Need supporting info

February 1, 2004

I am sorry to ask this here, I know I could do my own research but I’m

short on time at the moment and want a quick comeback to a question that

was posed to me:

“I wonder what God intended for us to wear if not

animal cloth. And isn't the pollution which is created

by the manufacture of synthetics also a great evil?”

I know I’ll get a lot of info here, and I will put it to memory so that

I have it for future reference! So much to learn – especially when

defending one’s own choices! Unfortunate that we even have to (

Thank you,

Lisa

Ever has it been that love knows not its own depth until the hour of

separation.

~Kahlil Gibran

www.pbase.com/aljuwaie

February 2, 2004

Assuming that God exists, and that is a BIG assumption seeing as how

Buddhists, Shintos, Pagans, Atheists, and lack of any scientific

evidence would all say otherwise... God probably intended for us to

be buck naked.

(1) Adam and Eve started out in some tropical paradise. In such a

warm place, who needs clothes?

(2) No other species wears clothes, let alone the flesh of another.

(3)Is it really any more difficult to weave cloth out of cotton or

hemp than to kill, skin, tan (leather) and design clothes out of

animal flesh?

(4) We come out of the womb naked; if god intended for us to wear

dead animals, shouldn't we be born in leather from head to toe?

Come to think of it, would God intend for us to do ANYTHING? I

thought we were supposed to have the gift of free will?

(5) The bible was written by several humans, who are fallible. It

was then translated from Hebrew. Even if you want to believe that

the bible is the " word of God " you can't possibly tell me that

something wasn't lost in translation. Sure it says in most versions

of the bible that god gave us dominion over all animals. It also

says thou shalt not kill. A passage in the old testament says that

the ideal diet for all animals is plants. Oh yes, and that women

should never speak.

Yes, pollution is an evil but it doesn't compare to the evil of

raising another species for slaughter. Besides, raising animals for

food / clothing causes so much more pollution than polyester and

pleather it's not even funny. Since we live in a climate that

demands we wear something and a society that says we have to, we have

to wear something. Ideally, we'd all be wearing hemp since it's the

best for the environment, but realistically most of us cannot afford

it.

, " l. a l j u w a i e "

<aljuwaie@c...> wrote:

> I am sorry to ask this here, I know I could do my own research but

I'm

> short on time at the moment and want a quick comeback to a question

that

> was posed to me:

>

> " I wonder what God intended for us to wear if not

> animal cloth. And isn't the pollution which is created

> by the manufacture of synthetics also a great evil? "

>

February 2, 2004

I do have a couple of thoughts on this as I, too, have been asked

about my choice of being a vegetarian in relation to their own belief

in the christian god.

First of all Adam and Eve didn't wear any clothes because they were

innocent and free of sin. When they did " eat the apple " , they then

hid themselves from god and, I believe, dressed themselves with fig

leaves. Nowhere does it say that they killed animals for their

clothing, provided to them by god. Also, you do not have to kill an

animal to wear it's fur, such as wool from a sheep.

It is true that manufacturers of synthetic textiles are polluters,

but so are the agribusinesses that raise animals in inhumane

conditions. Perhaps you could talk to them about all natural (cotton

and hemp) clothing that does not creat toxins and pollutions.

My personal experience with people who ask me god-based questions is

that they are very short sighted and hide behind their religion and

their god so as not to have to think for themselves or in alternative

ways.

Denise

, " l. a l j u w a i e "

<aljuwaie@c...> wrote:

> I am sorry to ask this here, I know I could do my own research but

I'm

> short on time at the moment and want a quick comeback to a question

that

> was posed to me:

>

> " I wonder what God intended for us to wear if not

> animal cloth. And isn't the pollution which is created

> by the manufacture of synthetics also a great evil? "

>

February 6, 2004

Ya know, I went on NoMail some time ago because I was weary of these

kinds of discussions (with all respect to those discussing the subject,

of course - I don't weary of my cyberfriends ;=)), and I come back on

and here it is again. Sorry guys, but I find the discussion of what a

fictional character would do or say or mean or want *if* s/he existed to

be rather foolish and inappropriate. Why not just tell the superstitious

fools who argue against vegetarianism on grounds of what someone in a

book might approve that they're being rude, illogical, and any other

adjectives that come to mind?

As for the discussion as it is here, tying religion to vegetarianism is

just an excuse to discuss the former in a forum otherwise dedicated to

the latter.

See ya later when all this settles down.

Grumpily yours,

Pat

>

> Assuming that God exists, and that is a BIG assumption seeing as how

> Buddhists, Shintos, Pagans, Atheists, and lack of any scientific

> evidence would all say otherwise... God probably intended for us to

> be buck naked.

>

> (1) Adam and Eve started out in some tropical paradise. In such a

> warm place, who needs clothes?

> (2) No other species wears clothes, let alone the flesh of another.

> (3)Is it really any more difficult to weave cloth out of cotton or

> hemp than to kill, skin, tan (leather) and design clothes out of

> animal flesh?

> (4) We come out of the womb naked; if god intended for us to wear

> dead animals, shouldn't we be born in leather from head to toe?

> Come to think of it, would God intend for us to do ANYTHING? I

> thought we were supposed to have the gift of free will?

>

> (5) The bible was written by several humans, who are fallible. It

> was then translated from Hebrew. Even if you want to believe that

> the bible is the " word of God " you can't possibly tell me that

> something wasn't lost in translation. Sure it says in most versions

> of the bible that god gave us dominion over all animals. It also

> says thou shalt not kill. A passage in the old testament says that

> the ideal diet for all animals is plants. Oh yes, and that women

> should never speak.

>

> Yes, pollution is an evil but it doesn't compare to the evil of

> raising another species for slaughter. Besides, raising animals for

> food / clothing causes so much more pollution than polyester and

> pleather it's not even funny. Since we live in a climate that

> demands we wear something and a society that says we have to, we have

> to wear something. Ideally, we'd all be wearing hemp since it's the

> best for the environment, but realistically most of us cannot afford

> it.

--

SANTBROWN

townhounds/

vegetarianslimming/

HOMEPAGE: http://www.angelfire.com/art/pendragon/

----------

* " There are too many idiots in this world. And having said it, I have

the burden of proving it. " (Franz Fanon)

* " Until he extends the circle of compassion to all living things, man

will not himself find peace. " (Albert Schweitzer)

February 6, 2004

Sorry Pat.

Being new here I didn't realize that the subject was taboo.

I feel compelled to defend myself as the original poster of this thread.

This is how the question was posed to me, and I was looking for

like-minded vegetarians to help me out in a sensible response.

Also, keeping my personal beliefs personal, perhaps one could have just

read the question as 'could man have survived thousands of years ago

without the use of animal products?' This is how I interpreted it. I

think this could be an interesting topic of discussion.

Again, sorry if I offended. Won't do it again.

Also very grumpy today,

Lisa

Ever has it been that love knows not its own depth until the hour of

separation.

~Kahlil Gibran

<http://www.pbase.com/aljuwaie> www.pbase.com/aljuwaie

Sant & Brown [santbrown]

Friday, February 06, 2004 8:49 AM

Re: Need supporting info