Vegetarian ??

[Guest guest]

I am confused ... I have seen this before. How can you consider yourself to

be vegetarian and you eat meat.

You can say we tend to eat more vegetarian than Standard American Diet . But

if you eat flesh you can't be a vegetarian or a Vegan.

Help me here if I'm not seeing something ?

Be Well,

Lynda

 

 

 

************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at

http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Um... if a person eats meat, they're not a vegetarian. If they say they are,

they obviously either don't know what they're talking about or they're using the

" image " as a status symbol or something.

 

I didn't quite catch the exact question there though... if you were referring to

a specific person or vegetarians as a group.

 

Namaska7 wrote: I am confused ... I

have seen this before. How can you consider yourself to

be vegetarian and you eat meat.

You can say we tend to eat more vegetarian than Standard American Diet . But

if you eat flesh you can't be a vegetarian or a Vegan.

Help me here if I'm not seeing something ?

Be Well,

Lynda

 

************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at

http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

 

[Guest guest]

who is this replying to? I think the person who said they eat more 'vegetarian'

meant more 'vegetables' therefore getting more vitamins than someone who eats

the SAD diet. You should have the quote and who wrote it in your response.

Renee

 

Namaska7 wrote:

I am confused ... I have seen this before. How can you consider

yourself to

be vegetarian and you eat meat.

You can say we tend to eat more vegetarian than Standard American Diet . But

if you eat flesh you can't be a vegetarian or a Vegan.

Help me here if I'm not seeing something ?

Be Well,

Lynda

 

************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at

http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

 

 

[Guest guest]

I think it is good for parents to think about serving their kids more

vegetables/vegetarian and it is especially good when the children

themselves are thinking about improving their diet. It is

intimidating to try something new; I

would like to feel comfortable asking questions without feeling like

I am a dumb meat-eater trying to fit into some elite vegetarian

group.

This is sometimes how many animal rights groups and vegetarian groups

come off. I think we make a bad impression when we respond to

someone who is really trying with sarcasm. Can we not just pass

information back and forth and leave it at that?

 

I look forward to hearing more ideas and questions about feeding my

kids vegetarian.

 

, Kadee M <abbey_road3012

wrote:

>

> Um... if a person eats meat, they're not a vegetarian. If they say

they are, they obviously either don't know what they're talking about

or they're using the " image " as a status symbol or something.

>

> I didn't quite catch the exact question there though... if you were

referring to a specific person or vegetarians as a group.

>

> Namaska7 wrote: I am

confused ... I have seen this before. How can you consider yourself

to

> be vegetarian and you eat meat.

> You can say we tend to eat more vegetarian than Standard American

Diet . But

> if you eat flesh you can't be a vegetarian or a Vegan.

> Help me here if I'm not seeing something ?

> Be Well,

> Lynda

>

> ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-

new AOL at

> http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Diana,

 

When someone asks me if I am a vegetarian (or vegan or don't you eat meat?),

my standard answer is that I am an environmentalist. I hate labels.

 

Robin

 

" diana.platt " <diana.platt wrote:

I think it is good for parents to think about serving their kids more

vegetables/vegetarian and it is especially good when the children

themselves are thinking about improving their diet. It is

intimidating to try something new; I

would like to feel comfortable asking questions without feeling like

I am a dumb meat-eater trying to fit into some elite vegetarian

group.

This is sometimes how many animal rights groups and vegetarian groups

come off. I think we make a bad impression when we respond to

someone who is really trying with sarcasm. Can we not just pass

information back and forth and leave it at that?

 

I look forward to hearing more ideas and questions about feeding my

kids vegetarian.

 

, Kadee M <abbey_road3012

wrote:

>

> Um... if a person eats meat, they're not a vegetarian. If they say

they are, they obviously either don't know what they're talking about

or they're using the " image " as a status symbol or something.

>

> I didn't quite catch the exact question there though... if you were

referring to a specific person or vegetarians as a group.

>

> Namaska7 wrote: I am

confused ... I have seen this before. How can you consider yourself

to

> be vegetarian and you eat meat.

> You can say we tend to eat more vegetarian than Standard American

Diet . But

> if you eat flesh you can't be a vegetarian or a Vegan.

> Help me here if I'm not seeing something ?

> Be Well,

> Lynda

>

> ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-

new AOL at

> http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

>

>

[Guest guest]

I wasn't attacking anyone, I just wasn't quite sure exactly what the question

was because of the wording. Some people call themselves vegetarians and yet they

eat fish or chickens or whatever. That's who I was referring to. Eating " more

vegetarian " isn't at all what I was talking about. It's those people who claim

to live the lifestyle and cheat. Kind of like if a person says they're a

non-smoker and yet they smoke cigars... not the greatest example but close. I'm

sorry if that came across wrong, I wasn't meaning to attack you. I was getting

pretty frustrated with the wording in the post I was responding to and

apparently I didn't word my own post as well as I should have.

 

" diana.platt " <diana.platt wrote:

I think it is good for parents to think about serving their kids more

vegetables/vegetarian and it is especially good when the children

themselves are thinking about improving their diet. It is

intimidating to try something new; I

would like to feel comfortable asking questions without feeling like

I am a dumb meat-eater trying to fit into some elite vegetarian

group.

This is sometimes how many animal rights groups and vegetarian groups

come off. I think we make a bad impression when we respond to

someone who is really trying with sarcasm. Can we not just pass

information back and forth and leave it at that?

 

I look forward to hearing more ideas and questions about feeding my

kids vegetarian.

 

, Kadee M <abbey_road3012

wrote:

>

> Um... if a person eats meat, they're not a vegetarian. If they say

they are, they obviously either don't know what they're talking about

or they're using the " image " as a status symbol or something.

>

> I didn't quite catch the exact question there though... if you were

referring to a specific person or vegetarians as a group.

>

> Namaska7 wrote: I am

confused ... I have seen this before. How can you consider yourself

to

> be vegetarian and you eat meat.

> You can say we tend to eat more vegetarian than Standard American

Diet . But

> if you eat flesh you can't be a vegetarian or a Vegan.

> Help me here if I'm not seeing something ?

> Be Well,

> Lynda

>

> ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-

new AOL at

> http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

>

>

[Guest guest]

Actually I had no idea what the original post meant -at all.

 

Kadee M <abbey_road3012 wrote: I wasn't attacking anyone, I

just wasn't quite sure exactly what the question was because of the wording.

Some people call themselves vegetarians and yet they eat fish or chickens or

whatever. That's who I was referring to. Eating " more vegetarian " isn't at all

what I was talking about. It's those people who claim to live the lifestyle and

cheat. Kind of like if a person says they're a non-smoker and yet they smoke

cigars... not the greatest example but close. I'm sorry if that came across

wrong, I wasn't meaning to attack you. I was getting pretty frustrated with the

wording in the post I was responding to and apparently I didn't word my own post

as well as I should have.

 

" diana.platt " <diana.platt wrote: I think it is good for parents to

think about serving their kids more

vegetables/vegetarian and it is especially good when the children

themselves are thinking about improving their diet. It is

intimidating to try something new; I

would like to feel comfortable asking questions without feeling like

I am a dumb meat-eater trying to fit into some elite vegetarian

group.

This is sometimes how many animal rights groups and vegetarian groups

come off. I think we make a bad impression when we respond to

someone who is really trying with sarcasm. Can we not just pass

information back and forth and leave it at that?

 

I look forward to hearing more ideas and questions about feeding my

kids vegetarian.

 

, Kadee M <abbey_road3012

wrote:

>

> Um... if a person eats meat, they're not a vegetarian. If they say

they are, they obviously either don't know what they're talking about

or they're using the " image " as a status symbol or something.

>

> I didn't quite catch the exact question there though... if you were

referring to a specific person or vegetarians as a group.

>

> Namaska7 wrote: I am

confused ... I have seen this before. How can you consider yourself

to

> be vegetarian and you eat meat.

> You can say we tend to eat more vegetarian than Standard American

Diet . But

> if you eat flesh you can't be a vegetarian or a Vegan.

> Help me here if I'm not seeing something ?

> Be Well,

> Lynda

>

> ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-

new AOL at

> http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

>

>

[Guest guest]

I thought you were probably referring to me, and I just assumed you

hadn't read my previous posts.

 

I am not trying to pass myself off as vegetarian. I came here

because I read this was a great resource for " parents trying to raise

vegetarian kids " not necessarily " vegetarian parents trying to raise

kids " . Subtle difference. I am not vegetarian, but after reading

" Charlotte's Web " my kids decided they no longer wanted to eat meat.

I am trying to support them in that, and to learn as much as possible

about providing a healthy diet - otherwise, their version of " not

eating meat " would be, skip the meat, still no veggies, let's just

eat bread and dessert!

 

So I guess the term " vegetarian " may not be appropriate for what they

are doing, since they are willing to eat fish (I assume it was the

sushi post you were responding to?). I thought there is a form of

vegetarianism that allows not only dairy but also fish. I dated a

guy for several years who called himself a vegetarian, but he would

eat fish. His reasons for his choices were to eat low on the food

chain, and to eat things with few or no brain cells. (His words, not

mine.) In our group were also two people who kept strict kosher, and

a couple who were strictly vegan, and several omnivores including

me. We would get together regularly for dinners at each other's

houses, everyone was accommodated and no one judged or tried to

convert another. (And no one was expected to prepare food they were

opposed to! The kosher and vegan utensils were never allowed to

touch the omnivore utensils.)

 

I am not trying to get my children to do anything other than eat

healthy, but I am very proud of their not wanting to eat the things

that in their 5-year-old minds are animals. I applaud their

determination, I thought it would only last a week or so and then

they would want their hamburgers and chicken nuggets again. I wish I

had their willpower. Their choice is influencing our whole family to

eat more environmentally-friendly. We aren't doing as well as

vegans, and I'm not trying to claim we are.

 

If there is a term for someone who eats fish and dairy (no poultry)

let me know.

 

I appreciate everyone's support here, and willingness to answer my

questions. Thank you for acknowledging our efforts, even if we

haven't gotten as far as you have.

 

Cheers,

-Kara

 

On Jul 24, 2007, at 12:11 PM, Kadee M wrote:

 

> I wasn't attacking anyone, I just wasn't quite sure exactly what

> the question was because of the wording. Some people call

> themselves vegetarians and yet they eat fish or chickens or

> whatever. That's who I was referring to. Eating " more vegetarian "

> isn't at all what I was talking about. It's those people who claim

> to live the lifestyle and cheat. Kind of like if a person says

> they're a non-smoker and yet they smoke cigars... not the greatest

> example but close. I'm sorry if that came across wrong, I wasn't

> meaning to attack you. I was getting pretty frustrated with the

> wording in the post I was responding to and apparently I didn't

> word my own post as well as I should have.

>

> " diana.platt " <diana.platt wrote: I think it is good

> for parents to think about serving their kids more

> vegetables/vegetarian and it is especially good when the children

> themselves are thinking about improving their diet. It is

> intimidating to try something new; I

> would like to feel comfortable asking questions without feeling like

> I am a dumb meat-eater trying to fit into some elite vegetarian

> group.

> This is sometimes how many animal rights groups and vegetarian groups

> come off. I think we make a bad impression when we respond to

> someone who is really trying with sarcasm. Can we not just pass

> information back and forth and leave it at that?

>

> I look forward to hearing more ideas and questions about feeding my

> kids vegetarian.

>

> , Kadee M <abbey_road3012

> wrote:

> >

> > Um... if a person eats meat, they're not a vegetarian. If they say

> they are, they obviously either don't know what they're talking about

> or they're using the " image " as a status symbol or something.

> >

> > I didn't quite catch the exact question there though... if you were

> referring to a specific person or vegetarians as a group.

> >

> > Namaska7 wrote: I am

> confused ... I have seen this before. How can you consider yourself

> to

> > be vegetarian and you eat meat.

> > You can say we tend to eat more vegetarian than Standard American

> Diet . But

> > if you eat flesh you can't be a vegetarian or a Vegan.

> > Help me here if I'm not seeing something ?

> > Be Well,

> > Lynda

> >

> > ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-

> new AOL at

> > http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

pescetarian - is a fish-eater.

Renee

 

Kara Keeter <karakeeter wrote:

I thought you were probably referring to me, and I just assumed you

hadn't read my previous posts.

 

I am not trying to pass myself off as vegetarian. I came here

because I read this was a great resource for " parents trying to raise

vegetarian kids " not necessarily " vegetarian parents trying to raise

kids " . Subtle difference. I am not vegetarian, but after reading

" Charlotte's Web " my kids decided they no longer wanted to eat meat.

I am trying to support them in that, and to learn as much as possible

about providing a healthy diet - otherwise, their version of " not

eating meat " would be, skip the meat, still no veggies, let's just

eat bread and dessert!

 

So I guess the term " vegetarian " may not be appropriate for what they

are doing, since they are willing to eat fish (I assume it was the

sushi post you were responding to?). I thought there is a form of

vegetarianism that allows not only dairy but also fish. I dated a

guy for several years who called himself a vegetarian, but he would

eat fish. His reasons for his choices were to eat low on the food

chain, and to eat things with few or no brain cells. (His words, not

mine.) In our group were also two people who kept strict kosher, and

a couple who were strictly vegan, and several omnivores including

me. We would get together regularly for dinners at each other's

houses, everyone was accommodated and no one judged or tried to

convert another. (And no one was expected to prepare food they were

opposed to! The kosher and vegan utensils were never allowed to

touch the omnivore utensils.)

 

I am not trying to get my children to do anything other than eat

healthy, but I am very proud of their not wanting to eat the things

that in their 5-year-old minds are animals. I applaud their

determination, I thought it would only last a week or so and then

they would want their hamburgers and chicken nuggets again. I wish I

had their willpower. Their choice is influencing our whole family to

eat more environmentally-friendly. We aren't doing as well as

vegans, and I'm not trying to claim we are.

 

If there is a term for someone who eats fish and dairy (no poultry)

let me know.

 

I appreciate everyone's support here, and willingness to answer my

questions. Thank you for acknowledging our efforts, even if we

haven't gotten as far as you have.

 

Cheers,

-Kara

 

On Jul 24, 2007, at 12:11 PM, Kadee M wrote:

 

> I wasn't attacking anyone, I just wasn't quite sure exactly what

> the question was because of the wording. Some people call

> themselves vegetarians and yet they eat fish or chickens or

> whatever. That's who I was referring to. Eating " more vegetarian "

> isn't at all what I was talking about. It's those people who claim

> to live the lifestyle and cheat. Kind of like if a person says

> they're a non-smoker and yet they smoke cigars... not the greatest

> example but close. I'm sorry if that came across wrong, I wasn't

> meaning to attack you. I was getting pretty frustrated with the

> wording in the post I was responding to and apparently I didn't

> word my own post as well as I should have.

>

> " diana.platt " <diana.platt wrote: I think it is good

> for parents to think about serving their kids more

> vegetables/vegetarian and it is especially good when the children

> themselves are thinking about improving their diet. It is

> intimidating to try something new; I

> would like to feel comfortable asking questions without feeling like

> I am a dumb meat-eater trying to fit into some elite vegetarian

> group.

> This is sometimes how many animal rights groups and vegetarian groups

> come off. I think we make a bad impression when we respond to

> someone who is really trying with sarcasm. Can we not just pass

> information back and forth and leave it at that?

>

> I look forward to hearing more ideas and questions about feeding my

> kids vegetarian.

>

> , Kadee M <abbey_road3012

> wrote:

> >

> > Um... if a person eats meat, they're not a vegetarian. If they say

> they are, they obviously either don't know what they're talking about

> or they're using the " image " as a status symbol or something.

> >

> > I didn't quite catch the exact question there though... if you were

> referring to a specific person or vegetarians as a group.

> >

> > Namaska7 wrote: I am

> confused ... I have seen this before. How can you consider yourself

> to

> > be vegetarian and you eat meat.

> > You can say we tend to eat more vegetarian than Standard American

> Diet . But

> > if you eat flesh you can't be a vegetarian or a Vegan.

> > Help me here if I'm not seeing something ?

> > Be Well,

> > Lynda

> >

> > ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-

> new AOL at

> > http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Kara,

 

Labels are hard and I wish we didn't need them. It is

difficult when people call themselves vegan and still

eat animal products or vegetarian and eat animals

because then in restaurants or when people are cooking

they think fish is okay for vegetarians or dairy is

okay for vegans. It makes it difficult to know what

is safe for us to eat when people expand the term

vegetarian or vegan. But, I also understand how there

needs to be a term for people who don't eat any

animals besides fish or eat dairy, but not eggs and

other animals. I don't really like these labels

either, but this is what some people use to describe

themselves if they eat fish, but no other animals:

Pescatarian.

 

I applaud you for supporting your children in their

choice to eat fewer animals. A lot of parents would

not be so supportive. Around 10 or so, I decided I

didn't want to eat any mammals, but I continued to eat

chicken, turkey (never really liked fish so I didn't

eat fish). This was some concern to my parents

because I really didn't like vegetables (potatoes,

corn, carrots were my favorites). They didn't expect

it to last long. My mom was very sweet and switched

to turkey burgers and stuff like that.

 

Over the next two years I slowly cut down on the

amount of turkey/chicken and stopped eating animals

all together. I was a young adult when I went vegan.

Over the years, my family has been very supportive and

I appreciate that so much since both my parents came

from farming families and my maternal grandfather was

a butcher for many years and my paternal grandfather a

dairy farmer. Both my parents shared an interest in

my eating and why I decided to not eat animals. They

were both surprised and happy to see my love for

vegetables grow and they saw how varied my diet became

and they have always agreed I was healthier. My

mother would cook vegan food for me when I came to

visit and eventually turned all our family

celebrations into completely veg events. Before my

mother was diagnosed and died of cancer, she was

trying to be vegetarian. My sister has been veg*n off

and on (when she travels to/lives in other countries

she isn't as strict) for several years.

 

My brother is a little annoyed by the whole veg*n

thing, but he's always been a vegetable lover and

understands the health aspects of it and although he

makes remarks he eats the food.

 

My husband went vegan as an adult and did not have a

supportive family. Which you wouldn't think would be

as bad since he didn't live with them, but it still

effects us and he has been vegan around 20 years. His

mother died of cancer and this was enough to get him

to change his diet. His father was on the Ornish diet

for a while because of heart issues, but still puts us

down for our vegan lifestyle. I think his dad still

secretly wishes my husband would start eating meat

again.

 

Sorry, didn't mean to get into all that. I just think

you are a wonderful mom for joining this group and

getting more information and supporting your children!

 

 

Linda

--- Kara Keeter <karakeeter wrote:

 

> I thought you were probably referring to me, and I

> just assumed you

> hadn't read my previous posts.

>

> I am not trying to pass myself off as vegetarian. I

> came here

> because I read this was a great resource for

> " parents trying to raise

> vegetarian kids " not necessarily " vegetarian parents

> trying to raise

> kids " . Subtle difference. I am not vegetarian, but

> after reading

> " Charlotte's Web " my kids decided they no longer

> wanted to eat meat.

> I am trying to support them in that, and to learn as

> much as possible

> about providing a healthy diet - otherwise, their

> version of " not

> eating meat " would be, skip the meat, still no

> veggies, let's just

> eat bread and dessert!

>

> So I guess the term " vegetarian " may not be

> appropriate for what they

> are doing, since they are willing to eat fish (I

> assume it was the

> sushi post you were responding to?). I thought

> there is a form of

> vegetarianism that allows not only dairy but also

> fish. I dated a

> guy for several years who called himself a

> vegetarian, but he would

> eat fish. His reasons for his choices were to eat

> low on the food

> chain, and to eat things with few or no brain cells.

> (His words, not

> mine.) In our group were also two people who kept

> strict kosher, and

> a couple who were strictly vegan, and several

> omnivores including

> me. We would get together regularly for dinners at

> each other's

> houses, everyone was accommodated and no one judged

> or tried to

> convert another. (And no one was expected to

> prepare food they were

> opposed to! The kosher and vegan utensils were

> never allowed to

> touch the omnivore utensils.)

>

> I am not trying to get my children to do anything

> other than eat

> healthy, but I am very proud of their not wanting to

> eat the things

> that in their 5-year-old minds are animals. I

> applaud their

> determination, I thought it would only last a week

> or so and then

> they would want their hamburgers and chicken nuggets

> again. I wish I

> had their willpower. Their choice is influencing

> our whole family to

> eat more environmentally-friendly. We aren't doing

> as well as

> vegans, and I'm not trying to claim we are.

>

> If there is a term for someone who eats fish and

> dairy (no poultry)

> let me know.

>

> I appreciate everyone's support here, and

> willingness to answer my

> questions. Thank you for acknowledging our efforts,

> even if we

> haven't gotten as far as you have.

>

> Cheers,

> -Kara

>

> On Jul 24, 2007, at 12:11 PM, Kadee M wrote:

>

> > I wasn't attacking anyone, I just wasn't quite

> sure exactly what

> > the question was because of the wording. Some

> people call

> > themselves vegetarians and yet they eat fish or

> chickens or

> > whatever. That's who I was referring to. Eating

> " more vegetarian "

> > isn't at all what I was talking about. It's those

> people who claim

> > to live the lifestyle and cheat. Kind of like if a

> person says

> > they're a non-smoker and yet they smoke cigars...

> not the greatest

> > example but close. I'm sorry if that came across

> wrong, I wasn't

> > meaning to attack you. I was getting pretty

> frustrated with the

> > wording in the post I was responding to and

> apparently I didn't

> > word my own post as well as I should have.

> >

> > " diana.platt " <diana.platt wrote: I

> think it is good

> > for parents to think about serving their kids more

> > vegetables/vegetarian and it is especially good

> when the children

> > themselves are thinking about improving their

> diet. It is

> > intimidating to try something new; I

> > would like to feel comfortable asking questions

> without feeling like

> > I am a dumb meat-eater trying to fit into some

> elite vegetarian

> > group.

> > This is sometimes how many animal rights groups

> and vegetarian groups

> > come off. I think we make a bad impression when we

> respond to

> > someone who is really trying with sarcasm. Can we

> not just pass

> > information back and forth and leave it at that?

> >

> > I look forward to hearing more ideas and questions

> about feeding my

> > kids vegetarian.

> >

> > , Kadee M

> <abbey_road3012

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > Um... if a person eats meat, they're not a

> vegetarian. If they say

> > they are, they obviously either don't know what

> they're talking about

> > or they're using the " image " as a status symbol or

> something.

> > >

> > > I didn't quite catch the exact question there

> though... if you were

> > referring to a specific person or vegetarians as a

> group.

> > >

> > > Namaska7 wrote: I am

> > confused ... I have seen this before. How can you

> consider yourself

> > to

> > > be vegetarian and you eat meat.

> > > You can say we tend to eat more vegetarian than

> Standard American

> > Diet . But

> > > if you eat flesh you can't be a vegetarian or a

> Vegan.

> > > Help me here if I'm not seeing something ?

> > > Be Well,

> > > Lynda

> > >

> > > ************************************** Get a

> sneak peek of the all-

> > new AOL at

> > > http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Kadee Sedtal

> > >

> > > " When you die, if you get a choice between going

> to regular heaven

> > or pie heaven, choose pie heaven. It might be a

> trick, but if it's

> > not, mmmmmmmm, boy. " -Jack Handey

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights

> and hotels with

> > FareChase.

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Kadee Sedtal

> >

> > " When you die, if you get a choice between going

> to

=== message truncated ===

 

 

Linda

http://triballife.net/ A Marketplace for a Better World

 

 

 

______________________________\

____

Need a vacation? Get great deals

to amazing places on Travel.

http://travel./

[Guest guest]

I'm not referring to you or anyone else in the group. The question in the

original post though almost (kind of??) seemed that they were saying that we

(the group members) are saying we're vegetarians but we eat meat, which isn't

true for the vegetarians here in the group *or* for the non-vegetarians who

aren't claiming to be such. If the only kind of meat a person eats is fish, they

are a pescatarian. I was definitely not attacking anyone here. I'm sorry if it

sounded that way.

 

Kara Keeter <karakeeter wrote: I

thought you were probably referring to me, and I just assumed you

hadn't read my previous posts.

 

I am not trying to pass myself off as vegetarian. I came here

because I read this was a great resource for " parents trying to raise

vegetarian kids " not necessarily " vegetarian parents trying to raise

kids " . Subtle difference. I am not vegetarian, but after reading

" Charlotte's Web " my kids decided they no longer wanted to eat meat.

I am trying to support them in that, and to learn as much as possible

about providing a healthy diet - otherwise, their version of " not

eating meat " would be, skip the meat, still no veggies, let's just

eat bread and dessert!

 

So I guess the term " vegetarian " may not be appropriate for what they

are doing, since they are willing to eat fish (I assume it was the

sushi post you were responding to?). I thought there is a form of

vegetarianism that allows not only dairy but also fish. I dated a

guy for several years who called himself a vegetarian, but he would

eat fish. His reasons for his choices were to eat low on the food

chain, and to eat things with few or no brain cells. (His words, not

mine.) In our group were also two people who kept strict kosher, and

a couple who were strictly vegan, and several omnivores including

me. We would get together regularly for dinners at each other's

houses, everyone was accommodated and no one judged or tried to

convert another. (And no one was expected to prepare food they were

opposed to! The kosher and vegan utensils were never allowed to

touch the omnivore utensils.)

 

I am not trying to get my children to do anything other than eat

healthy, but I am very proud of their not wanting to eat the things

that in their 5-year-old minds are animals. I applaud their

determination, I thought it would only last a week or so and then

they would want their hamburgers and chicken nuggets again. I wish I

had their willpower. Their choice is influencing our whole family to

eat more environmentally-friendly. We aren't doing as well as

vegans, and I'm not trying to claim we are.

 

If there is a term for someone who eats fish and dairy (no poultry)

let me know.

 

I appreciate everyone's support here, and willingness to answer my

questions. Thank you for acknowledging our efforts, even if we

haven't gotten as far as you have.

 

Cheers,

-Kara

 

On Jul 24, 2007, at 12:11 PM, Kadee M wrote:

 

> I wasn't attacking anyone, I just wasn't quite sure exactly what

> the question was because of the wording. Some people call

> themselves vegetarians and yet they eat fish or chickens or

> whatever. That's who I was referring to. Eating " more vegetarian "

> isn't at all what I was talking about. It's those people who claim

> to live the lifestyle and cheat. Kind of like if a person says

> they're a non-smoker and yet they smoke cigars... not the greatest

> example but close. I'm sorry if that came across wrong, I wasn't

> meaning to attack you. I was getting pretty frustrated with the

> wording in the post I was responding to and apparently I didn't

> word my own post as well as I should have.

>

> " diana.platt " <diana.platt wrote: I think it is good

> for parents to think about serving their kids more

> vegetables/vegetarian and it is especially good when the children

> themselves are thinking about improving their diet. It is

> intimidating to try something new; I

> would like to feel comfortable asking questions without feeling like

> I am a dumb meat-eater trying to fit into some elite vegetarian

> group.

> This is sometimes how many animal rights groups and vegetarian groups

> come off. I think we make a bad impression when we respond to

> someone who is really trying with sarcasm. Can we not just pass

> information back and forth and leave it at that?

>

> I look forward to hearing more ideas and questions about feeding my

> kids vegetarian.

>

> , Kadee M <abbey_road3012

> wrote:

> >

> > Um... if a person eats meat, they're not a vegetarian. If they say

> they are, they obviously either don't know what they're talking about

> or they're using the " image " as a status symbol or something.

> >

> > I didn't quite catch the exact question there though... if you were

> referring to a specific person or vegetarians as a group.

> >

> > Namaska7 wrote: I am

> confused ... I have seen this before. How can you consider yourself

> to

> > be vegetarian and you eat meat.

> > You can say we tend to eat more vegetarian than Standard American

> Diet . But

> > if you eat flesh you can't be a vegetarian or a Vegan.

> > Help me here if I'm not seeing something ?

> > Be Well,

> > Lynda

> >

> > ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-

> new AOL at

> > http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Oh no, you can't be suggesting I go to my kids and tell them they can

be pesky, are you??? LOL

 

On Jul 24, 2007, at 2:28 PM, Renee Carroll wrote:

 

> pescetarian - is a fish-eater.

> Renee

>

> Kara Keeter <karakeeter wrote:

> I thought you were probably referring to me, and I just assumed you

> hadn't read my previous posts.

>

> I am not trying to pass myself off as vegetarian. I came here

> because I read this was a great resource for " parents trying to raise

> vegetarian kids " not necessarily " vegetarian parents trying to raise

> kids " . Subtle difference. I am not vegetarian, but after reading

> " Charlotte's Web " my kids decided they no longer wanted to eat meat.

> I am trying to support them in that, and to learn as much as possible

> about providing a healthy diet - otherwise, their version of " not

> eating meat " would be, skip the meat, still no veggies, let's just

> eat bread and dessert!

>

> So I guess the term " vegetarian " may not be appropriate for what they

> are doing, since they are willing to eat fish (I assume it was the

> sushi post you were responding to?). I thought there is a form of

> vegetarianism that allows not only dairy but also fish. I dated a

> guy for several years who called himself a vegetarian, but he would

> eat fish. His reasons for his choices were to eat low on the food

> chain, and to eat things with few or no brain cells. (His words, not

> mine.) In our group were also two people who kept strict kosher, and

> a couple who were strictly vegan, and several omnivores including

> me. We would get together regularly for dinners at each other's

> houses, everyone was accommodated and no one judged or tried to

> convert another. (And no one was expected to prepare food they were

> opposed to! The kosher and vegan utensils were never allowed to

> touch the omnivore utensils.)

>

> I am not trying to get my children to do anything other than eat

> healthy, but I am very proud of their not wanting to eat the things

> that in their 5-year-old minds are animals. I applaud their

> determination, I thought it would only last a week or so and then

> they would want their hamburgers and chicken nuggets again. I wish I

> had their willpower. Their choice is influencing our whole family to

> eat more environmentally-friendly. We aren't doing as well as

> vegans, and I'm not trying to claim we are.

>

> If there is a term for someone who eats fish and dairy (no poultry)

> let me know.

>

> I appreciate everyone's support here, and willingness to answer my

> questions. Thank you for acknowledging our efforts, even if we

> haven't gotten as far as you have.

>

> Cheers,

> -Kara

>

> On Jul 24, 2007, at 12:11 PM, Kadee M wrote:

>

> > I wasn't attacking anyone, I just wasn't quite sure exactly what

> > the question was because of the wording. Some people call

> > themselves vegetarians and yet they eat fish or chickens or

> > whatever. That's who I was referring to. Eating " more vegetarian "

> > isn't at all what I was talking about. It's those people who claim

> > to live the lifestyle and cheat. Kind of like if a person says

> > they're a non-smoker and yet they smoke cigars... not the greatest

> > example but close. I'm sorry if that came across wrong, I wasn't

> > meaning to attack you. I was getting pretty frustrated with the

> > wording in the post I was responding to and apparently I didn't

> > word my own post as well as I should have.

> >

> > " diana.platt " <diana.platt wrote: I think it is good

> > for parents to think about serving their kids more

> > vegetables/vegetarian and it is especially good when the children

> > themselves are thinking about improving their diet. It is

> > intimidating to try something new; I

> > would like to feel comfortable asking questions without feeling like

> > I am a dumb meat-eater trying to fit into some elite vegetarian

> > group.

> > This is sometimes how many animal rights groups and vegetarian

> groups

> > come off. I think we make a bad impression when we respond to

> > someone who is really trying with sarcasm. Can we not just pass

> > information back and forth and leave it at that?

> >

> > I look forward to hearing more ideas and questions about feeding my

> > kids vegetarian.

> >

> > , Kadee M <abbey_road3012

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > Um... if a person eats meat, they're not a vegetarian. If they say

> > they are, they obviously either don't know what they're talking

> about

> > or they're using the " image " as a status symbol or something.

> > >

> > > I didn't quite catch the exact question there though... if you

> were

> > referring to a specific person or vegetarians as a group.

> > >

> > > Namaska7 wrote: I am

> > confused ... I have seen this before. How can you consider yourself

> > to

> > > be vegetarian and you eat meat.

> > > You can say we tend to eat more vegetarian than Standard American

> > Diet . But

> > > if you eat flesh you can't be a vegetarian or a Vegan.

> > > Help me here if I'm not seeing something ?

> > > Be Well,

> > > Lynda

> > >

> > > ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the

> all-

> > new AOL at

> > > http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

Has any one ever done any kind of a study on WHY it seems to bother

people so badly when a family member goes Veggie Or pesci or what ever?

I mean its not like they are killing anyone, or joining some really out

there cult that requires a disconnect of family members.

Recently I am hearing a lot of stuff about families really getting upset

about their relative going veggie. And am starting to get some mild

flack myself. Course my family gave up on me three kids and

homeschooling ago. They Know I am a lost cause.. LOL..

 

General concern out of lack of nutritional education I can see.. but to

the point where it divides a family?? !! Does it bother their conscious?

Are they afraid they are eating wrong? Is this some sort of social

eating thing?

 

Steph

 

" We all want progress, but if you're on the wrong road, progress means

doing an about-turn and walking back to the right road; in that case,

the man who turns back soonest is the most progressive. "

C.S. Lewis

 

 

On

Behalf Of Linda Evans

Tuesday, July 24, 2007 2:38 PM

 

Re: Vegetarian ??

 

Kara,

 

Labels are hard and I wish we didn't need them. It is

difficult when people call themselves vegan and still

eat animal products or vegetarian and eat animals

because then in restaurants or when people are cooking

they think fish is okay for vegetarians or dairy is

okay for vegans. It makes it difficult to know what

is safe for us to eat when people expand the term

vegetarian or vegan. But, I also understand how there

needs to be a term for people who don't eat any

animals besides fish or eat dairy, but not eggs and

other animals. I don't really like these labels

either, but this is what some people use to describe

themselves if they eat fish, but no other animals:

Pescatarian.

 

I applaud you for supporting your children in their

choice to eat fewer animals. A lot of parents would

not be so supportive. Around 10 or so, I decided I

didn't want to eat any mammals, but I continued to eat

chicken, turkey (never really liked fish so I didn't

eat fish). This was some concern to my parents

because I really didn't like vegetables (potatoes,

corn, carrots were my favorites). They didn't expect

it to last long. My mom was very sweet and switched

to turkey burgers and stuff like that.

 

Over the next two years I slowly cut down on the

amount of turkey/chicken and stopped eating animals

all together. I was a young adult when I went vegan.

Over the years, my family has been very supportive and

I appreciate that so much since both my parents came

from farming families and my maternal grandfather was

a butcher for many years and my paternal grandfather a

dairy farmer. Both my parents shared an interest in

my eating and why I decided to not eat animals. They

were both surprised and happy to see my love for

vegetables grow and they saw how varied my diet became

and they have always agreed I was healthier. My

mother would cook vegan food for me when I came to

visit and eventually turned all our family

celebrations into completely veg events. Before my

mother was diagnosed and died of cancer, she was

trying to be vegetarian. My sister has been veg*n off

and on (when she travels to/lives in other countries

she isn't as strict) for several years.

 

My brother is a little annoyed by the whole veg*n

thing, but he's always been a vegetable lover and

understands the health aspects of it and although he

makes remarks he eats the food.

 

My husband went vegan as an adult and did not have a

supportive family. Which you wouldn't think would be

as bad since he didn't live with them, but it still

effects us and he has been vegan around 20 years. His

mother died of cancer and this was enough to get him

to change his diet. His father was on the Ornish diet

for a while because of heart issues, but still puts us

down for our vegan lifestyle. I think his dad still

secretly wishes my husband would start eating meat

again.

 

Sorry, didn't mean to get into all that. I just think

you are a wonderful mom for joining this group and

getting more information and supporting your children!

 

 

Linda

--- Kara Keeter <karakeeter@cableone <karakeeter%40cableone.net>

..net> wrote:

 

> I thought you were probably referring to me, and I

> just assumed you

> hadn't read my previous posts.

>

> I am not trying to pass myself off as vegetarian. I

> came here

> because I read this was a great resource for

> " parents trying to raise

> vegetarian kids " not necessarily " vegetarian parents

> trying to raise

> kids " . Subtle difference. I am not vegetarian, but

> after reading

> " Charlotte's Web " my kids decided they no longer

> wanted to eat meat.

> I am trying to support them in that, and to learn as

> much as possible

> about providing a healthy diet - otherwise, their

> version of " not

> eating meat " would be, skip the meat, still no

> veggies, let's just

> eat bread and dessert!

>

> So I guess the term " vegetarian " may not be

> appropriate for what they

> are doing, since they are willing to eat fish (I

> assume it was the

> sushi post you were responding to?). I thought

> there is a form of

> vegetarianism that allows not only dairy but also

> fish. I dated a

> guy for several years who called himself a

> vegetarian, but he would

> eat fish. His reasons for his choices were to eat

> low on the food

> chain, and to eat things with few or no brain cells.

> (His words, not

> mine.) In our group were also two people who kept

> strict kosher, and

> a couple who were strictly vegan, and several

> omnivores including

> me. We would get together regularly for dinners at

> each other's

> houses, everyone was accommodated and no one judged

> or tried to

> convert another. (And no one was expected to

> prepare food they were

> opposed to! The kosher and vegan utensils were

> never allowed to

> touch the omnivore utensils.)

>

> I am not trying to get my children to do anything

> other than eat

> healthy, but I am very proud of their not wanting to

> eat the things

> that in their 5-year-old minds are animals. I

> applaud their

> determination, I thought it would only last a week

> or so and then

> they would want their hamburgers and chicken nuggets

> again. I wish I

> had their willpower. Their choice is influencing

> our whole family to

> eat more environmentally-friendly. We aren't doing

> as well as

> vegans, and I'm not trying to claim we are.

>

> If there is a term for someone who eats fish and

> dairy (no poultry)

> let me know.

>

> I appreciate everyone's support here, and

> willingness to answer my

> questions. Thank you for acknowledging our efforts,

> even if we

> haven't gotten as far as you have.

>

> Cheers,

> -Kara

>

> On Jul 24, 2007, at 12:11 PM, Kadee M wrote:

>

> > I wasn't attacking anyone, I just wasn't quite

> sure exactly what

> > the question was because of the wording. Some

> people call

> > themselves vegetarians and yet they eat fish or

> chickens or

> > whatever. That's who I was referring to. Eating

> " more vegetarian "

> > isn't at all what I was talking about. It's those

> people who claim

> > to live the lifestyle and cheat. Kind of like if a

> person says

> > they're a non-smoker and yet they smoke cigars...

> not the greatest

> > example but close. I'm sorry if that came across

> wrong, I wasn't

> > meaning to attack you. I was getting pretty

> frustrated with the

> > wording in the post I was responding to and

> apparently I didn't

> > word my own post as well as I should have.

> >

> > " diana.platt " <diana.platt@ <diana.platt%40comcast.net>

comcast.net> wrote: I

> think it is good

> > for parents to think about serving their kids more

> > vegetables/vegetarian and it is especially good

> when the children

> > themselves are thinking about improving their

> diet. It is

> > intimidating to try something new; I

> > would like to feel comfortable asking questions

> without feeling like

> > I am a dumb meat-eater trying to fit into some

> elite vegetarian

> > group.

> > This is sometimes how many animal rights groups

> and vegetarian groups

> > come off. I think we make a bad impression when we

> respond to

> > someone who is really trying with sarcasm. Can we

> not just pass

> > information back and forth and leave it at that?

> >

> > I look forward to hearing more ideas and questions

> about feeding my

> > kids vegetarian.

> >

> > @gro <%40>

ups.com, Kadee M

> <abbey_road3012

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > Um... if a person eats meat, they're not a

> vegetarian. If they say

> > they are, they obviously either don't know what

> they're talking about

> > or they're using the " image " as a status symbol or

> something.

> > >

> > > I didn't quite catch the exact question there

> though... if you were

> > referring to a specific person or vegetarians as a

> group.

> > >

> > > Namaska7 wrote: I am

> > confused ... I have seen this before. How can you

> consider yourself

> > to

> > > be vegetarian and you eat meat.

> > > You can say we tend to eat more vegetarian than

> Standard American

> > Diet . But

> > > if you eat flesh you can't be a vegetarian or a

> Vegan.

> > > Help me here if I'm not seeing something ?

> > > Be Well,

> > > Lynda

> > >

> > > ************************************** Get a

> sneak peek of the all-

> > new AOL at

> > > http://discover. <http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour>

aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Kadee Sedtal

> > >

> > > " When you die, if you get a choice between going

> to regular heaven

> > or pie heaven, choose pie heaven. It might be a

> trick, but if it's

> > not, mmmmmmmm, boy. " -Jack Handey

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights

> and hotels with

> > FareChase.

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Kadee Sedtal

> >

> > " When you die, if you get a choice between going

> to

=== message truncated ===

 

Linda

http://triballife. <http://triballife.net/> net/ A Marketplace for a

Better World

 

________

Need a vacation? Get great deals

to amazing places on Travel.

http://travel. <http://travel./> /

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

I don't know if anyone has done a study, but eating is a very emotional issue.

Family events can be so closely tied to traditional foods, many people feel

personal rejecttion when you reject their foods and focus on the difference

rather than focus on being together. The best that we can do is try to educate

our loved ones and remember why we love them and hope that they can accept us

for who we are, not reject us for not being who they wish us to be.

 

RnScarlson <scarlson1 wrote: Has any one ever done any

kind of a study on WHY it seems to bother

people so badly when a family member goes Veggie Or pesci or what ever?

I mean its not like they are killing anyone, or joining some really out

there cult that requires a disconnect of family members.

Recently I am hearing a lot of stuff about families really getting upset

about their relative going veggie. And am starting to get some mild

flack myself. Course my family gave up on me three kids and

homeschooling ago. They Know I am a lost cause.. LOL..

 

General concern out of lack of nutritional education I can see.. but to

the point where it divides a family?? !! Does it bother their conscious?

Are they afraid they are eating wrong? Is this some sort of social

eating thing?

 

Steph

 

" We all want progress, but if you're on the wrong road, progress means

doing an about-turn and walking back to the right road; in that case,

the man who turns back soonest is the most progressive. "

C.S. Lewis

 

 

On

Behalf Of Linda Evans

Tuesday, July 24, 2007 2:38 PM

 

Re: Vegetarian ??

 

Kara,

 

Labels are hard and I wish we didn't need them. It is

difficult when people call themselves vegan and still

eat animal products or vegetarian and eat animals

because then in restaurants or when people are cooking

they think fish is okay for vegetarians or dairy is

okay for vegans. It makes it difficult to know what

is safe for us to eat when people expand the term

vegetarian or vegan. But, I also understand how there

needs to be a term for people who don't eat any

animals besides fish or eat dairy, but not eggs and

other animals. I don't really like these labels

either, but this is what some people use to describe

themselves if they eat fish, but no other animals:

Pescatarian.

 

I applaud you for supporting your children in their

choice to eat fewer animals. A lot of parents would

not be so supportive. Around 10 or so, I decided I

didn't want to eat any mammals, but I continued to eat

chicken, turkey (never really liked fish so I didn't

eat fish). This was some concern to my parents

because I really didn't like vegetables (potatoes,

corn, carrots were my favorites). They didn't expect

it to last long. My mom was very sweet and switched

to turkey burgers and stuff like that.

 

Over the next two years I slowly cut down on the

amount of turkey/chicken and stopped eating animals

all together. I was a young adult when I went vegan.

Over the years, my family has been very supportive and

I appreciate that so much since both my parents came

from farming families and my maternal grandfather was

a butcher for many years and my paternal grandfather a

dairy farmer. Both my parents shared an interest in

my eating and why I decided to not eat animals. They

were both surprised and happy to see my love for

vegetables grow and they saw how varied my diet became

and they have always agreed I was healthier. My

mother would cook vegan food for me when I came to

visit and eventually turned all our family

celebrations into completely veg events. Before my

mother was diagnosed and died of cancer, she was

trying to be vegetarian. My sister has been veg*n off

and on (when she travels to/lives in other countries

she isn't as strict) for several years.

 

My brother is a little annoyed by the whole veg*n

thing, but he's always been a vegetable lover and

understands the health aspects of it and although he

makes remarks he eats the food.

 

My husband went vegan as an adult and did not have a

supportive family. Which you wouldn't think would be

as bad since he didn't live with them, but it still

effects us and he has been vegan around 20 years. His

mother died of cancer and this was enough to get him

to change his diet. His father was on the Ornish diet

for a while because of heart issues, but still puts us

down for our vegan lifestyle. I think his dad still

secretly wishes my husband would start eating meat

again.

 

Sorry, didn't mean to get into all that. I just think

you are a wonderful mom for joining this group and

getting more information and supporting your children!

 

Linda

--- Kara Keeter <karakeeter@cableone <karakeeter%40cableone.net>

..net> wrote:

 

> I thought you were probably referring to me, and I

> just assumed you

> hadn't read my previous posts.

>

> I am not trying to pass myself off as vegetarian. I

> came here

> because I read this was a great resource for

> " parents trying to raise

> vegetarian kids " not necessarily " vegetarian parents

> trying to raise

> kids " . Subtle difference. I am not vegetarian, but

> after reading

> " Charlotte's Web " my kids decided they no longer

> wanted to eat meat.

> I am trying to support them in that, and to learn as

> much as possible

> about providing a healthy diet - otherwise, their

> version of " not

> eating meat " would be, skip the meat, still no

> veggies, let's just

> eat bread and dessert!

>

> So I guess the term " vegetarian " may not be

> appropriate for what they

> are doing, since they are willing to eat fish (I

> assume it was the

> sushi post you were responding to?). I thought

> there is a form of

> vegetarianism that allows not only dairy but also

> fish. I dated a

> guy for several years who called himself a

> vegetarian, but he would

> eat fish. His reasons for his choices were to eat

> low on the food

> chain, and to eat things with few or no brain cells.

> (His words, not

> mine.) In our group were also two people who kept

> strict kosher, and

> a couple who were strictly vegan, and several

> omnivores including

> me. We would get together regularly for dinners at

> each other's

> houses, everyone was accommodated and no one judged

> or tried to

> convert another. (And no one was expected to

> prepare food they were

> opposed to! The kosher and vegan utensils were

> never allowed to

> touch the omnivore utensils.)

>

> I am not trying to get my children to do anything

> other than eat

> healthy, but I am very proud of their not wanting to

> eat the things

> that in their 5-year-old minds are animals. I

> applaud their

> determination, I thought it would only last a week

> or so and then

> they would want their hamburgers and chicken nuggets

> again. I wish I

> had their willpower. Their choice is influencing

> our whole family to

> eat more environmentally-friendly. We aren't doing

> as well as

> vegans, and I'm not trying to claim we are.

>

> If there is a term for someone who eats fish and

> dairy (no poultry)

> let me know.

>

> I appreciate everyone's support here, and

> willingness to answer my

> questions. Thank you for acknowledging our efforts,

> even if we

> haven't gotten as far as you have.

>

> Cheers,

> -Kara

>

> On Jul 24, 2007, at 12:11 PM, Kadee M wrote:

>

> > I wasn't attacking anyone, I just wasn't quite

> sure exactly what

> > the question was because of the wording. Some

> people call

> > themselves vegetarians and yet they eat fish or

> chickens or

> > whatever. That's who I was referring to. Eating

> " more vegetarian "

> > isn't at all what I was talking about. It's those

> people who claim

> > to live the lifestyle and cheat. Kind of like if a

> person says

> > they're a non-smoker and yet they smoke cigars...

> not the greatest

> > example but close. I'm sorry if that came across

> wrong, I wasn't

> > meaning to attack you. I was getting pretty

> frustrated with the

> > wording in the post I was responding to and

> apparently I didn't

> > word my own post as well as I should have.

> >

> > " diana.platt " <diana.platt@ <diana.platt%40comcast.net>

comcast.net> wrote: I

> think it is good

> > for parents to think about serving their kids more

> > vegetables/vegetarian and it is especially good

> when the children

> > themselves are thinking about improving their

> diet. It is

> > intimidating to try something new; I

> > would like to feel comfortable asking questions

> without feeling like

> > I am a dumb meat-eater trying to fit into some

> elite vegetarian

> > group.

> > This is sometimes how many animal rights groups

> and vegetarian groups

> > come off. I think we make a bad impression when we

> respond to

> > someone who is really trying with sarcasm. Can we

> not just pass

> > information back and forth and leave it at that?

> >

> > I look forward to hearing more ideas and questions

> about feeding my

> > kids vegetarian.

> >

> > @gro <%40>

ups.com, Kadee M

> <abbey_road3012

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > Um... if a person eats meat, they're not a

> vegetarian. If they say

> > they are, they obviously either don't know what

> they're talking about

> > or they're using the " image " as a status symbol or

> something.

> > >

> > > I didn't quite catch the exact question there

> though... if you were

> > referring to a specific person or vegetarians as a

> group.

> > >

> > > Namaska7 wrote: I am

> > confused ... I have seen this before. How can you

> consider yourself

> > to

> > > be vegetarian and you eat meat.

> > > You can say we tend to eat more vegetarian than

> Standard American

> > Diet . But

> > > if you eat flesh you can't be a vegetarian or a

> Vegan.

> > > Help me here if I'm not seeing something ?

> > > Be Well,

> > > Lynda

> > >

> > > ************************************** Get a

> sneak peek of the all-

> > new AOL at

> > > http://discover. <http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour>

aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Kadee Sedtal

> > >

> > > " When you die, if you get a choice between going

> to regular heaven

> > or pie heaven, choose pie heaven. It might be a

> trick, but if it's

> > not, mmmmmmmm, boy. " -Jack Handey

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights

> and hotels with

> > FareChase.

> > >

> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Kadee Sedtal

> >

> > " When you die, if you get a choice between going

> to

=== message truncated ===

 

Linda

http://triballife. <http://triballife.net/> net/ A Marketplace for a

Better World

 

________

Need a vacation? Get great deals

to amazing places on Travel.

http://travel. <http://travel./> /

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

I think when you're doing something outside the " norm " people get

upset or look at you differently. My sister didn't get her last

child baptised because she and her husband have had a change of

heart with the Catholic religion (due to recent events) and her

mother-in-law (a strict Catholic) won't let up on them and their son

is 2 1/2!! Plus they all went veggie 3 years ago and they still get

comments.

 

I know my family is understanding, but they're a big Polish and

German food family so when there's a get together they're proud of

their latest dish and we get the " oh, but you can't eat this " and

they're disappointed.

 

I think what you eat is almost like what religion you are, or race,

etc. It defines you and vegetarians aren't usually looked at

favorably. We're not looked at like we're saving animals' lives and

the environment. We're looked at like we're trying to take

something away from them or we're saying they're bad. My mom loves

animals and has her whole kitchen decorated in cows. Yet when I

make a comment about her eating them she almost gets in tears.

People don't like to be different and those that are are always

looked at negatively (by most).

 

It's sad, but someday we'll all be accepted.

 

Tonia

 

 

, " RnScarlson " <scarlson1

wrote:

>

> Has any one ever done any kind of a study on WHY it seems to bother

> people so badly when a family member goes Veggie Or pesci or what

ever?

> I mean its not like they are killing anyone, or joining some

really out

> there cult that requires a disconnect of family members.

> Recently I am hearing a lot of stuff about families really getting

upset

> about their relative going veggie. And am starting to get some mild

> flack myself. Course my family gave up on me three kids and

> homeschooling ago. They Know I am a lost cause.. LOL..

>

> General concern out of lack of nutritional education I can see..

but to

> the point where it divides a family?? !! Does it bother their

conscious?

> Are they afraid they are eating wrong? Is this some sort of social

> eating thing?

>

> Steph

>

> " We all want progress, but if you're on the wrong road, progress

means

> doing an about-turn and walking back to the right road; in that

case,

> the man who turns back soonest is the most progressive. "

> C.S. Lewis

>

>

>

On

> Behalf Of Linda Evans

> Tuesday, July 24, 2007 2:38 PM

>

> Re: Vegetarian ??

>

> Kara,

>

> Labels are hard and I wish we didn't need them. It is

> difficult when people call themselves vegan and still

> eat animal products or vegetarian and eat animals

> because then in restaurants or when people are cooking

> they think fish is okay for vegetarians or dairy is

> okay for vegans. It makes it difficult to know what

> is safe for us to eat when people expand the term

> vegetarian or vegan. But, I also understand how there

> needs to be a term for people who don't eat any

> animals besides fish or eat dairy, but not eggs and

> other animals. I don't really like these labels

> either, but this is what some people use to describe

> themselves if they eat fish, but no other animals:

> Pescatarian.

>

> I applaud you for supporting your children in their

> choice to eat fewer animals. A lot of parents would

> not be so supportive. Around 10 or so, I decided I

> didn't want to eat any mammals, but I continued to eat

> chicken, turkey (never really liked fish so I didn't

> eat fish). This was some concern to my parents

> because I really didn't like vegetables (potatoes,

> corn, carrots were my favorites). They didn't expect

> it to last long. My mom was very sweet and switched

> to turkey burgers and stuff like that.

>

> Over the next two years I slowly cut down on the

> amount of turkey/chicken and stopped eating animals

> all together. I was a young adult when I went vegan.

> Over the years, my family has been very supportive and

> I appreciate that so much since both my parents came

> from farming families and my maternal grandfather was

> a butcher for many years and my paternal grandfather a

> dairy farmer. Both my parents shared an interest in

> my eating and why I decided to not eat animals. They

> were both surprised and happy to see my love for

> vegetables grow and they saw how varied my diet became

> and they have always agreed I was healthier. My

> mother would cook vegan food for me when I came to

> visit and eventually turned all our family

> celebrations into completely veg events. Before my

> mother was diagnosed and died of cancer, she was

> trying to be vegetarian. My sister has been veg*n off

> and on (when she travels to/lives in other countries

> she isn't as strict) for several years.

>

> My brother is a little annoyed by the whole veg*n

> thing, but he's always been a vegetable lover and

> understands the health aspects of it and although he

> makes remarks he eats the food.

>

> My husband went vegan as an adult and did not have a

> supportive family. Which you wouldn't think would be

> as bad since he didn't live with them, but it still

> effects us and he has been vegan around 20 years. His

> mother died of cancer and this was enough to get him

> to change his diet. His father was on the Ornish diet

> for a while because of heart issues, but still puts us

> down for our vegan lifestyle. I think his dad still

> secretly wishes my husband would start eating meat

> again.

>

> Sorry, didn't mean to get into all that. I just think

> you are a wonderful mom for joining this group and

> getting more information and supporting your children!

>

>

> Linda

> --- Kara Keeter <karakeeter@cableone <karakeeter%

40cableone.net>

> .net> wrote:

>

> > I thought you were probably referring to me, and I

> > just assumed you

> > hadn't read my previous posts.

> >

> > I am not trying to pass myself off as vegetarian. I

> > came here

> > because I read this was a great resource for

> > " parents trying to raise

> > vegetarian kids " not necessarily " vegetarian parents

> > trying to raise

> > kids " . Subtle difference. I am not vegetarian, but

> > after reading

> > " Charlotte's Web " my kids decided they no longer

> > wanted to eat meat.

> > I am trying to support them in that, and to learn as

> > much as possible

> > about providing a healthy diet - otherwise, their

> > version of " not

> > eating meat " would be, skip the meat, still no

> > veggies, let's just

> > eat bread and dessert!

> >

> > So I guess the term " vegetarian " may not be

> > appropriate for what they

> > are doing, since they are willing to eat fish (I

> > assume it was the

> > sushi post you were responding to?). I thought

> > there is a form of

> > vegetarianism that allows not only dairy but also

> > fish. I dated a

> > guy for several years who called himself a

> > vegetarian, but he would

> > eat fish. His reasons for his choices were to eat

> > low on the food

> > chain, and to eat things with few or no brain cells.

> > (His words, not

> > mine.) In our group were also two people who kept

> > strict kosher, and

> > a couple who were strictly vegan, and several

> > omnivores including

> > me. We would get together regularly for dinners at

> > each other's

> > houses, everyone was accommodated and no one judged

> > or tried to

> > convert another. (And no one was expected to

> > prepare food they were

> > opposed to! The kosher and vegan utensils were

> > never allowed to

> > touch the omnivore utensils.)

> >

> > I am not trying to get my children to do anything

> > other than eat

> > healthy, but I am very proud of their not wanting to

> > eat the things

> > that in their 5-year-old minds are animals. I

> > applaud their

> > determination, I thought it would only last a week

> > or so and then

> > they would want their hamburgers and chicken nuggets

> > again. I wish I

> > had their willpower. Their choice is influencing

> > our whole family to

> > eat more environmentally-friendly. We aren't doing

> > as well as

> > vegans, and I'm not trying to claim we are.

> >

> > If there is a term for someone who eats fish and

> > dairy (no poultry)

> > let me know.

> >

> > I appreciate everyone's support here, and

> > willingness to answer my

> > questions. Thank you for acknowledging our efforts,

> > even if we

> > haven't gotten as far as you have.

> >

> > Cheers,

> > -Kara

> >

> > On Jul 24, 2007, at 12:11 PM, Kadee M wrote:

> >

> > > I wasn't attacking anyone, I just wasn't quite

> > sure exactly what

> > > the question was because of the wording. Some

> > people call

> > > themselves vegetarians and yet they eat fish or

> > chickens or

> > > whatever. That's who I was referring to. Eating

> > " more vegetarian "

> > > isn't at all what I was talking about. It's those

> > people who claim

> > > to live the lifestyle and cheat. Kind of like if a

> > person says

> > > they're a non-smoker and yet they smoke cigars...

> > not the greatest

> > > example but close. I'm sorry if that came across

> > wrong, I wasn't

> > > meaning to attack you. I was getting pretty

> > frustrated with the

> > > wording in the post I was responding to and

> > apparently I didn't

> > > word my own post as well as I should have.

> > >

> > > " diana.platt " <diana.platt@ <diana.platt%40comcast.net>

> comcast.net> wrote: I

> > think it is good

> > > for parents to think about serving their kids more

> > > vegetables/vegetarian and it is especially good

> > when the children

> > > themselves are thinking about improving their

> > diet. It is

> > > intimidating to try something new; I

> > > would like to feel comfortable asking questions

> > without feeling like

> > > I am a dumb meat-eater trying to fit into some

> > elite vegetarian

> > > group.

> > > This is sometimes how many animal rights groups

> > and vegetarian groups

> > > come off. I think we make a bad impression when we

> > respond to

> > > someone who is really trying with sarcasm. Can we

> > not just pass

> > > information back and forth and leave it at that?

> > >

> > > I look forward to hearing more ideas and questions

> > about feeding my

> > > kids vegetarian.

> > >

> > > @gro <%

40>

> ups.com, Kadee M

> > <abbey_road3012@>

> > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Um... if a person eats meat, they're not a

> > vegetarian. If they say

> > > they are, they obviously either don't know what

> > they're talking about

> > > or they're using the " image " as a status symbol or

> > something.

> > > >

> > > > I didn't quite catch the exact question there

> > though... if you were

> > > referring to a specific person or vegetarians as a

> > group.

> > > >

> > > > Namaska7@ wrote: I am

> > > confused ... I have seen this before. How can you

> > consider yourself

> > > to

> > > > be vegetarian and you eat meat.

> > > > You can say we tend to eat more vegetarian than

> > Standard American

> > > Diet . But

> > > > if you eat flesh you can't be a vegetarian or a

> > Vegan.

> > > > Help me here if I'm not seeing something ?

> > > > Be Well,

> > > > Lynda

> > > >

> > > > ************************************** Get a

> > sneak peek of the all-

> > > new AOL at

> > > > http://discover. <http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour>

> aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

> > > >

> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Kadee Sedtal

> > > >

> > > > " When you die, if you get a choice between going

> > to regular heaven

> > > or pie heaven, choose pie heaven. It might be a

> > trick, but if it's

> > > not, mmmmmmmm, boy. " -Jack Handey

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights

> > and hotels with

> > > FareChase.

> > > >

> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Kadee Sedtal

> > >

> > > " When you die, if you get a choice between going

> > to

> === message truncated ===

>

> Linda

> http://triballife. <http://triballife.net/> net/ A Marketplace for

a

> Better World

>

> ________

> Need a vacation? Get great deals

> to amazing places on Travel.

> http://travel. <http://travel./> /

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I think most people shy away from things that they don't understand. My husband

and I

are the only veggie's on my side of the family. I have been told so many times

that " we

can get salad anywhere " , so it's okay for them to plan family outings at steak

houses. This

has caused much turmoil, because they don't realize that they are making us feel

unwelcome, and they are almost never willing to come to functions that we host

because

they think they'll be served something weird. We've come to accept that we will

never be

taken into consideration for any family gathering, as we are the minority. It

is sad that

this has influenced our decision in where to spend holiday's and such, because

frankly we

just got tired of having to cook all day simply to enjoy a meal at someone

else's house.

 

Regards,

Merette

, " RnScarlson " <scarlson1 wrote:

>

> Has any one ever done any kind of a study on WHY it seems to bother

> people so badly when a family member goes Veggie Or pesci or what ever?

> I mean its not like they are killing anyone, or joining some really out

> there cult that requires a disconnect of family members.

> Recently I am hearing a lot of stuff about families really getting upset

> about their relative going veggie. And am starting to get some mild

> flack myself. Course my family gave up on me three kids and

> homeschooling ago. They Know I am a lost cause.. LOL..

>

> General concern out of lack of nutritional education I can see.. but to

> the point where it divides a family?? !! Does it bother their conscious?

> Are they afraid they are eating wrong? Is this some sort of social

> eating thing?

>

> Steph

>

> " We all want progress, but if you're on the wrong road, progress means

> doing an about-turn and walking back to the right road; in that case,

> the man who turns back soonest is the most progressive. "

> C.S. Lewis

>

>

> On

> Behalf Of Linda Evans

> Tuesday, July 24, 2007 2:38 PM

>

> Re: Vegetarian ??

>

> Kara,

>

> Labels are hard and I wish we didn't need them. It is

> difficult when people call themselves vegan and still

> eat animal products or vegetarian and eat animals

> because then in restaurants or when people are cooking

> they think fish is okay for vegetarians or dairy is

> okay for vegans. It makes it difficult to know what

> is safe for us to eat when people expand the term

> vegetarian or vegan. But, I also understand how there

> needs to be a term for people who don't eat any

> animals besides fish or eat dairy, but not eggs and

> other animals. I don't really like these labels

> either, but this is what some people use to describe

> themselves if they eat fish, but no other animals:

> Pescatarian.

>

> I applaud you for supporting your children in their

> choice to eat fewer animals. A lot of parents would

> not be so supportive. Around 10 or so, I decided I

> didn't want to eat any mammals, but I continued to eat

> chicken, turkey (never really liked fish so I didn't

> eat fish). This was some concern to my parents

> because I really didn't like vegetables (potatoes,

> corn, carrots were my favorites). They didn't expect

> it to last long. My mom was very sweet and switched

> to turkey burgers and stuff like that.

>

> Over the next two years I slowly cut down on the

> amount of turkey/chicken and stopped eating animals

> all together. I was a young adult when I went vegan.

> Over the years, my family has been very supportive and

> I appreciate that so much since both my parents came

> from farming families and my maternal grandfather was

> a butcher for many years and my paternal grandfather a

> dairy farmer. Both my parents shared an interest in

> my eating and why I decided to not eat animals. They

> were both surprised and happy to see my love for

> vegetables grow and they saw how varied my diet became

> and they have always agreed I was healthier. My

> mother would cook vegan food for me when I came to

> visit and eventually turned all our family

> celebrations into completely veg events. Before my

> mother was diagnosed and died of cancer, she was

> trying to be vegetarian. My sister has been veg*n off

> and on (when she travels to/lives in other countries

> she isn't as strict) for several years.

>

> My brother is a little annoyed by the whole veg*n

> thing, but he's always been a vegetable lover and

> understands the health aspects of it and although he

> makes remarks he eats the food.

>

> My husband went vegan as an adult and did not have a

> supportive family. Which you wouldn't think would be

> as bad since he didn't live with them, but it still

> effects us and he has been vegan around 20 years. His

> mother died of cancer and this was enough to get him

> to change his diet. His father was on the Ornish diet

> for a while because of heart issues, but still puts us

> down for our vegan lifestyle. I think his dad still

> secretly wishes my husband would start eating meat

> again.

>

> Sorry, didn't mean to get into all that. I just think

> you are a wonderful mom for joining this group and

> getting more information and supporting your children!

>

>

> Linda

> --- Kara Keeter <karakeeter@cableone <karakeeter%40cableone.net>

> .net> wrote:

>

> > I thought you were probably referring to me, and I

> > just assumed you

> > hadn't read my previous posts.

> >

> > I am not trying to pass myself off as vegetarian. I

> > came here

> > because I read this was a great resource for

> > " parents trying to raise

> > vegetarian kids " not necessarily " vegetarian parents

> > trying to raise

> > kids " . Subtle difference. I am not vegetarian, but

> > after reading

> > " Charlotte's Web " my kids decided they no longer

> > wanted to eat meat.

> > I am trying to support them in that, and to learn as

> > much as possible

> > about providing a healthy diet - otherwise, their

> > version of " not

> > eating meat " would be, skip the meat, still no

> > veggies, let's just

> > eat bread and dessert!

> >

> > So I guess the term " vegetarian " may not be

> > appropriate for what they

> > are doing, since they are willing to eat fish (I

> > assume it was the

> > sushi post you were responding to?). I thought

> > there is a form of

> > vegetarianism that allows not only dairy but also

> > fish. I dated a

> > guy for several years who called himself a

> > vegetarian, but he would

> > eat fish. His reasons for his choices were to eat

> > low on the food

> > chain, and to eat things with few or no brain cells.

> > (His words, not

> > mine.) In our group were also two people who kept

> > strict kosher, and

> > a couple who were strictly vegan, and several

> > omnivores including

> > me. We would get together regularly for dinners at

> > each other's

> > houses, everyone was accommodated and no one judged

> > or tried to

> > convert another. (And no one was expected to

> > prepare food they were

> > opposed to! The kosher and vegan utensils were

> > never allowed to

> > touch the omnivore utensils.)

> >

> > I am not trying to get my children to do anything

> > other than eat

> > healthy, but I am very proud of their not wanting to

> > eat the things

> > that in their 5-year-old minds are animals. I

> > applaud their

> > determination, I thought it would only last a week

> > or so and then

> > they would want their hamburgers and chicken nuggets

> > again. I wish I

> > had their willpower. Their choice is influencing

> > our whole family to

> > eat more environmentally-friendly. We aren't doing

> > as well as

> > vegans, and I'm not trying to claim we are.

> >

> > If there is a term for someone who eats fish and

> > dairy (no poultry)

> > let me know.

> >

> > I appreciate everyone's support here, and

> > willingness to answer my

> > questions. Thank you for acknowledging our efforts,

> > even if we

> > haven't gotten as far as you have.

> >

> > Cheers,

> > -Kara

> >

> > On Jul 24, 2007, at 12:11 PM, Kadee M wrote:

> >

> > > I wasn't attacking anyone, I just wasn't quite

> > sure exactly what

> > > the question was because of the wording. Some

> > people call

> > > themselves vegetarians and yet they eat fish or

> > chickens or

> > > whatever. That's who I was referring to. Eating

> > " more vegetarian "

> > > isn't at all what I was talking about. It's those

> > people who claim

> > > to live the lifestyle and cheat. Kind of like if a

> > person says

> > > they're a non-smoker and yet they smoke cigars...

> > not the greatest

> > > example but close. I'm sorry if that came across

> > wrong, I wasn't

> > > meaning to attack you. I was getting pretty

> > frustrated with the

> > > wording in the post I was responding to and

> > apparently I didn't

> > > word my own post as well as I should have.

> > >

> > > " diana.platt " <diana.platt@ <diana.platt%40comcast.net>

> comcast.net> wrote: I

> > think it is good

> > > for parents to think about serving their kids more

> > > vegetables/vegetarian and it is especially good

> > when the children

> > > themselves are thinking about improving their

> > diet. It is

> > > intimidating to try something new; I

> > > would like to feel comfortable asking questions

> > without feeling like

> > > I am a dumb meat-eater trying to fit into some

> > elite vegetarian

> > > group.

> > > This is sometimes how many animal rights groups

> > and vegetarian groups

> > > come off. I think we make a bad impression when we

> > respond to

> > > someone who is really trying with sarcasm. Can we

> > not just pass

> > > information back and forth and leave it at that?

> > >

> > > I look forward to hearing more ideas and questions

> > about feeding my

> > > kids vegetarian.

> > >

> > > @gro <%40>

> ups.com, Kadee M

> > <abbey_road3012@>

> > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Um... if a person eats meat, they're not a

> > vegetarian. If they say

> > > they are, they obviously either don't know what

> > they're talking about

> > > or they're using the " image " as a status symbol or

> > something.

> > > >

> > > > I didn't quite catch the exact question there

> > though... if you were

> > > referring to a specific person or vegetarians as a

> > group.

> > > >

> > > > Namaska7@ wrote: I am

> > > confused ... I have seen this before. How can you

> > consider yourself

> > > to

> > > > be vegetarian and you eat meat.

> > > > You can say we tend to eat more vegetarian than

> > Standard American

> > > Diet . But

> > > > if you eat flesh you can't be a vegetarian or a

> > Vegan.

> > > > Help me here if I'm not seeing something ?

> > > > Be Well,

> > > > Lynda

> > > >

> > > > ************************************** Get a

> > sneak peek of the all-

> > > new AOL at

> > > > http://discover. <http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour>

> aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

> > > >

> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Kadee Sedtal

> > > >

> > > > " When you die, if you get a choice between going

> > to regular heaven

> > > or pie heaven, choose pie heaven. It might be a

> > trick, but if it's

> > > not, mmmmmmmm, boy. " -Jack Handey

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights

> > and hotels with

> > > FareChase.

> > > >

> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Kadee Sedtal

> > >

> > > " When you die, if you get a choice between going

> > to

> === message truncated ===

>

> Linda

> http://triballife. <http://triballife.net/> net/ A Marketplace for a

> Better World

>

> ________

> Need a vacation? Get great deals

> to amazing places on Travel.

> http://travel. <http://travel./> /

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I'll say one good thing about steakhouses- check out their side items. Anybody

can cook up a slab of cow carcass. What makes one steakhouse better than another

is the other stuff. Saltgrass has the absolute, 100%, hands-down best sweet

potatoes EVER. Texas Roadhouse has these rolls and butter that are to die for. I

actually like going to those places because they often have more veg options

than a lot of other places! I just have the waiter leave one of the menus and I

stand it up so I can't see my husband's plate. Everybody's happy! He never

orders meat if the kids are with us.

 

nymusicgirl <bluebeetle_1 wrote: I

think most people shy away from things that they don't understand. My husband

and I

are the only veggie's on my side of the family. I have been told so many times

that " we

can get salad anywhere " , so it's okay for them to plan family outings at steak

houses. This

has caused much turmoil, because they don't realize that they are making us

feel

unwelcome, and they are almost never willing to come to functions that we host

because

they think they'll be served something weird. We've come to accept that we

will never be

taken into consideration for any family gathering, as we are the minority. It

is sad that

this has influenced our decision in where to spend holiday's and such, because

frankly we

just got tired of having to cook all day simply to enjoy a meal at someone

else's house.

 

Regards,

Merette

, " RnScarlson " <scarlson1 wrote:

>

> Has any one ever done any kind of a study on WHY it seems to bother

> people so badly when a family member goes Veggie Or pesci or what ever?

> I mean its not like they are killing anyone, or joining some really out

> there cult that requires a disconnect of family members.

> Recently I am hearing a lot of stuff about families really getting upset

> about their relative going veggie. And am starting to get some mild

> flack myself. Course my family gave up on me three kids and

> homeschooling ago. They Know I am a lost cause.. LOL..

>

> General concern out of lack of nutritional education I can see.. but to

> the point where it divides a family?? !! Does it bother their conscious?

> Are they afraid they are eating wrong? Is this some sort of social

> eating thing?

>

> Steph

>

> " We all want progress, but if you're on the wrong road, progress means

> doing an about-turn and walking back to the right road; in that case,

> the man who turns back soonest is the most progressive. "

> C.S. Lewis

>

>

> On

> Behalf Of Linda Evans

> Tuesday, July 24, 2007 2:38 PM

>

> Re: Vegetarian ??

>

> Kara,

>

> Labels are hard and I wish we didn't need them. It is

> difficult when people call themselves vegan and still

> eat animal products or vegetarian and eat animals

> because then in restaurants or when people are cooking

> they think fish is okay for vegetarians or dairy is

> okay for vegans. It makes it difficult to know what

> is safe for us to eat when people expand the term

> vegetarian or vegan. But, I also understand how there

> needs to be a term for people who don't eat any

> animals besides fish or eat dairy, but not eggs and

> other animals. I don't really like these labels

> either, but this is what some people use to describe

> themselves if they eat fish, but no other animals:

> Pescatarian.

>

> I applaud you for supporting your children in their

> choice to eat fewer animals. A lot of parents would

> not be so supportive. Around 10 or so, I decided I

> didn't want to eat any mammals, but I continued to eat

> chicken, turkey (never really liked fish so I didn't

> eat fish). This was some concern to my parents

> because I really didn't like vegetables (potatoes,

> corn, carrots were my favorites). They didn't expect

> it to last long. My mom was very sweet and switched

> to turkey burgers and stuff like that.

>

> Over the next two years I slowly cut down on the

> amount of turkey/chicken and stopped eating animals

> all together. I was a young adult when I went vegan.

> Over the years, my family has been very supportive and

> I appreciate that so much since both my parents came

> from farming families and my maternal grandfather was

> a butcher for many years and my paternal grandfather a

> dairy farmer. Both my parents shared an interest in

> my eating and why I decided to not eat animals. They

> were both surprised and happy to see my love for

> vegetables grow and they saw how varied my diet became

> and they have always agreed I was healthier. My

> mother would cook vegan food for me when I came to

> visit and eventually turned all our family

> celebrations into completely veg events. Before my

> mother was diagnosed and died of cancer, she was

> trying to be vegetarian. My sister has been veg*n off

> and on (when she travels to/lives in other countries

> she isn't as strict) for several years.

>

> My brother is a little annoyed by the whole veg*n

> thing, but he's always been a vegetable lover and

> understands the health aspects of it and although he

> makes remarks he eats the food.

>

> My husband went vegan as an adult and did not have a

> supportive family. Which you wouldn't think would be

> as bad since he didn't live with them, but it still

> effects us and he has been vegan around 20 years. His

> mother died of cancer and this was enough to get him

> to change his diet. His father was on the Ornish diet

> for a while because of heart issues, but still puts us

> down for our vegan lifestyle. I think his dad still

> secretly wishes my husband would start eating meat

> again.

>

> Sorry, didn't mean to get into all that. I just think

> you are a wonderful mom for joining this group and

> getting more information and supporting your children!

>

>

> Linda

> --- Kara Keeter <karakeeter@cableone <karakeeter%40cableone.net>

> .net> wrote:

>

> > I thought you were probably referring to me, and I

> > just assumed you

> > hadn't read my previous posts.

> >

> > I am not trying to pass myself off as vegetarian. I

> > came here

> > because I read this was a great resource for

> > " parents trying to raise

> > vegetarian kids " not necessarily " vegetarian parents

> > trying to raise

> > kids " . Subtle difference. I am not vegetarian, but

> > after reading

> > " Charlotte's Web " my kids decided they no longer

> > wanted to eat meat.

> > I am trying to support them in that, and to learn as

> > much as possible

> > about providing a healthy diet - otherwise, their

> > version of " not

> > eating meat " would be, skip the meat, still no

> > veggies, let's just

> > eat bread and dessert!

> >

> > So I guess the term " vegetarian " may not be

> > appropriate for what they

> > are doing, since they are willing to eat fish (I

> > assume it was the

> > sushi post you were responding to?). I thought

> > there is a form of

> > vegetarianism that allows not only dairy but also

> > fish. I dated a

> > guy for several years who called himself a

> > vegetarian, but he would

> > eat fish. His reasons for his choices were to eat

> > low on the food

> > chain, and to eat things with few or no brain cells.

> > (His words, not

> > mine.) In our group were also two people who kept

> > strict kosher, and

> > a couple who were strictly vegan, and several

> > omnivores including

> > me. We would get together regularly for dinners at

> > each other's

> > houses, everyone was accommodated and no one judged

> > or tried to

> > convert another. (And no one was expected to

> > prepare food they were

> > opposed to! The kosher and vegan utensils were

> > never allowed to

> > touch the omnivore utensils.)

> >

> > I am not trying to get my children to do anything

> > other than eat

> > healthy, but I am very proud of their not wanting to

> > eat the things

> > that in their 5-year-old minds are animals. I

> > applaud their

> > determination, I thought it would only last a week

> > or so and then

> > they would want their hamburgers and chicken nuggets

> > again. I wish I

> > had their willpower. Their choice is influencing

> > our whole family to

> > eat more environmentally-friendly. We aren't doing

> > as well as

> > vegans, and I'm not trying to claim we are.

> >

> > If there is a term for someone who eats fish and

> > dairy (no poultry)

> > let me know.

> >

> > I appreciate everyone's support here, and

> > willingness to answer my

> > questions. Thank you for acknowledging our efforts,

> > even if we

> > haven't gotten as far as you have.

> >

> > Cheers,

> > -Kara

> >

> > On Jul 24, 2007, at 12:11 PM, Kadee M wrote:

> >

> > > I wasn't attacking anyone, I just wasn't quite

> > sure exactly what

> > > the question was because of the wording. Some

> > people call

> > > themselves vegetarians and yet they eat fish or

> > chickens or

> > > whatever. That's who I was referring to. Eating

> > " more vegetarian "

> > > isn't at all what I was talking about. It's those

> > people who claim

> > > to live the lifestyle and cheat. Kind of like if a

> > person says

> > > they're a non-smoker and yet they smoke cigars...

> > not the greatest

> > > example but close. I'm sorry if that came across

> > wrong, I wasn't

> > > meaning to attack you. I was getting pretty

> > frustrated with the

> > > wording in the post I was responding to and

> > apparently I didn't

> > > word my own post as well as I should have.

> > >

> > > " diana.platt " <diana.platt@ <diana.platt%40comcast.net>

> comcast.net> wrote: I

> > think it is good

> > > for parents to think about serving their kids more

> > > vegetables/vegetarian and it is especially good

> > when the children

> > > themselves are thinking about improving their

> > diet. It is

> > > intimidating to try something new; I

> > > would like to feel comfortable asking questions

> > without feeling like

> > > I am a dumb meat-eater trying to fit into some

> > elite vegetarian

> > > group.

> > > This is sometimes how many animal rights groups

> > and vegetarian groups

> > > come off. I think we make a bad impression when we

> > respond to

> > > someone who is really trying with sarcasm. Can we

> > not just pass

> > > information back and forth and leave it at that?

> > >

> > > I look forward to hearing more ideas and questions

> > about feeding my

> > > kids vegetarian.

> > >

> > > @gro <%40>

> ups.com, Kadee M

> > <abbey_road3012@>

> > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Um... if a person eats meat, they're not a

> > vegetarian. If they say

> > > they are, they obviously either don't know what

> > they're talking about

> > > or they're using the " image " as a status symbol or

> > something.

> > > >

> > > > I didn't quite catch the exact question there

> > though... if you were

> > > referring to a specific person or vegetarians as a

> > group.

> > > >

> > > > Namaska7@ wrote: I am

> > > confused ... I have seen this before. How can you

> > consider yourself

> > > to

> > > > be vegetarian and you eat meat.

> > > > You can say we tend to eat more vegetarian than

> > Standard American

> > > Diet . But

> > > > if you eat flesh you can't be a vegetarian or a

> > Vegan.

> > > > Help me here if I'm not seeing something ?

> > > > Be Well,

> > > > Lynda

> > > >

> > > > ************************************** Get a

> > sneak peek of the all-

> > > new AOL at

> > > > http://discover. <http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour>

> aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

> > > >

> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Kadee Sedtal

> > > >

> > > > " When you die, if you get a choice between going

> > to regular heaven

> > > or pie heaven, choose pie heaven. It might be a

> > trick, but if it's

> > > not, mmmmmmmm, boy. " -Jack Handey

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights

> > and hotels with

> > > FareChase.

> > > >

> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Kadee Sedtal

> > >

> > > " When you die, if you get a choice between going

> > to

> === message truncated ===

>

> Linda

> http://triballife. <http://triballife.net/> net/ A Marketplace for a

> Better World

>

> ________

> Need a vacation? Get great deals

> to amazing places on Travel.

> http://travel. <http://travel./> /

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I've always felt that if someone chooses a steakhouse as a good place to invite

me to eat, then that person is being inconsiderate. There are sooooo many

places that I can have a real meal - try mexican, italian, japanese, etc. And I

can't imagine having to put up a barrier so I wouldn't have to see someone's

meal. Also, I do not believe in financially supporting steakhouses.

 

Kadee M <abbey_road3012 wrote: I'll say one good thing about

steakhouses- check out their side items. Anybody can cook up a slab of cow

carcass. What makes one steakhouse better than another is the other stuff.

Saltgrass has the absolute, 100%, hands-down best sweet potatoes EVER. Texas

Roadhouse has these rolls and butter that are to die for. I actually like going

to those places because they often have more veg options than a lot of other

places! I just have the waiter leave one of the menus and I stand it up so I

can't see my husband's plate. Everybody's happy! He never orders meat if the

kids are with us.

 

nymusicgirl <bluebeetle_1 wrote: I think most people shy away from

things that they don't understand. My husband and I

are the only veggie's on my side of the family. I have been told so many times

that " we

can get salad anywhere " , so it's okay for them to plan family outings at steak

houses. This

has caused much turmoil, because they don't realize that they are making us feel

unwelcome, and they are almost never willing to come to functions that we host

because

they think they'll be served something weird. We've come to accept that we will

never be

taken into consideration for any family gathering, as we are the minority. It is

sad that

this has influenced our decision in where to spend holiday's and such, because

frankly we

just got tired of having to cook all day simply to enjoy a meal at someone

else's house.

 

Regards,

Merette

, " RnScarlson " <scarlson1 wrote:

>

> Has any one ever done any kind of a study on WHY it seems to bother

> people so badly when a family member goes Veggie Or pesci or what ever?

> I mean its not like they are killing anyone, or joining some really out

> there cult that requires a disconnect of family members.

> Recently I am hearing a lot of stuff about families really getting upset

> about their relative going veggie. And am starting to get some mild

> flack myself. Course my family gave up on me three kids and

> homeschooling ago. They Know I am a lost cause.. LOL..

>

> General concern out of lack of nutritional education I can see.. but to

> the point where it divides a family?? !! Does it bother their conscious?

> Are they afraid they are eating wrong? Is this some sort of social

> eating thing?

>

> Steph

>

> " We all want progress, but if you're on the wrong road, progress means

> doing an about-turn and walking back to the right road; in that case,

> the man who turns back soonest is the most progressive. "

> C.S. Lewis

>

>

> On

> Behalf Of Linda Evans

> Tuesday, July 24, 2007 2:38 PM

>

> Re: Vegetarian ??

>

> Kara,

>

> Labels are hard and I wish we didn't need them. It is

> difficult when people call themselves vegan and still

> eat animal products or vegetarian and eat animals

> because then in restaurants or when people are cooking

> they think fish is okay for vegetarians or dairy is

> okay for vegans. It makes it difficult to know what

> is safe for us to eat when people expand the term

> vegetarian or vegan. But, I also understand how there

> needs to be a term for people who don't eat any

> animals besides fish or eat dairy, but not eggs and

> other animals. I don't really like these labels

> either, but this is what some people use to describe

> themselves if they eat fish, but no other animals:

> Pescatarian.

>

> I applaud you for supporting your children in their

> choice to eat fewer animals. A lot of parents would

> not be so supportive. Around 10 or so, I decided I

> didn't want to eat any mammals, but I continued to eat

> chicken, turkey (never really liked fish so I didn't

> eat fish). This was some concern to my parents

> because I really didn't like vegetables (potatoes,

> corn, carrots were my favorites). They didn't expect

> it to last long. My mom was very sweet and switched

> to turkey burgers and stuff like that.

>

> Over the next two years I slowly cut down on the

> amount of turkey/chicken and stopped eating animals

> all together. I was a young adult when I went vegan.

> Over the years, my family has been very supportive and

> I appreciate that so much since both my parents came

> from farming families and my maternal grandfather was

> a butcher for many years and my paternal grandfather a

> dairy farmer. Both my parents shared an interest in

> my eating and why I decided to not eat animals. They

> were both surprised and happy to see my love for

> vegetables grow and they saw how varied my diet became

> and they have always agreed I was healthier. My

> mother would cook vegan food for me when I came to

> visit and eventually turned all our family

> celebrations into completely veg events. Before my

> mother was diagnosed and died of cancer, she was

> trying to be vegetarian. My sister has been veg*n off

> and on (when she travels to/lives in other countries

> she isn't as strict) for several years.

>

> My brother is a little annoyed by the whole veg*n

> thing, but he's always been a vegetable lover and

> understands the health aspects of it and although he

> makes remarks he eats the food.

>

> My husband went vegan as an adult and did not have a

> supportive family. Which you wouldn't think would be

> as bad since he didn't live with them, but it still

> effects us and he has been vegan around 20 years. His

> mother died of cancer and this was enough to get him

> to change his diet. His father was on the Ornish diet

> for a while because of heart issues, but still puts us

> down for our vegan lifestyle. I think his dad still

> secretly wishes my husband would start eating meat

> again.

>

> Sorry, didn't mean to get into all that. I just think

> you are a wonderful mom for joining this group and

> getting more information and supporting your children!

>

>

> Linda

> --- Kara Keeter <karakeeter@cableone <karakeeter%40cableone.net>

> .net> wrote:

>

> > I thought you were probably referring to me, and I

> > just assumed you

> > hadn't read my previous posts.

> >

> > I am not trying to pass myself off as vegetarian. I

> > came here

> > because I read this was a great resource for

> > " parents trying to raise

> > vegetarian kids " not necessarily " vegetarian parents

> > trying to raise

> > kids " . Subtle difference. I am not vegetarian, but

> > after reading

> > " Charlotte's Web " my kids decided they no longer

> > wanted to eat meat.

> > I am trying to support them in that, and to learn as

> > much as possible

> > about providing a healthy diet - otherwise, their

> > version of " not

> > eating meat " would be, skip the meat, still no

> > veggies, let's just

> > eat bread and dessert!

> >

> > So I guess the term " vegetarian " may not be

> > appropriate for what they

> > are doing, since they are willing to eat fish (I

> > assume it was the

> > sushi post you were responding to?). I thought

> > there is a form of

> > vegetarianism that allows not only dairy but also

> > fish. I dated a

> > guy for several years who called himself a

> > vegetarian, but he would

> > eat fish. His reasons for his choices were to eat

> > low on the food

> > chain, and to eat things with few or no brain cells.

> > (His words, not

> > mine.) In our group were also two people who kept

> > strict kosher, and

> > a couple who were strictly vegan, and several

> > omnivores including

> > me. We would get together regularly for dinners at

> > each other's

> > houses, everyone was accommodated and no one judged

> > or tried to

> > convert another. (And no one was expected to

> > prepare food they were

> > opposed to! The kosher and vegan utensils were

> > never allowed to

> > touch the omnivore utensils.)

> >

> > I am not trying to get my children to do anything

> > other than eat

> > healthy, but I am very proud of their not wanting to

> > eat the things

> > that in their 5-year-old minds are animals. I

> > applaud their

> > determination, I thought it would only last a week

> > or so and then

> > they would want their hamburgers and chicken nuggets

> > again. I wish I

> > had their willpower. Their choice is influencing

> > our whole family to

> > eat more environmentally-friendly. We aren't doing

> > as well as

> > vegans, and I'm not trying to claim we are.

> >

> > If there is a term for someone who eats fish and

> > dairy (no poultry)

> > let me know.

> >

> > I appreciate everyone's support here, and

> > willingness to answer my

> > questions. Thank you for acknowledging our efforts,

> > even if we

> > haven't gotten as far as you have.

> >

> > Cheers,

> > -Kara

> >

> > On Jul 24, 2007, at 12:11 PM, Kadee M wrote:

> >

> > > I wasn't attacking anyone, I just wasn't quite

> > sure exactly what

> > > the question was because of the wording. Some

> > people call

> > > themselves vegetarians and yet they eat fish or

> > chickens or

> > > whatever. That's who I was referring to. Eating

> > " more vegetarian "

> > > isn't at all what I was talking about. It's those

> > people who claim

> > > to live the lifestyle and cheat. Kind of like if a

> > person says

> > > they're a non-smoker and yet they smoke cigars...

> > not the greatest

> > > example but close. I'm sorry if that came across

> > wrong, I wasn't

> > > meaning to attack you. I was getting pretty

> > frustrated with the

> > > wording in the post I was responding to and

> > apparently I didn't

> > > word my own post as well as I should have.

> > >

> > > " diana.platt " <diana.platt@ <diana.platt%40comcast.net>

> comcast.net> wrote: I

> > think it is good

> > > for parents to think about serving their kids more

> > > vegetables/vegetarian and it is especially good

> > when the children

> > > themselves are thinking about improving their

> > diet. It is

> > > intimidating to try something new; I

> > > would like to feel comfortable asking questions

> > without feeling like

> > > I am a dumb meat-eater trying to fit into some

> > elite vegetarian

> > > group.

> > > This is sometimes how many animal rights groups

> > and vegetarian groups

> > > come off. I think we make a bad impression when we

> > respond to

> > > someone who is really trying with sarcasm. Can we

> > not just pass

> > > information back and forth and leave it at that?

> > >

> > > I look forward to hearing more ideas and questions

> > about feeding my

> > > kids vegetarian.

> > >

> > > @gro <%40>

> ups.com, Kadee M

> > <abbey_road3012@>

> > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Um... if a person eats meat, they're not a

> > vegetarian. If they say

> > > they are, they obviously either don't know what

> > they're talking about

> > > or they're using the " image " as a status symbol or

> > something.

> > > >

> > > > I didn't quite catch the exact question there

> > though... if you were

> > > referring to a specific person or vegetarians as a

> > group.

> > > >

> > > > Namaska7@ wrote: I am

> > > confused ... I have seen this before. How can you

> > consider yourself

> > > to

> > > > be vegetarian and you eat meat.

> > > > You can say we tend to eat more vegetarian than

> > Standard American

> > > Diet . But

> > > > if you eat flesh you can't be a vegetarian or a

> > Vegan.

> > > > Help me here if I'm not seeing something ?

> > > > Be Well,

> > > > Lynda

> > > >

> > > > ************************************** Get a

> > sneak peek of the all-

> > > new AOL at

> > > > http://discover. <http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour>

> aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

> > > >

> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Kadee Sedtal

> > > >

> > > > " When you die, if you get a choice between going

> > to regular heaven

> > > or pie heaven, choose pie heaven. It might be a

> > trick, but if it's

> > > not, mmmmmmmm, boy. " -Jack Handey

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights

> > and hotels with

> > > FareChase.

> > > >

> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Kadee Sedtal

> > >

> > > " When you die, if you get a choice between going

> > to

> === message truncated ===

>

> Linda

> http://triballife. <http://triballife.net/> net/ A Marketplace for a

> Better World

>

> ________

> Need a vacation? Get great deals

> to amazing places on Travel.

> http://travel. <http://travel./> /

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I can't ask everyone to eat where I want to eat if they don't want to, plus I

really enjoy the food at most steakhouses. I've actually requested Roadhouse

before because I like the food... of course there's very little *real* Mexican

food around here or I'd be there all the time!! Seafood places, that's another

story. I have a rather weak stomach so that is a big no-no. Once while I was

pregnant with my son, we were all going out to eat. My parents and my husband's

parents were there and they all voted, without even consulting me, on a seafood

place. I was informed of their decision as we turned into the parking lot!! I

told them to have a nice time, that my daughter and I would take the car

somewhere else so I wouldn't smell that nasty place. That is pretty much the

most completely inconsiderate thing I could have imagined. They all *knew* I had

been sick pretty much the entire time I was pregnant, and they *knew* that I

couldn't stand that awful smell. A steakhouse would

have been a welcome thing compared to that. Luckily they all kind of went, " Oh

yeah, you're pregnant and are disgusted by really strong, horrible smells! "

DUH!! So we ended up going to the most totally awesome Mexican place ever. Their

chips and salsa are to die for... geez, now I've got a craving...

 

ben wenzel <jillben2005 wrote:

I've always felt that if someone chooses a steakhouse as a good place to invite

me to eat, then that person is being inconsiderate. There are sooooo many

places that I can have a real meal - try mexican, italian, japanese, etc. And I

can't imagine having to put up a barrier so I wouldn't have to see someone's

meal. Also, I do not believe in financially supporting steakhouses.

 

Kadee M <abbey_road3012 wrote: I'll say one good thing

about steakhouses- check out their side items. Anybody can cook up a slab of cow

carcass. What makes one steakhouse better than another is the other stuff.

Saltgrass has the absolute, 100%, hands-down best sweet potatoes EVER. Texas

Roadhouse has these rolls and butter that are to die for. I actually like going

to those places because they often have more veg options than a lot of other

places! I just have the waiter leave one of the menus and I stand it up so I

can't see my husband's plate. Everybody's happy! He never orders meat if the

kids are with us.

 

nymusicgirl <bluebeetle_1 wrote: I think most people shy away from

things that they don't understand. My husband and I

are the only veggie's on my side of the family. I have been told so many times

that " we

can get salad anywhere " , so it's okay for them to plan family outings at steak

houses. This

has caused much turmoil, because they don't realize that they are making us

feel

unwelcome, and they are almost never willing to come to functions that we host

because

they think they'll be served something weird. We've come to accept that we will

never be

taken into consideration for any family gathering, as we are the minority. It

is sad that

this has influenced our decision in where to spend holiday's and such, because

frankly we

just got tired of having to cook all day simply to enjoy a meal at someone

else's house.

 

Regards,

Merette

, " RnScarlson " <scarlson1 wrote:

>

> Has any one ever done any kind of a study on WHY it seems to bother

> people so badly when a family member goes Veggie Or pesci or what ever?

> I mean its not like they are killing anyone, or joining some really out

> there cult that requires a disconnect of family members.

> Recently I am hearing a lot of stuff about families really getting upset

> about their relative going veggie. And am starting to get some mild

> flack myself. Course my family gave up on me three kids and

> homeschooling ago. They Know I am a lost cause.. LOL..

>

> General concern out of lack of nutritional education I can see.. but to

> the point where it divides a family?? !! Does it bother their conscious?

> Are they afraid they are eating wrong? Is this some sort of social

> eating thing?

>

> Steph

>

> " We all want progress, but if you're on the wrong road, progress means

> doing an about-turn and walking back to the right road; in that case,

> the man who turns back soonest is the most progressive. "

> C.S. Lewis

>

>

> On

> Behalf Of Linda Evans

> Tuesday, July 24, 2007 2:38 PM

>

> Re: Vegetarian ??

>

> Kara,

>

> Labels are hard and I wish we didn't need them. It is

> difficult when people call themselves vegan and still

> eat animal products or vegetarian and eat animals

> because then in restaurants or when people are cooking

> they think fish is okay for vegetarians or dairy is

> okay for vegans. It makes it difficult to know what

> is safe for us to eat when people expand the term

> vegetarian or vegan. But, I also understand how there

> needs to be a term for people who don't eat any

> animals besides fish or eat dairy, but not eggs and

> other animals. I don't really like these labels

> either, but this is what some people use to describe

> themselves if they eat fish, but no other animals:

> Pescatarian.

>

> I applaud you for supporting your children in their

> choice to eat fewer animals. A lot of parents would

> not be so supportive. Around 10 or so, I decided I

> didn't want to eat any mammals, but I continued to eat

> chicken, turkey (never really liked fish so I didn't

> eat fish). This was some concern to my parents

> because I really didn't like vegetables (potatoes,

> corn, carrots were my favorites). They didn't expect

> it to last long. My mom was very sweet and switched

> to turkey burgers and stuff like that.

>

> Over the next two years I slowly cut down on the

> amount of turkey/chicken and stopped eating animals

> all together. I was a young adult when I went vegan.

> Over the years, my family has been very supportive and

> I appreciate that so much since both my parents came

> from farming families and my maternal grandfather was

> a butcher for many years and my paternal grandfather a

> dairy farmer. Both my parents shared an interest in

> my eating and why I decided to not eat animals. They

> were both surprised and happy to see my love for

> vegetables grow and they saw how varied my diet became

> and they have always agreed I was healthier. My

> mother would cook vegan food for me when I came to

> visit and eventually turned all our family

> celebrations into completely veg events. Before my

> mother was diagnosed and died of cancer, she was

> trying to be vegetarian. My sister has been veg*n off

> and on (when she travels to/lives in other countries

> she isn't as strict) for several years.

>

> My brother is a little annoyed by the whole veg*n

> thing, but he's always been a vegetable lover and

> understands the health aspects of it and although he

> makes remarks he eats the food.

>

> My husband went vegan as an adult and did not have a

> supportive family. Which you wouldn't think would be

> as bad since he didn't live with them, but it still

> effects us and he has been vegan around 20 years. His

> mother died of cancer and this was enough to get him

> to change his diet. His father was on the Ornish diet

> for a while because of heart issues, but still puts us

> down for our vegan lifestyle. I think his dad still

> secretly wishes my husband would start eating meat

> again.

>

> Sorry, didn't mean to get into all that. I just think

> you are a wonderful mom for joining this group and

> getting more information and supporting your children!

>

>

> Linda

> --- Kara Keeter <karakeeter@cableone <karakeeter%40cableone.net>

> .net> wrote:

>

> > I thought you were probably referring to me, and I

> > just assumed you

> > hadn't read my previous posts.

> >

> > I am not trying to pass myself off as vegetarian. I

> > came here

> > because I read this was a great resource for

> > " parents trying to raise

> > vegetarian kids " not necessarily " vegetarian parents

> > trying to raise

> > kids " . Subtle difference. I am not vegetarian, but

> > after reading

> > " Charlotte's Web " my kids decided they no longer

> > wanted to eat meat.

> > I am trying to support them in that, and to learn as

> > much as possible

> > about providing a healthy diet - otherwise, their

> > version of " not

> > eating meat " would be, skip the meat, still no

> > veggies, let's just

> > eat bread and dessert!

> >

> > So I guess the term " vegetarian " may not be

> > appropriate for what they

> > are doing, since they are willing to eat fish (I

> > assume it was the

> > sushi post you were responding to?). I thought

> > there is a form of

> > vegetarianism that allows not only dairy but also

> > fish. I dated a

> > guy for several years who called himself a

> > vegetarian, but he would

> > eat fish. His reasons for his choices were to eat

> > low on the food

> > chain, and to eat things with few or no brain cells.

> > (His words, not

> > mine.) In our group were also two people who kept

> > strict kosher, and

> > a couple who were strictly vegan, and several

> > omnivores including

> > me. We would get together regularly for dinners at

> > each other's

> > houses, everyone was accommodated and no one judged

> > or tried to

> > convert another. (And no one was expected to

> > prepare food they were

> > opposed to! The kosher and vegan utensils were

> > never allowed to

> > touch the omnivore utensils.)

> >

> > I am not trying to get my children to do anything

> > other than eat

> > healthy, but I am very proud of their not wanting to

> > eat the things

> > that in their 5-year-old minds are animals. I

> > applaud their

> > determination, I thought it would only last a week

> > or so and then

> > they would want their hamburgers and chicken nuggets

> > again. I wish I

> > had their willpower. Their choice is influencing

> > our whole family to

> > eat more environmentally-friendly. We aren't doing

> > as well as

> > vegans, and I'm not trying to claim we are.

> >

> > If there is a term for someone who eats fish and

> > dairy (no poultry)

> > let me know.

> >

> > I appreciate everyone's support here, and

> > willingness to answer my

> > questions. Thank you for acknowledging our efforts,

> > even if we

> > haven't gotten as far as you have.

> >

> > Cheers,

> > -Kara

> >

> > On Jul 24, 2007, at 12:11 PM, Kadee M wrote:

> >

> > > I wasn't attacking anyone, I just wasn't quite

> > sure exactly what

> > > the question was because of the wording. Some

> > people call

> > > themselves vegetarians and yet they eat fish or

> > chickens or

> > > whatever. That's who I was referring to. Eating

> > " more vegetarian "

> > > isn't at all what I was talking about. It's those

> > people who claim

> > > to live the lifestyle and cheat. Kind of like if a

> > person says

> > > they're a non-smoker and yet they smoke cigars...

> > not the greatest

> > > example but close. I'm sorry if that came across

> > wrong, I wasn't

> > > meaning to attack you. I was getting pretty

> > frustrated with the

> > > wording in the post I was responding to and

> > apparently I didn't

> > > word my own post as well as I should have.

> > >

> > > " diana.platt " <diana.platt@ <diana.platt%40comcast.net>

> comcast.net> wrote: I

> > think it is good

> > > for parents to think about serving their kids more

> > > vegetables/vegetarian and it is especially good

> > when the children

> > > themselves are thinking about improving their

> > diet. It is

> > > intimidating to try something new; I

> > > would like to feel comfortable asking questions

> > without feeling like

> > > I am a dumb meat-eater trying to fit into some

> > elite vegetarian

> > > group.

> > > This is sometimes how many animal rights groups

> > and vegetarian groups

> > > come off. I think we make a bad impression when we

> > respond to

> > > someone who is really trying with sarcasm. Can we

> > not just pass

> > > information back and forth and leave it at that?

> > >

> > > I look forward to hearing more ideas and questions

> > about feeding my

> > > kids vegetarian.

> > >

> > > @gro <%40>

> ups.com, Kadee M

> > <abbey_road3012@>

> > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Um... if a person eats meat, they're not a

> > vegetarian. If they say

> > > they are, they obviously either don't know what

> > they're talking about

> > > or they're using the " image " as a status symbol or

> > something.

> > > >

> > > > I didn't quite catch the exact question there

> > though... if you were

> > > referring to a specific person or vegetarians as a

> > group.

> > > >

> > > > Namaska7@ wrote: I am

> > > confused ... I have seen this before. How can you

> > consider yourself

> > > to

> > > > be vegetarian and you eat meat.

> > > > You can say we tend to eat more vegetarian than

> > Standard American

> > > Diet . But

> > > > if you eat flesh you can't be a vegetarian or a

> > Vegan.

> > > > Help me here if I'm not seeing something ?

> > > > Be Well,

> > > > Lynda

> > > >

> > > > ************************************** Get a

> > sneak peek of the all-

> > > new AOL at

> > > > http://discover. <http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour>

> aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

> > > >

> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Kadee Sedtal

> > > >

> > > > " When you die, if you get a choice between going

> > to regular heaven

> > > or pie heaven, choose pie heaven. It might be a

> > trick, but if it's

> > > not, mmmmmmmm, boy. " -Jack Handey

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights

> > and hotels with

> > > FareChase.

> > > >

> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been

> > removed]

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Kadee Sedtal

> > >

> > > " When you die, if you get a choice between going

> > to

> === message truncated ===

>

> Linda

> http://triballife. <http://triballife.net/> net/ A Marketplace for a

> Better World

>

> ________

> Need a vacation? Get great deals

> to amazing places on Travel.

> http://travel. <http://travel./> /

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Wow. I'm a new member but felt I had to chime in and share a recent experience

after

Robin's insightful post. The vegan vs. SAD diet has become an emotional issue in

our

family. We have a 4 year old daughter who is being raised vegan (my husband is

vegan and

I'm trying very hard to make the transition. I guess I'd be labeled a

flexivegan). Our

problem is with my mother. It started when we'd eat dinner at her house; my

daughter

would ask for soymilk and my mother would say 'oh, it's just milk' and my

daughter would

say 'cow's milk? We don't drink cow's milk.' My mom would respond by saying 'oh,

milk is

milk' as though there is no difference between the two. My daughter would start

to get

really confused and then my husband and I would jump in and say ' well of course

there

are different kinds of milk. Cow's milk is for baby cows, are YOU a baby cow?'

and my

daughter would say 'no, that's silly. I drink soy milk.' At this, my mother

would roll her

eyes. (What really annoyed us about this most of all is her not supporting our

parenting

decision, regardless of what she thinks of cow's milk.) Honestly, we were never

sure what

to say in those situations, except what I noted.

 

Then at Easter, after I'd gone throught a lot of trouble and expense to make

sure the

Easter bunny brought dark chocolate and vegan candy, my mother took her for a

sleepover

and when I picked up my daughter the next day the first words out of her mouth

were

'mommy, I had cow's milk chocolate,' (We have asked my mother in the past to not

feed

her food with cow's milk etc. in it). Man, was I mad!

 

Most recently, my mother had an ice cream cake for my brother's birthday and

when we

said no our little one's request for a piece (we gave her an alternative

dessert) my mom got

very upset. She sat me down the following week and told me that she was very

worried

about my daughter's diet and that I was harming my daughter emtionally by

" burdening "

her with knowledge that a 4 year old is too little for, and that knowing the

difference

between cow's milk and soy milk is " not normal " . She also said it was cruel for

me to have

refused her the ice cream cake and when I did that she felt sick to her stomach.

She also

said that " everyone " in the family has commented on their worries about my

daugther's

diet. I pointed out that it's not abnormal for children with food allergies to

question what

they eat, and she would only say 'well, that's different.'

 

The irony of this is that my 19 year old brother is 300lbs. On a drive home from

the beach

this week he asked me to drive through McDonalds where he bought 2 double big

macs, a

large fry and a large chocolate shake. That's upwards of 3000 calories on one

meal. I

mean, who has the unhealthy child here? We have recommended many books to her,

such

as The China Study and Eat to Live, but she's not interested in learning about

this. She

thinks food is food and can't understand why we're making it so hard on

ourselves (and

our daughter) by ruling out so much of it. We have become really frustrated with

her and

haven't had much contact with her over the last few months. We're not confident

we can

trust her to support our values where our daughter is concerned and don't think

it's fair to

confuse our daughter in this way. (I'd love to know if anyone has gone through

something

similar with a grandparent and how they handled it.)

 

This is just one of the reasons we are so grateful for this online community...

it's so nice to

be a part of a group that doesn't think we're nuts!

 

Christina

 

 

 

, robin koloms <rkoloms wrote:

>

> I don't know if anyone has done a study, but eating is a very emotional issue.

Family

events can be so closely tied to traditional foods, many people feel personal

rejecttion

when you reject their foods and focus on the difference rather than focus on

being

together. The best that we can do is try to educate our loved ones and remember

why we

love them and hope that they can accept us for who we are, not reject us for not

being

who they wish us to be.

>

[Guest guest]

Oh geez... that's pretty rotten of her to question your daughter's diet when

she's got a son that weighs that much!! I'm sorry you're having to deal with

that. What I've done since the beginning is I've been just flat-out mean about

it. I'm nice at first, but the moment someone questions it in a negative way I

spit out a bucketful of statistics and facts along with plenty of gruesome

stories of slaughterhouses and diseases, and I make it clear that I'm not going

to base my kids' diet on the words " just because. " I think that might do a world

of good for your mom, if you just put it all out on the table and let her know

that her attitude won't be tolerated. Bring up your brother. Ask her if she

wants your daughter to have the burden of being overweight like that and have to

suffer all the health consequences. Of course not. If she doesn't want to

research it herself, fine. But it's definitely not her place to be teaching your

daughter something that goes against your

parenting. You've obviously done a lot more reading and learning than she has

on diet. She needs to know that!

 

seenachick <youngcomm wrote: Wow.

I'm a new member but felt I had to chime in and share a recent experience after

Robin's insightful post. The vegan vs. SAD diet has become an emotional issue

in our

family. We have a 4 year old daughter who is being raised vegan (my husband is

vegan and

I'm trying very hard to make the transition. I guess I'd be labeled a

flexivegan). Our

problem is with my mother. It started when we'd eat dinner at her house; my

daughter

would ask for soymilk and my mother would say 'oh, it's just milk' and my

daughter would

say 'cow's milk? We don't drink cow's milk.' My mom would respond by saying

'oh, milk is

milk' as though there is no difference between the two. My daughter would start

to get

really confused and then my husband and I would jump in and say ' well of

course there

are different kinds of milk. Cow's milk is for baby cows, are YOU a baby cow?'

and my

daughter would say 'no, that's silly. I drink soy milk.' At this, my mother

would roll her

eyes. (What really annoyed us about this most of all is her not supporting our

parenting

decision, regardless of what she thinks of cow's milk.) Honestly, we were never

sure what

to say in those situations, except what I noted.

 

Then at Easter, after I'd gone throught a lot of trouble and expense to make

sure the

Easter bunny brought dark chocolate and vegan candy, my mother took her for a

sleepover

and when I picked up my daughter the next day the first words out of her mouth

were

'mommy, I had cow's milk chocolate,' (We have asked my mother in the past to

not feed

her food with cow's milk etc. in it). Man, was I mad!

 

Most recently, my mother had an ice cream cake for my brother's birthday and

when we

said no our little one's request for a piece (we gave her an alternative

dessert) my mom got

very upset. She sat me down the following week and told me that she was very

worried

about my daughter's diet and that I was harming my daughter emtionally by

" burdening "

her with knowledge that a 4 year old is too little for, and that knowing the

difference

between cow's milk and soy milk is " not normal " . She also said it was cruel for

me to have

refused her the ice cream cake and when I did that she felt sick to her

stomach. She also

said that " everyone " in the family has commented on their worries about my

daugther's

diet. I pointed out that it's not abnormal for children with food allergies to

question what

they eat, and she would only say 'well, that's different.'

 

The irony of this is that my 19 year old brother is 300lbs. On a drive home

from the beach

this week he asked me to drive through McDonalds where he bought 2 double big

macs, a

large fry and a large chocolate shake. That's upwards of 3000 calories on one

meal. I

mean, who has the unhealthy child here? We have recommended many books to her,

such

as The China Study and Eat to Live, but she's not interested in learning about

this. She

thinks food is food and can't understand why we're making it so hard on

ourselves (and

our daughter) by ruling out so much of it. We have become really frustrated

with her and

haven't had much contact with her over the last few months. We're not confident

we can

trust her to support our values where our daughter is concerned and don't think

it's fair to

confuse our daughter in this way. (I'd love to know if anyone has gone through

something

similar with a grandparent and how they handled it.)

 

This is just one of the reasons we are so grateful for this online community...

it's so nice to

be a part of a group that doesn't think we're nuts!

 

Christina

 

, robin koloms <rkoloms wrote:

>

> I don't know if anyone has done a study, but eating is a very emotional

issue. Family

events can be so closely tied to traditional foods, many people feel personal

rejecttion

when you reject their foods and focus on the difference rather than focus on

being

together. The best that we can do is try to educate our loved ones and

remember why we

love them and hope that they can accept us for who we are, not reject us for

not being

who they wish us to be.

>

 

 

 

 

 

 

Kadee Sedtal

 

" When you die, if you get a choice between going to regular heaven or pie

heaven, choose pie heaven. It might be a trick, but if it's not, mmmmmmmm, boy. "

-Jack Handey

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Take the Internet to Go: Go puts the Internet in your pocket: mail, news,

photos & more.

 

 

[Guest guest]

I think that the answer is to have your mother over to your home often. This way

she can see your happy, healthy daughter. Depending on your relationship with

your family doctor (the health care practioner you take your daughter to), you

may feel comfortable bringing mom along for your daughter's next check up; mom

can ask the doctor questions.

 

seenachick <youngcomm wrote: Wow. I'm a new member but

felt I had to chime in and share a recent experience after

Robin's insightful post. The vegan vs. SAD diet has become an emotional issue in

our

family. We have a 4 year old daughter who is being raised vegan (my husband is

vegan and

I'm trying very hard to make the transition. I guess I'd be labeled a

flexivegan). Our

problem is with my mother. It started when we'd eat dinner at her house; my

daughter

would ask for soymilk and my mother would say 'oh, it's just milk' and my

daughter would

say 'cow's milk? We don't drink cow's milk.' My mom would respond by saying 'oh,

milk is

milk' as though there is no difference between the two. My daughter would start

to get

really confused and then my husband and I would jump in and say ' well of course

there

are different kinds of milk. Cow's milk is for baby cows, are YOU a baby cow?'

and my

daughter would say 'no, that's silly. I drink soy milk.' At this, my mother

would roll her

eyes. (What really annoyed us about this most of all is her not supporting our

parenting

decision, regardless of what she thinks of cow's milk.) Honestly, we were never

sure what

to say in those situations, except what I noted.

 

Then at Easter, after I'd gone throught a lot of trouble and expense to make

sure the

Easter bunny brought dark chocolate and vegan candy, my mother took her for a

sleepover

and when I picked up my daughter the next day the first words out of her mouth

were

'mommy, I had cow's milk chocolate,' (We have asked my mother in the past to not

feed

her food with cow's milk etc. in it). Man, was I mad!

 

Most recently, my mother had an ice cream cake for my brother's birthday and

when we

said no our little one's request for a piece (we gave her an alternative

dessert) my mom got

very upset. She sat me down the following week and told me that she was very

worried

about my daughter's diet and that I was harming my daughter emtionally by

" burdening "

her with knowledge that a 4 year old is too little for, and that knowing the

difference

between cow's milk and soy milk is " not normal " . She also said it was cruel for

me to have

refused her the ice cream cake and when I did that she felt sick to her stomach.

She also

said that " everyone " in the family has commented on their worries about my

daugther's

diet. I pointed out that it's not abnormal for children with food allergies to

question what

they eat, and she would only say 'well, that's different.'

 

The irony of this is that my 19 year old brother is 300lbs. On a drive home from

the beach

this week he asked me to drive through McDonalds where he bought 2 double big

macs, a

large fry and a large chocolate shake. That's upwards of 3000 calories on one

meal. I

mean, who has the unhealthy child here? We have recommended many books to her,

such

as The China Study and Eat to Live, but she's not interested in learning about

this. She

thinks food is food and can't understand why we're making it so hard on

ourselves (and

our daughter) by ruling out so much of it. We have become really frustrated with

her and

haven't had much contact with her over the last few months. We're not confident

we can

trust her to support our values where our daughter is concerned and don't think

it's fair to

confuse our daughter in this way. (I'd love to know if anyone has gone through

something

similar with a grandparent and how they handled it.)

 

This is just one of the reasons we are so grateful for this online community...

it's so nice to

be a part of a group that doesn't think we're nuts!

 

Christina

 

, robin koloms <rkoloms wrote:

>

> I don't know if anyone has done a study, but eating is a very emotional issue.

Family

events can be so closely tied to traditional foods, many people feel personal

rejecttion

when you reject their foods and focus on the difference rather than focus on

being

together. The best that we can do is try to educate our loved ones and remember

why we

love them and hope that they can accept us for who we are, not reject us for not

being

who they wish us to be.

>

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with

FareChase.

 

 

[Guest guest]

Christina,

 

Wow.. I am newer to the group also and everyone has been great

here so far. There are a lot of wonderful discussions that help me

formulate ideas about how I want to proceed with my son, Conner.

 

 

 

In terms of similar situations, yes, been there done that.. my

example is less extreme (kind of) but I will share.

 

 

 

My husband and I have a 4 year old son, Conner. In the early days of our

relationship (13 years ago) my husband's mother was babysitting for his

brother's 2 children. The mom (my husband's sister in law) had said no

soda, we only want her to have water or milk. The mom (Sister In Law) was

not yet out of the driveway before my husband's mother had cracked open a

mountain dew and said to all in the room, what she doesn't know won't hurt

her. At that point I knew if our relationship progressed we would have

issues. We did.

 

 

 

I have had much heartache in knowing if our approach is good, but here it

is: We moved from the east coast to the west and raise our child our way in

Los Angeles. We have had to develop a network of friends that are basically

like family. We keep in touch via email and phone with our own family, but

the issue of them interfering is a moot point.

 

 

 

When we visit, it is with us as a family, not alone. They have discussed

what they feel is best and our answer is we love you- You made your choices

in parenting (my husband) and part of your raising him has led him to this

healthy lifestyle he shares with us his family. It is now our turn to make

choices for our family. If you disagree that is fine, we love philosophical

debates, but they will take place outside the hearing of our son. And the

final decision is ours. We love you and respect you, but we have chosen

different paths. You must respect us and our views if you want to

participate in our life. If you do not, that is a choice you can make, but

we would prefer to have you as a part of our lives and our son's life. We

are consistent but firm. When we are together they eat meat, we don't. We

have raised our son to be aware of our life choices and that others have

made different choices. We do not judge, we respect and we focus our energy

on the life we want to live, not on how we feel others should live like us..

and we ask the same from others in respect to us.

 

 

 

This is watered down, there have been some down and outs on the topic, but

we have weathered them. All in all it has worked out well. At daycare my

son when offered a cupcake for a birthday or farewell party will say, I

don't eat eggs and milk, but thank you. My mommy has a special treat in my

cubby can I celebrate with you with my cookie. His teachers constantly

comment on how they have forgotten about his habits and offered a cracker

with whey and he will say, no my crackers are in my cubby I can get them. I

think educating your child is excellent and keep strong. You definitely

have to be persistent and dedicated to your beliefs when you have family

challenging you, but stick to what you believe. I hope it does not come to

the point where you have to distance yourself from your family, but true

family that loves you unconditionally will honor your choices and respect

your differences. Sometimes it is fear of the unknown that can cause this

behavior and time may help.

 

 

 

Not sure this will help, but maybe just knowing someone else has been there.

 

Paige

 

 

 

_____

 

On

Behalf Of seenachick

Thursday, July 26, 2007 2:11 PM

 

Re: Vegetarian ??

 

 

 

Wow. I'm a new member but felt I had to chime in and share a recent

experience after

Robin's insightful post. The vegan vs. SAD diet has become an emotional

issue in our

family. We have a 4 year old daughter who is being raised vegan (my husband

is vegan and

I'm trying very hard to make the transition. I guess I'd be labeled a

flexivegan). Our

problem is with my mother. It started when we'd eat dinner at her house; my

daughter

would ask for soymilk and my mother would say 'oh, it's just milk' and my

daughter would

say 'cow's milk? We don't drink cow's milk.' My mom would respond by saying

'oh, milk is

milk' as though there is no difference between the two. My daughter would

start to get

really confused and then my husband and I would jump in and say ' well of

course there

are different kinds of milk. Cow's milk is for baby cows, are YOU a baby

cow?' and my

daughter would say 'no, that's silly. I drink soy milk.' At this, my mother

would roll her

eyes. (What really annoyed us about this most of all is her not supporting

our parenting

decision, regardless of what she thinks of cow's milk.) Honestly, we were

never sure what

to say in those situations, except what I noted.

 

Then at Easter, after I'd gone throught a lot of trouble and expense to make

sure the

Easter bunny brought dark chocolate and vegan candy, my mother took her for

a sleepover

and when I picked up my daughter the next day the first words out of her

mouth were

'mommy, I had cow's milk chocolate,' (We have asked my mother in the past to

not feed

her food with cow's milk etc. in it). Man, was I mad!

 

Most recently, my mother had an ice cream cake for my brother's birthday and

when we

said no our little one's request for a piece (we gave her an alternative

dessert) my mom got

very upset. She sat me down the following week and told me that she was very

worried

about my daughter's diet and that I was harming my daughter emtionally by

" burdening "

her with knowledge that a 4 year old is too little for, and that knowing the

difference

between cow's milk and soy milk is " not normal " . She also said it was cruel

for me to have

refused her the ice cream cake and when I did that she felt sick to her

stomach. She also

said that " everyone " in the family has commented on their worries about my

daugther's

diet. I pointed out that it's not abnormal for children with food allergies

to question what

they eat, and she would only say 'well, that's different.'

 

The irony of this is that my 19 year old brother is 300lbs. On a drive home

from the beach

this week he asked me to drive through McDonalds where he bought 2 double

big macs, a

large fry and a large chocolate shake. That's upwards of 3000 calories on

one meal. I

mean, who has the unhealthy child here? We have recommended many books to

her, such

as The China Study and Eat to Live, but she's not interested in learning

about this. She

thinks food is food and can't understand why we're making it so hard on

ourselves (and

our daughter) by ruling out so much of it. We have become really frustrated

with her and

haven't had much contact with her over the last few months. We're not

confident we can

trust her to support our values where our daughter is concerned and don't

think it's fair to

confuse our daughter in this way. (I'd love to know if anyone has gone

through something

similar with a grandparent and how they handled it.)

 

This is just one of the reasons we are so grateful for this online

community... it's so nice to

be a part of a group that doesn't think we're nuts!

 

Christina

 

@gro <%40> ups.com,

robin koloms <rkoloms wrote:

>

> I don't know if anyone has done a study, but eating is a very emotional

issue. Family

events can be so closely tied to traditional foods, many people feel

personal rejecttion

when you reject their foods and focus on the difference rather than focus on

being

together. The best that we can do is try to educate our loved ones and

remember why we

love them and hope that they can accept us for who we are, not reject us for

not being

who they wish us to be.

>