Guest guest Posted November 26, 2007 Report Share Posted November 26, 2007 >PETA-India alone through its petition alert managed to pump >approximately on an average 12000 signature petitions a day. This is a good example of why the power-holders of the world do not take electronic petitions seriously, & why activists are wasting their time to even use them as a tactic. Thousands of people collect tens of thousands of electronic petition signatures daily in the name of all sorts of causes, often threatening to boycott this and that, that the signers would never buy or visit in the first place, but there is seldom if ever any way for the recipients to verify (or even have reason to believe) that most of the people who signed really exist, let alone that they know what they are talking about. " Unless petitions are designed politically and strategically, they do not create one-to-one accountability of any individual lawmaker to his or her own constituents, " points out National Institute for Animal Advocacy founder Julie Lewin, who for more than 20 years has been among the most accomplished pro-animal lobbyists and political organizers in the U.S. " In contrast, " Lewin continues in her new book Get Political for Animals, " a highly effective petition is addressed to a specific lawmaker; asks that lawmaker to take a specific position (support or oppose a specific bill or proposed ordinance); is signed only by the lawmaker's own constituents; includes the home (voting) address of each signer; and includes the phone and e-mail addresses of signers who are willing to provide them. These petitions are joyously effective, because the lawmaker sees that you have the contact information to let each signer know exactly what actions he takes. " -- Merritt Clifton Editor, ANIMAL PEOPLE P.O. Box 960 Clinton, WA 98236 Telephone: 360-579-2505 Fax: 360-579-2575 E-mail: anmlpepl Web: www.animalpeoplenews.org [ANIMAL PEOPLE is the leading independent newspaper providing original investigative coverage of animal protection worldwide, founded in 1992. Our readership of 30,000-plus includes the decision-makers at more than 10,000 animal protection organizations. We have no alignment or affiliation with any other entity. $24/year; for free sample, send address.] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 27, 2007 Report Share Posted November 27, 2007 Well pointed out Mr. Merritt! This is exactly why " Care2 " is steadily losing traffic - their focus has been on boring & ineffective online petitions - look at the stat's on Alexa.com for a 5-year or " max " period. http://www.alexa.com/data/details/traffic_details/care2.com <http://www.alexa.com/data/details/traffic_details/care2.com> The " King of useless online petitions " - Mr. Naresh Kadyan - has been abusing me (and others) recently both on " aapn " & with personal emails Naresh - IT IS NEVER TOO LATE TO WAKE UP! - stop making a fool of yourself & focus / work to actually help animals. * Start with a public apology to Maneka Gandhi for your transparent attempts at " one-upmanship " . * Then work towards transparency - let people see how you are spending the monies that you receive. .. .. One-upmanship is the systematic and conscious practice of making one's associates feel inferior and thereby gaining the status of being " one-up " on them. .. .. aapn , Merritt Clifton <anmlpepl wrote: > > >PETA-India alone through its petition alert managed to pump > >approximately on an average 12000 signature petitions a day. > > > This is a good example of why the power-holders of the world > do not take electronic petitions seriously, & why activists are > wasting their time to even use them as a tactic. > > Thousands of people collect tens of thousands of electronic > petition signatures daily in the name of all sorts of causes, often > threatening to boycott this and that, that the signers would never > buy or visit in the first place, but there is seldom if ever any way > for the recipients to verify (or even have reason to believe) that > most of the people who signed really exist, let alone that they know > what they are talking about. > > " Unless petitions are designed politically and strategically, > they do not create one-to-one accountability of any individual > lawmaker to his or her own constituents, " points out National > Institute for Animal Advocacy founder Julie Lewin, who for more than > 20 years has been among the most accomplished pro-animal lobbyists > and political organizers in the U.S. > > " In contrast, " Lewin continues in her new book Get Political > for Animals, " a highly effective petition is addressed to a specific > lawmaker; asks that lawmaker to take a specific position (support or > oppose a specific bill or proposed ordinance); is signed only by the > lawmaker's own constituents; includes the home (voting) address of > each signer; and includes the phone and e-mail addresses of signers > who are willing to provide them. These petitions are joyously > effective, because the lawmaker sees that you have the contact > information to let each signer know exactly what actions he takes. " > > > > -- > Merritt Clifton > Editor, ANIMAL PEOPLE > P.O. Box 960 > Clinton, WA 98236 > > Telephone: 360-579-2505 > Fax: 360-579-2575 > E-mail: anmlpepl > Web: www.animalpeoplenews.org > > [ANIMAL PEOPLE is the leading independent newspaper providing > original investigative coverage of animal protection worldwide, > founded in 1992. Our readership of 30,000-plus includes the > decision-makers at more than 10,000 animal protection organizations. > We have no alignment or affiliation with any other entity. $24/year; > for free sample, send address.] > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 27, 2007 Report Share Posted November 27, 2007 > Well pointed out Mr. Merritt! This is exactly why " Care2 " is steadily losing traffic< Some not so boring and effective petitions which I would appreciate Mr. John Edmundson and those who have not yet signed have a look. The petitions carry a lot of weight as they are not kindergarten kids from across the globe who have signed but sound compassionate and credible people who understand the text and matter of what the petition stresses upon, who the target is and whether there is actually a crisis. Yes, one should try and avoid getting personal and perhaps at times some such petitions do get unnoticed by petition sites, but to generalise one petition would be unfair. Any valid criticisms and challenges of the following petitions is most welcome (that would be good if we can identify any drawbacks of the petition if any): Trains- The unquestioned death trap for elephants Link: http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/help-save-elephants-from-killer-trains Stop 'Terrorism' against Man's Best Friend in Bangalore Link: http://www.thepetitionsite.com/petition/605752040 Stop " TERRORISM " against Wild Animals in India Link: http://www.thepetitionsite.com/petition/213484384 SOS: Elephants are not 'Party Animals' Link:* http://www.thepetitionsite.com/petition/464562377* Urge the Director General of Police to take action against officer for sacrificing buffalo Link: http://www.thepetitionsite.com/petition/377552581 On Nov 27, 2007 7:02 AM, John Edmundson <balathai wrote: > > Well pointed out Mr. Merritt! > > This is exactly why " Care2 " is steadily losing traffic - their focus has > been on boring & ineffective online petitions - look at the stat's on > Alexa.com for a 5-year or " max " period. > > http://www.alexa.com/data/details/traffic_details/care2.com > <http://www.alexa.com/data/details/traffic_details/care2.com> > > The " King of useless online petitions " - Mr. Naresh Kadyan - has been > abusing me (and others) recently both on " aapn " & with personal emails > > Naresh - IT IS NEVER TOO LATE TO WAKE UP! - stop making a fool of > yourself & focus / work to actually help animals. > > * Start with a public apology to Maneka Gandhi for your transparent > attempts at " one-upmanship " . > * Then work towards transparency - let people see how you are > spending the monies that you receive. > > . > > . > > One-upmanship is the systematic and conscious practice of making one's > associates feel inferior and thereby gaining the status of being > " one-up " on them. > > . > > . > > aapn <aapn%40>, Merritt Clifton > <anmlpepl wrote: > > > > >PETA-India alone through its petition alert managed to pump > > >approximately on an average 12000 signature petitions a day. > > > > > > This is a good example of why the power-holders of the world > > do not take electronic petitions seriously, & why activists are > > wasting their time to even use them as a tactic. > > > > Thousands of people collect tens of thousands of electronic > > petition signatures daily in the name of all sorts of causes, often > > threatening to boycott this and that, that the signers would never > > buy or visit in the first place, but there is seldom if ever any way > > for the recipients to verify (or even have reason to believe) that > > most of the people who signed really exist, let alone that they know > > what they are talking about. > > > > " Unless petitions are designed politically and strategically, > > they do not create one-to-one accountability of any individual > > lawmaker to his or her own constituents, " points out National > > Institute for Animal Advocacy founder Julie Lewin, who for more than > > 20 years has been among the most accomplished pro-animal lobbyists > > and political organizers in the U.S. > > > > " In contrast, " Lewin continues in her new book Get Political > > for Animals, " a highly effective petition is addressed to a specific > > lawmaker; asks that lawmaker to take a specific position (support or > > oppose a specific bill or proposed ordinance); is signed only by the > > lawmaker's own constituents; includes the home (voting) address of > > each signer; and includes the phone and e-mail addresses of signers > > who are willing to provide them. These petitions are joyously > > effective, because the lawmaker sees that you have the contact > > information to let each signer know exactly what actions he takes. " > > > > > > > > -- > > Merritt Clifton > > Editor, ANIMAL PEOPLE > > P.O. Box 960 > > Clinton, WA 98236 > > > > Telephone: 360-579-2505 > > Fax: 360-579-2575 > > E-mail: anmlpepl > > Web: www.animalpeoplenews.org > > > > [ANIMAL PEOPLE is the leading independent newspaper providing > > original investigative coverage of animal protection worldwide, > > founded in 1992. Our readership of 30,000-plus includes the > > decision-makers at more than 10,000 animal protection organizations. > > We have no alignment or affiliation with any other entity. $24/year; > > for free sample, send address.] > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 27, 2007 Report Share Posted November 27, 2007 I would agree partially with all of you here. Meritt and John, I agree! Like you said may be if we do not observe discretion in creating and submitting petitions, people would not take note of the same seriously. With too many petition, people might loose track off of the same and the issue may not get addressed with the cause being lost along with the same. No doubt about that. But I would also agree with Azam too that there are petitions which do justice to the concept of petitions. Petitions was conceptualized to spread awareness and more importantly report back to a body/ individual/ organization or an authority that the undersigned people are in view of the points listed in the petition. I am sure you could definitly pick up many instances when petitions have actually opened up people's eyes towards an issue that was going on in their backyard and they didn know of and through these petitions they channeled their thoughts to the concerned people because that is the best they could do to help the cause. So I think for the bigger good, let us not generalize petitions as something totally useless but more importatly petitioners use discretion while creating and propagating them and most importantly channel these petitions to the concerned individual/ org/ authority to see there is some difference brought about in the cause it supports. Because for a lot of people thats their best efforts to help the cause and they should not be taken for a ride cos they did it with all their heart. Thanks, Pablo. On 11/27/07, AZAM SIDDIQUI <azam24x7 wrote: > > > Well pointed out Mr. Merritt! > > This is exactly why " Care2 " is steadily losing traffic< > > Some not so boring and effective petitions which I would appreciate Mr. > John Edmundson and those who have not yet signed have a look. > > The petitions carry a lot of weight as they are not kindergarten kids from > across the globe who have signed but sound compassionate and credible people > who understand the text and matter of what the petition stresses upon, who > the target is and whether there is actually a crisis. > > Yes, one should try and avoid getting personal and perhaps at times some > such petitions do get unnoticed by petition sites, but to generalise one > petition would be unfair. > > Any valid criticisms and challenges of the following petitions is most > welcome (that would be good if we can identify any drawbacks of the petition > if any): > > Trains- The unquestioned death trap for elephants Link: > http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/help-save-elephants-from-killer-trains > Stop 'Terrorism' against Man's Best Friend in Bangalore Link: > http://www.thepetitionsite.com/petition/605752040 > Stop " TERRORISM " against Wild Animals in India Link: > http://www.thepetitionsite.com/petition/213484384 > SOS: Elephants are not 'Party Animals' Link: * http://www.thepetitionsite.com/petition/464562377 > * > Urge the Director General of Police to take action against officer for > sacrificing buffalo Link: > http://www.thepetitionsite.com/petition/377552581 > > > On Nov 27, 2007 7:02 AM, John Edmundson < balathai wrote: > > > > > Well pointed out Mr. Merritt! > > > > This is exactly why " Care2 " is steadily losing traffic - their focus has > > been on boring & ineffective online petitions - look at the stat's on > > Alexa.com <http://alexa.com/> for a 5-year or " max " period. > > > > http://www.alexa.com/data/details/traffic_details/care2.com > > <http://www.alexa.com/data/details/traffic_details/care2.com> > > > > The " King of useless online petitions " - Mr. Naresh Kadyan - has been > > abusing me (and others) recently both on " aapn " & with personal emails > > > > Naresh - IT IS NEVER TOO LATE TO WAKE UP! - stop making a fool of > > yourself & focus / work to actually help animals. > > > > * Start with a public apology to Maneka Gandhi for your transparent > > attempts at " one-upmanship " . > > * Then work towards transparency - let people see how you are > > spending the monies that you receive. > > > > . > > > > . > > > > One-upmanship is the systematic and conscious practice of making one's > > associates feel inferior and thereby gaining the status of being > > " one-up " on them. > > > > . > > > > . > > > > aapn <aapn%40>, Merritt Clifton > > <anmlpepl wrote: > > > > > > >PETA-India alone through its petition alert managed to pump > > > >approximately on an average 12000 signature petitions a day. > > > > > > > > > This is a good example of why the power-holders of the world > > > do not take electronic petitions seriously, & why activists are > > > wasting their time to even use them as a tactic. > > > > > > Thousands of people collect tens of thousands of electronic > > > petition signatures daily in the name of all sorts of causes, often > > > threatening to boycott this and that, that the signers would never > > > buy or visit in the first place, but there is seldom if ever any way > > > for the recipients to verify (or even have reason to believe) that > > > most of the people who signed really exist, let alone that they know > > > what they are talking about. > > > > > > " Unless petitions are designed politically and strategically, > > > they do not create one-to-one accountability of any individual > > > lawmaker to his or her own constituents, " points out National > > > Institute for Animal Advocacy founder Julie Lewin, who for more than > > > 20 years has been among the most accomplished pro-animal lobbyists > > > and political organizers in the U.S. > > > > > > " In contrast, " Lewin continues in her new book Get Political > > > for Animals, " a highly effective petition is addressed to a specific > > > lawmaker; asks that lawmaker to take a specific position (support or > > > oppose a specific bill or proposed ordinance); is signed only by the > > > lawmaker's own constituents; includes the home (voting) address of > > > each signer; and includes the phone and e-mail addresses of signers > > > who are willing to provide them. These petitions are joyously > > > effective, because the lawmaker sees that you have the contact > > > information to let each signer know exactly what actions he takes. " > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Merritt Clifton > > > Editor, ANIMAL PEOPLE > > > P.O. Box 960 > > > Clinton, WA 98236 > > > > > > Telephone: 360-579-2505 > > > Fax: 360-579-2575 > > > > > E-mail: anmlpepl > > > Web: www.animalpeoplenews.org > > > > > > [ANIMAL PEOPLE is the leading independent newspaper providing > > > original investigative coverage of animal protection worldwide, > > > founded in 1992. Our readership of 30,000-plus includes the > > > decision-makers at more than 10,000 animal protection organizations. > > > We have no alignment or affiliation with any other entity. $24/year; > > > for free sample, send address.] > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 27, 2007 Report Share Posted November 27, 2007 >The petitions carry a lot of weight as they are not kindergarten >kids from across the globe who have signed but sound compassionate >and credible peoplewho understand the text Actually, there isn't really any way to tell whether the signatures on an electronic petition are actual people or just cut-and-paste from a telephone directory. People who really know how to do this, like the public relations managers for successful politicians, understand that an electronic petition of even a million signatures carries no real weight at all, since no matter whose name is on it, there is no guarantee of authenticity, and the signees, real or not, have no way to hold the recipient accountable for anything. -- Merritt Clifton Editor, ANIMAL PEOPLE P.O. Box 960 Clinton, WA 98236 Telephone: 360-579-2505 Fax: 360-579-2575 E-mail: anmlpepl Web: www.animalpeoplenews.org [ANIMAL PEOPLE is the leading independent newspaper providing original investigative coverage of animal protection worldwide, founded in 1992. Our readership of 30,000-plus includes the decision-makers at more than 10,000 animal protection organizations. We have no alignment or affiliation with any other entity. $24/year; for free sample, send address.] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 27, 2007 Report Share Posted November 27, 2007 Hi Azam, Your quote - > Any valid criticisms and challenges of the following petitions is most > welcome (that would be good if we can identify any drawbacks of the petition > if any): Petitions can be highly powerful / valuable tools - when they are well structured. Merritt's quote contains all of the " tips " which you need Azam. > " In contrast, " Lewin continues in her new book Get Political > for Animals, " a highly effective petition is addressed to a specific > lawmaker; asks that lawmaker to take a specific position (support or > oppose a specific bill or proposed ordinance); is signed only by the > lawmaker's own constituents; includes the home (voting) address of > each signer; and includes the phone and e-mail addresses of signers > who are willing to provide them. These petitions are joyously > effective, because the lawmaker sees that you have the contact > information to let each signer know exactly what actions he takes. " I wholeheartedly support the topics of each of your petitions Azam. Our goal is the same - less animal abuse - we differ only in that your main focus seems to be elephants - my main focus is cows. Such petitions though are of little practical use to campaigners without useable contact details. I suggest that you continue to " use " both www.thepetitionsite.com <http://www.thepetitionsite.com/> & www.care2.com <http://www.care2.com/> - but constantly work to " sharpen your axe " - make a point of systematically collecting the email addresses / other details of the individuals who are in support of the causes which you fight for. As your supporter base / lists grow so will your effectiveness. You can very efficiently supply them with regular news / ammunition to further the causes. You can also efficiently solicit their support for specific projects. A very focused 10 name petition with the contact details of the signatories can have great potency - when passed to the intended recipient. A 100,000 name e-petition existing in cyber-space without any verifiable contact details lacks tangible potency. Yes PETA sometimes runs online petitions but this is only a small part of their overall strategy to generate massive publicity for their " causes " . PETA's great power is their Membership Lists / their easily contactable supporter base. " aapn " is working as a good forum for " axe sharpening " these days - you do not have to agree with Merritt on all points in order to benefit from his experience Azam - there are few " easy " Animal Rights Activists. There is chronic abuse of e-petitions by some " online only activists " - who are very actively using online forums for - * " pulling down " genuine animal activists. * generating multiple online petitions. * building Care2 " fan bases " . - example here - http://www.care2.com/c2c/people/profile.html?pid=374874447 <http://www.care2.com/c2c/people/profile.html?pid=374874447> Y's. John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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