CHANGE THE HUSBAND'S MIND campaign - thank you

[Guest guest]

Thank you for all the recommendations. This is very helpful as I do not

have a lot of time (new baby) to do a lot of research on what is out

there these days. I am going to check out the online videos once I

work myself up to it. It has been a long time since I've exposed myself

to those types of images but I know that if I am to ask my husband to

view these, I need to be right there watching too. The pit in my

stomach has already started..

 

For now, things are sort of on hold here. My husband has agreed not to

eat meat until we " fix " this (meaning I be more accepting of this). I

honestly don't know if I can and it is a horrible feeling. We are

actually seeing a marriage counselor to get through this, and of course

there are other issues that come up in the process. I feel really

embarrassed about how this appears though - to others it must be so

comical that I am so upset about my husband eating meat. It is so much

deeper than this, but it's hard to get this point across fully to people

who are not vegetarians for the reasons I am. And I am generally a very

logical and accepting person, which makes this tough to sort out.

Logically, yes, he can eat meat and I can disagree with that and move

on. But the thought of him having dead animal working it's way through

his system is SO REPULSIVE that I can't see this ever working out. Not

to mention I would be married to a person with such different values and

morals. But it has to work out because we have two little children and

I do not want them to have divorced parents. Is this crazy that this so

painful and possibly a reason to part ways? I don't think I can ever

watch him eat meat without totally breaking down (not what I want the

unsupportive extended family to see happen). You can see why I need to

get him to come back to the good side here. Fortunately, because he

isn't out eating meat right now, we are able to carry on okay here with

the elephant in the closet. He's reading The China Study right now and

I don't know yet what he is thinking. I will wait until he gets further

in the book before asking.

 

Sigh, thanks for " listening. " I don't get much opportunity to discuss

how this affects me so I guess I just needed to get that out.

 

Hilary

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Hi Hilary,

Oh, I'm so glad you guys are getting counseling. That will be so

helpful. And please don't feel at all embarrassed or that you need to

question your ethics (like when you asked, " is this crazy. " ). This is

life and part of relationships - two different people can't agree on

everything all the time, and that's hard when it's your partner/spouse,

but that is the way it is - you are not being unreasonable or crazy.

You should not have to give up your ethics and moral beliefs for any

person, even the person you spend your life with. I hope so much that

you all figure this out and that either you get on the same page, or

that you agree to go to another page wherein you both meet your own

ethics in a way that works for the other. I know just how you feel

because this would be a challenging situation for me, too - but we have

friends who are a vegetarian living with a non-vegetarian couple, and

they just have ground rules about when and where the meat-eater can eat

meat. It's worked well for them for years and years - they just decided

this wasn't a deal breaker for them.

 

Best of luck and be sure to enjoy your new little baby amidst all this!

:-) That actually might be a good focus that can bring your two corners

together! :-)

Lorraine

 

 

On

Behalf Of hilbro

Wednesday, September 03, 2008 10:05 AM

 

CHANGE THE HUSBAND'S MIND campaign - thank you

 

 

Thank you for all the recommendations. This is very helpful as I do not

have a lot of time (new baby) to do a lot of research on what is out

there these days. I am going to check out the online videos once I

work myself up to it. It has been a long time since I've exposed myself

to those types of images but I know that if I am to ask my husband to

view these, I need to be right there watching too. The pit in my

stomach has already started..

 

For now, things are sort of on hold here. My husband has agreed not to

eat meat until we " fix " this (meaning I be more accepting of this). I

honestly don't know if I can and it is a horrible feeling. We are

actually seeing a marriage counselor to get through this, and of course

there are other issues that come up in the process. I feel really

embarrassed about how this appears though - to others it must be so

comical that I am so upset about my husband eating meat. It is so much

deeper than this, but it's hard to get this point across fully to people

who are not vegetarians for the reasons I am. And I am generally a very

logical and accepting person, which makes this tough to sort out.

Logically, yes, he can eat meat and I can disagree with that and move

on. But the thought of him having dead animal working it's way through

his system is SO REPULSIVE that I can't see this ever working out. Not

to mention I would be married to a person with such different values and

morals. But it has to work out because we have two little children and

I do not want them to have divorced parents. Is this crazy that this so

painful and possibly a reason to part ways? I don't think I can ever

watch him eat meat without totally breaking down (not what I want the

unsupportive extended family to see happen). You can see why I need to

get him to come back to the good side here. Fortunately, because he

isn't out eating meat right now, we are able to carry on okay here with

the elephant in the closet. He's reading The China Study right now and

I don't know yet what he is thinking. I will wait until he gets further

in the book before asking.

 

Sigh, thanks for " listening. " I don't get much opportunity to discuss

how this affects me so I guess I just needed to get that out.

 

Hilary

 

 

[Guest guest]

Hilary,

I feel so bad for you.  I know without a doubt that I would be affected the same

as you are....for so many reasons, most of which you have mentioned.  Add to it

that my home is my sanctuary, my escape from having to deal with the reality of

the suffering caused by our meat-eating world..  Not that I actually forget, but

I get to be surrounded by my husband and children who feel the way that I do and

support my feelings. 

Recently my husband mentioned how hard it can be for him to be vegan because he

just started a new job and the people he works with (all men) don't know.  It

was upseting to me just to think that he might be thinking that it's too hard,

but he reassured me that he would never eat meat, it's just hard..  I do think

that it's harder for men in some ways.

Trust me, if he were to give up being vegan it would not go well.  I married him

with the understanding that we held the same beliefs and that is important to

me. 

Btw, there is no shame in seeing a marriage counselor for any reason.  Everybody

should have one!  Though if you find that you are unsatisfied with your

counselor, you definitely need to try someone else.  There are great counselors

out there and not-so-great ones.

People sometimes ask me what I would do if my kids want to eat meat when they

are teenagers and I would tell them that I wouldn't necessarily stop them, but I

would definitely take them to one of the nearby slaughterhouses to witness what

they are supporting and fully realize where their meat comes from.

I know that the large slaughterhouses would not let you, however the smaller

ones will if you make up a reason about why.  Perhaps you should ask your

husband if he would be willing to visit one.

Jill

 

 

 

 

hilbro <hilbro

 

Wednesday, September 3, 2008 12:05:15 PM

CHANGE THE HUSBAND'S MIND campaign - thank you

 

 

 

Thank you for all the recommendations. This is very helpful as I do not

have a lot of time (new baby) to do a lot of research on what is out

there these days. I am going to check out the online videos once I

work myself up to it. It has been a long time since I've exposed myself

to those types of images but I know that if I am to ask my husband to

view these, I need to be right there watching too. The pit in my

stomach has already started..

 

For now, things are sort of on hold here. My husband has agreed not to

eat meat until we " fix " this (meaning I be more accepting of this). I

honestly don't know if I can and it is a horrible feeling. We are

actually seeing a marriage counselor to get through this, and of course

there are other issues that come up in the process. I feel really

embarrassed about how this appears though - to others it must be so

comical that I am so upset about my husband eating meat. It is so much

deeper than this, but it's hard to get this point across fully to people

who are not vegetarians for the reasons I am. And I am generally a very

logical and accepting person, which makes this tough to sort out.

Logically, yes, he can eat meat and I can disagree with that and move

on. But the thought of him having dead animal working it's way through

his system is SO REPULSIVE that I can't see this ever working out. Not

to mention I would be married to a person with such different values and

morals. But it has to work out because we have two little children and

I do not want them to have divorced parents. Is this crazy that this so

painful and possibly a reason to part ways? I don't think I can ever

watch him eat meat without totally breaking down (not what I want the

unsupportive extended family to see happen). You can see why I need to

get him to come back to the good side here. Fortunately, because he

isn't out eating meat right now, we are able to carry on okay here with

the elephant in the closet. He's reading The China Study right now and

I don't know yet what he is thinking. I will wait until he gets further

in the book before asking.

 

Sigh, thanks for " listening. " I don't get much opportunity to discuss

how this affects me so I guess I just needed to get that out.

 

Hilary

 

 

[Guest guest]

(((Hilary))) FWIW, I get it. My husband and I have differing opinions on a

LOT of really major issues in our lives, especially as regards child raising

(immunization and homeschooling are two issues we hardly dare even bring up

for fear of a major blowout). We love each other dearly, but our different views

and values have caused MAJOR marriage problems in the past. It has been

really, really hard to get through these times. But as you said--with kids in

the

picture, divorce is not an easy option!

 

You know you can't ignore your feelings, and all that you know about meat

eating. Hang in there! You're doing the best you can to help your husband

through this issue. I really hope he listens! Marilyn

 

 

 

 

 

**************It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel

deal here.

(http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv00050000000047)

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

, " hilbro " <hilbro wrote:

>

> So sorry that you are dealing with this..((((Big Hugs)))). I have a question.

When you met,

were you both vegan at the time? If not, did you both collectively decide on

changing your

diet and lifestyle? If it is the later, Did you change before the marriage or

after?

 

Why I am asking is that if you were not vegans to begin with or you were and he

wasnt, he

may have not been fully committed to it from the beginning. I KNOW that my

daughter will

never eat animal again. I can feel it in my core that she will not. I do not

even have to ask.

He may have hit a bump in the vegan road. Maybe with more reading, he will start

back

again, maybe be a vegetarian for awhile and then ease back into being vegan.

Do not let this ruin a wonderful marriage. You are in counseling and he will

either go back to

being animal free or he wont. If you both work very hard at finding a

resolution, whatever the

outcome, you will know that he loves you enough to try and work it out.

 

(can you tell I have been married for over 20+ years?)

 

I will be thinking of you.

[Guest guest]

Jill,

My husband is vegan as is my 12 yr. old son. I often think it would be a

great idea to have a vegan men's group.

Laura in MD

 

 

 

**************It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel

deal here.

(http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv00050000000047)

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Hillary,

I have never responded on this group before, just read through

things once and a while. But reading how this issue is pulling at

you, I can very much understand.

I have been a vegetarian for almost 20 years, a few of them

vegan. The book that first woke me up was called " Old McDonalds

Factory Farm " by C.David Coats. After that I knew I would NEVER eat

another animal again. I have struggled with living with someone who

is not a Veg. It is very hard to live with the fact that the person

you love dosen't see things the same way you do. I have two children

that we are raising Veg. and he has no issues with that. In those

regards, he is very supportive. I have just had to come to the place

that sometimes it takes people many years to finally come around to a

place inside them self that they can understand the whole picture of

what eating meat really means in all areas of the world.

I have also learned through much reading on the subject, that

trying to get people to think the way you do can sometimes have an

opposite effect. I try to bring facts into the picture once and a

while in hopes that someday he might want to turn his diet around.

For now, the fact that he is supportive with me and the kids, and

will eat vegetarian meals with us sometimes must be ok for me right

now.

In my heart I know I am doing all I can to make this a better

world for those who can not speak, and hopefully by my actions, that

will change someone elses way of thinking.

Good luck, I admire you for taking such a stand.

Theresa.

[Guest guest]

, VAP79 wrote:

>

> Jill,

> My husband is vegan as is my 12 yr. old son. I often think it would be

a

> great idea to have a vegan men's group.

> Laura in MD

>

>

>

 

 

I agree - a vegan/vegetarian men's group would be wonderful! I don't

know any other male vegetarians and I think if my husband had contact

with other vegetarians he might not feel so out of place. He says he

is uncomfortable " being special " in front of others, but seriously he

has special needs regarding food anyway. He's super picky - no onions

(unless blended), no tomatoes but pizza sauce is okay, no spaghetti

sauce on pasta (plain with butter), peas have to be baby peas from the

can (no other kind), nothing can be mixed so casseroles are out, skippy

peanut butter only (I tried bringing home jiff once and he went right

out and bought skippy because in the third grade his class did a taste

test with brands and he liked skippy, no need to ever try anything

else)... the list goes on. He says this is mostly a texture thing. I

try to understand but sometimes I just lose it. for instance, I made

cream of carrot soup a couple days ago thinking he eats carrots so

that's good, and it's blended so that's good. He hated it. During the

argument that followed he said " maybe there is a hint of carrot flavor

in there but that's it. " THERE WERE TWELVE FRIGGIN CARROTS IN THERE and

one potato. Give me a break!

 

okay, we worked past that one and I better not get all in a tiffy again

over it or it will ruin my night

 

SO, a vegetarian/vegan men's group would be great, as I was saying

earlier...

 

Hilary

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Oh thank you for your story. I truly hope I can get to the accepting

place that you have reached. The tough thing is that he was

vegetarian for 12 years before deciding he was done with it, and I

married him as a vegetarian (a high priority on my list of must-

have's in a relationship). I am hopeful that after some reading and

re-connecting with the benefits of being vegetarian, he might once

again realize that this decision was only because he wasn't so aware

of the issues at hand anymore. I am really scared that he will read

and still determine this isn't for him though. I know deep down in

my heart that I cannot change him unless he wants to change but I

can't sit back and do nothing. I was attracted to him partly because

[i thought] he was confident in his vegetarian beliefs. I wish I

could fast forward to the end and see where he's at with this - I'm

feeling anxious while I wait for him to millimeter his way through

these books (he doesn't have much time to read now that summer is

over). Thank you for your encouragement.

 

Hilary

 

 

> Hillary,

> I have never responded on this group before, just read through

> things once and a while. But reading how this issue is pulling at

> you, I can very much understand.

> I have been a vegetarian for almost 20 years, a few of them

> vegan. The book that first woke me up was called " Old McDonalds

> Factory Farm " by C.David Coats. After that I knew I would NEVER eat

> another animal again. I have struggled with living with someone

who

> is not a Veg. It is very hard to live with the fact that the

person

> you love dosen't see things the same way you do. I have two

children

> that we are raising Veg. and he has no issues with that. In those

> regards, he is very supportive. I have just had to come to the

place

> that sometimes it takes people many years to finally come around to

a

> place inside them self that they can understand the whole picture

of

> what eating meat really means in all areas of the world.

> I have also learned through much reading on the subject, that

> trying to get people to think the way you do can sometimes have an

> opposite effect. I try to bring facts into the picture once and a

> while in hopes that someday he might want to turn his diet around.

> For now, the fact that he is supportive with me and the kids, and

> will eat vegetarian meals with us sometimes must be ok for me right

> now.

> In my heart I know I am doing all I can to make this a better

> world for those who can not speak, and hopefully by my actions,

that

> will change someone elses way of thinking.

> Good luck, I admire you for taking such a stand.

> Theresa.

>

[Guest guest]

I will talk to my husband about a men's veg group tonight. 

He is under the impression that the only other veg men out there are,

um,  " weird " . 

I know that's terrible and silly and terrible.  But we don't meet other

vegetarians and the impression is that we are " weird " . 

We are definitely veg due to animal welfare issues and to a much smaller extent

for health.  So, I guess I would hope that a veg men's group wouldn't confirm

his belief.  We are not health nuts.  We use Peta's " vegan " list.  We drive

cars.  Before digital, we used film.  However, we have also participated in

circus/kfc protests.

I know sometimes I don't write on this group because I feel that I will be

judged as a " bad " vegan - I love my epidurals, I only nursed for a couple of

months, etc, etc, etc.

Hopefully men wouldn't run into their own things like that. 

 

 

 

 

hilbro <hilbro

 

Monday, September 8, 2008 7:21:20 PM

Re: CHANGE THE HUSBAND'S MIND campaign - thank you

 

 

 

 

@gro ups.com, VAP79 wrote:

>

> Jill,

> My husband is vegan as is my 12 yr. old son. I often think it would be

a

> great idea to have a vegan men's group.

> Laura in MD

>

>

>

 

I agree - a vegan/vegetarian men's group would be wonderful! I don't

know any other male vegetarians and I think if my husband had contact

with other vegetarians he might not feel so out of place. He says he

is uncomfortable " being special " in front of others, but seriously he

has special needs regarding food anyway. He's super picky - no onions

(unless blended), no tomatoes but pizza sauce is okay, no spaghetti

sauce on pasta (plain with butter), peas have to be baby peas from the

can (no other kind), nothing can be mixed so casseroles are out, skippy

peanut butter only (I tried bringing home jiff once and he went right

out and bought skippy because in the third grade his class did a taste

test with brands and he liked skippy, no need to ever try anything

else)... the list goes on. He says this is mostly a texture thing. I

try to understand but sometimes I just lose it. for instance, I made

cream of carrot soup a couple days ago thinking he eats carrots so

that's good, and it's blended so that's good. He hated it. During the

argument that followed he said " maybe there is a hint of carrot flavor

in there but that's it. " THERE WERE TWELVE FRIGGIN CARROTS IN THERE and

one potato. Give me a break!

 

okay, we worked past that one and I better not get all in a tiffy again

over it or it will ruin my night

 

SO, a vegetarian/vegan men's group would be great, as I was saying

earlier...

 

Hilary

 

 

[Guest guest]

Bravo for epidurals! My third child was born about 5 minutes after the epidural

was in, so I probably didn't need it. But I took it anyway! If this kind of

thing makes us 'bad' vegs, so be it. Amazing that there can be so much pressure

to conform, in a group of non-conformists. I don't think men would EVER put this

much pressure on themselves or each other.

 

 

 

 

Jillene Wenzel <jillben2008

 

Tuesday, September 9, 2008 9:41:19 AM

Re: Re: CHANGE THE HUSBAND'S MIND campaign - thank you

 

 

I will talk to my husband about a men's veg group tonight. 

He is under the impression that the only other veg men out there are,

um,  " weird " . 

I know that's terrible and silly and terrible.  But we don't meet other

vegetarians and the impression is that we are " weird " . 

We are definitely veg due to animal welfare issues and to a much smaller extent

for health.  So, I guess I would hope that a veg men's group wouldn't confirm

his belief.  We are not health nuts.  We use Peta's " vegan " list.  We drive

cars.  Before digital, we used film.  However, we have also participated in

circus/kfc protests.

I know sometimes I don't write on this group because I feel that I will be

judged as a " bad " vegan - I love my epidurals, I only nursed for a couple of

months, etc, etc, etc.

Hopefully men wouldn't run into their own things like that. 

 

 

hilbro <hilbro >

@gro ups.com

Monday, September 8, 2008 7:21:20 PM

Re: CHANGE THE HUSBAND'S MIND campaign - thank you

 

@gro ups.com, VAP79 wrote:

>

> Jill,

> My husband is vegan as is my 12 yr. old son. I often think it would be

a

> great idea to have a vegan men's group.

> Laura in MD

>

>

>

 

I agree - a vegan/vegetarian men's group would be wonderful! I don't

know any other male vegetarians and I think if my husband had contact

with other vegetarians he might not feel so out of place. He says he

is uncomfortable " being special " in front of others, but seriously he

has special needs regarding food anyway. He's super picky - no onions

(unless blended), no tomatoes but pizza sauce is okay, no spaghetti

sauce on pasta (plain with butter), peas have to be baby peas from the

can (no other kind), nothing can be mixed so casseroles are out, skippy

peanut butter only (I tried bringing home jiff once and he went right

out and bought skippy because in the third grade his class did a taste

test with brands and he liked skippy, no need to ever try anything

else)... the list goes on. He says this is mostly a texture thing. I

try to understand but sometimes I just lose it. for instance, I made

cream of carrot soup a couple days ago thinking he eats carrots so

that's good, and it's blended so that's good. He hated it. During the

argument that followed he said " maybe there is a hint of carrot flavor

in there but that's it. " THERE WERE TWELVE FRIGGIN CARROTS IN THERE and

one potato. Give me a break!

 

okay, we worked past that one and I better not get all in a tiffy again

over it or it will ruin my night

 

SO, a vegetarian/vegan men's group would be great, as I was saying

earlier...

 

Hilary

 

 

[Guest guest]

You know, it occured to me that your husband might have some sort of disorder

re:the textures, extreme pickiness.If we saw that in one of our kids, we'd

probably get it checked out as some sort of sensory thing but adults are out of

luck because they didn't know about that stuff when we were kids. My husband has

a lot of the same dietary issues as your husband, and I consider it part of his

OCD, but it could be a sensory issue, too. Not that there's necessarily anything

you can do about it, but it might help you to not get so annoyed (believe me, it

annoys me, too. It seems like they LIKE to be difficult at times).

 

 

 

 

hilbro <hilbro

 

Monday, September 8, 2008 7:21:20 PM

Re: CHANGE THE HUSBAND'S MIND campaign - thank you

 

 

 

 

@gro ups.com, VAP79 wrote:

>

> Jill,

> My husband is vegan as is my 12 yr. old son. I often think it would be

a

> great idea to have a vegan men's group.

> Laura in MD

>

>

>

 

I agree - a vegan/vegetarian men's group would be wonderful! I don't

know any other male vegetarians and I think if my husband had contact

with other vegetarians he might not feel so out of place. He says he

is uncomfortable " being special " in front of others, but seriously he

has special needs regarding food anyway. He's super picky - no onions

(unless blended), no tomatoes but pizza sauce is okay, no spaghetti

sauce on pasta (plain with butter), peas have to be baby peas from the

can (no other kind), nothing can be mixed so casseroles are out, skippy

peanut butter only (I tried bringing home jiff once and he went right

out and bought skippy because in the third grade his class did a taste

test with brands and he liked skippy, no need to ever try anything

else)... the list goes on. He says this is mostly a texture thing. I

try to understand but sometimes I just lose it. for instance, I made

cream of carrot soup a couple days ago thinking he eats carrots so

that's good, and it's blended so that's good. He hated it. During the

argument that followed he said " maybe there is a hint of carrot flavor

in there but that's it. " THERE WERE TWELVE FRIGGIN CARROTS IN THERE and

one potato. Give me a break!

 

okay, we worked past that one and I better not get all in a tiffy again

over it or it will ruin my night

 

SO, a vegetarian/vegan men's group would be great, as I was saying

earlier...

 

Hilary

 

 

[Guest guest]

Thank you - it really helps to hear that I am not crazy. My husband

keeps saying that it shouldn't affect me because I'm not going to have

to eat meat. I understand that but it certainly does affect me and

unfortunately the way I feel about him. Then I get accused of not giving

unconditional love. I love him, it's just hard to get past this right

now.

 

 

 

thanks,

 

hilary

, " Lorraine " <ldemi wrote:

>

> Hi Hilary,

> Oh, I'm so glad you guys are getting counseling. That will be so

> helpful. And please don't feel at all embarrassed or that you need to

> question your ethics (like when you asked, " is this crazy. " ). This is

> life and part of relationships - two different people can't agree on

> everything all the time, and that's hard when it's your

partner/spouse,

> but that is the way it is - you are not being unreasonable or crazy.

> You should not have to give up your ethics and moral beliefs for any

> person, even the person you spend your life with. I hope so much that

> you all figure this out and that either you get on the same page, or

> that you agree to go to another page wherein you both meet your own

> ethics in a way that works for the other. I know just how you feel

> because this would be a challenging situation for me, too - but we

have

> friends who are a vegetarian living with a non-vegetarian couple, and

> they just have ground rules about when and where the meat-eater can

eat

> meat. It's worked well for them for years and years - they just

decided

> this wasn't a deal breaker for them.

>

> Best of luck and be sure to enjoy your new little baby amidst all

this!

> :-) That actually might be a good focus that can bring your two

corners

> together! :-)

> Lorraine

>

>

[Guest guest]

It is so nice to read what you typed because you seem to know exactly

what I'm feeling. In fact, your description of feeling your home is a

sanctuary has been in my head ever since I read it the first time. I've

realized that is a huge reason this is so unsettling. It affects my one

and only comfort zone where I do not need to be confronted with the

issue of eating meat. Even though my husband says he will never bring

it into the house, I will still have to see him every day knowing that

he is 'one of them'. And I won't ever be able to handle actually being

in his company while he does it (like at a family gathering - ugh, just

the thought kills me) so what am I supposed to do? I know my family

members as well as my husband's will be chuckling behind my back. It

looks really bad, like I forced him to be vegetarian in order to marry

me and now he's come to his senses. That is what it will look like and

that is SO not the case. But you can't reason with people who scoff at

the idea of not eating meat. They will think what they want to think so

it makes them feel better about themselves. It is their problem, I

know. I will need to find that happy place within myself to let it all

run off my back. Thanks for your support.

 

 

 

Hilary

 

, Jillene Wenzel <jillben2008

wrote:

>

> Hilary,

> I feel so bad for you. I know without a doubt that I would be

affected the same as you are....for so many reasons, most of which you

have mentioned. Add to it that my home is my sanctuary, my escape from

having to deal with the reality of the suffering caused by our

meat-eating world.. Not that I actually forget, but I get to be

surrounded by my husband and children who feel the way that I do and

support my feelings.

> Recently my husband mentioned how hard it can be for him to be vegan

because he just started a new job and the people he works with (all men)

don't know. It was upseting to me just to think that he might be

thinking that it's too hard, but he reassured me that he would never eat

meat, it's just hard.. I do think that it's harder for men in some

ways.

> Trust me, if he were to give up being vegan it would not go well. I

married him with the understanding that we held the same beliefs and

that is important to me.

> Btw, there is no shame in seeing a marriage counselor for any reason.

Everybody should have one! Though if you find that you are unsatisfied

with your counselor, you definitely need to try someone else. There are

great counselors out there and not-so-great ones.

> People sometimes ask me what I would do if my kids want to eat meat

when they are teenagers and I would tell them that I wouldn't

necessarily stop them, but I would definitely take them to one of the

nearby slaughterhouses to witness what they are supporting and fully

realize where their meat comes from.

> I know that the large slaughterhouses would not let you, however the

smaller ones will if you make up a reason about why. Perhaps you should

ask your husband if he would be willing to visit one.

> Jill

>

>

>

>

> hilbro hilbro

>

> Wednesday, September 3, 2008 12:05:15 PM

> CHANGE THE HUSBAND'S MIND campaign - thank you

>

>

>

> Thank you for all the recommendations. This is very helpful as I do

not

> have a lot of time (new baby) to do a lot of research on what is out

> there these days. I am going to check out the online videos once I

> work myself up to it. It has been a long time since I've exposed

myself

> to those types of images but I know that if I am to ask my husband to

> view these, I need to be right there watching too. The pit in my

> stomach has already started..

>

> For now, things are sort of on hold here. My husband has agreed not to

> eat meat until we " fix " this (meaning I be more accepting of this). I

> honestly don't know if I can and it is a horrible feeling. We are

> actually seeing a marriage counselor to get through this, and of

course

> there are other issues that come up in the process. I feel really

> embarrassed about how this appears though - to others it must be so

> comical that I am so upset about my husband eating meat. It is so much

> deeper than this, but it's hard to get this point across fully to

people

> who are not vegetarians for the reasons I am. And I am generally a

very

> logical and accepting person, which makes this tough to sort out.

> Logically, yes, he can eat meat and I can disagree with that and move

> on. But the thought of him having dead animal working it's way through

> his system is SO REPULSIVE that I can't see this ever working out. Not

> to mention I would be married to a person with such different values

and

> morals. But it has to work out because we have two little children and

> I do not want them to have divorced parents. Is this crazy that this

so

> painful and possibly a reason to part ways? I don't think I can ever

> watch him eat meat without totally breaking down (not what I want the

> unsupportive extended family to see happen). You can see why I need to

> get him to come back to the good side here. Fortunately, because he

> isn't out eating meat right now, we are able to carry on okay here

with

> the elephant in the closet. He's reading The China Study right now and

> I don't know yet what he is thinking. I will wait until he gets

further

> in the book before asking.

>

> Sigh, thanks for " listening. " I don't get much opportunity to discuss

> how this affects me so I guess I just needed to get that out.

>

> Hilary

>

>

[Guest guest]

I had the same thought when I read that email. If I had a kid that picky I

would be tempted to tell them they are in charge of their own cooking from now

on. Or take some kind of measures to put a stop to it. What does your husband

do for you? For instance, my husband's main chore around the house is taking

out the garbage. What if I told him he could only do it between 10 and 10:15

and every trash bag had to be a different color and the trash cans all had to

face east and he could only use his right hand? Really, these things get out of

hand. That is a lot to put up with and still try to feed kids a healthy diet

too.

 

:-)

 

Dee

 

-

jenni claire garverick

Tuesday, September 09, 2008 12:41 PM

Re: Re: CHANGE THE HUSBAND'S MIND campaign - thank you

 

 

You know, it occured to me that your husband might have some sort of disorder

re:the textures, extreme pickiness.If we saw that in one of our kids, we'd

probably get it checked out as some sort of sensory thing but adults are out of

luck because they didn't know about that stuff when we were kids. My husband has

a lot of the same dietary issues as your husband, and I consider it part of his

OCD, but it could be a sensory issue, too. Not that there's necessarily anything

you can do about it, but it might help you to not get so annoyed (believe me, it

annoys me, too. It seems like they LIKE to be difficult at times).

 

hilbro <hilbro

Monday, September 8, 2008 7:21:20 PM

Re: CHANGE THE HUSBAND'S MIND campaign - thank you

 

@gro ups.com, VAP79 wrote:

>

> Jill,

> My husband is vegan as is my 12 yr. old son. I often think it would be

a

> great idea to have a vegan men's group.

> Laura in MD

>

>

>

 

I agree - a vegan/vegetarian men's group would be wonderful! I don't

know any other male vegetarians and I think if my husband had contact

with other vegetarians he might not feel so out of place. He says he

is uncomfortable " being special " in front of others, but seriously he

has special needs regarding food anyway. He's super picky - no onions

(unless blended), no tomatoes but pizza sauce is okay, no spaghetti

sauce on pasta (plain with butter), peas have to be baby peas from the

can (no other kind), nothing can be mixed so casseroles are out, skippy

peanut butter only (I tried bringing home jiff once and he went right

out and bought skippy because in the third grade his class did a taste

test with brands and he liked skippy, no need to ever try anything

else)... the list goes on. He says this is mostly a texture thing. I

try to understand but sometimes I just lose it. for instance, I made

cream of carrot soup a couple days ago thinking he eats carrots so

that's good, and it's blended so that's good. He hated it. During the

argument that followed he said " maybe there is a hint of carrot flavor

in there but that's it. " THERE WERE TWELVE FRIGGIN CARROTS IN THERE and

one potato. Give me a break!

 

okay, we worked past that one and I better not get all in a tiffy again

over it or it will ruin my night

 

SO, a vegetarian/vegan men's group would be great, as I was saying

earlier...

 

Hilary

 

[Guest guest]

You are not alone. I'm a bad vegan too, I guess. In fact, I'm off to make some

chocolate chip bars for my kids lunch - although they are from How it all Vegan.

:-) I'm vegan, but the rest of the bunch is vegetarian. My kids have never been

known to turn down " junk, " although they refuse items with gelatin and my son

will say " no thanks " if he's full (my daughter would not). I had two epidurals

and some pain meds on top of that.

 

Anyway, I'm just amazed that your husbands would consider joining a men's

vegan/vegetarian group, because mine would run screaming the other way. He

became veg of his own accord a couple of years after I did, and cannot imagine

ever going back, but he says that groups of vegetarians are " weird. " Several

years ago I tried to get him to go to a vegetarian Thanksgiving dinner, but he

adamently refused, saying it would be a gathering of strange people. He's

content to be veg and would not care if he never met another veg, although he's

not really into joining groups in general (unless it's poker).

 

Karen

 

 

-

jenni claire garverick

Tuesday, September 09, 2008 3:17 PM

Re: Re: CHANGE THE HUSBAND'S MIND campaign - thank you

 

 

Bravo for epidurals! My third child was born about 5 minutes after the

epidural was in, so I probably didn't need it. But I took it anyway! If this

kind of thing makes us 'bad' vegs, so be it. Amazing that there can be so much

pressure to conform, in a group of non-conformists. I don't think men would EVER

put this much pressure on themselves or each other.

 

Jillene Wenzel <jillben2008

Tuesday, September 9, 2008 9:41:19 AM

Re: Re: CHANGE THE HUSBAND'S MIND campaign - thank you

 

I will talk to my husband about a men's veg group tonight.

He is under the impression that the only other veg men out there are, um,

" weird " .

I know that's terrible and silly and terrible. But we don't meet other

vegetarians and the impression is that we are " weird " .

We are definitely veg due to animal welfare issues and to a much smaller

extent for health. So, I guess I would hope that a veg men's group wouldn't

confirm his belief. We are not health nuts. We use Peta's " vegan " list. We

drive cars. Before digital, we used film. However, we have also participated

in circus/kfc protests.

I know sometimes I don't write on this group because I feel that I will be

judged as a " bad " vegan - I love my epidurals, I only nursed for a couple of

months, etc, etc, etc.

Hopefully men wouldn't run into their own things like that.

 

hilbro <hilbro >

@gro ups.com

Monday, September 8, 2008 7:21:20 PM

Re: CHANGE THE HUSBAND'S MIND campaign - thank you

 

@gro ups.com, VAP79 wrote:

>

> Jill,

> My husband is vegan as is my 12 yr. old son. I often think it would be

a

> great idea to have a vegan men's group.

> Laura in MD

>

>

>

 

I agree - a vegan/vegetarian men's group would be wonderful! I don't

know any other male vegetarians and I think if my husband had contact

with other vegetarians he might not feel so out of place. He says he

is uncomfortable " being special " in front of others, but seriously he

has special needs regarding food anyway. He's super picky - no onions

(unless blended), no tomatoes but pizza sauce is okay, no spaghetti

sauce on pasta (plain with butter), peas have to be baby peas from the

can (no other kind), nothing can be mixed so casseroles are out, skippy

peanut butter only (I tried bringing home jiff once and he went right

out and bought skippy because in the third grade his class did a taste

test with brands and he liked skippy, no need to ever try anything

else)... the list goes on. He says this is mostly a texture thing. I

try to understand but sometimes I just lose it. for instance, I made

cream of carrot soup a couple days ago thinking he eats carrots so

that's good, and it's blended so that's good. He hated it. During the

argument that followed he said " maybe there is a hint of carrot flavor

in there but that's it. " THERE WERE TWELVE FRIGGIN CARROTS IN THERE and

one potato. Give me a break!

 

okay, we worked past that one and I better not get all in a tiffy again

over it or it will ruin my night

 

SO, a vegetarian/vegan men's group would be great, as I was saying

earlier...

 

Hilary

 

[Guest guest]

Hi,

thanks for the hugs To answer your question, I became a vegetarian

at 16 (18 yrs ago) and my husband didn't until a couple years before

we married (12 years ago). I know he never would have learned about

the animal welfare issues (my main reason for being veg at that time,

now it is really for all reasons) so technically I definitely

influenced him in his decision. I asked him to read Diet for a new

american and Factory Farms. He was really bothered by the info in

those books and agreed that eating meat was wrong. It was really

important to me that he come to this conclusion for himself, not for

me or to stay with me, and I stressed this with him multiple times.

I believed him and he says now that in the beginning he did feel

strongly about not eating animals. Just somewhere along the way he

started not caring so much anymore.

 

I think part of the reason he has lost touch is due to the shift of

priorities you have when you have kids. It was crazy for me, I know,

that after having our first son almost four years ago, our three

dogs - our " children " - suddenly became dogs to us. We still loved

them but I never thought I would see a dog as anything other than an

equally important living being in this world. I guess I should say

that I do still feel they are equally important, I just don't have

the time and energy now to make sure our dog has the best possible

life (and I've since learned from The Dog Whisperer that a dog is

happier being a dog than being a person...). So maybe he is feeling

the same thing and just needs to be reminded why he decided to become

a vegetarian. Sounds so simple, right? I have this horrible fear

that he will read these books and still say " nope, it isn't for me "

though. At least right now I have hope.

 

And if he still chooses to eat meat, it will certainly force me to be

accepting of this. I don't want a divorce, I just don't know how I

can be happy with him enough to enjoy the marriage if that's the

case. I have to trust that whatever decision he makes will be good

for me - I am sure I will grow somehow and I think I already have a

little. Maybe not, now that I feel that same pit in my stomach at

the thought of him eating meat...

 

( " I will grow, I will grow, I will grow "

Hilary >

 

 

> , " hilbro " <hilbro@> wrote:

> >

> > So sorry that you are dealing with this..((((Big Hugs)))). I have

a question. When you met,

> were you both vegan at the time? If not, did you both collectively

decide on changing your

> diet and lifestyle? If it is the later, Did you change before the

marriage or after?

>

> Why I am asking is that if you were not vegans to begin with or you

were and he wasnt, he

> may have not been fully committed to it from the beginning. I KNOW

that my daughter will

> never eat animal again. I can feel it in my core that she will not.

I do not even have to ask.

> He may have hit a bump in the vegan road. Maybe with more reading,

he will start back

> again, maybe be a vegetarian for awhile and then ease back into

being vegan.

> Do not let this ruin a wonderful marriage. You are in counseling

and he will either go back to

> being animal free or he wont. If you both work very hard at finding

a resolution, whatever the

> outcome, you will know that he loves you enough to try and work it

out.

>

> (can you tell I have been married for over 20+ years?)

>

> I will be thinking of you.

>

[Guest guest]

Hilary,

 

For what it's worth, when I became vegetarian (with my 2 teenaged daughters), my

husband wasn't on board at all. Actually, initially, we were still in the " meat "

goat business, so I was " attacking " not only his plate, but his dream of being a

farmer. After cooking 2 meals every night for a few months and fielding

questions from our 2 youngest daughters (what's a vegetarian? ewe, who WOULD eat

dead animals? What do you mean that's what you're feeding us? Mom, How COULD

you?), I asked my husband if he would agree to have a vegetarian home.

 

I promised not to be the food police and check his truck for Big Mac wrappers.

He agreed to having a veg home. I never asked if he ate meat when he was out (he

is a teacher and they have a lot of food meetings). About 6 months later, I

overheard him on the phone to the school secretary making sure there would be

vegetarian food for him to eat on the annual retreat. So he did come around on

his own...but I think it was helpful that I only changed what was mine to

change. He had to make his own choices. Including selling the farm. Now, he's a

pretty obnoxious vegan, boasting about his low blood pressure and 40 pound

weight loss.

 

Maybe your husband could agree to that for now, just keeping meat out of the

house for the sake of teaching your kids.

 

Just a thought,

 

Lisa

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

How great is that! Just when you think that all is lost and your husband isn't

REALLY LISTENING, they go and do something like that! I think 'keeping a veg

home' what with all the issues involved, is a great compromise. I can see both

sides- Hilary, your husband is a big boy and responsible enough to make his own

decisions about what to put in his mouth. On the other hand, this is a core

value you both shared when you married, and as such, he's responsible, really,

to keep that up. If, after all, you both agreed that you would be a particuar

religion as a married couple,  I don't think most people would want to FORCE

their spouse to practice that religion all day, every day, fervently (which is

what veg amounts to) if their heart wasn't in it. But, it seems to me to be

completely reasonable to expect the spouse to carry on in some sort of peaceful

way so as not to disrupt the children's lives and upbringing. I don't blame you

for being upset that your

whole life, as I'm sure it seems, has been upset- after all, this was not part

of the plan. But, forcing him to sneak behind your back to Black Angus would a)

make you really upset , and b) damage the fabric of your relationship, I think,

to have forced sneaking-around (that you're aware of) going on.

     I know the feeling of being worried that your family or his will be

laughing behind your back that he's eating meat now- before I met my husband I

had a boyfriend who hunted etc. and I worried would feed my future kids meat, or

carry on behind my back, too. I think it's really important that you explain to

him in no uncertain terms how any of this would make you feel- and that if his

family TRIES any of that crap, he's to put them in their place and let them know

that he still holds your values-values that you once shared- in extremely high

regard. I got this all straightened out with my husband before we got serious,

and I think it's important that you retain that sense of security and trust in

your spouse- and that HE understands what a loss it would be to your marriage if

you were to lose that security and trust in him.

     I don't know how much I've said of this before, but it seems like there are

a lot  of people in this group, myself included, who co-exist quite

peacefully  with a spouse who is not veg- even while raising their children veg.

I've often likened being a veg to religion, to give people who don't understand

it a sense of perspective about how seriously we all take these issues. It's a

core moral/ethical belief that colors everything you do everyday, as well it

should be. It is not to be taken lightly, nor made fun of, etc., anymore than

your religion would be.

 

 

Lisa Watson <karaitevegan

 

Wednesday, September 10, 2008 12:30:45 PM

Re: Re: CHANGE THE HUSBAND'S MIND campaign - thank you

 

 

Hilary,

 

For what it's worth, when I became vegetarian (with my 2 teenaged daughters), my

husband wasn't on board at all. Actually, initially, we were still in the " meat "

goat business, so I was " attacking " not only his plate, but his dream of being a

farmer. After cooking 2 meals every night for a few months and fielding

questions from our 2 youngest daughters (what's a vegetarian? ewe, who WOULD eat

dead animals? What do you mean that's what you're feeding us? Mom, How COULD

you?), I asked my husband if he would agree to have a vegetarian home.

 

I promised not to be the food police and check his truck for Big Mac wrappers.

He agreed to having a veg home. I never asked if he ate meat when he was out (he

is a teacher and they have a lot of food meetings). About 6 months later, I

overheard him on the phone to the school secretary making sure there would be

vegetarian food for him to eat on the annual retreat. So he did come around on

his own...but I think it was helpful that I only changed what was mine to

change. He had to make his own choices. Including selling the farm. Now, he's a

pretty obnoxious vegan, boasting about his low blood pressure and 40 pound

weight loss.

 

Maybe your husband could agree to that for now, just keeping meat out of the

house for the sake of teaching your kids.

 

Just a thought,

 

Lisa

 

 

[Guest guest]

Okay, you made me laugh out loud with that last tag on. YES, it does

seem like he LIKES to be difficult! I know that you understand

exactly what it feels like over here...

 

And about the sensory thought - he has mentioned that it is a texture

thing. always talks about the time he gagged on onions in a

mcdonald's burger when he was like 10 as if it just happened

yesterday. Interestingly, we recently had a discussion about this

again and it came out that maybe this problem is psychological. If

he were able to eat the average vegetarian cookbook meals this would

be so much easier. I have my private meeting with the

counselor/psychologist tomorrow and I am going to see if there is

anything that can be done to determine and " fix " it if this is

psychological. Hypnosis maybe? I also know it could just be a

texture thing and gagging response too, which is unfixable (right?).

Will have to google that topic soon...

 

Thanks for your thoughts (and your understanding)!

 

Hilary

 

, jenni claire garverick

<jennigarverick wrote:

>

> You know, it occured to me that your husband might have some sort

of disorder re:the textures, extreme pickiness.If we saw that in one

of our kids, we'd probably get it checked out as some sort of sensory

thing but adults are out of luck because they didn't know about that

stuff when we were kids. My husband has a lot of the same dietary

issues as your husband, and I consider it part of his OCD, but it

could be a sensory issue, too. Not that there's necessarily anything

you can do about it, but it might help you to not get so annoyed

(believe me, it annoys me, too. It seems like they LIKE to be

difficult at times).

>

>

>

>

> hilbro <hilbro

>

> Monday, September 8, 2008 7:21:20 PM

> Re: CHANGE THE HUSBAND'S MIND campaign -

thank you

>

>

>

>

> @gro ups.com, VAP79@ wrote:

> >

> > Jill,

> > My husband is vegan as is my 12 yr. old son. I often think it

would be

> a

> > great idea to have a vegan men's group.

> > Laura in MD

> >

> >

> >

>

> I agree - a vegan/vegetarian men's group would be wonderful! I don't

> know any other male vegetarians and I think if my husband had

contact

> with other vegetarians he might not feel so out of place. He says he

> is uncomfortable " being special " in front of others, but seriously

he

> has special needs regarding food anyway. He's super picky - no

onions

> (unless blended), no tomatoes but pizza sauce is okay, no spaghetti

> sauce on pasta (plain with butter), peas have to be baby peas from

the

> can (no other kind), nothing can be mixed so casseroles are out,

skippy

> peanut butter only (I tried bringing home jiff once and he went

right

> out and bought skippy because in the third grade his class did a

taste

> test with brands and he liked skippy, no need to ever try anything

> else)... the list goes on. He says this is mostly a texture thing. I

> try to understand but sometimes I just lose it. for instance, I made

> cream of carrot soup a couple days ago thinking he eats carrots so

> that's good, and it's blended so that's good. He hated it. During

the

> argument that followed he said " maybe there is a hint of carrot

flavor

> in there but that's it. " THERE WERE TWELVE FRIGGIN CARROTS IN THERE

and

> one potato. Give me a break!

>

> okay, we worked past that one and I better not get all in a tiffy

again

> over it or it will ruin my night

>

> SO, a vegetarian/vegan men's group would be great, as I was saying

> earlier...

>

> Hilary

>

>

[Guest guest]

HA HA HA HA! You are so funny! Yes, what if I told him to do that?

Oh thank you for making me laugh. It certainly HAS been exhausting

to think of how I can cook a normal meal for the kids and then have

to make something entirely different following all of the rules for

my husband. In fact, I gave up on that a long time ago (with a few

exceptions of when I put on my supermom cape) and he just makes his

own food. Often he'll pop in a cheese pizza while I'm trying to get

my 3 year old to finish his brussel sprouts (not usually a problem

unless there is a pizza in front of him). This won't work much

longer as the kids get older, that's for sure.

 

Now where can I get those different colored garbage bags ;?)

 

 

Seriously though, maybe it IS OCD or some other form of anxiety

disorder. Various anxiety disorders run very strongly in his

family... will definitely be mentioning this to the

psychologist/marriage counselor tomorrow, for sure. That would make

so much sense!

 

Hilary

 

, " Dianna Lu " <diannalu wrote:

>

> I had the same thought when I read that email. If I had a kid that

picky I would be tempted to tell them they are in charge of their own

cooking from now on. Or take some kind of measures to put a stop to

it. What does your husband do for you? For instance, my husband's

main chore around the house is taking out the garbage. What if I

told him he could only do it between 10 and 10:15 and every trash bag

had to be a different color and the trash cans all had to face east

and he could only use his right hand? Really, these things get out

of hand. That is a lot to put up with and still try to feed kids a

healthy diet too.

>

> :-)

>

> Dee

>

> -

> jenni claire garverick

>

> Tuesday, September 09, 2008 12:41 PM

> Re: Re: CHANGE THE HUSBAND'S MIND campaign -

thank you

>

>

> You know, it occured to me that your husband might have some sort

of disorder re:the textures, extreme pickiness.If we saw that in one

of our kids, we'd probably get it checked out as some sort of sensory

thing but adults are out of luck because they didn't know about that

stuff when we were kids. My husband has a lot of the same dietary

issues as your husband, and I consider it part of his OCD, but it

could be a sensory issue, too. Not that there's necessarily anything

you can do about it, but it might help you to not get so annoyed

(believe me, it annoys me, too. It seems like they LIKE to be

difficult at times).

>

 

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Wow, well if it runs in his family, then you probably have a strong case. I know

my husband's dad is just like my husband- just with his own variations and 35

years more experience being obstinate about them!

Of course, prepare for your husband to not be too thrilled with being labeled

ocd, or whatever the case may be. My husband rejected the idea for a long time,

until I started pointing out all of his weird little habits that he thought no

one else noticed. I think the key is (and this is what I told him) that when all

of that stuff starts to interfere with everyday life, it's time to get help. He

had some intrusive, irrational thoughts (overly obsessed with worry about family

members dying, making up stuff to worry about, etc.) and I think that's

eventually what moved him to get some help. Much of the rest of it he could

control. Of course, he's still a worry wart, and a picky person by nature- he's

just easier for the rest of us to deal with- and much happier becasue he's not

obsessing about dumb stuff. I gave up worrying about the 'cooking smells'- I try

to consider his feelings- sauteing the garlic/onions before he gets home from

work and opening up the

house to air it out, but Come On! I told him some stuff he's just going to have

to deal with. We will be considerate, we will not walk on egg shells.

 

 

 

 

hilbro <hilbro

 

Wednesday, September 10, 2008 9:06:33 PM

Re: CHANGE THE HUSBAND'S MIND campaign - thank you

 

 

 

HA HA HA HA! You are so funny! Yes, what if I told him to do that?

Oh thank you for making me laugh. It certainly HAS been exhausting

to think of how I can cook a normal meal for the kids and then have

to make something entirely different following all of the rules for

my husband. In fact, I gave up on that a long time ago (with a few

exceptions of when I put on my supermom cape) and he just makes his

own food. Often he'll pop in a cheese pizza while I'm trying to get

my 3 year old to finish his brussel sprouts (not usually a problem

unless there is a pizza in front of him). This won't work much

longer as the kids get older, that's for sure.

 

Now where can I get those different colored garbage bags ;?)

 

Seriously though, maybe it IS OCD or some other form of anxiety

disorder. Various anxiety disorders run very strongly in his

family... will definitely be mentioning this to the

psychologist/ marriage counselor tomorrow, for sure. That would make

so much sense!

 

Hilary

 

@gro ups.com, " Dianna Lu " <diannalu@.. .> wrote:

>

> I had the same thought when I read that email. If I had a kid that

picky I would be tempted to tell them they are in charge of their own

cooking from now on. Or take some kind of measures to put a stop to

it. What does your husband do for you? For instance, my husband's

main chore around the house is taking out the garbage. What if I

told him he could only do it between 10 and 10:15 and every trash bag

had to be a different color and the trash cans all had to face east

and he could only use his right hand? Really, these things get out

of hand. That is a lot to put up with and still try to feed kids a

healthy diet too.

>

> :-)

>

> Dee

>

> -

> jenni claire garverick

> @gro ups.com

> Tuesday, September 09, 2008 12:41 PM

> Re: Re: CHANGE THE HUSBAND'S MIND campaign -

thank you

>

>

> You know, it occured to me that your husband might have some sort

of disorder re:the textures, extreme pickiness.If we saw that in one

of our kids, we'd probably get it checked out as some sort of sensory

thing but adults are out of luck because they didn't know about that

stuff when we were kids. My husband has a lot of the same dietary

issues as your husband, and I consider it part of his OCD, but it

could be a sensory issue, too. Not that there's necessarily anything

you can do about it, but it might help you to not get so annoyed

(believe me, it annoys me, too. It seems like they LIKE to be

difficult at times).

>

 

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Well, I just read your first message,and I think there ARE things that can be

done re: textural stuff, and my guess is that it has to do with cognitive

therapy. I don't know much about that one, except to say that it can help all of

the issues we've discussed, I think. As for my husband, he's on a mild

antidepressant- the ocd stuff is probably synapses in the brain misfiring - and

they do have a strong genetic component. The question is, is your husband

willing to put the work in. I think mine would NOT be- he didn't see it as an

'issue' until I started pointing out how it affects me, the three kids, and his

crabbiness, in general. I'm sure many in this group would be anti- meds, as I am

normally. But this is one case where it was probably the only thing to be done.

It took a bit of experimenting with doses/ different drugs, but it's right now

and everyone is much happier.

Our husbands sound a lot alike. there is a laundry list of food mine won't eat

because of some perceived slight from way back when he was wearing velour shirts

and watching the Super Friends on Saturday mornings. Sometimes all you can do is

throw up your hands and say, " Really?!? Does that sound reasonable to you??!!! "

and grin a little to yourself when you buy onions and garlic at the grocery

store. Good luck at the counselor's today.

 

 

 

 

hilbro <hilbro

 

Wednesday, September 10, 2008 8:41:09 PM

Re: CHANGE THE HUSBAND'S MIND campaign - thank you

 

 

Okay, you made me laugh out loud with that last tag on. YES, it does

seem like he LIKES to be difficult! I know that you understand

exactly what it feels like over here...

 

And about the sensory thought - he has mentioned that it is a texture

thing. always talks about the time he gagged on onions in a

mcdonald's burger when he was like 10 as if it just happened

yesterday. Interestingly, we recently had a discussion about this

again and it came out that maybe this problem is psychological. If

he were able to eat the average vegetarian cookbook meals this would

be so much easier. I have my private meeting with the

counselor/psycholog ist tomorrow and I am going to see if there is

anything that can be done to determine and " fix " it if this is

psychological. Hypnosis maybe? I also know it could just be a

texture thing and gagging response too, which is unfixable (right?).

Will have to google that topic soon...

 

Thanks for your thoughts (and your understanding) !

 

Hilary

 

@gro ups.com, jenni claire garverick

<jennigarverick@ ...> wrote:

>

> You know, it occured to me that your husband might have some sort

of disorder re:the textures, extreme pickiness.If we saw that in one

of our kids, we'd probably get it checked out as some sort of sensory

thing but adults are out of luck because they didn't know about that

stuff when we were kids. My husband has a lot of the same dietary

issues as your husband, and I consider it part of his OCD, but it

could be a sensory issue, too. Not that there's necessarily anything

you can do about it, but it might help you to not get so annoyed

(believe me, it annoys me, too. It seems like they LIKE to be

difficult at times).

>

>

>

>

> hilbro <hilbro

> @gro ups.com

> Monday, September 8, 2008 7:21:20 PM

> Re: CHANGE THE HUSBAND'S MIND campaign -

thank you

>

>

>

>

> @gro ups.com, VAP79@ wrote:

> >

> > Jill,

> > My husband is vegan as is my 12 yr. old son. I often think it

would be

> a

> > great idea to have a vegan men's group.

> > Laura in MD

> >

> >

> >

>

> I agree - a vegan/vegetarian men's group would be wonderful! I don't

> know any other male vegetarians and I think if my husband had

contact

> with other vegetarians he might not feel so out of place. He says he

> is uncomfortable " being special " in front of others, but seriously

he

> has special needs regarding food anyway. He's super picky - no

onions

> (unless blended), no tomatoes but pizza sauce is okay, no spaghetti

> sauce on pasta (plain with butter), peas have to be baby peas from

the

> can (no other kind), nothing can be mixed so casseroles are out,

skippy

> peanut butter only (I tried bringing home jiff once and he went

right

> out and bought skippy because in the third grade his class did a

taste

> test with brands and he liked skippy, no need to ever try anything

> else)... the list goes on. He says this is mostly a texture thing. I

> try to understand but sometimes I just lose it. for instance, I made

> cream of carrot soup a couple days ago thinking he eats carrots so

> that's good, and it's blended so that's good. He hated it. During

the

> argument that followed he said " maybe there is a hint of carrot

flavor

> in there but that's it. " THERE WERE TWELVE FRIGGIN CARROTS IN THERE

and

> one potato. Give me a break!

>

> okay, we worked past that one and I better not get all in a tiffy

again

> over it or it will ruin my night

>

> SO, a vegetarian/vegan men's group would be great, as I was saying

> earlier...

>

> Hilary

>

>

[Guest guest]

I somehow missed this post until now. Thank you for spending the

time putting your thoughts out there. I agree with both of the sides

like you mentioned, and that makes this all the more difficult to to

deal with. It would be so much easier to feel one way about it.

Trying to change my husband's mind goes against my belief to accept

people for who they are, but my emotions are so strong I have found

that I can't just do nothing.

 

But, with the discovery of Selected Eating Disorder (posted earlir),

things might be heading in the right direction.

 

Hlary

(am i the only person not able to view any posts dated after the

12th? very frustrating)

 

, jenni claire garverick

<jennigarverick wrote:

>

> How great is that! Just when you think that all is lost and your

husband isn't REALLY LISTENING, they go and do something like that! I

think 'keeping a veg home' what with all the issues involved, is a

great compromise. I can see both sides- Hilary, your husband is a big

boy and responsible enough to make his own decisions about what to

put in his mouth. On the other hand, this is a core value you both

shared when you married, and as such, he's responsible, really, to

keep that up. If, after all, you both agreed that you would be a

particuar religion as a married couple,  I don't think most people

would want to FORCE their spouse to practice that religion all day,

every day, fervently (which is what veg amounts to) if their heart

wasn't in it. But, it seems to me to be completely reasonable to

expect the spouse to carry on in some sort of peaceful way so as not

to disrupt the children's lives and upbringing. I don't blame you for

being upset that your

> whole life, as I'm sure it seems, has been upset- after all, this

was not part of the plan. But, forcing him to sneak behind your back

to Black Angus would a) make you really upset , and b) damage the

fabric of your relationship, I think, to have forced sneaking-around

(that you're aware of) going on.

>      I know the feeling of being worried that your family or his

will be laughing behind your back that he's eating meat now- before I

met my husband I had a boyfriend who hunted etc. and I worried would

feed my future kids meat, or carry on behind my back, too. I think

it's really important that you explain to him in no uncertain terms

how any of this would make you feel- and that if his family TRIES any

of that crap, he's to put them in their place and let them know that

he still holds your values-values that you once shared- in extremely

high regard. I got this all straightened out with my husband before

we got serious, and I think it's important that you retain that sense

of security and trust in your spouse- and that HE understands what a

loss it would be to your marriage if you were to lose that security

and trust in him.

>      I don't know how much I've said of this before, but it seems

like there are a lot  of people in this group, myself included, who

co-exist quite peacefully  with a spouse who is not veg- even while

raising their children veg. I've often likened being a veg to

religion, to give people who don't understand it a sense of

perspective about how seriously we all take these issues. It's a core

moral/ethical belief that colors everything you do everyday, as well

it should be. It is not to be taken lightly, nor made fun of, etc.,

anymore than your religion would be.

>