Vegan author comments on EMES controversy

[Guest guest]

Shalom!

 

A favorite vegan author of mine is Bryanna Clark Grogan. She has a message

board on vegsource.com. Someone posted that article about Emes not being

vegetarian and here is here reply:

 

http://www.vegsource.com/talk/beginner/messages/145876.html

 

Bryanna (NewVeggies.vegsource.com)

Re: Emes updates?

July 18, 2005 at 10:57 am PST

 

In Reply to: Emes updates? posted by vegan goddess on July 18, 2005 at 10:47 am:

 

I saw that article, too, but I am not convinced. I spoke to a Seventh Day

Adventist friend who remembers hearing something along this line MANY years

ago, but says it was not proven back then. The Seventh Day Adventist store

near Vancouver still sells EMES, as do vegan online stores such as

differentdaisy.com, veganstore.com, healthy-eating.com, etc.

 

Annemarie on my vegsource beginners’ board wrote:

“The local vegan store here has been through this as well. They spoke with the

folks at Pangea online vegan store, who researched this and say Emes is indeed

vegan. Pangea continues to sell Emes kosher gelatin. My personal opinion? If

Pangea says it's ok - I'm not gonna worry about it.”

 

Read this article:

http://www.lsbu.ac.uk/water/hycar.html

 

This is the pertinent paragraph (bold type my emphasis):

 

" Carrageenans are used mainly for thickening, suspending and gelling. k- and

i-carrageenans form thermoreversible gels on cooling in the presence of

appropriate counterions. k-Carrageenan forms a firm clear, if brittle, gel

with poor freeze-thaw stability; the coil-double helix transition being

followed by a K^+ -induced aggregation of the helices [516 ]. k-*Carrageenan

gels may be softened (and is generally regarded to be synergistically

strengthene^a ) with locust bean gum . i*-Carrageenan has less specific ionic

binding but increased ionic strength allows helices to form junction zones in

soft elastic gels with good freeze-thaw stability. l-Carrageenan is non

gelling as the lack of the ^1 C_4 3,6-anhydro-link allows the galactose

residues to revert to their ^4 C_1 conformation which does not allow the

initial double helix formation required for gelling. Additionally, the high

density of charged sulfate groups encourages an extensive conformation.

l-Carrageenan has been found to act as a cryoprotectant and improves the

freeze-thaw behavior of locust bean gum . "

 

Locust bean gum is one of the ingredients in kosher gel-- it is NOT an

ingredient in animal gelatin. I used animal gelatin for many years before

becoming vegetarian, and kosher gel does not act just like Knox gelatin--it

takes much longer to gel, for one thing, and it is a more delicate gel.

Granulated animal gelatin has to be soaked in cold water before adding to hot

liquid. If you don't do this the outer layers of the granules become gluey and

stick neighboring granules together. Kosher gelatin can be added to hot liquid

and it dissolves and disperses instantly.

 

The article lumped all " vegetable gum products " in together, but this is

misleading. If you consult the revised and updated version of " On Food and

Cooking, the Science and Lore of the Kitchen " by Harold McGee (Scribner 2004),

you will see this. There are: Agarose (agar); alginates; carrageenans; gum

arabic; gum tragacanth; guar gum; locust-bean gum; Xanthan gum; and gellan.

All behave differently.

 

I would like to know what is the difference between EMES and other vegan

kosher gels--or all they all suspect? I am aware that all kosher gelatin is

not vegetarian-- however, are we to suspect all food labels of being

fabrications? Or just kosher gelatin? It almost sounds anti-Semetic! It is a

serious crime with stiff penalties to mislabel foods. What would be the

advantage of trying to pull this over on the public, anyway? Carageenan is

ALOT cheaper than kosher-certified animal hides that are the only material

that can be used for non-vegetarian kosher gelatin. EMES is an old and

well-respected kosher company. Kosher certification is extremely detailed and

time-consuming-- I know people who's companies have gone through the process.

 

I'm still using EMES!

Bryanna

 

 

In Reply to: Re: Emes updates? posted by vegangoddess on July 18, 2005 at

11:32 am:

 

I just spoke to someone at Pangea and they said that their carrying another

brand had nothing to do with this controversy-- they weren't aware of it at

the time. differentdaisy.com is out of stock temporarily, and

healthy-eating.com still carries it, as do most of the Seventh Day Adventist

sites. I have contacted the vegetarian resource Group in Baltimore about this

and hope to get some answers soon. They are a great vegetarian research

organization and their founders are Jewish, so they may be able to help.

 

I don't like condeming anything without something definitive, so I am

withholding judgement.

Bryanna<<<<

 

 

~~In Messiah,

Vickilynn

Micah 6:8

http://www.realfoodliving.com

[Guest guest]

Hi Vickilynn,

 

Thanks for the helpful information regarding Emes. My sister-in-law works at

the Adventist store that Bryanna spoke of near Vancouver. I was curious, so

asked her about this and she tells me that they still have some Emes in stock,

but once it is sold out they will not be ordering more. Evidentally they have

some " question " over the validity of the vegan claim.

 

The mystery unravels. . .and if it is undeed determined that Emes is not vegan.

.. .there will be many disappointed users of this product that works so well!

 

~ LaDonna

>>>>>I spoke to a Seventh Day

Adventist friend who remembers hearing something along this line MANY years

ago, but says it was not proven back then. The Seventh Day Adventist store

near Vancouver still sells EMES. . .