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On Jun 28, 2006, at 11:30 AM, renee2323 wrote:

> So now, for the first time in 15 years I am wondering if I should

> start feeding my family organic, free range meat. If I did not see a

> moral issue with eating meat, I would definitly think that my

> children would be healthier with a non-allergenic source of protein,

> like meat. I think my husband would be leaner and healthier because

> he would have a lean source of protein in his diet. Despite warnings

> about phtyo-estrogens, he continues to eat processed soy.

 

 

Non-allergenic? Any protein can be allergenic. I'm allergic to

pork. ;)

 

It's really up to you. I'm allergic to soy, wheat, peanuts, hemp,

and a few other things. I can remain vegetarian, but not vegan.

 

If you think your family would be healthier, you must do what you

feel is right. When I lost too much weight (and kept losing) and had

super low iron, I did re-introduce meat to my diet. After a few

months, I'd gained way too much weight and my iron was lower than

ever. With proof that diet didn't help my malnutrition, my doctors

said that I could eat what I wanted, so I cut the meat out again.

 

I originally became veg out of health concerns, so it was easier for

me to reconcile myself with eating meat. I only bought from local

farmers with pasture-fed animals. It wasn't an easy decision, but I

stuck with it for awhile, until I found that it wasn't helping me at

all.

 

If it helps you, do it. It can always be a trial period.

 

ygg

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Dear Renee,

 

I'm so sorry for the frustration you are feeling over your decision to be

veg'n and your concerns about soy. It is definately difficult to have to

eliminate certain foods from our diets. The gluten free diet is a huge

change, and being vegan and/or vegetarian adds another element to the

puzzle. I understand your concerns about soy, and since they appear to be

valid concerns for you and your family, then I really do encourage you to

eliminate them from your diet and lifestyle. There are quite a few list

members here to have similar concerns and who avoid all gluten, soy, and

remain veg'n. You'll find that in our 'files' section, all our recipes have

been catagorized by type. They are all vegan and gluten free, plus there is

a large section that are soy-free as well. Kim, our recipe manager, has

designated them with the letters SF in the heading, to make it easier for us

to find the soy free recipes. It's really quite possible to be healthy and

remain a veg'n without any soy products. Although we do not have issues

with soy in our family (allergies, etc.), we use very few soy products.

Most of the vegetarian soy meats also contain wheat gluten, thus eliminating

them. Our main protein sources are the gluten-free grains and foods from

the legume family. Beans are a staple. We also use quite a few nuts

(almonds, walnuts, pecans) and lots and lots of fruits and vegetables. For

us, adding any meat to our diet wouldn't even be a consideration (we have

always been vegetarian and the thought of eating meat actually turns our

stomachs; we've never had it). But, each family needs to consider what is

best for them and their needs. I would encourage you, though, to look at

other options (citing food safety issues; the disease and health factors

that come with even supposedly healthy meats). It really is possible to

live a healthy, veg'n lifestyle --- even without wheat and soy.

 

Wishing you success as you put the puzzle pieces together.

LaDonna

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Renee,

 

I am vegan and gluten free as well as soy free, and have been for

nine months now. I would say, don't be so quick to discount your

options- have you thought about protein powders? I use a brown rice

protein powder that I get in the natural foods section at Fred

Meyer. Being pressed for time all the time, I use it in banana

smoothies almost every morning, but I think it would definitely be

good baked into gluten free breads, muffins, etc. It just needs to

be blended rather than stirred with whatever you eat it with-

otherwise it makes the food lumpy and grainy.

 

Let me know if I can be of further help, and good luck!

 

Courtney

 

, " renee2323 "

<reneestorm wrote:

>

> Hi group,

> I am having a " crisis of faith " and could use some advice. I

have

> been vegetarian or vegan for the past 15 years. My husband has

been

> veggie for 15 years and we have raised our three kids vegetarian.

My

> problem now is concerning soy. I began to worry about 1 month ago

> that perhaps soy was contributung to my Asperger son's ADD. He

has

> been GFCF for 4 years but many people have begun telling me

recently

> that it is likely that soy is a problem for him too.

>

> Yesterday, on another group, someone posted an article decrying

the

> evils of soy.

>

> http://www.mothering.com/articles/growing_child/food/soy_story.html

>

> While the article is definitely biased, it does make some good

points

> about processed soy products.

>

> Both of my daughters have some trouble attending to tasks. My

> youngest daughters has sensory integration problems and food

> allergies. She is definitly intolerant/allergic to corn, wheat,

> dairy, and I suspect soy because she craves it when she eats it.

>

> To make matters worse, I have thyroid disease, which has been

> linked by some to consumption of soy. Would I be healthier if I

> stoped eating soy? My mother, aunt and uncle all have thyroid

> disease and they are meat-eaters.

>

> Finally, my husband has grown very overweight. He mainly eats

> bread, cheese and processeed soy products. I have tried over the

> years to get him to change his eating habits but he doesn't like

> beans and is just really out of balance with his eating right now.

>

> So now, for the first time in 15 years I am wondering if I

should

> start feeding my family organic, free range meat. If I did not

see a

> moral issue with eating meat, I would definitly think that my

> children would be healthier with a non-allergenic source of

protein,

> like meat. I think my husband would be leaner and healthier

because

> he would have a lean source of protein in his diet. Despite

warnings

> about phtyo-estrogens, he continues to eat processed soy.

>

> I know this is long and rambling. Thnaks to anyone who has read

> this far. I guess I am just looking for than inspiration, recipe,

> word of wisdom - whatever- that will make it seem okay because I

do

> not want to feed animals to my children, but I don't want to feed

> them foods they are allegic to either. Renee

>

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Hi Renee;

 

It's totally OK to eliminate soy from your diet and still eat a vegan diet! You

get lots of protein, more than enough, just by eating a variety of fruits,

veggies, whole grains and legumes. Soy is totally optional when it comes to

protein. But starting to eat meat would be just trading in one set of problems

for another.

 

I agree that your husband's diet is imbalanced as you have described it. He'd

be healthier and leaner by increasing the fruit and veggie portion of his diet,

decreasing the amount of dairy and wheat. Getting all the protein we need is

super easy on a whole food vegan diet.

 

Here is a link about that: http://www.drmcdougall.com/med_hot_protein.html

 

Hang in there Renee! Being a gluten free, soy-free vegan is very do-able! My

husband and I have been at it for over 20 years, we raised our daughter this

way.

 

Wishing you all the best,

 

Deborah

 

 

Hi group,

I am having a " crisis of faith " and could use some advice. I have

been vegetarian or vegan for the past 15 years. My husband has been

veggie for 15 years and we have raised our three kids vegetarian. My

problem now is concerning soy. I began to worry about 1 month ago

that perhaps soy was contributung to my Asperger son's ADD. He has

been GFCF for 4 years but many people have begun telling me recently

that it is likely that soy is a problem for him too.

 

Yesterday, on another group, someone posted an article decrying the

evils of soy.

 

http://www.mothering.com/articles/growing_child/food/soy_story.html

 

While the article is definitely biased, it does make some good points

about processed soy products.

 

Both of my daughters have some trouble attending to tasks. My

youngest daughters has sensory integration problems and food

allergies. She is definitly intolerant/allergic to corn, wheat,

dairy, and I suspect soy because she craves it when she eats it.

 

To make matters worse, I have thyroid disease, which has been

linked by some to consumption of soy. Would I be healthier if I

stoped eating soy? My mother, aunt and uncle all have thyroid

disease and they are meat-eaters.

 

Finally, my husband has grown very overweight. He mainly eats

bread, cheese and processeed soy products. I have tried over the

years to get him to change his eating habits but he doesn't like

beans and is just really out of balance with his eating right now.

 

So now, for the first time in 15 years I am wondering if I should

start feeding my family organic, free range meat. If I did not see a

moral issue with eating meat, I would definitly think that my

children would be healthier with a non-allergenic source of protein,

like meat. I think my husband would be leaner and healthier because

he would have a lean source of protein in his diet. Despite warnings

about phtyo-estrogens, he continues to eat processed soy.

 

I know this is long and rambling. Thnaks to anyone who has read

this far. I guess I am just looking for than inspiration, recipe,

word of wisdom - whatever- that will make it seem okay because I do

not want to feed animals to my children, but I don't want to feed

them foods they are allegic to either. Renee

 

 

 

 

 

 

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> Yesterday, on another group, someone posted an article decrying the

> evils of soy.

> ...

>

> While the article is definitely biased, it does make some good points

> about processed soy products.

 

Try this article - it is a little less biased and actually includes

references of the studies used in it:

 

http://www.drmcdougall.com/misc/2005nl/april/050400pusoy.htm

 

Soy protein will interfere with thyroid (and thyroid drugs) and does act as

an estrogen (something men don't need, nor children and is somewhat

questionable for many women -- estrogenic effects of plastic are one reason

you should not use them in the microwave as well as being one the bad side

effects of extensive pesticide use).

 

Soy is also the fastest growing food allergy, as the protein is added to

more and more products.

 

> My mother, aunt and uncle all have thyroid

> disease and they are meat-eaters.

 

But, have they been checked for CD? It's more likely it was caused by this,

not meat.

 

> Finally, my husband has grown very overweight. He mainly eats

> bread, cheese and processeed soy products. ...I think my husband

> would be leaner and healthier because

> he would have a lean source of protein in his diet. Despite warnings

> about phtyo-estrogens, he continues to eat processed soy.

 

Does he cook on his own? If not, changing his diet would involve mainly

putting up with his complaints. Many people who are overweight will not

change their eating and excercise habits. You have some control over only

one; continuing to provide him with the " poison " he uses to maintain an

unhealthy weight is no different than supplying alcohol to an alcholic.

Presumably he will continue his bad eating habits outside the house; at

least inside you can provide healthier food (and perhaps start your son on

the road to healthy eating, before it is too late).

 

Try different seasonings and different beans - after all, soybeans are

somewhat close (and much nastier in flavor). Many " don't like beans " because

all they are offered is one thing (say, boiled pinto beans with little added

or overgrown & overcooked green beans), but they do like lentils, garbanzos,

kidney beans, etc, when presented with different choices.

 

---

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My first suggestion is to look into Amaranth and Quinoa as they are

complete, gluten-free proteins that both happen to taste pretty good

(although I prefer Amaranth). If you can't do Amaranth and Quinoa, just

make sure you have some form of legumes with your grains and you'll make

complete proteins (they also tend to taste better too). Lentils are

exceptionally nutritious, and can be pureed with rice and left to rise like

sourdough. Lentils and rice make an indian bread or pancakes known as dosa

or idli, depending on how much water you add before fermenting. Other

common legume/grain combinations are adzuki beans and rice, black beans and

rice, etc.

 

One of my favorite snacks is made out of amaranth. It takes some practice

but you take whole amaranth and put it in a clean, dry pot over the stove.

Either stir with heat resistant brush/spatula or grab the pot by the handle

and swirl on and off. Be very careful not to burn it. The resulting

miniature " popcorn " is excellent mixed with honey and molded into bars.

 

As for hubby... I have a similar problem with mine! :) Since you mention

processed foods, my first concern would be: how much trans fat is he getting

a day? Even if it isn't much: I would suggest he start supplimenting with

extra virgin coconut oil, as well as other vegan saturated fats (palm, palm

kernal, etc) as soon as possible. Check out the book " Eat Fat, Lose Fat "

for info on how fats help regulate weight, or " Know Your Fats " for a general

overview of fats. Interesting tidbit: recent research finds trans fats put

on more fat per calorie than other fats.

 

The rest of my concerns for your hubby would be: Is the bread whole grain?

Is it sourdough? Is the cheese made from raw milk? Is the cheese naturally

fermented and aged? If not, start moving him over to these superior forms

of his existing foods before trying to meddle further. I have been doing

the same transition with my SO over the last year and he is now beginning to

prefer the superior forms.

 

Another thing that could help hubby right away is to start feeding more

dry-acting foods. Wheat and dairy are very damp according to traditional

chinese medicine, and need to be balanced with appropriate amounts of dry

foods, especially sour and pungent foods. Does he like spearmint? It is an

excellent drying pungent food. Otherwise add things like kimchee, garlic,

onion, brined pickles, vinegar etc.

 

-Lana

 

 

 

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Renee-

you are facing a dilema that many of us have faced in the past. I

have been vegetarian for about 17 years, vegan for 2 1/2 and

completely raw for about 9 months. By moving towards a raw food diet

I easily eliminated the soy, wheat, and any other items that might

have been triggering my health issues. Like your daughter, I craved

soy when I was eating it and the same was true with wheat items.

There is a whole world of raw food out there that's easy to prepare,

phenomenally delicious, and the whole family will probably love. It

is easy to become a cheese, soy, and wheat person when one becomes a

vegetarian. I've watched my own husband go through this struggle. He

has given up the cheese and very rarely eats the processed soy

products since I won't bring them home anymore. It's possible to make

cream sauces using nuts, etc. I'd love to discuss this further if you

have the time or inclination. This is what I do for a living-teach

people how to be vegan, raw, and wildly healthy.

peace and health

debbie bennett

dynamicwellness or rawvegangoddess

 

, " renee2323 "

<reneestorm wrote:

>

> Hi group,

> I am having a " crisis of faith " and could use some advice. I have

> been vegetarian or vegan for the past 15 years. My husband has been

> veggie for 15 years and we have raised our three kids vegetarian. My

> problem now is concerning soy. I began to worry about 1 month ago

> that perhaps soy was contributung to my Asperger son's ADD. He has

> been GFCF for 4 years but many people have begun telling me recently

> that it is likely that soy is a problem for him too.

>

> Yesterday, on another group, someone posted an article decrying the

> evils of soy.

>

> http://www.mothering.com/articles/growing_child/food/soy_story.html

>

> While the article is definitely biased, it does make some good points

> about processed soy products.

>

> Both of my daughters have some trouble attending to tasks. My

> youngest daughters has sensory integration problems and food

> allergies. She is definitly intolerant/allergic to corn, wheat,

> dairy, and I suspect soy because she craves it when she eats it.

>

> To make matters worse, I have thyroid disease, which has been

> linked by some to consumption of soy. Would I be healthier if I

> stoped eating soy? My mother, aunt and uncle all have thyroid

> disease and they are meat-eaters.

>

> Finally, my husband has grown very overweight. He mainly eats

> bread, cheese and processeed soy products. I have tried over the

> years to get him to change his eating habits but he doesn't like

> beans and is just really out of balance with his eating right now.

>

> So now, for the first time in 15 years I am wondering if I should

> start feeding my family organic, free range meat. If I did not see a

> moral issue with eating meat, I would definitly think that my

> children would be healthier with a non-allergenic source of protein,

> like meat. I think my husband would be leaner and healthier because

> he would have a lean source of protein in his diet. Despite warnings

> about phtyo-estrogens, he continues to eat processed soy.

>

> I know this is long and rambling. Thnaks to anyone who has read

> this far. I guess I am just looking for than inspiration, recipe,

> word of wisdom - whatever- that will make it seem okay because I do

> not want to feed animals to my children, but I don't want to feed

> them foods they are allegic to either. Renee

>

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Renee

 

My personal experience is this .... children with ASD often have what amounts to

leaky gut syndrome and while it seems they are most affected by gluten and

casein, those who are VERY reactive to casein also seem to have problems with

the protein in soy. If they are on a strict GFCF and soy free diet, the leaky

gut can resolve and they may be able to tolerate soy again but the gluten and

casein seem to encourage the body to produce a brain chemical called

dermorphine.

 

My eldest two sons were diagnosed with ADHD very early on and both are extremely

reactive to soy, casein and gluten - the least trace and the eldest, who is 16,

turns into a 2 year old.

 

That doesn't mean soy is inherently bad, it just means that I think we have come

to a place in our -devolution - for lack of a better word, where foods can cause

serious problems for many people. As the greek philosopher once said, " let your

food be your medicine " or rather in this case, it seems wise to let your " lack "

of food be your medicine.

 

BL

 

 

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Thanks to everyone who replied to my post last week. The support

helped a lot and remined me of some things I needed to hear.

I started makikng veggie burgers for my kids by putting beans or

lentils in the food processer with a gf whole grain and a vegetable

like spinach. My son came up with the idea of cutting them out with

cookie cutters. Now my daughter will now eat them and we don't have

to use any soy. She is extremely sensitive to food texture so these

are perfect for her. Thanks again and any further ideas or

insights are always appreciated. Renee

 

 

, " renee2323 "

<reneestorm wrote:

>

> Hi group,

> I am having a " crisis of faith " and could use some advice. I

have

> been vegetarian or vegan for the past 15 years. My husband has

been

> veggie for 15 years and we have raised our three kids vegetarian.

My

> problem now is concerning soy. I began to worry about 1 month ago

> that perhaps soy was contributung to my Asperger son's ADD. He has

> been GFCF for 4 years but many people have begun telling me

recently

> that it is likely that soy is a problem for him too.

>

> Yesterday, on another group, someone posted an article decrying

the

> evils of soy.

>

> http://www.mothering.com/articles/growing_child/food/soy_story.html

>

> While the article is definitely biased, it does make some good

points

> about processed soy products.

>

> Both of my daughters have some trouble attending to tasks. My

> youngest daughters has sensory integration problems and food

> allergies. She is definitly intolerant/allergic to corn, wheat,

> dairy, and I suspect soy because she craves it when she eats it.

>

> To make matters worse, I have thyroid disease, which has been

> linked by some to consumption of soy. Would I be healthier if I

> stoped eating soy? My mother, aunt and uncle all have thyroid

> disease and they are meat-eaters.

>

> Finally, my husband has grown very overweight. He mainly eats

> bread, cheese and processeed soy products. I have tried over the

> years to get him to change his eating habits but he doesn't like

> beans and is just really out of balance with his eating right now.

>

> So now, for the first time in 15 years I am wondering if I should

> start feeding my family organic, free range meat. If I did not see

a

> moral issue with eating meat, I would definitly think that my

> children would be healthier with a non-allergenic source of

protein,

> like meat. I think my husband would be leaner and healthier

because

> he would have a lean source of protein in his diet. Despite

warnings

> about phtyo-estrogens, he continues to eat processed soy.

>

> I know this is long and rambling. Thnaks to anyone who has read

> this far. I guess I am just looking for than inspiration, recipe,

> word of wisdom - whatever- that will make it seem okay because I do

> not want to feed animals to my children, but I don't want to feed

> them foods they are allegic to either. Renee

>

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CAn you tell me more about how to make those indian breads from

lentils and rice. That sounds very good.

 

 

 

, " Lana Gibbons "

<lana.m.gibbons wrote:

>

> My first suggestion is to look into Amaranth and Quinoa as they are

> complete, gluten-free proteins that both happen to taste pretty

good

> (although I prefer Amaranth). If you can't do Amaranth and

Quinoa, just

> make sure you have some form of legumes with your grains and

you'll make

> complete proteins (they also tend to taste better too). Lentils

are

> exceptionally nutritious, and can be pureed with rice and left to

rise like

> sourdough. Lentils and rice make an indian bread or pancakes

known as dosa

> or idli, depending on how much water you add before fermenting.

Other

> common legume/grain combinations are adzuki beans and rice, black

beans and

> rice, etc.

>

> One of my favorite snacks is made out of amaranth. It takes some

practice

> but you take whole amaranth and put it in a clean, dry pot over

the stove.

> Either stir with heat resistant brush/spatula or grab the pot by

the handle

> and swirl on and off. Be very careful not to burn it. The

resulting

> miniature " popcorn " is excellent mixed with honey and molded into

bars.

>

> As for hubby... I have a similar problem with mine! :) Since you

mention

> processed foods, my first concern would be: how much trans fat is

he getting

> a day? Even if it isn't much: I would suggest he start

supplimenting with

> extra virgin coconut oil, as well as other vegan saturated fats

(palm, palm

> kernal, etc) as soon as possible. Check out the book " Eat Fat,

Lose Fat "

> for info on how fats help regulate weight, or " Know Your Fats " for

a general

> overview of fats. Interesting tidbit: recent research finds trans

fats put

> on more fat per calorie than other fats.

>

> The rest of my concerns for your hubby would be: Is the bread

whole grain?

> Is it sourdough? Is the cheese made from raw milk? Is the cheese

naturally

> fermented and aged? If not, start moving him over to these

superior forms

> of his existing foods before trying to meddle further. I have

been doing

> the same transition with my SO over the last year and he is now

beginning to

> prefer the superior forms.

>

> Another thing that could help hubby right away is to start feeding

more

> dry-acting foods. Wheat and dairy are very damp according to

traditional

> chinese medicine, and need to be balanced with appropriate amounts

of dry

> foods, especially sour and pungent foods. Does he like

spearmint? It is an

> excellent drying pungent food. Otherwise add things like kimchee,

garlic,

> onion, brined pickles, vinegar etc.

>

> -Lana

>

>

>

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