Guest guest Posted January 21, 2007 Report Share Posted January 21, 2007 In the defense of the RAV diet....and all " RAW Food " diets we all should Unite and learn from one another, share our experiences for each one of us is different with our own points of view and our own unique bodies Unite in Love and spread the good word on Health for all eating a more Raw Living diet why be so segregated with narrow minds yes we all have our " Opinions " and that is All they are...OPINIONS lets just share and learn from one another Me: Vegetarian 28 yrs, then vegan mostly for past 12 yrs, then raw vegan......now after much narrow mindedness and deteriorating health, have opened up and TRIED Other raw nutrition....Health is great improving this is my personal experience along with thousands of others. thank you for your time and consideration namaste Kieba " do not be sheep " in following 1 diet plan or 1 person be your Own leader and listen to your body .... it is telling you what it needs In rawfood , " Peter Gardiner " <petergardiner wrote: > > Doug, > > In response to your request for other to express their opinions on > debate and confrontation, > here goes. > > I agree constant confrontation is a pain in the neck. Furthermore when > dealing with rank prejudice > it can be destructive to bang on about diet. Even Christ said it is > sometimes better to turn the other cheek. > > However a forum without debate is hardly a forum. What would Socrates > or Plato say to a forum without debate. > > How could there be progress without enlightenment from debate? Have we > already arrived at a perfect understanding of what raw foodism is really > about? There is a richness in allowing for individual differences. > There is a purpose in helping others. > > If one just wants to share similar feelings, then an orgy is the best > place. There people have the sense > to say very little if anything. > > Peter > > > Roger Haeske [roger] > 07 July 2003 06:36 > rawfood > RE: [Raw Food] Re: Meat > > > > > > Roger; > > My position is that as raw fooders we get a lot of crap from our > friends and family. I don't think we need confrontation in this club. > Also I just don't think this is a good club for him. He may find > another club that eats meat. A place where he would be much happier. > [RH] > Yes I agree there must be a group more suited to Dave's current views on > nutrition. Though I wouldn't mind a friendly debate if someone wanted to > do so. I just feel it makes me stronger. > > To be great in tennis for instance, you have to have great competition. > Otherwise you would never develop your full potential. Maybe this isn't > the right place for a friendly debate. I'd be interested in what others > have to say about that. > > Roger > > > Doug > > > rawfood , " Roger Haeske " <roger@s...> wrote: > > I think we may have something to learn if we have people posting in > the > > group that don't exactly agree with us. > > > > Personally I like to read as much about health and nutrition as I > can. > > I've learned much from reading books that weren't about raw foods > only. > > Reading the book, Nutrition and Physical Degeneration was > enlightening. > > In it Dr. Price recommends and believes that we need certain animal > food > > factors for the best health. But I also realize the limitations in > his > > argument. He was studying nutrition in the 1930's and 40's. He > didn't > > understand that all the animals got their nutrition from raw plant > > foods. He didn't know anything about vegetarian nutritional > science. > > > > I've also read a very interesting book by Aajonus Vonderplanitz. > He's > > the guy who eats raw but also includes many raw animal products in > his > > diet. Again I learned much from reading that book. I even bought > some > > raw meat and ate it. But it really disgusted me and I quickly > realized > > we were not designed to eat meat. At least this is my current > viewpoint > > on it. Most of the evidence I've read points to that. > > > > Of course my beliefs about nutrition are also based on my particular > > beliefs in general. I disagree with the whole theory of evolution > for > > instance. I don't think it actually works in nature. If you study > it or > > read some counter opinions to that of the evolutionists you'll see > that > > it just doesn't make sense. Before I read this I was like most > people > > and believed in evolution. But it still is a theory to this day and > > always will be. > > > > I've also had a former long time vegetarian and raw foodist email > me all > > sorts of links about why eating vegetarian isn't the best way to > go. Of > > course I was already familiar with much of this literature, but not > all > > of it. I guess I don't have the time to read every single thing > that is > > out there. But it is good to see where people are coming from and > see if > > our current theory stands up to the truth of cause and effect. > > > > What if eating a vegetarian diet really is unhealthy? No matter how > > logical it seems people may be experiencing deficiencies without > meat. > > At least that is the viewpoint of some of these authors like Tom > > Billings. > > > > By the way I'll post some links on articles refuting the teachings > of > > Tom Billings by some nutritional scientists. You can decide for > > yourself. I think his website is http://www.beyondveg.com > > <http://www.beyondveg.com/> . Found an interesting website promoting > > veganism www.beyondvegetarian.com > <http://www.beyondvegetarian.com/> . > > > > Here are the links for the articles analyzing Tom Billings' > approach. > > http://venus.nildram.co.uk/veganmc/johnc.htm > > http://venus.nildram.co.uk/veganmc/polemics.htm > > http://www.vegsource.com/talk/raw/messages/1389.html > > > > Arguments or debates on nutrition will actually help us become > stronger > > in our own understanding. Though if we had constant wars on here, I > > don't think that we be too good either. > > > > Roger > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 21, 2007 Report Share Posted January 21, 2007 I am very surprised by all this agressivity, but i understand it too. I think in the sentence " I eat. " There is " I " which involve a part of unicity and difference for everyone. Personnally I am an idealist I've veggie for 2 years, vegan for 6 months and 100% raw for 8 days (today) but i will never refuse to admit that perhaps my choices in my diet are not perfect. I think you can be an omnivore and have a healthier life than a raw foodist. Because you can eat small amount of good meat and fish, seeds, grain and large amount of vegetables and fruit and so be very healthy. And you can eat just raw and not eat enough calories, or enough different kind of thing as vegetables, seaweeds, nuts, sprouted seeds and be hurting yourself. It's all about balance. We have to admit that we are searchers and not prophets. And not forget neither that nutrition is just a part of an healthy life, stress management, proper sleep, sport, interesting work and love are the others parts. I think tolerance is one key of the happiness. If I decide to not eat meat or uncooked food it's because i want to try something different and see if i feel better and happier in my life. And because i care of animals suffering and my health. And i am trying to have an optimal life and i think 100% raw may give it to me. But i will never refuse to sit at the table of an meat eater... or critisize their choices. Because it can be absolutly possible that small amount of organic meat, fish, dairy products or cooked food suit better for the human health. I'm just trying to find what work best for me and to listen to my body. And I think too, that when you try to control what you eat there is a part of you that you control a lot as well, because changement mean effort. If suddenly someone says to you all of this is wrong, it's difficult to admit that you hurt and frustrated yourself for " bad reason " so it's easier to refuse it and to get agressive and narrow mind. Let's relax and admit our imperfection and anyway every information about nutrition is interesting for us. xx > " Dawn " <kieba_om >rawfood >rawfood >[Raw Food] Re: Meat OPEN YOUR MINDS and Hearts >Sun, 21 Jan 2007 04:59:50 -0000 > >In the defense of the RAV diet....and all " RAW Food " diets >we all should Unite and learn from one another, share our experiences >for each one of us is different with our own points of view and our >own unique bodies Unite in Love and spread the good word on >Health for all eating a more Raw Living diet >why be so segregated with narrow minds yes we all have >our " Opinions " and that is All they are...OPINIONS >lets just share and learn from one another >Me: Vegetarian 28 yrs, then vegan mostly for past 12 yrs, then raw >vegan......now after much narrow mindedness and deteriorating health, >have opened up and TRIED Other raw nutrition....Health is great >improving this is my personal experience along with >thousands of others. >thank you for your time and consideration >namaste Kieba > " do not be sheep " in following 1 diet plan or 1 person >be your Own leader and listen to your body .... it is telling you >what it needs > > >In rawfood , " Peter Gardiner " <petergardiner >wrote: > > > > Doug, > > > > In response to your request for other to express their opinions on > > debate and confrontation, > > here goes. > > > > I agree constant confrontation is a pain in the neck. Furthermore >when > > dealing with rank prejudice > > it can be destructive to bang on about diet. Even Christ said it is > > sometimes better to turn the other cheek. > > > > However a forum without debate is hardly a forum. What would >Socrates > > or Plato say to a forum without debate. > > > > How could there be progress without enlightenment from debate? >Have we > > already arrived at a perfect understanding of what raw foodism is >really > > about? There is a richness in allowing for individual differences. > > There is a purpose in helping others. > > > > If one just wants to share similar feelings, then an orgy is the >best > > place. There people have the sense > > to say very little if anything. > > > > Peter > > > > > > Roger Haeske [roger] > > 07 July 2003 06:36 > > rawfood > > RE: [Raw Food] Re: Meat > > > > > > > > > > > > Roger; > > > > My position is that as raw fooders we get a lot of crap from our > > friends and family. I don't think we need confrontation in this >club. > > Also I just don't think this is a good club for him. He may find > > another club that eats meat. A place where he would be much happier. > > [RH] > > Yes I agree there must be a group more suited to Dave's current >views on > > nutrition. Though I wouldn't mind a friendly debate if someone >wanted to > > do so. I just feel it makes me stronger. > > > > To be great in tennis for instance, you have to have great >competition. > > Otherwise you would never develop your full potential. Maybe this >isn't > > the right place for a friendly debate. I'd be interested in what >others > > have to say about that. > > > > Roger > > > > > > Doug > > > > > > rawfood , " Roger Haeske " <roger@s...> wrote: > > > I think we may have something to learn if we have people posting >in > > the > > > group that don't exactly agree with us. > > > > > > Personally I like to read as much about health and nutrition as I > > can. > > > I've learned much from reading books that weren't about raw foods > > only. > > > Reading the book, Nutrition and Physical Degeneration was > > enlightening. > > > In it Dr. Price recommends and believes that we need certain >animal > > food > > > factors for the best health. But I also realize the limitations in > > his > > > argument. He was studying nutrition in the 1930's and 40's. He > > didn't > > > understand that all the animals got their nutrition from raw >plant > > > foods. He didn't know anything about vegetarian nutritional > > science. > > > > > > I've also read a very interesting book by Aajonus Vonderplanitz. > > He's > > > the guy who eats raw but also includes many raw animal products in > > his > > > diet. Again I learned much from reading that book. I even bought > > some > > > raw meat and ate it. But it really disgusted me and I quickly > > realized > > > we were not designed to eat meat. At least this is my current > > viewpoint > > > on it. Most of the evidence I've read points to that. > > > > > > Of course my beliefs about nutrition are also based on my >particular > > > beliefs in general. I disagree with the whole theory of evolution > > for > > > instance. I don't think it actually works in nature. If you study > > it or > > > read some counter opinions to that of the evolutionists you'll see > > that > > > it just doesn't make sense. Before I read this I was like most > > people > > > and believed in evolution. But it still is a theory to this day >and > > > always will be. > > > > > > I've also had a former long time vegetarian and raw foodist email > > me all > > > sorts of links about why eating vegetarian isn't the best way to > > go. Of > > > course I was already familiar with much of this literature, but >not > > all > > > of it. I guess I don't have the time to read every single thing > > that is > > > out there. But it is good to see where people are coming from and > > see if > > > our current theory stands up to the truth of cause and effect. > > > > > > What if eating a vegetarian diet really is unhealthy? No matter >how > > > logical it seems people may be experiencing deficiencies without > > meat. > > > At least that is the viewpoint of some of these authors like Tom > > > Billings. > > > > > > By the way I'll post some links on articles refuting the teachings > > of > > > Tom Billings by some nutritional scientists. You can decide for > > > yourself. I think his website is http://www.beyondveg.com > > > <http://www.beyondveg.com/> . Found an interesting website >promoting > > > veganism www.beyondvegetarian.com > > <http://www.beyondvegetarian.com/> . > > > > > > Here are the links for the articles analyzing Tom Billings' > > approach. > > > http://venus.nildram.co.uk/veganmc/johnc.htm > > > http://venus.nildram.co.uk/veganmc/polemics.htm > > > http://www.vegsource.com/talk/raw/messages/1389.html > > > > > > Arguments or debates on nutrition will actually help us become > > stronger > > > in our own understanding. Though if we had constant wars on here, >I > > > don't think that we be too good either. > > > > > > Roger > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 22, 2007 Report Share Posted January 22, 2007 Alix, I agree with not refusing to sit down with a 'meat eater' or criticize them. I think we should love them for who they are and just try to set a healthy example in hopes of winning them over! I do know being narrow minded or refusing to be around people just because we don't agree with their choices is ridiculous. People can be wonderful regardless of what they eat. Asa christian I run into a lot of people that may not share my beliefs, that doesn't make them bad people. I would miss out on some wonderful experiences if I would only associate with people that only agreed with my views. Alix Bernet <alixbr wrote: I am very surprised by all this agressivity, but i understand it too. I think in the sentence " I eat. " There is " I " which involve a part of unicity and difference for everyone. Personnally I am an idealist I've veggie for 2 years, vegan for 6 months and 100% raw for 8 days (today) but i will never refuse to admit that perhaps my choices in my diet are not perfect. I think you can be an omnivore and have a healthier life than a raw foodist. Because you can eat small amount of good meat and fish, seeds, grain and large amount of vegetables and fruit and so be very healthy. And you can eat just raw and not eat enough calories, or enough different kind of thing as vegetables, seaweeds, nuts, sprouted seeds and be hurting yourself. It's all about balance. We have to admit that we are searchers and not prophets. And not forget neither that nutrition is just a part of an healthy life, stress management, proper sleep, sport, interesting work and love are the others parts. I think tolerance is one key of the happiness. If I decide to not eat meat or uncooked food it's because i want to try something different and see if i feel better and happier in my life. And because i care of animals suffering and my health. And i am trying to have an optimal life and i think 100% raw may give it to me. But i will never refuse to sit at the table of an meat eater... or critisize their choices. Because it can be absolutly possible that small amount of organic meat, fish, dairy products or cooked food suit better for the human health. I'm just trying to find what work best for me and to listen to my body. And I think too, that when you try to control what you eat there is a part of you that you control a lot as well, because changement mean effort. If suddenly someone says to you all of this is wrong, it's difficult to admit that you hurt and frustrated yourself for " bad reason " so it's easier to refuse it and to get agressive and narrow mind. Let's relax and admit our imperfection and anyway every information about nutrition is interesting for us. xx Recent Activity 39 New Members Visit Your Group Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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