Guest guest Posted May 21, 2007 Report Share Posted May 21, 2007 So many of you have probably seen this already, but I thought I'd share for those of you who haven't. It's ugly; do not read if you want to remain in a good mood. Oh, and at the bottom, I included a letter-to-the-editor I'd written to the Chicago Tribune a couple of weeks ago in response to the " Vegan Couple Starves Newborn " story that was all over the news. The Tribune didn't print it yet, but I'm holding out hope. (Keep in mind that this was not in response to the ridiculous editorial below - I know that it's confusing!) Op-Ed Contributor Death by Veganism By NINA PLANCK Published: May 21, 2007 WHEN Crown Shakur died of starvation, he was 6 weeks old and weighed 3.5 pounds. His vegan parents, who fed him mainly soy milk and apple juice, were convicted in Atlanta recently of murder, involuntary manslaughter and cruelty. This particular calamity ‹ at least the third such conviction of vegan parents in four years ‹ may be largely due to ignorance. But it should prompt frank discussion about nutrition. I was once a vegan. But well before I became pregnant, I concluded that a vegan pregnancy was irresponsible. You cannot create and nourish a robust baby merely on foods from plants. Indigenous cuisines offer clues about what humans, naturally omnivorous, need to survive, reproduce and grow: traditional vegetarian diets, as in India, invariably include dairy and eggs for complete protein, essential fats and vitamins. There are no vegan societies for a simple reason: a vegan diet is not adequate in the long run. Protein deficiency is one danger of a vegan diet for babies. Nutritionists used to speak of proteins as ³first class² (from meat, fish, eggs and milk) and ³second class² (from plants), but today this is considered denigrating to vegetarians. The fact remains, though, that humans prefer animal proteins and fats to cereals and tubers, because they contain all the essential amino acids needed for life in the right ratio. This is not true of plant proteins, which are inferior in quantity and quality ‹ even soy. A vegan diet may lack vitamin B12, found only in animal foods; usable vitamins A and D, found in meat, fish, eggs and butter; and necessary minerals like calcium and zinc. When babies are deprived of all these nutrients, they will suffer from retarded growth, rickets and nerve damage. Responsible vegan parents know that breast milk is ideal. It contains many necessary components, including cholesterol (which babies use to make nerve cells) and countless immune and growth factors. When breastfeeding isn¹t possible, soy milk and fruit juice, even in seemingly sufficient quantities, are not safe substitutes for a quality infant formula. Yet even a breast-fed baby is at risk. Studies show that vegan breast milk lacks enough docosahexaenoic acid, or DHA, the omega-3 fat found in fatty fish. It is difficult to overstate the importance of DHA, vital as it is for eye and brain development. A vegan diet is equally dangerous for weaned babies and toddlers, who need plenty of protein and calcium. Too often, vegans turn to soy, which actually inhibits growth and reduces absorption of protein and minerals. That¹s why health officials in Britain, Canada and other countries express caution about soy for babies. (Not here, though ‹ perhaps because our farm policy is so soy-friendly.) Historically, diet honored tradition: we ate the foods that our mothers, and their mothers, ate. Now, your neighbor or sibling may be a meat-eater or vegetarian, may ferment his foods or eat them raw. This fragmentation of the American menu reflects admirable diversity and tolerance, but food is more important than fashion. Though it¹s not politically correct to say so, all diets are not created equal. An adult who was well-nourished in utero and in infancy may choose to get by on a vegan diet, but babies are built from protein, calcium, cholesterol and fish oil. Children fed only plants will not get the precious things they need to live and grow. Nina Planck is the author of ³Real Food: What to Eat and Why.² **************************************************************************** In the coverage of the tragic death by starvation of a Georgia newborn, the news media have been exceptionally cavalier with using the descriptor of 'vegan' to follow the boy's parents ( " Vegan Couple Get Life In Death of Six-Week-Old " , May 10). In fact, the word 'vegan' is in virtually every headline I've come across regarding the story. Jade Sanders and Lamont Thomas, the parents in question, fed their baby a diet of apple juice and soymilk, not breastmilk - the optimal food for a newborn - not infant formula. Their purported vegan status is incidental to what transpired: they starved their child, pure and simple, and starving a child with a nutritionally and developmentally inappropriate diet has nothing to do with veganism. Not only is a typical vegan diet diverse and abundant in nutrients, but the core tenet of it is to extend compassion to others. Allowing a baby to starve to death is the opposite of regarding others with compassion. My own vegan child was born full-term at nearly nine pounds and has grown into a healthy, intelligent, lively, inquisitive, caring, and compassionate four-year-old; he is much like any other well-adjusted child (except, of course, that he eats broccoli and Swiss chard). I am also fortunate to be able to spend time with many other vegan children, and I am happy to report that they are also well-fed, robust and thriving. I am quite certain that they eat more varied and nutritionally dense diets than the vast majority of their omnivorous peers. Regardless of what the headlines imply, what happened to this poor child had nothing to do with the professed diet of his parents. Mike Carlson, a prosecutor in the case, put it quite succinctly when he told the jury, " They're not vegans, they're baby killers. " My hope is that the news industry will start to show the same degree of responsibility in their reporting of this tragic story instead of resorting to simplistic and misleading shock tactics. Marla Rose, co-founder The Chicago Vegan Family Network Oak Park, IL 708-386-0116 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 22, 2007 Report Share Posted May 22, 2007 The only intelligent thing written in that entire article was that breastfeeding is ideal. Past that, the writer of the article is obviously an idiot. I'm not vegan (yet), but I do believe it's a great thing. Those parents in the article, the ones whose baby starved, are no more intelligent parents that my stupid cousin and his wife who gave their baby powdered milk instead of formula. Inadequate nutrition is inadequate nutrition. But if my cousin's baby had died, the title of the article wouldn't have been " Meat-Eating Parents Starve Baby. " Marla Rose <marla wrote: So many of you have probably seen this already, but I thought I'd share for those of you who haven't. It's ugly; do not read if you want to remain in a good mood. Oh, and at the bottom, I included a letter-to-the-editor I'd written to the Chicago Tribune a couple of weeks ago in response to the " Vegan Couple Starves Newborn " story that was all over the news. The Tribune didn't print it yet, but I'm holding out hope. (Keep in mind that this was not in response to the ridiculous editorial below - I know that it's confusing!) Op-Ed Contributor Death by Veganism By NINA PLANCK Published: May 21, 2007 WHEN Crown Shakur died of starvation, he was 6 weeks old and weighed 3.5 pounds. His vegan parents, who fed him mainly soy milk and apple juice, were convicted in Atlanta recently of murder, involuntary manslaughter and cruelty. This particular calamity ‹ at least the third such conviction of vegan parents in four years ‹ may be largely due to ignorance. But it should prompt frank discussion about nutrition. I was once a vegan. But well before I became pregnant, I concluded that a vegan pregnancy was irresponsible. You cannot create and nourish a robust baby merely on foods from plants. Indigenous cuisines offer clues about what humans, naturally omnivorous, need to survive, reproduce and grow: traditional vegetarian diets, as in India, invariably include dairy and eggs for complete protein, essential fats and vitamins. There are no vegan societies for a simple reason: a vegan diet is not adequate in the long run. Protein deficiency is one danger of a vegan diet for babies. Nutritionists used to speak of proteins as ³first class² (from meat, fish, eggs and milk) and ³second class² (from plants), but today this is considered denigrating to vegetarians. The fact remains, though, that humans prefer animal proteins and fats to cereals and tubers, because they contain all the essential amino acids needed for life in the right ratio. This is not true of plant proteins, which are inferior in quantity and quality ‹ even soy. A vegan diet may lack vitamin B12, found only in animal foods; usable vitamins A and D, found in meat, fish, eggs and butter; and necessary minerals like calcium and zinc. When babies are deprived of all these nutrients, they will suffer from retarded growth, rickets and nerve damage. Responsible vegan parents know that breast milk is ideal. It contains many necessary components, including cholesterol (which babies use to make nerve cells) and countless immune and growth factors. When breastfeeding isn¹t possible, soy milk and fruit juice, even in seemingly sufficient quantities, are not safe substitutes for a quality infant formula. Yet even a breast-fed baby is at risk. Studies show that vegan breast milk lacks enough docosahexaenoic acid, or DHA, the omega-3 fat found in fatty fish. It is difficult to overstate the importance of DHA, vital as it is for eye and brain development. A vegan diet is equally dangerous for weaned babies and toddlers, who need plenty of protein and calcium. Too often, vegans turn to soy, which actually inhibits growth and reduces absorption of protein and minerals. That¹s why health officials in Britain, Canada and other countries express caution about soy for babies. (Not here, though ‹ perhaps because our farm policy is so soy-friendly.) Historically, diet honored tradition: we ate the foods that our mothers, and their mothers, ate. Now, your neighbor or sibling may be a meat-eater or vegetarian, may ferment his foods or eat them raw. This fragmentation of the American menu reflects admirable diversity and tolerance, but food is more important than fashion. Though it¹s not politically correct to say so, all diets are not created equal. An adult who was well-nourished in utero and in infancy may choose to get by on a vegan diet, but babies are built from protein, calcium, cholesterol and fish oil. Children fed only plants will not get the precious things they need to live and grow. Nina Planck is the author of ³Real Food: What to Eat and Why.² **************************************************************************** In the coverage of the tragic death by starvation of a Georgia newborn, the news media have been exceptionally cavalier with using the descriptor of 'vegan' to follow the boy's parents ( " Vegan Couple Get Life In Death of Six-Week-Old " , May 10). In fact, the word 'vegan' is in virtually every headline I've come across regarding the story. Jade Sanders and Lamont Thomas, the parents in question, fed their baby a diet of apple juice and soymilk, not breastmilk - the optimal food for a newborn - not infant formula. Their purported vegan status is incidental to what transpired: they starved their child, pure and simple, and starving a child with a nutritionally and developmentally inappropriate diet has nothing to do with veganism. Not only is a typical vegan diet diverse and abundant in nutrients, but the core tenet of it is to extend compassion to others. Allowing a baby to starve to death is the opposite of regarding others with compassion. My own vegan child was born full-term at nearly nine pounds and has grown into a healthy, intelligent, lively, inquisitive, caring, and compassionate four-year-old; he is much like any other well-adjusted child (except, of course, that he eats broccoli and Swiss chard). I am also fortunate to be able to spend time with many other vegan children, and I am happy to report that they are also well-fed, robust and thriving. I am quite certain that they eat more varied and nutritionally dense diets than the vast majority of their omnivorous peers. Regardless of what the headlines imply, what happened to this poor child had nothing to do with the professed diet of his parents. Mike Carlson, a prosecutor in the case, put it quite succinctly when he told the jury, " They're not vegans, they're baby killers. " My hope is that the news industry will start to show the same degree of responsibility in their reporting of this tragic story instead of resorting to simplistic and misleading shock tactics. Marla Rose, co-founder The Chicago Vegan Family Network Oak Park, IL 708-386-0116 Kadee Sedtal Brain: " Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering? " Pinky: " I think so, Brain, but three men in a tub? That's unsanitary! " If you can't afford the vet, you can't afford the pet!! Ready for the edge of your seat? Check out tonight's top picks on TV. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 22, 2007 Report Share Posted May 22, 2007 that makes me SO ANGRY. she got so many of her facts wrong. i looked her book up on amazon. obviously, she's spreading her own agenda as a WAPFer. since liver is a " health food. " On 5/21/07, Marla Rose <marla wrote: > > So many of you have probably seen this already, but I thought I'd share > for > those of you who haven't. It's ugly; do not read if you want to remain in > a > good mood. Oh, and at the bottom, I included a letter-to-the-editor I'd > written to the Chicago Tribune a couple of weeks ago in response to the > " Vegan Couple Starves Newborn " story that was all over the news. The > Tribune > didn't print it yet, but I'm holding out hope. (Keep in mind that this was > not in response to the ridiculous editorial below - I know that it's > confusing!) > > Op-Ed Contributor > Death by Veganism > > > By NINA PLANCK > Published: May 21, 2007 > > WHEN Crown Shakur died of starvation, he was 6 weeks old and weighed 3.5 > pounds. His vegan parents, who fed him mainly soy milk and apple juice, > were > convicted in Atlanta recently of murder, involuntary manslaughter and > cruelty. > > This particular calamity ‹ at least the third such conviction of vegan > parents in four years ‹ may be largely due to ignorance. But it should > prompt frank discussion about nutrition. > > I was once a vegan. But well before I became pregnant, I concluded that a > vegan pregnancy was irresponsible. You cannot create and nourish a robust > baby merely on foods from plants. > > Indigenous cuisines offer clues about what humans, naturally omnivorous, > need to survive, reproduce and grow: traditional vegetarian diets, as in > India, invariably include dairy and eggs for complete protein, essential > fats and vitamins. There are no vegan societies for a simple reason: a > vegan > diet is not adequate in the long run. > > Protein deficiency is one danger of a vegan diet for babies. Nutritionists > used to speak of proteins as ³first class² (from meat, fish, eggs and > milk) > and ³second class² (from plants), but today this is considered denigrating > to vegetarians. > > The fact remains, though, that humans prefer animal proteins and fats to > cereals and tubers, because they contain all the essential amino acids > needed for life in the right ratio. This is not true of plant proteins, > which are inferior in quantity and quality ‹ even soy. > > A vegan diet may lack vitamin B12, found only in animal foods; usable > vitamins A and D, found in meat, fish, eggs and butter; and necessary > minerals like calcium and zinc. When babies are deprived of all these > nutrients, they will suffer from retarded growth, rickets and nerve > damage. > > Responsible vegan parents know that breast milk is ideal. It contains many > necessary components, including cholesterol (which babies use to make > nerve > cells) and countless immune and growth factors. When breastfeeding isn¹t > possible, soy milk and fruit juice, even in seemingly sufficient > quantities, > are not safe substitutes for a quality infant formula. > > Yet even a breast-fed baby is at risk. Studies show that vegan breast milk > lacks enough docosahexaenoic acid, or DHA, the omega-3 fat found in fatty > fish. It is difficult to overstate the importance of DHA, vital as it is > for > eye and brain development. > > A vegan diet is equally dangerous for weaned babies and toddlers, who need > plenty of protein and calcium. Too often, vegans turn to soy, which > actually > inhibits growth and reduces absorption of protein and minerals. That¹s why > health officials in Britain, Canada and other countries express caution > about soy for babies. (Not here, though ‹ perhaps because our farm policy > is > so soy-friendly.) > > Historically, diet honored tradition: we ate the foods that our mothers, > and > their mothers, ate. Now, your neighbor or sibling may be a meat-eater or > vegetarian, may ferment his foods or eat them raw. This fragmentation of > the > American menu reflects admirable diversity and tolerance, but food is more > important than fashion. Though it¹s not politically correct to say so, all > diets are not created equal. > > An adult who was well-nourished in utero and in infancy may choose to get > by > on a vegan diet, but babies are built from protein, calcium, cholesterol > and > fish oil. Children fed only plants will not get the precious things they > need to live and grow. > > Nina Planck is the author of ³Real Food: What to Eat and Why.² > > > **************************************************************************** > > In the coverage of the tragic death by starvation of a Georgia newborn, > the > news media have been exceptionally cavalier with using the descriptor of > 'vegan' to follow the boy's parents ( " Vegan Couple Get Life In Death of > Six-Week-Old " , May 10). In fact, the word 'vegan' is in virtually every > headline I've come across regarding the story. > > Jade Sanders and Lamont Thomas, the parents in question, fed their baby a > diet of apple juice and soymilk, not breastmilk - the optimal food for a > newborn - not infant formula. Their purported vegan status is incidental > to > what transpired: they starved their child, pure and simple, and starving a > child with a nutritionally and developmentally inappropriate diet has > nothing to do with veganism. Not only is a typical vegan diet diverse and > abundant in nutrients, but the core tenet of it is to extend compassion to > others. Allowing a baby to starve to death is the opposite of regarding > others with compassion. > > My own vegan child was born full-term at nearly nine pounds and has grown > into a healthy, intelligent, lively, inquisitive, caring, and > compassionate > four-year-old; he is much like any other well-adjusted child (except, of > course, that he eats broccoli and Swiss chard). I am also fortunate to be > able to spend time with many other vegan children, and I am happy to > report > that they are also well-fed, robust and thriving. I am quite certain that > they eat more varied and nutritionally dense diets than the vast majority > of > their omnivorous peers. > > Regardless of what the headlines imply, what happened to this poor child > had nothing to do with the professed diet of his parents. Mike Carlson, a > prosecutor in the case, put it quite succinctly when he told the jury, > " They're not vegans, they're baby killers. " My hope is that the news > industry will start to show the same degree of responsibility in their > reporting of this tragic story instead of resorting to simplistic and > misleading shock tactics. > > Marla Rose, co-founder > The Chicago Vegan Family Network > Oak Park, IL > > 708-386-0116 > > > > > For more information about vegetarianism, please visit the VRG website at > http://www.vrg.org and for materials especially useful for families go to > http://www.vrg.org/family.This is a discussion list and is not intended to > provide personal medical advice. Medical advice should be obtained from a > qualified health professional. > > edical advice. Medical advice should be obtained from a qualified health > professional. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 22, 2007 Report Share Posted May 22, 2007 Here's the letter that I just sent to the NY Times: To the Editor: As a registered dietitian and the parent of two healthy vegan children, I join thousands of other vegan parents in taking issue with recent comments on vegan diets (NYTimes, 5-20-07). I'd like to share some up-to-date information on sources of key nutrients for vegan babies and children. In early infancy, babies, whether vegan or not, thrive on breast milk, with infant formula an option when breastfeeding is impossible. Vegan toddlers get adequate protein from a variety of foods including dried beans, whole grains, nut butters, and soy products. Vitamin B12 sources include fortified foods and supplements. Calcium comes from greens and from fortified foods like orange juice and soymilk. Interested readers can learn more about vegan diets from reputable organizations like The Vegetarian Resource Group. Yes, it's important to be aware of what you're feeding your vegan child; but this awareness is not limited to vegan parents. In view of the epidemic of childhood obesity, perhaps more parents should be focusing on the quality of their children's diets. Reed Mangels, PhD, RD Nutrition Advisor, The Vegetarian Resource Group If other parents are interested in writing to the NY Times, letters can be sent to: letters. Here are the requirements: " Letters should be no longer than 150 words and may be shortened to fit allotted space. They must be exclusive to The Times (no prior submission to, or publication in, any other medium, including the Web). They should generally refer to an article that has appeared within the last seven days. " To be considered for publication, letters must include the writer's name, address, current location (where you are writing from) and daytime and evening phone numbers at your current location (for verification, not for publication). " We generally do not publish more than one letter from the same writer within any 60-day period. " Reed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 22, 2007 Report Share Posted May 22, 2007 At 3.5 pounds he should've been in the hospital!! Why weren't they taking him to the doctor either. My daughter weighed less than 6 pounds and I had to take her to the doctor's office every day until she weighed 6 pounds and then every other day until she weighed 7 pounds. When I was born (I was a 4 pounder -my mom couldn't even take me home from the hospital until I weighed 6 pounds). I am pretty sure that when my daughter was born the rule was 5 pounds thus I was able to take her home from the hospital on the grounds that I would bring her back regularly until her weight was adequate. Giving a newborn soymilk in place of breastmilk or formula is equally as irresponsible as giving the baby cow's milk. That's just negligence. There are lots of negligent parents in the world but only the vegetarian/vegan ones seem to get press. Renee Kadee M <abbey_road3012 wrote: The only intelligent thing written in that entire article was that breastfeeding is ideal. Past that, the writer of the article is obviously an idiot. I'm not vegan (yet), but I do believe it's a great thing. Those parents in the article, the ones whose baby starved, are no more intelligent parents that my stupid cousin and his wife who gave their baby powdered milk instead of formula. Inadequate nutrition is inadequate nutrition. But if my cousin's baby had died, the title of the article wouldn't have been " Meat-Eating Parents Starve Baby. " Marla Rose <marla wrote: So many of you have probably seen this already, but I thought I'd share for those of you who haven't. It's ugly; do not read if you want to remain in a good mood. Oh, and at the bottom, I included a letter-to-the-editor I'd written to the Chicago Tribune a couple of weeks ago in response to the " Vegan Couple Starves Newborn " story that was all over the news. The Tribune didn't print it yet, but I'm holding out hope. (Keep in mind that this was not in response to the ridiculous editorial below - I know that it's confusing!) Op-Ed Contributor Death by Veganism By NINA PLANCK Published: May 21, 2007 WHEN Crown Shakur died of starvation, he was 6 weeks old and weighed 3.5 pounds. His vegan parents, who fed him mainly soy milk and apple juice, were convicted in Atlanta recently of murder, involuntary manslaughter and cruelty. This particular calamity ‹ at least the third such conviction of vegan parents in four years ‹ may be largely due to ignorance. But it should prompt frank discussion about nutrition. I was once a vegan. But well before I became pregnant, I concluded that a vegan pregnancy was irresponsible. You cannot create and nourish a robust baby merely on foods from plants. Indigenous cuisines offer clues about what humans, naturally omnivorous, need to survive, reproduce and grow: traditional vegetarian diets, as in India, invariably include dairy and eggs for complete protein, essential fats and vitamins. There are no vegan societies for a simple reason: a vegan diet is not adequate in the long run. Protein deficiency is one danger of a vegan diet for babies. Nutritionists used to speak of proteins as ³first class² (from meat, fish, eggs and milk) and ³second class² (from plants), but today this is considered denigrating to vegetarians. The fact remains, though, that humans prefer animal proteins and fats to cereals and tubers, because they contain all the essential amino acids needed for life in the right ratio. This is not true of plant proteins, which are inferior in quantity and quality ‹ even soy. A vegan diet may lack vitamin B12, found only in animal foods; usable vitamins A and D, found in meat, fish, eggs and butter; and necessary minerals like calcium and zinc. When babies are deprived of all these nutrients, they will suffer from retarded growth, rickets and nerve damage. Responsible vegan parents know that breast milk is ideal. It contains many necessary components, including cholesterol (which babies use to make nerve cells) and countless immune and growth factors. When breastfeeding isn¹t possible, soy milk and fruit juice, even in seemingly sufficient quantities, are not safe substitutes for a quality infant formula. Yet even a breast-fed baby is at risk. Studies show that vegan breast milk lacks enough docosahexaenoic acid, or DHA, the omega-3 fat found in fatty fish. It is difficult to overstate the importance of DHA, vital as it is for eye and brain development. A vegan diet is equally dangerous for weaned babies and toddlers, who need plenty of protein and calcium. Too often, vegans turn to soy, which actually inhibits growth and reduces absorption of protein and minerals. That¹s why health officials in Britain, Canada and other countries express caution about soy for babies. (Not here, though ‹ perhaps because our farm policy is so soy-friendly.) Historically, diet honored tradition: we ate the foods that our mothers, and their mothers, ate. Now, your neighbor or sibling may be a meat-eater or vegetarian, may ferment his foods or eat them raw. This fragmentation of the American menu reflects admirable diversity and tolerance, but food is more important than fashion. Though it¹s not politically correct to say so, all diets are not created equal. An adult who was well-nourished in utero and in infancy may choose to get by on a vegan diet, but babies are built from protein, calcium, cholesterol and fish oil. Children fed only plants will not get the precious things they need to live and grow. Nina Planck is the author of ³Real Food: What to Eat and Why.² **************************************************************************** In the coverage of the tragic death by starvation of a Georgia newborn, the news media have been exceptionally cavalier with using the descriptor of 'vegan' to follow the boy's parents ( " Vegan Couple Get Life In Death of Six-Week-Old " , May 10). In fact, the word 'vegan' is in virtually every headline I've come across regarding the story. Jade Sanders and Lamont Thomas, the parents in question, fed their baby a diet of apple juice and soymilk, not breastmilk - the optimal food for a newborn - not infant formula. Their purported vegan status is incidental to what transpired: they starved their child, pure and simple, and starving a child with a nutritionally and developmentally inappropriate diet has nothing to do with veganism. Not only is a typical vegan diet diverse and abundant in nutrients, but the core tenet of it is to extend compassion to others. Allowing a baby to starve to death is the opposite of regarding others with compassion. My own vegan child was born full-term at nearly nine pounds and has grown into a healthy, intelligent, lively, inquisitive, caring, and compassionate four-year-old; he is much like any other well-adjusted child (except, of course, that he eats broccoli and Swiss chard). I am also fortunate to be able to spend time with many other vegan children, and I am happy to report that they are also well-fed, robust and thriving. I am quite certain that they eat more varied and nutritionally dense diets than the vast majority of their omnivorous peers. Regardless of what the headlines imply, what happened to this poor child had nothing to do with the professed diet of his parents. Mike Carlson, a prosecutor in the case, put it quite succinctly when he told the jury, " They're not vegans, they're baby killers. " My hope is that the news industry will start to show the same degree of responsibility in their reporting of this tragic story instead of resorting to simplistic and misleading shock tactics. Marla Rose, co-founder The Chicago Vegan Family Network Oak Park, IL 708-386-0116 Kadee Sedtal Brain: " Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering? " Pinky: " I think so, Brain, but three men in a tub? That's unsanitary! " If you can't afford the vet, you can't afford the pet!! Ready for the edge of your seat? Check out tonight's top picks on TV. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 22, 2007 Report Share Posted May 22, 2007 I've been writing multiple LTEs about this, as well as discussing it ad nauseum on multiple forums. It's the usual problem: the only people who " get it " are the people who already get it. This is just more fuel on the fire for the people who are already convinced that not eating dead animals is akin to child abuse. Which reminds me....I've discovered that I might have to do a lot more legwork, including legal documentation, because it turns out naming someone as guardian in my will might not be enough if family members were to step forward and claim that it wouldn't be in the best interests of my children (which is highly likely to happen, sad to say). The vegetarian diet would be number one on the list of reasons why they would do this. They really do think that I'm stubbornly harming my children with my " lifestyle choice " . Liz Marla Rose <marla Monday, May 21, 2007 12:56:26 PM NY Times OP-ED Slams Vegan Diet... So many of you have probably seen this already, but I thought I'd share for those of you who haven't. It's ugly; do not read if you want to remain in a good mood. Oh, and at the bottom, I included a letter-to-the- editor I'd written to the Chicago Tribune a couple of weeks ago in response to the " Vegan Couple Starves Newborn " story that was all over the news. The Tribune didn't print it yet, but I'm holding out hope. (Keep in mind that this was not in response to the ridiculous editorial below - I know that it's confusing!) Op-Ed Contributor Death by Veganism By NINA PLANCK Published: May 21, 2007 WHEN Crown Shakur died of starvation, he was 6 weeks old and weighed 3.5 pounds. His vegan parents, who fed him mainly soy milk and apple juice, were convicted in Atlanta recently of murder, involuntary manslaughter and cruelty. This particular calamity ‹ at least the third such conviction of vegan parents in four years ‹ may be largely due to ignorance. But it should prompt frank discussion about nutrition. I was once a vegan. But well before I became pregnant, I concluded that a vegan pregnancy was irresponsible. You cannot create and nourish a robust baby merely on foods from plants. Indigenous cuisines offer clues about what humans, naturally omnivorous, need to survive, reproduce and grow: traditional vegetarian diets, as in India, invariably include dairy and eggs for complete protein, essential fats and vitamins. There are no vegan societies for a simple reason: a vegan diet is not adequate in the long run. Protein deficiency is one danger of a vegan diet for babies. Nutritionists used to speak of proteins as ³first class² (from meat, fish, eggs and milk) and ³second class² (from plants), but today this is considered denigrating to vegetarians. The fact remains, though, that humans prefer animal proteins and fats to cereals and tubers, because they contain all the essential amino acids needed for life in the right ratio. This is not true of plant proteins, which are inferior in quantity and quality ‹ even soy. A vegan diet may lack vitamin B12, found only in animal foods; usable vitamins A and D, found in meat, fish, eggs and butter; and necessary minerals like calcium and zinc. When babies are deprived of all these nutrients, they will suffer from retarded growth, rickets and nerve damage. Responsible vegan parents know that breast milk is ideal. It contains many necessary components, including cholesterol (which babies use to make nerve cells) and countless immune and growth factors. When breastfeeding isn¹t possible, soy milk and fruit juice, even in seemingly sufficient quantities, are not safe substitutes for a quality infant formula. Yet even a breast-fed baby is at risk. Studies show that vegan breast milk lacks enough docosahexaenoic acid, or DHA, the omega-3 fat found in fatty fish. It is difficult to overstate the importance of DHA, vital as it is for eye and brain development. A vegan diet is equally dangerous for weaned babies and toddlers, who need plenty of protein and calcium. Too often, vegans turn to soy, which actually inhibits growth and reduces absorption of protein and minerals. That¹s why health officials in Britain, Canada and other countries express caution about soy for babies. (Not here, though ‹ perhaps because our farm policy is so soy-friendly. ) Historically, diet honored tradition: we ate the foods that our mothers, and their mothers, ate. Now, your neighbor or sibling may be a meat-eater or vegetarian, may ferment his foods or eat them raw. This fragmentation of the American menu reflects admirable diversity and tolerance, but food is more important than fashion. Though it¹s not politically correct to say so, all diets are not created equal. An adult who was well-nourished in utero and in infancy may choose to get by on a vegan diet, but babies are built from protein, calcium, cholesterol and fish oil. Children fed only plants will not get the precious things they need to live and grow. Nina Planck is the author of ³Real Food: What to Eat and Why.² ************ ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* * In the coverage of the tragic death by starvation of a Georgia newborn, the news media have been exceptionally cavalier with using the descriptor of 'vegan' to follow the boy's parents ( " Vegan Couple Get Life In Death of Six-Week-Old " , May 10). In fact, the word 'vegan' is in virtually every headline I've come across regarding the story. Jade Sanders and Lamont Thomas, the parents in question, fed their baby a diet of apple juice and soymilk, not breastmilk - the optimal food for a newborn - not infant formula. Their purported vegan status is incidental to what transpired: they starved their child, pure and simple, and starving a child with a nutritionally and developmentally inappropriate diet has nothing to do with veganism. Not only is a typical vegan diet diverse and abundant in nutrients, but the core tenet of it is to extend compassion to others. Allowing a baby to starve to death is the opposite of regarding others with compassion. My own vegan child was born full-term at nearly nine pounds and has grown into a healthy, intelligent, lively, inquisitive, caring, and compassionate four-year-old; he is much like any other well-adjusted child (except, of course, that he eats broccoli and Swiss chard). I am also fortunate to be able to spend time with many other vegan children, and I am happy to report that they are also well-fed, robust and thriving. I am quite certain that they eat more varied and nutritionally dense diets than the vast majority of their omnivorous peers. Regardless of what the headlines imply, what happened to this poor child had nothing to do with the professed diet of his parents. Mike Carlson, a prosecutor in the case, put it quite succinctly when he told the jury, " They're not vegans, they're baby killers. " My hope is that the news industry will start to show the same degree of responsibility in their reporting of this tragic story instead of resorting to simplistic and misleading shock tactics. Marla Rose, co-founder The Chicago Vegan Family Network Oak Park, IL 708-386-0116 <!-- #ygrp-mlmsg {font-size:13px;font-family:arial, helvetica, clean, sans-serif;} #ygrp-mlmsg table {font-size:inherit;font:100%;} #ygrp-mlmsg select, input, textarea {font:99% arial, helvetica, clean, sans-serif;} #ygrp-mlmsg pre, code {font:115% monospace;} #ygrp-mlmsg * {line-height:1.22em;} #ygrp-text{ font-family:Georgia; } #ygrp-text p{ margin:0 0 1em 0;} #ygrp-tpmsgs{ font-family:Arial; clear:both;} #ygrp-vitnav{ padding-top:10px;font-family:Verdana;font-size:77%;margin:0;} #ygrp-vitnav a{ padding:0 1px;} #ygrp-actbar{ clear:both;margin:25px 0;white-space:nowrap;color:#666;text-align:right;} #ygrp-actbar .left{ float:left;white-space:nowrap;} ..bld{font-weight:bold;} #ygrp-grft{ font-family:Verdana;font-size:77%;padding:15px 0;} #ygrp-ft{ font-family:verdana;font-size:77%;border-top:1px solid #666; padding:5px 0; } #ygrp-mlmsg #logo{ padding-bottom:10px;} #ygrp-vital{ background-color:#e0ecee;margin-bottom:20px;padding:2px 0 8px 8px;} #ygrp-vital #vithd{ font-size:77%;font-family:Verdana;font-weight:bold;color:#333;text-transform:upp\ ercase;} #ygrp-vital ul{ padding:0;margin:2px 0;} #ygrp-vital ul li{ list-style-type:none;clear:both;border:1px solid #e0ecee; } #ygrp-vital ul li .ct{ font-weight:bold;color:#ff7900;float:right;width:2em;text-align:right;padding-ri\ ght:.5em;} #ygrp-vital ul li .cat{ font-weight:bold;} #ygrp-vital a { text-decoration:none;} #ygrp-vital a:hover{ text-decoration:underline;} #ygrp-sponsor #hd{ color:#999;font-size:77%;} #ygrp-sponsor #ov{ padding:6px 13px;background-color:#e0ecee;margin-bottom:20px;} #ygrp-sponsor #ov ul{ padding:0 0 0 8px;margin:0;} #ygrp-sponsor #ov li{ list-style-type:square;padding:6px 0;font-size:77%;} #ygrp-sponsor #ov li a{ text-decoration:none;font-size:130%;} #ygrp-sponsor #nc { background-color:#eee;margin-bottom:20px;padding:0 8px;} #ygrp-sponsor .ad{ padding:8px 0;} #ygrp-sponsor .ad #hd1{ font-family:Arial;font-weight:bold;color:#628c2a;font-size:100%;line-height:122%\ ;} #ygrp-sponsor .ad a{ text-decoration:none;} #ygrp-sponsor .ad a:hover{ text-decoration:underline;} #ygrp-sponsor .ad p{ margin:0;} o {font-size:0;} ..MsoNormal { margin:0 0 0 0;} #ygrp-text tt{ font-size:120%;} blockquote{margin:0 0 0 4px;} ..replbq {margin:4;} --> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 22, 2007 Report Share Posted May 22, 2007 Reed, Very well said. I like that you didn't get defensive, you offered info and resources and pointed out that other people's food choices (vegan, non-vegetarian alike) are questionable at times as well. Nice job! Laura Mount I am training for my first TRIATHLON with Team In Training! Please take a look at my fundraising page and help the cause!! http://www.active.com/donate/tntwi/tntwiLMount Thank you in advance for your support! Green Girl's Guide Family Blog Our photos reed mangels <reedmangels Tuesday, May 22, 2007 8:05:03 AM Re:NY Times OP-ED Slams Vegan Diet... Here's the letter that I just sent to the NY Times: To the Editor: As a registered dietitian and the parent of two healthy vegan children, I join thousands of other vegan parents in taking issue with recent comments on vegan diets (NYTimes, 5-20-07). I'd like to share some up-to-date information on sources of key nutrients for vegan babies and children. In early infancy, babies, whether vegan or not, thrive on breast milk, with infant formula an option when breastfeeding is impossible. Vegan toddlers get adequate protein from a variety of foods including dried beans, whole grains, nut butters, and soy products. Vitamin B12 sources include fortified foods and supplements. Calcium comes from greens and from fortified foods like orange juice and soymilk. Interested readers can learn more about vegan diets from reputable organizations like The Vegetarian Resource Group. Yes, it's important to be aware of what you're feeding your vegan child; but this awareness is not limited to vegan parents. In view of the epidemic of childhood obesity, perhaps more parents should be focusing on the quality of their children's diets. Reed Mangels, PhD, RD Nutrition Advisor, The Vegetarian Resource Group If other parents are interested in writing to the NY Times, letters can be sent to: letters (AT) nytimes (DOT) com. Here are the requirements: " Letters should be no longer than 150 words and may be shortened to fit allotted space. They must be exclusive to The Times (no prior submission to, or publication in, any other medium, including the Web). They should generally refer to an article that has appeared within the last seven days. " To be considered for publication, letters must include the writer's name, address, current location (where you are writing from) and daytime and evening phone numbers at your current location (for verification, not for publication) . " We generally do not publish more than one letter from the same writer within any 60-day period. " Reed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 22, 2007 Report Share Posted May 22, 2007 i've had several questions about this article since i tend to be the only vegan -slash- nutrition student in my groups. this was the reply i posted to my unschooling group today (contains harsh language): this article made me so angry, i was shaking when i finished it. i really hesitate to comment on it because i don't want to sound zealous or defensive. but i checked out her book and the lady is clearly advancing her own agenda. but what else would you expect from something so inflammatory and hateful. i like what the prosecutor said - that child did not die from a vegan diet. he died of starvation, pure and simple. they were only feeding the kid every six hours or so. regardless of WHAT they were feeding him, they weren't feeding him enough. most vegans are very responsible and up to date about health information...it's often because of health that vegans became vegan. no vegan, or anyone else, in his or her right mind would think that a baby could survive on that kind of diet. many other children have died from such starvation diets, only instead of soymilk and apple juice it was things like skim milk and bananas, but you don't see headlines like, " meat-eating parents starve child, " do you? this article gets many things wrong. for one thing, many plant foods do indeed provide complete proteins and all of the essential amino acids and non-essential ones, too. sea greens, for example, have a complete protein comparable to that of animals. quinoa and hempseeds are complete proteins. this: Too often, vegans turn to soy, which actually inhibits growth and reduces absorption of protein and minerals. is true in part. way too many vegans replace animal products with soy and grains. both can indeed cause health problems when not used in moderation, when modified, and when used inappropriately. what she is referring to re: absorption is a handful of studies done in 2005 that indicated that soy was a major issue. i've looked at those studies first-hand. almost all of them were conducted on women taking supplements of isolated soy protein. ISP is nothing like a whole soy product, and most people taking a supplement are receiving way higher doses of soy isoflavones than a normal person would who was eating normal, whole, complete soy. such results should be expected of anyone who is overzealous or obsessed with a particular food or food product. negative effects should be expected to arise from any food taken in such high doses, even fruits and vegetables. such results have neverbeen duplicated in studies conducted on moderate intake of whole soy products such as edamame, tempeh, etc. but sally fallon and the WAPF have just run with that, since it seemed to prove their original agenda, and many, many people have come along for the ride, based mainly on internet scare tactics such as the article " the whole soy story " (for the other side of that, here's an article by john robbins, the vegan equivalent of sally fallon, but a lot nicer: http://www.healthyat100.com/display.asp?catid=3 & pageid=12 ). as far as i can tell, this woman is no different. i would like to see her references on lower levels of DHA in breastmilk, since i've seen dozens of studies saying just the opposite. my bet is that, again, she's spreading her own agenda. the WAPF is notorious for spreading the message that a woman should only breastfeed if she has a *perfect* diet, by their standards (and frankly, i have no idea how someone could even afford to eat like that, much less choke down all that food, to have *ideal* breastmilk according to the WAPF). the WAPF's message is that, while they pay lip-service to breastmilk being ideal, " many " women cannot do it, or should not because of a lacking diet, and should instead make their own raw-liver-based formula, based on their recipe. this is a direct contradiction of every health organization in existence, all of which state that pretty much the only circumstances under which a mother who can breastfeed should consider not doing so is HIV/AIDS infection. even smoking mothers are encouraged to breastfeed (although they should of course stop smoking!). You cannot create and nourish a robust baby merely on foods from plants. bullshit. you guys have seen pictures of my kids. my son has never had an animal food in his life. he's always been at a perfect weight and height and development. nobody in their right mind could look at either of my kids and describe them as anything but robust and thriving. when we had our blood levels tested in february, he had higher-than-necessary levels in EVERYTHING. sure, you can screw up on a veg diet. you can screw up by giving your kids nothing but hot dogs, cola and cheetos too, as i saw way too often as a lactation educator for WIC. the point is that the diet has to be *well-planned* - whether it includes meat and dairy or not. babies are built from protein, calcium, cholesterol and fish oil. Children fed only plants will not get the precious things they need to live and grow. my son gets more than enough protein, high-quality protein. calcium, too - we don't struggle one whit to get calcium, and plant calcium is actually more easily absorbed and utilized by the body, whereas animal protein tends to leach calcium from the body. and fish oil - i'm assuming she's referring to DHA requirements. here's a little secret. you know how fish get to be so high in DHA? they eat ALGAE. and so do we. we just cut out the middleman. it's just as high-quality as that from fish, but without the concern of heavy metals, overfishing, global warming, and other nastiness. running nutrients through an animal first rather than eating them firsthand is like drinking water from a sewage treatment plant (paraphrased). yes, veronika, they do need a whole crap-load of healthy fats and proteins. protein is not an issue. on fat, you do have to work a little harder to get it into them, since they aren't eating junk. but it's not that hard; you just have to be a bit more conscientious, something no conscious parent should object to. i actually agree that soy formula is not that great. it *is* the equivalent of giving your child 3-4 borth control pill a day. it's ISP, which i mentioned before. it's gross. but dairy has issues too - the same high levels of cancer-causing hormones, even in " organic " cows, plus pesticides, genetic engineering, etc. there are drawbacks to both, and the only positive is that your kid will survive if you choose to not breastfeed or cannot. commercially-prepared formula is the *only* viable, tested option to breastmilk that contains all the necessary nutrients, including DHA now. of course, there's a whole lot of stuff in breastmilk that cannot be duplicated. i am a mama who cannot breastfeed. choosing a formula was tremendously difficult. my daughter gets a lot of donated breastmilk, but she still needs formula, especially when we don't have a running car to go pick up the breastmilk, like now. she is on an organic non-GMO soy-based formula. i thought long and hard about this and ultimately how i made this decision was not based on animal issues, but based on the simple fact that i am lactose-intolerant, and so is my son. when my son was born, and it became painfully obvious that we could not breastfeed, we used the basic enfamil dairy formula. it was a disaster. he could have died. so we switched to soy and all of his problems disappeared. i know within hours if someone gives him something with dairy. my daughter was so sick after our failed breastfeeding attempt, i didn't even want to risk trying a dairy formula, remembering what happened with my son. so we just went right to soy. i know it's what no lactivist wants to hear (i'm a lactivist, despite my troubles, and i hate saying it), but both have my children have survived and thrived on soy formula. breast is best and unless i was absolutely forced to, i would not even consider a formula. unfortunately, i was forced to. so, i hope that answers your questions. [later, i said this:] ok, looking back over that, i'm sorry if it sounded angry. this is the seventh time in two days that i've been asked about this article. most queries were not respectful, like yours, veronika, but were posed more as challenges, as " see, here's the evidence! you ARE f*ing up! " it's quite difficult to take, even more so because i *do* feel compelled to make some attempt to carefully straighten out people's incorrect assumptions and the inflammatory inaccuracies perpetuated in articles like this. if not me, then who? not that anyone cares anyway. so, my apologies for the long-winded answer, and for not being more peaceful and forgiving. [thankfully, everyone in the group said that they thought my response was not angry, but passionate. there are several people influced by WAP in this group and even they said that they appreciated my response and thought that i made good points, and that they didn't know that some plant foods contain whole proteins, and that one can take algae for a healthy fish oil alternative, etc. EVERYONE said that when they read this article they thought of MY kids because they could not believe that what she was saying was true based on how healthy and strong my kids are. one woman said that she wants to see my meal plans because she used to be vegan and just found it too difficult to come up with meals. she wants to be vegan again someday. so we're all making advances, people!!!] chandelle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2007 Report Share Posted May 23, 2007 " ...she's spreading her own agenda as a WAPFer. " Ahhhhh. It all makes sense now. Kadee Sedtal Brain: " Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering? " Pinky: " I think so, Brain, but three men in a tub? That's unsanitary! " If you can't afford the vet, you can't afford the pet!! Sucker-punch spam with award-winning protection. Try the free Mail Beta. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2007 Report Share Posted May 23, 2007 I don't think you sounded angry at all. A bit annoyed by the ignorance of the person who wrote the article, which is justifiable. I'm not vegan and that article pissed me off!! chandelle' <earthmother213 wrote: i've had several questions about this article since i tend to be the only vegan -slash- nutrition student in my groups. this was the reply i posted to my unschooling group today (contains harsh language): this article made me so angry, i was shaking when i finished it. i really hesitate to comment on it because i don't want to sound zealous or defensive. but i checked out her book and the lady is clearly advancing her own agenda. but what else would you expect from something so inflammatory and hateful. i like what the prosecutor said - that child did not die from a vegan diet. he died of starvation, pure and simple. they were only feeding the kid every six hours or so. regardless of WHAT they were feeding him, they weren't feeding him enough. most vegans are very responsible and up to date about health information...it's often because of health that vegans became vegan. no vegan, or anyone else, in his or her right mind would think that a baby could survive on that kind of diet. many other children have died from such starvation diets, only instead of soymilk and apple juice it was things like skim milk and bananas, but you don't see headlines like, " meat-eating parents starve child, " do you? this article gets many things wrong. for one thing, many plant foods do indeed provide complete proteins and all of the essential amino acids and non-essential ones, too. sea greens, for example, have a complete protein comparable to that of animals. quinoa and hempseeds are complete proteins. this: Too often, vegans turn to soy, which actually inhibits growth and reduces absorption of protein and minerals. is true in part. way too many vegans replace animal products with soy and grains. both can indeed cause health problems when not used in moderation, when modified, and when used inappropriately. what she is referring to re: absorption is a handful of studies done in 2005 that indicated that soy was a major issue. i've looked at those studies first-hand. almost all of them were conducted on women taking supplements of isolated soy protein. ISP is nothing like a whole soy product, and most people taking a supplement are receiving way higher doses of soy isoflavones than a normal person would who was eating normal, whole, complete soy. such results should be expected of anyone who is overzealous or obsessed with a particular food or food product. negative effects should be expected to arise from any food taken in such high doses, even fruits and vegetables. such results have neverbeen duplicated in studies conducted on moderate intake of whole soy products such as edamame, tempeh, etc. but sally fallon and the WAPF have just run with that, since it seemed to prove their original agenda, and many, many people have come along for the ride, based mainly on internet scare tactics such as the article " the whole soy story " (for the other side of that, here's an article by john robbins, the vegan equivalent of sally fallon, but a lot nicer: http://www.healthyat100.com/display.asp?catid=3 & pageid=12 ). as far as i can tell, this woman is no different. i would like to see her references on lower levels of DHA in breastmilk, since i've seen dozens of studies saying just the opposite. my bet is that, again, she's spreading her own agenda. the WAPF is notorious for spreading the message that a woman should only breastfeed if she has a *perfect* diet, by their standards (and frankly, i have no idea how someone could even afford to eat like that, much less choke down all that food, to have *ideal* breastmilk according to the WAPF). the WAPF's message is that, while they pay lip-service to breastmilk being ideal, " many " women cannot do it, or should not because of a lacking diet, and should instead make their own raw-liver-based formula, based on their recipe. this is a direct contradiction of every health organization in existence, all of which state that pretty much the only circumstances under which a mother who can breastfeed should consider not doing so is HIV/AIDS infection. even smoking mothers are encouraged to breastfeed (although they should of course stop smoking!). You cannot create and nourish a robust baby merely on foods from plants. bullshit. you guys have seen pictures of my kids. my son has never had an animal food in his life. he's always been at a perfect weight and height and development. nobody in their right mind could look at either of my kids and describe them as anything but robust and thriving. when we had our blood levels tested in february, he had higher-than-necessary levels in EVERYTHING. sure, you can screw up on a veg diet. you can screw up by giving your kids nothing but hot dogs, cola and cheetos too, as i saw way too often as a lactation educator for WIC. the point is that the diet has to be *well-planned* - whether it includes meat and dairy or not. babies are built from protein, calcium, cholesterol and fish oil. Children fed only plants will not get the precious things they need to live and grow. my son gets more than enough protein, high-quality protein. calcium, too - we don't struggle one whit to get calcium, and plant calcium is actually more easily absorbed and utilized by the body, whereas animal protein tends to leach calcium from the body. and fish oil - i'm assuming she's referring to DHA requirements. here's a little secret. you know how fish get to be so high in DHA? they eat ALGAE. and so do we. we just cut out the middleman. it's just as high-quality as that from fish, but without the concern of heavy metals, overfishing, global warming, and other nastiness. running nutrients through an animal first rather than eating them firsthand is like drinking water from a sewage treatment plant (paraphrased). yes, veronika, they do need a whole crap-load of healthy fats and proteins. protein is not an issue. on fat, you do have to work a little harder to get it into them, since they aren't eating junk. but it's not that hard; you just have to be a bit more conscientious, something no conscious parent should object to. i actually agree that soy formula is not that great. it *is* the equivalent of giving your child 3-4 borth control pill a day. it's ISP, which i mentioned before. it's gross. but dairy has issues too - the same high levels of cancer-causing hormones, even in " organic " cows, plus pesticides, genetic engineering, etc. there are drawbacks to both, and the only positive is that your kid will survive if you choose to not breastfeed or cannot. commercially-prepared formula is the *only* viable, tested option to breastmilk that contains all the necessary nutrients, including DHA now. of course, there's a whole lot of stuff in breastmilk that cannot be duplicated. i am a mama who cannot breastfeed. choosing a formula was tremendously difficult. my daughter gets a lot of donated breastmilk, but she still needs formula, especially when we don't have a running car to go pick up the breastmilk, like now. she is on an organic non-GMO soy-based formula. i thought long and hard about this and ultimately how i made this decision was not based on animal issues, but based on the simple fact that i am lactose-intolerant, and so is my son. when my son was born, and it became painfully obvious that we could not breastfeed, we used the basic enfamil dairy formula. it was a disaster. he could have died. so we switched to soy and all of his problems disappeared. i know within hours if someone gives him something with dairy. my daughter was so sick after our failed breastfeeding attempt, i didn't even want to risk trying a dairy formula, remembering what happened with my son. so we just went right to soy. i know it's what no lactivist wants to hear (i'm a lactivist, despite my troubles, and i hate saying it), but both have my children have survived and thrived on soy formula. breast is best and unless i was absolutely forced to, i would not even consider a formula. unfortunately, i was forced to. so, i hope that answers your questions. [later, i said this:] ok, looking back over that, i'm sorry if it sounded angry. this is the seventh time in two days that i've been asked about this article. most queries were not respectful, like yours, veronika, but were posed more as challenges, as " see, here's the evidence! you ARE f*ing up! " it's quite difficult to take, even more so because i *do* feel compelled to make some attempt to carefully straighten out people's incorrect assumptions and the inflammatory inaccuracies perpetuated in articles like this. if not me, then who? not that anyone cares anyway. so, my apologies for the long-winded answer, and for not being more peaceful and forgiving. [thankfully, everyone in the group said that they thought my response was not angry, but passionate. there are several people influced by WAP in this group and even they said that they appreciated my response and thought that i made good points, and that they didn't know that some plant foods contain whole proteins, and that one can take algae for a healthy fish oil alternative, etc. EVERYONE said that when they read this article they thought of MY kids because they could not believe that what she was saying was true based on how healthy and strong my kids are. one woman said that she wants to see my meal plans because she used to be vegan and just found it too difficult to come up with meals. she wants to be vegan again someday. so we're all making advances, people!!!] chandelle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2007 Report Share Posted May 23, 2007 is it just me, or are those people popping up everywhere? i swear if i meet three new people, one will be a WAPFer, one will be learning about it and trying to apply it, and the other will hear about it from me and then become a WAPFer within a year. i don't know if it's maybe just a utah thing, but i meet those people everywhere, man. they're sprouting up all over. On 5/22/07, Kadee M <abbey_road3012 wrote: > > > " ...she's spreading her own agenda as a WAPFer. " > > Ahhhhh. It all makes sense now. > > > > > > Kadee Sedtal > > Brain: " Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering? " > Pinky: " I think so, Brain, but three men in a tub? That's unsanitary! " > > If you can't afford the vet, you can't afford the pet!! > Sucker-punch spam with award-winning protection. > Try the free Mail Beta. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2007 Report Share Posted May 23, 2007 That's weird because I've never met one personally. On the internet, yes, but not in person. I'm awfully glad of it too!! chandelle' <earthmother213 wrote: is it just me, or are those people popping up everywhere? i swear if i meet three new people, one will be a WAPFer, one will be learning about it and trying to apply it, and the other will hear about it from me and then become a WAPFer within a year. i don't know if it's maybe just a utah thing, but i meet those people everywhere, man. they're sprouting up all over. On 5/22/07, Kadee M <abbey_road3012 wrote: > > > " ...she's spreading her own agenda as a WAPFer. " > > Ahhhhh. It all makes sense now. > > > > > > Kadee Sedtal > > Brain: " Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering? " > Pinky: " I think so, Brain, but three men in a tub? That's unsanitary! " > > If you can't afford the vet, you can't afford the pet!! > > > > > > > > Sucker-punch spam with award-winning protection. > Try the free Mail Beta. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2007 Report Share Posted May 23, 2007 I too am really frustrated by articles like the one in question. As several people pointed out, this has to do with a lack of education on proper infant care and very little to do with a vegan diet. But I feel like an idiot. What does WAPF stand for? Katie http://frugalveggiemama.blogspot.com Pinpoint customers who are looking for what you sell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2007 Report Share Posted May 23, 2007 Same here -- I have never heard of it anywhere outside this group! Must be regional. Are there any Canadians out there who listen to CBC Radio 1 -- I heard a promo this morning that " It could be that eating beef is worse than driving an SUV " and it was going to be discussed on the show called The Current -- but I had to go out and I missed it. I'd love to know what they actually said! Heather Kadee M wrote: > > That's weird because I've never met one personally. On the internet, > yes, but not in person. I'm awfully glad of it too!! > > chandelle' <earthmother213 > <earthmother213%40gmail.com>> wrote: is it just me, or are > those people popping up everywhere? i swear if i meet > three new people, one will be a WAPFer, one will be learning about it and > trying to apply it, and the other will hear about it from me and then > become > a WAPFer within a year. i don't know if it's maybe just a utah thing, > but i > meet those people everywhere, man. they're sprouting up all over. > > On 5/22/07, Kadee M <abbey_road3012 > <abbey_road3012%40>> wrote: > > > > > > " ...she's spreading her own agenda as a WAPFer. " > > > > Ahhhhh. It all makes sense now. > > > > > > > > > > > > Kadee Sedtal > > > > Brain: " Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering? " > > Pinky: " I think so, Brain, but three men in a tub? That's unsanitary! " > > > > If you can't afford the vet, you can't afford the pet!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sucker-punch spam with award-winning protection. > > Try the free Mail Beta. > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2007 Report Share Posted May 23, 2007 Nice letter, Reed! , " reed mangels " <reedmangels wrote: > > Here's the letter that I just sent to the NY Times: > To the Editor: > > As a registered dietitian and the parent of two healthy vegan children, I join thousands of other vegan parents in taking issue with recent comments on vegan diets (NYTimes, 5-20-07). I'd like to share some up-to-date information on sources of key nutrients for vegan babies and children. In early infancy, babies, whether vegan or not, thrive on breast milk, with infant formula an option when breastfeeding is impossible. Vegan toddlers get adequate protein from a variety of foods including dried beans, whole grains, nut butters, and soy products. Vitamin B12 sources include fortified foods and supplements. Calcium comes from greens and from fortified foods like orange juice and soymilk. Interested readers can learn more about vegan diets from reputable organizations like The Vegetarian Resource Group. Yes, it's important to be aware of what you're feeding your vegan child; but this awareness is not limited to vegan parents. In view of the epidemic of childhood obesity, perhaps more parents should be focusing on the quality of their children's diets. > > Reed Mangels, PhD, RD > > Nutrition Advisor, The Vegetarian Resource Group > > If other parents are interested in writing to the NY Times, letters can be sent to: letters > Here are the requirements: > > " Letters should be no longer than 150 words and may be shortened to fit allotted space. They must be exclusive to The Times (no prior submission to, or publication in, any other medium, including the Web). They should generally refer > to an article that has appeared within the last seven days. > > " To be considered for publication, letters must include the writer's name, address, current location (where you are writing from) and daytime and evening phone numbers at your current location (for verification, not for publication). > > " We generally do not publish more than one letter from the same writer within any 60-day period. " > Reed > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 26, 2007 Report Share Posted May 26, 2007 In case, people are interested, I was able to score an interview with a Chicago Parent magazine blogger on this topic. It can be found at: http://chicagoparent.com/cs/blogs/thread/archive/2007/05/23/feminist-mama-fi les-a-vegan-mama.aspx There are a lot of things I wished that I'd rephrased or emphasized more, but, on the whole, I think that it went pretty well. Marla Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 3, 2007 Report Share Posted July 3, 2007 " Death by Veganism " Begins Its Slow Demise http://www.drmcdougall.com/misc/2007nl/jun/vegan.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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