Guest guest Posted May 5, 2006 Report Share Posted May 5, 2006 In a message dated 5/4/2006 5:16:32 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, no_reply writes: Soy has been implicated in the early puberty of young girls. I know this post was originally explaining a point of view (not the poster's). But to me, is a ludicrous statement. So many young girls today begin puberty by age 10.........geeeeeee they must be afraid to admit that it is the growth hormones in all of the meat and dairy that these young girls are raised on?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? Awwwwwww since when can anyone trust " them " to give us all of the facts plain and simple:::sigh::::::: The longer I live, the more life seems to imitate " The Matrix " It is one of the things that I love about this list........so many who " think outside of the box " . Just my own two cents Bright Blessings, Stacey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 6, 2006 Report Share Posted May 6, 2006 <snip>So many young girls today begin puberty by age 10.........geeeeeee they must be afraid to admit that it is the growth hormones in all of the meat and dairy that these young girls are raised on?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?<snip> Amen (and Awomen), Stacey! Both industries have done such a fabulous job of making sure they are highly represented on the USDA and FDA that protecting their growth-hormone use is easy. But, it's not just these federal agencies in on the duping. Anyone remember the story of the two Fox news reporters who were fired because they wanted to report the truth about BGH? Here's a great little web site that talks about it (one of many), if you haven't heard about it: http://www.foxbghsuit.com/ By the way, I remember reading some things on the Mercola site that seemed awfully quacky to me, but he does have some good stuff -- like this new Allopath video. Worth a watch: http://www.mercola.com/townofallopath/index.htm Suzy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 6, 2006 Report Share Posted May 6, 2006 Stacey, are you sure about this? My granddaughter is a vegetarian. At 10 years, she has curves I would have killed for (not literally) at age 14. She drinks large glasses of Silk and eats fake steak, phony baloney, and not chicken on a daily basis. Her mother uses many prepared foods and, if you read almost any label, they contain some form of soy. Tommie http://www.rawburchard.blogspot.com rawfood , subtlewitch wrote: > > > In a message dated 5/4/2006 5:16:32 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, > no_reply writes: > > Soy has been implicated in the early > puberty of young girls. > > > I know this post was originally explaining a point of view (not the > poster's). But to me, is a ludicrous statement. So many young girls today begin > puberty by age 10.........geeeeeee they must be afraid to admit that it is the > growth hormones in all of the meat and dairy that these young girls are raised > on?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? > > Awwwwwww since when can anyone trust " them " to give us all of the facts > plain and simple:::sigh::::::: The longer I live, the more life seems to > imitate " The Matrix " It is one of the things that I love about this list........so > many who " think outside of the box " . > > Just my own two cents > > Bright Blessings, > Stacey > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 6, 2006 Report Share Posted May 6, 2006 I have two young cousins that began puberty around 7 or 8. I don't think it was exclusively the soy milk they drink every day (and have for their whole lives), but I have always believed, even before I researched the dangers of soy, that the soy milk played a huge part in their early puberty. I think for them it was a little of both, but I have also heard of other vegetarians who have the same end results. Just my own personal observations. Cindy Stacey, are you sure about this? My granddaughter is a vegetarian. At 10 years, she has curves I would have killed for (not literally) at age 14. She drinks large glasses of Silk and eats fake steak, phony baloney, and not chicken on a daily basis. Her mother uses many prepared foods and, if you read almost any label, they contain some form of soy. Tommie http://www.rawburchard.blogspot.com -- Version: 7.1.392 / Virus Database: 268.5.4/332 - Release 5/4/2006 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 6, 2006 Report Share Posted May 6, 2006 I wanted to add that my cousins are both girls. It really pained me to see them start their periods at 7/8 years old! I also have two nephews that are HUGE at 11 and 13, but I don't think they consume soy except what is in packaged foods (which is probably a lot). They eat the typical SAD, and it hurts me to watch them grow and develop too. They also went through early puberty, but not quite as early as the girls. It is *mainly* because of watching my female cousins that I am trying to be very careful to keep the soy and non-organic meat away from my own kids, but with grandparents being so involved in their lives, that's not always practical. They don't get it very often though! Cindy I have two young cousins that began puberty around 7 or 8. I don't think it was exclusively the soy milk they drink every day (and have for their whole lives), but I have always believed, even before I researched the dangers of soy, that the soy milk played a huge part in their early puberty. I think for them it was a little of both, but I have also heard of other vegetarians who have the same end results. Just my own personal observations. Cindy -- Version: 7.1.392 / Virus Database: 268.5.4/332 - Release 5/4/2006 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 6, 2006 Report Share Posted May 6, 2006 Cindy, that's sad for kids to start their periods that young. It's no picnic. Thank God I'm past all that! You have to be careful of the organic meat, too, since the requirements are so loose, the cattle don't have to be organic all their lives, just a certain amount of time before they are sent to slaughter. Of course, if you raise your own, then you know from " cradle to grave " . And you can't shelter your kids from not getting something you don't want them to--even if you feed them raw. You just have to do what you can and hope for the best. Tommie http://www.rawburchard.blogspot.com rawfood , " pruegert " <pruegert wrote: > > I wanted to add that my cousins are both girls. It really pained me to see > them start their periods at 7/8 years old! > > I also have two nephews that are HUGE at 11 and 13, but I don't think they > consume soy except what is in packaged foods (which is probably a lot). They > eat the typical SAD, and it hurts me to watch them grow and develop too. > They also went through early puberty, but not quite as early as the girls. > > It is *mainly* because of watching my female cousins that I am trying to be > very careful to keep the soy and non-organic meat away from my own kids, but > with grandparents being so involved in their lives, that's not always > practical. They don't get it very often though! > > Cindy > > > > I have two young cousins that began puberty around 7 or 8. I don't think it > was exclusively the soy milk they drink every day (and have for their whole > lives), but I have always believed, even before I researched the dangers of > soy, that the soy milk played a huge part in their early puberty. > > I think for them it was a little of both, but I have also heard of other > vegetarians who have the same end results. > > Just my own personal observations. > > Cindy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 6, 2006 Report Share Posted May 6, 2006 I rarely buy meat at all because organic is so expensive and I don't think it's necessary to eat meat, but when they eat outside our house, it's definitely not organic. At least they don't get very much though. I believe they will choose not to eat very much if any when they get older. Right now my oldest is only 6 and LOVES to stuff himself with anything! Over all though they are very healthy eaters. Cindy Cindy, that's sad for kids to start their periods that young. It's no picnic. Thank God I'm past all that! You have to be careful of the organic meat, too, since the requirements are so loose, the cattle don't have to be organic all their lives, just a certain amount of time before they are sent to slaughter. Of course, if you raise your own, then you know from " cradle to grave " . And you can't shelter your kids from not getting something you don't want them to--even if you feed them raw. You just have to do what you can and hope for the best. Tommie http://www.rawburchard.blogspot.com -- Version: 7.1.392 / Virus Database: 268.5.4/332 - Release 5/4/2006 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 6, 2006 Report Share Posted May 6, 2006 Another study accuses HIGH fat diets ( prepared foods, fast foods, school lunches, etc.) for the early onset of puberty. Add all the studies together and it's just further proof that a higher fruit/veggie diet is optimal. Pam - pruegert rawfood Saturday, May 06, 2006 12:25 PM RE: [Raw Food] Re: It isn't the soy! I rarely buy meat at all because organic is so expensive and I don't think it's necessary to eat meat, but when they eat outside our house, it's definitely not organic. At least they don't get very much though. I believe they will choose not to eat very much if any when they get older. Right now my oldest is only 6 and LOVES to stuff himself with anything! Over all though they are very healthy eaters. Cindy Cindy, that's sad for kids to start their periods that young. It's no picnic. Thank God I'm past all that! You have to be careful of the organic meat, too, since the requirements are so loose, the cattle don't have to be organic all their lives, just a certain amount of time before they are sent to slaughter. Of course, if you raise your own, then you know from " cradle to grave " . And you can't shelter your kids from not getting something you don't want them to--even if you feed them raw. You just have to do what you can and hope for the best. Tommie http://www.rawburchard.blogspot.com -- Version: 7.1.392 / Virus Database: 268.5.4/332 - Release 5/4/2006 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 7, 2006 Report Share Posted May 7, 2006 Stacey wrote: > Soy has been implicated in the early > puberty of young girls. > I know this post was originally explaining a point of view (not the > poster's). But to me, is a ludicrous statement. So many young > girls today begin puberty by age 10.........geeeeeee they must be > afraid to admit that it is the growth hormones in all of the meat > and dairy that these young girls are raised on?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? There have been comments in the nutrition community on effects in certain countries (such as Brazil) where hormone use in beef production is unregulated, regarding the early development of girls. Many people are concerned about soy consumption. The fact of the matter is that, if laboratory rats are given about 100 times what a human might be able to consume in one day, they might get sick. (in laboratory studies of estrogen effects, the ovaries are removed from rats, the rats are fed a low-estrogen diet, and then injected with 100 times more estrogen than a human could consume in a day, or even a week.) In other words, the fun part of what medical studies do is that they give rats (not people, duh!) many times more than a person would consume, and then draw conclusions about effects on humans based on such information. Common sense provides us with conflicting information. Japanese studies show that soy is beneficial to health. In Japan, soy is a basic element in the diet. Soy sauce is ever present. " Miso " , a paste made from soybeans, is basic to most Japanese cooking, from basic daily soups to pickles. Many Japanese believe that " natto " , a fermented soybean product, is so important to health that they eat it daily. Freshly steamed soybeans (edamame) are a common snack. Soy milk is an ingredient in many " soft drink " beverages. Even if we, Americans (or other westerners), added as much soy as we possibly believed we could to our diets, we would likely never achieve the amounts of soy in the average Japanese diet. Regardless, there is no appreciable difference between the rates of onset of puberty in Japan and the onset rate elsewhere (the average onset in Japanese girls has been around 10 or 11 years of age, for at least the last 30 years). No significant difference in the occurrence of breast cancer or female reproductive system organ cancer between the Japanese population and any other world population has been noted. (Given the typical high-sugar Japanese diet -- sugar is added to almost every dish, because it gives " mother's taste " -- we must look elsewhere, other than soy -- or even sugar-- for substances which cause cancer in women.) For some reason, the allopathic medical community has latched onto the idea that soy is detrimental to women's health. Could it possibly be due to lobbying by animal protein source producers who wish to divert attention from hormone-enhanced meat products? (hormone injections of animals can cause more than just hormonal abnormalities in women. On a return visit to Taiwan, I became violently ill shortly after my " old customary breakfast " of pork and vegetable dumplings -- immediately, my Taiwanese friends suggested that I had eaten a " bad dumpling " made from the " neck meat " of a pig-- the hormones are injected into the neck--- I was so sick that I had to go to the nearest doctor -- fortunately he spoke a little English-- (usually, you just stick out your tongue, and let them feel your pulse, and you just hope for the best from whatever they give you, if you don't understand Chinese -- I did that, but he could speak English, so he told me that he thought I had eaten a " bad bao " , i.e., a dumpling made from injected neck meat) I took the mystery medicine from that doctor... what could I do? ... I was scheduled to fly out to Hong Kong the next day.... I arrived in Hong Kong sick as a dog, only able to request a " down bed " in the hostel, where I agonized for another day.) I would be worried, for sure, if I were to eat pork from a part of the pig which I could not identify as the part where the hormone injection had been given. I read information on a chicken package recently (my room-mate does not share my dietary proclivities). It said that hormone " additions " to meat are illegal -- I have never noticed such a notice on beef or pork, which she also brings in-- but....does that mean BEFORE or AFTER the animal is dead. This sort of information (gobbledygook), and lack thereof, makes me shy away from animal products. Meanwhile, I am just NOT afraid of soy. I think we should look at what happens with raw soybeans. Can we eat them? What will they taste like? What will happen if we don't cook them? Who has investigated this? (even personally, by sprouting them) If we cannot eat them raw.. if we cannot sprout them and eat them, then we should look at whether or not they are bad for us? Margaret Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 7, 2006 Report Share Posted May 7, 2006 I am clapping, Margaret. Thanks for your words. Judy On 5/6/06, Margaret Gamez <mgamez1 wrote: > > Stacey wrote: > > Soy has been implicated in the early > > puberty of young girls. > > > I know this post was originally explaining a point of view (not the > > poster's). But to me, is a ludicrous statement. So many young > > girls today begin puberty by age 10.........geeeeeee they must be > > afraid to admit that it is the growth hormones in all of the meat > > and dairy that these young girls are raised on?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? > > There have been comments in the nutrition community on effects in > certain countries (such as Brazil) where hormone use in beef > production is unregulated, regarding the early development of girls. > > Many people are concerned about soy consumption. The fact of the > matter is that, if laboratory rats are given about 100 times what a > human might be able to consume in one day, they might get sick. (in > laboratory studies of estrogen effects, the ovaries are removed from > rats, the rats are fed a low-estrogen diet, and then injected with 100 > times more estrogen than a human could consume in a day, or even a > week.) In other words, the fun part of what medical studies do is that > they give rats (not people, duh!) many times more than a person would > consume, and then draw conclusions about effects on humans based on > such information. > > Common sense provides us with conflicting information. > > Japanese studies show that soy is beneficial to health. In Japan, soy > is a basic element in the diet. Soy sauce is ever present. " Miso " , a > paste made from soybeans, is basic to most Japanese cooking, from > basic daily soups to pickles. Many Japanese believe that " natto " , a > fermented soybean product, is so important to health that they eat it > daily. Freshly steamed soybeans (edamame) are a common snack. Soy > milk is an ingredient in many " soft drink " beverages. Even if we, > Americans (or other westerners), added as much soy as we possibly > believed we could to our diets, we would likely never achieve the > amounts of soy in the average Japanese diet. Regardless, there is no > appreciable difference between the rates of onset of puberty in Japan > and the onset rate elsewhere (the average onset in Japanese girls has > been around 10 or 11 years of age, for at least the last 30 years). > No significant difference in the occurrence of breast cancer or female > reproductive system organ cancer between the Japanese population and > any other world population has been noted. (Given the typical > high-sugar Japanese diet -- sugar is added to almost every dish, > because it gives " mother's taste " -- we must look elsewhere, other than > soy -- or even sugar-- for substances which cause cancer in women.) > > For some reason, the allopathic medical community has latched onto the > idea that soy is detrimental to women's health. Could it possibly be > due to lobbying by animal protein source producers who wish to divert > attention from hormone-enhanced meat products? (hormone injections of > animals can cause more than just hormonal abnormalities in women. On > a return visit to Taiwan, I became violently ill shortly after my " old > customary breakfast " of pork and vegetable dumplings -- immediately, > my Taiwanese friends suggested that I had eaten a " bad dumpling " made > from the " neck meat " of a pig-- the hormones are injected into the > neck--- I was so sick that I had to go to the nearest doctor -- > fortunately he spoke a little English-- (usually, you just stick out > your tongue, and let them feel your pulse, and you just hope for the > best from whatever they give you, if you don't understand Chinese -- I > did that, but he could speak English, so he told me that he thought I > had eaten a " bad bao " , i.e., a dumpling made from injected neck meat) > I took the mystery medicine from that doctor... what could I do? ... I > was scheduled to fly out to Hong Kong the next day.... I arrived in > Hong Kong sick as a dog, only able to request a " down bed " in the > hostel, where I agonized for another day.) > I would be worried, for sure, if I were to eat pork from a part of the > pig which I could not identify as the part where the hormone injection > had been given. > I read information on a chicken package recently (my room-mate does > not share my dietary proclivities). It said that hormone " additions " > to meat are illegal -- I have never noticed such a notice on beef or > pork, which she also brings in-- but....does that mean BEFORE or AFTER > the animal is dead. > This sort of information (gobbledygook), and lack thereof, makes me > shy away from animal products. > > Meanwhile, I am just NOT afraid of soy. > > I think we should look at what happens with raw soybeans. Can we eat > them? What will they taste like? What will happen if we don't cook > them? Who has investigated this? (even personally, by sprouting them) > If we cannot eat them raw.. if we cannot sprout them and eat them, > then we should look at whether or not they are bad for us? > > Margaret > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 7, 2006 Report Share Posted May 7, 2006 In a message dated 5/6/2006 8:58:06 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, no_reply writes: Stacey, are you sure about this? My granddaughter is a vegetarian. Perhaps an over abundance of ANYTHING is not healthy? I cannot speak on the ramifications of eating much soy. I myself am hesitant due to the fact that it has been reported that soy causes a slower thyroid. I have also heard that soy has an affect on estrogen levels....at what quantity I am not sure, but maybe consuming mass quantities is just as bad as eating meat?:::::shrug:::::::: Is your vegetarian granddaughter entirely dairy free? Has she always been (meaning from birth)? I am just sitting here thinking hard and it all gets curioser and curiouser. I have read much regarding the state of the meat industry in general and the pictures it creates leaves me never craving any. I have also heard that the meat and dairy carry residual antibiotics and growth hormone. Another note here..........I wonder how many resistance to antibiotics is caused by ingesting so many antibiotics in meat and dairy?!?!?! This whole thread only serves to further my own commitment to a raw foods lifestyle. Soy is a processed food (except for raw edame...spelling?). Maybe is a sort of a non-issue on that level? Sorry for the late reply......I haven't been online since Friday and am enjoying all of the posts here. With Brightest Blessings and many musings, Stacey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 8, 2006 Report Share Posted May 8, 2006 I don't think I mentioned this before when I told the story of my female cousins going through puberty so early, but I don't believe it is just soy alone, but the fact that it was not organic. I think that makes a huge difference! Perhaps if they were drinking organic soy milk they wouldn't have as many problems, although they do still eat non-organic meat and cheese. BTW, these girls are 11 and 15 and are already taller than both of their parents! Cindy -- Version: 7.1.392 / Virus Database: 268.5.4/332 - Release 5/4/2006 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 8, 2006 Report Share Posted May 8, 2006 As a matter of fact, no. She isn't entirely dairy-free. She had a BIG dish of Ben & Jerry's Saturday night. That's a dairy and egg festival in itself. While B & J oppose the use of rBGH, that's only a small sector of the manufacturers so she could be getting _some_ in other things she eats. There seems to be a need for people on this forum to use soy whether it's good for them or not. As long as you don't hold me down and force me to eat it, it won't bother me one way or the other so have at it! Tommie http://www.rawburchard.blogspot.com rawfood , subtlewitch wrote: > > > In a message dated 5/6/2006 8:58:06 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, > no_reply writes: > > Stacey, are you sure about this? My granddaughter is a vegetarian. > > > Perhaps an over abundance of ANYTHING is not healthy? > I cannot speak on the ramifications of eating much soy. I myself am > hesitant due to the fact that it has been reported that soy causes a slower thyroid. > I have also heard that soy has an affect on estrogen levels....at what > quantity I am not sure, but maybe consuming mass quantities is just as bad as > eating meat?:::::shrug:::::::: Is your vegetarian granddaughter entirely dairy > free? Has she always been (meaning from birth)? I am just sitting here > thinking hard and it all gets curioser and curiouser. > > I have read much regarding the state of the meat industry in general and the > pictures it creates leaves me never craving any. I have also heard that the > meat and dairy carry residual antibiotics and growth hormone. Another note > here..........I wonder how many resistance to antibiotics is caused by > ingesting so many antibiotics in meat and dairy?!?!?! > > > This whole thread only serves to further my own commitment to a raw foods > lifestyle. Soy is a processed food (except for raw edame...spelling?). Maybe > is a sort of a non-issue on that level? > > Sorry for the late reply......I haven't been online since Friday and am > enjoying all of the posts here. > > With Brightest Blessings and many musings, > Stacey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 9, 2006 Report Share Posted May 9, 2006 I have a few questions: Are these girls eating only a vegan diet? What else are they eating? Hormones are injected into animals. Furthermore, hormones are not the only things that can produce unusual effects. Do these girls eat sugar? Have they taken antibiotics? Have we even considered the fact that human beings do change over time? I mean, heck! Romeo and Juliet were 13 and 14! there are so many things that could contribute The nature of our health establishment is to " identify " a transgressor and then " invent " a cure for it. Usually, that is a pill. My room-mate, who is Japanese, and who is working on PhD in animal psychology, has told me that part of her research involves injecting rats with estrogen. When this thread started, I went and annoyed her, asking about her studies and also about her own feelings about soy, based on her cultural background. What she told me was that, when they give estrogen to the rats, they inject an amount which is more than a human would likely consume in a month, even should said human eat soy at every meal. Not only do they inject massive amounts of the hormone, but it is pure. We simply cannot get that amount in our diet. Hence, we should look for some other cause of these perceived abnormalities. Margaret rawfood , " pruegert " <pruegert wrote: > > I don't think I mentioned this before when I told the story of my female > cousins going through puberty so early, but I don't believe it is just soy > alone, but the fact that it was not organic. I think that makes a huge > difference! Perhaps if they were drinking organic soy milk they wouldn't > have as many problems, although they do still eat non-organic meat and > cheese. > > BTW, these girls are 11 and 15 and are already taller than both of their > parents! > > Cindy > -- > > > Version: 7.1.392 / Virus Database: 268.5.4/332 - Release 5/4/2006 > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.