesley cathyjupp [cj]20 August 2002 17:08 Subject: Re: Smoking?, "Lesley Dove" <Lesley@v...> wrote:> Yes many of them do just that and they know they cannot justify it!> > LesleyBut then again, they don't *have* to justify it.CathyTo send an email to - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2002 Report Share Posted August 20, 2002 , " Lesley Dove " <Lesley@v...> wrote: > > I see quite a lot of people here questioning the activists who smoke, > obviously I am far from alone in seeing it as unreasonable on demos and > protests. > > Lesley Do you? I've seen one or two. Besides, being questioned is not the same as needing to justify one's actions. You sound like an old- fashioned schoolteacher, demanding that a pupil justify their actions. You have no such authority. Cathy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2002 Report Share Posted August 20, 2002 good then we aRE NOT ALONE IN THAT !!!!!!! >"Lesley Dove" > > >RE: Re: Smoking? >Tue, 20 Aug 2002 17:19:44 +0100 > > >I see quite a lot of people here questioning the activists who smoke, >obviously I am far from alone in seeing it as unreasonable on demos and >protests. > >Lesley > > > cathyjupp [cj] > 20 August 2002 17:08 > > Re: Smoking? > > > , "Lesley Dove" wrote: > > Yes many of them do just that and they know they cannot justify it! > > > > Lesley > > But then again, they don't *have* to justify it. > > Cathy > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2002 Report Share Posted August 20, 2002 questioning it is fine, discussing it is fine its the " how dare they " attitude which worries me yup, i don't think smoking is particularly good..but, railing against them isn't going to change many minds imo " B. B. " <ibyza2001 wrote: > > >good then we aRE NOT ALONE IN THAT !!!!!!! > > > > gt; " Lesley Dove " gt; gt; gt;RE: Re: Smoking? gt;Tue, 20 Aug 2002 17:19:44 +0100 gt; gt; gt;I see quite a lot of people here questioning the activists who smoke, gt;obviously I am far from alone in seeing it as unreasonable on demos and gt;protests. gt; gt;Lesley gt; gt; -----Original Message----- gt; cathyjupp [cj] gt; 20 August 2002 17:08 gt; gt; Re: Smoking? gt; gt; gt; , " Lesley Dove " wrote: gt; gt; Yes many of them do just that and they know they cannot justify it! gt; gt; gt; gt; Lesley gt; gt; But then again, they don't *have* to justify it. gt; gt; Cathy gt; gt; gt; Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2002 Report Share Posted August 20, 2002 Next time I go on a demo I shall have to get a gas mask to wear then, if they are allowed to smoke I am allowed to try to keep it from my lungs. It's funny that they are allowed to take away the most basic right to breatheable air, it is one of those things most necessary for life, so I feel justified in saying how dare they. I always thought you cared about human rights, Fraggle, do parents have the right to cause their kids to die of SIDS by their smoking too? Lesley EBbrewpunx [EBbrewpunx]20 August 2002 17:57 Subject: RE: Re: Smoking?questioning it is fine, discussing it is fineits the "how dare they" attitude which worries meyup, i don't think smoking is particularly good..but, railing against them isn't going to change many minds imo"B. B." <ibyza2001 wrote:> >>good then we aRE NOT ALONE IN THAT !!!!!!!>>>> gt;"Lesley Dove" gt; gt; gt;RE: Re: Smoking? gt;Tue, 20 Aug 2002 17:19:44 +0100 gt; gt; gt;I see quite a lot of people here questioning the activists who smoke, gt;obviously I am far from alone in seeing it as unreasonable on demos and gt;protests. gt; gt;Lesley gt; gt; gt; cathyjupp [cj] gt; 20 August 2002 17:08 gt; gt; Re: Smoking? gt; gt; gt; , "Lesley Dove" wrote: gt; gt; Yes many of them do just that and they know they cannot justify it! gt; gt; gt; gt; Lesley gt; gt; But then again, they don't *have* to justify it. gt; gt; Cathy gt; gt; gt; Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2002 Report Share Posted August 20, 2002 you are making really large and sweeping statements, from people smoking outside to parents smoking in front of their kids.... wait..i said i was quitting this discussion... whether i'm caring er not is immaterial..its not wot i think, its wot i do and how i act... fraggle " Lesley Dove " <Lesley wrote: > >Next time I go on a demo I shall have to get a gas mask to wear then, if >they are allowed to smoke I am allowed to try to keep it from my lungs. It's >funny that they are allowed to take away the most basic right to breatheable >air, it is one of those things most necessary for life, so I feel justified >in saying how dare they. I always thought you cared about human rights, >Fraggle, do parents have the right to cause their kids to die of SIDS by >their smoking too? > >Lesley > > > EBbrewpunx [EBbrewpunx] > 20 August 2002 17:57 > > RE: Re: Smoking? > > > questioning it is fine, discussing it is fine > its the " how dare they " attitude which worries me > yup, i don't think smoking is particularly good..but, railing against them >isn't going to change many minds imo > > > " B. B. " <ibyza2001 wrote: > > > > > > >good then we aRE NOT ALONE IN THAT !!!!!!! > > > > > > > > gt; " Lesley Dove " gt; > gt; gt;RE: Re: Smoking? >gt;Tue, 20 Aug 2002 17:19:44 +0100 gt; gt; gt;I see quite a lot of >people here questioning the activists who smoke, gt;obviously I am far from >alone in seeing it as unreasonable on demos and gt;protests. gt; gt;Lesley >gt; gt; gt; cathyjupp >[cj] gt; 20 August 2002 17:08 gt; To: > gt; Re: Smoking? gt; gt; >gt; , " Lesley Dove " wrote: gt; gt; Yes many >of them do just that and they know they cannot justify it! gt; gt; gt; gt; >Lesley gt; gt; But then again, they don't *have* to justify it. gt; gt; >Cathy gt; gt; gt; Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2002 Report Share Posted August 20, 2002 actually wearing a gas mask sounds great...it makes a point..and people will ask questions.... " Lesley Dove " <Lesley wrote: > >Next time I go on a demo I shall have to get a gas mask to wear then, if >they are allowed to smoke I am allowed to try to keep it from my lungs. It's >funny that they are allowed to take away the most basic right to breatheable >air, it is one of those things most necessary for life, so I feel justified >in saying how dare they. I always thought you cared about human rights, >Fraggle, do parents have the right to cause their kids to die of SIDS by >their smoking too? > >Lesley > > > EBbrewpunx [EBbrewpunx] > 20 August 2002 17:57 > > RE: Re: Smoking? > > > questioning it is fine, discussing it is fine > its the " how dare they " attitude which worries me > yup, i don't think smoking is particularly good..but, railing against them >isn't going to change many minds imo > > > " B. B. " <ibyza2001 wrote: > > > > > > >good then we aRE NOT ALONE IN THAT !!!!!!! > > > > > > > > gt; " Lesley Dove " gt; > gt; gt;RE: Re: Smoking? >gt;Tue, 20 Aug 2002 17:19:44 +0100 gt; gt; gt;I see quite a lot of >people here questioning the activists who smoke, gt;obviously I am far from >alone in seeing it as unreasonable on demos and gt;protests. gt; gt;Lesley >gt; gt; gt; cathyjupp >[cj] gt; 20 August 2002 17:08 gt; To: > gt; Re: Smoking? gt; gt; >gt; , " Lesley Dove " wrote: gt; gt; Yes many >of them do just that and they know they cannot justify it! gt; gt; gt; gt; >Lesley gt; gt; But then again, they don't *have* to justify it. gt; gt; >Cathy gt; gt; gt; Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2002 Report Share Posted August 20, 2002 Sweeping statements are pretty justified if something is deadly. Parents who smoke around their kids are simply unfit to have kids and they should be taken away to be protected, wish I had been. My life was in constant danger from it. Lesley EBbrewpunx [EBbrewpunx]20 August 2002 18:22 Subject: RE: Re: Smoking?you are making really large and sweeping statements, from people smoking outside to parents smoking in front of their kids....wait..i said i was quitting this discussion...whether i'm caring er not is immaterial..its not wot i think, its wot i do and how i act...fraggle"Lesley Dove" <Lesley wrote:>>Next time I go on a demo I shall have to get a gas mask to wear then, if>they are allowed to smoke I am allowed to try to keep it from my lungs. It's>funny that they are allowed to take away the most basic right to breatheable>air, it is one of those things most necessary for life, so I feel justified>in saying how dare they. I always thought you cared about human rights,>Fraggle, do parents have the right to cause their kids to die of SIDS by>their smoking too?>>Lesley>> > EBbrewpunx [EBbrewpunx]> 20 August 2002 17:57> > RE: Re: Smoking?>>> questioning it is fine, discussing it is fine> its the "how dare they" attitude which worries me> yup, i don't think smoking is particularly good..but, railing against them>isn't going to change many minds imo>>> "B. B." <ibyza2001 wrote:>> >> >> >good then we aRE NOT ALONE IN THAT !!!!!!!> >> >> >> > gt;"Lesley Dove" gt;> gt; gt;RE: Re: Smoking?>gt;Tue, 20 Aug 2002 17:19:44 +0100 gt; gt; gt;I see quite a lot of>people here questioning the activists who smoke, gt;obviously I am far from>alone in seeing it as unreasonable on demos and gt;protests. gt; gt;Lesley>gt; gt; gt; cathyjupp>[cj] gt; 20 August 2002 17:08 gt; To:> gt; Re: Smoking? gt; gt;>gt; , "Lesley Dove" wrote: gt; gt; Yes many>of them do just that and they know they cannot justify it! gt; gt; gt; gt;>Lesley gt; gt; But then again, they don't *have* to justify it. gt; gt;>Cathy gt; gt; gt; Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2002 Report Share Posted August 20, 2002 , EBbrewpunx@c... wrote: > actually wearing a gas mask sounds great...it makes a point..and people will ask questions.... Then wish they hadn't ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 2002 Report Share Posted August 20, 2002 AT LAST! They've found the cause of SIDS. That's good news. Pergaps you should tell the people that are still researching into the caused cos they've obviously not heard the news... Lesley Dove [Lesley]Tuesday, August 20, 2002 6:10 PM Subject: RE: Re: Smoking? Next time I go on a demo I shall have to get a gas mask to wear then, if they are allowed to smoke I am allowed to try to keep it from my lungs. It's funny that they are allowed to take away the most basic right to breatheable air, it is one of those things most necessary for life, so I feel justified in saying how dare they. I always thought you cared about human rights, Fraggle, do parents have the right to cause their kids to die of SIDS by their smoking too? Lesley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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