Jane Goodall interview in the Telegraph

[Guest guest]

Dear colleagues,

Please find attached the article on Jane Goodall

that I have written in the Telegraph based on her interview. It has been

published today. I am pleased that I could also incorporate material

obtained from an interview with her colleague, Marc Bekoff, at the Asia for

Animals conference in Madras. The article had to be geared toward the

scientific orientation of the specialised section I was asked to cover but

there was a lot of information still available that I made available to

individuals and organisations with her due permission.

Best wishes,

 

 

http://www.telegraphindia.com/1070129/asp/knowhow/story_7316212.asp

 

 

Chimps feel

Animals should be treated as individuals; it is possible to be objective

and have empathy at the same time, Jane Goodall tells *

Ghosh* Pet

subject: Jane Goodall at Calcutta Zoo

 

Evolutionary biologist Stephen Jay Gould said her work " represents one of

the Western world's great scientific achievements " . Dr David Hamburg of the

Stanford University School of Medicine described her research as the kind

that " occurs once in a generation and changes man's views of himself " . And

millions of others across the globe, glued to National Geographic, have

admired her patience and fortitude whilst conducting field studies in Gombe,

Africa, on chimpanzees.

 

Jane Goodall as a field researcher and primatologist has single-handedly

done more than anyone else in the 20th century to make us aware of what

ethology (the study of animal behaviour) is all about. In Calcutta recently

to promote the Wildscreen Film Festival organised by British Council,

Goodall spoke extensively on how she has conducted science and challenged

conventional perceptions. " When I started studying chimpanzees in 1960 at

the Gombe National Park in Tanzania, no one would ascribe emotions or

feelings to animals, " she says. " Well, now they do, " she smiles. Her work

has been lauded as groundbreaking since she discovered that these apes make

tools and use them, a trait once considered uniquely human.

 

Goodall's approach to ethology is unique and special. For example, she names

the individual subjects of her research rather than assigning them numbers.

She is also convinced that non-human species can emote just like we do. This

may seem romantic and naïve to some, but scientific evidence is emerging to

support her assertions.

 

Dr Marc Bekoff, professor of biology at the University of Colorado, for

example, says, " Asking questions about science is not to be anti science. "

He points out that humans are not the only animals that experience a wide

range of feelings. " The real question is why emotions have evolved, not if

they have evolved in some animals… Claims that anthropomorphism has no place

in science or that anthropomorphic predictions and explanations are less

accurate than behaviourist, more mechanistic or reductionistic explanations

are not supported by any data. "

 

Goodall explains from an evolutionary perspective how feelings of awe might

have originated in organisms. " Spoken language would have enabled our

ancestors to articulate feelings of awe, feelings that would lead to

religious belief, then to organised worship, " she says. But we are not the

only beings to experience awe. " In the Kakombe valley is a magnificent

waterfall, " she narrates. " Often the chimpanzees aggregate near the fall and

exhibit a slow, rhythmic motion, performing a magnificent dance for more

than 10 minutes. " Goodall believes the chimps may be responding to a feeling

of awe and that in a similar fashion our prehistoric ancestors may have

discussed such feelings which may have in turn led to the development of

organised religion.

 

For Goodall, there is no conflict between science and religion. She is

opposed to evolutionary biologist and atheist Richard Dawkins's view that

religion is the root of all evil. " The sheer diversity of life on earth is

the source of spirituality, " Goodall believes. She, however, does

acknowledge that " religion " is a difficult word to use since it implies

bigotry and fanaticism but emphasises that like science, it goes way beyond

materialism.

 

Goodall argues that the science of biology has to be carried out at both the

molecular and organismic levels. " I am against reductionism, " she states.

According to her, conventional science has led to immoral behaviour since it

wants to be too objective. And immoral science has led to unpleasant

experiments being carried out on animals, for example, subjecting them to

electric shocks for research purposes and blindness tests on baby monkeys.

" We need a new approach in science towards animals in laboratories, " says

Goodall. " But where are the Nobel Prizes for scientific development of

non-animal alternatives to replace invasive animal research, " she asks.

" Unfortunately, science is dictated by money and very often scientists cheat

by ignoring facts that do not fit their passionate theories. " She points out

that journalists have a significant role to play in presenting science in a

way that would put forward facts for better evaluation by the public.

 

Aggression is one aspect of human behaviour that has always interested

behavioural scientists. The causes of aggression are common in humans and

chimpanzees — dominance, food, territory and so on. Yet, when Goodall first

discovered aggression among chimpanzees in the early 1970s, she was asked to

downplay the phenomenon whenever possible since it was thought that

publishing the data would prove that the " human " tendency to engage in

conflict is innate, and that war is therefore inevitable. " Back then, I

concluded it is pointless to deny that we humans harbour innate

aggressiveness and violent tendencies, " remarks Goodall. But does that mean

human beings are forever enslaved in " evil " genes? " Surely not, " she

replies.

 

Goodall's painstaking work has opened up hitherto unknown fields of study,

for example, animal communication. She has done the narration in a film

called *When Animals Talk* which shows how humans and animals are able to

communicate with one another in distinctive ways.

 

As a United Nations Messenger of Peace, Jane Goodall is deeply concerned

about the use of nuclear energy. The development of weapons and the

irresponsible dumping of nuclear waste might cause environmental damage, she

says. However, it would be hypocritical for the five permanent members of

the Security Council to dictate terms on nuclear policy to other countries

whilst piling up nuclear weapons in their own backyards. " The UN can be of

great help in spreading the benefits of science around the world but

unfortunately its role has been less than satisfactory, " she says.

 

India's fabulous biodiversity provides huge potential for scientific study,

says Goodall, who is currently compiling a book entitled *Hope for

Nature*on endangered species that have made a comeback, and the

researcher is

looking for Indian examples.

 

Goodall's colleague, Marc Bekoff, emphasises that it is essential to blend

" science sense " with " common sense " when studying living creatures. The two

have teamed up to form an organisation called Ethologists for the Ethical

Treatment of Animals to promote this idea.

 

So what would be her word of advice for prospective ethology students? " Try

to be non judgmental and treat animals as individuals, " says Goodall. " It is

perfectly possible to be objective and have empathy at the same time. "

 

Coming from an individual who has created a scientific record by studying a

single species for 47 long years, the words might provide new insight for

science students whose only idea of biology is a rat or a toad on the

dissecting table.